HOTD Episode 6 is Overwhelming But Still Good
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- čas přidán 26. 09. 2022
- A review of Episode 6 of House of the Dragon. Primarily looking at the pacing issues within the episode regarding the 10 year time jump and the season so far. While also looking at some highlights like the new kids, actors, and crazy revelations.
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I think they could easily have done another episode right in between these two. All of the following plotlines would have been interesting to see:
- Alicent getting Criston Cole out of trouble and Criston then becoming her ally
- Larys Strong becoming Alicent's ally as well
- Rhaenyra getting to know Harwin and them ultimately getting together to make the first bastard
- Daemon getting to the Vale and being refused by Jeyne Arryn when he tries to claim the Royce holdings
- Daemon and Laena developing a relationship, marrying and moving to Pentos
- Laena finding Vhagar and bonding with her
- Laenor being introduced to Qarl Correy
- Rhaenyra becoming pregnant and giving birth, overcoming her fear of motherhood
- Alicent discovering that Rhaenyra's firstborn son might be a bastard
I agree otherwise, but in that case the cast change would have seemed weirder.
not rly they would have had to do 2 times jumps then
Might also be interesting to see how the hell Viserys managed to survive another 10 years after the last few episodes.
The issue would be you'd either need another set of actors for a 5-year time jump or it would otherwise look awkward trying to make young Rhaenyra look too old or older Rhaenyra looking too young. In theory, definitely I'd agree, but it would probably be a logistical nightmare
@@domskillet5744 I think an episode like that could maybe have a time jump halfway throughout the episode itself, so the first half could deal with the immediate aftermath of the previous one, and the second half could deal with the events that can be placed around Jacaerys' birth.
I loved the detail of Rhaenyra still having a tummy after having the baby. It doesn’t just disappear. Also, her handmaiden mentions that her breast will feel better, “when the milk dries up”.. she’s a high born lady and they rarely breastfed their children.
Wow thanks for that, I was wondering about this breastfeeding thing
Yeah I remember in the books Rhaenyra's appearance after giving birth is specifically talked about, I love that the show stays faithful to such details.
ok that makes sense. i was wondering what she meant by that lol
Yess for a second when I noticed I was like "wait did they skip some months and she's pregnant again? Wait no she only has 3 harwin kids and also this is the same day lol" and then it hit me, like of course she just ga e birth! But it's so uncommon (for me at least) to see that it took a second to compute. Lol it reminded me of the office when Angela came to work after giving birth and pam still had her baby belly
Babies just don't stop crying though, they need to be fed immediately to calm them down.
I wouldn't say Laenor and Rhaenyra dislike each other. In first scene Rhaenyra doesn't despise her husband, she's just slightly annoyed by his comments and the fact she's summoned by Alicent. We can see they're good friends, living in peace and understanding, like strong partnership. She then is concerned about Laenor's carelessness behaviour and she wants him to be beside her and protect her, what he understands and agrees, even when he wanted something else. Overall this episode shows that these two has very good relationship but it is just slightly more difficult moment for them.
@@arthurleonepimenta2266 thank u for the spoilers. If he read the book he would know that already and if he didn’t he doesn’t want know. So there is no need to say what’s going to happen
Yeah no.. you are very wrong.
exactly. laenor and rhaenyra have a strong partnership and friendship but the show introduced them at a bad moment. if we had gotten more time with the 10 year time jump we could've seen more of that.
@Merlin That's CZcams for you.
Yeah it’s like some people expect a woman that has literally just given birth and is forced to walk all the way across the keep and up multiple flights of stairs while blood and other bodily fluids are leaking out of her to be happy and polite.
It's also kind of funny the names "Varys" and "Littlefinger" can be combined into "Larys". I don't know if that was intentional by GRRM though.
I kept thinking that too lmao
What ?
I suspect its VERY intentional. Larys has extremely heavy parallels to the book versions of both characters.
Id love to see him get a nice treadment by the Boltons x
It's definitely intentional.
I still think it's unfair how Crispin gets to stay at his position at the Kingsguard after murdering a guest at a royal wedding while Harwin gets sent home for beating Crispin in a courtyard. You'd think Laenor would hold a grudge over him after all these years.
Right
allicent made him a higher kingsguard member so the murder was overruled
It is unfair, but thats how politics goes. Joffrey of Lonmouth was a relative nobody and to insinuate otherwise would disgrace the future King Consort as well as the two most powerful houses in the realm. Criston could kills him with, relatively, light consequences because he could spin a tale that Joffrey threatened the crown or was an acting agent against it. He also had the Queen’s backing, and a weak King who cant handle controversy.
Conversely, Harwin struck and beat a Kingsguard member based off an accusation which is by all metrics true. People have eyes and they notice and spread gossip throughout the city and the realm/ world as even Daemon knows of the infidelity. Harwin has less allies. Even his dad doesnt want him at court as he sees him as a stain to the honor of House Strong.
Right? I was surprised there was no interaction between Laenor and Criston.
I mean I think the only time they came close was when the baby was being brought to Alicent.
Everyone was killing people left and right but a small boop on crispin's face and everybody loses their collective s.
Go figure.
Assume that the dragon that scared Aemond is Dreamfyre really confirms that Dreamfyre is Drogon, Reaghal and Verseiron’s mother since she’s the spitting image of them
Good assumption. That's Helaena's dragon being she's a "dreamer".
"He'll have to close an eye."
Wow! I didn’t even catch that
I remember in episode one of game of thrones the man who gave Daenerys her eggs mentioned that the eggs where from the shadowlands beyond asshai which is wayy east of the map.
