This Prototype AIO works without Pump and is Amazingly Quiet
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- čas přidán 16. 06. 2024
- More Information about Hetzners AX162 Servers:
htznr.li/der8auer/AX162_en
IceGiant Cooler:
• 2-Phase-Cooling? How d...
Wieland AIO:
www.wieland.com/en/solutions/...
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Support me on Patreon:
/ der8auer
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Music / Credits:
Outro:
Dylan Sitts feat. HDBeenDope - For The Record (Dylan Sitts Remix)
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Paid content in this video:
- Hetzner Spot
Samples used in this video:
- Wieland Cooler
Timestamps:
0:00 Intro
1:03 Hetzner (Advertising)
1:47 Test system
2:27 Problems with the 240 AiO
3:05 Makita inspection
3:14 Benchmarks with "240" AiO
3:46 Prototype from Wieland
5:25 Radiator & cooler
6:11 Installation of the Wieland cooler
6:32 The prototype in operation
7:25 Gaming benchmark
8:29 Room for improvement with the radiator
9:01 Cinebench
9:55 Thermal imaging camera
10:40 Temperature comparison
11:14 Summary/conclusion
13:18 Outro - Věda a technologie
Thank you so much for releasing EN videos, Roman!
thanks for watching them :)
Me too. Thank you.
@@der8auer-en same here. I dont think it is stated enough, but I am very grateful that you take the time to make videos in English as well.
Twice the amount of effort should not go unnoticed. Much appreciated!
My cat Mauser says hello to his favorite CZcams feline friend.
He's jealous of all that open desk space to lay on.
@@der8auer-en how did that ai voiceover language app go? Good but not ready yet? Maybe Paul did it but I thought u tried it too so you didn't have to record the videos twice
This! Thank you!
Asetek in shambles.
They have been for a while once companies like arctic cooling, deepcool, and ek finally got around their patents.
GOOD
Asetek: "We have a bunch of the patents for pump on block cooling solutions so we're gonna need you to pay a licence fee right meow!"
Wieland: "All right then, keep your pump secrets" *pumpless straw sucking pumping (no)noises*
I actually really like how plain it looks tbh, the prototype is giving me industrial design vibes and it's probably something that would look at home in a server chassis, I wouldn't mind also seeing the mounting screws be flush with the surface.
Absolutely. I'm running a 14700k in my NAS/Server on a stock cooler (mad I know, but it was the number of cores I wanted rather than the boost speed and it was a straight swap from a 12400). It can fit a 240mm AIO, but I'm nervous about running an AIO 24/7. Something like this is more appealing as it should be more reliable than a pump.
Asetek: "pay us meow!"
Wieland: "i drink your milkshake!"
Asetek and pump secrets are oxymoron's.
I'm not a fan of RGBs, and I would be happy to have this industrial look in my case.
There's someone likely with a patent on thermosiphon, but then I'd love to see the counter claim and prior art defense.
As someone who does patent tech, the whole field is weird.
I'm interrested by this. No pump = no failure and no noise. This is why i got an air cooler right now.
I just got a massive cooling block, no air or water needed. Just a soft air flow from the case fans and dust blocking fabric over the inlets. Much less power consumption this way. I already have a radiator in my room, no need for an additional dust capturing one.
These fans only draw power and dust into our machines and now this genius is telling us we should ad some water to the mix. His pc is running at 40°C doing nothing while mine does 30°C at room temp. 40°C would be 100% cpu at my end.
no chance your pc is 40c at 100% for more than a few seconds unless the tdp is locked to like 50w and/or sitting outside in Siberia@@googleaccountuser3116
it can still leak tho
111q+aa Q1😊qqa@@googleaccountuser3116
@@googleaccountuser3116there's no way you're getting 10 degree lower idle than a water cooled pc with a passive block (???) of metal
I would take the 8 degree worse performance for the sake of not having a point of failure such as a pump in my system. As you said, "Impressive"
It'll likely be a hell of a lot cheaper than current AiO's due to far less plastic components, PCB's, pumps, software integration ETC.
8 degrees less is basically a air cooler
Even more impressive would be to scale it up (like the Ice Giant), so it would be capable of 300-400w of heat dissipation. 280mm or 360mm and perhaps larger tubing?
