Investigating The MISMATCHED Main Bearings In The BROKE DOWN 235 Chevy
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- čas přidán 20. 02. 2024
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The customer brought us their 1956 235 Chevrolet after it broke down within about 10 miles of a complete rebuild..
In the teardown video ( • Their 235 Chevy BROKE ... ) we found a few things wrong, including a .020" main bearing shell mixed with a .030" main bearing shell on the front main journal.... Why?
Check out the playlist here: • Our Customer Brought U...
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I was told by a few engine builders that you can take two different sized main bearing shells and combine them to get your desired clearance, I've done this and it has worked for me in the past. So this shouldn't be done?
@@rustybritches6747 because the crank will then be off-centre within the bearing housing
😊😊😊
Can you ahow what it looks like after a shop preps a head surface with a 3m roloc disk? What does the surface finish measure? High and low spots. Etc. I'm at a dealership and we use the blue 3m rotor disks for nearly every head and block surface. Would love to see that same surface 3m resurfaced, then machined.
@@revell7156: Don't do it, especially on aluminum heads! Using a 3M Roloc for anything but the slightest of clean-up makes for a short trip to the next blown head gasket. Shops which do this are, generally, low-budget, schlock operations. You can bet that the customer gets charged just as much as if the head(s) were sent to a good shop and surfaced correctly.
It's always such a pleasure to have a look in a real shop. No shouting, no boasting, just quiet confidence, a lot of experience and genuine bemusement. I sincerely hope that your videos attract customers that appreciate this level of detail and quality. - Ed.
Not a fan of Orange County? Me neither.
The good side of youtube
And a lot of waiting till people get around the corner and mumbling "you never let me do anything!" Lol jk i agree ed, this a very enjoyable to watch their interaction
I'm not so sure about "bemusement"! Look it up.
@@edwatts9890i can see the bemusement. It is kinda like befuddled.
The lack of music or exaggerated good old boy accents mixed with just straight forward machine work, clear explanations, make this easily one of the best automotive youtube channels. Never change
This! The fact they don’t have shit scripted out ahead of time and just let their conversations flow naturally is one of the biggest reasons why I watch their stuff. If there was anything I hated during the weekend automotive blocks on Speed Channel and Spike, it was the scripted BS that ruined the flow of the show
I'm not so sure about "exaggerated"!
The aspects this comment along with this dad son teams
Interesting content reasons to subscribe
I'm pretty sure that farmer accent is legit. I live among farmers and its real.
I must have the same accent. I don't hear anything.
A friend of mine, who was a pro motorcycle mechanic (working for som of the top racing teams in Europe back in the 90s) was rebuiding a GSXR 1000 one night, I was there watching, so was the owner. This guy never rushes anything, the work is slow but top notch. The owner got stressed and tried to rush my friend to work faster. When he took a pencil and eraced Suzukis nubers on the main bearings, the owner really rolled his eyes; Why not just mount them, right out of the box?
When he unpacked bearing nr 3, he found that Suzuki had packed two different size bearing halves in the same box.. Saved the owner from a very expensive experience..
I wil never forget that..
That's exactly why a good shop doesn't allow customers in the shop.
I used to hear people "well, they don't want you in the shop because they're trying to hide something!"
That might be true in some instances, but mostly, it's a matter of liability and having to comply with insurance requirements - when I left the automotive repair industry in 2002, shops had to have $1,000,000.00 worth of liability insurance in case a customer got hurt on the premises. Gas stations that also did repairs were worse. They had to carry a million for the shop, and a million for the rest of the station.
And, as the story illustrates, it's a matter of distracting the guy that's performing an expensive repair on your vehicle, and potentially costing you a lot more because you wanted to hang around.
More haste, less speed :)
You do have to check behind parts manufacturers. Monday and Friday parts come in many ways !!!
Always enjoy your videos. It would be great to have follow up footage on the engines [when possible] to see the engine running in the vehicle, and customer comments on finished product. An epilogue as it were.
Haste makes waste
As a teen I worked in a tractor dealership. Every time we had an engine that needed machine work I spent the better part of my days at the machine shop watching the work being done. Crank Grinding, cylinder boring, head/valve work done, etc. The guys in the shop appreciated my interest and taught me a lot over those years. This reminds me of those years very much. Thank you for all of your professionalism & dedication to the art.
You guys are definitely the definition of if something is worth doing it’s worth doing it right. I wish more people were like that.
They are part of a dying breed :(
I absolutely love the dedication of these guys.
Dying breed unfortunately
Precision machining especially must be done right or its worse than worthless.
