The Day Friends Died
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- čas přidán 25. 05. 2021
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An exploration into the history of Friends, the aspects that made it special, and the one episode that sparked the show's downfall to mediocrity.
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*What should I explore next in my Day __ Died series?*
you should do the day 30 rock was born
For me Pirates died after the third one.
You should do the day Bojack Horseman was born
You should do the day black mirror died!
The day Brooklyn Nine-Nine died (I think it probably around the 6th season - all the characters narratives was worn out and I lost interest and stopped watching)
I used to really hate the Joey/Rachel storyline but it could have worked if they hadn‘t made Joey an absolute idiot in the later seasons. Matt LeBlanc always sold the character but they didn‘t give him the character development that he deserved. If they had used the crush on Rachel as a motivator for Joey to figure out what he wants in life beyond acting, it could have been pretty great. His family is barely mentioned (aside from his little sister). They never explored the son-from-a-big-Italian-family angle and that‘s a missed opportunity in my book!
They totally explore his family? The episode where his dad is cheating, the one where chandler kisses Mary-Angela? Someone needs a re-watch
@@jocewaitwhat came here to reply with the exact same thing
@@jocewaitwhat i meant in the later seasons when Joey/Rachel happens.
I definitely agree that Joey was the most underdeveloped character in the show. Which is sad, because he had so much potential as a character and I think Matt LeBlanc could've done a great job with whatever character arc the writers could've come up with.
Joey slowly got dumber and dumber as the show went on. If you watched an episode from season 1, then another from season 10 featuring him, he goes from a believable human being to....... Well, Joey. They took two or three of his character traits(Like being a womaniser, stupidity and loyalty), stripped him of all others and exaggerated them to the extent it wasn't believable anymore.
While Joey suddenly having feelings for Rachel came out of nowhere, Matt's solid acting ability managed to make it work, and Rachel gently turned him down. What I found the most unbelievable was Rachel randomly returning Joey's feelings after seeing him read a play, and having a heated dream about kissing him.
Have you ever irresponsibly fell for a coworker?
It wasn’t “returning his feelings” it was a 5 minute crush
This! Matt’s acting is solid and the only non cringe thing about it. When your actors are telling you no this storyline is not good you shouldn’t do it
Yeah I think that's the consensus. As a one off story, Joey's one-sided crush made for a pretty good arc. I actually see what the creator meant when he talks about "playing with fire" and "exploring a doomed relationship".
The issue I think everyone has is Rachel randomly returning the feelings. That's when it jumps the shark.
I highly agree with you in that first stretch of Season 8 episodes (he was nominated for an Emmy for the episode where he finally confessed, after all).
Chandler and Joey's bromance and friendship was always my favorite part of the show , the soul of Friends
Agree. IMO The first 2 or 3 seasons were near perfect. But the next 3 or 4 it gets heavily reliant on caricatures. After that it clearly ran out of steam. However it was always funny. It wasn't the stories why we loved friends, it's the fact it always made you laugh.
The chick and the duck were my favourite characters.
And monica and chandler were the the best love story
Careful. The most toxic fans are the ones who despise Kathy for "daring" to come between them.
@@danielebowman yep
The best word I've ever seen to describe Friends is "comfy"
Idk what it was like back at the time it was airing because I was a bit too young to care, but watching it in a modern setting is just comfy. You know there won't be anything serious, you just get to vicariously live through the lives of people you wish you were in a time period that is pretty nostalgic in 2021. If you're having a crappy day, or it's a cold Sunday and there's nothing you really want to do, you can just throw on some random episode and take yourself back
It's my comfort sitcom, I can just watch an episode and it would make me smile
yeah bro that's kind of the whole point of sitcoms. they all do that. friends isn't some comfort unicorn
This is exactly how I refer to this show and a couple of others. They’re my comfort. It’s not that serious to me and I can’t understand this deep analysis of a sitcom. This over analysing everything is what’s wrong with the world today. Being offended by story lines and jokes because everything is so PC today, is just plain stupid and a lame excuse to be outraged.
All sitcoms are like that. Friends is special because of the characters.
AGREE
Ross’ reaction to the relationship was hilarious. Even when the plot of Friends sucked, the jokes still hit.
I’M FINE, gets me every time
eeeeeeee 🤣
This comment is great
David Schwimer literally carried this show on his back, the guy is a comedic genius, he steals every scene.
Especially in the crap seasons he is the only one worth watching.
Absolutely agree.
Joey having feelings for Rachel is fine, it's believable to fall in love with your friend after many years, but once Rachel turned him down that's where that story should have ended.
Exactly.
For me the problem is with them actually hooking up. I just don’t buy they would both be willing to do that to Ross.
@@Tillyard86 but Ross was "fine" with it 😀
@@Tillyard86 they only ever kissed though. Nothing further than that
After Monica and Chandler’s wedding in season 7, they could’ve spent season 8 really building and solidifying how different the friends’ dynamic is. Everyone’s coming of age story could have been told properly and season 8 could’ve been the last. It could’ve ended with Monica and Chandler moving, Rachel taking that job in Paris (Emma would not exist), Joey taking some sort of responsibility in his career and dating habits, Phoebe finding Mike (probably not marrying him because it would be too fast for a proper arc, but at least implying she’s found someone to call home, since she never really had one), and Ross, idk, finally letting Rachel go and going to therapy lmao. Instead of dragging it on for 3 more seasons until everyone, especially Joey, is just exaggeratedly defined by one characteristic they were given.
that is literally the ending of How I Met Your Mother. most fans hated that....
@@hendrasetiawan5740 how?
@@marywallace3378 HIMYM's ending was hated because it undid the rest of the final season's plot, and BECAUSE the main character hooked back up with his series long crush.
Heads up on HIMYM's main character, by the finale (which is set ~15 years after the shows events) Ted was a widower with two kids who had long given up on his series long crush. Despite that, in the finale he goes back to her, ruining everything we learned about the two.