Even more impressive would be to scale it up (like the Ice Giant), so it would be capable of 300-400w of heat dissipation. 280mm or 360mm and perhaps larger tubing?
@@milescarter7803 I like your thinking 👍
This product looks promising and I hope it would be launched successfully like the IceGiant
I wish ice giant would release a unit designed for am5 and Intel, respectively. For their consumer side cpu's. Currently ice giant's offerings are designed for amd and intel server cpu's. So they don't function right. When used on consumer cpu's. I really wanted one for my build. I was disappointed when I saw the reviews.
I was strongly planing on buying that product for my latest build, but the reviews scared me off that. Didn’t seem to have the extra cooling ability I was hoping for without the point of failure of a 360mm AIO.
The block is aluminium probably to stop galvanic corrosion. The radiator appears to be a microchannel design used in automotive air-conditioning that can withstand high pressures of up to ~450PSI. The cooling tubes are not open but are bridged internally to hold pressure and to aid in exchanging heat from the fluid to the surface of the tubes.
If let's say they are using something that isn't water like 3m novec, would galvanic corrosion still be a problem?
@@Marcos-ee7nt It depends on what's used, either case they could also maybe plate the copper block with aluminum to prevent that without a change in liquid formula i guess
Only if the rad is aluminum. I learned the hard way with an AIO that had copper block and aluminum rad. Ended up using a custom setup with copper block and rad.
That's insightful, have a like kind sir.
you can nickel plate it!
I hope this will become the new standard. Not having a high pitch noise is obviously a big deal but in my opinion what really sells the idea is that it essentially combines the biggest benefits of both current AIO models (easy to fit in cases that have no space for a giant cube) and air coolers (no pump to fail on you).
I would love to see diy fan foam or tape mod to see if escaped air makes a difference.
Or just turn it into a pull configuration...
@@The_Noticer. Static pressure also helps on cooling, so the tape mod should perform better
@@The_Noticer.If you look at 5:25 you will notice the same problem exists on the other side, so that would also have wasted air.
@@matheusdesouza565static pressure always causes recycling the hot air in the case as per my experience and how automotive cooling is designed
I feel, since this is about a prototype, this was one of the missing points in the video. Perhaps der8auer didn't had the free time.
what do you mean nothing matters on the prototype! everything matters! IT IS GORGEOUS!
This could definitely look great in an industrial mech build as is, yes! (I do agree that the market for this is way smaller than for a discreet sleek black one, but it's still cool in its own right.)
Pretty much as it looks just like an oil cooler from a car.
Best part is NO RGB! I love it!
@@1kreature RGB cools the extra 10c cause it is so cool 🌈
Things that I would like to see for further testing with this AIO, if possible, would be how it performs:
1. with those radiator gaps filled
2. with pipes straight
and as additional tests, that would be worth knowing for SFF:
1. with radiator mounted on the side (so maybe more convection in the radiator itself?)
2. on direct die (edit: whoops I forgot that it's aluminium)
I know that this all would be very time-consuming, and thus these are only suggestions of (maybe) interesting tests, seeing any of them would be equally interesing.
"2. on direct die with liquid metal" - on aluminium block? That would be fun to watch))
Regarding direct die with liquid metal, it's probably not a good idea as the coldplate seems to be aluminium, and aluminium is highly soluble in gallium.
Liquid metal + Al cold plate 🤔
Would be cool to see this with clear pipes to see what is actually going on. How the liquid moves around and so on. Interesting idea, maybe not practical for me personally at +250W load (12900K) but interesting and useful to someone else i'm sure.
You know what. Given the liquid metal suggestion is now dead, how about indium soldering it directly to the CPU core instead, if you want to test something in this vein?
during the flir segment its more clear by looking at the tubes which one is hotter, very intriguing stuff, copper block and improved fan mount could potentially close the gap with the aio, also no pump means no patent trolls can bury you with legal stuff *coughasetekcough*
Very impressive, if these get noticeably better than dual tower air coolers then I am switching. Great video
Most fascinating. For a 1st go at it they might be on to something ... for sure room for improvement! Thanks for the look-see ... we can always depend on Roman for the "off the beaten path" items.
would be an awesome product for micro builds since no wasted space on pump or tower for cpu, plus micro builds aren't usually the most energy hungry.
