The Best Small Council in Game of Thrones History
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- čas přidán 4. 06. 2024
- Who would be the best Small Council in all of A Song of Ice and Fire? Today we find out!
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Thank you all for watching! Character art in this video is by TheMico!
My Twitter: / quinnthegm
00:00 Ruling the Realm
00:57 Selecting a Council
02:00 Additional Rules Note
02:21 Master of Laws
03:39 Rebranding?
04:09 Lord Commander of the Kingsguard
05:29 Master of Ships
06:36 Grand Maester
08:12 Master of Whispers
09:40 Master of Coin
10:58 Hand of the King
11:53 The Smallest Possible Council
12:27 The Golden Council - Zábava
I would argue that Bloodraven would still be preferable to Varys for the simple fact that he probably isn’t trying to overthrow the crown.
His actions directly lead to the weakening of the House Targaryen.
Imagine a Varys that for whatever reason was completely loyal to Robert. Literally all the problems he faced would be solved.
We'll have to see about that. It seems a strong likelihood that Bloodraven has designs to overthrow the crown and put Bran/himself/weirwood network on the throne. His plan is just on a longer time scale than Varys.
I would say the best master of whisperes was Serenei of Lys since she was reportedly so good that bloodraven was the only one that came close to matching her.
@@MossyQualia maybe.
Tywin visibly angry but silently happy since the lannisters have the most positions
And honestly Tywin should be the Hand of the king
@renadandolo Tywin is the best hand at being the true power behind the throne. Aerys didn't have the dragons anymore, and his grandsons were just foolish little boys. It was Tywin that the realm truly feared.
The maesters examined Aerea’s infected body and diagnosed her with “holy shit that’s nasty”
Personally I think Stannis is the best master of ships seeing as he rebuilt the royal fleet after it was destroyed during Robert’s rebellion and was one of the best naval commanders in Westeros who destroyed the iron born fleet and made way for the invasion of the iron islands, plus he is fiercely loyal to you once he picks you as his lord despite all his grievances with his brother Robert he was loyal to him till the end, plus he is an amazing general as well as admiral and he notices the dealings and is weary of little finger and Varys. Overall Stannis is an amazing general, admiral and loyal small council advisor.
He was great, but he’s not the Sea Snake
@@QuinnTheGM
He’s not the sea snake he’s the mannis
To be fair defeating the Iron Fleet isn't really that spectacular once you actually look at it, with the overwhelming majority of it being made up out of longships that are much smaller than even the smallest warship used by Westerosi navies.
@@DominionSorcerer
Yes the iron fleet is made up of smaller ships but it is large fleet and led by people who know nothing but sailing those who are more skilled at sailing and naval combat than most and this was done with a fleet that was recently rebuilt after being completely destroyed
I think he's a solid second choice, but Stannis would probably do better in a different role. If there was an actual place on the council for a general, perhaps?
Viserys is a good pick for hand of the king, but I do feel like not mentioning Septon Barth feels harsh.
Barth had the benefit of serving a very capable king with dragons to back up his decrees. Viserys was given a lot worse circumstances.
@@kevinneutzling8267I feel like Barth and the Good Queen actually did most of the heavy lifting in Jaehaerys I’s reign. Fire and Blood makes me feel like his role was written by the maesters to be much more important than it actually was.
@@realdaggerman105 Okay I'm a lover of Jaehaerys in general, I think that, to an extent, you are right. The man clearly surrounded himself with exceptional advisors. However, doesn't that speak for itself? A good King should never rule alone. Jaehaerys was very wise with how he was portrayed and how he treated other around him. I think he's absolutely deserving of the credit along with his closest friends.
@@elijahalbiston This. He knew who to pick and when to listen to them. He also respected his wife's opinion, especially when it came to laws benefiting the women of the realm. And he didn't go willy-nilly into any pointless wars. If he had been a better father, he would be just about the greatest character in the whole damn lore. But homeboy had no idea what to do with his daughters.
@jessjess23brooks89 and his poor sons didn’t manage to live long enough for Kingship. I have no doubt about their success if they had
Ser Pounce for Hand of the King, obviously
Ser Pounce is the King this Small Council will be serving.
@@thing_under_the_stairs
The only one capable of stewarding such an unruly kingdom.
Ser Pounce is already busy fighting the War for the Dawn as Azor Ahai reborn.
You mean the Paw of the King. ^^
All hail Ser Pounce, the Lion that rides, Strongcat, the Pounce that was promised, Azhor Kitai
9:54 It's actually hilarious how "Tyrek is a horse" is pretty much canon everywhere in the ASOIAF fandom by now. 😁😁
Well IT'S IN THE TEXT!
