Why Is American Patriotism So Weird?
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- čas přidán 26. 01. 2023
- To anyone outside the US, our particular brand of patriotism is very strange. Why is the average American so violently attached to symbols like the American flag? Why is our version of patriotism so dogmatically opposed to actually improving our country? Let's take a look.
Why Is American Patriotism So Weird? - Second Thought
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Glenn Loury interview
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Anti-communist immigration acts
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On American patriotism, nationalism, etc.
• "They Hate America!" -...
is.muni.cz/el/1423/jaro2016/S...
jacobin.com/2021/04/john-judi...
jacobin.com/2020/05/keir-star...
• Against Patriotism
theanarchistlibrary.org/libra...
www.socialist.net/left-patrio...
www.reddit.com/r/communism101...
theanarchistlibrary.org/mirro...
books.google.com/books?id=8hn...
washingtonmonthly.com/2018/07...
jacobin.com/2019/03/greg-gran...
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I love your timing😂 Just got out of an hour long tik tok battle with an exceptionalist… I wish they could break out of this patriotic shell of theirs… Thanks for the video comrade. Always love your work.
Another banger. ✊️
Frankly, when the far right calls any social justice movements or government social programs "socialism!"...Well, these movements and programs can often really help people.
So the right is inadvertently leading at least some people to believe that socialism is when people are helped or supported?
Not accurate, but useful to us.
I know you were using them as an example, but why didn't you blur their email name? Though what they said to you could be considered controversial to your audience, your decision to leave the name is likewise, a possibly bad decision.
Nationalism is just politics for basic people.
-Beauofthefifthcolumn's shirt
Someone really tried to argue with me that kids these days need to stop demanding rights 🤦🏻♂️
I'm Spanish. In my country some conservatives ask why we cannot be as "patriotic" as the US. My father gave me a great response when I was a kid: because we had a 40 years dictatorship in which the regime sponsored that blind patriotism.
In Chile happened the same thing. The dictatorship also forced that kind of blind patriotism and fractured the country in 2: The ones who benefited from the dictatorship and the rest. Luckily, that "patriotism" over time transformed into a cult of personality for the Dictator. Even more luckily, the trauma of the dictatorship makes it that, if you ever dare to speak good of that dictator, you immediately commits a "social suicide" (everyone will hate you)
I both like and hate that conservatism so often finds itself aligned with oppression and tyranny.
some spaniards want Franco to come back. Fortunatelyevery year there are less of them, slowly dying
Franco? Yeah. That's rough.
I'm American but one side of my family moved to America in the 1950s from Germany. Why not pledge undying fanatical devotion to a leader who promises to make the nation "great again"?
It didn't go well the last time.
American patriotism is so odd because it's often conflated to morality. You'll often see a bunch of people calling others unpatriotic as if that means they are some how evil.
When usually it's he exact opposite.
True
It's just like 1930's Germany!!! 😰😰
Not sure if that's American only, in Poland it's pretty much the same
Ultranationalism.
It's weird how people's reactions to criticism of the US is "if you don't like it, then leave" instead of working to make it better. It's literally "Why solve a problem when you can just ignore it?"
Usually it depends on the problem. Modern patriots and/or nationalist say that when someone is trying to change something seem as fundamental about America. So for example if someone was saying “We want more libraries!” No one would tell him to leave the country. However if they are talking about implementing socialism or getting rid of the first or second amendments (things that are seen as intrinsic to the nation) then they are told to leave as they would essentially want to change the nation so much that it would essentially be a different country all together.
"if you don't like it you can leave" is the typical fascist response
@@thedukeofchutney468 implement socialism? aside maybe a couple of countries in the world, see "socialist" countries in Europe? In the long term, does the American model seem successful in any case or that the American model will last indefinitely compared to Europe?
@@MrNoncredo Dude, that is not a fascist response AT ALL. A fascist would imprison or kill dissenters as they see the glory of the state as the highest good. While I don't see America being an indefinite part of the world (no nation or civilization is) I will say that I personally see it lasting longer than Europe. The latter is far too reliant on the American globalized order to be able to disconnect and run itself. Many nations such as Germany have pretty much nerfed their militaries as well making them even more vulnerable. For all of its hype I don't see the EU lasting for too much longer at least not in its current state due for a number of factors.
@@thedukeofchutney468 " A fascist would imprison or kill dissenters as they see the glory of the state as the highest good."
you intentionally forgot the word "exile" in that sentence, as expected from dishonest scum
I am from Russia and it is so darkly ironic that patriotism in America and Russia is so similar
It's pretty well known that if you don't like someone's personality trait it's because you yourself have that trait. This makes Russia, USA, China & North Korea the same in my book. They are the same rotten country, just speaking different languages
@@vanidemo Are you sure? North Korea is vastly different from the other three countries you listed.
The US has more money, so they can do it better.
@@neisseri Judging by the context it's rather obvious that the user above was speaking figuratively
I was birn in Belarus but than moved to Germany and what I always tell people is that Russia is litteraly the same as the USA but without the sugar coating.
They call it patriotism, but really it's nationalism.
I have no idea
It's fascism.
Fascism my boy, one day americans will wake up
@@colinbrown7305 what are the laws or the customs that make them fascist?
We literally had people hit the capitol being upset with the government.
Trust me, we have zero love for the government. Its only a neccessary evil. The patriotism we have isnt because we think we're better. We just love where we live and love the lifestyle we're allowed to live
It always blows my mind how a country that declares how free it is so violently demands conformity.
The Kiwis enjoy the most freedom in the world.
It's a variation of "anyone who truly understands _____ can't disagree with it." For these people, the conforming is the same as being right, and a free person will inevitably become that if there aren't any institutions interfering with it. That's why they use the argument: freedom allows people to opt out of "being right" and that makes the government allowing that to be "tyrannical" because it somehow *compels* people to be counter-cultural through trickery or something.
@@JamesDavy2009 maybe, I would have said the dutch. The USA isn´t even among the top ten. Kiwis are prohibiting smoking?
@@etopsch369 I don't know what my neighbours across the ditch are trying to do. As far as I know, smoking is verboten in certain places and vaping is also falling under the umbrella of smoking as it's a different method of ingesting nicotine.
Because freedom doesn't mean you can do anything you want. You must make concessions in order to be free. For example your freedom to force me to not be able to speak isn't allowed because it would violate my freedom to speak. Therefore you must conform to the law so that we may both be able to speak freely and spread ideas.
I love the argument of "You cant change the constitution!", bruv, of couse you can, we call them ammendments. 😂
Yikes, I pity the person who has to explain to such an individual that the Bill of Rights wouldn’t exist without the ability to amend the Constitution.
In Germany there is a "Ewigkeitsklausel" for the first 20 laws of the Grundgesetz (german constitution) and therefore they can never be changed.
@@gren97 Anything can be changed. German doesn't have a real constitution because post WWII it was an American protectorate (and the USSR protectorate of East Germany merged into it). But anything can change. Germany as a country didn't even exist 200 years ago. It was founded in 1871.
@@gren97 If the government realy needs or want to change one of the laws they can just change the Ewigkeitsklausel. Can't they?
@@Fabioonn no. It would have to go through the Bundesrat and the Bundestag and because of the Ewigkeitsklausel being the Ewigkeitsklausel it wouldn't get far. But if the government decides to replace the Grundgesetz completely, I think it could be possible but wouldn't be easy.
I love how “patriotic” people’s answer to distaste and disgust at crumbling American society is to just leave 😭 “I know this country is turning to shit but if you don’t like it then leave 😡”
Democrat run cities are most certainly turning to shit, people can't leave them fast enough.
Bro, exactly.
When "winners" of the Cold War are turning into ex-ussr...
Hear it everytime.
“You’re not to be so blind with patriotism that you can’t face reality. Wrong is wrong, no matter who does it or says it.” -Malcolm X
yeah malcom x used violence wrong is wrong right?
@@angelcabeza6464 how is self defense equal to systemic violence brought on to a community solely based upon race? Like genuinely please tell me
@@angelcabeza6464 Is defending yourself wrong? Violence shouldn’t be a first resort but, as sad as it sounds, oppressors & oppressive systems can’t always be changed peacefully. Especially if the oppressors are themselves militant & uncompromising.
The US is still one of the least patriotic nations on earth. People need to travel and interact with the locals more. As an example the main thing stopping confederate Europe from becoming a union like the USA is their patriotism not wanting to give up their national identity. Becoming a union like the US has always been the goal of the EU
@@angelcabeza6464 A man tries to kill a kid on the street and the kid fights back. Would in your estimation that be wrong?
I'm always astonished at people who say about our country (or the state we share), "If you don't like it, get out." I was born here and have lived here my whole life, so this is my home and I want it to be the best for everyone.
It's as if, when your house is being robbed or burned down, the problem is your reporting it, not the robbers or arsonists actions.