@@ThePatman1980 yes, I was right after watching that episode echcking if I forgot that fact or if they didn´t mention anything of that power she owns in F&B
@@ilyasahmed2929 those three eggs from asshai have a whole story of their own
See during the reign of maegor, his older brother/previous king aenys had a daughter rhaena who had a second marriage to some lord farmen (not because she loved him but because she was in love with his sister ellissa farmen so on the isle of house farmen rhaena lived with her dragon dreamfyre and there dream fyre layed three eggs
And ellisa(rhaenas lover) wanted to go west and explore the unknown west world but when she left, she stole dreamfyres egg betraying rhaena
The ship ellisa took west with the dragon eggs was called sunchaser and some year before the events of house of the dragon corlys velaryon went to asshai and he saw a ship there which he said could be none other than sunchaser which was ellisas ship and meaning the dragon eggs that ellisa took with her to the west were now in asshai since it could be that ellisa ended up sailing accross the world and arrived at asshai from the eastern side of the world
My issue with the black hair thing, is that Leanor has Baratheon in him. They changed the Queen that Never Was's hair from Black to White in the show, even though she is half Baratheon. And as far as I know, Jon Snow is a clear example of a Targaryen without the silver hair. So it's pretty clear the silver hair isn't as dominant as it is iconic.
Baelor "The Hammer" is another Targaryen who didn't have the Targaryen silver hair. His mother was a Martell so he had a darker skin completion, dark brown hair, and brown eyes. Many bigoted nobles hated Baelor for his Dornish appearance.
I mean hair aside, the kids a completely white while leanor isn't. Like I get that he's mixed as well but like come on the kids are literally snowflakes
That was honestly such a weird choice, especially since the whole plot of GoT literally started from the fact that Baratheon features pretty much trump anything.
The seed is strong, but not this time baby.
What did you say about my bitches hair homeboy
How does that long take show Rhaenyra and Laenor disliking each other? If anything, it shows their friendship and understanding.
Agreed. They don't dislike each other but aren't fond of their situation.
Honestly I just see them as friends with benefits
@@Chadius_Thundercock friends with babies.. I don't think they have benefits.. that was Harwin's role :)
@@misterhenchmen oh I thought laenor and rhaenyra were doing it but laenors dick didn’t work on women
@@misterhenchmen roommates (nominally) raising kids together
To be fair, what made me sympathize most with Rhaenyra in that first scene was just how joyfully she looked at her baby. Rhaenyra is a great character but she was in need of some redeeming characteristics at this point, so having her be a loving mother is a nice thing to see.
I agree with you, this episode made me much more sympathetic to Rhaeynra, however I will point out that Cersei also loved her children (and had good cheek bones) and that was her one redeeming feature. Not saying that this the case with Rhaeynra but I just think it is ironic.
So true
@@Sam_Kings Well, there are a LOT of similarities between Cersei and Rhaenyra. Another big issue is that both place massive bombs under the stability of the realm by mothering bastards and passing them off as legitimate heirs to the throne. Rhaenyra may look like Daenerys (which is why many normies root for her I think), but she is a lot more like Cersei in her character.
@@frankvandorp2059 I feel like Alicent is more like Cersei. Rhaenyra isn't a perfect gem, but she did have the rightful claim to the throne and while they may not have been Laenor's children, they were still hers and as she was the one with the claim, her children by her were rightful to the throne.
Cersei endangered the realm by passing of her own bastards off as the King's, so the line of succession was broken.
@@frankvandorp2059 I think Rhaenyra is a more likable iteration of Cersei and Alicent is a more dislikable iteration of Catelyn.
I think people underestimate how much GoT benefited from the variety of setting and story arcs - you had the politics in king’s landing but also adventure with the night’s watch and in Essos. People who find HotD boring probably miss the adventure, action and an ensemble cast like GoT
We also miss our white meat baby faces, the Starks
@@theelectricprince8231 the starks will arrive in hotd. And with a fury.
I don't think the creators expect people to weep for Harwin and Lyonel tho... I think it was more about Larys...it really established the character as cut throat, very unpredictable and intriguing.
Exactly. People don’t understand the story very well. Harwin was nothing more than a lover to Rhaenyra.
People liking Lyonel for putting the realm first, and even trying to give up the position when he knew he was no longer impartial, was pretty good. Especially as he’d been advising and been by the Kings side at these times as his health degenerates.
@lethabo maunatlala should've been nicknamed breakback
@lethabo maunatlala I think that’s the point, a strong man with so much potential unfortunately caught up in the brewing storm.
@@ragnarok283 We understand the story just fine, we just needed more time with these characters for their deaths to mean something and to feel the impact it would have had on Rhaenyra and Daemon. The pace was way too fast this episode.
You can see how much care and attention they put into every scene and that's great.
But it's frustrating that they feel the need to move forward so quickly.
Yeah but it really is difficult not to rush because the story is told over I think 30 years and the most relevant things are still to happen in the last 3 years
I don't think they'd have enough material if they were to stretch it more, okay they could have given us some more time (maybe an extra episode in runtime - but idk exactly what the season end is so-) so I find this pacing to be fine
They have to since the events here are described by like 1 or two lines in the book and this season isn't even what the shows about, the dance of the dragons
They have to rush bc THERE IS NOTHING IMPORTANT IN THE 10 YEARS OMGG Thats how the book tells the story
They don't feel the need, there is a need. The prologue is very important but it's also the slowest part of the story from a plot point. If I had to blame anybody it's GRRM for spacing out the events of the prologue so much. But I doubt GRRM thought an adaptation was on the way when he wrote these stories so it's really not even his fault.
When she said "Bring him, we'll need all swords we can get." It was a nice touch. Diplomatic love despite attraction must be difficult but it shows she does care for him.
it's sad that laena and harwins death didn't have more build up
but i fear it's because in the grand scheme of things.. they were quite insignificant to the story..
.. which means we're probably going to see some brutal shit go down between rhaenyras and alicents families?
big time brutal shit in bound. we're 4 pages into the 600 page story.
@@bearpoos8696 bahaha thats a very good point
Trust me w hen I say that, unless they somehow skip some of the incredibly brutal but cool shit. There's going to be alot of incredibly brutal and cool shit upcoming, yeah.
"which means we're probably going to see some brutal shit go down" oh buddy. trust me. you ain't seen nothing yet
I doubt they’ll have the balls to fully show a particular scene from the books.
