Fix Irrigation Water Hammer Step-By-Step
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- čas přidán 16. 09. 2020
- Installing a water hammer arrestor into an existing backyard schedule 40 PVC irrigation system. Reducing the 60psi shockwave when the valves close to just a nominal pressure change.
Practical Engineering Water Hammer Explanation
• What is Water Hammer?
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Product Links (Affiliate Links)
Hose Bib Pressure Gauge - amzn.to/39buOIM
Sioux Chief 652-A Hammer Arrestor - amzn.to/2MdZb8z
Pipe Insulation - amzn.to/2MmTHbv
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Product Links (Not Affiliate Links)
Drip Depot Dawn KwikRepair Tee 3/4"
www.dripdepot.com/item/dawn-k...
3/4" to 1/2" Threaded PVC Bushing
www.lowes.com/pd/LASCO-3-4-in... - Jak na to + styl
I’ve been in the business 30 years and learned something new so I’m very thankful. One thing I want you to do is get a steel threaded coupling for your arrester. You can screw plastic into metals but cannot screw metals into plastic or it’s going to break. Your skilled enough to know how to install a coupling in there that’s steel. Also Teflon tape is a pain and you just need to use pipe dope and brush it on. You’ll never use Teflon tape again. Now I’m going to try and find one of these water hammer arresters
Thanks for the tip about not screwing male metal threads into plastic. However, I've also read that one shouldn't screw copper into a steel coupling because there will be corrosion. So we're doomed either way? I tried looking for a brass coupling but can't find any longer than an inch and I don't think 1 inch is long enough to screw in both the arrestor and a PVC fitting. I'm trying to figure out how to install the arrestor myself because I oddly enough can't find any local irrigation people who are familiar with it. The whole experience has been extraordinarily frustrating.... there are so few tutorials online and all have "mistakes" without a clear solution.
Impressed with how you took care in refilling the hole with dirt and not rocks. Hardly anybody pays any attention to that. Great video.
Thanks for sharing, Jesse. It's great that you made this video! Two times I had pipes burst due to irrigation system water hammer, so it's good that you were proactive in fixing it. There's surprisingly little information online about installing water hammer arrestors in irrigation systems, even though it's probably a common problem. Even the plumbers I've contacted don't seem familiar with installing the arrestors. I live in CA where there's no rain 6 months per year and everyone has irrigation systems. One year my irrigation line burst and another year the main line, both PVC. This resulted in expensive repairs... it could have been much worse if I wasn't home to shut off the rapidly leaking water. The second time I realized the bursts were not due to high water pressure by itself but by the water hammer from the system. We always had to run our system while we were awake because the hammer noise was too loud to sleep through. I don't think I'm brave enough to try plumbing work myself but your video was inspiring. Some neighbors on Nextdoor suggested installing newer valves which supposedly might be less prone to water hammer. If replacing valves has solved water hammer for anyone, please reply. BTW as a scientist I'm baffled how the arrestor works at all, not even being in line with the flow!
Good video in general just want to point out that you definitely want to test for leaks under pressure, not just gravity. So seal the system (attach the arrestor) then open the valve all the way and look for leaks that way. Also note that if you do have a leaking joint, and then you fix that leak, the next weakest joint in the system may start to show a leak, even if it didn't at first. So chasing leaks can become frustrating until you're practiced at gluing up pipe properly (look for a video on that). Also be sure to wrap your teflon tape in the correct direction (so it can't loosen up when threading parts on). The easy way to do that without having to think about which direction you need to wrap the tape is to simply wrap all your parts before assembling anything. On each part, hold the male threaded end vertically up, and, looking down on it, wrap it clockwise.
Thanks for the video. Did a similar install, but I used a galvanized coupler. Since many of the comments were mentioning that metal INTO plastic was a bad idea. I put the water arrester into the galvanized coupler (metal to metal), and then the galvanized to PVC (metal over plastic). Used some of my blue pipe tape, and seems to be working well. Hammering of the pipes inside the house it gone. Hopefully lasts a long time!
