Wire Connectors Overloaded
Vložit
- čas přidán 29. 08. 2024
- A selection of wire connectors are overloaded - which will fail first?
Connectors and wire sent in by TheChipmunk2008
1.5mm² PVC insulated solid core wire, connectors are a screw terminal 'chocbloc' style, a Wago 773 series, a red insulated butt crimp, and an Ideal Wing-Nut twist connector.
► Support this channel:
Patreon: / jwflame
PayPal Donations: xo4.uk/?PPP
► Social Media:
Twitter: / jwflame
Facebook: / jwflame
Instagram: / jwflame
► Contact info, sending stuff in: etc.:
xo4.uk/?YTT
► Website - More on this video and many other subjects
Website: www.flameport.com
Page for this video: xo4.uk/?wC0
"Looks like we've got a bit of flame going on over there..." You've got a knack for narrating drama. :) Thanks for conducting this test. It was impressive to see all the connectors "survive" your torture test.
The key to the wirenut is to make sure the wires are twisted together under the cap. The manufacturers don't require it, but many electricians in the US and Canada twist the wires together with pliers then apply the wirenut. If you just rely on the spring inside to complete the circuit, you're asking for trouble. In other words, use the wirenut to insulate the splice only. Don't rely on it to male the connection for you.
I have been trying to convince myself to do pretwisted, but does not Pretwisted stress the copper, which can also cause a wire to come loose.
Really don't see wire nut connection coming loose just by pull, the only way I can see coming loose is the spring overheating
@@La2venida
I've seen some rather crazy looking pretwisting, and yes it does seem to cause more stress on the copper. Theoretically if everything is within specifications (such as maximum current) this kind of exercise is really just for dramatic effect.
I will say that of these four different connector types, the plastic wire nut is the only one that relies on the plastic portion to maintain the mechanical connection between wires. All the others are really just the plastic portion preventing electrical contact with everything outside the connector. But if the plastic portion of a wire nut is gone, the steel spiral isn't necessarily going to hold the wires in place. However, it shouldn't get to the point where it's going to melt.
Although I am using them on a daily base, I was always a little sceptic about the Wago connectors in general. Nice to see those new small types drawing 4-5 times their rated current without failing. Thanks for the video.
The wire nuts have been used in America for decades. If the best brands are used (I prefer Ideal brand) and installed properly they will last a lifetime with no failures. Thanks for the video.
Great job! Real conditions, real live testing. All connectors are amazingly capable.
Cool, so by the time any connector has failed your house would have burnt down already 😃
It seems so.
I would hope one would have appropriate over-current protection in the circuit so that this scenario would never happen. ;)
A problem with this test though I think is that all those connections seem to be freshly-made, and so haven't suffered the effects of years of hot-cold cycling, and degradation due to moisture/etc. I've seen plenty of choc-block connections fail badly in my time, to the point of setting on fire, purely down to contact resistance increasing as a consequence of the above. And thus melting/smoke/fire before any protection device kicks in. :/
+9ff70f96 hmmm. Good point about age of the connections. If I've only got 1 in 1 out of a choc block I'll stick them in the same side and use both screws on both wires, to try and keep the most surface area and reduce the chances of a high resistance join.
Yep, that's good practice, in my opinion. Nice to know others out there put the effort in too. :)
Thanks, now I don't have to watch the video. idiot
This was interesting, thank you. I personally prefer the lever type Wago connectors for two reasons, they are intended to be reused, and they can clamp down securely on really tiny wires, in other words they are really versatile.
Some of them also work on stranded wire and not just solid core. This can be pretty useful when connecting lamps and other appliances
Yup those are the best
For building wiring I prefer the non-lever type because they're quicker and cheaper. Most domestic fixed wiring here is 1.5 and 2.5 solid, so the non-lever connectors (2273 series) are perfectly suitable. I do use the lever types for connecting lights and other items wired with flex. Never had one fail so far.
Out of the many I've installed myself I've only had one choc block fail though, so they aren't that bad either. It's mostly down to properly tightening the screws I think. Wagos are massively faster and nicer to use though, so choc blocks are mostly a thing of the distant past for me. I feel sort of nostalgic for them but sticking in five wires and keeping them from slipping back out while tightening the screw is definitely rather annoying.
Wire nuts are best because the wire is wrapped around itself a couple times and the nut is merely holding the wires in place. All other connectors use a single contact point on each wire and the current must pass through the connector. The single contact point is hundreds times less area than the wire wrapped in the wire nut.
Contact area is overrated. Look at a push-in connector and how it contacts the bus bar, and there can be a fairly small contact area yet it meets all relevant safety standards. The most important thing is going to be that the connector is not going to overheat when used within its specified current rating.
I've used wire nuts without pretwisting and according to a manufacturer's directions where undoing the connection and the wire tips are loosely against each other and don't really hold together.
I'm only a diy'er when it comes to electrics but enjoyed your video. Nice to know that whatever connection used they all held up 👍🏼
Why is that a good thing that the connections 'held up'? This demonstration doesn't make a lot of sense.
Surprised to see that the connectors lasted for so long and at such a high amperage. They seem far more reliable than most people give them credit for. Great experiment and a real eye opener !!