They literally needed to do just one more episode in between E5 & E6 so they can establish:
- The outcome of the Green Wedding
- Rhaenyra's adventures (and maybe love story?) with Harwin Strong
- How Visaerys gets to live for another 10 years even tho in E5 he was falling to pieces
- Daemon's decision to leave for Pentos and live with Laena and maybe their wedding
- Laena finding Vaghar
- Alicent's friendship with Larys
- Cole's faith after the Green Wedding and his friendship with Alicent. Why did he not choose to kill himself anymore. What purpose did Alicent give him.
- Establishing a little bit more of Larys' scheeming personality
- The relationship of Rhaenyra and Alicent after the Green Wedding
etc
They could;ve easily fit all of those things into one episode. And then we would've cared about Harwin's death or Laena;'s death and all the jump would've felt more natural.
I agree about Harwin and Laena, but these stuff wouldn't make a good episode or even a full episode.
@@adnansrour8790 They can flesh all of these points out though. Since the source material is so sparse they could have easily made up some fluff for an interesting episode. In the book laena and daemon are across the sea because it's their honeymoon tour. So have them visit some different cities, add a minor antagonist with a little twist to him, portray them as this fiery couple and you can make it work as a fast moving subplot. Or have Larys show how scheming he is by pulling some clever moves to help Alicent. But ultimately it's understandable if HBO wants only the actual civil war and they had to fight to even put any of this prologue in. If they're only allowed 10 episodes to build all these characters and cover 20 years, then they're doing a great job.
I think the health of Viserys has all to do with the switch of the Grand Maester. The former Grand Maester never really did anything usefull for Viserys's illness. In episode 5 the future Grand Maester suggests something that might be more effective for Viserys, but the former Grand Maester says that it "wont be necessary". And I feel like those lines where in there for a reason. Idk if his motivation was to let Viserys die in a grand conspiracy (maybe together with the Hightowers since they rule Oldtown where the maesters are trained or other reasons connected to "the grand maester conspiracy") or if he was just incompitent lol. Noticed in episode 6 that one of the small councill members wasent aware that they switched the conversation-subject, which might indicate the theme of the royal staff being there for alliance over actually being usefull xd
Spot on
Stop crying and just enjoy it
I think Viserys is just so happy to be a Grandfather and he won't let anything come in the way of his own happiness. He has so many boys!
Honestly one of my only problem with the show is how fast characters are introduced then killed off before we even get to care about them or how they change drastically off screen, really wish the show would take its time a bit more, the impact of a lot of those scenes is kinda lost on me because of it
(Just watched the video after writing this, glad to see I’m not alone XD)
they're honestly unimportant to the coming plot. they're mentioned VERY briefly in the book
Believe me mate, there will be more characters coming up, no less interesting than what we have right now
Those scenes aren't meant to have much impact, scenes like Ser Harwin's death are literally given 4/5 lines in the book. The whole point of the show is not to focus on small things like Game of Thrones or other shows do and instead focus on the bigger plot points that leads to the Dance of Dragons hence the time jumps and fast pacing.
This is really just the background to the main plot, more important characters are coming don't worry
I think the problem ist that the only others options would have been to leave all of that completely out and start with the main plot right away or a way too slow pacing.
"It's not just Tommen's corpse falling on them, but instead some sticky rain." I almost spit my coffee out LOL
The pacing is fast but when you look at the books we've not had that many pages. Also the main storyline starts now, and we've got a good enough introduction towards this world where I feel like everyone should understand everyone's motives etc.
I’m so mad that we were robbed of Harwin & Rhaenrya’s relationship :(
I don't care if its boring, I want a whole season of just Harwin and Rhaenyra together with their kids. And I guess Leanor too. Maybe a spin off miniseries called "Domestic Lives of Westerosi Nobles" where everyone is raising their kids together before they start killing each other. I want some happy vibes before it all ends in tears 😅
@@irenebondar1799 lmao, go back to your sitcoms then
The fact the eldest son, Jacaerys immediately realize that Harwin is his dad really shows how smart that kid is
We know almost nothing about Harwin as a character....and now he's dead.
@@danb9028 didn’t really know him in the books either
Larys Clubfoot's monologue when his family was burning alive was menacing, not to mention he was playing with and smelling the same flower from when he introduced himself and spoke of the "thriving foreign flower" , Maybe the flower represents Alicent.
Larys is such a cunning character that even his name implies that he's a love child of Littlefinger and Varys
Larys = "Littlefinger + Varys"
Nobody:
Absolutely nobody:
HOTD creators: This is a sprint, not a marathon!
This is precisely what I thought about this episode, I wanted more scenes b/w Rhaenyra and Ser Harwin and Daemon and Leana so we would've gotten to know their relationship and how close they were to each other. But I still absolutely adored every scene in this episode in of itself and it's easily my favorite episode till now, the new actors and actresses nailed their roles and I love them equally as the younger ones. And the character of Larys is something else man I can't even tell how excited I am to see where his story goes.
I think you hit the nail in the head with getting attached to Harwin. Watching this I literally thought he was a new character, only later, online I saw he has like a literal second of screentime. I really identified him by his armour, and when he dies and has it off it I barely recognized him, let alone cared. Not to mention that I could not believe they were in Harrenhall already. This could've been a super interesting tragic love-story, instead it is just a plotpoint.
Well yeah, that's exactly what it is in the book. Also his death in the show was more about Larys's character
@@schwaben4120 Yeah, but the point of adaptations is that you get to flesh out scenes. You know, like they did in GoT.
@@LPChipi the focus of the show is the dance of dragons war though... Everything else is just introduction after introduction. I just hope once the war start, it will slow down and focus on developing everything with attention more. So far I am enjoying the show a lot and despite all the rush I know Viserys's death will be pretty devastating.
@@saorisouma5841 Of course everything feels like introduction after introduction when they don't let anything breathe or flesh anything out.