I will say, even based on what we know from Fire & Blood, Lyonel Strong would still make a great master of law because he was known as being exceptionally intelligent, had six links from the Citadel and unlike a lot of people in Westerosi history actually studied for the job he had since the book notes he was an expert at law and understanding how to read legal matters. He was kind of a full package for the Small Council- intelligent, competent, highly capable at war and fighting, tactful, and honest. Master of Laws or Hand of the King would very much suit him well as it did in his life.
Definitely agree, I haven’t read up to the point where Kevan is the master of laws so I can’t personally comment on his proficiency, but Lyonel is just so hard to overlook for being such a great servant of the king
Cersei changes the names of all the "Master" positions - in the style of the free cities (if I remember correctly) - so there would be no "masters" above her in the council
Lmao yep thats exactly right its so funny
I nominate Rego Draz as the best master of coin. Sure Tyland was a huge asset to the Greens, but it was for 2 very specific things outside the normal duties of the offices (dividing the treasury, and not buckling to torture. And really, was it in the realm's best interest that Greens be allowed to prolong the war?). Rego on the other hand, served for much longer and brought economic stability to a a realm recently torn apart by Maegor with policies that were more just to the common folk and allowed King Joe to fund his many progressive projects. He died in a riot due to his vanity during a period of famine/plague/winter outside of his control, but if anything the famine likely would've hit much worse if not for Rego's work.
This is what I was going to comment, and you beat me to it.
I also chose Rego Draz.
He was good for the king he served and saved Aegon III’s reign by dividing the treasury and saving it from Rhaenyra and Aegon II.
That's a surprising choice for Master of Coin, I had heard a lot of buzz about Lyman Beesbury.
House Beesbury one of the most honorable houses
The question now is, which small council was the best in history? You have to take the good with the bad, IE with Varys and Stannis comes Littefinger, Renly and Pycelle.
Maybe Jaehaerys's at one point of his long reign.
I think I remember Cersei saying she didn’t want any “Masters” on the Council because she wanted everyone to remember they report to the king (and her as his proxy) and they all serve him, being masters of nothing.
Spot on. I just recently finished reading Feast - the Small Council "rebrand" was one of the several ways Cersei manifested her paranoia and jealousy regarding the Iron Throne and her regency.
It's just a way for GRRM to simplify stuff since Justiciar is basically the way a master of laws would be called in a medieval feudal royal court.
My list:
- Hand: Viserys II (Tywin and Barth also close behind)
- Whisperers: Bloodraven - I disagree that having a sinister reputation in this job is bad for his king; in fact, it deflects blame from the king; Varys doesn't have that great of a reputation either. Plus he did both this job and that of Hand at the same time.
- Coin: Rego Draz - one of Jaehaerys's masters of coin who help him develop and enrich the realm, especially with the kingsroads project and expanding King's Landing.
- Laws: Prince Aemon, Jaehaerys's oldest son - he would have made a fine king, and no doubt helped his father craft laws during his service;
- Grand Master: Benifer for sure
- Ships: Alyn Oakenfist (yes Corlys is up there, too) - Alyn defeating a Braavosi fleet is an accomplishment that I don't think another Westerosi has achieved; he was just as adventurous as Corlys, he defied Unwin Peake and helped his young king, and probably would have defeated the Red Kraken, too.
- LLC: the White Bull - besides a protector, the LLC also serves as military advisor, and in times of need he does lead armies to war; that is exactly what the Gerold Hightower did during the War of the Ninepenny Kings after the Hand was killed; he took overall command and the war was won.
I'm fine with all of them except for the White Bull. He's a Hightower; I don't trust that his loyalty would be solely to the King. I'd go with Ser Duncan or the Dragonknight.
@@juanpablomina1346 but he died for Rhaegar. So he was trustworthy.
@@CulinVlau We don't really know what happened during Robert's Rebellion, but I'll grant that he appeared loyal. I still don't trust that he'd be more loyal to his King than to his family, the maesters and/or the Faith.
Finally someone puts respect on Corlys cough cough grandson (totally not is son), Alyn is pretty much a younger Corlis which is a bonus since we want to have him as long as possible. The fact that he wasn't mension is criminal, the man killed a baby dragon.
For master of coin I would put Martyn Tyrell just for the troll of having a woman is wife Florence Fossoway in the small councel plus she was said to be as competent as Rego.
I’d have Davos as hand of the king. Always a voice of reason and he puts people in their place and brings them down a step in a geordie accent.
