Massive Speed and Spin on your Forehand Drive!! Tennis Secrets Applied to Pickleball
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- čas přidán 6. 06. 2024
- Can Zane HIT the ball HARD?!?
This video will teach you how to hit amazing forehand topspin drives with the right grip and speed to win all your games! This in depth breakdown will level up your game if you are a pickleball beginner to pro. The forehand drive will help both your pickleball singles and pickleball doubles gameplay. We highlight key secrets of the forehand drive.
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Chapters:
00:00 INTRO
00:33 FOREHAND MYTHS
01:25 SPEED
01:55 ROTATION
02:45 LAG
03:27 HOW TO
04:33 SELKIRK
04:58 BREAKDOWN - Sport
Great breakdown of the stroke! I personally just started playing Pickleball, but I've played years of competitive tennis and table tennis. My first day serving on the PB court felt so natural. I was already acing those who have been playing for months. What you are explaining as: Rotation + Lag = Speed is so familiar. I remember my instructors teaching "Racquet Head speed" in tennis, accelerating the racquet head by snapping your wrist right before impact. This was made popular by Andre Agassi who had excellent hand to eye coordination; he appeared to slap the ball with power and spin from both wings. The closest I get to hitting with power and control like him is on table tennis where my practice partner and I would send the ball over the table 3 times in under 2 seconds.
Please keep sending the great videos, I'm so eager to learn this new sport. Any recommendations for PB paddles for spin and control? Thank you!
That was a slap and a half!
A work of art
it was a lucky shot
You've got the semi-closed tennis stance, which I prefer.
Your forehand drive video from a year or more ago gave me a really good serve, in addition to a good drive. Now, after seeing Jack Sock smoke the ball with this technique, I’m very excited to bring this into my serve and the rest of my game. Thanks!
FYI, I routinely get comments on my serve and I tell them they can do it too, just check out Cincola’s video!
That’s awesome, I love to hear it 👊
Great video! Really good breakdown!!
Appreciate it!
Absolutely love this video. I've been trying to take my drive to the next level as I aim for that 5.0 level (I've typically been more of a placement>power type of player, but you need both as you get better). I was wondering if you could elaborate a bit more on the technique when the ball is lower. I know you need more of a low --> high motion, but are there other considerations?
Thanks, John. Im a fan of how you break down the game and techniques. I noticed in your drop drill that you were swinging controlled and off your right foot. Did Zane being on his left foot allow him to completely uncoil to help create that powerful shot?
Thank you so much!
Glad it helped!
Great video, thank you. Just to be clear, it looks like the ball is exiting from the top of the paddle, not the side. Is this ideal? I have been trying to figure out where the ball should ideally exit the paddle face, either the top or the side. Do you know what I mean?
Could you help me understand why you say that Zane was in an open position? When I watch the video, he looks closer to "closed" than open. At the 06:00 mark, when he's about to make contact, it looks like his toes are facing the wall, as is his chest. Am I misunderstanding closed vs. open?
I have trouble with understanding everyone's use of this as well, not coming from tennis. In golf there are typically 3 positions relative to the swing path towards the hole. Neutral, lined up parallel to the swing path (--), open - facing towards the swing path slightly (/), closed, facing away from the swing path slightly (\). I think the difference is that John was completely or fully open in his demo and Zane was Semi-open. Not really neutral and definitely not closed.
it's definitely more closed than open. however when you watch the full swing, he doesn't generate power off the back foot like a traditional closed stance. zane sorta just uncoils and lets his body fall towards the ball instead of pushing with the backfoot and stepping in.
TLDR, not open stance, but all the video suggestions are still applicable.
Yeah, I was looking at his right foot. He was uncoiling his lower body away from swing. What was that?
Conner Garnett, in his video on hitting the two handed backhand, emphases keeping the stroke following the path of the ball as Lomb as possible. Is the backhand technique different?
Great video John as usual. Can't wait to drill this one...
Thanks!!
hey John, is this myth or not? do I have to finish my forehand swing over my shoulder as part of the turning motion for speed?
Best pickleball video every made. Your comparing the swing to other sport swing, in my case the golf swing, brought it home. I been practicing it for several days , hitting thousands of practice shots, I figure in a few months I will have it. Let’s go Fives.🤡
When in the bounce should you contact the ball for groundstrokes? At the top of the bounce (apex/peak), before (rising), or after (falling)?
