How to Buy Gold (Without Getting Ripped Off)
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- čas přidán 23. 09. 2023
- A viewer emailed me asking how to buy gold. He knew I didn't personally invest in gold. But he asked how he might go about investing in gold.
So in today's video we'll look at five important questions you must answer when buying gold:
1. Should you buy gold in a retirement or taxable account?
2. Does a gold IRA ever make sense?
3. Should you own physical gold or gold ETFs?
4. What type of gold ETFs are best?
5. If you wanted to buy physical gold, where's the best place to buy it?
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ABOUT ME
While still working as a trial attorney in the securities field, I started writing about personal finance and investing In 2007. In 2013 I started the Doughroller Money Podcast, which has been downloaded millions of times. Today I'm the Deputy Editor of Forbes Advisor, managing a growing team of editors and writers that produce content to help readers make the most of their money.
I'm also the author of Retire Before Mom and Dad--The Simple Numbers Behind a Lifetime of Financial Freedom (amzn.to/3by10EE)
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DISCLAIMER: I am not a financial adviser. These videos are for educational purposes only. Investing of any kind involves risk. Your investment and other financial decisions are solely your responsibility. It is imperative that you conduct your own research and seek professional advice as necessary. I am merely sharing my opinions.
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Gold is not an “investment” per se. It’s insurance and a store of value.
If you bought a bunch of it a few years ago you would have made a lot of money, that's an investment
So would have an index fund owning 500 stocks . And 100% liquid
@@embededfabrication4482 If you bought in 1980, counting for inflation, after 44 years you have still not broke even. Hell of an investment.
@@embededfabrication4482 Two years ago, I bought gold at $17XX. It is now up $600 per ounce. That said, I am a long term holder of precious metals and buy them as an insurance policy against foolish economic debt driven policy.
totally agree. I don’t own gold as an investment. it’s just a small amount for diversification. 1-2% of your total portfolio.
I hold physical gold not as an investment, but mostly as a back-up to my savings.
how do you avoid getting ripped off
Costco has 1 ounce gold bars available occasionally for ~$40 over spot, free shipping. Either PAMP or Rand, depending on the deal. But it usually sells out within two hours.
Great video as usual. Very informative and keeping very simple!
Money is not meant to control people, rather it is meant to be put to work producing more money for you. You cannot build wealth without putting money in its rightful place...
SCAM ALERT!
I thought CZcams got rid of this social proof scam tactic, sad to see it’s still here
Thanks for your opinions.Enjoyed.
I always learn something from his videos.
Look at Jason Hartman’s, Hartman index. He shows the value of assets over time - how many barrels of oil in 1974 would buy a median price home vs. today. How many oz’s of gold will do the same. With few exceptions (2008,09) it shows that it takes about the same amount of gold today. How many dollars does it take you today vs. 1974?
Buying the gold miners is probably a better option for multiple reasons. GDX is one way to do this in a diversified way.
Physical gold is very profitable. It makes very good returns for people that collect the premium when buying it and selling it. They do pretty good.
Gold and Silver are good wealth preservers. If buying physical gold, I recommend buying from reputable online dealers or local coin stores and buying in smaller increments, 1oz coins vs. Kilo bars for example. Do some research, you can find 1oz American gold coins at a 5% markup (premium). Apmex is a decent option but they usually charge more than other online dealers. I do agree with buying American coins (Buffalo or Eagles), they typically hold value better over time, and Canadian & British coins are well-recognized as well. Note anything under 1oz will have much larger markups but if SHTF 1/10ths and 1/4s would probably be easier to bargain with.
The Aussies make nice coins.
@@infinitemonkey917 Indeed they do Roos, Kooks, and others are great options as well!
If the value is in the metal (and same purity) why does it matter which coin it is (American, Canadian, Australian)? I figure that if the SHF, my my guns and booze will be more valuable……
@@Frank-nh9fe If you need to sell your coins prior to SHF and you are in America then you will get more for them if they are American coins. My dealer is currently paying spot price for foreign and spot +2% for American 1oz gold coins & spot +6% for 1/10oz gold coins. An unexpected astronomical tax or insurance bill is more likely than the apocalypse, lead and 90 proof will not help pay those bills.
