Litespeed Watia gravel bike review: A magical ride, but old-school handling
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- čas přidán 28. 07. 2024
- Litespeed has been in the titanium game for well over three decades now, and as you can imagine, the heralded American brand has accumulated a fair bit of knowledge in that time on how to work with this mysterious metal. The Watia is the company’s latest gravel model, and as you’d expect (and hope), it incorporates plenty of clever thinking.
Check out the full review at CyclingTips.com: cyclingtips.com/2021/06/lites... - Sport
For the ultra posh setup, Litespeed needs to sell a pair of titanium fenders.
Thank you and that was one of the most thorough incisive non-hyperbolic reviews of a bike I’ve ever seen and I watch for a lot of them,
Good work Sir!
James thanks for the thorough review and stellar work as usual. It is a very nice looking bike and made in the U.S. is important to many of us, myself included. Worth mentioning too that originally the Lynskey family who started and ran Litespeed for many years are still manufacturing in Tennessee not far apart from Litespeed . Under current ownership Litespeed has fortunately retained their base of manufacturing in the U.S. (minus their short foray of carbon bikes that were poorly reviewed), I own two titanium bikes both were made by Lynskey. For those who haven't spent time on a Ti frame I can recommend them highly. Durability, looks and that raw Ti finish just appeal to me as a metal worker. Great review!
I ordered this bike the day after it came out and love it. My Watia has already been on a ton of adventures with me. The geometry was perfect for my crazy long legs and short torso
Not the bike for me then, I got short legs and long torso..
I also ride a Litespeed due to my long legs/short torso! Funny to read this.Enjoy your bike!
Been considering this one as well because I'm the same build! Interesting to read this - thanks!
I think this represents an amazing value for a USA made from that is better than almost any production frames available. In addition the modest $600 up charge for custom Geo or upgrade to T47 BB also is super cool that Litespeed offers these options at a lower cost than any custom builder.
Excellent review. Very informative, balanced and realistic. Thank you!
Personally, I think the geometry of the frame is more a thing to be noted, instead of a con. If you're going to be riding your gravel bike on gravel/dirt roads & trails and not the MTB-esqe technical stuff, having something more endurance-road focused is a good thing.
@James Huang Understood regarding fit. Agility and speed (you mentioned the agility part at 8:49). If you're buying a gravel bike to ride country roads, road geometry makes sense. If you're buying a gravel bike to race gravel, getting flat and low on a bike with smaller gaps b/w the front tire and down tube are good things. When I look at the routes for many of the gravel races, and published rides even outside the midwest (where I live) they aren't technical in a way that something endurance-road-focused wouldn't be a good choice. For the most part they are very focused on putting big miles, at speed, on the bike.
Personally, I have two gravel bikes (Lynsky GR300 / Revolt Advanced Pro) with exactly that kind of geometry, and I've never found it to be a con; even on technical single track, but most of the riding that I do on them is unpaved roads or trails where agility and speed are good things. Obviously, there are trade-offs involved in everything; if I was going to ride a lot of technical single track, neither would be the best choice. But, if I was going to ride a lot of technical single track, I probably wouldn't want to do it on a gravel bike either, unless I planned to ride 20-30 miles to get there.
Just to be clear, I do think there's a place for gravel bikes like the kind you want, I just don't think they are right for everyone (maybe not even most gravel riders). Which if that is true, makes the road focused geometry of this frame more a "thing that is noteworthy", and less a con.
Great review James. If I could comment on just point please, and that is the benefits of frame decals. I agree with you that electroformed, polished or etched frame graphics are aesthetically superior, but the benefit of decals is that you can easily replace them when the frame needs a refurb. Speaking as an owner of a beautiful custom Ti frame myself (Burls from here in the UK) I found that, over time, the frame picked up a few nicks, scratches and marks, as would any bike. But as my frame was supplied with vinyl decals for the graphics, I was able to recondition the frame surface using the red Scotchbrite pads and re-linish it. Once completed I cleaned the frame using WD40 and then IPA wipes (as advised on a Lightspeed CZcams video!) and then apply some brand new decals and the frame looks like new. Not a big deal perhaps, in the grand scheme of things, but Ti does enable this process as a way to aid its longevity, though perhaps only applicable to linished (not bead-blasted) Ti framesets. 🙂
Polished, etched, and even colored anodized graphics on a titanium frame are easily buffed out with a red scotchbrite pas assuming you are brushing the rest of the frame as well. Not sure why you think it’s hard to remove any of those 3 graphics options assuming you are hand brushing the rest of the frame with the same type scotchbrite red pad?
Very INFORMATIVE review =) Thank you
James is cool.