Very interesting demonstration John.
You could draw a following conclusion: Overloaded cable itself is a much weaker point in a circuit than any of the used connectors on such cable. Never overload cables in the first place.
From practical observations and working with properly designed, non-overloaded cabling, I can say it's almost always cable connectors that go wrong first before the cable does.
This test doesn't find the weakest connector as the heat of the wire being conducted to the connectors is the reason for these connectors to melt. A better test would be to use the biggest diameter wire that could fit in all the connectors so there would be less effect from the heating wire so we could really see the effect of the current on the connectors only.
That wouldn't be a realistic scenario.
and 90A on a 1,5mm² is?
can't get a much bigger wire than that though from what I see
That's what I'm saying. Many of these test introduce the wire to current that code would not allow for. However there are larger wago connectors with up to 8 ports. Presumably the added metal would allow for more current but I still do not trust them.
the wago bridge heated higher than the wire, you can see it heat the wire near the connector. as long as it's thick enough for the rated circuit it may be ok, but I can see where they can become hotspots.
That last one that was shown, 3m WingTip is very Common and used in the USA by All Electricians ! They are the best to use because once they are twisted on all the way , no wire is loose . Yellows are for 2-3 # 12AWG , Reds are for 3-4 # 12 AWG
Best case scenario no wire is loose, which is why many regions don't use them.
Don't forget to disconnect the circuit when you play with it at 9:30.
Good video nad very instructive.
9:30
Normal reaction: Oh shit!
JW: Just inadvertently reconnected it, there
Interesting, and one would hope that the breaker would go way before any of this could ever occur. I particularly like the poking around on the failed wire with the metal screwdriver! ;)
I've started using wago. I like them especially for others to use as they can not over tighten the terminal and damage the wire. I've seen a good number of melted choc-bloks from damaged conductor.
my bad experience is rusted choc-blok screws
Same is true of the screw terminals on sockets and light switches. It's usually what causes the wire to break when fitting a new one.
nice video I enjoyed the experiment. My guess is that the wago connector actually did cause the failure, that connection being the most resistance, higher ohms, caused it to heat up more than the other connectors. Although the wago connection itself didn't fail it got hot enough to cause the failure in the wire immediately adjacent. Maybe?
In Australia, the most common connector is called a "BP" (I have no idea why). It's kind of like the screw nut, but you twist using pliers then shove the result into a one-sided barrel and tighten down a brass screw. They are quite reliable due to the combination of twisting and pressure.
It stands for BluePoint, a company long since bust
@@Bobo-ox7fj - Oh yeah, that's right, I remember now. I worked for Clipsal when they purchased BluePoint. I inspected the factory at Padstow NSW where thick brass/bronze wire was unrolled, stamped and turned into the screws and connector barrels. The machines were many decades old and still ran 24/7... It was incredibly old fashioned and felt like it would have been steam powered when it first started 😃
Hi Very interesting. I worked in France for 10 years and I must have fitted thousands of the Wago type connectors. It's nice to know they "work" as advertised! Thanks.
Just a couple of points John. The Wago connectors are pronounced as Vargo ( German word) Plus I was always taught that crimp connectors are only to be used on multi stand cables, The crimp could be pulled off a solid drawn cable as it didn't bite into the cable.
Every region has their own ideas, and everyone thinks theirs are the best.
I agree with you points Mike. I too was always taught to use crimps only on stranded (I did my apprenticeship in 1977). Having said that a properly crimped connection on solid drawn conductor is going to be fine. A correctly sized and installed screw connection is bomb proof and maintenance free in my book. There are hundreds of screw connections I made 20, or 30 years ago that are still
working safely.
@@canopus101 just consider how many items use screw fittings,sockets,lampholders,lightswitches,plugtops and so on....few will ever get looked at after the day of fitting
Multi strand (Engish word)
An important factor for a connector design is how easy is it to do wrong. You did a good so they all worked here. Many people do not put wire nuts on correctly for the type of wire they are using. You correctly pre twisted this solid wire with pliers, which should not be done on small thermostat wire or stranded wire.
On the crimp connector people often use cheap crimper tools or don't get the wire in all the way.
With the push in connector they move it around so much and damage the connector. They strip off too much insulation so wire is exposed, then have to try to pull it out which damages the connector.
For the screw type they don't get tight enough or they don't strip the insulation enough so some insulation is under the screw. In the USA wire nuts are used a lot on smaller wire #10 and smaller but all the connectors are used. Big or serious stuff usually uses the block type connector, so I assume engineers feel those are the best. I like the screw block best because you can test voltage easily on the exposed screw.
Good video, but thermal camera would have been amazing for this.
That would have made a fasinating addition to the vid.
+Philip Burkett Yes I agree, seeing a hot spot form would be very informative. I use Wagos mostly now as I found crimps unreliable on solid core wire especially cheaper ones even using a good crimping ratchet tool.
Whereas Wagos are not intended for stranded wire.
According to Wago they are good for both solid core and stranded wire.
Programentalist Have you ever tried pushing very fine stranded wire into a Wago terminal?
Nice video.