@@Frank-nh9fe It doesn't really, but some have more recognition as standard bullion coins. Also, there are some coins with lower mintage figures that raises the premium.
I have coins because I like them, not because I think they will benefit me in a post apocalypse.
Hi Rob, thanks for covering this topic.
Hi Rob, I just wanted to correct you. Both GLDM and IAUM hold physical gold in vaults. That's what their docs say.
They do not operate with futures.
Rob - off topic but would be great if you could do a video on a treasury bond nvestment strategy for retirement folks given the current high yields. Value your prespective. Thanks.
I have around 5% of my portfolio in physical gold just for peace of mind. I've had good experiences online with Provident Metals. Today, a 1 oz US Gold Eagle costs $2017. Spot price is $1929. That's about a 4.5% markup. I'm in California and have never paid any sales tax. Definitely going into smaller sizes will increase the markup percentage.
Hi, the sales tax varies by state and there are exceptions. Here's what Bing AI says about California :
---- Yes, sales tax applies to the sale of gold bullion in California 12. However, there is an exemption for a single transaction that exceeds $1,500 2. The state of California imposes a sales and use tax of 7.5% 2.
According to APMEX, taxes must be collected on nonmonetized bullion made from platinum, palladium or copper; monetized bullion, nonmonetized gold or silver bullion, or numismatic coins if the total amount of a single sales transaction is less than $2,000; accessory items; and processed items 1. All other products sold by APMEX are exempt from these taxes. ----
I have always bought ounces, always > $1500. Bought in 2011, 2020, 2021. Never paid sales tax.
I pay a 3% premium on one-ounce American bullion coins with a dealer to include a small USPS shipping expense.
Have some GLD (5%) I in my 457 , first time hearing about GLDM
Could you tell me for stability in a Roth IRA, would a high yield bond or gold be a better option? Thank you. Oh, I also live in a state tax free state, that is why I am not looking at TIPS. Thank you so much for all your teaching!
What is the recommended way to SELL physical gold?
I would recommend a local coin shop near where you are located. If none exist then any online buillon dealer would be another good option.
Its difficult. Nobody talks about selling it.
Keep in mind that when buying small amounts of gold and silver bullion online you are usually paying shipping charges which negates any low premiums and/or special sales they may be offering and depending on your state and method of payment you may also have to pay tax. So unless you are buying enough quantity to get a bulk discount and/or free shipping it may be better to buy from a local dealer where you'll usually only pay their premium over spot. Some dealers won't charge tax if paying with cash as long as the transaction is under 10K.
"Some dealers won't charge tax if paying with cash as long as the transaction is under 10K." also known as Tax fraud
@@dancooper6002 That's not what I ment exactly. It's perfectly legal to buy just under 10k of gold and pay no taxes (in states where there is no tax on precious metals). Anything above 10k and the dealer has to fill out a special form so the government knows about the purchase even if no taxes are ultimately paid. Some precious metals buyers and sellers would just prefer to stay off the governments radar and they are not without some justification. For states who still charge a tax on precious metals (thankfully few these days) then yes, the dealer is supposed to charge tax.
PHYS is a better way to buy gold than GLD, while GLD has outperformed PHYS over a 10 year period, PHYS is literally based off of the Spot price of Gold and has no dividend or option contracts.
So I am just referring to a Pure gold play!
However GLD is way better if you know how to sell covered calls for income and want to actively manage the fund
If buying gold or silver is something you've chosen to do, it might be worth your time to check if your state charges sales taxes on in-state and/or online purchases. Many states have no taxes at all when purchasing precious metals from local coin shops
Edit: Owning physical metal isn't without fees, though. It is common for significant mark ups from actual spot/market price depending on purity, weight, year, etc.
yep, in the state I live in you just gotta buy at least $500 and then no tax.
Also to keep it off the books I highly recommend ALWAYS buying your precious metals with cash. Don’t put it on a card.