If you don't like it get out is the only form of choice they are given in the workplace. So naturally they extend the only choice they know of to people they don't like.
Your second paragraph (re your house being burgled) is an outstanding analogy.
Plus, "packing your bags and leaving" is WAY easier said than done lol. Entertaining a move to Europe right now and man, immigration is way more difficult than I feel like it should be. Not to mention the costs incurred with moving on top of that.
@@tblakemusic Yeah, too rich for my blood. I can't leave...unless the governor ships me off somewhere with a McDonald's gift certificate as a lagniappe.
What would the "Love It or Leave It" types have said to those awful protestors in 1776? It's not hard to imagine: "If you don't like the way King George is running his colonies, then you can bloody well leave." These love it or leave it types aren't Patriots, for in 1776 the true Patriots were the protestors. Instead, they'd have been the Loyalists, the Tories.
There is a quote from a book that paraphrases John Steinbeck that I always like when discussing why the US is so like this. It sums up how I was raised and the general philosophy of the people in the midwest and rural US. “John Steinbeck once said that socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.” -Ronald Wright, 'A Short History of Progress' (2005).
Most grass root right-wingers everywhere look at themselves like that. There is an internet forum in my country Sweden, called Flashback. Most people there are like US MAGA people. Just like US MAGA people it's also obvious that most of them are wage slaves and on welfare or disability. 90% of them would perish within a month or so, if the brutal social Darwinist society most of them want actually came true. But they're living on the illusion that they are temporarily embarrassed elite people.
So blind hope and delusion.
This is 100% true. There are people living below the poverty line with no medical care, no education and no hope of ever getting any, but they’re against a minimum wage
And the rich see them as lazy potential scroungers
Why I get annoyed when someone says "when I become a millionaire" like...hard work and progress in this society will save them.
Few things I am proud of my country, Mexico.
We are very patriotic, but this love is towards the people and our culture. We never hesitate to accept that we suck at things like education, safety and inequality.
Same as here in Brazil!
🇺🇸 ❤ 🇲🇽 ❤️ 🇧🇷
I like this comment. This seems to be a correct form of patriotism and things you guys should absolutely be proud of, along with that rich history and ancient civilizations.
LOL...
When I was in middle school, we got an assignment where we had to write an essay explaining why we were either proud or not proud to say the pledge of allegiance. I wrote that I wasn't proud because saying "one nation under God" didn't seem like a good separation of church and state and that it didn't seem like there was "liberty and justice for all." I remember, as an 11 year old, being pulled aside by my teacher who asked if I hated America and wanted to live somewhere else.
It is truly disturbing as a child when you are chastised with dogma when pointing out flaws within that dogma.
That's interesting, because what did they think was going to happen? Every kid would say they are proud? Of course some kids are going to think differently and explain their reasoning. Good for you.
I think kids should have this basic assignment, these days: "What would happen if you woke up tomorrow and money didn't exist and nobody knew what it was? Everything built is already known, all the knowledge is still written down and we have some people with really big houses and jets and vain stuff like that, but money no longer exists. What do you think would happen in the next 7 days? The next month? And next year?"
That's a Critical Thinking class question opener, I think.
What a courageous 11yo. I wasn't that brave at 11
OMG, that's simultaneously awesome but also horrifying that the teacher would be so blindly uncritical and that an 11 year old has to point out basic reality to someone that is supposed to teach kids how to think critically.
This is horrifying!
It's like a filtration system...
"A true patriot seeks to make their country the best it could be through change and reform, a "patriot" seeks to keep their country stagnant as they see it as the best version of itself"
- me, a couple years ago, also more than likely some dead guy who's way smarter than me
W
It's just like 1930's Germany!!! 😰😰
@@toolbaggers Germany was only trying to be 1900s america. They literally got 100% of their policy from American politics. America has segregation and slaving, while having killed off all our native populations, we also invented eugenics. So yea, Germany 1930 was based on the foundations of America. We have the letters between the two country’s to prove it as well. It’s a sad fact. We are the Nazis forefathers.
The majority of people with famous or profound quotes are just as smart as you
@@Trixie_Lavender I wouldn’t say that. Maybe as smart as this person. But if you’ve ever been out in ya’know the public. They are fucking stupid.
Here in Egypt "patriotsm" is a greatly hated concept among the public nowdays specially the young, cause it's only promoted by the ruling class, most of us don't feel like we are attached to our country anymore. This makes sense considering being ruled under a dictatorship regime. Hope this changes in the near future.
How it is there?
Hope you guys are able flip Sisi upside down like the Egyptian Mussolini that he is
I've said this a thousand times: this is not patriotism, it's nationalism.
and both are fine
@@cowfat8547nationalism will lead to fascism, while Patriotism is a whole different thing bru
@@alibarznji2000 depends on how far nationalism goes. nationalism at its basic level is simply putting the priorities of your own country over other countries. if it’s something like civic eco-nationalism (putting the protection of one’s country’s environment over everything else), it could be beneficial
Yeah sure, because climate change will _respect_ your nation's borders.
The video points out how borders are just arbitrary lines drawn on a map.
What affects your neighbor can also affect you indirectly. All too often, nationalists have a tendency to say "not our problem" when another country is suffering, and then complain about the price of certain products going up, never realizing that they went up because the SUPPLIER of those goods is the country that we ignored while it was burning.
@@leyrua Yeah and it’s a terrible video. Also I completely understand that what affects other countries affects us too. Globalism has made the world’s economy much more integrated which is a great thing. There’s also just simply helping out countries because it’s the right thing to do like with Ukraine. Plus when it comes to civic eco-nationalism, since the world ecosystem is interconnected and climate change is global, focusing on protecting one’s country’s environment means pushing for global policy change for the environment.
I’m Australian, we used to look to America as a kind of benevolent big brother, someone to follow and admire, someone we knew had our back.
Now America is viewed more like that crazy uncle you wouldn’t invite to a bbq.
Now we use it to laugh at them
And I laugh at both of your corrupt politicians. It's something that keeps me from crying
You can thank your own Rupert Murdoch for carefully raising that crazy uncle. No one single person has done more damage to present-day America than Murdoch. Thanks a lot Australia.
@@kkpenney444 we hate Murdoch too, he also harms our country.
@@kkpenney444 Good point!
If you aren't the biggest critic of your own country, something is wrong in your understanding of a democracy!
The blind love for a country and its actions is fundamental dangerous.
Sadly that is mostly the case when patriotism is part of your identity.
I completely agree with you! However in my country the people who hate Austria or even try to abolish it claim this opinion to be theirs. (sorry for my bad english)
Patriotism doesn't mean blind loyalism to your own country. In Ireland we are quite patriotic in our own way, but we are not overly militaristic and still critical of things our country/government does. We are generally quite Liberal too these days
@@professorminstrels6460But in America, it is. And we are talking about America.
@@tino5971 it doesn't have to be that way tho
If your definition of history is nostalgia wrapped up in a flag.......you’re a patriot.
“If you REALLY love America, you better love it so much that you ignore its historical and present flaws!” American patriotism/nationalism in a nutshell
Every country has historical flaws einstein..
@@donmezzanatto8607 attaboy let the whataboutism surge inside you
How true.
@@donmezzanatto8607yes, but do all of those countries ignore those flaws?
Most do COMRADE~...You have a low IQ@@theguythatasked6400
As an American, I find our sense of patriotism and national identity to be very superficial and hollow. It's all about flags and songs. It's style over substance, form over function. American patriotism is not about doing what's best for America, but assuming that we already are the best so we make excuses for not actually putting forth the effort to make America as best as we can be.
Also, the fact that we make children say the pledge of allegiance every single day is incredibly disturbing. Imagine forcing people to say a pledge to remind them of how free they are. If that's not Orwellian doublespeak, I don't know what is. State mandated patriotism is the kind of thing that dictatorships are made of.
THIS! Is the best comment. I am American and completely agree. I was a teacher feeling so out of place when it was time for pledges.
America is free only for the people who agree with the ones in charge
and i was shamed during freshman year when i stopped standing for the pledge. i soon began standing but not saying anything. i gave into peer pressure. they said i didn’t respect vets and soldiers. but i do. the pledge is not about respecting american soldiers. it’s about the government. if it was about the veterans, it would mention them.
Its due to a very dirty truth Americans have been conditioned to overlook, whilst the results of which are obvious to many around the world ... America took in many of the top Nazi officials after the wars and they've basically amalgamated their propaganda methods - because their belief systems are basically the same. Turn the volume down and its all the same thing... only difference is the Nazis probably didn't wear their flag on their underpants like the Americans do 😅
@@tootnfart Holy s%^t me too! I legit got pulled aside by the teacher and they attempted to guilt-trip me with military related nonsense of all things. Like lady first the vast majority of "soldier's" in the U.S. military have never seen violent action. Second I told her it shouldn't be required and they got visibly upset.