I think a more comprehensive test would be to heat and cool the wire repeatedly several times (perhaps dozens) to get some expand/contract wear, and THEN see how the connectors handle a high load.
You chickened out at 90A. Photonicinduction would have *started* at 90A. More likely he'd have started at 900A.
bdf2718 I popped it
My Power meter is smoking. Well it can take a bit more. Oh, i broke it.
Where that bloke's at, by the way?
Send you wire to photonic !
Where's my 'ammer?
Over the years I have discovered quite a few burnt wires that did not cause house fires. Arcing, flame and combustible materials will. I have not used the WAGO, but was considering them. They are easier and quicker to use, but your demonstration revealed that they are combustible and could cause a flame in certain conditions. Great test!
I was quite an early adopter of the wago connectors both push in and lever type and have never seen one fail, choc bloc's on the other hand goodness knows how many failed and loose one I've seen even from "new" installations, glad to see that none of them if connected properly are going to fail. I'd much rather believe a real world test like this than any manufacturer claim, thanks JW, now somebody lend JW a climatic chamber and a thermal camera and we'll see the complete picture as they age.
In one instance I've come across a junction box full of Wagos (2273, the exact type shown in the video) where several wires just fell out when I touched the connectors. The whole box was full of signs of super-sloppy work though, stripped wire length all over the place, lots of exposed live copper and generally a rats nest - imagine a 200x200 mm box with all wires for a large room with five groups of lighting (two of them on two-way switches) and a bunch of sockets crammed in! (In Austria it's acceptable and rather common to mix lights and sockets and the whole box was just one circuit).
My task was to find out why and how all the sockets in the room had ended up being switched with the wall lights and change them to permanently live. Took me a while to figure out the layout and find all the splices behind the sockets but eventually managed.
In the Netherlands chocblocks are forbidden in mainwirering the crimp butt connector also. Before the adoption of wago push in early 1980 we used wirenuts. Wirenuts are better if done correctly but hard to do so with 5 wires.
Wago connectors are fine if you keep the current ratings in mind. Do not reuse them to many times If you think the spring lost his tention do discard them.
MultiArrie Same in Germany, only I never run Info wire nuts, even in older Installations. Chocblocks are forbidden in junction boxes, but still okay for light fixtures, also mostly today the clamping wago Type ist preferred. Instead of wire nuts in older stuff CZcams will find Lots of WhatsApp Looks Like half chocblocks with one Screenshot and all wires inserted from one Side.
The only time I've seen fail choc blocks fail is when an idiot doesn't strip the wire ends & relies on the screws to puncture the insulation. This make the choc block act as bridge & if its not rated properly, will overheat melting the plastic, allowing the metal barrel to come into contact with stuff it should not. I would normally strip the wire twice the length of the barrel. Double them over & make sure that the wires are clamped by both screws.
The question is, how long do spring clamp type terminals last in an environment where it is humid?
And this is why I still use connector block even though it would never be subjected to such high load. Done property can build a far stronger join than a wago which relies on tension pressure from a pissy bit of bent brass.
while it was 90A, its worth mentioning the wago connector was the only one that actually caught fire.
I initially scoffed at the spring clip type connectors. I then realised that their benefit is that they maintain a constant clamping force on the wire. Screw type connectors relax over time.
Not sure about how well every spring type works. I've removed one and took it apart and wasn't terribly convinced it was a good design. However, this was from a "lowest bidder" company that made some good products. These did have European and American testing lab approvals, but even then I wasn't convinced the spring material was very good. Now a WAGO or Ideal push-in connector I would trust.
The lever-type connector is another matter. Those use individual springs compared to one piece of stainless steel formed into separate fingers like with most push-in connectors. I would trust those springs to maintain pressure indefinitely.
They all work when done correctly but I guess the regulator has to take a view on how easy it is to put the connector on incorrectly/dangerously without realising it. I thought that was the original problem with the 1960s wingnut type in the UK tbh.
Butt crimp should be fantastic but a lot of people are inevitably going to munge them closed with random pliers.
Wago might be the best here in terms of only looking like it's on properly when it really is on properly.
possible idea for a future video would be comparison of crimps made with inappropriate tools vs correct tools - demonstration of the easyness of making a bad joint with the varying types
Oh yeah, crimp connections are extremely awful when you don't have good tools. Many years ago I used to work in clay mining industry and these were used for connecting control circuits to bucket-wheel excavator. We had to solder these (guerilla style - bucket, campfire and lot of solder - these were pretty big connectors, as all the control was based on pretty beefy contactors) because there was no hydraulic crimper available on site and if we used manual one it was failing after a week or two.
I don't believe wire nuts have ever been banned from use in the UK, although obviously they've never been terribly common. My understanding is that they fell out of use because of the older style ceramic caps that didn't contain a metal spiral. They basically had threads cut into the ceramic and the threads cutting into the wires as the thread spiral got smaller is what held wires in place. I understand they weren't always terribly secure and had a tendency to break when overtightened. I can't even get a modern plastic wire nut to crack using pliers.