Oooo I hope these really do come to market - nothing annoys me more than AIO pump whine.
Tons of people always argue how AIOs are absolutely required for silent builds, and yet here I see one complaint about pump noise after another. Curious indeed.
And when the pump fails, that is were the fun begings
@@Lishtenbird If I had to guess the people complaining just slap in there and call it a day.
@SkinUpMonkey The pump whine is actually very noticeable under certain circumstances. They are more silent though than vacuum cleaner level of noise coming from fans trying to deal with all the heat. But they are absolutely not silent. Try sleeping with one of those in the same room as you while it's doing some type of work
@@marcm. Did you know you can change the rpm of the pump which then makes less noise without hurting the performance much like 1c at worse. I got custom setup but run the pump at a lower rpm when the pc is not doing much then bring the speed up inline with the fans which is based off the water temp.
Der8auer's content is always world class! Thank you 🙏
Great video. Really informative and I'm looking forward to the potential future of pumpless long-service life AIOs!
Never really wanted to use AIO because of the pump noises, pretty sure i am not the only one, this is definitely interesting indeed, and as you mentioned still a lot of headroom to increase temperatures, will be keeping an eye on this :) Would definitely prefer a 280 version.
The artic liquid freezer 2 i had, was more quiet than any case fan
The radiator fans rarely even spool
And pump was silent
The NZXT aio, pump is not loud, but the radiator fans love to spin up all the time.
The Artic was actually cooler as well
@@fepethepenguin8287 Yeah I heard people saying all that years ago when I tried water. Bought one, still made audible churning/trickling sounds so returned it
I don't know why people think a pump is so loud. A single fan will make more audible noise........
@@Apollo-Computers on most AIOs , yes, the pump is one of the more quiet parts. A few brands have noisy pumps. And a few high power custom loop pumps as well.
I feel the same, I don't think these people have used one, and are going on assumptions
I know some AIO's can be oddly loud but IME the pump is the last thing I'm worried about hearing. this is a cool benefit but never having to worry about pump failure is far more interesting to me.
In this house we obey the laws of thermodynamics!
Man...whys its always gotta be Wieland-Yutani Corporation at the heart of stuff like this. Maybe one day Bishop will learn his lesson... ( 😉 )
Well, the final Product may be released as "Casehugger! ;D
Always great that you're always looking at new, interesting things instead of just the same old, same old, think that the companies benefit greatly from your testing and feedback.
Have to say though of course having an extra 33% more water and radiator to flow through, of course it'll help and absorb some heat, of course it will be different from a 240 AIO. Would be curious to see it compared to a real 240 AIO.
fascinating proof of concept product. i hope they continue to iterate on it.
Very interesting exploring and testing this prototype ! Keep going
This has potential. Thanks Roman.
Really appreciate this channel … unlike some of the larger tech CZcams channels that have clowns giving advice, Roman actually knows what he’s talking about. This AIO is a fantastic future option.
One suggestion for improving the thermals of this system is to add some cooling fins on top of the cold plate and adding a small fan. Great concept.
Was hoping someone would notice that too, big missed opportunity for some fins and maybe an optional downfiring fan like what artic has gone on with their AIOs.
Cool to see you featured on their website page for this.
It makes sense that the prototype is made from aluminum and not copper. It's easier and cheaper to manufacture. But the final product has to be plated copper for the heatsink and copper for the radiator to have any chance in the current market.
This is quite interesting, thanks for sharing it. I hope it makes it to production.
Super cool product. Hope you get to follow it as it improves, and it does make it to mass market
Lol, I might 100% get this if it's released uk/eu. A water cooling convenience of moving the "radiator" with the simplicity of a heat pipe "air cooler". I'm so for this!
Why are you want "new" staff with x5 price to Air cooler with the same effectivity?
@@baks567 because it looks cool
I like the look of this prototype! Hope it comes to the market one day.
Very interested in this! Thanks for bringing it to our attention. Definitely one to keep a close eye on. 👍
Very cool product, thx 4 highlighting it!
wow thats pretty dope!!! ...nice vid thanks for sharing that...im very interested to see where that goes!!