So no, if Ross and Rachel don't hook up, it doesn't make it a HIMYM style ending, it makes it the opposite.
that's very much true... after the 7th season it went kinda downhill
@@hendrasetiawan5740 i loved how i met your mother, in almost every way
Even if the show died before it ended, The Thanksgiving Episode with Brad Pitt will never not be funny.
I gotta agree, that episode was amazing.
“You dated her? We had a pact.”
@@gianna-the-lesbian9651 when Phoebe hugged him will always make me laugh
"Come on, just take off your shirt and tell us! 🙄" God that episode is good
We’re all part of the ”I Hate Rachel Club” when that ones on
"You had a cluuuubbbb?"
Whenever a show overstays it's welcome the characters tend to turn into caricatures of their caricatures. Amplifying whatever the audience responds to until they become unrecognisable. Which is why i would love to see your analysis of Frasier. A show despite being a spin off, running for 11 seasons, different writers, remained consistent to the characters and spirit of the show (99 percent of the time).
It can work out. Ross goes from a pretty bland "Not the one she realises she needs" romcom lead to an absolute weirdo. He has some of the best mini-stories in the second half of the show.
God I love Frasier so much. Would love to talk about it in some capacity.
@@EntertainTheElk Perfect.
@@KotoCrash Flanderization i think it's called. Joey became an absolute cartoon buffoon of a person.
After Chandler and Monica got together, she became the worst. I honestly found her one of the more relatable ones before that. But then she developed sitcom-OCD, but no one called her out for being aggressive, controlling, and paranoid. I guess they didn’t really do interventions on the show.
When Ross left Julie. She was great, had more common interests, was more mature, and was on his intellectual level. Leaving her for Rachel was a sitcom move, that only made sense from the perspective of heightening the drama. In real life, we mature, and often realize how poorly suited some of our adolescent crushes actually would have been for us. In sitcoms, nobody ever grows or learns.
Likewise, I felt terrible that Ross emotionally cheated on the incredibly sweet and patient Julie with Rachel, though at least she fell for his doppelganger in the end.
She was actually sweet making her hateable was really a dick move. if she had showed the "overprotective that it's suffocating" qualities from the get go. but she was good with rachel before their marriage it was Our dude that fucked up on the goddamn altar. and then her reaction was kinda over the top but understandable at the core.
This is why It's Always Sunny *thrives* in this! They have some character growth moments in some episodes and get right back to their awful selves by the end of the episode. The show establishes they are terrible people who are not supposed to be relatable, which makes the show so funny since we are not laughing with them but at them.
@@1daboi100 Well... that started with Seinfeld. Peep Show is also another great example. But I think that the key for Always Sunny is that it's not THAT big compared with other shows (The Office US for example). When you have smaller audience you can move with more freedom.
@@atharvadeshpande4749 I think you’re talking about Emily here, not Julie
I completely agree. Their romance was awful.
Let’s not forget, highly problematic as well
Yup
I loved their dynamic as roommates
When I saw the show for the first time, I was thinkin: "Alright! Here's where the writers started to run out of ideas"
Well it's not worst then Riverdale 😂 which actually doesn't say alot.
Also I kinda disagree. The initial run of episodes where Joey has a one sided crush on her I think is pretty good. It's a nice moment for Joey's character that makes him grow up, one of the few. I like how when he confesses there's not even a moment of tension, we all know she'd say no and she says it right away. It wasn't about "Will they, wont they?", it was about this womaniser character going after someone he'd never have; unlike pretty much every other love triangle on the show (Chandler/Cathy, Chandler/Janice, Ross/Charlie, Rachel/Tag etc.)
I actually see what the creator meant when he talks about "playing with fire" and "exploring a doomed relationship" in this first burst of eps.
I'll never understood why they revisited the dynamic though. It was over, Joey finished the arc and had grown up from it. As a one off, its an interesting plot. To do it again and actually get them together? That's truly a sign they had run out of ideas. Nothings a bigger tell than the extremely quick and shallow way they split up.
Hey i loved that too. Joey loving a pregnant woman by caring for her instead of bring shallow player could've showed some serious growth. They didn't really have to make him end up with someone in the end and he just could've been more serious about monogamy. And they made it clear in earlier episodes that Joey wasn't just a womanizer, he liked to have a partner too, just never and bothered going beyond superficiality.
But Rachel going after him really felt kinda incestous.
It would’ve been nice if it was phoebe who he a had a crush on BUT it ends in her rejecting him
+1
i never realized joey and rachel's relationship lasted so long
Honestly the smartest thing they did was jumping the shark in season 1, with Ross getting a monkey as a pet. Made everything else super tame in comparison
It jumped the shark in the first season then lasted 10 seasons?
@@jp3813 No don't worry
@@UriosEditz Rhetorical question.
You do not know what jumping the shark means.
This really made me think, that I, being 25 is in that time of my life the show takes place. Most of my friends are moving to different cities, some have started lasting relationships. I think I'm going to enjoy this time in my life while it lasts, but I'm glad for this realization, this introspectiveness, so I don't forget. Maybe these are some of the best days of my life...
Yeah, this video made me reflective too. It's strange because I'm at the age of the characters when the show ends. Starting my own family, having kids, not seeing my friends as much. It's definitely a loss of an old way of living, but a new beginning to a new adventure as well!
I'm 41. As long as you remain healthy, the best days of your life are up to you. Don't think of your life as a series of unrelated "episodes", think of it as something you are building, brick by brick, day by day. Every day builds on the last. Every relationship grows a tiny bit stronger or weaker, depending on what you did that day.
Build your life with an eye to the future, and you'll never need to look back with regret.
You should enjoy it, because once you’re at that age of settling down, your friends aren’t really ‘there for you’ in the same way. I’m still friends with mine, but it’s much less infrequent. People spend 60% of their time at work, 30% with their other half and if you’re lucky 10% with friends. It’s kind of sad, but I suppose you don’t notice if you’re happy with you’re new family.
Make the most of the time with your friends now. I'm glad I went on so many vacations with mine, and went out dancing with them etc., when we were in our 20s, because once they started getting married and having children, that all came to a pretty abrupt halt. That on top of career changes, moves, life stuff. We're all still friends, but it's definitely not the same.