I think the biggest knock against Davos is his lack of knowledge concerning politics. He's a fantastic council to Stannis as he serves as his anchor, but he'd only work as Hand *for* Stannis given their prior friendship and understanding, not to mention Stannis' competence. He basically would serve the same purpose as always, with Stannis making the major political plays and Davos making sure his need for duty and "fairness" doesn't end up making the realm hate him. Compared to very many other hands of varying loyalties, he simply lacks much of the knowledge required to fulfill the position to its fullest. However, the position can also be filled for the sole purpose of giving the King a trustworthy advisor who wont mince words or betray them, such as with Robert asking Ned despite him not knowing a large amount about politics either. So in that way i think there's an argument for our onion knight
@@XSacredX27 very good points 👍 I’m very biased toward Liam Cunningham as he’s the only actor able to do my Newcastle accent convincingly. Cheers for the reply 👍
@@curtishay9936 Honestly if you were going to have any bias towards an actor in the cast, he remained solid throughout so good choice~ and np ^^
Davos loves the bigg market
@@atomicwarlord8 haha it’s because there is a river of piss flowing down it like gin alley.
It has to be Tyrion. He had a best selling single written about him. Hands of Gold. The B side had a rap: Where do whores Go. Epic. It is known.
It is known
Along with the Tyrion rap ft Alt Schwift X
@@williamtehan4028 I played that at my son’s birthday and everyone cried.
idk i'd stick with Aurane Waters because he's kinda hot
Hey Cersei.
Also Cersei rebranded all the offices because she felt threatened by anyone except her being called "master" of anything and thought it was a direct threat to the throne (i.e. her) and thus wanted to remove that implication from the title (basically its all pettiness).
Icon. I need to reread Feast, apparently
@@QuinnTheGM yeah! its also why she changed Master of Ships to Lord Admiral and Master of Coins to Lord Treasurer (though she never changed Master of Whispers because Qyburn definitely would have gone full Herbert West if he found out)
Loved the video!
My ideal small council list:
Master of Laws: Aemon (Son of Jaehaerys)
Alysanne thought Aemon would be an even better King than Jaehaerys. So he seems to be the obvious pick for me, despite having relatively little information on what he did in his position.
Kingsguard Lord Commander: Dunk the Lunk of course
(I liked what you said about him being a voice for the smallfolk on the council)
Master of Ships: Stannis the Mannis
(While Corlys is the better sailor, I do not think we get any specifics on how good he was of a naval commander. Whereas Stannis is among the best of the best of strategists and tacticians. Also, since the position of Master of War is show-only, and there are no Kingsguard who are standout generals, I would want Stannis on the council who could do double-duty and be a commander for a land army as well)
Grand Maester: Benifer
(only real choice)
Master of Whispers: Bloodraven
Bloodraven is both more effective and more loyal than Varys. And if he is relegated to the position of spymaster, who are always shady, I do not think he would create bad PR for the crown. Bloodraven only started creating problems when he became Hand.
Master of Coin: Tyland
(I agree Tyland is definitely the best, rebuilding the economy and infrastructure after the Dance. Rego Draz is another good contender if the embezzlement accusations were false, and Martyn Tyrell is a safe pick, but I still think Tyland is better than either)
Hand of the King: Baelor Breakspear
(I agree that Viserys II is probably the better administrator, but with such a stacked Small Council, I think you can sacrifice some brains for heart, and have the Hand be the moral leader of the council, guiding policy towards the common good of the realm and the smallfolk. And for that purpose there is no one better than the true knight Baelor Breakspear. And he was also clearly very wise and intelligent and by all accounts a more than able Hand. And he was a skilled politician/diplomat, rallying the Stormlords to the Targaryen cause when they should have been natural supporters of the Blackfyres. The greatest king who never was)
I really enjoyed the video though!
Are you going to do a Worst Small Council video?
This is an absolutely phenomenal list. I'm loving the respect for both Aemon and Baelor Breakspear, they could have been two of the finest kings had they lived to succeed their fathers
They definitely would have been two of the absolute best kings. Baelor probably would have been pro-smallfolk similar to Egg, but a stronger king and better diplomat who probably would have been able to get more done.
Was thinking Septon Barth as Hand, if only for the fact that he held that position the longest.
I love me some Tyland Lannister, but I'd go with Rego Draz as Master of Coin. Dude was Littlefinger without the debt.
I don't understand how you could justify Varys given his loyalty was for a usurper, he constantly sowed chaos (when he could get away with it), and killed Kevan (your pick for Master of Laws). Seems nonsensical to pick him.
I mean its no problem if the King in question is Young Griff!
Having played as Young Griff in ck2 agot many times I can attest to this.@@PineappleLiar
3:45 it is explained in the book that she "doesn't want any other masters" in the government besides her. She also renames "master of ships" to "grand admiral" and "master of coin" to "lord treasurer" or something like that (I don't remember the specific names).
I'd replace Tyland Lannister with Rego Draz. He turned out a bankrupt and indebted realm, and helped make it prosperous.