"You wouldn't want a constitution written by a bunch of frat boys to be immortal and unchangeable, would you?"
Funny story, Thomas Jefferson (one of the big brains behind the constitution) actually advocated for changing it periodically to update it with the times. He claimed that not doing so was like forcing a grown man to continue wearing the clothing he wore as a child.
That was the purpose of the whole system of amendments - to amend and update the constitution over time.
A perfect example is the second amendment. It was written when there was no standing army in America, having just won independence primarily because Britain couldn't get soldiers to the battle fast enough..The "security of a free state" isn't talking about individual states - its talking about the nation. It was basically saying "We need militias to defend against invasion, so lets ensure everyone is able to form a militia as quickly as possible". It was never about personal self-defense or to fight against your own government.
@@dyent it goes beyond that too. The US can't be conquered anymore so the reason doesn't exist in the current era. You have the most nukes and the biggest military. That alone is sufficient to deter anyone from wanting to fight a war on your soil, which is why you haven't seen a war on continental soil since the civil war.
Now what you do have is the only country with a mass shooting problem, and cities with homicide rates as high as some zones controlled by narcos in Latin America.
@dyent pretty sure "the security of a free state" goes against what you said. If the government becomes a dictatorship, it's no longer a free state, to which having guns would be very useful for removing the dictatorship and reinstating a better government. Your country can't become a dictatorship if your reign of power would last maybe a month. The second amendment was written to stop the government from becoming tyrannical, because they had just won a war against their own government for that exact reason and they didn't want to do it again
You can say all you want against the second amendment, but it is the reason we still have as many rights as we do. I know without a doubt that the government would remove many of the rights we have if they could. What stops them is 1/3 of the country owning guns and many of those people willing to fight their government in order to keep their freedom.
Think of it this way, if I don't go around committing crimes and killing people, then why does it matter if I own guns? Guns are used many more times per year to defend someone, than they are to hurt someone innocent.
@@samyloaiza98 the mass shooting problem is because the media glorifies it. We have guns in order to keep our freedom and stop our government from deciding that some of our freedoms aren't needed. If you think the shootings happen too often, then why not have security guards at the areas where it happens? Let's have someone there to stop it. Or maybe make it harder to get in to a school with a gun, by idk, having security guards, or a front desk that controls electronic locks in the doors to stop anyone from coming in with a gun. If we guard everything else with guns, why don't we guard schools too?
Of course. He also advocated for distribution of wealth every few generations too.
"Patriotism is the belief that my country is the best because I was born here."
-- Terry Pratchett, Jingo
@@justinratcliffe947 Pratchett is ridiculing patriotism/nationalism in Jingo.
Nationalism says "My country is better than yours." Patriotism says "I love my country."
@@tobitobi628 Exactly, as a democratic socialist, I love the US, I want to see it's problems get solved, I'm not gonna pretend they don't exist like some people do.
@@tobitobi628 And there's so much more too! Like fighting for economic equality, guaranteed housing, and empowering the people to have a real say in political, economic, and workplace decisions by redistributing power from the 1% to the other 99% of the population!
I mean, USA 🇺🇸 is the best,
Im an immigrant from asia
Anyone who's travelled even a modicum won't be able to help noticing that the US is the *only* country where people fly the national flag outside private homes en masse.
I know right. I plan to move to NZ in another year and it's completely uncommon there.
It also happens in Norway, though not in an overly nationalistic way. Some just genuinely appreciate the values of the country.
Except for 1 month in a year to celebrate National Day, it’s not even allowed in my country..
That has always amazed me, I don’t get the point.
Countries with cool flags get a pass. Canada, Angola, China, etc. US flag is mid af@@mirkoferrini6909
As someone who grow up in Germany and is currently a teenager, all that patriotism and nationalism feels incredibly strange.
Yeah as a German I agree
Same in Poland
I can see why you would not be proud of your own country.
@@scrambler69-xk3kvbeing proud of any country is weird...what are you proud of? The leaders? The people? The land mass? You have had little contact with and little influence over most of those
American here and I agree, that's why I don't partake.
"Patriotism is believing a country is the best because *you* were born in it" - Stephen Fry
That makes sense to me.
-Kayne West
“Try and take guns & rights away and I’ll take your life away”
-me
@@phillygrunt2154 What rights? Pretty sure in US you have to buy even basic human rights XD
The sports team from my geographical location is far superior to the sports team from your geographical location.
""Patriotism is believing a country is the best because you were born in it" - Stephen Fry" - Sun Tzu
Comedian George Carlin once said: "Rights aren't rights if someone can take them away. They're privileges. That's all we've ever had in this country is a bill of temporary privileges."
Ayy!!! My man, George Carlin!
If only he were still alive today.... he'd have a heart attack and die again at the state of this country.
How true
will never forget a teacher yelling at me for not standing for the pledge, saying it was ungrateful to her military husband…. some of us have our sense of selves way too woven into this country
I was visiting Mount Rushmore and didn't sing the national anthem before they raised the flag or whatever. I stood up and kept my arms by my side. Some woman after told me that it was incredibly unpatriotic of me to not join in. I laughed and said "Oh no sorry but I'm Irish." She told me that that shouldn't matter.
I stood, but I never put my hand to my heart or say the pledge. The pledge just feels cultist to me. I like the US to an extent, I like most of the people and the land, but the government has shown time and time again that it serves its self and those who run it and not it's people.
My favorite symptom of the American patriotism disease is this amazing double standard.
If you don't like your country? LEAVE
Meanwhile, people don't like Mexico and try to leave.
Those same "if you don't like it, leave" folks - Don't run away, FIX YOUR OWN COUNTRY!
Exactly
A lot of people (Mainly Conservatives) I've talk to love their blind Patriotism & will overlook or outright ignore a lot of systemic problems of this country Mainly by saying "America is The Greatest Country on Earth, & if you don't like it go live somewhere else" it's Infuriating that people can be so oblivious. 🤦🏿♂️
It's just like 1930's Germany!!! 😰😰
It was version of fascism.
They called it "National-socialism".
As russian i just say
"DON'T BE AFRAID OF FASCISM, FIGHT IT".
Well, or else you will live under fascism, as my deceived fellow citizens live and believe, who for 20 years already look like cattle, not people and are proud of Ruzzia, how much to take over the world!
@@reyalsregnava or just plain idiots
When they do say to me “leave if you don’t like it here”
At times..I respond back to them: “Well I don’t to be a victim under US foreign policy “, and you wouldn’t believe how it goes over many heads (mostly right wingers)- I am truly amazed how ignorant this country really is
America IS one of the best countries on Earth… which says a lot about the current state of the world as a whole
I started noticing this in the early 2000's when I was opposed to the Iraq war, I was called unpatriotic and all kinds of other things, my favorite was being called a Muslim sympathizer which I had to laugh at and agree with, it's so weird to think being sympathetic is wrong.
actually the people were uneducated & I understand you didn't know what to say at the time.
in Reality people / & ME who supported the war were Muslim sympathizers because we wanted the people of kuwait to live freely & Not be Killed by Saddams sorry ass Army.
I know my 1st girlfriend growing up was a Palestinian Muslim it's so sad that compassion is dead 😢
As a muslim I appreciate your sympathy
Muslim integrism is religious fascism. It's not because you are a PoC that you are always right or you above any critism.
@@olafsigursons Citation needed.
It’s not the patriotism that is worrying to me, it’s the militarism. The frankly creepy way people interact with ‘veterans’ is like something out of a dystopian sci fi novel.
@@eh3744The bitter irony is that those same people who advocate for needless wars are ones who push policies that rob them of their care, welfare, benefits and housing once they’ve completed their service
yeah people told me i was disrespectful to the veterans and soldiers when i didn’t stand for the pledge. IT DOESNT EVEN MENTION VETERANS 🤦♀️🤦♀️
Just recently came across your channel. As an Englishman, I must say just how fantastic your insight is. It's very interesting to get a better understanding of the American narrative from an insiders' point of view, especially one aware enough to be able to critique so well. Bravo. I will say I've met a lot of Americans out and about in London and other European cities, and astonishingly, those who travel (outside of the US) seem to be a lot more collected and critical than the portrayal of a lot of US citizens from your news media. Anyway, thank you.
So your telling me your statement isn’t just a regurgitated stereotype
I get the impression that a lot of American 'patriots' haven't visited many other countries, so their patriotism is not based on experience, just what they've been told.
Agreed. I would go so far as to submit that many of the ‘patriots’ haven’t even crossed state lines and have no idea how much time it takes to cross through a national border post. If they did they would see that borders are not as wide open as their propaganda has led them to believe.
this
And I get the impression you are guilty of the same crime
Well I'm afraid you're wrong@@assassinunknown6664
@@assassinunknown6664even if that was true. america is the dominant culture in media and internet. we are always seeing american politics and american opinions online. and for me personally, i tried to visit america and see what it’s like but i got my tourist visa rejected 4 times all because i happen to have an unfavorable passport.