Well yeah, it being just a plot point is…the point. His death was given a line of dialogue in the book and is insignificant to the Dance of the Dragons.
This Rhaenyra was so badass. Literally walking and climbing stairs after birthing a baby while still bleeding!
Definitely keep an eye on Aemond next episode 😜
I really liked that Aegon hadn't been secretly groomed by Alicent for kinghood, didn't have a.sense of entitlement to the throne, and seemed genuineky surprised he was going to someday have to battle his cousins. He seems to like his cousins more.than.his own brother. I honestly felt in this episode Aego was somewhat likeBle as opposes to the future serial.killer vibe feom Aemond.
The problem with splitting the set-up into 2 seasons is that the set up in the book only has enough content for like 12 episodes max. If we had two seasons half of it would be completely made up by the writers and it would end up just being filler. I think they’ve done a great job fleshing out characters where they can considering they’re pretty limited by the source material.
Is there a rule that a season needs to be 10 episodes? Why can't a season be 6 episodes?
@@randomstrategy7679 they are already rushing and you want 6 episodes? Remember how bad S8 was because of the 6 episodes…….
@@hellodigitalworld8224 2 seasons of 6 episodes makes 12 episodes total, which is more content than the current 10 episodes.
DON'T DIE, I need your post House of the Dragon episode breakdown/reviews. I look forward to them almost as much as the show ❤❤
apparently episode 8 will have the last major time jump and after that the actors arent gonna change, probably gonna be alot easier to follow after that!
I definitely feel like another episode before the massive time jump would have been welcome. It would have given us a chance to see a lot of big stuff that happened in the aftermath of the wedding and allow us to get attached more to some important characters this episode. Stuff like seeing the beginning of Rhenyra and breakbone’s relationship, Alicent helping Cristen and forging their alliance, Laena getting Vhagar, and her starting her relationship with Daemon all happened not long after the last episode ended so I feel like an episode about those things would have helped bridge the gap better once we got the big time jump. I don’t blame the showrunners too much though as they likely had a set episode count and a lot of content to cover in the time after the skip. As is it’s a bit jarring but it’ll hopefully be better now that we have established the new state of the characters after the skip decently well.
HoTD is really great so far, but I agree that the fast paced story telling can be a bit overwhelming. I personally can’t really see the show topping GoT just because in GoT at least we get to spend a good stretch of time with all the main characters. Like Tyrion,Jon,Arya… hopefully season two slows up a bit and gives us MORE time with the characters, and isn’t jumping ahead in time so frequently.
They are stopping the time jumps after season 1, if the quality of each episode remains consistent I think it could possibly match GOT in the later seasons, even GOT took a couple of seasons to really get going
i think they did this because in the book it’s just 250 pages long and many of pages cover the actual war itself rather than the build up.
I feel like they're fast forwading every episode to way focus to the war storyline between Green vs Black. Hopefully, they don't rush it like Season 8 GOT. I want to see young Rhaenyra and Alicent more and Rhaenyra and Daemon's relationship and how is Daemon just okay to marry Laena?
apparently there are loads of deleted scenes so I fell if they added them it would slow the pase down a bit and add more depth, but i'm loving it cos it feels like every scene is integral and keeps us hocked as viewers cos the writing is amazing.
I think we needed one more episode with the young actors. Feel like there was a lot we missed
the pacing is insane, but I am impressed how each actor in each scene tells so much of a story with very limited time, also good on the writers and director. like Harwin's looks w/ Rhae and glances in the courtyard
“A woman’s battle is the birthing bed” is a common sentiment in these books (especially Fire & Blood), but we almost never see that battle, and never before in a way that supports and strengthens the woman doing the fighting; until now.
Would have really loved to have gotten an episode between 5 and 6 showing some of the plot points already developed in episode 6. Showing how Rhae and Hawrin's relationship developed, how Laena and Daemon's relationship developed, how Alicent saved Criston from punishment for his actions in 5, etc. I really like the plot points they hit in this episode; I just wish we had a little more time to build up to them because, at the moment, they feel rushed.
One issue I think they faced is that there's really not a whole lot in Fire and Blood about Harwin. Iirc there's a decent amount about the history and lineage of House Strong and Lyonel but Harwin himself only gets a couple of lines and mentions.
He's not really a character you ever meet or spend time with in the book unfortunately - it would have been nice if they could have changed that in the show, though I think they did do a *very* good job with the few scenes they have - just like you said it felt rushed and so the death was less impactful.
Basically you know he's Rhaenyra's sworn shield after Criston, they're obviously lovers, he's one of if not the strongest men in the kingdom, and the Seed is Strong. There's really not any kind of indication of the nature of their relationship except that Laenor was fine with it.
One thing they actually skipped was a tourney where Criston and Harwin fight, Criston plays dirty and injures Harwin so badly that afterwards they call him Brokenbones rather than Breakbones. They also seem to have dropped the sort of implicit but unstated connection that Ser Duncan and maybe even the later Baratheons have ancestry from surviving members/bastards of House Strong.
I quite liked how they did the jump - the overall impact of it is to show that Daemon and Rhaenyra both settled down and TRIED to be happy, but ultimately end up alone again, albeit now both with children. This is a good juxtaposition against the previous episodes which built up their “lone wolf” personalities. The stage is set for the dance of dragons, and we care about all of the characters that will take part.
Just chills when you hear Bobby B's voice in the 7th episode trailer
what?
@@dayarih1217 Just watch the next trailer, you will understand
Saw this comment, watched the trailer but no Bobby B for my ears :( What did he say?
@@StartTheJoust same
Huh? I think you’re hearing things…
Well, the story is from the books, and the show is mainly about Dance of Dragons, so it needs to be fast paced. The first season is basically a prologue to the civil war, and honestly in that period of time maybe a few interesting things happen. We need to see some of these characters like Joffrey, Leana or Howard in the first season, and also see them die in that same season or even episode so that we understand motivations and stories of characters later on. If we wanted to see more of them we would have two or three seasons of following the peaceful life in King's Landing, Pentos, Driftmark and so on and it would become boring really fast.