Nice. That riser is making an even larger arrester. The Slip fitting is also helping.
I had similar issues and had already installed an arrestor (Sioux Chief Mini) which didn't help much, if at all. After watching your video, I noticed yours was quite a bit larger so I went out and got Sioux Chief part number 653-B which might even be larger that what you used. Zero water hammer now. Note: I also installed it about 16" from the first inlet on my sprinkler valves. I realize that distance was not an option for you. Just mentioning it for those interested.
Well explained. Couple things to share.
Putting on teflon tape: you wrapped yours backwards, always put it on like installing a nut in a bolt- same direction as threads. Often putting it on backwards can cause the tape to come off because you are actually unthreading the tape with the outer device. Electrical pvc is grey and very uv resistant, you can inner-mix electrical pvc into plumbing. It isn’t uv proof, but will withstand better.
Sizing the water hammer arrestor to the pressure, volume is important. Protecting it from weathering (heat/cold, uv) helps extend its life. There is a rubber bladder that wears and gets aged inside.
Glad you got it sorted, hope it was done during one of our nice days!
It's been over the last 3 or so days... so nice mornings but not super nice afternoons (while I was doing all of the digging!) :D
Jesse
Had the same problem loud water hammer in home and noisy irrigation. Had a number of plumbing co check it out replaced PRV which helped a little. Another plumber came out last week and put a expansion tank and a silent check valve on hot water heater....immediate complete silence in home. No noise, 0 water hammer from any device in home or irrigation. Your video got me thinking in the right direction...
Glad it helped and you got the issue resolved 👍🏻
Great video, I have the same exact issue. Just bought my house last August and when I turned the sprinklers on this year had the same problem. Thank you!
I bought the same water hammer arrestor from your link and installed it. For some reason it worked for a day and now it’s happening again. My suspicion is it has something to do with the vacuum breaker when the water pushes the air out of the way and purges the air. It seems to only happen when it’s first filling with water. But then once the system has been activated the water hammer arrestors seem to help. Wonder if I need a new vacuum breaker or need to add a T on the other side of the breaker?
what a great video, thank you for the help !!
Great video, thanks for making it. I'm having the same problem so I will be trying this soon.
I finally got around to doing the job, this almost eliminated the water hammer 100%, still hear some very faint water movement noise occasionally, but now I have some peace of mind, I no longer feel that my plumbing system is a ticking time bomb. The hammer used to kick like a mule, seriously loud and actually startling if you didn't expect it. Thanks again for posting such an easy to follow video.
Great vid. I hate plumbing but gotta do this today.
Thanks for the video. A suggestion would be to test first the water pressure valve before installing a water hammer arrestor. A defective WPV results in a pressure drop of 30% to 50% inside the house when the sprinkler valve opens. The huge pressure difference causes a water hammer when the sprinkler valve suddenly shuts off. If after replacing the WPV, re-verified that it is not defective, and the water hammer still occurs, only then you can consider installing an arrestor.
Second this. I had a really nasty water hammer from my irrigation. It was so bad it was activating my tankless water heater which lead me to this video. But, I found the pressure regulator was set full open. I adjusted it to 60psi and it almost completely eliminated the hammer. Based on that, I'm surprised that the one in this video did not help according to Jesse, since the two devices wound up so close to each other anyway, and I also am curious if it's not working properly.
I agree bring down work place violence WPV is the answer to bring the pressure down
Very helpful video. Thanks bro. 👍
Folks, when you’re experiencing waterhammer, it means that there is a loose washer in one of the valves within your house. You can locate which valve it is by turning every valve off one by one then running your sprinklers while one of the valves is off. You must turn the valves off one at a time, then run your sprinklers. When the water hammer stops, it is the valve that is turned off. You must either replace the valve or you can sometimes turn the valve a quarter of the way off and that will stop the water hammer.
