American Civil War - River War Pt 1 - Up the creek but have ironclad
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- čas přidán 11. 09. 2024
- Today we speak to author and historian Sean Chick about the riverine aspect of the American Civil War.
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During the battle of Island #10, there was an amusing incident that can be found in the official archives. The battle took place just upstream from New Madrid on the TN/ KY border where there was an S-curve in the river. There was a battery that looked straight up the river and that was getting attention from the Bombardment barges as first threat. At one point the Union forces stopped firing and the battery commander watched a small steam boat approach is battery under a flag of truce and inquire about terms of surrender. The battery Lt. was confused and asked what the union officer was talking about. The union officer, now confused basically said,”Sir, your battery is flying the white flag. Don’t you want to surrender?” The confederate looked to his signal flag he had been using to communicate with the local headquarters and realized to his chagrin that the flag was white. There was then an apologetic conversation about the improper use of a white flag to communicate with the rear and that he had no intentions to surrender. I can imagine the Union officer had a bit of a chuckle at the mistake. He then apologized for his mistaken intent, went back up stream and the bombardment continued. When I read this in the Official archives, I had a good laugh at the absurdity of it and show the weird things that can happen in war.
This report is in the archives (it was on a right hand page) but I read it back in the early nineties so I may be wrong about some of the details.
Edit: I am familiar with many of the etiquette of the time period and the above incident a great example of those courtesies in action. For those who would like to look into this, I believe it was a report from the Confederate officer and should be found in the Confederate's records.
Further Edit: See below for post with sited report per official archives
Probably the best definition of a "civil war" xD "Apologies my good sir for our improper use of the flag of truce"... proceeds to shoot guy in the face.
@@Corristo89 I have always found the various stories of the Courtesies of War the fascinating regardless of the time period.
“Whoa, whoa. Everyone just hold on. We got a rule dispute.”
Big oof
Reading the Official Records myself, right now! Just finished Series 1 Volume seven, and reading now about that very battle! Can't wait to get to the Confederates' side of things [We weren't beat!"]
Library of Congress has the entire series available online.
Listed as "The War of the Rebellion" and comes with maps and everything!
"This time we are going to talk about an interesting subject"
You make it sound like interesting subjects are the exception rather than the rule here. :P
Bro replace the emoticon with "lol" and this is the exact sentence I came down here to type. Faux paragraph break and all. I'm kinda creeped out.
What I consider interesting other people may not. I can watch a whole video on Naval logistics and enjoy it. Though what I find funny is when I was in the U.S. Navy, I would have been bored to tears about Naval history. I was in my 20's, and those kinds of things were furthest from my mind. Now in my 40's, I can't get enough history content.
To be fair the earliest Ironclads are a VERY interresting subject.
@@dougfoust117 hhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
"One fleet, slightly used." Was lowkey the best thing in this episode.
Also the sign that Congress had ready before the ink dried at Appomattox.
@@AdmRose
Not even close.
It's right up there with when Drach called the French navy something akin to, "A rather truculent unit of the British fleet reserve."
Guess what: War is not funny. I notice there are no mentions of casualties or suffering in these programs.
@@johnbailey4734 what? People die in war? Why didn't somebody tell me this?
"Spoilers: The Union won" - Drach
*Surprised Pikachu face*
Darn! Why did he have to go and ruin the ending? :-)
“Wait am I in the wrong timeline again”
Well, recall that there are still some fools who believe otherwise, despite all evidence to the contrary.
"The south shall rise again!"
"Why?"
"Uh.... um... heritage?"
"Were your ancestors even here in the 1860s?"
".........no."
@@AsbestosMuffins And to a certain extent ditto for a lot of people demanding reparations for slavery. To be taken from a bunch of people whose ancestors were in other countries during the Civil War. To say nothing of the descendants of Union soldiers and sailors who would be expected to pony up for that.
"Put your faith in God and gunboats."
Americans are second only to the Spartans in war-time rhetoric.
You mean like "Praise the lord and pass the ammunition", and "Nuts!"?
I kind of like Cromwells quote put your faith in God and keep your powder dry.