They could have had a few more episodes this season though to flesh out the relationships and make the deaths hit harder
I thought the pace was moving fast too, until I learned that literal seasons worth of stuff happens during the Dance. And much like Ned’s death caps off the first season of GoT and kicks off the War of the Five Kings, Viz’s death caps off the first season of HOTD and kicks of the Dance of the Dragons
I hated a lot I this episode. Leana's death made no sense logically, she just "didn't wanna die on the birthing table". But how on earth would nobody follow the woman ACTIVELY IN LABOR until its too late??? Makes absolutely no sense
That's not a lot , thats just one nitpick
@@xarmanhsh2981 I also hated the introduction of larys, he seemed evil for the sake of being evil
I agree that the pacing is a bit too fast, i think a longer season would have been cool, but hey the show is still fantastic as it is and once the dance of dragons begins is going to be even better
If only there were 12 or even 15 episodes. Too bad they’re limited to 10, I can sympathize with their constraint and what happened during filming. Hopefully they will have more time next season.
There not much from the source material. Most of the events are from when they are adults.
I think HBO was unsure how successful this would be. That's why they're rushing to the war.
Now that it's a gigantic hit, hopefully they will let the story breathe in future seasons.
@@lpphillyfan That's 100% it, like the show wasn't renewed until the airing of Episode 1 so obviously, they were writing the show without knowing there would be a season 2 so they couldn't just focus on the boring set-up
Goodluck on the hurricane man, great video 💪🏽
Hope you and yours are all doing okay in the midst of the hurricane. Thanks for the great content! I agree the pacing was fast on this one. I'm not super familiar with the book so I don't know how much content they're trying to get through and over how many seasons, but it does feel we're moving quickly. I'm fine with it all the same as I'm just along the for the ride, but I do think some emotional attachment to some of these lesser seen characters would be welcome.
I think we should’ve been introduced to the older characters in season 2 the beginning of season 2 , it woulda been way cooler , I woulda loved to see sir harwin and the princess’ relationship start to developed and how it started to developed and , I would’ve loved to see how daemon basically got cast away somewhere , like I think the biggest problem is the pacing like how on I wanna see the dance of the dragon too but let the audience ease into it
Dude, we got hit by hurricane Fiona a while back. Overflowed all our rivers to an absurd degree. I wish you and your people safety and all the best.
Love the breakdowns and your thoughts, would also love to hear some more on Rings of Power, now that we have seen a little more
Definitely agree with your point about splitting this season into two separate seasons. All of this backstory we're getting this season is important for the actual Dance of The Dragons, but it feels like they are rushing to get to it instead of flowing to that event more naturally. IMO what makes it an even greater flaw that they're rushing past these events is that people are actually responding really well to this part of this story and are loving it. This goes to show that people probably would've loved the show even more if season one was split into two seasons because when you boil down almost all of the criticism for this show so far, most of them come down to the rushed pace and would've been fixed if the show had more room to breathe.
House of the Dragons does everything right for me! 🔥 I really can‘t understand why people have a problem with the timejumps. If there would be a bunch of fillerepisodes people would complain also just like it‘s now with RoP. These timejumps are necessary because we are in a kind of „prolouge“ for the main event. Yes these leads to the fact that the viewer hast to put his head on. But i think it‘s great that we get a show that takes the viewer serious and not dumb!🙏🏼
(Sorry for my englisch)
people need to hate something
I don't think people would complain because the characters are a lot more interesting in Rings of Power.
I actually think Harwin's death was quite impactful. Maybe because I kept my eye on him anytime he showed up on screen this season, knowing he would become involved with Rhaenyra. But I noticed how he was one of the few people impressed by Rhaenyra's boar kill during the hunt , the fact that he ran into her during her night out with Daemon but didn't expose her, how he hauled her away from the chaos of the brawl at the wedding. I think he respected Rhaenyra before he came to love her which is why he was fine with just being her paramour unlike Crispin. He never felt the urge to possess her or try to influence her and that is just so wholesome. And in this episode, how he was such a doting father and honourable man really made him stand out amongst the Westerosi men like Crispin, Larys and Otto that put their own self interests above all else.
I've watched GOT as well and I would say Harwin's death has been the most impactful to me amongst all the deaths in the two shows. Perhaps I'm a sucker for a tragic love story, but Harwin's moments with Rhaenyra were the highlights for me and I wish I could get a whole season of them being happy together and raising Jace and Luke with Leanor.
I mean they had kind of been together for a decade so I mean he probably did possess her in always except marriage like I feel like after a few years it’s a bit more than a fling 💀
Harwin's death was pretty sad but no way it was the saddest among all the deaths in GOT and HOTD , like Harwin's death wasn't sadder than Ned, Rob or even obryne
@@genericanimegirl10 I feel like the fact that it was Harwin's brother that was responsible for his and his father's death was what really gutted me. Like how could you do that to your own family? It would have been less tragic if someone else had done it, like Corlys. The fact that Larys did it was so left-field for me.
Also, I started watching GOT after season 3 was released and I knew how and why Ned and Robb died when I got to their deaths so I was disengaged from those characters from the start. I also disagreed with their decisions that led to their deaths, they were too honourable for survival in GOT, but that's just my opinion. I didn't like Jon Snow either lol
Great video! Hope you stayed safe with the hurricane coming!
I’ve been refreshing so much waiting for this vid to drop today
fully agree, the show is excellent so far but I wish they gave us more time to bond with the characters. like even 1 more ep would've made laena and harwin's deaths more impactful to be sure
I agree we needed more time with my boy Harwin.