Ideally at the apex or just as the ball starts falling from apex.
I love your forehand! That's a smaller version of a Federer's forehand(the GOAT)
Thanks, I was actually going to add a Federer forehand breakdown to this video because his technique is what I studied a lot in tennis and tried to emulate. I didn’t want the video to be too long and technical though.
@@johncincolapickleball Would love to see that if you still want to post it as an addendum!!
Can you comment on how he created the topspin? Looks like as he swung across his body he came over or on top of the ball with his paddle face pointing down? You have to put a lot of topspin on it to keep it in hitting that hard.
He actually brushed up the back and over table tennis style.
You just need the paddle brushing up the ball through contact. If you’re going for heavy spin when you go into the “lag” phase you want the paddle to lag behind and below your hand. As it pulls forward it will rotate up and then continue to rotate above the hand in the finish.
The speed up in pickleball reminds me of the speed up in table tennis (many years ago). Indeed, this shot looks more like a table tennis shot (positioning of the feet, top spin, etc.) than what I have been taught by PB coaches.
When I started playing PB (7 years ago) I was told “Just get the ball over the net, have patience, dink and let your opponent make an unforced error, dink until you drop” ….. not anymore you have to be more aggressive, hit the ball hard, turn your dink into a roll/speed-up that targets your opponent. Be more offensive than defensive.
Indeed. It looks like a table tennis forehand topspin smash, with the left leg forward and trunk rotating with the swing of the arm.
One reason for most mere mortals have to TURN their body sideways is so that they can: (1) Involve the torso in generating power given that most do not have the power in the rest of the body to generate needed power. (2) Avoid Injury by spreading the torque/force over a longer time period as they accelerate. I have the mental and muscular speed to accelerate ala Tyson McGuffin (albeit not quite as fast) BUT my tendons cannot take all that torque/force over a very short snappy acceleration to speed. So I had to lengthen the amount of time I accelerate over. Hence I had to go back to using a lot of the torso turn.
The largest amount of human power generation comes from hip and knee extension (glutes, hams, quads) not the torso. Torso just transmits the power to the arms. Open stance places that opening on the dominant leg.
By definition, if you increase the amount of time you decrease acceleration (acceleration = change in velocity / time).
Do you have a backhand video?
Not yet, I’m gonna work on that
I counted 14 frames at 24 fps, or a bit under 600 ms from paddle to floor. Say 40 feet and you have a 45 mph average ball velocity.
Sound about right. That’s the average over the whole distance of the shot though. The ball slows down a lot through the air so it was probably considerably faster coming off the paddle.
no need imo to think about rotation ie it just happens - think (a) lag, even if you need to preset and (b) eyes on the ball
step into the stroke when hitting the ball
Ok, so just disregard everything I said in the video 👍
It looks to me like Zane hit that from a closed stance. His rear foot lifts off the ground and behind him, like a counter movement.
This would be considered a semi open stance. He loads on his rear foot and drives to initiate the hip rotation. His rear foot comes off the ground and around as a product of his body rotating to his finish and having to unwind.
After watching this I got pulled over by the police because I was driving too fast !
Don't quit your day job bud
I see what you did there. Your dad joke game is almost as good as your backhand counter
All modern tennis players have an open stance forehand. The follow through after you hit the ball is the most important, so your paddle is accelerating. Also the continental grip does not work for lots of speed.
I agree follow through is important but I don’t like to teach it. If you tell someone to follow through they just fake it/ force it. The follow through is just a product of acceleration. If you teach how to accelerate and get speed with follow through happens on its own.
@@johncincolapickleball like the pose in golf. Ya gotta look good.
@@johncincolapickleball very interesting point! Never heard it put that way
Can I get an entry ticket to the lab 😂
Zane was very closed in his stance to start, not open.
Zane is completely turned sideways. What are you talking about. Kinetic chain! Cone on man
Just watch Jack Sock's technique!
It doesn't look there was hardly a top spin at all as the ball only stayed on the paddle for a tiny split second. It looks like Navratil just wacked it with a whipping motion, and what kept the ball in, is that the ball at point of contact was above the net and Navratil hit it like a sideways smash from high to low. It went on a straight line from his paddle face to as close to the net without hitting it, ending darn close to the baseline at almost the perfect point where the base line and the perpendicular middle line intersect. One of the most perfect shots I've ever seen. If anything, it was a bit of side spin applied by the paddle in a side and downward motion.