@@michaelsommers2356 and “damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead”
Men the enemy are ahead, they are behind, they are to the left and the right. They can't get away from us now.
"Come on, you sons of bitches, do you want to live for ever?!"
The guest is talking just like he is fighting a Demon inside trying to possess him.
lol
Everybody doesn't have that?
_Huh._
Might also just be some technical gremlins with the audio recording itself.
Uhhh yeah, don’t know what’s going on there.
Could be, or most likely just a bad mic
That the Union had functional ironclads 1000 miles inland prior to the Battle of Hampton Roads has always been one of my favorite obscure history facts. So excited to see you covering the Brown Water Navy.
Yeah but the Confederates had one in the middle of an African desert so there.
@@wingracer1614 😀
@@wingracer1614 very useful and a cliver cussler book.
@@wingracer1614 That was the ironclad that shot down a helicopter. right?
@@wingracer1614 css Texas last ironclad built at Richmond captured and sold 1867 iirc. In Cussler book escapes with treasure and Abe Lincoln
There is one Civil War ironclad still in existence which can be visited, the USS Cairo was raised from the mud of the Yazoo in the 1960s and is currently housed at the Vicksburg National Monument.
I've been to her, and she is in rough shape. If there wasn't a sign that read "USS _Cairo,_ I would think she was a small destroyed power plant.
There was an Ironclad sold to the Victorian Navy in Australia the remains are still visible. Search HMVS Cerberus there are a few good pics of it.
USS Carondelet has a really tragic story.
Extremely busy in the war, sunk and lost for over a hundred years. Clive Cussler tracked it down, and when he went to search the river, found out a river dredger had passed over the wreck only two days before, destroying her.
Hunley is technically still "sunk", only in a tank of treated water in a preservation lab.
Thanks to Clive Cussler.
the fact that the Union Navy was able to go from a few ships to being able to blockade THE ENTIRE SOUTH in a few short years is mind boggling because you had to have people, ships, ships to supply those ships, people on those ships, and so on and so forth, and they started with next to nothing
L o g i s t i c s
In fairness, this was in a time and place where a requisitioned merchant ship equipped with a couple 9 pounders passed for a warship.
And that is why the north won.
Apparently, the U.S. went from a 10,000 man army and a few ships to one of the biggest militaries and economies in the world during those years. They had everything needed to be a world dominating empire, at the time, but instead went "nah" for 75 years.
@@L0stEngineer It was more fun to get the Europeans to pay for our world dominance by buying weapons for their pointless wars. /shrug
There’s a life-sized mock-up of the USS Monitor at the Mariner’s Museum in Newport News, Virginia as a part of their Monitor exhibit. This also includes mock-ups of the Monitor’s turret when it was first discovered and what it was like prior to it sinking.
I know about this because I was there opening day of the exhibit with my reenacting unit.
You beat me too it! (Should have looked before I posted :-) What unit were you with? I was a member of Co H 32nd VA
@@stopspammandm, 12th Va. Co. B.
@@stopspammandm, I was ~12-13 when they opened up the exhibit, so I was with the line infantry. However, I was there for the opening ceremony with my mother and brother. Fun event, to say the least.
@@JegerVonOni They raised her turret, engines, and a few other pieces but her hull for the most part still remains where she sank
@@sirboomsalot4902 Yeah, the hull was left both as a war grace, but also for the fact that it's extremely fragile after all those years at the bottom.
The Battle of Vicksburgs was brilliant and it is still being studied for the hybrid warfare in terms of amphibious operations.
Just so, the whole campaign was a demonstration of Grant's outstanding Generalship.
@@roll4initiative872 the navy always gets ignored in the western campaigns in favour of Grant which is a shame, especially since Grants first major victory, the battle of Fort Henry was really won by a naval squadron that forced the fort to surrender before Grants army even arrived
Despite the armchair historians focusing on the eastern campaigns, the Civil War was really won when Vicksburg fell and the Confederate armies were driven out of Tennessee later in 1863. Grant had learned everything about how to defeat Confederate armies by that time. A less skilled commanding general than Lee would have never lasted into 1865.