I've been dealing with older homes and replacing old connections. I've seen some ghastly soldered connections that were covered with vinyl electrical tape, rubber splicing tape, and/or friction tape. I've also encountered wires that were twisted together, then covered with a crimp sleeve, and finally covered with tape. These were variously replaced with wire nuts or lever-style connectors like a WAGO 221 or Ideal In-Sure L2.
Fascinating vid John. I thought the Wago Connector would fail first as the actual wires are not in contact with each other but they all stood up well to the overload. :)
There's no direct wire to wire connection in any of these other than the wire nut. Butt connectors have a piece of metal between the crimp ends, the WAGO push-in uses springs (which might provide some conductivity) placing the wires against a bus bar, and a terminal/choc block uses a metal base.
I've seen some testing and one of the highest resistances came from just trying to touch wires together. With a wire nut, the resistance can vary depending on how much twisting there is between wires. Push-in connectors tend to be very stable in terms of how much contact there is using a spring. I've heard criticism that the contact area with the wire is small (and thus resistance is higher), but I don't believe that's so much the issue as much as whether or not it will overheat under rated current.
@9:28
And here we can see I just leave the current running through the wire at 89.43 amps while i inspect 🤣🤣🤣🤣
In my experience, connectors never go bad from a single overcurrent event. They go bad because the design cannot cope with thermal cycling (screw clamps) or with oxidation/annealing (push-in spring clamps and cheap faston clones).
I've always been told it's best practice to check bus bar and breaker screws occasionally, and certainly I always find loose ones when I do. Who ever actually does retighten screw clamps? Effectively nobody -- and then you're left scraping melted insulation out of control box because someone used a euro terminal block from ebay, tightened it until the teeny screw slots stripped and called it indefinitely done.
this.
a millionth time this.
Reviewing this a couple of months later John, one thing strikes me. The actual failure was at the point where the wire would have been stripped to go into the WAGO, and was PROBABLY due to me stripping the wires with a pair of sidecutters rather than the correct tool. A cautionary tale?
TheChipmunk2008
thats why its important to not nick the wire or bend to much or to sharply
nice vid.
Comparing to the untested wire, it looks like it was a little way from where you would have stripped the wire. In fact, there's still some insulation on the bit that's in the connector. It is where the wire is bent but not sure if that's relevant.
Looks like it failed at a hard bend. Assuming that was AC, that would be a high inductive resistance. The Wire nut also has high inductive resistance, but the spring and other material gives it more heat sinking capacity.
+Copper Hamster I don't think inductive effects would be within a bull's roar of being significant at 50Hz.
The inductance of a bend like that wouldn't even be significant at 50MHz, and the wire nut does not form an inductor at all.
Also, the correct term is impedance, not inductive resistance.
+Godfrey Poon
To be fair, I think Copper Hamster meant inductive reactance, which when combined with capacitive reactance, forms the complex component of the electrical impedance vector. Resistance is the real component.
Thanks, gives comfort knowing load ratings have (as they should) such a safety margin.
the twist nut connector used to be the most common connection here in NL up to the late 80's and 90's and even early 2000's in some installations. these days we majorly use the insert type (WAGO) I like that they are transparent these days as you can see if your connection is correct. this is only since a few Years
Good demo John, nice to see that most terminals held up under normal loading conditions. The wirenut is good for solid conductors, I used them in The Netherlands for 1.5mm² (lights) and 2.5 mm² (power) in the 1980's. I think they are best as the twisted wires have a large contact surface area within the spring.
Wago's are also for solid wires. I don't like the relatively loose connection and small contact surface area.
The chock block can be used for solid and stranded wires, the cheap chock blocs often have a steel housing instead of brass adding to more thermal cycling.
The crimp sleeve is for stranded wire, and as long the correct crimping tool is used it is a very good connection.
When you think about it, it's hardly surprising that the connectors didn't fail, for two reasons.
Firstly, there's more conductive metal for the current to flow through in any properly-made connection through any of those connectors, therefore a lower resistance, therefore less heating inside the connector.
Secondly, there's more metal in the connector than in the wire, therefore more surface area for any heat build-up to be radiated from, therefore keeping the connectors cooler than the wires.
Elementary, my dear Watson (as Sherlock Holmes never said). :)
So I don't think the wire would have failed first at the Wago connector if the Wago plastic hadn't caught fire and made a hot spot. So I still blame the connector. Note that in my opinion, the crimp is the most dangerous, since it often happens that a crimp is not carried out correctly.
You got to get a flir one thermal camera.. although I think any of those connectors are perfectly acceptable, just not in the same circuit- You would have easily been able to have a visualization of where the most resistance was originating..
you should commentate tennis or cricket
He reminds me more of a weather man!
My dad would turn on NOAA weather radio whenever he had trouble sleeping he said it would put him to sleep in a few minutes.
This would be a good video for apprentices showing just how everything will burn when things go wrong. Thank you
You should take a look at the WAGO 221 connector. It is the most versatile and user friendly connector I know.
Fantastic video! I might add that crimp connectors are designed for stranded wire. I've seen a few burn out with solid core but they are usually in high vibration applications like motors.