Again thank you for video, most helpful
You have just answered for the Phantom ghost that haunting my kids wondered ! Thank you for sharing the knowledge.
I guess I'm kinda off topic but do anybody know of a good place to watch new series online ?
@Emilio Lucca flixportal xD
@Aries Justice Thank you, I signed up and it seems to work =) I really appreciate it!!
@Emilio Lucca No problem =)
Amazing video bro
Great video!
Very good
Install a second hammer arrestor to see if it solves the remainder of the hammer. Rent a press tool and put in on the copper line.
Good video dude
Nice install! However, as other commenters said, screwing a male metal thread into a female plastic one isn't a good idea. It's better to use a PVC male adapter and a female metal thread. Adding that insulation as UV protection is a great idea!
Got mines at "Jackass Lowe's" lol
👀 "Jerk Depot" lol
Nice A Cloud Guru tshirt 😊
You're overthinking all this that Christie's red hot glue should be able to turn on the water in 10 minutes you do not need a primer
Good video. Just FYI for folks, the apparatus you called a backflow preventer is actually a vacuum breaker and NOT a backflow preventer.
Thanks for the correction. Pinned your comment.
Actually it is a back flow preventer. Its a PVB pressure vacuum breaker which makes it so the water doesnt go back and contaminate the citys water supply
Right on the box it says backflow preventer. Since you know it all contact the company let them know their wrong 🙄
Teflon tape winds on opposite from what you did! Wind tape opposite direction of the direction of the piece you are winding on. Your direction of wrap tends to unwrap and bunch up as you wind on.
Wrap in the opposite direction your turning, that way it doesn’t wanna bunch up and not serve it’s purpose. You basically turned your wrap up and out.
Do you think that adding multiple Arrestors in the same line would completely eliminate the water hammer?
Thanks for the video! Just a few quick questions for you. Is there a reason you had to add the vertical pvc? Does the arrestor need to be vertical? Thanks!!!
The arrestor does not need to be vertical. I added the vertical standoff primarily to be able to see leaks if any formed. Also, there are different sizes of arrestors and if I needed to add a larger one, it'd be easy to access without having to dig again.
Tried 2 arrestors on backflow today (water in, out) and still banging. Wonder if valves could be bad? Toro. I could replace the ck valves in preventer with extras i have. Irrigation company coming out agsin to try to solve. Water pressure and gpm has not changed in 10 years. Ty
Thanks for the walk through. It looks odd to me though that the backflow preventer you have does not prevent the hammer. I mean, shouldn't water just splash out of it instead of going back to the house and cause the hammering?
You can also fix your irrigation water hammer by adding a sprinkler head close to the vibration source i.e. early bleed off i.e. if you can tolerate having water close to the source.
Great video. Didn't seem too loud, did you capture all the noise it in the video?
Hey Jesse..so do I place this set up between the valves and the line heading towards my sprinklers, or between the water source to the sprinkler valves from the house?
The second option. In between the first valve and the house line.
Thank you
wish you did installs on the side , I am in chandler, if ya want to make a few bucks...lol
I forgot to TURNOFF the Gardening hose outside of the house, and then when I TURN ON the water in the Shower. IT MAKES REALLY LOUD NOISES. what seems to be the problem? Thanks
Great video I have water hammer on my automatic pool fill when it comes on it causes it the shake do you think this will work to stop the water hammer
Yeah it should work for any quick-close valve. Same steps apply, just install it as close to the valve as you can get.
1 inch pipe would help a lot.
Great job. Any reason for the sizing of the water arrestor at 1/2? I have the exact one, but my pipes start at 1 inch and then there is a reducer to 3/4 when it starts going to the valves
I bought the arrestor first and built the rest of the system around it. That was the only size I could find at the time. I suspect the larger 3/4 unit would do equally well.
@@jessemsparks I was just thinking to getting a 1" to 1/2" reducer since I already have it but wonder if 3/4 arrestor would be more effective or just the same.