P.S. Stay safe
Great episode. Hope that your hurricane situation goes smoothly 🤞
People familiar with the source material (I know you said you aren't) can attest that this pace is what they need if they want the Dance to start by the end of the season. Then the war itself, which has a huge number of events they can depict, can last two to three seasons and they can end the show successfully without declining the way GOT did in Seasons 5-8. I wouldn't complain if they went slower and let us get to know the characters more, but it is what it is and the showrunners have said they only want to go for 3-4 seasons. I'd rather have the show intentionally build to a satisfying end point (although IMHO the Fire & Blood book doesn't really have a satisfying ending as much as it just cuts off and supposedly may have a continuation if GRRM ever finishes Winds of Winter).
Miguel Sapochnik mentioned on the HOTD Podcast that this episode was intended to be kinda overwhelming. If you think about it as a second pilot, the pacing makes a bit more sense, but it’s still a bit jarring for casual viewers who aren’t familiar with characters like Laena and Harwin and how they fit into the story
Let's see what they'll do with the next episode? It's not even an hour long & contains about 5 major plot points. If this episode f*cked up, they'll lose some viewers.
As a new father, I feel for harwin strong. He seemed like an asshole in all the episodes before. But changed my perception the second I saw him carrying the newborn. What a dotting father especially the training scene. Too bad that's all we get. Just when you start liking a character, very GoT lol
Criston going full villain is nice too.
what part of FL are you in? We are in Land O Lakes and just got a lot of wind and barely any rain. Sadly our vacay spot, Sanibel was utterly destroyed
Good luck with the hurricane ma friend. And awesome video as per usual
You truly feel like the last honest CZcamsr, it’s still good but you don’t suck the show off for the popular opinion thank you and keep up the good work
The show is good but people are praising it into oblivion just because of its existence alone not because it’s storytelling the show is average so far nothing that has really made me say holy shit or anything
You must not watch many CZcamsrs.
I disagree, well you see its not that they are skipping over content. Its just that the "real story" hasn't started yet. There is actually too much content to cover and trust me if some things are feeling rushed that's because they technically don't matter that much in the grand scheme of things so don't need that much time to be spent on them (like laenas and the strongs quick death). On the contrary im surprised they have gone through most of the season with just exposition stuff and still kept it interesting
Needed 1 additional episode dealing with fall out from last episode, the time jump and then set for this episode.
If I remember right, Rome did a similar time jump mid episode
Similar to house of the dragon or the explanation you've given
I think it was a great call to jump those 10 years, because u really need to give time to the kids as they will become really massive protagonists in this story. And btw if u are interested in aegon with that homelander analogy, wait till u see aemond
Laenor's death was rushed and confusing. Her labor isn't going smooth so she decides to kill herself and murder the baby? WTF? There was no build up to it at all.
Laenor didn’t die
Yeah because she probably heard what Daemon and the other dude were talking about which is cutting her up Aemma style
For me this really should have been 2 episodes at least, because both big deaths (Strong and Leana) had 0 impact, since we barely got to know the characters before them being killed. Compare this to Game of thrones where we would know characters for 6-8 episodes before them being killed.
But the rest of the episode i found to be at a good pace and i really liked how we jumped to 2 different locations Pentos and Kings Landing(sound familar?) . But it did make me want to maybe see a third Location being shown, maybe Driftmark or Oldtown, ,maybe even Sunspear since it seems Dorne will be playing a role in future events.
Impact wasn’t what they were going for. What they showed about these characters was everything we needed to know. Laena died because Daemon had to be a single father and Vaghar without master. Harwin and Lyonel died to show how cruel and ruthless Larys is. Now they need a new Hand of the King and Harwin’s only role was being Rhaenyra’s lover and that’s it. A major build up would have been a waste of time
This harakiri knight should at least look different past 10 years
Saw your title...I knew you would come around to this show😁
Also, I feel the show is fast paced because of its source material, which is essentially a history book of 200 years before denaerys's birth. So like any history, we get a few famous dialogues here, few key moments there. But mostly we glide through important parts of history, and do not concern ourselves with mundane lives of westerosis.
If you don't feel like you haven't connected with the characters enough before their departure, well, that's the case with the book too because the book is, as mentio Ed earlier, a history lesson through the eyes of pious masters and scandalous biographers in the form of bards, courtesans and court jesters
But awesome video as always.
Nothing against the new cast post time jump, but I really think they could have let the young rhaenyra and alicent actresses just have the whole 1st season
Season 1 is just really hard to tackle. For those who know the story, it's been clear that this season is building up so that at the end of it the dance of dragons civil war will start. The problem is that for us to care about the civil war they need to show us the whole backstroy of the main characters. Even though the civil war only lasts for like, 3 years, the buildup takes 20 years. So yeah this is why there are so many timejumps and this season feels kinda rushed. Season 2, 3 and 4 (if there is a 4th season) will consist of the the civil war only, so we will have no more time jumps and loads more time to get invested in the characters. This is when well see the true potential of the show. All things considered I think the showrunners are doing a wonderful job at adapting this story without it feeling to rushed or jarring. The decision to have the whole backstory of the civil war in just one season is a good one in my opinion. I would hate to have 2 seasons of backstory it would definetly unfocused and too slow if it were the case.
Yeah. I think people like the idea of 2 seasons more than the actual practicality of it. That is a decision that would age poorly in the big picture because any time you want to rewatch the show, a good portion of those first two seasons will feel pointless. I think a 12-episode first season probably would have been the best way to make the massive jump feel less harsh without overdoing filler but HBO has a hard limit of 10.
There is a little story in book, what do expect? There r 2 sentences for the death of Laena in the book? HARWIN AND LAENA R side characters, u dont need detail of their stories
As Jon Arryn would say, The Seed is Strong... Rhaenyra took that literally 💀
Just watched the episode, and it was definitely very jarring... Hoping some of the in between stuff will be explained further. For sure could have been an extra episode in between these last two. I feel like they just glossed over so much important stuff...
The show definitely benefitted from the 10 year time jump. So many new and interesting characters with intense conflicts, and it all feels cohesive. I have this huge feeling of dread because so much can go wrong now, I haven't felt such intensity like that since early days Game of Thrones.