@@laszlovincze5095 Thank you 🙏🏽
Ross and Rachel were both terrible for each other , but they also were terrible for the people who they dated on the show , maybe it was punishment for them or they really deserved each other
They were so codependent of each other. They were truly solemates which is why it was fascinating to watch them act foolish. Up until season 9 of course.
I miss these type of shows though. Shows that just follow normal people, normal interactions and normal life. No supernatural, no murders, nothing that is unrealistic or too out of the ordinary. Shows like Friends, Gilmore Girls, Anne with an E, All American, Dawson’s Creek etc that are just so simple but that’s the point. If asked to explain the plot you wouldn’t know how to but there’s a deep sense of comfort as you grow and watch your favourite characters do the same. Idk I just think this genre has pretty much died out and if nowhere near as made as it used to be and I wish that wasn’t the case.
I was born in 98 so my mom was obsessed with this show and always referencing it and of course I saw it on tv all the time. But I rewatched it about 3 years ago on Netflix and I was shocked about how they just pulled Ross and Rachel out every finale to tease it, then the first episode of the new season was tearing them down and that just happens over and over. I know sitcoms aren't supposed to be binged like that, but it obviously destroys their value as a couple when they've broken up and gotten back together so many fucking times haha.
Ayy, 98 fam here too!!
I agree. The "will they, won't they" thing is a very tired trope to begin with, but apparently something audiences really respond to, which is why every showrunner of a sitcom feels like putting it in. Kinda cheap imho. Ross and Rachel in particular should have ended up together sooner or at least not have gotten back together in different ways before finally getting back together for real in the end. Because at that point, yes, they say: "no more messing around", but who's supposed to believe that after all that turmoil?
I totally agree! I loved Ross and Rachel in the beginning but got so frustrated for the reasons you mentioned that I eventually gave up on them. I know they write it that way to keep people interested but I would think that it would have the opposite effect like it did with me. By the end of the show the characters had matured a lot so maybe by then it could have worked between them.
I think apart from Rachael and chandler none of the character makes significant changes in their personalities
This would have worked better as a one-sided crush that could have contributed to Joey's growth as a more mature character. Having Rachel like him back just so Ross would get jealous literally made it a nothing subplot.
I agree! If Joey had a crush but kept to himself and later grew out of it it would have been great character development.
"We were on a break" could have died sooner. But Joey and Rachel were terrible as a couple but hilarious as roommates... Aka books in the freezer
Exactly, having Rachel and Joey as roommates worked surprisingly well. Matt LeBlanc and Jennifer Aniston do have an strong chemistry together, just not in a romantic way.
I'm actually fine with it. I don't know why in my mind that sound squeaky and high pitched but i'm fine with it.
It died for me the day they announced James Corden as a guest on the reunion.
We we're already sick of him in the UK, now he's everywhere on American TV. Can't seem to get away from his fake friendliness and hollow charm.
@@gitsurfer27 he's painfully unfunny. He wrote a decent and passable sitcom and now we can't seem to get rid of him
Hahahaha what??? Oh god no thanks.
@@generichuman2044 co-wrote it with Ruth Jones as well. You often seem to find there’s a chemistry between comedy writers as a partnership they can never quite rekindle when they start working alone.
@@garycheesman6821 that's a good point. I find Mitchell and Webb hilarious but think Webb is pretty unfunny on his own. Same with French and Saunders. Worked well together but I don't find French funny by herself
I thought that the Joey and Rachel story worked somewhat well. When your friends are getting married and setting out on their lives journey together it mixes peoples minds up and makes them more open to the idea of trying someone close that they had not fully considered before, and she was pregnant which adds in different hormonal signals and the desire to find someone to go through it with you since you are about to have a child and be a single mother which has a whole host of new complications.
I definitely feel like Phoebe getting angry a Ross over a dream and her trying to get a rise out of Ross about evolution didn’t work as story points. Also Joey not being able to speak French came off as completely ridiculous like he memorised medical jargon on Days of our lives so he’s definitely not a complete idiot
Oh I hate the episode where Joey can't speak French so much. It's so unfunny, he just makes random noises instead of words the studio audience laughed at. But tbh friends always had storylines that worked and some that didn't - yes, towards the end more of the ones that didn't, but I still disagree with the maker of the video, Friends ended at the right point and didn't jump the shark. It's definetely not perfect, but still my favourite show from start to finish. Even the (dreaded by many) first season has some really funny moments.
Joey exposes the writers' weakness. They clearly had no idea what to do with him in an overarching way. I can't recall which season but he's reading 'Little Women' at some point and that is completely incompatible with the guy from later seasons (the ability to not speak French etc...)
@@komi-creative Ya, I don't think "idiot" was the right word for early seasons Joey. More like "stunted growth".
@@komi-creative Joey loved "The Shining" (the book!), he guessed "The Unbearable Lightness of Being" on pictionary... and later on he thought his random noises was French. Definitely one of the worst episodes of the show
The evolution storyline happened in the earlier seasons when Heckles died and honestly, it is much smarter than her getting mad at Ross for something she saw in a dream. In the early seasons, everyone was well spoken and witty, even Joey.
I am actually one of the only people who liked the idea of Joey and Rachel together. They had fun together and enjoyed each other's company, and their chemistry only got better when they became roommates. Whereas, other than Rachel and Ross's attraction to each other, they didn't seem to have any shared interests or even like each other. They constantly mocked each other for their chosen careers, which was something both characters were very passionate about in their respective fields. Rachel and Joey never bickered like that. In fact, Rachel loved the soap that Joey starred in and Joey respected the fashion advice that Rachel gave him over the years. And Rachel and Joey, in universe, are portrayed as being the most attractive members of the group. So it doesn't seem so out of left field that they could be physically attracted to each other too. Rachel had never considered Joey a prospect before, because of his notorious history as a womanizer, and Joey never consider Rachel because she was his friend's girlfriend. But by the time, Joey developed feelings for Rachel, Ross and Rachel had been broken up for years. And Joey appeared to have a longing to settle down with one woman toward the end of the series. I actually think that all of the things that kept Ross and Rachel apart for the better part of a decade were the same reasons that would cause their relationship to fail. I think it would been really interested if they actually gave Rachel and Joey a fair chance, instead of immediately ending it before it began.