I'd also not have Varys there. For the entirely of Robert's rule, he has sought to subvert it over the long term. Even if he believes that Aegon VI is the best possible king, he's still on Robert's council. He's not necessarily wrong, but working against the throne should disqualify him. In sheer ability, he's the only one close to Bloodraven (who you make a good point against). But I'd take the sinister but loyal Bloodraven over Varys. Clubfoot wasn't bad at the job either (while Tyanna, Mysaria and Qyburn haven't done much yet)
I’m quite stung you didn’t choose Lord Beesbury for any position of high honor
You bought tears on eyes with this list,
(Tbh i was chopping onions hahaha),
I enjoy your work, thank you for very much for finding such juicy stuff.
5:43 I agree with Corlus but I’d say that you could maybe make an argument for his grandson/ maybe son Alyn Okenfist. But I still think the sea snake takes the cake
Renly as master of law was quite ridiculous.
they need to create a new position for Renly - Master of Style.
They should've made a new position like Master of Diplomacy or something.
Master of laws was Kevan Lannister.
@@atishayritulpatwathis is during Robert’s reign
This was fun to think about. Ty for the content.
Great video as always man
Love Tyland! Great video as always
The best Master of Laws would obviously be Lord Quinn himself.
Sidenote: In the show there is also the position of Master of War which is interesting.
In Feast Cersei changes all of the Titles of office.
Master of Laws becomes Justiciar, Master of Ships becomes Grand Admiral, Master of Coin becomes Lord Treasurer.
She borrowed the titles from the Free Cities so that there would be no Masters at court besides herself of course.
Jingle Bells as Master of Ships is a no brainer*, being the drowned god an all.
that's Patchface
@@davidlewis5312 wow HUGE brain fart. That’s embarrassing.
We all know who really should be master of coin 🐝🐝🐝
I strongly support Tyland as best master of coin, I love this character
I always thought the Master of Laws as a combination of the offices of Attorney-General and Chief Justice. Like, the officeholder is supposed to oversee most of the realm's criminal and security matters; manage the King's laws to ensure a proper, non-conflicting, and codified set of laws govern the realm (cause even the King needs to make sure he doesn't contradict himself); and act as the King's main legal advisor, interpretor, and adjudicator of the codified laws (of course the King is the ultimate adjudicator of justice and he has final say).
@quinn okay now do the best blunt rotation
I know he'd be hard to control but I would be curious about a Dagon Greyjoy master of ships. I feel like a lot of masters of ship are very defense minded so I would curious what an almost purely offence minded master of ships with the skills and charisma to make it work would do.
I think Bloodraven's devotion to his royal half-brother, Daeron, & then to Daeron's sons makes it pretty clear that his loyalty was to the stability of the realm - he made hard decisions at a hard time (he's essentially the sole reason the '2nd Blackfyre Rebellion' is more an honorific for the abortive fizzle-out that it was, rather than becoming another actual conflict, like the first or later ones); Daeron trusted him, Aerys I trusted him even more- & Maekar might not have liked Bloodraven (& was jealous of him being Hand) but he did trust him to hold his positions of Hand & Master of Whisperers once Maekar became King- & when Maekar died, Bloodraven was Lord Protector of the Realm - at that point, he could have arguably *forced* his control of the realm & become King or de facto king- but he didn't, & (in my head-canon) ensured the right person became King, as soon as he could, without giving way to the biased politics of other factions.
It's my head-canon that he also arranged his exit-strategy, as a means of giving Aegon a fresh start (with a healthy dose of fear, to keep his subjects in line for a while)- & to get him where he needed to go, without drawing any attention to it...
I mean if Bloodraven did want to rule by proxy, all he had to do was argue they should follow the actual line of succession and put Prince Maegor as king. But he seems to have pushed for Egg, the adult wandering heroic prince with plenty of ideas and self-direction who would never be his puppet.
Keep this in mind, legally Maegor SHOULD have been king over Aegon. He was Aerion's son.
@@davidlewis5312
Exactly.
In pure legality/ custom alone- Bloodraven _could_ have easily made himself Regent/ Lord Protector for the infant/ toddler who was the only son of the eldest son (I can't recall if his mother was still alive, I know Aerion & Egg's mother wasn't) of Maekar- as 101 AC's precedent had established, & then had a good decade-plus accustoming people to his rule & ensured a total control over the Small Council, as well as others who'd be with Prince Maegor & what-have-you (possibly arranging his bride & so on), *but* I think Bloodraven *_saw_* that Aegon was who the realm needed.
All of which is why I will never believe him to be a villain, as some theorize.
However, there is also the fact to keep in mind, that strangely- Maegor didn't _actually_ have a lot of support, even with his 'official' position in the line of succession; he'd been named for one of the most feared & reviled men in the realm, & his father was hated & despised for his madness- that many feared might have seeped into his son.
Also- I think it's strongly implied that his youth was against him- for precisely my above reasoning - his accession would have necessitated a long regency- & even the regency of Jaehaerys, short as it was- did not run smoothly - Aegon III's regency was even longer, & there were *a lot* of problems during it (Lord Peake, anyone?)