Man I realized you weren’t turning off whatever you were using to supply the high amperage, legend
I just twist the wire ends and give them a wrap with some duct tape. The fire department and my insurance company keep threatening me with fines and jail time after each fire but it’s my life. Yolo.
The marret/wire nut with tape on top to make it more secure is the way that feel good for an old electrician who think that the young generation has nothing good to teach them. If the wire nut get loose, the tape will keep the wire together, preventing short circuit with the metal enclosure.
The professionals reasoning is: wire nut of the correct size for the number of wire you intend to fix are stronger than this tape which get dry over time and fall by itself.
However, if the wire nut fail and a wire get exposed, we prefer to get a short circuit to the metal box which is always connected to the ground, right? It is better that a fuse blow and the light stop working and force the user to inspect the electrical problem. If electrical tape is holding the wire despite the poor electrical contact, the user may tolerate that intermittent blinking light for years... until the heat from that bad contact finally start a fire.
This cheap electrical tape at $1 dollar store is probably not fireproof I imagine. It just add combustible to your electric box.
l purchased a box of the wing nut type in denmark about 25 years ago i saw them in use and thought what a great idea .i just use them as a tempoary connection while working . have never seen them anywherd else in 25 years
Everywhere in America. They were the gold standard here for a long time. Actually not bad if used properly.
I'm but a novice here but the way I see it is as follows.:-
-Junction blocks do go brittle eventually & also split during initial installation sometimes, however can the connection not loosen due to repeated heating up & cooling of the wire, thus leading to an arcing. A good point is that it does take a tool to mess with them.
-Wago's are tool free in assembly & disassembly so anyone could mess with them, however as long as the wire is stripped correctly they are also quite safe to handle as the insulation goes partly into the connector. The connector would expand & reduce with the wire as it heats up & so shouldn't lose it's grip strength or integrity, especially when used in conjunction with the proper enclosures. Yes the levers do open one version but I bet that even if that part melted off the connection would remain good.
- The winged twist on type may be secure initially but I reckon expansion/contraction from heat would ease the connection in time. Also a child could undo one of these if it found one, they would know what to do straight away, grab the wings & twist it.Not that they should be able to access such a connector.
- Crimp on "car style" connectors. Surely expansion/contraction does it again here over time, you could also touch the ends if poorly fitted.
Obviously consumer units have the wires secured by screw, theres more & more focus on the torque settings to ensure the connection stays put, however the tightness is easy to check during a periodic inspection. When a connection is under a floorboard, "accesible" but rarely checked for tightness & definitely NOT torque set upon assembly would it not be best to make that connection using something that retains its grip even after heating up ?
I have a WAGO preference...
What a useful video! Connectors are usually fine, until they need to operate in bad conditions.I don't like a connector that reduces the thickness of the wire by only making contact on some surface area of the wire at the connections. So twisting the wire around itself a few times ensures you don't create a weak spot. My money was on the push in connector. Although it did not fail.
I would suggest that the test should be executed with an infrared camera to see which connector gets the hottest (if at all). Because that indicate a bad connection although it may be made of a metal that can handle the heat, so it will not fail. I had a chocolate block (connector block) used to join a geyser wire and the connector heated up to melting point of the plastic, but it didn't fail. Although I would consider that a bad connection.
My take on this test is, that anytime you have a connector that has movement, or not solidly connected together, such as the spring clip connector, you build up more heat at that location due resistance in the connection. Just like in situations in a home where a screw connector on a switch or receptacle is loose, heat builds up at that location when under a load and many times that wire gets hot enough to melt even though the connection itself does not fail. When I first saw the connectors at the start of the video I selected the spring connector to be where the failure would most likely happen. The heat built up in the area near the connector and even though the connector did not fail, the heat was high enough to melt the wire before the connector.
Nice test. Next one with 2.5 qmm or 4 qmm cable? Normally do you not use one cable only - if you use it with gr/ye and blue together then the cable fault early and the breaker tripping. So what? Now all people can see that the cable fault first before the connectors fault. I self use sice years Wago connectors. All Busch-Jäger power connectors put in cable same Wago connectors - all allowed here in Germany. So I use them in Thailand too. Never a fault. The screw connectors can fault if the screw not connect good enough - I use them only in miniatur railway systems.
A better test is repeated hot-cold cycling. This is when failures show up as the metal expands and contracts. Most electricians in the US have bad experience with wagos because their small spring-contacts weaken and fail long before the other connectors.
It's actually quite interesting how people feel about their preferred connector types. Here in the US, most electricians are skeptical of screw terminal connectors and spring connectors like Wago, and will never stop using wire nuts. And I'm pretty sure that the crimp on butt connectors aren't allowed to be used here for mains wiring. They're often used inside of appliances, but that's about it. There are bare copper crimp connectors used for connecting several ground (earth) wires together, but I've seen more badly terminated connections with those than I've seen properly done ones. (I'm not an electrician, I do general building maintenance as part of my job, so I do sometimes work on existing installations. Can't do new installs or major work such as replacing a circuit breaker panel, however.)
Love the video. Also can't help but notice the old Hammond in the background. Looks to me an m 100 series. I have an old M3 147 combo that just about burned my house to the ground due to some leaky capacitors. Just had the amp completely rebuilt on it and the Leslie. Thanks for the great video!!!