I would love to see a comparison between this and the Why Cycles R+ since both seem to run in the same price range.
Awesome job James.....Cheers! PJW
Hmm... on an other popular bikepacking website they made actual testing of diamond frames made from titanium, steel and aluminum. Under load they measured almost identical and neglegible flex of the frames. Within 1-3mm only and actually not noticeable. That was to be expected because a diamond frame is the lightest and stiffest frame design. Much more important for comfort were wider tires and a flex carbon seatpost and carbon bar. So instead of spending U$ 6k on titanium one can get better comfort with a cheap alu frame and a good carbon flex seatpost and carbon bar. 😉
Seems like some of the complaints with the bike are contradictory and could be solved with some fit changes; like maybe shorter crank arms and a longer (or shorter) stem (or just getting used to the feel of a gravel vs. a road bike).
I seem to hear a lot of reviewers complain about toe overlap and figure (myself included) that we guys always go for those 175 crank arms, when a 170 might mitigate problems with both toe overlap and pedal strike.
I wonder, as far as front end geo goes, whether just swapping out the fork for an ENVE Adventure fork with the flip chip set to its longer setting would do the trick...
Amazing bicycle and great review.
How tall ymare you and what size did you go?
Hi James, I noted your comment on the toe overlap (may I know your height and shoe size)?
I ask because Im thinking of getting this land in the: Medium size classification (per their size guide) and was wondering whether there is merit to going to ML instead? (I stand at 5’9 use Size 11 (US) shoes. Thanks!
Simple but awesome 👍
What is the compliance implication from the bar on the chainstay v a tube?
Great review. I’ve been looking at Lightspeed, Lynskey and Engima (based in UK) for my new gravel bike. Anyone have any experience with these brands or others? I’m looking at mid range with a gravel bike leaning towards road.
It looks really good. I have a lynskey gravel bike. I love it. I like the ride quality. It was cheaper than this bike. But it doesn't look as good as this one.
I have a GR 300 which overall I really like after 1.5 years of ownership. One thing I see on the Litespeed that Lynskey also does is the riv-nuts on the bottle cage mounts, which I don't like. I've already needed to replace one of the riv-nuts on the top tube bento box mount. I wish they would do welded bosses like Moots, Lindarets and others, much more durable but adds to manufacturing costs of course. I really like the geometry on the GR 300 too, it just fits superbly for me. Enjoy the ride!
No problem with using riv-nuts for long term durability if they are installed properly. If you had to replace yours that quickly it wasn’t because it was a riv-nut it was because they were installed incorrectly.
The aerospace industry uses the exact same type of riv-nuts throughout the fabrication of both airplane fuselages and wings and missiles. Those components undergo exponentially greater stresses than any bicycle riv-nut would ever in any situation encounter, and they last tens of thousands of cycles without replacement when installed properly.
Litespeed is still around? 🤔
Ok ill take it... thank you for breaking it in for me
can we have Litespeed build the bike with a flatbar in lieu of traditional dropbar? Thank you
James, how would you compare this to the Seven (Evergreen) you’ve written about previously?
@James Huang Very interesting, and thank you for replying. I've had a Seven Id8 for years, and added a Scott Addict for all road/gravel riding back in 2017. I've been looking to upgrade the frame on the Scott to Ti, and had been thinking of going with another Seven, but these have me a bit curious. What is it that you prefer on this bike? What characteristics are more to your liking?
Excellent review. Currently looking at a Specialized Diverge/Roubaix expert, but for nearly the same money I could get something similar from Litespeed which is based in my home state. Wondering if it is worth it! My dream bike is a Firefly, but I suppose a Litespeed would do?
I also live in TN. I like the Diverge, but I found the Lynskey Pro GR more attractive because: Ti more durable than carbon, better long-term value, handcrafted in state, lifetime frame warranty, 2X Di2 GRX, HED wheels, Ti stem, Ti setback post, Ti silver badge, engraved logo, upgraded ENVE fork, excellent customer service, and all for less than $6K (promo and negotiation). Note that Litespeed was founded by the Lynskey family many years ago.
Just last weekend, a nice guy from mainland China was peppering me with questions and taking pictures of the bike, saying he wants to buy one. Maybe to copy in Taiwan?
Personally digging the geometry as it is, for a Western European with longer legs.
Hello... Lynskey!
I have freaky big feet, so toe overlap and heel v. Mech are part of life
Very nice
Who makes those water bottle cages on the bike?
King Titanium Cages
Any comments if putting 30mm road racing tires on this and racing with my roadie friends?
That could easily be done.