This is pretty cool. Not having to deal with a pump is a huge bonus. If it performs decently I would consider it for a build...
Really interesting. thanks for covering this!
Very interesting! Thanks for showing us!
Interesting product, very well presented, as usual. Thank you! 🙂
This is very interesting! I looked into Wieland-Werke AG and they are indeed enormous! I was thinking that maybe this cooler might bump their stock, but they're so big this thing will have no impact even if it beats AIO's eventually.
I would pay 150 for that 240mm model , right now ! I need 2 , the lack of noise for my ITX builds is a dream come true !!
I would have liked to see you test it in a pull configuration to reduce the impact of that bottom gap and in different orientations. My main concerns are how difficult it would be to refill and if it can still perform mounted on its side. Not having a pump is great but every AIO I've owned permeated fluid long before I was ever concerned about the pump failing. Pump noise has been a negligible concern for me but I'm aware some AIOs are surprisingly loud.
Very impressive prototype overall. With a copper coldplate, improved fan mounting and no paint on those fins, this could get interesting if the price is reasonable. A thicker radiator would also help to make this standout.
For a moment I thought this was going to be a new version of that phase change AIO you made before
Very interesting, I like this mainly because of the no worries about a pump failure due to no pump. Making a better seal around the fans so that they are working at optimal efficiency will reduce temps also.
Very cool product, thanks for sharing !
I love the industrial look and the red on white color is unique.
That is really cool, I would seriously consider getting one if they release it someday
That looks cool also visually
Awesome, great content 🙌
I'm loving it. The water pump being an additional point of failure is the primary reason I don't run watercooling anymore.
Because you totally can't just run two pumps.
@@rustler08Not with the convenience of an AIO or air cooler you can't.
i really like the idea of no pump, less noise, can't wait to see that product on the market one day
The color combo looks great. Are those push connect fittings or compression?
Love this product! I even really like the red and white colour scheme.
I wonder if you can 'beef it up' to make it better? Obviously the fans can be improved like you said but I wonder if you made it twice as big would that improve things significantly or is that not how these kind of thermal siphon work?
I think I would literally buy it exactly how it is right now. I think the colors are really cool.
this is so cool! can you keep it for more testing? like see what happens when placing the radiator in different positions
I'm liking the 'industrial look' design.. emanating toughness aura
I have used AIO coolers for over a decade, and I most certainly would be interested in a pumpless one like this. If it's Made in Germany, I reckon it wouldn't be the cheapest option, but if there's no need to worry about a pump dying and especially pump noise, it could be worth a little bit of extra price.
What if Roman re-positions chassis so that CPU block lie horizontally and flip the "hot side" upward so that gravity help pull down liquid phase if there is any.
Old cars used to have siphon cooling, and yes tall radiators.
Interesting. The lack of noise as well as potential longevity compared to water AIO's is really appealing.
My guess is that this is a dual phase design based on the single pass radiator. With a single phase, I'm pretty sure you could use a dual pass radiator, but a thermal scan of the radiator in use would likely confirm.
Thank you for an interesting video on a very interesting tech! (less moving parts, yay! :) )
Love the innovation, I'll be buying one as long as it's not crazy expensive
Good news to see this type of cooler for consumer PC, and quite amazed by performance, it is holding a 7950X.
It's probably a single phase thermosiphon, easier to engineer and less sensible to placement (you could do front monting too).
For the tube going donward it is not a problem since it is driven by density difference at hot point versus cold point, if it is enougth to moove against gravity then it is allright (just dont give it too much head loss ofc, same for pumps).
Phase change seems more promising for permormance, thus it depend on the fluid I gess, but also less quiet so if it work as single phase that's fine for me.
8:30 that is done for noise. We do the exact same thing with regular radiators. It reduces air noise.
I am looking forward to this AIO. Hope they release a good product in the future
Hey, great review again. Question: doesn't it help if you place the radiator at the front panel vertically to give the temperature difference a help?
I want one :). I think that with some adjustments to air flow, it would perform as good as an AIO. Looking forward to the follow-up :D
That is impressive. Price would be the question? Other question that I would have is, does the heat plate over the CPU need to be warm... i.e. would extra fans inside the case blowing air over that area, actually make it worse/better/have no effect.