Yes, it's an M102 from 1965.
@@jwflame oh cool. Thought it looked familiar lol i think mine is a 58
Nice demonstration, WAGO insulation started melting from high resistance first, the wire nut wires should be twisted 360 and trimmed before the nut
In Portugal we also have all of those. Until a few years ago, inside the walls, the wing-nut twist connector (we call it "Torix") was the type of connection we used most, now the Wago type of connectors have replaced the use of the Torix connectors. We also have a Wago type of connectors which are filled with a gel inside, they say the connections will be protected from the air outside, preventing any type of corrosion. These gel connectors, which are expensive, are mainly used in communication boxes. It would be interesting to do your experiment with these connectors, that have that gel inside, to see if the fire created is attenuated or not. As I can see on your video, I'm not to sure if we are going the right way by replacing the Torix connectors with those Wago. Well thanks for another great and interesting video.
Torix seems to be a Swedish brand name for wire nuts.
Wago sells a gel in a little syringe too (probably vaseline) that has to be used if you've got aluminium wiring, which is quite common in eastern Europe.
Here in Germany we do mostly use Wagos these days, they are practical and more secure than the screw terminals due to better insulation.
Hi resistance at the wago connector caused increased heat in the conductor causing the failure at that point. If you watch closely, you can see that the wago connector begins to smoulder first.
Could also be that the WAGO plastic has lower melting point.
A thermal imaging camera would make this analysis much more easy to see!
It certainly would - unfortunately cheap thermal cameras are next to useless, and good ones are £1000+
I use the push fit connectors sometimes the lever cage type and both are easy to use plus do not stress the copper like the other types that tend to squash or twist the conductor. The new wago connection boxes are fantastic in place of the traditional type junction box.
The really interesting test would be to take a 100’ extension cord and cut it at around 10 different places along its length. Splice it with different connections and test for voltage drop.
This is a good demonstration on how housefires start when you run a plug-in heater for too long from an outlet it's not the heaters that catch fire it's the wiring inside the wall that is not rated for that constant amps being pulled. so just imagine a wire from that outlet all the way to your breaker doing this inside your walls.
This is actually a bad demonstration. Most electrical fires do not start because of a heavily overloaded wire, but because of dodgy wire connections at currents well wirhin the projected limits of the wire itself. So the connections are the critical pointsm not the wire itself.
Wagos are fine at the end of a circuit. But I have found that if installed near the beginning of a circuit and with the amount of wattage that goes through them, they eventually burn apart. But when speed comes into play, they rock.
cool test JW, also eastern USA here and ive used those screw in block connectors several times in the past just not for mains voltage. i have used that type of connector for LAN and telephone lines.
That wago actually let up a flame. Scary, as the others were self extinguishing and didnt light up and add heat to the fault
Just what I expected, no connector failed at all. Thank you for settling this common debate among Do-it-yourself -ers. Just ordered a massive set of wire-nuts from Amazon because of this video.
Im really supprised that the wago did so well, the spring must be really good heat wise :-)
The butt joint and chocolate block connector was no supprise, i didnt expect them to fail.
The nut or i think marette worked but i think it was the tight twist of the wires that took the brunt of the power, not that spiral spring.
Amazing that the wire took so much :-)
I think a more factor would be the resistance of a connection cause that's what cause the heat and subsequently the failure and fire ?
One thing to keep in mind:
The heating is due to the resistance of the wire. I would assume that the wago connector was the least solid connection which allowed more resistance causing heat. Still very impressive load handling
I don’t really see any reason to think that. The point it broke was well beyond the connector.
The failure point is likely due to the 90 degree bend or better (barring and unforeseen nicks) next to the Wago connector which undoubtedly as seen by the actual fire was the connection with the most resistance, therefore creating heat. It would have been been helpful to have an infrared camera to watch the actual relative temperature on each one. As electricians we are taught to avoid sharp bends and over fatiguing the wire. Thanks for the demonstration. By the way, most of my brothers do not use the Wago connectors in anything other than end point connections in ceiling light cans as provided by the manufacturers..
Can't beat A good solder joint 👌
I would have liked to seen a test of the electrical resistance formed by each connector. ALL connectors are only as good as the installer. A butt connector can have its plastic insulation damaged especially if crimped without using the proper tool, can be weak, not very good for solid wire but takes up the least amount of volume. The wire nut can provide the greatest surface area of wire in contact but can become loose and fall off if not taped on due to vibration, or not provide good contact if not twisted on properly. It also takes up the most volume (in this comparison). The screw connector may loosen over time and many heat cycles but is the easiest to remove without distorting the wire much. It also is less mechanically secure on solid wire. The Wago connector is the simplest to install and easiest to learn to install properly, can safely and securely attach two different size wires (within reason) and takes up little volume. It may be more difficult to install on stranded wire and some types do not recommend using for stranded wire.
All of these connectors provide no protection against oxidation and/or moisture without using dielectric grease so connection resistance will change with time. It should go without saying to make sure that the connector is rated for aluminum if used on aluminum wires. Essentially all of these connectors (except Wago and screw connnectors, as far as I know) are available with grease and/or heat shrink or a skirt (wire nuts) which improves protection against oxidation/corrosion. But then there's always tape. Good old tape.