@@observationsfromthebunker9639 I concur,, Vicksburg was to the Civil War as Midway was to WWII, it was only a matter of how long the opposition would last (not that it felt that way to the participants in either case).
@@roll4initiative872 I think it was up in the air until the Emancipation Proclamation was released, as the only way the CSA would have won is if there was a British/French intervention and they wouldn't intervene with slaver nation
"But Have Ironclad" -Jefferson Davis when Lee surrendered
Sad reacts only for Jefferson Davis.
World: the civil war Will see the development of the ironclad.
Confederacy: introduces cottonclads.
To slightly terrify you, the first Armored train (and first railway Gun used in combat) was made by the Confederacy. Some of the cars were armored with tightly-wrapped cotton bails strapped to the sides.
@William Mulvaney unless allowed to siphon water... on the other hand, I bet that would cause buoyancy and stability issues for ironclads...
@@seanchick8451, yeah. It was used during the Battle of Savage’s Station as a part of Lee’s overall plan to drive McClellan back. He wanted an armored railway train to drive forward and assault the Union’s main depot at Savage’s Station in order to cut the army off from supply. So, in order to do this, Lee asked for the navy to build him an armored railway car with a front-mounted cannon. They ended up granting this request, built the armored railway gun, and had the honor of manning the gun when it was driven forward down the Richmond and York River railroad line (a line that’s still in service, by the way) to meet the federals at Savage’s Station.
Unfortunately for Lee, the battle ended in a stalemate, though the federals would abandon the station and move southward towards Glendale.
You use what you have.
If god gives you cotton make cottonade
Confederate shipbuilding be like:
Oi, boss! Look what the Mekboy has come up with!
Paints ship red...
*Salesman slaps roof of ironclad* This’un fits so much dakka in it!
I do say, general WarBozz, why are those boys in blue screaming about "For the Greater Good" on their charge. Should we get the dander up and give em a good Crumpin?
Red uns' go fasta!
*Dakka Dakka Dakka*
Accurate.
Maybe when you discuss maps again have like small arrows pointing at the river or location because I had a hard time following on the map.
I was trying to follow this using Google Maps on a second monitor... and could not.
As an American that knows where these rivers are, I agree with the above.
i second this notion.
Drach , stop being stingy on graphics
@@murderouskitten2577 Stingy may be a bit harsh; decent graphics are a time consuming process, and in this case, where it involves an interview of a guest expert, it’s difficult to predict where the conversation is going to go into detail and call for helpful visual graphics
@@parrot849 i was being sarcastic ;)
As a 40 year enthusiast of Civil War ironclads I didnt know I needed you to do this until you did it.
When he said "It was one of the Confederacy's main sources of beef" I thought he meant "beef" like "disagreement"....
I think I need to go get a coffee.
It *is* possible he meant both versions...
Texas has always been like that.
The one thing I liked about this period.. when I was young.. was that you could make models of the monitors in about 5 minutes..
John Ericsson probably thought the same. USS Monitor went from laying down to launch in less than 100 days.
The mortar boat model from Paper Shipwright probably took as long - but it is free!
lol I made a DIY one. I used one of those brass spray nozzles you get for your garden hose as the cannon.
What I like about this period is that I could ride a bike to several battlefields (born and raised in Richmond). Highly recommend visiting Drewry's Bluff if you're ever in the area. I would not want to have to take a ship up that river with that big ass canon on the hill.
@William Mulvaney Ive always wanted to do something like that and never knew where to start.
Great to hear Sean Chick! His book on Petersburg is a must read for Civil War buffs. My great-great grandfather was there with the 11th Pennsylvania Cavalry so I had a special interest. His contribution here on the river campaigns was just fabulous and I am so glad you had him on!
Thanks for the tip! I understand that my g-g-grandfather was there with the 26th Mississippi.
At Vicksburg, you can see the remains of the USS Cairo that was sunk and recovered in more recent times. As it was under river silt, there were lots of artifacts recovered.
"Row row row your boat, gentle down the ri.." *_BOOM_*
I never thought a Drach video would ever mention my neck of the woods since I'm so far inland, but here we are. I'll even let that 'Nashville not as important as New Orleans' swipe slide.
