Gatekeeping Mallgoths
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- čas přidán 6. 07. 2024
- This episode we return to form by settling down in the gothic parlor for a wide ranging discussion on goth. The history of mallgoth, the relevance of gatekeeping, how to run an event, body shaming and aesthetic expectations and more! We also have a new batch of band recommendations, Azy Bat’s All Goth Considered and more.
Consider supporting us at: / cemeteryconfessions
Our guests are Julian Black and Candace Midnight. You can also find the Arcane Vampire Ball here.
www.thejulianblack.com/
linktr.ee/thejulianblack
/ lakesidegothictakeover
www.arcanevampireball.com/
00:00 Intro
7:22 Arcane Vampire Ball
13:40 Vampires
26:06 Local Flavor
31:48 Gothic Takeover at Lakeside
37:30 Aesthetic Expectations
55:50 Advice for New Blood
1:07:05 Safe Spaces
1:15:10 Gatekeeping and Mallgoths
1:46:30 Goths Future
1:54:28 More Gatekeeping
2:02:00 More Mallgoth
Sinister Suggestions 2:12:20
-Princess Ugly - Individual Soul
princessugly.com/track/an-ind...
-Fevr - Running Away
fevr.bandcamp.com/track/runni...
-Propter Hoc - Ask Dr. Mueller
propterhoc.bandcamp.com/track...
-The Medicines - Alone in a Room
themedicinesmusic.bandcamp.co...
-Pontaguhla - Perante o Caos
systemica.bandcamp.com/album/...
-Cerulean Veins - Black
music.ceruleanveins.com/album...
-Skltn Chr - Eternally
skltnchr.bandcamp.com/track/e...
-Bite Marx - Pissing in the Dark
bitemarx1.bandcamp.com/album/...
-Casket Cassette - Antabuse
casketcassette.bandcamp.com/t...
-Solara Obscura - Dark Valleys
solaraobscura.bandcamp.com/tr...
-Dot Wall/Nympf
dotwall.bandcamp.com/album/do...
-Desmond Doom - Disease
desmonddoom.bandcamp.com/trac...
-Witch Lover - In Patience
witchlover.bandcamp.com/album...
-Guerra Fria - Cuando Todos Duermen
guerrafriamusic.bandcamp.com/...
-Corbeau Hangs - Light to Dark
corbeauhangs.bandcamp.com/tra...
-Minimal Unit - Минималистичная Единица
minimalunit.bandcamp.com/album/-
2:30:00 All Goth Considered
2:51:43 Outro
References:
-New Media
• Walter Benjamin: The F...
-An Ode to Mallgoths
www.thebelfry.rip/blog/2015/6...
-Homology Hypothesis
• The Value of Music to ...
-So You Want to Start a Goth Event
www.thebelfry.rip/blog/2017/9...
-So you Want to Throw a House Party
www.thebelfry.rip/blog/2019/9...
-Sinister Suggestions Playlist
open.spotify.com/playlist/47F... - Zábava
Thank you so much for having us 🖤
Loved this topic. Love to hear so many 90s baby bat origin stories so close to home. I lived in a desert town in the Bible Belt and the ‘scene’ was the smoking section at Denny’s and burned CDs of music from Napster. When we finally got a Hot Topic, I could only browse for ideas. Luckily Walmart sold velvet skirts back then.
Classic-style CC episodes are back!
I’m coming back to this older episode, and the point at 42:33 it’s still so relevant.
I’m currently doing a thesis on fast fashion and the way that textile waste is environmentally degrading developing countries - and the expectation that Goths are meant to be dressed to a certain higher standard is part of the reason so much clothing ends up in landfills.
There are ways to create a gothic closet that is customized to your personal tastes and comforts (textiles, silhouettes, patterns) that still count as “goth.” Trying to emulate the “correct” way to be instead of trying to curate their own understandings of their style and how that relates to the larger Goth scene is what is fueling this high turnover of clothing that then ends up in the landfills, and pollute the beaches of Ghana or leeches, toxic, dies in the waterways of India.
Fast fashion companies often capitalize on this insecurity in personal style, and will quickly create fashions that are cheaply made, use the labor of exploited peoples to create, and do not last longer than a year. If the origins of this community have such strong roots in DIY, and, the liberation of fashion through androgyny, then Goth fashion should be an experience that is flexible in its expression, but still responds to the core tenants of what it means to be (the appreciation of darkness, etc., etc.)
Anyways, ramble over. I’m always appreciative of the conversations on this channel 🖤
Lucid and eloquent, as always.
It takes me so long to get through an episode because I'm constantly googling each movie, book, band, and song mentioned 🖤 thanks for the great content as always!