There is an old adage: If you don't have time to do it right the first time, when will you have time to do it again.
This pair is a golden example of that. Bravo Zulu for these guys. (BZ is an old, at least navy term, for "good job!")
As a full-time Gunsmith this is what I do when installing scope rings.
Many scope rings (especially older ones) are made just like rods.
BTW, my Dad has been an automotive machinist for 50+ years.....just now semi-retiring.
My oldest son will probably take over in the next few years.
I worked with my Dad for about 5 years......you guys work together MUUUUCH better than we did. KUDOS!!!!
Well . . . It helps when the cleaning guy knows his place and doesn't act like he owns the place!
😜😜😜
@@marcusambrester Yeah, those guys get big HEADS!!😊😅
I’ve worked full time as a mechanic for close to 20 years and I find your channel to be very addictive. Love the information, your shops dynamic, and dedication to quality. Carry on!
The cleaning guy does a great job of explaining things as he goes along.
Machining these old engines is becoming an art form. Passion with patience towards perfection. Would like to see this engine running in the truck.
I’m just a 53 year old IT guy that wants to know how things work. Love the father / son duo. Long time subscriber that loves this channel.
I love this channel, it's how reality TV on motor cars and cycles should be. No crappy egos and bs trying to make it interesting. Keep up the good work guys. Memories of my youth. Best wishes from Australia. 🇦🇺
Yeah, let's keep it boring...
@@Cheepchipsable So why are you here hero?
@@lukewise1227 I'm pretty sure that "boring" was a play on words.
@@byronmill I don't concur.
@@Cheepchipsable: Or surfacing...
When you were talking about cylinder clearance it brought back memories of my old 74 Chevy truck, it had a 250 straight six and 3 on the tree in 1998 I paid $400 for it. During the winter of 99 on a Saturday I had to work the morning was freezing cold but when I got off at 1 o'clock it was 60 degrees, it never occurred to me that I had a piece of cardboard in front of the radiator until the temp light came on, seconds later the engine developed a misfire. I stopped and removed the cardboard and drove home. Number 6 cylinder had no compression. I pulled the head and found the number 6 piston cracked around the ring land, it got tight and popped it. Spent the rest of the night getting the piston out. On Sunday I ordered a piston and rings and gaskets from Napa and left my piston and rod with them so they could press the new piston on the rod, the machine shop guy wasn't there on Sundays and I didn't have any spare cash to offer as an incentive. Monday I had to get a ride to and from work. When I got home I measured the bore, without honing for a crosshatch I had .007" clearance, after honing I had just over .008", the taper was about the same. I had Napa mic the piston because all I had was an inside mic set that I inherited from my dad and a 1"-2" outside micrometer so I knew my inside mic was accurate at 1" and 2", I figured it would be good at whatever the bore was. I reassembled her and she purred like a kitten again. No smoke either. She served me well for a few more years but sadly the power train was still in great shape when the body rot ended her life. And it still used a points ignition.
The job wasn't daunting at all, no different than doing an in-frame on a diesel. I think the whole job cost me $60 in parts and I already had the tools.
I'm still amazed at the results I got with the cylinder wear it had, I was sure she was going to be a smoker.
Back in my day we would knurl piston skirts and valve guides to tighten things up when clearances were loose but owners had no money to proper repairs. Nicholas probably would laugh out loud at the thought but I wonder if the Cleaning Guy ever did that stuff?
At our old we always tried to help out the regular guys. We didn't waste all that time measuring the fly crap. Taking hours to deglaze cylinders. We got $8 a cylinder to deglaze with either 3 stone or ball hone. If you're not going to bore it, why should I charge the customer $90 an hour for all that fussing. We did what the customer could afford. Did it 50 yrs never had a come back. Always instructed customer on assembly.
76 C10 with 3 on Tree 350 (5/8 Ton Truck) thats what I learned to drive standard in
For an old gear head who was in another field of work, it's very interesting to see all your various machines in set up and operation, greatly enjoy your channel and respect your work.
And Nick, congratulations on the upcoming addition to your family!
I feel blessed when we get TWO videos in ONE week!! Thanks, guys, for showing the world the correct way to do automotive machine work.
Chevrolet and GMC may have made one million of these engines. I had no idea of the complex measurements and procedures required to bring one back into proper operation. This is a fine video. Thanks, Gentlemen!
I live nearly 2000 km (1250 mi.) away in Northern Alberta Canada. I watch all your videos. I wish it was plausible to ship you the motor out of my 1974 674 International for rebuild. I thought I knew a fair bit about rebuilding motors but after watching your videos, I realized how little I really do know. The attention to detail, the decades of experience, the knowledge, and the pride in your work is very hard to come by now a days. Thanks for another awesome video.