I think these factors were in a lot of people's minds, too- *_&_* given how feared & despised Bloodraven was- & the fact that people had _already_ thought him too powerful in the reign of the adult Aerys I- becoming Regent, as well as being Lord Protector, & Hand, *&* Master of Whisperers for so young a king- would have been an outrageous concentration of power in the hands of a single person- & a bastard at that...
@@OcarinaSapphr- certainly, but there is no evidence that BR ever advanced Maegors claim. Seems he was all in on Aemon putting aside his chain and when that fell through, took Egg.
@@davidlewis5312
No, I know- I was really just positing a 'what if'.
But where did you hear Bloodraven was a part of the Aemon-thing?
I was aware that there was a cadre that were interested in getting someone _other_ than Aegon, which was what I was referring to in my first comment when I mentioned 'factions'- I was including those who wanted Aemon, the small handful of Maegor supporters, as well as the remaining Blackfyre sympathisers...
@@OcarinaSapphr- I admit I might be wrong about that.
I would pick:
Master of Whispers - Bloodraven
Master of Ships - Alyn Oakenfist
Master of Coin - Rego Draz
The rest of your picks are solid.
I would replace Kevan with Stannis for Master of Laws. I also think this move allows you to have Bloodraven as your Master of Whisperers. The fear of bloodraven might be overshadowed by a Stannis who would enact Justice on those identified as problems to the crown. Just my thoughts
I would’ve, but Stannis was never actually Master of Laws, just Ships.
@@QuinnTheGM whoops, guess my head cannon leaked in
This video is slander against the greatest master of coin, Lord Gyles Rosby of Rosby. He was in charge of the crown’s coffers, a role he performed with great consistency. No man was more suited for the role.
My picks would be
Hand of the King- Viserys Targaren (Honorable mention to Septon Barth, honestly maybe an advisor from the faith could be created allowing him in or simply as an advisor)
Grand Maestar- Benifer (Honestly Geradys was decent if we are taking Rhaenyra's council into consideration. Also )
Master of Coin- Rego Draz
Master of Laws- Aemon Targaryen (If we take the show as canon, I loved Lyonel Strong like you and would probably pick him)
Master of Ships- Corlys Velaryon
Master of Whisperers- Bryden Rivers (Honestly the hardest choice. Larys Strong and Varys are good but plot to much. Mysaria is a great choice honestly)
Lord Commander of the Kingsguard- Duncan the Tall (If we are talking about the Lord Commander being an advisor Duncan is a great moral compass and insight into the smallfolk like you said)
(We know to little of Aemon Targaryen and how he may advise a King)
I’d argue with hand it depends on the situation if I need a hand who’s going to make heads role and secure my throne at the end of a war
Cregan Stark
If I need a hand who’s going to ensure a long and stable rule Barth
I I need a friend loyal to me because I’m surrounded by a lot of vipers Ned Stark
If I’m a mad man and need to be killed Tywin Lannister
When it comes to Lord commander it’s either Dunc, Ser Aemon the Dragonknight or Ser Barristan Selmy
Master of ships corlys Velaryon Stannis the Manis or Aurane
Master of whispers bloodraven
Master of Coin absolutely no clue
Master of Laws Prince Deamon Well all the thieves in kings landing disappeared pretty quick
@@wargey3431 Tywin and Otto are great effective rulers but they are ambitious and will take advantage of you. Cregan Stark is an interesting one, maybe would be a good fit for Master of Laws but I doubt he would stay in the South. Now for a real solid Master of Laws Ned Stark, if he stays in the South he can do alot of good for the smallfolk and right many wrongs.
Honestly I would want to pick Barth over Viserys if I had the choice again tbh, but imagine having both on the same council? Like give me a council slot for a Septon and give me Barth though I the position gives alot of power to the Faith of the Seven.
@@wargey3431 Would not trust Aurane after what he did to Cersei but to be fair can you blame him haha. Daemon I wish would just be the Commander of the City Watch and be granted an advisor slot maybe. He is very heavy handed with law and thinking the Targs are superior to all so he may care less about the normal lords qualms or the smallfolk. But he does do a damn fine job preventing crime :P
I think two notable Hands are Baelor Breakspear and the Ned. Ned is the guy you can completely trust to do his duties, put him in an ideal small council and it's great. Baelor showed how good of a man he was in Dunk and Egg.
Cregan Stark for his actions during the hour of the Wolf deserves an honourable mention
the best king of westeros video is just three seconds long: "Jahaerys, the end"
While the Small Council is undoubtedly essential - what do we know about how any of the positions function?