Growing up I always thought that the truest form of patriotism was loving your country enough to want to make changes for the better of its people. By my teens and twenties very common to hear "if you don't like it leave" as a response to the smallest of suggestions.
As harsh as it sounds, that’s what many people do. Many people leave their countries because they don’t like their policies. Why can’t americans not content with the government do the same ?
@@kenethrodriguez573 Because it sounds like you think the country belongs to you first, because you like it the way it is.
@@autoteleology huhh ? No lol every country has a set of policies. That’s what our ancestors did also, left countries they felt uncomfortable. British left to come to the americas.
@@kenethrodriguez573 A vast majority of people do not do that. Do you think George, Alexander, Thomas, Benjamin, and John should have just left the colonies instead of declaring independence from the British? Also, the Brits didn't leave a country they didn't like. They established colonies all over the world in the name of and controlled by their own monarchy. Most of those places became independent only after the citizens enacted bloody revolutions and established new governments. Most didn't just leave.
The colonists who chose to revolt against the British government called themselves Patriots. Our modern use of the word patriotism is literally derived from that term. What's crazy is that some of the same people who tell others “if you don't like it, just leave” also say that storming the Capital was an act of patriotism. Why couldn't those people “just leave” instead of trying to stop the lawful transfer of power?
So many Americans would be horrified to know what the majority of the developed world thinks about them.
I feel like they don’t care and use it to justify their sense of “otherness” being separate and “better” than the rest of the world. Roasting America would make me defensive if I grew up there surrounded by its culture of patriotism personally
@@totallynotafanficreader7850 reminds me of how many americans seem to think europe is poor
They got phones outside America?
No, a lot are arrogant, ignorant and stupid and tell themselves (and us) that we are somehow jealous of them.
@@yobgow you are doing exactly what you think Americans do
A few years ago I was spending some time with a few neighbors of mine - they're not MAGA crazies, but they are slightly conservative - and when I told them that I indeed loved my country they couldn't believe it. Because they knew I was a democrat and that my political views swung top the left they assumed I hated America. I told them that realizing that your country was flawed and wanting to fix it was not unpatriotic, that, indeed, a love for my country was what motivated me to try to make progressive change. They accepted this, but it has always bothered me that most people equate patriotism with a completely blind acceptance that America was always good, was always in the right, has no structural flaws which need to be fixed, that "American Exceptionalism" was absolute and that the only problem this country has are "radical lefties" like me who want to "destroy tradition."
Dismissing concerns because 'someone else has it worse' is emotional abuse.
Seriously, ask a therapist.
It's yet another excuse they always make. They'll say..."well, just think if you were in a third world nation" how bad it would be". So that means we have to accept the United States being an oligarchy and never strive for anything better? So we have to accept the majority of people living in poverty and our environment being destroyed because our Government is thoroughly corrupted by corporate cash? It's like these people don't have a braincell in their skulls. I usually say to them..."You don't want us to be #1? You want the Scandinavian Countries to keep kicking our ass?"(by the way, these are usually the people who supported Trump with that slogan of "make America great again", quite ironic) That really annoys them. Especially when I get out my cellphone and show them the graphs and data! 😆
It's also a logical fallacy known as "whataboutism" which is a form of Appeal to Hypocrisy.
In psychology, this is called minimization.
Gaslighting
So do you support the folks who claim anti white racism? They have concerns but many say that other racial groups have it worse?
I've always thought of it like owning a house, pointing out a crack in the foundation or water damage in the walls doesn't mean you hate the house, and failing to recognize those problems will eventually lead to its destruction, so if you love the house, take good care of it
And sometimes when you ignore water damage too long, you might have to take the wall out and rebuild it. For the greater good of the house.
thing is, people have different understanding/believe which thing is bad and which is good. whats your solution to that?
@@rizkyadiyanto7922 democratic discussion focusing on the groups that specialize in each specific issue. Y'know, to avoid such farces as the recent congressional "hearing" on tiktok. And to avoid such things like the entire discussion being dominated by corporate media (a la most things in australia)
That really good analogy
@@pallingtontheshrike6374
Tick-tock?
You are correct. Democrats don't bother with things like ticktock 😂.
I've only been to the US once. It was sobering. It is my impression that the US is more a bunch of lonely individuals than a people. The diversity is so great, people have so little in common that they need something to give them a sense of belonging, of unity. I believe that is what that flag is for.
I was somewhere in Illinois. I worked on a project for an insurance company that had a luxurious building there besides the river. Just by walking through a neighborhood you could tell no one had the slightest bond with their habitat. One house deserted, weeds a yard high, broken windows. The next pretty rich, closed but obviously inhabited. The next one poor but also inhabited. Streets unmaintained, no money in the local government apparently. I suspected people didn't even know their neighbors. Washington felt a long way, like in a different world. The frightening understanding why people would ever vote for someone like Trump crept up on me.
But this is a description of modern western cities. Hence the rise in populism.
As a German the general concept of being patriotic is just wierd to me. When I first saw how proud Americans are of their country, I was honestly pretty disgusted. We can all see to what horrible things blind patriotism can lead and has leaded to in the past. My country is the best example and I think we should really learn from these horrible mistakes. In my country we say: „We are proud of not being proud“ („Wir sind stolz auf‘s Nicht-Stolz-Seins.“) Be smarter than my ancestors… (sry for bad english)
Your English is better than mine, a native English speaker
Some patriotism is overboard, but some people are thankful to live in a first world country, like in the west. Not being thankful is a little insulting to poor migrates from third world countries who are trying to flee to the west. I mean would you rather live in a third world country? Also, it's nice if people preserve some good parts of their culture. Like food, etc. However, I don't like how some people, like some Americans, try to hang onto some bad things cause they're desperate for culture too much. Such as too much car dependency.
What you are talking about is not patriotism, but nationalism. Nothing wrong about pride in your nation necessarily, just don't need to go overboard
@@denkanator I mean, yeah you're right of course. Not everything my country ever did was bad or smt, but it doesn't work like that over here. Of course I'm proud of my boi Carl Benz, who invented the car, or of how multicultural my city is now, but that doesn't make me proud of my country. I know that sounds probably wierd to patriotic people, but I'm proud to live in Germany, but not proud of Germany. If that makes sense idk ^^
@@user-gu9yq5sj7c I'm thankful for everything I have and that I can in a free country. I'm just not patriotic about it... Sure traditions are neat and I love the traditional food my Grandma cooks. We aren't insulting or disrespecting people who live in worse conditions, when we don't sing the national anthem in the supermarket. Idk being proud of my country is wierd to me and that's everything I wanted to say here...
If we in Germany pledged some kind of allegiance to the flag then the rest of the world would be worried but when Americans do it it‘s alright? It‘s not any less weird?
Well we startet two world wars (yes i know first one by Austria etc just to simplify what Americans are thinking) and America never startet cruel wars without cause…. Oh wait irak, Vietnam, and just so much more (but Americans don’t talk about that)
it's pretty much normalized, considering americans have been doing it ever since it was first established
doesn't mean that it's not weird
@@husooderudo210Franz Ferdinands assassination at Sarajevo in 1914. Dont tell me Americans think Germany started the great war.
@@cadjebushey6524sadly many do cuz the education system is shit.
Um guys german and american patriotism is like exactly the same thing guys. I mean both germany and america have a long history of being freedom loving, human rights preserving, bastions of liberty and peace right guys? I really loved the part when germany during the last few hundred years has spread their peaceful and loving ideas to their neighboring countries even if those dummies didnt want to accept the germans loving and kind embrace!!
As an American I've always been pretty critical and weirded out by patriotism/nationalism. My introduction to american patriotism when i was a kid was in school where we had a veteran come in and explain to us 'the flag'. It's history, the rules of how you treat it etc. They told us that you should never let it touch the ground and handed us all some mini flags. I as a pretty skeptical and curious child took my flag and dropped it on the ground in front of everyone. This wasn't out of "cool based anti american sentiment" or whatever but based off of me wanting to see people's reaction. Alot of kids got offended and started yelling at me, and I thought it was weird that they would be offended over dropping cloth that they had no other reason to think was immoral other than the fact that they had just been told to believe it. And this pretty much sums up my view of american patriotism for the rest of my life. A bunch of intellectual children being angered by things that don't hurt people for reasons they have never thought about and don't understand.
I’m not an American so patriotism and nationalism are completely different things for me. Some people get confused and conflate the two, but I don’t think that means we should do the same thing.