Yeah, in this instance he was going for all speed and very little spin. The majority of the time Zane will hit with a lot more upward swing through the ball to create heavy topspin.
And as the game gets faster, eye protection becomes more important. I cringe when I see all of you guys hitting the ball so hard, so fast, with nothing to protect your eyeballs. Emulate Anna Liegh and protect the one spot on your body where a speeding pickleball can do catastrophic damage. Otherwise, great content.
Simplifying the technical aspects of all strokes is very important. I always enjoy and look forward to hearing your tips and ideas for instruction. While not absolutely essential to have a closed stance, I believe using it is easier for weight transfer/ torque ( hitting forward thru the ball) and certainly easier on the body. Many of my students have mobility and / or joint issues. I find that just having them relax and lay that wrist/ paddle back slightly helps them to create that lag and helps them speed the paddle up ( whip thru the ball) for more power. The elbow action mentioned and shown seems a bit concerning...any thoughts if using this can contribute to developing " tennis elbow" ?
Again, my students vary in age and safety is foremost....just want to provide the best instruction tailored to their needs but also instruction which won't limit their potential.
You don't need eye protection. This isn't paintball.
@@natebeal18 Really? Nobody ever takes a pickleball to the eye? There are never eye injures in pickleball? Brilliant!
Body turn: you did not mention Frederico , should be what a person is comfortable with, everyone body acts a little different
You sure I didn't hit the fastest forehand in pickleball against a 3.5 doing a moonball serve back in 2021? C'mon, you remember right?
The opening FH. He just wrist slapped it. 🙄He’ll miss 95% of those. There is a reason tennis pros don’t wrist slap their groundstrokes.
That “he” is Zane Navratilova. He’s a pro.
@@frankfurter7260 jack sock technique
Technically true. He hit this one flat and hard just for fun. It was low percentage. He can creat the same paddle speed and change his swing path to brush up the ball more to create more spin and hit this very hard with a high level of consistency. I see him and all the other pros I play with do it everyday.
@@johncincolapickleball I love your videos but you just contradicted your reply to me above. I said what you showed in the video was very low percentage and I would welcome my opponents to use it. Here in this comment you say it is a low percentage shot that Zane hit. I understand what you are trying to teach but the graphic and demo did not match what you are conveying. I basically applied a lot of techniques from your vids but I will pass on this one. I can't get the ball in if I don't create enough spin on the ball.
The point of the video is to teach how to create speed in the paddle. The shot of Zane is just an example of him creating a lot speed. He just happened to have hit that ball very flat but that’s not what I’m telling you to do. If you look at all the examples of me hitting forehands from the side view in the video I’m using the same lag and rotation concept that I’m teaching and hitting with heavy topspin.
Mlb baseball players , with great power have the shoulder turn side ways with hip and weight going forward , Sam thing with golf players , stop being lazy with your foot work hip weight shoulders going forward sometimes back foot going forward following theu
Actually they don’t. They may start sideways but there is very little foreword movement. The drive off the back leg is to initiate hip rotation not forward movement. Also baseball players and golfers actually brace there front leg to stop forward movement so the club/ bat accelerates faster.
Not to mention an open stance is way faster for setup and recovery of court position. which baseball players and golfers don’t have to worry about.
Wow! And it looks like he didn't even hit the sweet spot of the paddle...
My opponents. Please learn this. I will gladly win point off your unforced errors. And I like to drive the ball but this technique requires you to time the hit of the ball perfectly or it will fly.
Don’t worry, they will. The game is getting faster whether you like it or not. I hope you’re ready for it.
Guy in the blue tee is clearly not as impressed as everyone else.
dudes stance is absolutely not open. That is a fully closed golf/baseball swing.
Pickle is better faster.
ageed
So he hit a racquetball flat hard shot. That shot is not a repeatable pickleball shot...really bad video.
Or you totally missed the point of the video. The video is about how to increase paddle speed. In that particular example Zane is hitting flat. In the examples of me hitting a forehand from the side view I’m using the same concepts and hitting with heavy topspin.