Pro Tools allows setting multiple outputs on a bus. I'm sending my master to a separate monitor bus, in which SW is inserted. That way master isn't "corrupted" by correction. But I'm still contemplating on buying ARC Studio for correcting the room, when I'm mixing a stream with a sound console.
If possible, you might run single-frequency tests first, with sine waves. Then check the time difference between peaks. Try several frequencies. Take the average, then apply as a first correction factor.
The DUT may be causing its own slight phase difference. Was this corrected for in your test signaling? If not, then I would expect the slight offset error to be visible in the meter when the two signals are combined.
It was actually just a slight level difference, but I only realized it after the review video. I went back into my phase test and adjusted the level between the signals by 0.5 dB (half a dB) and they cancelled out completely. So for all practical purposes, the ARC box is transparent and not doing anything significant.
Hi there! I using app "SoundSource" in system audio. This allows you to run the Sonarworks plugin with 0 latency for system audio. The monitoring aux will not be affected by sonarworks in this case. Pro Tools will also work without a plugin in the master, but everything will sound corrected, since we have a plugin in the system audio. Hope this helps in some way. At the very least, this greatly simplifies the manipulation of switching on/off the plugin and bounce.
I'm glad that's working for you. I tried it for a week and had multiple crashes and bugs. I just didn't find it stable enough to trust during sessions (unfortunately, because it was great when it was working!).
great video! Out of curiosity, which correction type did you settle on? It looks like you chose sharp judging by how much its correcting? I found there to be quite a difference between default correction and sharp correction , but I was felt sharp to be quite extreme in terms of correction.
Ya, I chose "sharp" but you're absolutely right, it's very extreme. When I started on Sonarworks with my Footprint 01 speakers, it was a massive difference. I worked my way into it and had Sonarworks running at about 70% (since they let you blend in the room correction amount). When I upgraded to MM45's, I ran Sonarworks and set it at 100%. They were new speakers to me, might as well "learn" them with full on room correction. I'm still running the MM45's at this point. When I tried the Arc, my goal was to fiddle around and get it as close as I could to the Sonarworks sound so it's wans't going to be a huge adjustment. I basically tried a bunch of different settings until they matched what I was hearing with Sonarworks. The settings I chose ended up being what sounded the most "familiar" to me, so take my choices and settings with a grain of salt, as I was simply trying to match what I had before. "You do you" as far as what sounds right!
Great video. Thank you. I have a few questions: 1) Does the ARC software introduce any latency in your DAW video playback sync? 2) Does the ARC box need to be connected via USB-C to work? Or can you just set it up once and then it runs as a self-contained system? Asking because my main rig doesn’t meet the minimum system requirements. Hoping I can do the initial setup on an updated laptop.
I would talk to IK just to confirm some of this. I have not had any significant latency issues, as I've kept my settings in the "natural" phase setting (that sounded the best to me). There is a "Linear" phase mode that introduces more latency, at that point you might start to notice something. As far as connection, you need to connect it to run the room correction the first time and create a preset. After that's done, you can just hit "store" and it will send your settings to the box. You don't need to do anything after that, it can run independently.
I can't really understand why we don't get a perfect null with the ARC bypassed given that the ARC box has a hard bypass using relays between the inputs and outputs. So there cannot be any latency as you have been able to verify but then, why the null is not perfect ?... It's strange... Cables maybe ?... I don't know... But I want to believe you that the difference is minimal enough to be able, as you say, to trust our ears. Thank you for this video.
Cables is another good thought, but I kept the same cable chain in each test (cables that were unplugged from the ARC were plugged into each other). I’m not really sure either, but it does seem to be an incredibly tiny difference. Some people are just not going to trust it if it doesn’t test out completely transparent, which will mean a significantly larger investment in the signal chain for more than likely inaudible results (up but peace of mind). I can’t hear the difference, so I’m very happy!
Thanks. I’d been looking forward to your review as I knew you were also concerned with the DA involved. I don’t believe you’ve mentioned what converters you’re currently using. I’ve been using Avid HD IO for monitoring through my console.
@@ILoveTeles You don't need to, it's pretty much colorless. After this video, I went back to the phase test I did and adjusted the filed 0.5 dB (half a dB) and was able to get them to cancel out completely....
I have a hybrid setup too. I was using Sonarworks SoundID on a separate computer with a Lynx Hilo connected via Thunderbolt. The systems worked independently from my DAW (on another Mac-Studio), so no plugins were used in my DAW or system-wide. The latency is virtually nonexistent. Essentially, I am achieving the same functionality as with this small box. I initially desired the Trinnov system, but it was too expensive once I factored in the cost of having a separate "recorder"(Hilo) for the printing process (I am using a summing device). Therefore, by implementing a second computer (mac mini m1), I have saved a significant amount of money. Now, with this ARC device, I can switch to it and discontinue using the second Mac Mini that I currently use for SoundID. The question is: Will be better, or should I wait to get the Trinnov Nova?
I havn't had any issues transitioning out of SonarWorks. I played around with a bunch of settings in ARC for the first day or two and got it to a point where it sounded really close to what SonarWorks was doing. I'm really happy with the results, and even happier not having to jump through as many stupid hoops during tracking sessions, totally worth it!