In the books (less in the show), we see just *how **_many_* under-positions & functionaries the Master of Coin controls, for instance -- & it appears that LF has manipulated other positions, possibly outside his direct control (Keepers of Keys)...
Also, HotD has introduced under-positions for the Master of Whisperers, with Larys Strong being a confessor before his elevation.
Edited: word
Nice to see some Tyland Lannister recognition!
Varys turned Aerys against Rhaegar, plotted with Illyrio to bring a Dothraki army against Robert’s realm, and set the Tyrell’s and the Lannisters against each other under Tommen.
By contrast, Bloodraven was responsible for alerting Daeron of the first Blackfyre rebellion, killing several Blackfyre heirs, putting down two further Blackfyre rebellions (including aborting one while magically disguised). Explain to me how Varys is better again?
Going to say this... every Master of Whispers we know nothing about did a better job than Varys, Rivers, or Strong... why?
We know nothing about them, that's why. They did their stuff, kept things quiet, and faded into the background.
I can understand the reasoning behind all of them but I could see a problem regarding representation. You basically have 3 people who derive from Essos (Viserys, Varys and Corlys), one from Kings Landing (Duncan), one Maester and two Lennisters. Even though each member (maybe except Varys) is loyal I can see some of the other Kingdoms being jealous of the Lennisters for having two members while all other Kingdoms basically have nobody representing them. This might cause problems.
Aemon and Baelon (sons of Jaehaerys) and Baelor Breakspear all deserve consideration for their fine council work during their fathers' reigns
An excellent line up. But I must ask, which king would they advise to have the most stable and prosperous realm?
Also good luck with finals.
I can’t say Viserys II because he’s already on the council, my gut says Daeron II? I might dedicate a future video to that topic.
Ser Pounce, of course!
@@QuinnTheGM Love to hear it.
@@thing_under_the_stairs Oh but of course.
Patchface for master of ships easy
Surprised the Lannisters got two spots. That’s 1/2 of all the spots they could have gotten
In retrospect that surprised me too, though I credit that mostly to master of laws being a weak category
8:12 Having Varys as master of whisper is such a shit idea. The most important thing about a spy master is trust and you can't trust Varys. Bloodraven is the only master of whisper to have proven is loyalty which is worth the bad kinslayer reputation plus most of the bad press he gets is when he become hands through one of the most troubled times in Westeros and it's clear he is use as a scapegoat.
If I remember correctly cersi changed the names in a deranged attempt at curbing any ambitious members I.E. "you are *Master* of nothing I AM THE QUEEN"
You’d disqualify Bloodraven because there’s a chance he’d try to overthrow his liege and then pick Varys who has literally been plotting against his liege (and previous lieges) from the start?
Is it really that bad Barristan made a coup against Hizdar? For all we know, he wasn't the most supportive of Daenerys' reign and policy. Sure, at face value it IS bad for the Lord Commander of the kingsguard to betray his king (Ser Goldenhand the Just, I'm looking at you), but that's the thing. Hizdar isn't Selmy's king. He is sworn to Dany. If the king consort to his monarch is (supposedly) plotting against your queen, would you stand by and let him wreack havok on her things? The guy did urge Dany to eat the locusts, and wasn't against killing Drogon.
Now, I would justify Barry being a bad kingsguard when he bent the knee to Robert and served him for 15 years. Only after Joffrey dismissed him for being old, the guy got pissed and went in search of Viserys and Dany. Only after this did he consider being loyal to the house he served for more than 20 years. And if we are to say he's just, then why did he stay silent when Cersei disregarded HIS OWN KING'S decree? He did nothing when they condemned Ned Stark to death. Fickle loyanties this man has.
Barristan’s coup shatters the peace that Dany spent the entirety of Dance building, and directly plays into the hands of pretty much all of her enemies. Hizdar wasn’t an ideal ruler, nor was Barry sworn to him, but peace in Slaver’s Bay was contingent on retaining his position as king.
@@QuinnTheGM yes, you are right. If we are judging them by the consequences of their actions and not the actions itself. he had limited information on who was trying to work against Dany's peace, so he acted. Clearly didn't go as well as they expected, either because the slavers saw it as a betrayal to their agreement (which was already crumbling because of Drogon) or because the Shavepate is the guy manipulating Selmy. It is the situation where if you do nothing, things will get out of hand for sure, but if you act, it can get better. Unfortunately, Barristan is unlucky on that department.
In AFFC, Cersei renames more than just master of laws including master of coin (which you said she should) Master of Ships becomes Grand Admiral and Master of Coin becomes Lord Treasurer. This is a Free Cities thing, I think it was because she didn't like the idea of them being masters, wanting them to be completely loyal to her.
I really love the title Justicar btw.
This is a truly goated small council!
Jaehaerys is the greatest king in Westerosi history since the Conquest, hands down. But neat idea for a video, fun listen.