In NY its $1,000 worth bullion to avoid sales tax
@@alextjb
@@alextjb Terrible advice, you want to be able to prove what you paid for it when you have taxes on the sale
@@dancooper6002 when did I say that you shouldn’t document it? lol
you buy it using cash and over $400 worth so that you don’t get charged sales tax on it and you 100% get a receipt from your shop.
@@alextjb Why do you want it "off the books" then?
BAR is an inexpensive gold ETF- I think. I’m not a fan of gold as an investment, however.
My view on gold is that it would serve as a means of bartering and holding a physical asset of known value in a doomsday scenario (or more likely, some kind of disaster where we wouldn't have access to other assets for a period of time...)
I would have zero interest in owning "paper" gold (Gold ETF or otherwise).
With that, the IRA route isn't possible as you aren't allowed to physically hold the gold yourself.
Owning physical gold also means that nobody knows how much you own nor would they know when you sell or transact it (and by "they" I mean Uncle Sam and/or the IRS and/or other people)... Having it in an IRA or owning paper gold doesn't have this advantage.
I don't own any gold but have considered it ... what I have also considered is that owning ammunition and shelf stable food might prove to be much better "investments" than gold or silver in the doomsday scenario ...
Just some thoughts... not financial advice!
For a doomsday scenario you're probably better off stocking guns, ammo, petrol and paracetamol than gold.
@@sarchmaster5779if you have enough money to buy gold, then you probably have enough to buy the other stuff to.
Plus physical gold is cool
@@sarchmaster5779 Yeah, until you have to move any meaningful distance and then that gets left on the side of the road
I'm surprised mining companies weren't mentioned. Are there ETFs of mining companies?
What do you think about investing in gold from the US Money Reserve? I'm considering it.
Hi Rob, have you read Ray Dalio’s book Principles for a Changing World Order? I’d be really interested in hearing your take on it.
Another problem with owning physical gold is when you go to sell it the buyer will take a 5% to 10% discount of its value. Way to much friction in buying and selling physical gold.
Yeah… it’s ridiculous. So much robbery in our world.
Don't make such a blanket statement. What you're saying is only true with fractional gold or certain unpopular foreign coins.
If it's US Mint, you should be getting spot price or better on the sale.
Rob, do you have an updated link to the 1994 Bengen 4% Rule paper? The link in your Video #3 doesn't work, nor can I find an active link on the internet. Thx!
My question is why does portfolio visualizer show a 60% US stock and 40% gold from January 2001 to today with $10,000 invested give me a return of $69,000? Is something wrong with the software? What am I missing?
What about IAU?
I don’t know Rob, you are talking yourself into some niche fringe cases. First you say “track dividends” which reasoning was a huge stretch. Now it’s “gold has a place in some portfolios”. I’m in a parallel universe 😂
Hey Rob, I’m 29 years old and have $12,500 in my Roth IRA to invest. My Ira is currently with fidelity. I would love to know what you would recommend I should invest in based on my age and all of your knowledge and experience. Thank you!
FFNOX if you want an all in one fund. Fluctuates between 85/15-70/30 global stocks/bonds.
Thank you for this honest and the depth on this investment type. I truly appreciate your prospective.
1❤
Man Rob I really disagree with you on this one. For an asset with an expected real return of 0, or nominal return of maybe 3% putting it in a retirement account seems horrible.
Especially for GLDM where if you’re owning bonds in a tradition account with tax rates of ordinary income, since GLDM is futures with 60% LTCG and 40% STGC it wouldn’t make sense to me at all to put that in a retirement account unless you own few bonds and are really really terrified of inflation, as I’d probably do roth conversions on my traditional anyways and want it to grow.
>since GLDM is futures
I read GLDM prospectus, it is backed by physical gold in vaults the same way that GLD is.
Don’t buy numismatics unless you’re a collector.
Howard Marks says: “It’s not so much What you Buy- It’s What you Pay”
Bought Gold in 2008 at $835. Now close to $2000. A 6% return per year tax deferred.
How about a The Return Bonds have made since 2008?
Would I Buy Gold now?
Not with Bonds NOW yielding 5% and portfolio is already 10% Gold.