Im currently demoing trinnov and also have the ARC and sonarworks. To me both the ARC and Trinnov wipe the floor with SW but obvs just my oppnion. Between Trinnov and ARC it's actually disturbingly close. The main difference in my room being a bit of 3d and better stereo field. Id going to put it at 10-15% better... worth the price tage??
Yes as mentioned in the other comment did you account for that latency? Or try a null test of the box in audio path but the correction turned off ? I think that might be the issue. Thanks for the video, I also work with hybrid analog digital daw setup and need this box over sonar works
I thought about that, but there should only be latency when the EQ is activated (the latency varies depending on what phase setting you have). I ran the box in bypass for the test, it shouldn’t have been an issue.
I just double checked one more time and it's not a delay issue. I wish I could post a picture in here. If you look on the GearSpace forum, I posted recently and attached a picture from my DAW confirming the waveforms line up. It would have been pretty frustrating if there was STILL latency in the hardware even when it was bypassed.
That probably doesn't allow for the latency of the ARC unit. (ie I believe around a ms in the nonlinear mode). It would be amazing if you could determine that delay and offset the recorded file by that exact amount to see if it then in fact nulls. Thanks for doing this video by the way! 🙂
Good thought. I’ll double check, but I don’t believe here’s any latency when the EQ is bypassed. I ran the unit bypassed in the test, so there shouldn’t have been any latency.
I just double checked one more time and it's not a delay issue. I wish I could post a picture in here. If you look on the GearSpace forum, I posted recently and attached a picture from my DAW confirming the waveforms line up. It would have been pretty frustrating if there was STILL latency in the hardware even when it was bypassed.
I spent a week trying to register and activate ARC Studio 4... what a navigational nightmare!!! I gave up in frustration and returned the unit... the salesman was not the least bit surprised to see it come back. It appears IK Multimedia has a negative reputation when it comes to their online registration and activation procedures. IK Multimedia gets 2 thumbs DOWN from me.... epic fail.
Good empathic Test. Thank You!
Thanks a lot, very informative. :)
This is a great video, thanks for making it. Subscribed, cheers!
Pro Tools allows setting multiple outputs on a bus. I'm sending my master to a separate monitor bus, in which SW is inserted. That way master isn't "corrupted" by correction. But I'm still contemplating on buying ARC Studio for correcting the room, when I'm mixing a stream with a sound console.
Good review! Love your caveat.
Awesome video quality!
If possible, you might run single-frequency tests first, with sine waves. Then check the time difference between peaks. Try several frequencies. Take the average, then apply as a first correction factor.
The DUT may be causing its own slight phase difference. Was this corrected for in your test signaling? If not, then I would expect the slight offset error to be visible in the meter when the two signals are combined.
It was actually just a slight level difference, but I only realized it after the review video. I went back into my phase test and adjusted the level between the signals by 0.5 dB (half a dB) and they cancelled out completely. So for all practical purposes, the ARC box is transparent and not doing anything significant.
Hi there! I using app "SoundSource" in system audio. This allows you to run the Sonarworks plugin with 0 latency for system audio. The monitoring aux will not be affected by sonarworks in this case.
Pro Tools will also work without a plugin in the master, but everything will sound corrected, since we have a plugin in the system audio. Hope this helps in some way. At the very least, this greatly simplifies the manipulation of switching on/off the plugin and bounce.
I'm glad that's working for you. I tried it for a week and had multiple crashes and bugs. I just didn't find it stable enough to trust during sessions (unfortunately, because it was great when it was working!).
SoundSource sucks. Quiet, boy.
great video! Out of curiosity, which correction type did you settle on? It looks like you chose sharp judging by how much its correcting? I found there to be quite a difference between default correction and sharp correction , but I was felt sharp to be quite extreme in terms of correction.
Ya, I chose "sharp" but you're absolutely right, it's very extreme. When I started on Sonarworks with my Footprint 01 speakers, it was a massive difference. I worked my way into it and had Sonarworks running at about 70% (since they let you blend in the room correction amount). When I upgraded to MM45's, I ran Sonarworks and set it at 100%. They were new speakers to me, might as well "learn" them with full on room correction.
I'm still running the MM45's at this point. When I tried the Arc, my goal was to fiddle around and get it as close as I could to the Sonarworks sound so it's wans't going to be a huge adjustment. I basically tried a bunch of different settings until they matched what I was hearing with Sonarworks. The settings I chose ended up being what sounded the most "familiar" to me, so take my choices and settings with a grain of salt, as I was simply trying to match what I had before. "You do you" as far as what sounds right!
Great video. Thank you. I have a few questions:
1) Does the ARC software introduce any latency in your DAW video playback sync?
2) Does the ARC box need to be connected via USB-C to work? Or can you just set it up once and then it runs as a self-contained system? Asking because my main rig doesn’t meet the minimum system requirements. Hoping I can do the initial setup on an updated laptop.