Daemon in his time as master of laws singlehandedly remade the city guard and created the gold cloaks, I think that does count for something
I don’t know if Dany will have the best small council but she’ll definitely have the most interesting
Tyrion as hand
Barriston as lord commander
Victerian as master of ships
Marwin as grand maester
Cersei’s inner monologue says she “will have no masters in King’s Landing but her” so she changes the names of all the council positions
Hand of The King: Ser Brynden “Bloodraven” Rivers
Grand Maester: Hareth
Master of Laws: Ser Kevan Lannister
Master of Coin: Rego Draz
Master of Ships: Alyn “The Oakenfist” Velaryon
Master of Whisperers: Qyburn
Lord Commander of The Kingsguard: Ser Criston “The Kingmaker” Cole
Advisor: Nymeria Sand
Advisor: Ser Torrhen Manderly
Advisor: Mathis Rowan
Similare video idea: What would be the best setup or great lords for a prosperous realm? So which Stark, Lannister, Tyrell etc. from history was the best
There isn’t a perfect analogy to medieval England, but I’ve always guessed the Master of Laws was in charge of the system of courts at the king’s level and at the local levels. The other options lead back to the power of the Small Council or Hand of the King (chief justiciars / chancellors / curia regia / et cetera). Just a guess, though.
I love your videos! I'm not sure if you did a theory on this yet or not, but the suspicious death of Viserys II really caught my attention recently. Viserys and Tywin are parallels to one another, and we know how Martin loves his historical parallels (ex: Ned honorably too Dawn back to House Dayne while Tywin took Ice for himself). Tywin was killed by his Son, though not by poisoning but there's speculation for that. By all accounts Viserys was old, but still healthy. Would this mean he wasn't killed by his son? Than by who? Many agreed Viserys had it him to be a 2nd Conciliator, so it wasn't political. I suspect it was the maesters, as the world book immediately points towards Aegon IV as the culprit (a perfect scalegoat). What did Viserys know that the maesters couldn't risk getting out? Or was it to further destabilize the dynasty faster under the reign of the Unworthy?
Or was there something more going on? This is where I'm getting tinfoil hat on. What if Baelor actually gave into his lust and slept with Daena, fathering Daemon? (Perhaps the real reason for his 40 day fasting). So the next question is why Aegon IV would claim Daemon as his own? We're never told outright but it seems Aegon thought very highly of his cousins (naming his first trueborn son Daeron and returning the Dornish hostage he was sleeping with to Viserys after Baelor got hurt on trip back home). Perhaps he never told anyone to preserve Baelors imagine. Viserys, king at this point, probably caught on but got killed before he could abigate the throne. Aegon probably wanted to abigate himself, but him and all his vices wanted his cake and ate it to, leaving his will legitimatizing "his son" trying to do right by his cousins. Anyway im done rambling but it's interesting to think about😅
I really don't know what the master of laws would do that isn't a responsibility contained by the king or local nobility. Is it more adjudicating or legislating?
Doesn't pick bloodraven because he's not good for the monarchs he's served ... Goes on to pick VARYS!?
If I remember correctly, the idea with Cersei renaming all of the offices on the Small Council was that she didn't like the idea that there were "masters" on the Council and in government besides her, so she renamed the offices in the tradition of Essos with titles like Lord Justicar, Lord Treasure, and Lord Admiral.
She had a temper tantrum and renamed 300 year old offices to sooth her ego.
Not picking bloodraven is criminal, even if people were scared and revolted he would take care of them just like with the blackfyre rebellions.
I think master of law is a between congressman and supreme judge. He makes laws, supervises other judges and dispenses justice.
What I love about Game if Thrones is that basically all of the first small council member shown are actually really, really competent men who know what they're doing, including Pycelle despite what he's trying to show and maybe excluding Renly. Had they shared their interests the kingdom would be in its golden age, but as it stands Robert's council was just a snake den with each snake having it's own ambition.
Master of Laws: Septon Barth
Master of Ships: Lord Stannis Baratheon
Master of Coin: Prince Viserys Targaryen (the future king, brother of Aegon III)
Master of Whisperers: Lord Larys Strong
Lord Commander of the Kingsguard: Ser Aemon Targaryen (the Dragonknight)
Grand Maester: Maester Aemon (of the Night's Watch)
Hand of the King: Lord Tywin Lannister
Thats a good choice. Although i would switch Tyland with Rego Draz. Two Lannisters in a small council seems a bit excessive,i would imagine the realm would grumbling about it. 🤣
Rego Draz would be a better overall naster of coin in my opinion. He had a solid career as master of coin. Also Tyland to things were not typical duties of the master coin.
Picking Varys because Bloodraven might turn people against king while all of Varyss kings were assassinated.