Recently a guy finished 2nd in a local CAT 3 crit in NorCal racing on a 2003 model Trek aluminum bike with a 9 speed Ultegra triple, low profile aluminum clincher wheels, no power meter, and no bike computer on his bars. His bike is worth maybe $200 US. Most of the dentist types in the race were on $10,000+ Specialized’s and Treks with Enve or Zipp multi thousand $ deep dish carbon wheels, power meters, and Garmin computers on their bars. This guy trashed all but one of them.
Racing is about the motor, not the bike though many poser types and clowns think it’s about the bike and their credit cards. 😀😃😀
@@ivanboesky1520 Why is this a surprise? Indurain rode alpe on his 19lbs steel bike faster than modern riders.
Lynskey and Litespeed you can't go wrong.
warranty they give ain't worth shit. Buy a bike from manufacturer that honours and stands behind their goods. Once it's been ridden a few years they consider the bike to have outlived its use. Hardly supports the titanium is for life unique selling point that the marketing department propogate.
@@kc3718 And you know this how, Mister Helper?
Not mentioning Lynskey as the direct competitor in production volume and price seems intentional. Moots and Mosaic wouldn’t be cross-shopped with Litespeed.
Moots and Mosaic are both wildly overpriced overhyped “dentist” status symbol bikes.
I’d challenge anyone to claim they could tell any meaningful ride quality difference between a Litespeed, Lynskey, Moots or a Mosaic if they are built to similar geometries using similar tubes. The reality is a large portion of bike world members like many other endeavors enjoy buying perceived status symbols, and then rationalize that they just have to ride a lot better simply because their price is “through the roof”.
Having ridden over a dozen different ti based frames including both Moots and Mosaic there is nothing special or noteworthy about how either of them ride or handle. And given the completely silly prices that Moots charges for stock batch made bikes with little to no real custom options it’s laughable that they use the very cheapest way to finish their frames (bead blasting) rather than a hand brushed finish. Then they try to claim its bead blasting is superior when in fact it’s harder to maintain than a brushed finish and shows every mark without the ability to simply brush those marks and dings out. Bead blasting is all about cost savings for the manufacturer, it is literally the cheapest and worst finish from a maintenance standpoint that you can get for a ti frame.
@@ivanboesky1520 I bought a Lynskey because I could afford it but even so I did splurge (brushed finish, anodized logos, custom IndustryNine wheels). I do love it but I’ve always been curious about Moots and other high-end ti brands. Thanks for sharing your view on them since I thought I was missing something by not spending more than I really needed to.
@@ivanboesky1520 Will Litespeed go with 3D stamping on their frames? Is it better?
@@ivanboesky1520 I heard this before about Moots! I have both a Serotta and Lynskey TI. Both great rides
sana all
$6k and it still has a press fit bottom bracket...wtf.
Review ML and you wont complain as much.
Great review, detailed and well spoken. My takeaway: great frame - provided you do your own custom frame design.
Not exactly what I am expecting from a frame manufacturer. Many better carbon alternatives out there.
Never got all the titanium hyperbole, I think some just talk about how perfect it is but secretly trying to justify what they spent … and yes, I’ve ridden all the frame materials
Frame material has next to no impact on a ride feel, it's all about the design itself. As for confort, the tyres and seatpost are what makes all the difference.
The biggest pro of titanium is its longevity, other than that, anything else will do as long as the bike is purpose-built.
Same exact thing should be said with about 10 times more emphasis regarding carbon fiber, which often is used to produce silly stiff and uncomfortable rides that are then claimed to be “plush” comfy rides simply because the frame is CF. 😀😀
watchya or WATTeeyuh
Titanium are dinosaurs.
Stainless Steel is going to rule the metal road bike world.
@James Huang Steel can be built up stiffer and more compliant than titanium and is far easier (and cheaper) to manufacture while still offering the durability of Ti.
@@solitaryrefinement6787, then where are all of the stainless steel bikes? Note that material is only one variable that influences frame "performance".
Titanium is much lighter, doesn't rust and in a few years will be 3D printed as standard making all of them fully custom and taking away the only 2 disadvantages titanium has. Difficult to make and difficult to shape.
And my T1SL by litespeed is crazy stiff, I used to have the T2 the model below and I liked it better because it was less aggressive.
@@reginaldscot165 Stainless steel doesn't rust
@@treygray2817 all depends on the alloy. All being equal, stainless steel is 30% heavier.
As for stainless steel not rusting, look at a DeLorean DMC10, back to the future car. They oxidize. Only way to keep them looking good is to polish then polyurethane clear coat.
19.69 lb pig.
How much does your gravel setup weigh? My giant revolt advanced is 18 in an xs.....