Having a problem threading the Sioux Chief Arrester metal male threads with PVC without leaking. Going to look for a metal to PVC union tomorrow.
You got a threaded bushing? And used some Teflon tape?
Good call Joseph. Metal in pvc will eventually leak in our heat. The adapter you seek is tricky to find and is only available in one size, but it is at blue and orange stores. Maybe more sizes are online tho.
Just FYI Sioux Chief makes a ton of variations on this product, including one with a built-in PVC connector. Model number 652-AC. This should take away any threading/metal-to-PVC connection issues people might run into.
All that work to get a foot closer?
I’m in Oregon, not sure where you’re at, but I’ve got pretty bad water hammer from not only our yard sprinklers, but toilets, sinks, washing machine etc. My plumber said not to install the arrestor outdoors due to it freezing in cold temps? Commented before end of video, lol, you’re in Phoenix, has the arrestor been pretty helpful otherwise?
Yeah it’s been great. They sell smaller stressors to use inside that connect to the washer lines and toilet lines. Might be worth installing a few of them.
Or a full size expansion tank at your water heater may absorb the pressure. Maybe.
Good video...My landscaper (Surprise, AZ0 told me the hammer was cause by a failure in the Irritrol Timer, so he replaced it ($180.00) and that stopped the hammer, and improved the flows (shrubs were looking a little dried out). Is it possible that the timer was the root cause of your hammer problem? You mentioned that you could still hear a faint hammer after your repair. Hope it's holding up...much less expensive solution than mine.
@dawillis124, I hope you see this post, and I hope you can respond. I have not replaced my Irritrol Timer, but I am about to do it. I am wondering if you experienced the hammering problem since you've changed your timer? Thank you in advance for your response.
Tighten down the packing nut on that hosebib. It will stop the leak. The nut that’s right under the handle
You really don't want to screw a metal MPT fitting into PVC as it's likely to crack. Instead, use a brass coupler with a MPT PVC adapter.
I would have considered putting the new pipe horizontal then install the hammer arrestor in a new valve box (eg, below ground level).
The instructions on the arrestor say it can be installed in any orientation. As far as a box goes, I considered it but I wanted a stand-off with enough height that I could cut it a few times (if it didn’t work) and test something else like a 3/4” thread arrestor or something. The tight tolerances in an irrigation box make modifications more challenging so I intentionally chose not to put one in.
How's this holding up? Since originally filmed
Hey Gary it’s still working fine, doing its job. Haven’t touched it once since the install.
Great video! I’ve been dealing with “hammering sound” for years. I’ve had plumbers, professional irrigation companies and everything you can imagine trying to get this straightened out and still dealing with it. The strange thing is that the hammering sound doesn’t come on when he irrigation system comes on it only happens between 5:30am-7:00am time frame and nothing comes on during that time there’s nothing running inside or out so that’s a big mystery. One final thing: Do you happen to live in the Silvercreek Development in Peoria? Your house looks very familiar, so I’m wondering if it something in this hood.
I am watching these videos because one of my client has exact same thing only in the mornings I'm trying to solve that problem without her spending a lot of money
That "showcase" tee would fail over time. The vibration from irrigation turning on and off would probably cause it to fail, maybe even catastrophically, while no one was home.
Did you have to install it by digging up the main line? - you could have installed it on the line going into the ground using a 3 way elbow
Could have, but didn't want to solder copper. Gluing PVC is easier. Also, I put it as close to the irrigation valves as I could.
I desperately want to fix the same problem I am having with our home drip.
FYI….thread tape is installed clockwise
Does the arrestor need to be at a certain height?
Nope. It can go in any direction, just put it as close as you can to wherever the valve is that's creating the hammer.
do you know if the arrester absolutely needs to be installed *after* backflow preventer? because i do get hammering when valves open. but it sounds like all the hammering is actually happening in my basement, not outside.