People with physical gold never talk about the experience of selling it. I could imagine its difficult because everyone wants to get it cheap and argue about its purity.
U walk into a coin shop knowing exactly what they will buy ur gold for because u called ahead of time and walk out with cash 10 mins later. It's that easy
A few things:
- I view precious metals not as an investment, but as an insurance policy against economic policies that are entirely debt driven and will crash our economic system.
- If you don't hold it, you do not own it. I am specifically addressing paper gold (GLD) and gold that you trust that others are holding for you.
- Tax reporting guidelines are different depending on what you are selling. If I go down to my local shop and sell them a one ounce American Gold Eagle, that sale does not generate tax paperwork. Foreign gold and gold bars have less favorable reporting requirements.
- APMEX and most online dealers have high premiums. I have a private bullion dealer that will sell one-ounce American Gold Eagles with only a 3% premium, plus shipping.
Would you please do a similar video for dummies as in me 😅 I had a hard time keeping up 😢
Why can't you just buy say 1oz coin from SD bullion and continue doing that until you retire. Lets just say you have a 1 million portfolio and you invested roughly 10% so price of Gold now that would get you roughly 50 coins and when you retire just sell a coin a month for cash at spot to help supplement your retirement. You would have 4 years that you might not need to dip in your IRA account so heavily maybe help with the 4% rule
I think precious metals should largely be viewed as a fun hobby that will (likely) allow you to recoup your initial investment should you really need to. Nothing more, nothing less. The “precious metals community” is really a mixed bag of people, a majority of whom I would classify as borderline delusional.
A fun hobby that would have gotten you better returns than the S&P 500 over the past five years. But that’s of course very much not guaranteed.
Online retailers such as APMEX, JM BULLION, and others actually charge high premiums themselves. If you don’t live near a local store, then they might be your only option. Today, APMEX is selling fresh 1oz rounds at spot +$4, and 1oz silver eagles at spot +$8. They’re $110 over on gold eagles, and $70 over on gold maples and gold krs. As a dealer in this industry, current cost on rounds is $1 over, silver eagles +$3.75, gold eagles +$60, and gold maples/kr +$60. We all buy from the same few distributors/brokers, so shops can match and/or beat those online guys if they really want to. Keep the money local and with the small businesses!
@@PatrickStahlitrm
Wrong! Wrong! Wrong!
But of course Gold lovers always cherrypick dates to try to convince everybody else to buy Gold. But Gold is and has been a terrible investment, ridiculous returns, and just like you I can pick dates and tell you that Gold reached its highest price back in August of 2020 with a price of around $2075 per ounce (it took a world pandemic for Gold to go briefly above $2000,) and today (3+ years later) Gold is hovering at $1900.
Sorry but the Opportunity cost of owning Gold is too high, the only Good things Gold has is....its name “Gold”, but as an investment it is terrible, and it’s also terrible as a hedge against inflation, but it shines doesn’t it.
Delusional is a perfect way to describe Gold lovers... “Gold will go to $3000... possibly to $5000” and “Silver will go to $100”
The astonishing thing is that many of them believe that based on the fact that the world will collapse very soon and precious metals, mainly physical Gold will go through the roof (key word here is “will”, meaning one day.)
A friend of mine spent a bunch of money building an underground bunker as he was convinced the Soviet Union was going to attack the US. Today his bunker functions as an underground storage room, a very expensive one.
@@p.c.h.6721 My allocation is somewhere around 2.5%. It’s just one component of a mixed (and very small right now) portfolio.
Does anyone know if it is worth it to invest gold in an IRA? If so. Is it nessesary to have a custodian /broker? I have read a lot info on the Internet . However, I'm just confused about how to obtain gold and wisely use the money in my 401K. Some companies like American Hartford Gold and others charge maintenance fees and I have read that are mostly scams.
Since you have done the reading, you know the answer.
Do you have to pay sales tax on gold bullion?
Depends on the state but usually no
A gold CFD
OneGold?
Unless you’re holding it in your hand I would not invest in gold.
There are two reasons to own gold.
The first is as a safety play when it all goes to hell. For this you need physical gold stored somewhere in your possession, and it is way better for this than large amounts of cash, since it performs way better than cash stored “under the mattress”.