@@Spengleman2 That's the thing, you aren't American, and that is how it is unfortunately here. The typical "Patriot" here IS a Nationalist. Patriots in your sense of the word, and the correct definition, don't call themselves Patriots, rather "true patriots" or nothing, because they don't want to be compared to the nationalists.
Exactly the moment when American individualism is gone and become collectivist drone-minded shills they often think their enemies are.
When an American found everyone else odd, I always pointed out how it is very American to do so, while claiming to be "free" and "open minded" or living in a "melting pot" country. It is the same old American exceptionalism all over again: we were taught that everyone else will appear weird, because they are "different" from us. Americans however, tend to judge others from their own lens / perspective. They are more personal.
There is a code to respect the flag - and things are kept like that to make any symbol matters / sacred / meaningful in a culture. And if they respect that, I hope they can respect other culture, and not do what Logan and Jake Paul did in Japan.
@@tylerblue9691 it seems to me that part of the reason the American political landscape is so hostile is because language is so heavily manipulated. Both sides seem to constantly change the meaning of words and phrases as they become associated with cultural phenomena.
How are people supposed find mutual understanding if they literally fail to understand each other? I don’t think it’s a good idea to change the practical definition of words unless everyone is very clear about the new meaning.
When my mother passed away a couple of years ago. My two older sisters and I were moving stuff out of the house, throwing things away, donating stuff, etc. My father was very patriotic and had a American flag from before Hawaii became a state. I decided to keep it. One because it's unique and Two it was my father's. My oldest sister saw me with it and said " Don't throw that out ! " I told her I was keeping it and she calmed down. What she don't know is he had a modern one he would hang on the porch I threw out right before that. She also got upset when mom was going to throw out the family bible when dad died because it was falling apart. I don't know what else to say. Just wanted to tell the story I guess. I'm equal parts proud to be American and equal parts ashamed to be American.
as a German I may have a biased view on patriotism bc here its neither taught, lived nor encouraged but I gotta say its odd to pledge allegiance in the classroom every morning and hoisting your countries flag on ur house
As a German I agree
as a brit, we make fun of our own government too much to be this patriotic lmao
"It is lamentable, that to be a good patriot one must become the enemy of the rest of mankind." - Voltaire
As an American I was always curious where our patriotism came from. The Founding Fathers, certainly must have had some love (like?) of the British. They were just under the yoke of the Crown, which they didn't hate, just wanted independence from. All you have to look at is how quickly we tried to repair our relationship with them after the war.
WW2 and the cold war is really the start of modern patriotism in my historical understanding.
We did not really repair our relationship entirely until WW1. We even tried to invade them in the War of 1812 which was our fault (Well, Canada, but that was still British at the time, not Canadian as we know it whatsoever) and it didn't work very well. Burning the first white house is still a symbol of patriotism to this day.
Our relationship didn’t get anywhere until ww1.
It wasn't freedom to be equal, it was freedom to hold slaves when the rest of the world was ending it. Then conservatism turned to fanaticism which slowly turned the country into a mindless drone. This same thing was done in Afghanistan, the once liberal people are now fanatically conservative due to US's involvement..
England had its own earlier revolution lead by merchants who came in conflict with King Charles I. The king was executed after a meeting of 59 commissioner. A war broke out the ended with restoration of the King and Amnesty for all except the 59 commissioners. Those still living were forced to run for their lives to New England, the Dutch republic and Switzerland. The dead were dug up and hung in post mortum execution.
"The world is not going to be made better as long as the oppressed fight one another. for the crumbs dropped from the tables of the oppressors."
What a quote!
I must say my eyes have been opened hugely by this content!
From a very cold overworked south west England
It’s so weird to live in a country where when someone has the flag on their truck it makes your hair stand on end.
why does it make you feel that way? it’s just them celebrating their country by putting up a flag
@@cowfat8547 because if someone has American flags on their truck their most likely a Trump supporter
@@rigatonipasta it’s “they’re” and no that’s not true at all. some of the most overt patriotic people i know hate trump. it’s simply just a stereotype that gets pushed forward by propaganda videos like this
@@cowfat8547 not to delve into semantics but “their” is the possessive form of “they”. “They’re” is a contraction (shortened version) of “they are”
In trying to nitpick me you’ve only proven your own ignorance.
@@cowfat8547 do you live in America?
My dad told me this story: He used to work with an elderly man who was an immigrant from Nazi Germany, and made a miraculous escape from the country during the Holocaust. When I was in elementary school living in a conservative part of New York, his friend/coworker couldn’t drive to work one day, so my dad decided to carpool and pick him up at his apartment complex while driving me to school. When we pulled up to my school so I could be dropped off, the front entrance’s walkway had a line of poles with American flags on each side (it looked ridiculous, but “Patriotism”, I guess).
My dad said his friend/coworker (who, to remind you, was a refugee from Nazi Germany) got quite a disgruntled look on his face. He pointed to the display of flags and said: “This. This doesn’t look good.”
Won’t forget that story.
So being a conservative or Just a patriot means being a nazi oh Jesus could yall just use another argument yall are doing every time it has to do with any non woke left thing yall be like if u voted for trump u a nazi if u conservative u a nazi if u oppose abortion u a fascist if u dont follow every single word we say and be exactly the sheep we want you to be u a nazi it's pretty good tactic of pushing your values under the im the good guy who fights nazism role
@@superkingoftacos2920 so patriotism = nazism? Oh guess the next thing would be a Christian = nazi
It's interesting to me how Germany may be one of the most progressive countries in the world.
They took being Nazi's and causing WWII and the holocaust to heart.
And they STILL get called Nazi's to this day. Just because we won 80 years ago doesn't mean we now have the moral high ground.
We literally took all the Nazi's, made them work for us, and we are closer to creating a fascist regime than any other country.
True,, it’s like the statement that goes: “if you don’t think your country has propaganda, it’s working too well. “
Germany wasn't the one who was attacked and getting gassed in camps my friend
Everyone knows that after the national anthem is played, EVERYONE cheers and claps, yet if you ask them if they like how America is in its current state, most will say no. "Not my president. I hate this, I hate that." Americans like the "idea" of America, but with no one wanting to work together, it can never be that "idea" that they want it to be.
Thank you, after just a few minutes I subscribed. Am Dutch, living in Germany, age 78. Having lived in the Netherlands, England, Canada and now Germany and having traveled extensively to and all over the U.S.A. (approx 140 times in my life so far) and always having had a very mixed up "like/dislike" feeling, your approach to what I experienced being excessively weird (and stupid), i.e. this nationalism/so-called patrottism, your narrative is refreshing and - I think - absolutely neccessary and true. Thx again!
In the pilot episode of All in the Family, near the end, Mike ( meathead) says " Mr. Bunker I love this country too, thats why I want to fix thngs wrong with it."
While Archie is singing the national anthem out loud and ignoring him.
That scene says it all about this nation.
We are not innovating anymore and it seems to me that this country is becoming a dinosaur, just going through the motions, terrified of any change.
The obnoxious part is that those who most need to hear this message have been trained all their lives not to listen to it.
Worse, to reject it out of hand as subversive and criminal. We blacklisted writers in Hollywood, for crying out loud, because they were or were suspected to be members of the Communist Party. As a kid of the Cold War and the son of military vets, I was confused and terrified that such a thing could happen in America. But I credit my early history classes with providing me enough of the truth that I could go on and learn to think critically about the country in which I was born.
I can't hear you over all my freedumbs™!!!
Brought to you by Walmart©
@@Praisethesunson i love my country!!!™
Brought to you by Carl's Jr.
There's no need to be nice about it by saying "trained" they are fully indoctrinated to the core to ignore any facts and evidence that doesn't jive with their views of reality. It's not a coincidence that most of these types of people fall into the fundamentalist Christian nationalist category. These people have stepped up their game in recent years because they know they are a dying breed.
@@Praisethesunson "Welcome to Walmart. Get your shit and get out!" -Walter
“The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out for himself, without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, and intolerable...” -HL Mencken
Ironically, those who are blindfully patriotic, and willfully ignorant, are the ones who are most likely to scream "Learn To Think For Yourselves!". 🤔🙄
Conservatives: “If you don’t like this country, why don’t you just leave?”
Also Conservatives: “Immigrants should go back to their own country and fix it instead of stealing our jobs.”
"Uh oh, two independent thought alarms in one day." -Principal Seymour Skinner
Very well said. Good luck getting your message through!
Every time we wave the flag, you defend the system that makes rich people richer, and poor people poorer. So in that sense, yes, patriotism does pay the bills. Just not our bills.
Every time we wave the flag, we celebrate a system that makes rich people richer, and poor people poorer. So in a sense, yes, patriotism does pay the bills. Just not our bills.