Nice! Would love to see ideal insure nuts / switch / outlet push-in terminals tested after pushed in and out a few times under max load!
I feel better about those wire nuts now, seeing the wire itself failing before any connector.
Photonicinduction would love this - on a wood surface as well - only difference,
Mr. Photonicinduction would get the conductor glowing bright orange, then
Oh dear. " I`ve POPPED IT"
I always use connector blocks and crimps as I personally think there the safest. I’ve done tests like this myself.
I’ve never used wire nuts and the spring types of connectors as I don’t think you get a proper tight connection.
i think the issue was that it was a loos connection.
in my experience, over time a loos connection will cause increased temperatures around it even at currents lower than the line is rated. only recently i had to deal with a situation were the wiring had melted and a fuse had blown around a fuse holder where the terminals wear not screwed tightly, with now indication of undercurrent .
Results are basically what one would expect. The connectors have a larger surface area relative to that of the wire.
Pretty impressive nonetheless at 90 amps. Thanks for yet another entertaining and educational video!
I actually really like the thingie you call a "wirenut". In Sweden I've heard the name Torix (brand name possibly). They're great for how we do stuff here with single few-stranded wires (FK) running in tubes in the wall. I suppose though, that the Wago is by far the most popular.
If I got any of the technical lingo wrong, feel free to enjoy yourself on my behalf. :P
Opinions seem to be divided in Sweden as well, I read a rather lively discussion on byggahus.se today. Actually Wago 2273 are rated for FK but I'm not sure how easy that'd be to get in (some geniuses even manage to get stranded into 273/2273 connectors, don't ask me how) but according to Wago it's acceptable (only noted on the boxes in Norwegian and Swedish because no one else seems to use FK/H07V-R smaller than 10 mm2). I once found a box of wire nuts in a shed in Austria and have used them for the odd job, mainly for replacing filter capacitors in old vacuum cleaners. They seem to hold up fine there and gripped the stranded wires quite nicely but I wouldn't use them in fixed wiring because they're a bear if you want to remove or add wires from a splice.
I'm putting crimps on all ties and splices or whatever anyone calls it.
Great video 👍
This was a wire in open air, and its insulation started melting first. Normally, the conductors would have been in a cable. Had he installed this rig at the end of a cable with same cross section, it would have short-circuited first, leaving all connectors at the end with near to zero current. And in an actual home, a fuse would have reacted before any of this happened. But, I get the test. To me, all connectors did just fine. I'm just tripping to smell an actual burn in my house right now...
Well, nothing caught on fire except the Wago. Nice.
For jointing I prefer a butt splice crimp as it's a solid mechanical connection I've now got into using the Waggo connectors but I still like to use chock blocks as it gives you piece of mind knowing you've tightened it up good and tight that's something your don't get from a push in style of connection. I've never used the wire nut style of connection I always thought they were a Twist and Stick style of connection so I've never trusted them and with all the testing that's required in the UK it would be a right pain for testing.
+glenwoofit But that's the whole weakness of chocolate blocks, and why it's forbidden to use then in inaccessible places - you can do up the screw nice and tight to start with for sure, but copper is ductile not springy, and the pressure in the screw connector can gradually weaken as the copper slowly deforms. you also have to exercise good judgement as to just how tight to do it up in the first place. the wago connector has none of those problems. it's only really disadvantage I have found is that it's more awkward to remove wires to change connections, and the 222 type overcomes that.
+Rosscoff2000 Yeah in the UK it's in the regulations that only maintenance free connections are allowed in inaccessible area's
All we use in the USA is Wago's and wire nuts, never seems a wire nut fail either and that's a I use.
i love how he speaks
rising inflection
Damn no, it is quite irritating, if you make a video try and keep your voice constant, going up and down like that can make your listeners seasick.
I find it irritating as well. I have been speaking English for 50+ years and still find it difficult to understand the speaker. Anyone else would never finish this video.
Thankfully we have fuses, circuit breakers and component ratings. I am not sure what the purpose of the video was, just use the components as rated. I admit, I had fun watching it.
This was a great electrical education video. Sort of like a professional wrestling match however; we pretty much knew what was going to be the outcome from the beginning: The Bad Guy seems to be winning but the Good Guy overcomes a dirty hold and then throws the SOB Bad Guy over the ropes, jumps out of the ring and stamps on his head before hitting him with a metal chair. HA HA.
three things unless your circuit breaker is faulty, the wrong breaker was installed for a certain wire gauge, or there is a wire gauge being used somewhere that is lower than what the circuit is rated for. this kind of extreme testing the results will never happen in real life.
i have mixed feelings about many of these connectors the screw down type can be over tightened and then fracture the copper and it can just break off and pop out of the block.