General Winfield Scott to Lincoln:
My Anaconda Plan don’t, my Anaconda Plan don’t want none.
Until you give it ironclads and guns, hun.
Gen. Winfield "Nicki Minaj" Scott
Gen. Winfield "Sir Mix-a-lot" Scott.
Sounds like an Oversimplified quote tbh.
Battle of Memphis, Union Commander: "I'm going to imitate Nelson and defeat the Rebels!"
Confederate Sniper: Sees him and shoots him!
Therefor the Union Commander did indeed imitate Nelson!!!
...admiral Nelon and admiral Yi: "...welcome to the club...!"
Cottonclads, now that's one hell of a trade off, stop/reduce iron shot damage at the expense of inflammable armour 😏
When you guys talk about personalities being important during this war it’s even true for senior officers on opposing sides! A lot of officers above colonel knew each other personally.
i believe most of them went to the same military academies.
@@STScott-qo4pw Most likely many went to West Point and some even to VMI as these two were the first Military Academies, it is said, and probably true, that Robert E Lee was commandant of West Point at an early stage of his career, so would have known personally many of his opposing generals and senior Union staff. No wonder the Native Americans called it the Brother War.
@@STScott-qo4pw The Dahlgren brothers. One was owner of Dunleith at Natchez. The other was Union Navy. Invented the Dahlgren cannon. His son was killed on a cavalry raid on Richmond.
The funny thing about river-based warfare in that era is that they could more or less slap shit together and put it into the water, stick a gun on it, and it'd have a use. So all sorts of crazy ideas and improvised measures were used, and could actually be affordably employed by both sides.
Did not know that the Union had armored warships other than monitors. Very cool.
The USS 'Cairo' was raised years ago, partly restored, and is on permanent display at Vicksburg.
Quite a fair amount as well. The Monitor was one of 3 selected designs, the other 2, one was a Gloire like vessel, and the third had armor so thin, it might as well not been armored.
If you want a good book going into this topic, look up Thunder Along the Mississippi. :D Aaaaall about the river ironclads and Pook's Turtles.
Union: **Walks into New Orleans** This is mine now.
I think it's an artifact of the microphone, but Sean's voice seems to drop register and get really deep occasionally and it's a little freaky. I imagine it would give me a bad acid trip, if I was, you know, on acid. Other than that, great video, love Drach's work hope he keeps it up!
Sean sounds stoned lol.... Must have been 4.20 when making this doco lol
More likely a connection issue if Drach is recording it all on his end.
More likely a connection issue if Drach is recording it all on his end.
are you kidding? that shit would be hilarious on acid
Have you ever tried acid?
This guy's voice all if a sudden drops like 3 octaves... is he letting his demon out?
I thought I was the only one who heard it!
Indigestion? Not being rude. It was what I thought of when I noticed it.
Sounds like packet loss artefacts
I wonder if it could be a problem with his mic?
Sounds more like an encoding issue to me. Drach has occasionally had the same issue in some of his longer dry docks.
There's a full size replica of CSS Neuse in Kingston, North Carolina, along with the remains of the original ship.
A few of us toured those while we were down touring the USS North Carolina. An excellent replica.
*Kinston.
This expert guest dude is such a great storyteller! Could listen to him talk about stuff for hours
If you like Sean Chick you should check out “Thersites the Historian”, Chick is a frequent guest there.
I always love your longer form documentaries about these niche topis. Keep up the amazing work!
Things I did not expect to learn watching Drach:
US Geography!!
US Army and Navy cooperating-WW2 Japanese military men must have been sick the day that part was covered in class...
Sean Chick is a big contributor to the CZcams channel "Thersites The Historian". Sean is a good guy and knows more about the U.S. Civil War than anyone. But he is also fairly knowledgeable about history in general. He also knows alot about the Napoleonic Wars.