Must disagree about Jim and Pam, the moment they got together was wen finally Pam was free from the old cliché to become a full fledged character. Which I'll give you, most spectators hated.
I just disliked it because I always hated Jim. The little sociopath.
Friends is one of those shows you can just…watch. It’s just easy to watch because you know nothing that bad can happen. I feel like that’s why so many people can go to it even now when your having a tough time or just need something to watch to make you feel better. In my opinion it’s an amazing comfort show
I could have gone my whole life without knowing Friends episodes start with “The One...”
You didn't notice it on your copy of the Friends Bluray box-set?
You sat through over ten minutes about a show you clearly don't like just to write a sad troll comment. Congratulations.
@@michaelmigliaccio1939 Actually, here in my country episodes don't start with "The One". They just skipped that part while translating.
I’ve seen so many videos on friends on CZcams, and have still yet to watch a single episode of the show. I probably need a break from CZcams.
@@michaelmigliaccio1939 who said he sat through it. Dont assume!
While I completely see and agree with your points, for the most part, I personally loved Joey and Rachel's relationship, specifically from Joey's side. While they ended it horribly (there's no possible way Joey can't unhook a bra and there's no woman who wouldn't be a little curious to make out with Joey), one of Joey's most compelling series arcs is the hints of him actually wanting to find the kind of love that Monica and Chandler have. This is littered throughout the show with how serious he gets with several of his girlfriends, even if they're ultimately not right, because despite the playboy facade, Joey is one of the kindest men on the show with a lot of heart and love to offer. To me, it's what Rachel represents rather than Rachel herself for Joey. Aside from the core 3 girls, he's never been friends with women let alone before dating them, it's never occurred to him. It's only natural once he recognizes that's what makes Monica and Chandler's love so strong that he'd consider it for himself. I find it incredibly relatable that he in turn develops a crush on Rachel, his close friend, and tries to keep it hidden from her because he doesn't want to screw up what they have. And I also understand any woman melting into putty when one of their best friends has the exact same humor, is super supportive, a genuine person, extremely handsome, and just happens to have a crush on them. Also being roommates increases their proximity around one another so it's understandable that a crush could develop. Also in how the show has aged, I don't find Ross to be a compelling match with Rachel especially as she becomes more independent and finds herself. He's constantly belittling her and forcing her to be who he wants her to be instead of letting her decide. I very much enjoy her dynamic with Joey and how they understand one another. Joey can only be himself so he would never force his ideals onto someone else and Rachel is the perfect mix of ambitious and nurturing to help Joey grow. So while I agree that their relationship fizzles into nothing due to the framework the creators boxed themselves into leaving no hope for it to become something real (I personally would've loved to see them actually have sex because it would've been incredible, but maybe find once the curiosity is gone, they're really just friends and not romantic which could've been a super interesting angle) I still found their feelings to be relatable and even sad in how it was never given that chance. Either way, it gave me one of the all time funniest eps (the One Where Ross is Fine) so I'll always be grateful for that.
Completely agree with this take!
Totally agree. Many people including me many years ago could not stand the couple Joey and Rachel because they think Rachel is way out of Joey's league. But they live together as roommates and to be honest, Joey is really the best and sweetest friend among the six!! I could totally understand if he and Rachel ever fall in love with each other or even getting physical.
Friends never died in my opinion, this show is forever in my heart
Indeed.
Friends was a product of its time. There are things I like about it, things I disagree and other things that I outright think are offensive and do deservice nowadays. It has its up and downs as any other sitcom back in the 90s and that's ok. What I don't like is when people shield shows/series from criticism and claim they are perfect.
Me too
@@Destroyer2150 Don't be a snowflake.
I think if we simply your comment it reads like "the show never had a drop in quality because I really like it" which is a best a non sequitur. That's why I strongly advise against platitudes like "x thing died" and "having something or someone in your heart"
I disagree, for me their romance and Joey’s love was so pure and beautiful
I would have been more into phoebe and Joey having a relationship.
Lisa Kudrow and Matt Le Blanc pitched a storyline for the end of the show that it would be revealed that Phoebe and Joey had been casually hooking up throughout the course of the series.
It was teased throughout the series that Phoebe and Joey had romantic potential and then the show did nothing with it.
@@unc54 they certainly had more chemistry than Joey and Rachel. It just seemed wrong
@@CMShuckle I would have loved that
That was supposed to be the original plan: Phoebe and Joey was supposed to end up together.
Except Matt was convinced to do a spin off called “Joey”. So they couldn’t have Joey and Phoebe break up.
“Friends was always at its best when all six friends was together” !!!!
When James Corden joins the reunion.
Why is James Corden doing everything these days?
@@EntertainTheElk who knows why. I honestly find him painfully unfunny
Can the UK please take him back?
@@BronzeMantis we don't want him back I'm afraid
@@BronzeMantis Nah mate you can keep him, fuck that
Today agree, Joey’s crush then his and Rachel’s short relationship felt so forced and just another obstacle to her Ross getting back together. It was clear that the writers were out of ideas. There were still plenty of other great moments the last few seasons, but you’re right they had less episodes together and the plot suffered. I still love it though. ❤️
One moment in the show that really signaled to me a decrease in writing quality was when Emily decided to continue with the wedding after Ross said Rachel’s name. It just seemed completely illogical to me that anyone would move forward with a wedding after that. At the very least, take a minute to speak with one another privately about it before making a lifelong commitment. The stupidity of it all really pissed me off. It’s a great example of the writers being unsure of how to continue plot lines, and in an attempt to make things interesting just makes things complicated and frustrating.
Friends worked very well. Even if you were not a fan there was still a hook that grabbed your attention. It made you feel welcome, as though you were apart of their group.