I would talk to IK just to confirm some of this. I have not had any significant latency issues, as I've kept my settings in the "natural" phase setting (that sounded the best to me). There is a "Linear" phase mode that introduces more latency, at that point you might start to notice something. As far as connection, you need to connect it to run the room correction the first time and create a preset. After that's done, you can just hit "store" and it will send your settings to the box. You don't need to do anything after that, it can run independently.
I can't really understand why we don't get a perfect null with the ARC bypassed given that the ARC box has a hard bypass using relays between the inputs and outputs.
So there cannot be any latency as you have been able to verify but then, why the null is not perfect ?...
It's strange... Cables maybe ?... I don't know...
But I want to believe you that the difference is minimal enough to be able, as you say, to trust our ears.
Thank you for this video.
Cables is another good thought, but I kept the same cable chain in each test (cables that were unplugged from the ARC were plugged into each other). I’m not really sure either, but it does seem to be an incredibly tiny difference. Some people are just not going to trust it if it doesn’t test out completely transparent, which will mean a significantly larger investment in the signal chain for more than likely inaudible results (up but peace of mind). I can’t hear the difference, so I’m very happy!
@@MillSounds I'm tempted to try it ;-)
Thanks. I’d been looking forward to your review as I knew you were also concerned with the DA involved. I don’t believe you’ve mentioned what converters you’re currently using. I’ve been using Avid HD IO for monitoring through my console.
I'm using the new UA Apollo X interfaces.
Is it easy to bypass the ADDA of the Arc?
@@ILoveTeles You don't need to, it's pretty much colorless. After this video, I went back to the phase test I did and adjusted the filed 0.5 dB (half a dB) and was able to get them to cancel out completely....
I wonder why wanting to get rid of the console. I've been reading into the API Box2 and have been wondering if this is the right direction for me.
Shoot me an email if you want to discuss more (contact info is on the MillSounds Studio website).
I have a hybrid setup too. I was using Sonarworks SoundID on a separate computer with a Lynx Hilo connected via Thunderbolt. The systems worked independently from my DAW (on another Mac-Studio), so no plugins were used in my DAW or system-wide. The latency is virtually nonexistent. Essentially, I am achieving the same functionality as with this small box. I initially desired the Trinnov system, but it was too expensive once I factored in the cost of having a separate "recorder"(Hilo) for the printing process (I am using a summing device). Therefore, by implementing a second computer (mac mini m1), I have saved a significant amount of money. Now, with this ARC device, I can switch to it and discontinue using the second Mac Mini that I currently use for SoundID. The question is: Will be better, or should I wait to get the Trinnov Nova?
I havn't had any issues transitioning out of SonarWorks. I played around with a bunch of settings in ARC for the first day or two and got it to a point where it sounded really close to what SonarWorks was doing. I'm really happy with the results, and even happier not having to jump through as many stupid hoops during tracking sessions, totally worth it!
@@MillSounds I put both side by side and the sound is different. I installed the ARC a week ago but I can’t say which is better.
Im currently demoing trinnov and also have the ARC and sonarworks. To me both the ARC and Trinnov wipe the floor with SW but obvs just my oppnion. Between Trinnov and ARC it's actually disturbingly close. The main difference in my room being a bit of 3d and better stereo field. Id going to put it at 10-15% better... worth the price tage??
Is it Virginia?
Yes as mentioned in the other comment did you account for that latency? Or try a null test of the box in audio path but the correction turned off ? I think that might be the issue.
Thanks for the video, I also work with hybrid analog digital daw setup and need this box over sonar works
I thought about that, but there should only be latency when the EQ is activated (the latency varies depending on what phase setting you have). I ran the box in bypass for the test, it shouldn’t have been an issue.
I just double checked one more time and it's not a delay issue. I wish I could post a picture in here. If you look on the GearSpace forum, I posted recently and attached a picture from my DAW confirming the waveforms line up. It would have been pretty frustrating if there was STILL latency in the hardware even when it was bypassed.
That probably doesn't allow for the latency of the ARC unit. (ie I believe around a ms in the nonlinear mode). It would be amazing if you could determine that delay and offset the recorded file by that exact amount to see if it then in fact nulls. Thanks for doing this video by the way! 🙂
Good thought. I’ll double check, but I don’t believe here’s any latency when the EQ is bypassed. I ran the unit bypassed in the test, so there shouldn’t have been any latency.
I just double checked one more time and it's not a delay issue. I wish I could post a picture in here. If you look on the GearSpace forum, I posted recently and attached a picture from my DAW confirming the waveforms line up. It would have been pretty frustrating if there was STILL latency in the hardware even when it was bypassed.
@@MillSounds so therefore, in that instance there is no AD/DA being used at all, as the bypass is completely analog.
I spent a week trying to register and activate ARC Studio 4... what a navigational nightmare!!! I gave up in frustration and returned the unit... the salesman was not the least bit surprised to see it come back. It appears IK Multimedia has a negative reputation when it comes to their online registration and activation procedures.
IK Multimedia gets 2 thumbs DOWN from me.... epic fail.
What was it doing when you tried? I think it took me all of like 5 minutes to finish, has something changed in the last month or so?