I mean you can't blame the mad king's death on Varys. You don't need a master of whispers to know that the son of the guy who is currently sacking your city (who, incidently, Varys correctly advised against letting in) might have some motive to betray you.
Ah yes! The Grand Medicine Person. Key member in the council.
no mention of Gerald Hightower the White bull is kinda crazy
4:00 Cersei did rebrand Master of Coin. In fact, she rebranded a few of the positions. I think Master of Coin became Treasurer and Master of Ships became Lord Admiral or something like that. Can’t remember the others. I think she says the new titles are based off of what they use in Braavos. I think she just wanted it to sound fancier, but like most of her decisions in Feast, it’s dumb
Isn't there also meant to be a Master of War or am I imagining that?
Cersei made that position up, mainly to have someone be in charge of the royal armies but without the authority the traditional title "Protector of the Realm" implies, so her appointed general wouldn't have an independent power base.
This video is to remind the King that his network is his net worth.
I don't think it's pronounced "justa-car". I think it's more like "jus-TISS-ee-ar". . .
It’s pronounced just-isher, all the asoiaf channels pronounce it incorrectly
I couldn't remember off the top how other channels say it (not that it really matters). . . It was an English/Scottish title now that I think about it. So your pronunciation is probably how it was actually said real world. I was trying to picture accents with my pronunciation. My point was more about GM omitting the second 'i'.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but if I remember right Cersei renames a bunch of if not all the positions and uses Essosi names instead of the traditional “Master of” ones, and I think her justification is that she will have “no masters” on her council.
Might be misremembering but that’s what I recall.
Didn’t Cersei also change the name of the master of ships? Also a best possible council made of people who haven’t already done it would be a great video!
I am rewatching GoT currently as I never finished watching it. THIS time I am paying attention to the props and lighting, etc. Holy SHITE! It is changing the entire show-making it SO much better. Even the first seasons! Look at that tapestry behind them-you get different parts of it lit up in different scenes and it is playing out wtf happened at the Trident. Look at the Hands symbol-it is a Garth hand holding a wreath of green fire when you see it in stained glass in the Tower of the Hand. Look at the shadows of the characters! Soe of them have 2 some have none and some of them have shadows going in ways they should not due to the CLEVER use of lighting and blue filtered night. Arya has the sound of crickets and locusts playing for her lowkey even during the day-it is ALWAYS night for her. Sansa has the sound of birds lowkey in her scenes. Dany has the cricket night sounds during the daytime as well. House of the Dragon is doing the same thing so i went back to look at GoT and I think I was wrong-there is a chance the show was SUPER brilliant good shit. What they are doing is the coolest crossover from OLD theater to modern screen I have ever seen. The Masters-text and show, Essos or Westeros-masters are in a ton of danger once named as masters.
Varys is such an awful choice. You only think your goals are aligned but really he's going to overthrow you despite your otherwise perfect council. Quyburn is so much better if you know how to keep him happy.
Is having two Lannisters on the small council wise? Nothing to say about their competency, but giving House Lannister too much power over affairs might give them ideas, and might also cause some jealousy among other houses who weren't picked. For this reason, I'm giving master of laws to Lyonnel Strong. I don't care if his competent protrayal was show only; he was master of laws during one of the most peaceful times so he must have been at least somewhat competent.
Fireball was top tier Lord Commander.
My boy kev is the goat
3:48 she rename the SC offices just for ego as far as I remember, to have no other masters on the council besides her
As much as I like Tyland Lannister, especially during his time as Hand to Aegon III, I think Rego Draz from Jaehaerys’s reign is the best Master of Coin
Thumbs up for the TWD reference.
What around Rego Draz as master of coin?
Tbf if stannis and ywin where on roberts it would be pretty great
Sandoq the shadow for the kings guard position.
Best hand of the king- bloodraven
Best master of whispers- bloodraven
Best master of coin- bronn
Best master of ships- stannis
Best master of laws- daemon
Best lord commander- barriston selmy
Best grand maester- qyburn
For the position of Lord Commander of the Kingsguard, I would say that Gerold Hightower is a good candidate too. For the position of Master of whisperers, in my opinion, there are three candidates : Bloodraven of course, Varys, but also and perhaps above all Larys Strong : The man who defeated Rhaenyra is him. Obviously, he is handicapped by the fact that he ends up probably betraying his king, but in terms of skills, he is in my opinion the best. For the best hand of the king, there are three characters who seem to me to be forgotten a little quickly: Tywin Lannister, Otto Hightower and Septon Barth. I would perhaps eliminate Tywin Lannister, for obvious reasons, but his competence cannot be questioned. Otto Hightower is perhaps the most competent of all, and since I don't see him as the real person responsible for the Dance of Dragons, perhaps he is the one I would choose. Septon Barth also seems to be a model of his genre, both in terms of competence and loyalty. For the others, I tend to agree...