Both the wrecks of the CSS Neuse (Albemarle Class Ironclad Ram) and the CSS Jackson another casemate Ironclad have been raised and are on display in North Carolina and Georgia respectively. The Monitor’s turret, guns, engine, screw, etc. are raised from the Atlantic off Cape Hatteras and are on Display in Norfolk Virginia. The Cairo as mentioned is also above water in the Vicksburg Military Park. The CSS Neuse in addition to being preserved in a climate controlled museum, has a FULL SCALE wooden replica built just a few blocks from the museum that you can tour on Saturdays for FREE. I have been recently and it was amazing to step onboard a replica of a Civil War Ironclad and if your even near Kinston North Carolina I highly recommend you see both the raised wreck and the replica!
I love Sean's streams with Thersites. Excellent choice of guest, Drach.
Would love to see a video on the Confederate gun boat CSS Pee Dee. The state of South Carolina has been doing a lot of archeological work in rediscovering her and raising her three cannons out of the Pee Dee River near Florence, SC.
What I'm taking away from this is that McClellan was *WAY* more important in riverine combat than I thought.
Him and Scott saw the importance of squeezing the lifeblood out of the CSA with the Anaconda plan.
Is it me, or did the recording of this make the guest Sean Chick, at times, sound a bit like he was possessed?
Yeah, his voice does fluctuate a bit...
I thought it was indigestion at first.
You mean the SUDDEN BASE VOCALS?
You mean, that's not normal?
I thought daemonic posession happens to everyone...
Well, crap...
It has happened to Drach a few times too.
Looking at the armored trains of this time I was struck by the cross over between the armour on river boats and the armour on the trains. So you will see the use of cotton bales to protect some Confederate trains and railroad rails one some Federal trains.
Cotton bales as armor wasn't new. Look at the battle of New Orleans in 1814.
I mean the Japanese strapped mattresses to the island of one of their carriers in WWII, so...
@@Mishn0 I was more looking at the connection between the way both ships and trains were similarly armoured. I had not known about the use of cotton bales in New Orleans so thanks for that.
@@bluemarlin8138 Thanks. I did know about the Japanese using mattresses on their carriers. I felt sorry for the poor sailors whose mattress came back full of bullet holes and bomb splinters.
Those RR flat cars carrying cannons were the World's first self-propelled artillery.
Few people has a voice fit to documentaries more the drach. Love hearing him explain things 😍
I'm so glad you mention the James River. So many people forget anything that isn't the Mississippi because of the Anaconda Plan. But the James is strategically imperative because of Richmond. I've spent summers in Richmond and I've seen the James with my own eyes. There are places in modern Richmond, mere miles from the old city, where it would be easy to land troops. The Confederates can't let the Union forces anywhere near there.
As our guest says, the real strength of the Confederate river combat was the use of coastal artillery. You've mentioned before, Drach, that for most of history, coastal artillery trumps warships. It's more stable and usually big. This is true in the Civil War too. Cliff side artillery is devastating.
Am I the only person that much prefers videos with drach narrating the entirety. Not to disparage any of the guests but I definitely prefer 100% pure drach crack
You are not the only one. As an American, I found the guest's almost giddy delight as he considered ways the rebellion could have succeeded to be thoroughly offputting.
Nashville, while not as important as New Orleans, was still important as a town with BOTH kinds of music.
Country *and* Western!
Time for some Blues Brothers quotes!
I hate Illinois Nazis
Rock & Roll!
"It's 106 miles to Chicago, we've got a full tank, half pack of cigarettes, it's dark out, and we're wearing sunglasses. Hit it."
Absolutely love this episode, love hearing my home state of Louisiana being talked about in depth.
"I shall commission my own gunboat"-Drachinifel...You heard him, man your patreon stations!(disclaimer Drac in no way condones me doing this...I just want it to happen lol🤣)
I really want my own paddle gunboat lol paddle steamers are really cool
I can see a modern Kentucky style gun boat. A fiberglass fishing boat with two paddles and a port and starboard AR-15 duck taped to the gunwhale...
I would be interested in a video on the Monitor class as a whole. Looking at the photographic record with an amateur's eye , the later variations appear to me to be substantial improvements on the prototype. The question of seaworthiness interests me especially given the fate of the USS Monitor. It seems a lucky thing that the Monitor's original trip to Hampton Roads did not end its career early! Presumably all monitors would have to make similar fraught journeys from shipyard to station.