I incorrectly called the vacuum breaker a backflow preventer. But to answer your question, it should be as close to whatever valve is closing that causes the hammer. So if you have a low-flow toilet that shuts quickly and causes the hammer, the arrestor would go at the toilet water connection at the wall. Same for dishwasher or washing machine or whatever valve is the culprit. There are some purpose-built for appliances that aren't quite as large as the arrestor I linked in the description.
@@jessemsparks right. i got all of that. and i'm actually trying to figure out if the arrester can help w/my sprinkler system water hammering. whenever the controller opens a valve there's a lot of noise (coming from basement, though, all the way to the second floor of the house) which is not nice at 4:45 am. if the hammering was happening outside of the house I wouldn't even notice (the valves are pretty far from the bedroom). but the hammering noise is coming from the basement. that's why i'm asking if I have to install the arrester outside (and make sure it doesn't freeze in winter or something) after the vac breaker or is it still okay to put it on in the basement?
@@nskmda In that case, putting the arrestor in your basement will let the shockwave travel from the sprinkler into your basement and back. It would be much better to put it as close to your irrigation valve box as possible (so, outside).
@@jessemsparks i see. okay. thanks for the response.
@@jessemsparks I would suggest both inside close to exit and another closer to valve. . Distance doesn't make as much difference as bends and other restrictors . There was a patent issued for air retaining pocket built into irrigation solenoid.to reduce hammer.
More primer needed
Need new content!
Does the arestor need to be installed before the irrigation switches? Why do you have to install it so tall?
Yes, as close to the valves as you can (on the input side). No, you don’t have to install a standoff like I did. I did it this way to make it easier to change since Arizona has such hard water and the internal piston in the hammer arrestor can seize over time.
@@jessemsparks awesome. So if I had room, I could install this in my "box".
@@matthewlaborde1080 for sure
Use plain old exterior house paint to protect PVC from the sun. That black insulation won't last a couple years and looks ratty.
After 9 months is it still working good at preventing the water hammer?
Yes sir. Still going strong.
I think you jinxed me! The hammer came back this week. Unscrewed the arrestor and replaced with a new one and it’s back to working like it did. 60 second repair. I may test out replacing it with a 3/4” thread arrestor instead of the 1/2” in the winter when it’s not so hot out.
@@jessemsparks from my understanding, the arrestor is a temporary fix that doesn't solve the underlying problem.
@@kevinbreese5739 the underlying problem is the quick-close irrigation valves. There are some expensive ones that close with a slower mechanism, but changing the arrestor even yearly is way less effort than replacing everything in the irrigation box.
@@jessemsparks Curious why the 3/4" would be better? Does the bigger connection and/or added length allow for better shock absorption? I'm trying to figure out which one to use for my sprinklers and if the 3/4" does a better job overall, I would rather spend the extra few dollars and just use that one from the start.
What I am doing here . How I got here ?
Jesse, can the arrestor be buried?
The package says it can be placed inside an interior wall, so I suspect it can also be buried. However, After about a year I had to replace mine because the hard water in Phoenix effectively calcified the arrestor in place and it no longer absorbed the hammer. I would suggest putting it in a small irrigation box instead of completely burying for that reason.
@@jessemsparks thanks for the quick reply, that sucks for your arrestor 😑. Yeah i will more than lilely attempt to install it in the crawl space underneath my house. But dont want to deal with old galvanized pipes, more than likely ill do it just like you. I live in LA so hopefully i can get a longer ife out of it.
7:44 wrong teflon direction...
What kind of pvc t is that????!!!!!
I need it
metal threads into pvc lol....wrong....
Jerk depot.
Music bad
Everybody love to use the word Massive ,when it is not massive .I guess it's the trendy word to use .So I doubt your issue is Massive .
Put it in the box
I absolutely would have done that if there was enough room, but the box is completely full with irrigation valves.
@@jessemsparks if that 90 on the last valve threads on you probably could have dug down with a little garden shovel cut it out spun it off and added a tee with the arrestor coming off the side