Is it weird that I really want Rhaenyra and Daemon to get together?
Not weird at all it seems that with both their lovers dying the gods want them to end up together anyway.
I absolutely agree it should have been 2 short seasons or 1 longer season.
Definitely feels like we've rushed through some plot points and disposed of characters that we could have had stick around for a little bit longer.
Perfect summation of my feelings for this season and episode
One thing that bugged me about the dragonpit scene was that Helaena wasn't there. Wasn't she already supposed to have bonded her dragon at this point? Why wouldn't she be part of the same training as her brothers?
She had already fully bonded to her dragon by age 12 and had full control unlike her nephews and brothers. So she probably didn't need anymore training till dreamfyre got big enough to ride that's a guess
yeah I'm not sure. Unlike Aegon, Daeron (if he exists in show-cannon) and Rhaenyra's sons' dragons who are all recently hatched, Helaena's dragon Dreamfyre is about 100 years old at this point, and had a previous rider. Maybe you have to do less training with a dragon that already knows the ropes?
@@Mj_Jetson ah forgot how old the dragon was this makes more sense
The true twist to the story was the incoming hurricane. Paramount tension and great development to the story cant wait to the see the characters' reactions and how the conflict develops from this.
I've been loving the small details too. For instance, one thing I caught is the role of Valyrian. While it's shown that Daemon's children know Valyrian, the interaction with the Dragonkeepers shows that Rhaenyra's children don't. This both indicates Rhaenyra's disregard for old traditions and might be foreshadowing Daemon presenting himself as the "traditional monarch" in the upcoming conflict.
Also, I'm about to get hit by the hurricane too. Stay safe!
I will say this: they really made me care about Harwin and Laena in the little screentime they had, although more time would have been great (to explore everything you mentioned in this video), they did extremely well with the little time they had with everything.
I agree with your assessment- they need to take more time with character development
It was waaaaaay too big of a jump! Really pissed me off and a cheap way to do so.
8:36 perfect use of this meme LOLL
I love your reviews man never change it,iknow there's alot of comments that's disagree with you and I find it okay this how the show is supposed to be people having different perspectives.
I think these time skips are seriously hurting the character development/ story progression of the show. Also the petty drama in the family about the next heir is nowhere near interesting because there's pretty much almost no intrigue, mistery or even build up to make it more than just superficial. They would have been better off taking the show more slowly and giving the actors a better script.
I hope the show gets better after the Green and Blacks are introduced but these first 6 episodes pale in comparison to GOT S1, especially since it had alot more going on with many different story lines.
Dude there is still 600 pages of book to adapt we barely touched 5... a slower pace will put this show from 4 seasons to 15 and without time skips (which this is the last big one apparently) incredibly boring
in the book I was team black but in the show I'm finding it difficult which side to really root for. anybody else feel that way?
Yes, and that's good because there aren't supposed to be good and evil sides.
@@bruhmcmoment196 If anything I think Rhaenrya is just as hard to get behind as Alicent is but in different ways they are both as bad as each other imo and she's certainly not doing herself any favours by making bastards 🤣🤣
@@manvirshergill1739 Yeah, neither are really likeable, but both have some good points and most of their actions are justifiable from some points of view.
What is the last music you used?
I agree that this episode was paced a little too quickly. We just got introduced to these characters (some the older versions of previous characters) and then they just died and I’m sitting here going “oh, ok. So much for them I guess”
It’s weird how alicent went from being sweet to how she was in episode 6
Alicent wasn’t sweet at the end of Episode 5😅 she was clearly mad. That was the moment she “changed”
Not really. We saw her character shift to a more colder one in Episode 5 where she realizes that Rhaenyra has lied to her and that resulted in her father being fired. So she deems her untrustworthy and that keeps getting solidified as Rhaenyra has not 1 but 3 bastards but the crown recognizes them as legitimate despite it is plain as day to everyone that they are not Laenor's kids. And as her distrust of Rhaenyra increases so does her paranoia that her children are going to be unsafe and that manifests in an obsession to crown Aegon. Doesn't help that her two best friends at court are an incel who has it out for Rhaneyra and a sociopath who wants to stir up trouble.
If you think she changed out of nowhere, you might want to rewatch the previous episodes again. They have set up her character very well and the way she turns out is very believable
@@GabrieleTarallo I know, I guess the 10 years we didn’t see changed her even more
10:04 It will be very surprising when it is revealed exclusively in the series that Larys' legs are actually disabilities caused by Harwin accidentally due to his strength when they were child. Lord Strong then forced to covering it as that Larys has been disabled since birth...
I agree with you on most things. I think they should have waited until next season to time jump and switch out the actors
The Dragon Trainer dude sounded like Jabba the Hutt speaking Huttese and I really enjoyed that moment, not just because it felt like a reference somehow but really because it reminded us that the Dragons and their trainers are from a forgotten culture.
Agree with the overall summary. A heck of a lot happened in this episode. But it'll hopefully be worth the payoff when he get into the meat of the story. The 'Dance of the Dragons'
*The* *Greens*
*Alicent:* Most newbies aren't getting it with her. It was Emily's whitewashed version of her that went 180 on Alicent's real character. The older versions were casted first and probably shot their scenes first. That's why they were the ones featured in the teaser last year. How Olivia is portraying Alicent is more accurate. She is more of a manipulative b*tch like Cersei.
*Otto:* Dubbed "Middlefinger" and a rival to Daemon. One of the most hated characters in the Dance and in ASOIAF lore. The one who helped started this whole mess by pimping his daughter to the king and ratting out Daemyra.
*Larys:* Probably the worst character in the series just in terms of morals and ethics. The Littlefinger of this series. We just witnessed him hiring prisoners to kill his father and brother without any remorse. So cold.
*Aegon:* We're already seeing what a d*uchebag he'll turn out to be by going full Homelander. Imagine if Bran witnessed this instead of incest? Bran would stop climbing up walls thinking he's Spider-Man. Be blinded by Aegon's "Splatoon".