Beautifully executed Marta Kauffman quote about why there will never be a reunion. "The friends reunion is set to air on hbo max" gold!
:)
the reunion is not an episode though, it's the cast reuniting and talking, and we all knew that for a whole year.
that was a great set up
I found Joey's side of the Rachel-Joey arc believable to be honest, he had to take on a more responsible role in her life due to her planning on raising a child in his apartment, and that eventually blossomed into something more
the part I didn't buy so much was Rachel loving him back in Season 9, felt like it came out of nowhere, and I didn't believe it.
Of course.. the entire arc was worth it in the end, cause we got one of the best episodes ever (The One Where Ross is Fine)
in the reunion (on HBOMAX), David and Jennifer (Ross & Rachel) talk about how they would frequently 'crush' on one another, and how "never really acting on that" helped add spark to 'Ross & Rachel'
Unrelated Friends side note, am I the only one that has always thought that Rachel was a pretty terrible person?
They kinda all are in some way or another. Expecially when you binge watch some charakter trades are unbareable. The Relationship between her and Ross is just getting more toxic with every season. For me Rachel was at least relatable and pheobe is just horrible in almost every way.
No. On paper, we would hate her. Jennifer Aniston is really skilled actress. She took a one dimensional unlikeable character and made her sweetness itself. 😉😊
They all are in some way. I always say that some shows are a product of its and Friends was no exception. Rachel had her moments, but tthe bad ones... OOF, really stinged on me.
I can’t pin point the exact moment but when they started to feel separated it stopped feeling like “friends” chandler and Monica , Ross and Rachel , phoebe in her own world and Joey tagging along , it started to feel like little seperate islands , instead of one group , which was the glue aspect of friends
I do think as a whole, Friends is pretty solid compared to other show, especially the ending.
When they turned Ross from a loveable nerd, to a sad drop kick wearing overly tight pants, having fluorescent teeth and getting married every second season killed it for me. I started losing interest when Chandler and Monica got together and completely stopped watching when Rachel had the baby and thought Joey was proposing to her.
When I occasionally see an episode on tv nowadays, it looks so dated and feels worse than I remember it.
I thought season 8 was a rebirth for the show personally. After season 4 with Ross’s wedding, it seemed like the writers were content on making Monica and Chandler the main couple and completing their arcs in 3 seasons. Then season 8 finally gave us Ross and Rachel’s relationship as the center plot line ever since season 4. Seasons 9-10 were deemed failures because of throwaway plot lines and some characters becoming flanderized.
For me Ross improved, and became actually funny by himself. Agree on Chandler and Monica though.
Monica was probably the most annoying character In later stages
@@Dragonclaw110 Each to their own but I struggled to get past season 3 and gave up after season 6.
When was he lovable?
Ross and Rachel's characters and relationship were really toxic on the show
This is totally on point. The best thing about Friends was the whole concept of young single people starting their adult lives and going through all the ups and downs of life and leaning on each other. Once they get married and / or have kids the youthful dynamic changes. Not that it’s bad just more adult and less fun.
While Seasons 9 and 10 were definitely a couple steps down, the show was still incredibly consistent IMO. That one plot line kind of defines that part of the show’s run unfortunately, when the main problems were more the egregious character decisions (like Ross firing a nanny for being effeminate) and flanderization (Joey becoming TOO dumb) in each respective season. But the show never really destroyed its reputation the way The Office did, and like you mention, it ended off on an incredible high note (it’s the most watched television episode of the entire 2000s, after all). As for the breaking of the ensemble, I will agree that Chandler and Monica were pretty much stuck with each other after they started dating, but I could say the same about Chandler and Joey prior to then. And the rest didn’t really do that: beyond their being several ensemble episodes (primarily in Season 8), a lot of interesting pairings happened later down the road (I think Ross and Phoebe basically had all their interesting episodes in the last two seasons, including the finale). So yeah, I don’t think Friends ever really died. More like it stabbed itself in the foot, then dressed the wound up, limped half the way to the finish line, and then sprinted in the final stretch.
I’ve noticed in years gone by some think of friends of a perfect 10 seasons, but I’m always a bit like, ‘no, if you liked it when it first came out, the earlier seasons were the best and the later seasons were the ones that you could watch or ignore’. The characterizations turned up to 11, shclubby Chandler, Joey + Rachel. Just, no!
I agree with this video about when the show started to "die", but not in a sense of its quality, but it was reflecting life's point when you know you and your friends start drifting apart to start families and live other lifes. It was a sad feeling of growing up but I do feel that it was intentional.
I always thought it peaked with the London episodes. Series 1 was a bit weaker, but after London, Ross becomes a mess and seems to have some sort of mental breakdown. It was still funny and really good but was never as good after London. The Joey and Rachel stuff was terrible. Also after Phoebe found her birth mum, the birth mum was never talked about again and never appeared again (I know the actress had some problems). Phoebe finding her family was a huge part of her character in the early seasons and after finding her birth mum it is pretty much forgotten except for her brother making a few appearances.
If they had ended series after Chandler and Monica's wedding, it would've been more about them than all of the other characters.
Love the show but now that you mention it the last couple seasons were always a little less fun to watch. Me and my mom always wanted the Joey Phoebe ship to happen lol
Really? Think of the children lol
@@MPT1983 theys be the weirdest sexiest people when they grow up lol
Just let people be friends.
Lol at one point in the show everybody wanted phoebe and Joey to be a thing
I personally think that the show died the moment Rachel got pregnant. I actually liked her storyline with Joey, they could have at least explored it a bit more if she hadn't been pregnant with Ross' baby. Her relationship with Ross was always a toxic one, the baby made it impossible for her to detach completely from him and her giving up the job opportunity in Paris just to be with him is what really ruined her character and development up to that point.
I would have loved for her to just keep growing professionally and move to Paris to live her dreams. But that's just my 2021 millennial point of view.
And yes, Joey's charachter deserved waaaay better.
For the life of me, I will never, EVER understand why Phoebe and Joey didn't get together. They are perfect together.