Really interesting product.
What's crazy is that you know you'll drop a few degrees in temp just by fixing the fan gaps.
Not necessarily, as it depends how the passive circulation works in the loop. Its not like the radiator seemed to be running particularly hot.
Would love to see more of something like this come to market. Less points of failure and with more tweaking like distance between fan and radiator and you'd have a pretty good cooler. Do wonder what the trade off or limit would be for something like this in the future.
Noise normalized thermals would be interesting. Maybe this actually outperforms the other cooler at like 25 or 30 decibels.
That is what I want to see too.
Interesting concept. Would be good to do an interview with Wieland in the future to learn more about their designs?
Pretty cool video, really seems like a great idea with no pump. Hopefully they can improve this and come back with something better.
Really exciting product development for people wanting quiet PCs.
@derbauer EN:
2 suggestions.
1) Put the fans on the other side of the radiator, it looked like there was a much smaller gap between where the fans would mount (although that maybe down to the video angles).
2) No clue how the cold plate is setup, but I would of expected the hot coolant to of exited out of the higher tube (out of the cold plate) not the bottom. I wonder if putting the cold plate the other way round (so Wieland is upside down), would provide slightly better results.
This is a great review. Thanks for making this video. I wonder if the lack of a pump also means less risk of leaking, due to less pressure in the pipes. The risk of leaking is the main reason why I've never used liquid cooling in my computer.
That cooler itself looks really cool
With all of the m.2 ssd coolers you reviewed, have you given any thought to reviewing external m.2 pcie enclosures? Thank you for being such a reliable person
I can't wait to see version 2
Great review as always. Could you use some strip of foam or rubber to cap off the airflow lost on the ends then remount the fans? If you could do that for an additional test and then raise the output side line to see if it affects the temperatures on back to back runs that could be insightful. I'm also curious what an automatic fan curve or much higher fan speed would do. Would it actually lower temps or have you already reached the thermal conductivity of the aluminum plate and fluid. Curious minds want to know! Cheers,
I was waiting as well for that prototype you showed at Computex, didn't know that the liquid was banned
This was very interesting. Hope there is a follow up video
Can't wait for V2 testing!
For a prototype, this doesn't look bad at all. I hope they improve those like you mentioned.
a very interesting product for sure !
Very intriguing
Im very interested in this and hope there is one that comes to market!
This is cool. Guessing it has to be in certain orientation. As in radiator at top. You mentioned air flowing from the sides, anyway to add paper baffles in the gaps to reroute and retest?
Looking forward to this tech.
Very interesting concept prototype.
I need a 360 variant just for the aesthetic alone, the simplicity is just an added bonus!
Super interesting, can be the future of "AIO" !
You can easily improve & retest it by putting the fans on the top of the rad rather than below as (badly) designed, and test outside of a case (or in pull mode)
Oooh... That is some nice looking product.
Looks like a good idea for low power CPU and low noise solutions
Very cool!
I really hope they make a mk2 with copper plate and improved radiator so they could be compared side by side
@der8auer @Wieland
This is very cool! I would happily buy this kind of product! A 280mm/420mm(140mm fan sizes) version would be preferred.
I love the look of the prototype and fans a lot. Very industrial. Could you contact the company to get more details about the inner workings etc?
Very interesting. Though I would've loved to see you close up the space at the edge where the air pressure leaks out and re-test if that improves the cooling.
Thanks for explaining single and dual phase. I knew the principle, but not the names for them. 🐱
I had a Swiftech AiO a while back, yeah I know, but it eventually had a pump failure as they tend to do. Thing is, I didn't notice until I really pushed it with rendering. Playing games and doing other productivity things it was still fine. Granted the pump could still have moved a bit of water around, but opening it up the shaft was well and truly broken off eventually. So it doesn't surprise me that a passive solution for water cooling would actually work if carefully designed. Certainly for most people that don't run games that use all of the cpu this would be a good option. With some refinement it could very well be a viable product for the middle of the road systems with overall lower TDPs, like your i5's and stuff. Good to see some actual movement on this stuff as well, feels like hardware innovation kind of stagnated the last couple years.
Very interesting concept.