Taxes are not an issue in this situation.
The second is as part of your retirement portfolio, in that case I would go with a gold fund such as GLD or PHYS. In your IRA it would be a means to diversify without any additional tax consequences. As to how much, it depends.
But if all goes to hell, guns, booze, & food would likely be a better investments.
@@Frank-nh9fe Doubtful, there is a reason currency exists. Barter is inefficient, and most barter goods expire or are too heavy and large to transport.
Like Levi Strauss found out, selling to the gold miners was more profitable than mining it. Similarly, gold dealers make money (and you lose) when you buy and when you sell…..
They aren't making a killing, the spread covers the cost of doing business. No different than brokers make money when you buy and sell securities.
GDE
Even if you keep gold in an IRA, eventually the tax man will come and get his 28%, right?
Physical is a pain in the arse.
The info on this video is so full of dangerous assumptions and bad advice.
I have used the etf IAU in the past to own gold. Exactly the same as GLDM but I paid a higher fee.😢
Yeah, I've held IAU in the past too. If you're looking for an ETF option, I'd consider that along with GLD. I don't own it anymore. I would stress owning it in a retirement account though. That's NOT what I did before, and the tax overhead was way more than it was worth. I had to wait for K-1's every year, and it was just overly complicated for what little I had in it. At this point, I just don't see the need for the added complication... at least that's my opinion right now.
Look into gold miners etf too. It’s another angle. Also gold miners that mine PMs (rare earth) used in all tech now and future.
IAU is 25bps per share. IAU holds physical gold; and each share represents 1/50 of a troy ounce. So it is not like GLDM. No derivatives like futures are involved.
@tollermaus if you do a comparison graph of any time frame you will see exactly one line! They move together exactly!
Dude SO needs to buy and hold a one ounce physical gold coin. 😂
Physical gold is worth more than paper gold
Rob ur videos are normally such well put together. This is a rare miss. So many issues with the information provided. First u dont mention a single advantage to owning physical gold which imo is the best pro for gold. Next ur biggest problem with gold are mainly tax reasons which couldnt be further from the truth with physical. If u buy in cash in majority of states u pay 0 tax. When u sell in cash u pay 0 in tax. Ive been buying and selling gold and never paid a dime in tax, its one of the pros of physical gold, and its ur biggest con. Huge problem with that. Lastly u say dont buy in person at coin shops when that is literally the cheapest place to buy precious metals. No idea how ur other experiences would have shown different.
I would strongly recommend revisiting this topic and video.
thanks for your insight.
BTW mrkriegs, have you become a flat earther yet? If not I suggest viewing the 13 part series _what on earth happened_ in my about to learn how the earth is not a globe
I would rather buy an ounce of gold and take possession that treasuries which is not money
Great. But how do you buy without being cheated?
I am skeptical of personally holding gold. I doubt Publix would accept it.
😂 I'm with you.
If the dollar becomes worthless things will be interesting, but yes, it will buy more than worthless paper
Step 1: dont.
Im thinking of buying gold coins aince they look cool as fuck
There are no fundamentals in today's economy that make sense investing in America's future. We're going over the cliff. Some amount of gold makes sense.
Now could you please advise the best way to sell physical gold, like jewelry, teeth, gold scraps, etc.
Check for shops in your area which buy precious metals in any form. I sold some old silver candlesticks which were damaged beyond repair in a move. This was in a small town in an army surplus store. Now, we have a small shop in our local shopping mall. Perhaps ask in a jewelry store or seach online. BTW, when you sell precious metals, it is weighed by the troy ounce which is 31.1 grams. This is different than the usual ounce which is 28 grams.
Thank you
Gold is the currency of fear. There are great businesses out there that are worth a lot more than gold!
Fear is certainly not limited to gold. People lose boatloads of money every day buying and selling stocks at the wrong times based out of fear and emotion.
Why bother? Gold is an asset that produces nothing. Your only hope is someone is dumb enough to pay more than you paid.
Because it is a highly concentrated form of wealth that can save you when nothing else can