Me neither, Lisa and Matt proposed to the writers that they write a joke which implied that Joey and Phoebe were engaging in secret friends with benefits relationship, but they vetoed it, citing that it would be too cliché for all of the friends to pair up romantically.
@@trinaq I would much rather have them then Ross and Rachel. Ad much as I love Paul Rudd I also wanted her to end up with the scientist :(
@@trinaq I can't believe they nixed Joey x Phoebe just to SubVErT exPeCTaTioNS.
The creators' reasons for doing so is because they didn't want to have every friendship on the show pair off into 3 neat couples. They may have been perfect in theory, but their friendship, flirty, yet sibling-y, is one of the rarest relationships ever on TV. Not only do they prove the stereotype "men can never be friends with women because there's always a sexual undercurrent" --- they choose their friendship over a relationship because it's something that hold equal, if not more, weight to a relationship. I think that's admirable.
If I were to propose favorable to your POV, Joey and Phoebe ending up together would be great while Ross and Rachel could have stayed friends to the very end, just because they seemed better as friends than as a couple. Either way, the choice to not let all of them end up with each other was a brilliant move, in my opinion.
I remember the creators saying they didnt want to pair off all six with each other, and I agree. Also, while there is good chemistry between Joey and Phoebe, I wouldnt call it romantic.
I enjoyed this episode. Though I respectfully disagree some aspects. Just as the creators said, I truly don't believe the show lost it's steam in the later seasons (Shark porn aside). I will agree that it etched farther and farther away from it's initial premise, but I think that slow burn was the entire point, it doesn't all happen at once, you grow apart over time. By the end of S7 only M&C were ready for that next chapter of life. But the show couldn't end till everyone was. You'd be left with too many questions about where the others are going next. And even though Joey never grows up, 5 out of 6 Friends do.
Please do one for "New Girl" as well.
Show was shit from the start, no need.
New Girl never died. The last season wasn’t great but I think that was only because the unnecessary time jump
Bit** please
New Girl died when Jess and Nick got together for the last time.
New girl died when they got rid of the theme song
I genuinely believe that if they had planned it better, then solidly wrote it (because there was some SOLID writing in that show), Joey and Rachel could have been the best end for Friends. I dont think they could have gotten away with the element of surprise like with Chandler and Monica, but if Joey grew up out of his womanizing ways, and Rachel realized just how toxic her dynamic with Ross was (and it WAS!), I think that actually would have been something great in their coming together. Because those are the types of things that change as well in your adult years--- growing and maturing and realizing that the things that worked 2/5/10 years ago are no longer for you--- not just getting married and having babies.
Again, they would have had to ease the audience into it, but I genuinely think it would have been so much better and not at all predictable.
But, as it was, you're right, their relationship was crap 😁
The day friends died was when Joey falls in love with Rachel
I like the contrast of the quote at the end "That's why a friends reunion wouldn't work", literally seconds later "this video is brought to you by the friends Reunion on HBO Max."
The "Joey accidentally proposing to Rachel cliff hanger" while I think is followed up in a funny way, it's still one of the most uninteresting and worst cliff hangers of all time.
I think the downfall started after Chandler and Monica got engaged, but I agree, them getting married was the perfect moment to end...
Friends *is* the '90s and New York, when the decade ended, the series lost half its identity, and after 9/11...it lost the other half.
See, I actually liked the idea of Rachel and Joey. In context it didn’t work because you had 7/8 prior seasons of content that it just didn’t jive with, but on its own whereas Ross just kind of gave off this vibe that he was entitled to Rachel by virtue of....pining over her since high school I guess? Joey always treated her as a friend and equal. I mean the first thing he does when he finds out she’s pregnant is propose to her so she doesn’t have to raise the baby alone. Like I said in context of the entire series it was a weird choice and didn’t work but had they introduced that pairing much earlier I would have much preferred it to Ross and Rachel.
Meh. Him proposing to Rachel was a joke about how little he was thinking it through, the set up being him proposing to Phoebe earlier that morning.
I think it might have worked better if they had allowed Joey to grow as a character a little more before he fell for Rachel. Like if we had seen him have at least one or two actual relationships with women he had real feelings for, the idea of him being with Rachel would have felt less strange.
No
Years ago Dave Barry mentioned this about TV sitcoms.
"Somewhere in Hollywood, I believe there is a computer that TV executives use when they can't come up with a good idea for a show. They consult the computer, and it spits out an idea:
'3 QUIRKY BUT ATTRACTIVE YOUNG PEOPLE LIVING IN AN APARTMENT'.
Some years go by and when they again run out of ideas, they consult the computer and it produces:
'5 QUIRKY BUT ATTRACTIVE YOUNG PEOPLE LIVING IN AN APARTMENT'.
This process goes on for many years.
'6 QUIRKY BUT ATTRACTIVE YOUNG PEOPLE LIVING IN AN APARTMENT'.
We need to locate this computer and destroy it with hammers."
Even though I loved Monica and Chandler’s relationship, it feels like as soon as they adopted the “married couple” cliché, Chandler just wasn’t as funny anymore. I guess a lot of his humour was centred around him being “hopeless and awkward and desperate for love” but there were episodes where he wasn’t even present and the show as a whole lost a little bit of spark.
I wish Rachel and Ross never got back together it would have made a better ending
Some people have mentioned flanderisation and I think FRIENDS is a great example of one of the few times it actually goes well. Ross is a pretty bland, by-the-books romcom lead early on in the show. The nerd with a heart of gold, the unnoticed friend, etc. He becomes such a weirdo later on, its great. He has some of the funniest lines and storylines in the second half of the show once the Rachel relationship was put on hold and the writers were able to have fun with him.
Flanderisation was terrible for Joey and Monica though
@@RodHammett95 While I enjoy childish dumb Joey, partly due to how quickly it happen, I 100% agree with Monica.
Kevin from the office is a very good example of flanderisation as well. He went from being believably stupid to having the intelligence of a little kid like when he didn’t know the alphabet or couldn’t do math unless it was about food🤦♂️
Ross is nothing more than a stereotypical ''nice guy'' who is actually anything but. He's possessive, controling, judgemental, and immature. Worst character on the show IMO.