I was never a pacifist but I tried to stay out of trouble and be respectful to people around me as a teen. I had a history of fighting prior to entering the scene due to bullies. I wore a black leather jacket that came to my knees so I remember the stereotypes. Also being black and wearing a jacket like that in highschool always got me comments about me being a "thug" or something. Because of my build and bring protective of people around me I try to look out for creepy guys who want to harass us at events and such.
I'm glad that the youth are more accepting of other Goths who may not have time or desire to be dressed to the nines all the time. Being thirty-seven years old and working in a warehouse I'm dressed down day to day. Good video!
I had a similar experience with trench coats and experiences relating to gothic attire being considered bad also in high school and I was in high school in the early 2010s. I remember many times the teachers pulling me aside and talking about how they were worried about me and my wellbeing and they thought that I was getting myself involved into dangerous situations. Teachers would send out referrals in the mail over something as simple as wearing dark makeup and spiked/studded jewelry.
It's been a while since there's been a bit of the round table. I'm sure it will be a fine companion for my work day. It's been interesting seeing a mild uptick in mentions of Mallgoth in various other CZcams channels.
I couldn't wait to get home to listen to this. Thank you all for another great and interesting episode.
Also, love the inclusion about tips for creating events! I've been kicking around the idea of hosting a cemetery picnic on World Goth Day, but unsure where/how to start 😅
That reference to Steve Roach took me back to my early 20's. I recall enjoy Ambient music for a time, and particularly enjoyed the radio programs Echoes and Hearts of Space. Haven't thought about that for a good ten or so years.
I entered the goth subculture irl by going to goth coffee houses in San Diego, CA in 1996. Meanwhile Vampire the Masquerade RPG was irl. That was too goth for me 😂 Men coming up to me kissing my hand “mi lady” type stuff at coffeehouses and clubs. And I LOVE vampires since I was 4 I had a cape. If you don’t know it, you got to check out the old TV show, Kindred: The Embraced. I LOVED that show! Toreador 🙋🏻♀️ The fine lines I draw for myself lol.
YES! I absolutely love Kindred The Embraced! I have the collectable DVD set!
@@CemeteryConfessions I wish! Now I want to binge
Korn was one of my first introduction to goth
It inspired me to make many of my vampier journals
That year was the 1st mall goth conflict in the earben suberbs
I use to read a lot of vampier books as a teen I did not find out it was called goth until 1998 when it 1st entered the earben suberbs on late March early April
In LA/Hollywood real nightlife club and event scene back in the day and now most definitely had dress codes that literally could get you gate kept. Especially back in the day. Not so bad now on that note but it can make a difference when you get in or how you’re treated. In the 90s you could be refused entrance. Keep in mind that in the 90s in general people dressed up more in general for a Friday or Saturday now. Starting in the 2000s, I was a bit dumbstruck how low-key they started show up. That’s not being gother than though to me. That’s like come on it’s Friday or Saturday, get your cute, sexy, freak, whatever-bring it on
1:43:04 Banning Trench coats and not fire arms, I don’t get it.
On angla Benet chanal one of her subscribers. Said mall goth is making a come back I wonder what issues are helping mall goth come back ?
When I first heard heard the tearm mall goth 2004 on March 15 it was tied to the destruction of skate park to make room for luctury houses for the rich pepole
Even now the emo vs goth debate gos on into the modern day
To a 90s goth like myself, mall goths, emos, dark alternatives in general have potential to become an actual baby bat and possibly a full-on Goth. From my online experience in the 2010s and 2020s, it seems a lot of people becoming aware of the Goth subculture don’t realize that baby bat is not inherently a put down. I adore baby bats I see as being on their way to becoming Goth.
It was the emo conflict of 2005 between skaters & emo that eliminated punker from the goth vocabulary & gave us the modernday mall goth & forced it to evolve in the earbern suberbs
In California, mall goth was a term that my friends and others used in the 1990. The meanings of it were derogatory or othering on some level in the 90s. Nowadays mall goth with youth - at least online - seems to be a positive fashion sense. Today’s definition from a 90s goth perspective is stance, I assume for 80s goths too. Because we were not wanting to blatant show such support for a corporation target marketing us
Don't forget 2001 on September 11th that was a bad time for goths too goths were a target too
Most of the mall goths were wiccen & pagen & fallen skate boarding groups it was not called mall goth until 2004 it called darkly inclined or punker
I have no problem with pepole picking up on goth grils or females picking up on goth men I'm more about the safety then anything
As much as I get anyoied by emos the I'll give them credit getting rid of racist tearms like punker opened the doors for today's mallgoth & darkly inclined goths
Who are these Gothic gate keepers I bet u they are Gothic elitists
Poppy z Brite, Lost Souls: I adored that book so much that I still have it. I related to it so much. And places they mention in the book are real places that myself and San Francisco/visiting Goths really went to in real life. Lots of real vibes in there 😊 and the chartreuse green that was acceptable color back then when used sparingly by Goths and popular in general back then 🥝🍈📗🔋🧩🎾