Iron clad Drach on a Wednesday is a good Wednesday well spent.
The fun stories are an added bonus.
It was a Civil War because everyone used their best manners during the fighting. Pinkies extended during bayonet charges!
One of the most important factors for the Union in controlling the major rivers was there function as stable supply lines and avenues for military offensives which could not be disrupted by confederate cavalry and guerillas
While it is not a particularly well known river in the US, the James River is a fairly large one, in breadth if not in length. I work right on the river near were it empties into the Chesapeake Bay, and the river is just over 5 miles wide from bank to bank at that point.
I was a bit disappointed that Fort Monroe was not mentioned. It gave the Union a headstart on advancing up the James River.
I've crossed just about every bridge over the James (and the Williamsburg Ferry) and it's pretty wild how different they all are. From tiny little things like that one up by the Powhatan prison to monsters like the James River Bridge or Monitor-Merrimack tunnel.
Great video. Could we have a video on the Royal Navy's own riverine warfare efforts on the Yangtze River?
I’m s simple man. I see a Drach video, I sip my tea or coffee and press play.
Aye
Yeeeeeesssss, I've been waiting for something like this!! The ACW naval scene, and the Brown Water theatre in particular is a huge interest of mine, so thank you for doing this and thank you for Sean Chick for helping you discuss it!
Love the name of this episode. Had me smiling before we even got to the juicy naval history
The Tyler and Lexington came up the Tennessee River during the Battle of Shiloh, and fired on the South, Thus relieving the pressure on my great grandfather who was wounded earlier in the day defending for the North. Excellent production, Thank you Drach and Sean!!
Pinned post for Q&A :) - EDIT: Apologies for a few odd audio artifacts, sometimes trans-atlantic digital connections don't function 100% :D
I noticed that british battleships with Queen Anne's Mansion have the main rangefinder relatively low and that the rangefinder is relatively small compared to ships like Yamato, Iowa or Bismarck, which have the mail rangefinder very high on the superstructure and the rangefinder is very long. Is that correct or I missed something? Were because of this british battleships in disadvantage compared to other battleships?
Were there any tactics that are usrd in open sea naval warfare that either didnt work or modified yo suite the river environment? Also was the convoy system ever used during the civil war?.
Drach, do you know anything about the Armstrong Design 702, the planned Portuguese battleship?
Why do you think there is so much more interest in the forty~ years of WWI and WWII compared to the hundreds of years of the age of sail?
Which would you consider to be the most effective monitor design of the civil war? Or were they all roughly comparable?
The way in which Grant's Ironclads ran the vaunted Vicksburg defenses on the Mississippi River was quite a stroke of genius. Apparently, the fort guns couldn't deflect down far enough to cover the river bank closest to the city.
If and when you are able to come over to the states, I would gladly show you around the Richmond/Petersburg area; Drewry's Bluff, Tredegar Iron Works, City Point, and the remnants of the William Trigg Shipbuilding Company
This is going to be an interesting series.
The guy you were talking too, though... was his voice dipping low because of connection issues, or is he a lizard person?
oh man dont mention the lizard overlords in a thing about the civil war, the southern apologists might not spot the joke and see it as confirmation of a black-mexican-jewish-commie-lizard conspiracy.....
I live near Petersburg in Virginia. I have been to the battlefield site. One can still see the remnant of The Crater.
Messiness Ridge: "Hold my beer."
(I'm guessing these 17 mine detonations left an enduring impression on the local geography.)
@@kemarisite The fact there's still an undetonated mine or two in that region must be horrifying. But given the last mine going off only took the unluckist cow in history away with it should be okay now.
If you haven't already, head up to Drewry's Bluff. Cool little river fortification.