@@sashatheelf Ross can be very funny but the older I got the more I disliked him, now he’s my least favorite character in the main group
The Tulsa storyline was because of Matthew Perry's absences due to his stint in rehab. It was the easiest way to film around him.
For me, the show started to fall when the characters werent relatable humans anymore and just became their character trope. For example, Chandler in the beginning was a sarcastic jokester that always found humor in every situation and was also not that great with women. Some of the jokes were about him but usually we would be laughing with him. Season 7 onwards he became this ultra pathetic nerd who couldnt stand up for himself against anyone and was made the bud of every joke and couldnt hold a conversation for his life other than occasional one liners. Its weird when early on Chandler was the quick witted king of comebacks and sarcasm and could quip with the best of them. I mean he even manipulated Monica into lying down when she was energetic for a run. And now he couldnt make any conversation with anyone without making a fool of himself and saying something painfully embarrassing. And that is apparent for everyone:
- Joey went from a smooth talking womanizer who wasnt all that smart to a smooth brain idiot.
- Ross went from a hopeless romantic geek to an overemotional loser who couldnt keep a girl with him because of his whole unhealthy relationship with Rachel
- Pheobe went from a sweet, likable and quirky lady with a mean streak to some crazy woman who just belittled and bullied all her friends constantly
- Monica went from just a chill girl, who liked cleaning, cooking and winning to a controlling clean freak, who wouldnt ever let something happen without her intervention and was also incredibly loud.
- Cant think of one for Rachel, been a while since I have seen the show.
Its not just the plot, but the characters regressed like crazy as well. They all became one note and it was obvious that the show was on its last legs and the writers couldnt keep it going for much longer.
Thissssss
Well that's how all people are as they age. They go into habits which annoy you as they become older.
I love the show and I absolutely agree
Rachel might have been the only character who got better with time. But the show would also make her obsessed with Ross because they wanted to stretch the Ross-Rachel plotline to the end.
Disagree about Chandler, his character had the most growth according to me. He said once he uses jokes and sarcasm as a coping mechanism because of his childhood trauma..as time went by he changed from a guy afraid of commitment to a loving boyfriend and husband..and he was healing with him hence his lack of jokes. I will never forget his speech to Erica requesting her to give her kid to them.
I agree that the Joey/Rachel romance was unnecessary but I think the idea that they all had grown up by the end of the series and it was no longer the premise of "found family" is actually what is so beautiful about the show. It might be hard to see it in retrospective now, but remember that viewers in that demographic were also growing up with these characters. By the time they had their own families and children, so did the viewers and it felt natural and normal. At some point, we all grow up. After 10 years, the status quo of these characters make sense to change and evolve.
From Rachel , i learned some things :
1° Don't bother studying seriously in college , Rachel was trained for nothing yet managed to be successful
2° Never take responsibility for your faults , 'cause yours friends will vouch for you anyway
3° Don't apologize for be you , including your clumsy side. Instead , cultivate it and then burned Phoebe's apartment yet with no tinge of feeling sorry.
4° Treat the others as stuffs , that's the what "queens" do right ? Drive your friend's car without their permission have her brother to take the blame if you go stopped by a police officer , don't worry , you'll get out of the blame for being pretty and slutty in exchange for your dignity
5° Don't clean the apartament, you know what , don't clean at all.( bonus : don't help during thanksgiving , just take a nap and whine when somebody wakes you )
6° Follow your passion , even if means taking away your daughter from the father without discussing it with him first , you make her alone , right ?
7° Don't mind getting a health insurance, just make your friend commit fraud.
8° Never give your siblings the same treatment your friends gave to you
9° When you run out of your wedding , use Monica's conscience to take you , even if you are penniless , jobless , and didn't invite her to the wedding , even if they say you guys just drifted apart , boy , the awkwardness could be cut by a knife when you were telling her about being engaged to barry.
10° As a "crown favorite" favorite , all attention should be with you , if you two best friends are getting engaged , steal thier thunder , never care how they waited for true love , make sure that you always have the spotlight.
Her character development was being focused on , which is unfair to the others , she is just pretty and loves fashion , but not funny and not talented ( the others are way more funny than her )
Jesus Christ that’s a lot of serious hate for a character, calm down bro
Agree , and also she also never helped her friends out the same way they did with her
Overrated character
It was the same effect with the Nanny series. As soon as the main conflict is dissolved, tension also goes off.
The series finale of Friends is very sad. If those 6 characters really existed in real life, think how depressing the whole thing would be... Joey was sharing the building with his best friends, he would go to Monica's every single day and hang there. Monica and Chandler gone to the suburbs means that Joey is alone, central perk is no longer their cafe and without the glue of the group (Monica) to keep them together, they would all go their separate way. Joey moved to LA, Phoebe is with Mike (who never really connected with any of Phoebe's friends) so they are probably living together and not really seeing the others. Ross is Monica's brother so them 4 are probably still hanging out (given that Rachel did stay with Ross).
Respectfully disagree, I think the romance was excellently handled. The season 9 finale really convinced me that the relationship could work and the following episodes where they listen through the wall, Ross is fine and Joey and Rachel fail to hook up were some of the best things the show delivered. Joey and Rachel were so close it makes sense they'd start feeling things for each other. Monica and Chandler worked because, as they themselves say, they weren't the best of friends and always liked each other romantically underneath the friendship which you show in various clips. Rachel and Joey actually were awesome and close friends who helped each other and loved each other even though there was no attraction.
As soon as I saw the title I said “Joey & Rachel”, I’m glad you agree!
I would pay for you to read books for audio books, you have a nice voice that makes me feel smarter when I listen to you lol
Oh wow thank you. I'd love to get into audiobooks but not sure how!
@@EntertainTheElk if you did a podcast of book reading people would listen.
Just pick 4 books you like and have people vote on what you read each time.
Even if it wasn't traditional books, even comics I know you'd have a good turn out.
I hated how they handled Phoebe's dad appearing
How so?