As a German I can only say: It's probably a good idea to be a little careful with that "patriotism" thing. ;) Cheers guys
Concern yourself with your own country please. Thank you
@@sweetpeach3649 I am concerning myself with Germany, actually(?). Are you saying that I shouldn't be informed about or shouldn't be in contact with people from other countries? If so: Why the hell would I limit my intellectual scope like that?
@@sweetpeach3649 Oh what an Archetype of an American. Sad little creature xD...
@@sweetpeach3649 yea, but like we do the same 🙄
@@sweetpeach3649 When you are from the US, this would be pretty hypocritical
Thank you for speaking on the African American struggle within American patriotism. Very often, when these kinds of videos are made, this is a subject very lightly touched on, but I appreciate you taking the time to touch on not only the history but call out one of the biggest "shut up and dribble " talking points we have thrown at us.
It's unfortunate that sometimes leftists make the same racist claims as conservatives like "race shouldn't matter. Just accept my political theory and everything will work out." It's much more complex, and I'm glad this channel recognizes that. In this society, race and class intersect, and you can't just fix one and expect the other to "work out "
@@hueypautonoman I've been learning more about the lack of change from policing coming from within the community, e.g. the racial makeup of the local police force is similar to that of the population they police, yet issues and brutality remain the same, the needle doesn't even quiver.
It really puts into perspective how much work needs to go into all facets of these issues to change... literally anything.. To the point it becomes rapidly overwhelming to try to wrap your head around it all at once, at least as some single rando on the internet.
@@hueypautonoman bing9
@Sojo even though you're some rando on the internet, you're capable of doing something the majority of Americans have been unable to do for the past few centuries. That's something to be proud of even if you don't have a solution or something to contribute other than affirmation that you see what we have been saying. For me, at least, that's plenty.
Agreed
If your definition of history is nostalgia wrapped up in a flag.......you’re a patriot.
As an American I really like this video I’ve been called unpatriotic too many times and I think this shows that I was never really unpatriotic when I was simply questioning the ethics of it all thanks for making this video
I took two of my friends from China to an NBA game, and in the beginning there was the usual national anthem ceremony. My friend then turned to me and asked, "is this a religious thing"? Makes you realize just how weird US patriotism is.
I would have said, no, it's a cult thing.
I attended a game in the Chinese pro basketball league and the crowd stood and sang their national anthem louder than I'd ever heard the USA anthem sung anywhere. Nationalism is much stronger in China.
@@tperk - Was that a domestic event or were they competing with a team from another country?
@@RictusHolloweye Chinese Basketball Association finals between domestic teams.
I actually refuse to stand up for those things. Seriously, it is a violation of people's rights to force em to stand for the anthem, and I do not care about the dirty looks I get.
I am Dutch and had the misfortune to live in TX during the Reagan years. When I had a presentation I dared to question American freedoms. Mainly freedom of Speech. I made (or tried, I was just 14) the case that I found Amercian patrotism totalitarian as it did not allow for critism.
Long story short. I got my ass kicked on the track field, ending my American experiment as my parents found it safer if I went back to my own country. Where patrotism is reserved for soccer games.
I want to apologize for what my fellow Americans did. I'm embarrassed to live in a nation where so many people will literally attack other people for questioning their system.
@@TheBeatlesShow No need to apologize. Not trying to blame anyone. Just wanted to give an outsiders view on what so many Americans take on face value. Their precious freedoms. Besides, I learned (Texas) English as a kid. How cool is that.
I like how they basically proved your point.
@@TheBeatlesShow Honestly his problem was more about having bad luck of living with hyper conservative people than those conservatives being Americans. Every country has irracional people like that.
@@DarthFhenix55 I lived in many countries. It is no5t about X conservative people or X irracional people. American exceptionalism is a thing. Bred in schools, nr 1, USA,USA!. Pledge of alligiance. I am not blaming people, I was critiquing a social system.
Kids in school pledging to a flag in the corner is so damn culty, it's really creeping me out. This is brainwashing the citizens from a young age.
Of course there are these pledges of allegiance in other countries too: for policeman, judges and politicians. But not the average citizen. And especially not children.
Punishing children because they don't want to say the pledge of allegiance is wrong on so many levels. It kills criticism in its roots from a very young age
Never be proud of Something, If you didn't do anything for it. I mean, no one did "earn" His or her place of birth. It's just random.
You cannot inherit the right to be proud. You got to earn it by your doings.
The way Americans revere their constitution reminds me a lot of how many religious people approach their holy books. It was handed down from these semi-legendary figures, it can never be changed, and interpreting it to find out what someone hundreds of years wanted the country to be is more important than figuring out how we want the country to be today. In most other countries, constitutions can be rewritten or replaced if they are no longer fit for purpose.
Indeed, the American constitution is designed to be allowed to be amended by Congress, under certain voting results. It was also originally designed back in the day to keep the wealthy whites in power through multiple means (and we still are directly affected by several of them to this day).
For example, originally, only a white land owning head of household could participate in elections (this was later extended to adult men of all races, then adults of both sexes). Its electoral college is also designed for only a two-party system to ultimately survive (both of which are corporate puppets today). The Bill of Rights (free speech, arms, religion, personal property, rights of the arrested, etc.) also "cleverly" does not state that companies or individuals must respect those rights, only the federal government must honor them.
Well the US constitution can be rewritten. It’s called an amendment
@@iPlayOnSpica “shall not be infringed”
The 2nd amendment protects the 1st, to think the government cares about you is 100% a disillusion.
The reason is because despite our country only being about 200 years old it's still the oldest constitution on Earth and that's something to value
@@phillygrunt2154 What part of WELL ORGANIZED MILITIA does not get through your skull? They meant guns for what is today national guard, not every wannabe mass shooter...
I remember reading something a long time ago that said the reason American patriotism is still so alive and well as opposed to Europe was because it hasn't blown up directly in our face yet. In Europe, patriotism or nationalism directly resulted in two world wars and massive destruction on a level that no one had seen up until that point. This caused Europeans to tone down nationalist rhetoric, if not turn away from it entirely, for fear of experiencing another devastating war. Meanwhile, for the US, far enough away from the frontlines to avoid any direct consequences of the wars, patriotism is seen as something that actually helped us win those wars. And even though blind patriotism hasn't really helped in any American war since then, since the US is so far away from their opponents, the average American has never actually faced the consequences of it.
I don't know, there were many fascist/nationalist regimes in Europe even after ww2, like in Spain, Portugal, and Greece, and there are many powerful nationalist parties in many countries. Some of them directly tied to Nazis and fascists. They're even in power in Italy.
While this is true, one should ask why America engaged in those wars to begin with. I doubt it was for the freedom of their people.
the us has won no wars, ever
That's why I say the US is so hot for any war - after the civil war they haven't had one in their own country.
@@Celatra They did... albeit not militarily...
First time watching one of you videos and I already subscribe. How beautifully, objective and concise this video is made, already add 6 videos to my watch list. Thanks for speaking only truth
This kind of patriotism is kind of cute and adorable. I wish I had it in my country
I am 71 years old and you have articulated my feelings and beliefs better than I ever could have. Thank you.
Thanks for destroying our country Boomer
Man, you really had the opportunity to see a lot of things happen.
I'm in the UK and honestly American patriotism and watching some of them in church scares me. They seem nuts, to someone from the outside it looks like blind devotion and extremism.
It's just like 1930's Germany!!! 😰😰
yeah it’s weird. our ‘patriots’ are weird too but no where near like this.
@@toolbaggers why are you spamming this lol
theyre brainwashed
@@jifij89 our UK patriots look like nothing compared
What other country in the world insists on making their children pledge allegiance to that country's flag? North Korea….. and isn’t that the exact sort of company you want to keep.
I think it strange that we claim to be "American "when American is the whole western hemisphere from Alaska to Argentina
When my sister was an exchange student in America, every day she would get in trouble for refusing to recite the Pledge of Allegiance at her school. She told her teachers that "this is some North Korea shit". Seems very bizarre to force kids to stand up and pledge allegiance every morning at school. Tho I heard that not all states require this.
LOL. Some north korean shit. The irony.
Pledge of allegiance is not problematic on its own. We have it in schools in India too but then again, India didn't attack a nation two continents away for oil after lying about it having WMDs.
I guess WHO you pledge allegiance to is what matters.
I sat down during the pledge of allegiance once in high school and a male classmate kicked me and told me to "stand up."
yes, as someone who has never lived in the US, it comes off as super creepy and North Korea-like. Also, non-US citizens going to school in the US shouldn't say the pledge . . . they have their own citizenship and country. Why would they expect a child to have an allegiance to a place where they are just doing an exchange?
@@suzannahdarcy6903 non-Americans actually haven't been been expected to say the pledge, and it's also becoming an antiquated practice
One time I was working at a sports game and I was told to go run off and handle something just before the national anthem started. Which I did because you know... Its my job. Some guy in the stands threw a full bottle of beer at me (which I dodged 😎) and had to be removed from the stadium, where he was yelling to security that nobody respects the flag anymore.