Thanks For another fascinating episode … The Virginia WVA highlands is the Home of some of the most beautiful river Basins The Potomac … the James … the Roanoke … the New “ironically the worlds 2nd oldest and north flowing ‘ and the Holsten … this area is also rich in coal , iron , lead , and potassium nitrate … the local Railroad Bridge over the New wasn’t captured until the last week of the war …The James River Canals Went as far north as what is now the I81 corridor …and the Potomac canal was Washington’s pet project
McClellan would’ve been a great chief of staff for a “fighting” general.
Ah, a blind believer of the popular myth I see.
Great, often overlooked, subject.
Great discussion, but in Part 2 can you go over the use of shipborne mortars on Confederate defense works?
In WW2, I'm pretty sure British General Slim requisitioned some ships for his army in Burma. He named one of them after his daughter. The British Admiralty weren't happy with this as only they get to name HM ships. I'm pretty sure I read it in Slim's book "Defeat into Victory." Great book. Great video as always
An interesting book covering some of the river campaigns is 'Ironclad Captain: Seth Ledyard Phelps and the U.S. Navy 1841-1864' by Jay Slagle. It is many years since I've read it but I very much enjoyed reading it when I used it for my Advanced Higher History dissertation in school many years ago
The "Brown Water Navy" has always been of interest. IN the past I have read a book by Gary Joiner and one by Angus Konstam on the subject.
During 1967, after having been drafted, the US Army sent me to Ft Eustis, VA which is on the James River between Newport News and Williamsburg. There I learned how to operate landing craft and tug boats.
I took a Louisiana History class at LSU Shreveport about a decade ago with Gary Joiner, we learned the whole Red River Campaign and read the same book if I recall. He is an exceptionally good history professor.
I never ever ever expected Sean to be on here, I was like, WTF, love his channel though.
The Monitor was actually found off the coast of North Carolina past the Outer Banks. It is currently undergoing the long process of restoration (as much as can be done) at the Mariner's Museum in Hampton, VA. The same museum has a replica of the CSS Virginia. This is the museum you showed at 1:05:15
Union General Fremont was the first to order the building of ironclads by the conversion of salvage vessels on the Ohio River.
I was only about 8 when an older friend turned me on to history. Scouring the history shelves of the public library, I found a book about the naval part of the American Civil War. It was not written for children and was way above my reading level, but I fought my way through it. I think my mother started having me fit for a children’s straight jacket. It had lots of maps, pictures and illustrations. I remember seeing pictures of the USS Cairo and CSS Manassas and saying, „Cool!“. 54 years later, I‘m still fascinated.
Well shit, Sean Chick.
This is probably the closest we’ll get to a Drachinifel and Thersites The Historian crossover.
The CSS Hunley was found intact in the outer extent of Charleston Harbor. The wreck was so complete that the bodies of the final crew were found at their duty stations. The gold piece mentioned at 1:03:44 is on display at the very neat museum/preservation facility where the Hunley and many artifacts are on excellent display. It is worth a trip to see; not to be confused with the so-so sub-scale replica at the entrance to the Charleston Museum on Meeting Street.
Thanks Drach, for my Wednesday night( in Tasmania) dog walking time entertainment😀 you never fail to come up with the goods, and give me an excuse to keep on walking and listening.
Victoria watcing on the sofa.
@@GrahamWKidd drach = lockdown saviour?
@@timclaridge7455 I started watching 5 minute guides from 001 this lockdown!
@@GrahamWKidd perfect!
The log jam that Captain Shreve removed on the Red River was about 160 miles long and is believed to have been there since the 12th century. It’s removal spurred the development of some of the first steam powered “snagboats” where a steam crane lifted the logs from the jam.
Also recommend American Battlefield trust and Atun-shei films for more US civil war history videos.
When I read Atun-Shei films in your post my brain immediately went to “REBEL YEEEEEELLLLL” lol
Shreveport designed the snag boats. He also designed river steamboats that used the first high pressure steam engines to challenge Fulton's monopoly on steamboat shipping on the inland rivers. Shreve was sued in court with the suit decided by the SCOTUS. He won with their ruling that allowed unfettered free trade between the states on water and roads.
Drach gets his civil war info first person via exorcism.
Underrated comment!
Well done. Thank you!
"General Banks, the fleet is stranded in the Red River and capture is imminent!"