@@VicenteTorresAliasVits It was just really stupid, he didn't know Phoebe's mom was dead? He didn't expect his kids to be at their grandma's funeral? They barely talked and then he was gone forever
finally it came. been waiting for this since I watched the day jurrassic park died
Ross had that idea first
Jurassic Parka!!!!
@@padmay114 my man lol
I hope it lived up to expectations.
I can always sense a huge shift in energy at the end of Season 5 -- when they are in Vegas. And then in Season 6 when Chandler moves in with Monica. With Joey and Chandler almost always in separate stories, their amazing chemistry as best friends is gone. Joey / Ross just doesn't have the same manic, unbalanced energy. I also think at this time the creators were working on a new show for NBC -- an American version of the UK show, Coupling. It seems like after that characters became caricatures and not real people.
You finally did it, and I got it right! 1 of 3 episodes I suspected you’d choose, the other 2 being, “The One Where Rachel Has A Baby Part 2” and “The One in Barbados” These videos are always a joy to watch!
Those are all possible episodes for the day it died!
What's the name of that song in the background that starts at 6:00? I've heard it before on podcasts.
Would love to see Archer or American Dad
Idk if American Dad actually died but it is on a very slow decline
Best relationship of the show was Joey and Chandler. One way it felt fake is how all the friends like each other so much. I usually have to hang out with someone I don't care for because we share a mutual friend in common. I deal with more Janices than Joeys.
I would argue it's pretty clear that Phoebe only likes Monica, Joey and Rachel (most days) and doesn't care at all for Ross or Chandler 90% of the time haha
The courtship and then initial break up between Ross and Rachel had such emotional intensity. You believe that these opposites attracted and fell in love, as Rachel matured enough to want a sweet man, and you believed that their immaturity ruined in and the pain of that. A pain we've all felt. Even the 2nd break up had emotional traction.
But by the finale I felt nothing for the pairing, all my intense investment had been snuffed out by deteriorating writing and the devolution of Ross into a hopelessly neurotic joke, and the idea that Rachel should get off the plane. And give up a once in a lifetime opportunity to try again with a character who was discredited in the very act of trying to trick her to stay...
It was just dead. No chemistry. And I very subjectively thought her outfit was one of her worst ever in that climatic moment.
At least we had the plotline of Chandler and Monica adopting a kid. I always felt that was the best part of the later seasons.
Rachel and Joey's storyline was by far the worst storyline in Friends
I think it was a good plotline in Season 8. Joey never really had a serious crush on anyone and it scared him. But after Rachel rejected him that should have been it. The show should have focused on getting Joey a real love interest instead of having Rachel fantasize about Joey when she just had a baby with Ross mind you.
Can you do “that 70’s show” PLEASE
I know Im alone in this, but I enjoyed the Rachel/Joey storyline at the time. I thought it gave Joey a growth that his character certainly lacked that far in the show's existence.
I liked it in season 8
I know im alone on this but "the one with monicas thunder" is when the show died for me
Good parts, bad parts, boring, or exciting parts, Friends to this day is still a great watch! I agree after season 7 it was dying but I still would watch 8 9 and 10 in a heart beat.
It was pretty funny when you were listing off some of your favourite episodes (which happen to be bottle episodes) and just how much I disagreed. It made me laugh since its like you specifically chose all the episodes I really didn't like, especially the Brad Pitt thanksgiving one which is just too cringe to watch for me. But it makes it interesting, that people can watch the same show and leave it with completely different mindsets.
For me the most "jumping the shark" moment of friends was actually Chandler with Cathy. He spends like an entire season having a crush on her, so much so that he basically makes Joey break up with her and have her cheat on him he loves her so much...only to break up the very next episode.
The Joey/Rachel storyline would've worked if Joey had learnt that he was craving stability and a more permanent partner again and Rachel was looking for love in the wrong places because she was pregnant and upset that she was going to have to do it alone, but the writers for some reason decided that he had to go back to being a womaniser and Rachel going back to Ross (which I hate).
Love these tv show analysis. I would ask for an analysis of The Magicians but that’s a weirder one.
In response to the call to action all I can say is: do day peep show (was born)
The "rotting on my couch", neverending hate against the show has been endless since the announcement. But I found some valid points in your video
He's not hating, just analyzing the show. You should check his "The Day ___ Died" series to catch up the tone of his videos, it's more about when series/franchises lost what made them special.
@@RodHammett95 I am referring to everyone else commenting the show and how he stands apart
12:19 I like how Phoebe's extreme back ground is, instead of laughted at as bizarre, in this video essay presented as a further extension of the family disillusionment all the characters were facing. It's nice to see an essay take this light hearted show so seriously. Comedy like this wouldn't work if the characters didn't have real travails and even pain to contend with.
It might of died but it still lives with me.. every few years I watch it all from episode 1 to the very last one.. one of the best comedy shows that came out of America.
I knew you were gonna talk about Rachel and Joey's romance just by the title
I don't think Friends ever died. However, I also don't believe it was always great. It's a middle-of-the-road show IMO
Thank you!
Agreed.
That’s what’s so great about it.
I loved the show when it was being broadcast and I agree the quality definitely dipped from season 7. Though there were still quality A, B or C plots in individual episodes right up until the end, and the very occasional stellar full episode, I can’t help think they really should have listened to the actors. Also Rachel & Ross’s ending still doesn’t sit right with me, yeah it was great to see them together at last but it seemed like only Rachel was the one making any sacrifice, which in my head canon has them long bitterly divorced by now & completely fractured!!!
Great video, really glad to have found your work
Came here to fun, not to feel.
Awesome video about my friends, because i was the 7th friend, the one that grew up watching my friends grow, Becoming adults, leaving my teenage behind. The Hard part and also the special part about Friends is that you no longer saw them consolidate as a full adults. You leave them as well and begin to live your life, not knowing what or how it will be. I saw them as my older brothers and sisters, then as my equals, and now as my younglings ones. They kept back in my past. A beautiful memory that never happened in my real life.
Greetings from El Salvador