It's kind of comedic but also kind of scary how violent and delusional these people are.
Liz Thats something thats different to my country. The national football/soccer and rugby coach appointment is looked upon with the same interest as the appointment or more than the appointment of the prime minister and thats the same for most countries other than american team.Yes you have the dream team ,but generally patriotism is not focussed on national sports team . Which is a pity because national sports teams provide a more positive outlet for patriotic fervour
@@gallowglass2630 Yeah, there's an interesting book outlining how Nelson Mandela utilized South Africa's rugby team to help overcome (the white people's) fear of ending apartheid. Helped some of the more ambivalent white folks realize that black folks loved the same sport and humanized them enough to change some minds.
Most assuredly he was a redneck with perhaps a high school education. Low income earner.
Americans forgo decent standards of living for pride. The countries with the highest standard of living do not require pride.
Americans have no sence of the redicilous. I can't remember who said it, but it explains a lot with American culture.
Is Americans aren’t that patriotic. It’s literally flags
There's nothing I love more than the "if you don't like it you can leave" argument. It's usually said by people who cry the loudest about their 1st amendment rights being taken away. Nothing says freedom quite like the choice between blind nationalism or exile!
I also love the irony that the people who claim to love the US the most and are the most vocal about it also despise over half the population and want to take their rights away
The empty can rattles the most.
It actually speaks well of that country that tells you to leave it if you don't like it. Afterall, it's the oppressive states that keep you from leaving it if you don't like it.
@ChuddleBuggy It's kind of insidious though because while you are "able" to leave physically, financially most can not. Also doesn't help that our leaders made us very unpopular worldwide.
@@anthonycekic4509 Oppressive states keep you from leaving. East Germany collapsed a long time ago now you don't want immigrants coming into the Imperialist nations. You talk of needing to build a wall because capitalism doesn't work for the masses of people as if you could survive without foreign trade. The bosses only hire if they can make a profit and because those who work can not buy back all that can be produced capitalism becomes the first system to fail due to overproduction of commodities . Capitalism can not use all the productive capacity and the stats kept by the Federal Reserve bank bear that out. The use of productive capacity has been in decline since stats began being kept in 1968.
The biggest weird thing for me is the pledge of allegiance. The fact that you force little kids to ritualistically recite it every morning, stood up, hand on heart, is just plain creepy. It’s almost got a nazi Germany or soviet Russia vibe to it.
Yeah I was really baffled when I heard that kids do that every morning in school. As a Finn, it seems so bizarre, almost dystopian lol
Lol ironic they do same things in socialist regime's, stop dissing usa...
@@a.ielimba78 so you're saying it's okay because authoritarian dictatorships do it too?
Even as a child I knew something was wrong with this.
I’d routinely refuse the pledge & be punished for it.Mostly sent to the principals office & talked to.
This was the 90’s in Florida btw.
@elimba78 lmao but that's exactly my point, you dullard
You're content is timely, relevant, eye opening!
Thank you for yet another video that has shed an insightful perspective into this topic. I also appreciate the perspectives shared from those of you from other countries in the comments.
Josh
I find certain phrases Americans use, to be so odd. 'That's unamerican behavior' or 'he's an all-American boy.' As though being American is associated with morality. No other country does this. I'm Irish, I've never heard of 'un-Irish behavior.' Nor does any other country do this.
India does it too. Sadly.
Australia does it as well.
Canada does it :(
I'm not surprised by Russia, but I didn't know Australia, India and Canada said it. To say something is 'unirish' behaviour would only only ever mean that someone is supporting the interests of the UK and perhaps was used in during the war of independence. The idea of one's nation being directly related to morality, is so strange to me.
England does it.
Completely agree with you. I am an Army Veteran. I wanted to go into the military since I was 10. I love my country but I see its flaws and many are ugly AF. I enlisted when I was 17 before my senior year and went active duty after HS graduation and turning 18 that July. I saw myself as a Lincoln/Teddy Republican. I had bought a computer game on the 88 POTUS election. You could run actual politicians or you could run as yourself after you took this political test which was the most thorough test I have seen to date. I came up on the Left though and this befuddled me. Then came the examination of the GOP overall and they were no longer the party of Lincoln/Teddy. 8value says I am a Libertarian Socialist. I am not a purist though.
There is a lot of flag waving and sabre rattling in the military but I was never any of that. I saw the repression inherent in the system. I wanted to correct that and make things better. I wanted to do 20+ years in and get my retirement but after 4 years I was done. At least for the Army. What gets me are those on the outside who say, thank you for your service. I mean wtf? We have a huge Vet suicide and homeless issue and that saying is like saying to someone, we send our hopes and prayers. You are doing absolute zero to effect change. See I worry every time my brothers and sisters get deployed in another war that has nothing to do with preserving our freedoms but just making rich people richer. I want to know, do we have an exist strategy? Are we actually helping the people there? See I am addressing our policies but to do so you get called unpatriotic. I get the blindness by service members, it is those civilians I am addressing who have never been in the military before.
They gaslight on the poor foreign policy by making it about the troops themselves. They completely take the lessons of Vietnam wrong. You support the troops by questioning why they are there etc. You support them by when they get home with their mental health issues, physical issues, etc. Supporting the troops does not mean accepting poor foreign policies.
Outside of that the GOP likes using children all the time in the same compacity. The US Constitution is a living document, meaning it is supposed to change with the times. This soldier though loves history. Not only would I read in fox holes, I was an atheist in them, still am. The history of the US though has been the history of various groups fighting for inclusion to be considered English White. I think we can do far better than we have and have a long way to go. I swore to defend that Constitution. The 1A is not saying you can go around saying racial slurs etc but is saying you can openly air your grievances about your govt at all levels.
In large part due to our innate Tribalism we tend to treat politics like sport teams. We cheer for our team while we leer at the other team. Our team can do no wrong as we boo the ref for calling a penalty on our team, "what, are you blind!" We know damn well our team committed a violation but for the other team, we cheer when a penalty call is made but will never come clean that we damn well know it was a bad call.
BUT, we do this also for things like a movie. Someone does not like a movie and another gets offended because we make all of this personal. Oh yeah, you do not like that movie means something is wrong with me. You do not like it? So you are saying something is wrong about me?
So instead of critical thinking of examining the validity of said criticisms, we personalize it as an attack on us personally.
Very well said.
Thank you for posting this.
Well said!
@Okami Amaterasu My man didn’t read the whole comment
@@okamiamaterasu5416 I have relatives I cannot even talk to any more. As kids, politics I do not recall ever being discussed but now they make everything about politics with little digs here and there.
I have a cousin who is a lot younger than me and I have only seen him maybe 4 times in my life but he has an ass whooping coming to him. I had to unfriend and block him. He wanted me to block him and just kept making comments to every post I had ever made till I did block him. He then went to his friends about how me, a libtard, could not handle the truth. Another of my friends watched him post that shit to his friends.
All of this because I made two posts. One was of President elect Trump over white supremacy groups to which I said he needs to distance himself from those types of groups and if not hate crimes will go up because they will think he approves of them and they can now come out into the light.
So my cousin was calling me a jackboot over that as well as a Nazi.
I found a clip of the 1980 GOP primaries where Reagan and Bush ran against each other. The question was on illegal immigrants to which both said, they just come here for jobs and should not be criminalized, the guilty party are those who hire them. I said, wow how much as the GOP changed on this stance. It was an objective statement of fact. CA Senator Pete Wilson (R) said the same thing when he became CA governor in the 1990s and wanted to go after businesses. That was short lived and I am sure he was taken aside and talked to. Instead no fines to businesses and just the capture and deportation of those immigrants.
So here again, he was posting I was a jackboot and a Nazi because I was not bashing the Democrats as well. So I found a clip of Clinton in his first term and Obama in his first term talking about immigration and they were consistent. Both were deporting people and some even called Obama, Deporter in Chief due to this.
@@DevinMacGregor republican’s seems to scream nazi at anyone while reading mein kampf and agreeing with it
This is short but really good. Nice one
14:56 I’m always amazed that people can reconcile that poor needs to “pull themselves up by their boot straps” instead of asking for a handout, yet it’s okay for big corporations to get bailouts and tax cuts 😅
My personal theory from observation is that you talked to any of the voters who say bootstraps stuff, they are going to not like bailouts either (unless it's a company they work at). It's the lobbyist-led politicians who we all elect to do the bailouts, whether its cronyism or fear of economic collateral damage
OH and are the Rich people of Russia, England, France helping their poor people? you people really NEED to do some more World Studying
@@MetalHeart8787 I barely see a country actually helping their people, but only a pretty handful, one I know is Japan, the others idk but I'm sure there are, rest like US, China, Russia, UK, France and more? Hahaha no, also Russia is ruled by Soviet oligarchs so pretty much this explains it
@@MetalHeart8787 Of course they’re not. First of all this video wasn’t about those countries so what you just did is classic example of tu qouque. Secondly it shouldn’t be surprising in the slightest that the poor in those countries face similar oppression as all of the nations you mentioned are capitalist countries, which means their ruling class have very similar motivations to the ruling class in the US.