As an owner of several Chevy inline 6s over time, I found this series very interesting. Thanks!
yeah.. i'm solely here for the blue flame stove bolt
I loved working on those inline 6's. I had 5 chevy cars with that engine. Had a boat with 2 6's. Easy to work on in a bilge compared to a V8.
CONGRATULATIONS. Having your first baby is going to be a wonderful time. I have 1 daughter and 3 granddaughters and I wouldn’t change anything. So much fun.
OMG Gentlemen, what a masterclass. I love the way you "out loud" your thought processes, thinking, and understanding of the challenge. It's so informative, educational and instructive.
Your experience, skill and understanding of your trade is obvious
I'm addicted to this channel now, which just isn't FAIR 😂😂
NEW SUBSCRIBER from Ireland 🇮🇪
👏👏
thank you both so much
God Bless
This engine brings back memories for me I was assembling a 454 Chevy engine for my uncles motorhome and when I checked the bearing clearances all were good except one ...as it turned out there was standard bearings in an under size box ...the parts guy at the engine shop that did the machine work could not believe that I found this problem because he said no one checks all the bearings...I said I do ..I was taught to be thorough ...thanks for sharing your good work with us
I always check all bearings. I have a great machinest, still I check all his work just to be on the safe side.
I really enjoy these longer videos!!! More time to listen to the cleaning guy explain the meaning of life!
So glad I found this channel. I’m fascinated with this as a 43 year old bloke from England.
There's a few channels on youtube that I really enjoy, but the father and son ones seem the best, in my opinion. Love you guys, thank God your fathers passing along his knowledge. Lord knows we've lost a lot of it in the last 40 to 50 years.
You might be on to something, another one of my favorite channels is Stud Pack it’s a father son carpentry channel.
A father and son getting along is a nice wholesome experience.
Man your dad is a legend! Cherish every single moment you guys spend working together. This engine is going to run amazing!
Extremely interesting ! You guys are spending a lot of time on this restoration ! Setting up the Mains is a eye opener for me ! Thanks for sharing !
Machinist rule; before we change size/dimensions we check part numbers to make sure we have the right parts. 😊
I really enjoy your videos. I really appreciate the expertise and the wholesome relationship between father and son.
Wish I had a dad like the cleaning guy. He's a good guy.
From a guy who taught himself engines and machining your videos are spot on. Very much enjoyed this and looking forward to more on this engine. Great job guys.
I just recently found your channel and I do enjoy watching it. I started working as a mechanic for my Father in 1964 and worked on automobiles until I moved to Alaska in 1986 and worked mostly on heavy equipment. I also got my welding certifications that almost guarantees you a job in Alaska. Over the years I received a degree in electronics and retired from that field in 2005
I have been retired since 2005 and the last 235 I worked on was probably in the late 1970's so it has been 40 years since I had the head off of one, but if my memory is correct, the 235 was a full pressure oil system and used bearing inserts. I have never seen an engine that used inserts and shims. The shims were used on the earlier 216 with babbit bearings. The method you described to adjust them is what I remember as well, but I don't remember ever seeing a 235 with babbit bearings. We checked the clearance with plasti-gauge on every rod and main bearing on every overhaul, .002 to .003 was acceptable, any more they would burn oil because of the excess getting thrown toward the top end. There were oversize bearings then, .003, .004, and .005, but my Father would not use them. It was time to turn the shaft or put in a short block.
We also did not put lubricant on the bearings when we installed them. My Father felt it was an easy way to get dirt under the cap without knowing it. We removed an oil galley plug and attached a hose from a portable oil pump and lubed the engine just before we started it.
Great channel, it brings back a lot of memories. . . .
Many people expect, ( Fast, Cheap, and Perfect. ) Rushing a task usually creates problems, Cheap labor usually gets low quality, and Perfection isn't realistic when combined with the first two.
I love watching your videos. I admire your value of doing your best. Both of you guys should be very proud.
As a guy who also occasionally edits hour long videos, thanks for doing it. I love the long content.
Not very many years before poured Babbitt bearings were the industy " norm ". So this motor is a pioneer with insert bearings. Lots of finess to fit properly. Great video. This motor will run many years.
Returned to watch these videos that I missed before and I want to thank you for making these! Your father and son relationship resonates the same vibes that me and my dad have. When he still was in better condition, we assembled one B20 motor that was machined in local machineshop and I will always remember that. It was a fresh engine for my Volvo 142 -72 that I used to drive when got my drivers licence ❤ So many good memories, nowadays I work as a machinist for local production machinery where we do a lot of different parts for the industry and I love it 😊 Love all the different machining work that you post and its always a good time to spend watching, much love from Finland ❤
Congrats man!! Get ready to have your whole world change when the baby comes!