"Impossible! I have a map here that clearly shows a blue line on it!"
It's awesome, seeing Sean on this channel. He often makes videos with the youtube channel Thersites the Historian and did some extensive tier lists about Japanese and allied Admirals in the Pacific, for example.
This is how I know it's Wednesday. Coffee and one of my favorite subjects- Our Civil War.
Drach, when you do make it to the United States you absolutely must see Vicksburg. The physical space of the city and river must be seen to appreciated.
The Confederate ironclads were doomed by one common failure: the availability of decent propulsion machinery. Darn near all of their engines were salvaged/repurposed riverboat engines, many of them from older and far smaller vessels not able to propel 10x their designed tonnage. Thus, grossly under-powered, there were few that could move at more than 6 kts. Some could not even keep themselves in position on the river...much less steam upriver... being unable to fight the current.
While a dearth of iron for armor and facilities for repairs were great hardships, a Confederate ironclad could be defeated by a company of Union infantry... because they simply could not escape. Ergo, most of them were lost at the hands of their own crews to avoid capture.
For a great read on the subject, I recommend "Engines of Rebellion: Confederate Ironclads and Steam Engineering in the American Civil War" by Saxon Bisbee.
Not "up the creek with paddles"?
Great stuff though. The river war in the ACV is very interesting and important to the campaign yet so little spoken of compared to the big land battles.
Thanks Drach
While the RN no longer issues a rum ration We are glad you continue this fine tradition
Yes they're up the creek, but ironclads don't really need or use paddles don't they?
Also, first.
Some are paddle steamers. :-D
@@vaclav_fejt One ironclad was steam powered, sails, and had paddle wheels. I'd have to guess the sails were to extend the range? Sort of like a hybred car. I can't see it helping much. The paddle wheels would cause alot of drag if they're weren't powered.
Those rivers were full of snags and deadheads (up to and including 100 ft long trees hidden underwater), rocks, and sudden mud banks; so props would not last long.
This was an excellent collaboration. Really enjoyed the views reaching beyond the actual River conflicts.
My great uncle Eli Stevens joined the navy for WWI and received his training to be a steam engineer aboard the USS Richmond very same vessel that was at Vicksburg during the War of Yankee Invasion. He was born and raised in Vicksburg. The Richmond was a training ship then with her prop shaft cut and firmly tied the the dock with barracks built on the upper deck and masts removed.
WaR oF YaNkEe InVaSiOn
my favorite quote
the captain of the Arkansas , barely moving with asthmatic engine descent the Mississipi alone past the whole union fleet
everybody start madly shooting with much friendly fire hits while the Arkansas was firing at a solid wall of armor-clad on both boards
"I proceeded without the chance to miss an enemy or hitting a friend "
Would like to hear about river operations in the Russian + Ukrainian + related Civil Wars.
I conduct tours of the Red River Campaign 1864. There is a lot more to it than general history has attributed to it. It was an overall Confederate strategic victory and since the South ultimately lost the war it is easy to brush it off as just a side show. But, it was close to being a "complete" Southern victory and had that occurred it would have changed history.
Banks was worst than Fredendall? Worst than Macclenan.? Worse than MacArthur? Worse than Clark? Worst than Westmoreland? I don't know. That's some pretty strong incompetence.
His high point was first failed attack on fort Fisher. He packed a ship with a huge amount of gunpowder to blow the fort down. It fizzled. The confederates barely noticed it
Maybe made mistake about uss Massachusetts bomb to shatter fort Fisher was general butler not banks
I like WW2 battles and big gun ship designs. All really started here. Another interest is the Texas Navy. Small junk boats asked to shoot above their grade.
14:40 everyone thought about how Hornblower destroyed that army in Spain using Sutherland's great guns against them.
A fascinating look at the American Civil War Navy. One of the most interesting periods in Naval History.
I've been to the Cairo at Vicksburg, fascinating museum in the park.
Actually this is fascinating. The engineers work very hard in this theater. Have you seen a map of the USA, with the Mississippi river, and all it's tributaries highlighted. It looks like a huge deciduous tree. Like an old oak that has never been pruned.