"wire nut" which is a "brand name" or twist connector can be improperly installed and can fail when you use the wrong nut for the wrong wires. such as using a nut that is for 12 gauge wires on 10 gauge wires. or the nut was simple installed improperly and the copper wire has been weakened and given time can snap off and come loose.
the crimping style conector is the most secure and allows for marine grade heat shrink to make a waterproof connection but these waste wire when you have to modify or repair it later. uses these in conditions that they could get wet or corrode.
the "wago brand" which they now make reusable "lever nuts" (the ones in this video are push fit) are pretty good and that they allow easy and less "violent" means of connecting but given that they are newer we do not know how long they will last overtime. and the "lever nut" style is 100% reusable unlike a "twist connector" style that really should be disposed of after it is used.
i work in an older apartment community that has been remodeled twice. original (1950s)wires were copper the 1st remodel wiring was aluminum and the 2nd remodel used copper clad aluminum. so when the Wago lever nuts were released i immediately began testing to see if they could replace traditional twist connectors.
and behold they do a fine job keeping the copper wires from directly contacting the aluminum wires and severely reduces the problems that i have with working at my job. how i tested this is we used all electric appliances and the water heaters are a troublesome problem. new water heaters use copper wires. the buildings wires are 90% solid aluminum for connection from the load center to the water heaters. so i set a water heater to normal temperature and had it run water through it constantly until the lever nut failed. and it didn't even break a sweat.
I have to do (well i had to) periodic maintenance on the water heaters to prevent them from melting the twist connectors and they the plastic on the twist connectors would melt and then eventually something would contact metal and trip a circuit breaker. these lever nuts have been going for nearly 2 years now and i refuse to use anything else for my needs.
The weakest part of the circuit was probably caused by bending the conductor sharply or nicking it when stripping.
I have never liked or trusted the "Screwit" types although they were probably used on the moon landings. I was always taught not to crimp solid conductors, and the Wago ones have their main contact point on a tangent to the conductor, so I would have thought that the common terminal block type would be the most secure, particularly if the conductors were pushed through so that each screw clamps down on both of them.
Thanks for doing the video John... I'm surprised too, I really expected either the Wago or the Wirenut to fail. The choc blocks as noted by CrimsonTrainer tend to fail over the years due to loosening from heat/cool cycles (That's partly why I included it)
I should have included the 222 type as I had some, but I suspect, as they rely on the plastic lever to supply force, they'd fail pretty fast. Looking forward to stefantrethan's video :D
I don't think the wago 222 type relies on the plastic levers to apply the force, it's the other way round. The levers are used to open the gate and when you release them a spring clamps the wires.
That would make more sense, yes, thanks :D
That is correct; the plastic lever pushes down the metal springy bit to release; when the lever is down, it doesn't touch it and the springy bit clamps the wire. Look at Wago's demonstration video(s).
Actually I think the 222 types have a even stronger connection. Other types you can twist and pullout the wires but doing this on the 222 type is much harder. You need a mechanical lever to insert something while on the other types you can simply push the wire in.
wire nuts dont ever fail thats how we wire all our high power in our houses in the usa you wingnut lol
I suspect the wire failed at the wago because the wago has the least amount of contact area with the wire, therefore the most resistance and heat. A thermal image at the time of failure might confirm this.
Chris Landry I see what you mean, but I think he might still have a valid point. The heat generated at the contacts is transmitted to the adjacent metal of the wire by thermal conduction.
Real Monty Python type experiment. I love it. Let's have some more.
Personally I would have preferred it if it wasn't done on wood. I think the extra heat from flames from the wood fire was probably what ultimately caused the failure. Other than that I love the video I would love to see more of this with other connectors. Perhaps you could use multiple of the same connectors at the same time to increase the sample size?
Interesting video. I wonder how the Wago Lever nuts would compare to the other connectors? And with a heavier gauge wire say rated for 20 amps....
Great video - I do use the Wago connectors now and again, but have wondered how much I would trust them. Clearly I have nothing to worry about.
It would've been interesting to see any voltage drops over the connectors - to see which suffered conductivity and loss issues first. Likely the Wago connector generating heat the most causing the copper to fail at that bend where it's under a little bit more mechanical stress. Although the Wire Nut is the only other with a perpendicular connection...
As someone else said, thermal camera wouldn've been a good indication of this too.
Thanks for the video!
What's the resistance of those connectors? Intuition suggests the standard brass and crimped tube will be best since they got most contact area and the copper can be squeezed quite hard, meanwhile wago has so tiny area the wire spins freely inside (and the thin plate has less copper?). Not sure about the yolo twist thing, it's too big and funky anyway. Mechanical properties are also important (on the battlefield which is construction site), with inline connectors you avoid the 90 degree kink.
I use wago for neutral (can connect 3-5 together easy), for rest the old screw stuff.
Thanks for the vid.
We don't see block and wago type around us much. May be has to do with cost? They all pretty much use wing nut type and crimps are used in automobile wiring.
At first, I thought, "I wonder which one is the best and will fail last?" then I started thinking, "Is that better? If the connector failed, then the current might stop and then stop the heat, so is a connector that doesn't fail better?"
One of the reasons I was keenly interested was to see how well the wago connector would fare with heat etc. I think this shows that it is a good connector for many applications. Now to see if it is legal to use in my area.
Thanks, I was just wondering the other day how the Wago would stand up to current stresses.