I hope you drill the block to give full pressure rather than bypass oil filtering. Simple change by machine shop. I am an odd ball as I love the 235 - have two city under bench and obviously one in my 54 3100
Still run 1 also in my 59 1/2 ton Apache ..original 235
Did a 440 Mopar once that the crank wouldn't turn at the final torque spec which I believe was 105. It would spin free at 100. The block came from a local machine shop to replace a cracked one. Turns out they were missing a main cap and used one of our originals without align honing or even telling us. I was amazed that just a few pounds of torque made such a huge difference.
I could watch you guys all day long, the experience and knowledge you guys have is awesome 👍🇺🇸🇺🇸
You guys make an awesome team ! My Grandfather taught me a bunch. He had a huge factory and he was the master of the tool and die room ! 3 Bridgeports and a lathe ! I'll never forget his Gerstner wooden toolbox !
I pulled a abandon 65 Chev 1/2 side step out of a potato field that had three broken piston and brought it back to life . By replacing all piston and connecting rods that came out of a 283 .. ran like a champ ..the engine out lasted the body of the truck .
Love watching you interact with your old man, you're truly blessed my man...
In the first video of this series where you initially discovered the 20 bearing, the cap was originally bolted on with the nipple towards the 3rd bearing. You've turned it around on re-assembly so the nipple was towards the 1st bearing. Maybe having the cap bolted the wrong way round was the reason the 20 bearing was in there in there from the last workshop.
You are so lucky to work in such a wonderful environment, I am thankful that you share your talents with us!
the best duo and channel on all platforms . absolutely love watching your craft
Thanks for the great content in your videos. Much more informative than TV, really makes me appreciate the quality of your work and the effort you put into editing the videos and explaining important details. I had a 52 Chevy with a 235 , really a sweet little engine.
Those venerable dial gauges would benefit from new clear glasses. I’m sure a clock maker could help.
They sell replacement super cheap. Easy to install. No clock maker necessary
That new honing oil looks good. All I remember was the black stuff. Thanks for the videos. I love watching precision machining.
Love to the details. That's why I like watching you work. Thanks for showing !
I loved one of the final comments, "when it came in here it had already gone 10 miles more than this one". Humility.
I'm looking forward to watching this one. You guys are doing a great job so far. Love watching you both do this stuff. Keep up the great work.
Thanks for digging in to this
I love watching you guys. A good machinist is like gold, and you gentlemen shine!
I really enjoyed this one guys, thank you!
Your videos are a pleasure to watch, ole dogs can still learn new tricks. Thanks for being so thorough in your explanation of the process and cure of issues, looking forward to the next one, only wish you had a dyno, I'd love to see this run.
Awesome gentlemen. A real pleasure to learn from watching your work.
It was pretty neat to see the decking progress .002 at a time.
This style video is my favorite so far. Thanks for the hard work
This is high quality watching and even higher quality machining! Thank you!
Also congratulations on parenthood!
Wonderful series .... 235 brings back memories!
Thank you for great audio.
Have this engine in 1967 C-30 dumptruck with heavy gravel box. The origal engine was swapped for the smaller displacement earlier engine.
Must be a good engine.
Very much enjoying the calm, deliberative expertise.
Love watching you guys. I'd be that old guy that said "we did hundreds of those old Chevys". Measure the bores, ball hone it 15 seconds a cylinder, send it down the road.
Actually measuring the finish? Are you serious?
Why do they make ball hones? Why do they make plateau hones?
Used them for years in our shop. Never had an issue. My old boss would have given us hell for all that diddling around. Your not boring it, measure and reglaze it, get it done!
Howdy from Sacramento! Your dad is so cool, and I like how there is mutual respect between you. You're blessed to be able to work together. Thanks for sharing!
I have a strong feeling the cleaning guy has done this before.
your videos always brings back memories . I have used the old style boring bar that bolted to the block. But i don' remember working on any old stovebolt 6s. They were gone and smallblocks were swapped in.
Always a pleasure to watch and hear a master of their trade at work. The old 235 Chevy engine did not put out a lot of horses but it was a dependable engine in its day as was the 265 V8 and 283 that followed.
I really appreciate these videos, I rebuilt my 235 while in high school in 1968 and again in 1988 when i bumped up the compression ratio and installed an Isky cam just because
"Near enough is not good enough.