Have same people tried to pull themselves up their bootstraps,
"Getting out of that is as easy as pulling up by your bootstraps" was coined by unions, because, well its night impossible.
So have you tried to pull up yourself up your bootstraps, try it, might be a good answer.
Such a great and educational video and channel
Patriotism/Nationalism is more similar to what Mexico, China or Ukraine have for example, American patriotism sounds more like a strange mix between Italian German and modern Russian fascism.
It’s also really eerie to see it spreading over to Canada. Protesters holding up American flags and spouting “freedom” nonstop.
Australian politicians have been trying to import US style ideology, including exceptionalism. It's had varying degrees of success (with right wing, conservative people) but I am hopeful the majority will detect and reject it.
Whenever I see a car drive by with Canada flags, I don’t know if they just like Canada or are a nationalist freak.
There is growing fascism in Canada.
@Zaydan Alfariz freedom of speech is dangerous. The "convoy" protests are a prime example of this. I'm in favor of this kind of interjection made by the state.
Also a socialist.
@Zaydan Alfariz I was personally in favor of the use of the emergencies act. The trucks should have been towed day 1. Nobody has the right to block our roads and the people behind all of the noise complaints should have been fined. The casual protester who wasn't disturbing the peace at night is perfectly fine. The emergencies act was required because the cities police force was incapable of maintaining the rule of law and so was the province of Ontario. This never should have gotten out of hand to the point where the federal government had to intervene, but municipal and provincial government was unable to enforce the law.
I was always confused why Americans think red white and blue are there colours, like dozens of countries have that on their flags
Try the majority of 196 countries.
Lmao I once saw an American who has his own CZcams page watch a video about the Netherlands and when he saw the flag he said, quite seriously, 'Copycats!' just because of the red, white and blue and yes he did cop a load of flak over it and plenty of New Amsterdam references!
Shock horror. Apple pie wasn't invented in America either and the music to their anthem is a British drinking song :D There are apple pie recipes dating back to the 1500s and earlier.
Never forget, they have usa educations.
@@B-A-L well OK that guy is an idiot. Thats why people should watch my Videos about Flags,
I love being from where I'm from: Portugal and the United States. I love how unique each place is, the nature, the monuments, etc, but I still recognize how flawed each place is in their governmental and social workings. There are so many things wrong in the United States that continue to go wrong because of national pride, or for a blind devotion to "American Values", and there are so many things wrong in Portugal. When I visit my home countries (I live abroad), and mention where I live, there's always a tone of either superiority or detachment from any responses. These places seem so foreign and so different, that anything in those countries couldn't be as great as what we're familiar and proud with, right? At least, that's what it sounds like when I people react. I have so many friends from around the world, and we all have love for our home countries, but we can still laugh together about the same youtube videos, complain about homework, stress about our futures, recommend cool Netflix shows to each other. Despite the patriotism we have for our countries, we still have our hearts open to love other cultures and values, and we can recognize that the values upheld in our own countries aren't all perfect. I wish that this was something most people could recognize. The problem with radical patriotism in the United States would be so much better if everyone had a clear lens to the world around us, to how other people live their lives, and how every nation has something to bring to the table, but American systems just don't do well with adapting to international settings.
This is my absolute favourite essay video on CZcams. I've always hated the concept od patriotism and i never understood why
As a Russian this topic of uncritical patriotism really hits close to home, thank you for the video.
Edit: Don't read the replies if you value your sanity :)
How many military bases does Russia have in Latin America?
@@MatheusFernandes-xf4zm Would you support literally any murderer or terrorist so long as they oppose the US? This is the logic of a 10 year old who got into trouble for shoplifting who thinks he did nothing wrong because his friends who did it with him avoided trouble.
@@dueiu3383j I can't support any people who fight against dollar hegemony and fascist imperialism, oh my god I'm so wrong🤡
@@MatheusFernandes-xf4zm You can say whatever nonsense you want but at the end of the day it's s just one breed of fascists vs another breed of fascists to anyone with a brain.
@@dueiu3383j USA: "800 military bases around the world, created a military dictatorship in my country and condemns us to poverty"
Illuminated Anon: "You should love America"
stupid puppet
I'm enjoying your videos more and more! Thank you so much for this one: you articulated these vital ideas with a clarity that filled me with relief, to be real. Your brain does great work.
I never understood patriotism, the hell are you proud of? That you were born in a random place? It's a strange type of "us vs them" tribalism that feels completely out of place in a modern connected world
Patriotism is the conviction that your country is the best simply because you were born and/or raised in it.
I'd call that nationalism...
It's just like 1930's Germany!!! 😰😰
its kind of weird, because, patriotism is really an invention of the state, you are made a patriot, the state (as nation-state) created all sorts of mechanisms to alienate its population to feel part of their country (the flag, national anthem, national heroes, iconography, and so on) having a patriotical population, means its easier for the government to do things without getting questioned
@@ramenbomberdeluxe4958 So, in other words, American patriotism is a (deliberate) misnomer and what they're actually shipping is outright nationalism.
@@lonestarr1490 In the words of Emmanuel Macron in an address to Trump and Putin in 2018
"Patriotism is the exact opposite of nationalism. Nationalism is a betrayal of patriotism. By putting our own interests first, with no regard for others, we erase the very thing that a nation holds dearest, and the thing that keeps it alive: its moral values."
As a foreigner to the usa all you said is pretty evident from the outside. I feel like I already knew everything you said!
Regarding patriotism, I consider myself patriotic even when my country is very capitalist and I'm an anarchist. This is because I love my language, many parts of my culture, our history, our sense of humor and so on. Many have told me to leave if I hate our system so much, but I believe leaving is selfish. I must stay and do all in my power to make the changes my people need.
Hopefully we can unite on day, so that all of our efforts can be directed towards the greatest good.
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!! ANARCHISM!!! HAAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!
@@nocantry the day the world unites is the day pigs can fly. (and also the day i kill myself)
@@hansiza9701 so...why are you laughing in a way that coveys to us that we should know the reasons for your laughter? Are you finding it hard to mount an argument or is it just Tourettes?
@@hansiza9701 you okay dude?
Love your channel. This helped critical thinking for the population or at the very least viewers. Subscribed!
I really enjoyed your video. Great points 💯
American patriotism is far closer to a religion than it is to a love of their nation and many of the arguments patriotic americans make are very similar to those made by religious people.
There is a term for it, the "American civil religion." The idea that American patriotism, though not actually a religion, does share a similar social function. It has rituals, and symbols, and a notion of righteous and sinful behaviour. It serves to unite the community, and in doing so to also define outsiders who are not part of that community. And it has certain sacred elements that must be accepted for a person to be considered part of that community.
It's a cult
@@vylbird8014 Indeed. Which is funny considering those that claim to be "Christian nationalists" are violating the whole no idolatry and serving two masters thing in the Bible. What does pledging allegiance to the flag or standing up for the anthem in any country actually achieve unless you believe it is spiritually empowering the people of the nation somehow. I get that it's a sign of respect in some regard, similar to standing at a funeral, but come on.
Let's not forget about the North Koreans that see Kim Jong Un as a type of God and have pictures of him in their home that they pray to as well as make pilgrimages to his grandfather's home.
if you are familiar with the bad religion song "the american jesus" it deals with it. its weird, because i consider myself religious, but its just a bizarre mix.
@@zaberfang Too bad a lamb is not leading it.
As a german this video is very interesting. The last time we tried Patriotism it didn’t work out quite well, so there is not this kind of patriotic national pride like in the us. I personally think that this is a great advantage for example in history class where we learn (from what i can tell) out of an very objective standpoint.
Don’t mind me please if there are any grammar mistakes
No your grammar was great! Thanks for commenting!
As an American, I'm always told that "patriotism" =/= nationalism. Yet, since before I was born the two have been conflated heavily and whatever distinction there ever was has neither been clearly articulated to me nor seems to accurately describe how the terms are used.
Ah but Germany has excelled so much as a country in the past decades. You have overcome a lot and are now one of the leading nations in the world. You don’t try to cover up past mistakes. And that is something to be proud of as a German!
@@magesalmanac6424 They never would have developed that way if they hadn't been completely defeated so the Allies could direct their rebuilding and reshaping.
@@magesalmanac6424 one thing about the germans is they do not try to cover up their past, they actually learn from it. From teaching history to kids in school and banning the nazi salute in public, is them owning up and learning from their mistakes.
...the japanese on the other hand...LOL