*Aemond:* The only bad-ss from the Greens but also a bigger d*uche than his uncle. Escalated a war. Drew first blood. Aemond will be my 2nd fav character once HOT D is done but I'm aware he's more of a Daemon wannabe who will never be as great as the original. A poor man's Daemon.
*Criston:* Incel.
*House* *Lannister:* *Jason* *Lannister* has got to be one of the most unlikeable d*uchebags in the TV series. He's an even bigger moron than Ser Crispin. Just saying the name Jason Lannister makes you want to roll your eyes.
The only likeable Green is really Helaena and guess which d*uchbag she ends up marrying and having children with? We don't see Daeron in Ep 6 who happens to be the youngest child and less problematic son of Alicent.
How the hell do people root for the Greens? Because they think Alicent is pretty? They have the most and biggest c-nts in the series. People rooting for the Greens would be like someone rooting for Germany and Japan during WW2.
The Blacks have Daemon Targaryen, rider of Caraxes, wielder of Dark Sister. The only reasons most fans with eyes and a brain needs to root for the Blacks. Jace, Luke, Baela, and Rhaena are better kids than most of Alicent's kids.
Velaryons are the most likeable family in HOT D and they're siding with the Blacks. Starks are the most likeable family in ASOIAF and they're siding with the Blacks. Blackwoods and Brackens hate each other and they're siding with the Blacks.
*Dragons*
1. 💚 *Vhagar* (Aemond)
2. 🖤 *Caraxes* (Daemon)
3. 🖤 *Vermithor* (Hugh Hammer)
4. 🖤 *Meleys* (Rhaenys/Rhaena)
5. 💚 *Sunfyre* (Aegon II)
6. 💚 *Dreamfyre* (Helaena)
7. 🖤 *Silverwing* (Ulf the White)
8. 🖤 *Sheepstealer* (Nettles)
9. 🖤 *Syrax* (Rhaenyra)
10. 💚 *Tessarion* (Daeron)
11. 🖤 *Seasmoke* (Laenor/Addam of Hull)
12. 🖤 *Arrax* (Lucerys)
13. 🖤 *Moondancer* (Baela)
14. 🖤 *Tyraxes* (Joffrey)
15. 🖤 *Stormcloud* (Aegon III)
16. 💚 *Morghul* (Jaehaera)
17. 💚 *Shrykos* (Jaehaerys)
18. 🖤 *Vermax* (Jacaerys)
I've counted 18 dragons. There's a chance they won't show one of the kid's dragons, Vermithor, or Silverwing by excluding Hugh 🔨 or Ulf completely. So far, we didn't see Daeron. If he's excluded, then there would be no Tessarion.
The only two dragons that matters to me are Vhagar and Caraxes. If you want to extend it by including Vermithor, Meleys, and Sunfyre, that's fine. Only five real heavy-hitters in the Dance and Vhagar and Vermithor are extremely old.
How I listed them is based on power rankings from this Reddit post...
www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/ddurt4/power_ranking_the_targaryen_westerosi_dragons/
Really wish they showed when Laena claimed Vhagar at the age of 15 or only 3 years after Viserys rejected her for Alicent. So Laena already claimed Vhagar before the Green Wedding. In the book, it's Alicent pushing Aemond to steal Vhagar in order for their side to stand a chance.
The Blacks have less c-nts and more dragons. Go, Greens! 💚 🤣 Be different. Be the contrarian because you want to be the smartest person in the room like you're Kyrie and want to stand out more by rooting for obscure characters nobody cares about or has no real importance to the story. The Greens are a joke to most fans but go hate on Daemyra and root for the losing side.
_
TV writers are making Daemon look worse than he actually is. Cut out the scenes of him hugging his daughters after Laena dies. Made him look like a bad dad when it's the total opposite in the book. Is one of the TV writers Mushroom?
According to Mushroom, Daemon is suspected killing most of Westeros. Mushroom ratted on Daemon about sleeping with Rhaenyra. And Daemon was a suspect to Mushroom when it came to Rhea, Harwin, and Laenor's deaths. In the book, it's never mentioned who killed Rhea. For TV, they made sure it was Daemon.
We now know Larys is the one who killed Harwin and Lyonel. At least the TV version. Why would Daemon kill Harwin? Daemon knew Harwin was the father to Nyra's kids. They're homeboys who fought together with the City Watch and Gold Cloaks. And Daemon fought next to Laenor and happens to be his nephew and brother-in-law.
I swear if someone slips on a banana peel, Mushroom will find a way to blame it on Daemon.
daymn daemon... you planning to write a book or some sh*t?
Are you ok...bro???
If you call Criston Cole an incel, I already can't take you seriously. It shows your obvious failure to understand the character's perspective, if there is anything he is upset about, it's that he is NOT celibate anymore by sleeping with Rhaenyra. Which makes him the direct opposite of an incel. Please learn what words mean before using them.
Ignore people hating on your essay here. I enjoyed it. Haven’t read the books so enjoyed a bit more context over what’s happening in the long run.
You’re also absolutely right that the Black side is by far the easier side to sympathise with
Your blind favoritism of the black is very clear. Daemon is not a great guy either. He killed his wife and groomed his niece. Rhaenerya is no saint either. She is spoiled and stubborn and was even sarcastically given the title “the realms delight” because viserys always turned blind eye to her wrong doings ma seems you already the books so you know that the blacks are equally bad as the greens. Also aegon isn’t even that bad he’s just a boy going through puberty.
When people say 'the show is boring', it's cause we as the audience don't get to see the consiquence of anything. Every episode is like a mini film, so there's no emotional investment to deaths/battles. Probably studio meddling as you mentioned. They've still done a great job of introducing all the conflicts/world building.
For those who know what's coming though it's a different story, it's all epic set up, lots of improvement on Fire and Blood.
Now the set up is done though and the dance will begin and everyone will see how great this can be! 🙂😊
Its important to note that the book is written as an in universe history book of events. That's why there's so many time jumps