Perfect is good enough"
Well thought through guys, a pleasure watching.
I still bore blocks with my old Van Norman 777 , I had it for 40 years !
Love watching you guys work! Good for the brain in these times of foolishness! Does taking 7 mm off the deck affect the compression much in the end? Keep up the great vids!
Seniors rule, you can't beat experience.
Funny our boss used to mix up the main caps in rod caps, to test us to see how fast we can match them up. He taught us how to match up the machine marks.
Thanks for the video and tech explanation. And the cylinder honing explanation really interesting and informative.
You were talking about that old van Norman boring bar. Me and dad used that on alot of engines that we overhauled at the farm. I believe my grandfather bought it. It didn't run on 110 volts either. We had a setup with an 110 electric motor driving the generator that supplied the correct voltage which I don't remember what that was. Why the different voltage I don't know. But it worked great.
In UK we use a 240 to 110 step down transformer. I’ve never done it, but connected the other way around should give a voltage step up.
The only use for a motor-generator that I know is where the mains power single phase and the load is three phase.
I love all the information you guys share, I used to work at a machine shop when I was just out of high school, I was the cleaning guy 😂😂. And Nick, congratulations to you and your family! I send my best wishes to you and the Mrs. I bet the cleaning guy is excited to meet his grand baby!
I sure miss machining. I didn't spend too much time in automotive, about 6 years back in the 70's, and mostly on my own stuff, including a 235 chevy. But I spent another 47 years in high tech molding and associated tooling as well as R&D. The last decade or so was mixed with engineering and CAD/CAM integration, which I fought tooth and nail, to no avail. Disability of some sort comes to us all and all this is just a memory for me now. Thanks for giving me a few moments like I was back there in my good old days.
Excellence personified,,,, keep it up ❤❤ you work on a level I completely understand I came from a machine shop/toolroom where everything HAD to be right. Nobody checked my work,,,, it went out the door and never came back.
Nice job, as expected, and a 1 hour vid, more of this, please!
Ahhmazing video - LOVED the detail working on the crank and caps etc. etc..
Great video! Thank you for posting.
You all do excellent quality work!! Everything in your power to get it exactly right is what you did!! Much Respect for your work ethic and quality work output! Subbed!!
Good stuff...looking forward to seeing more of the build... good content and thanks
I never expected another hour long video so soon after the last one. 👍
I really like to see the time and thought you put into your machining. Great job.
Massive respect for your attention to detail
torque plates are only necessary when your building race engines. most engine shops don't use them unless the customer insists on it. also, that is the cleanest honing lube I have ever seen.
Jims shop gives us pistons heads comfort.. This is our happy place. Many don't understand, but this methodical craftsmanship, is what keeps us going around the world... and a way to pay for those babies... Ha
Another brilliant video ! Enjoyed it all.
Alway a good channel to watch. Thank you guy.
Ive done some of the shimed motors, rods and mains but they were poured babbit brgs,,, i do remember they recommended to get your correct tolerances , the shims were to be added or subtracted from the cam shaft side of the block. Im really enjoying this particular series, nice job guys!
For engines like this 235 where it's hard to get (or not hard to get) oversize pistons the Line2Line coating worth looking into to tighten up the piston to wall clearance.
The cylinder head rebuild was magnificent, wow.
Hi guys
I wish more people from all walks of life would take this kind of care and pride in their work , no matter what they’re doing please just do it right , there is no substitute for experience and knowledge,
Regards Davy 🏴🇹🇭
Another great video, the dynamic between you reminds me of my father and I.
Can't wait to see next video on this engine. Really enjoying it!!!
I've rebuilt a few of these 235/261's and never could understand GM's theory with the stepped main bores.
There was no theory ,their machinery was 50 years old and they were too cheap to replace it or buy new . I am a 39 year GM retiree machinist.
I presume they get larger in diameter towards the rear, yes? The front main is supporting the crankshaft front bearing, the second, on this engine is supporting a bearing that is taking the load of two cylinders, the third takes four and the final crank bearing is taking the power of all six cylinders and holding a flywheel. An old truck or car engine never drives much off the front of the engine like a tractor with a front power take-off, so it kind of makes sense.
I am enjoying watching your videos. I’ve dropped blocks & heads off at a machine shop but never seen the process
first off congratulations on the baby girl can't wait to see all 3 of you machining blocks and tractors. also thanks for all the great videos as a craftsman myself (union carpenter) it's refreshing seeing another craftsman really show there craft and knowledge.
btw i have a quick question, how much can you surface a block (especially older blocks) before you can't or is there ways to fix a block if you have to machine past "the point of no return"