I purchased a CZ 505 in 2015 took to African what a hammer! I used Norma PH 600 grain Woodleigh I have not reloaded or attempted to. Sounds like gathering some components will prove difficult. Thanks for sharing your knowledge
Thank you for a great history video! The 408 Chey-Tac as you point out, was derived from the 505 Gibbs. It has a strengthened case as well. Perhaps, if someone wants to popularize the old Gibbs round, they could use 408 cases and neck them up? Custom rifles are being made by several gunsmiths. George Gibbs Gunmakers in the UK even advertises original barrels from the 1930s that they will build you a rifle with. Perhaps, there's life left in the old chambering, albeit in very expensive custom rifles only...
Have been watching for years, and it's been gratifying to watch your Videos "mature." The production values (video clarity, sound, organization, and narration) have steadily improved. In addition to the great shooting lore and teaching moments (Scope videos, for example), your channel is just great fun to watch!
Thanks for the history lesson. As a teenager I used to take various Rifle magazines and heard about George Gibbs and his big game rifles based around Mauser actions. All the more interesting because his shop in Park Row was only a couple of miles from my house
This is the best hunting/rifle/cartridge channel on CZcams! Thank you D.D.! I love .505 Gibbs. Buffalo bore and Aria ballistics research are both loading .505 Gibbs. Woodleigh is back up and running, and I've been lobbying for .505 bullets. You can get bullets from Barnes, Hawk, C.E.B. and probably more im not thinking of. This is a fantastic cartridge, lets keep it alive. Thanks
Thank you for that great video! As some of your other viewers have said, I really enjoy the dangerous game history lessons. I remember back in the '70s when Outdoor Live published that monthly series by Peter Capstick about dangerous game. I subscribed at that time, and each month I'd read the story to my kids. Great stuff.
Great presentation of little known subject matter. While hunting in Alaska, I had the opportunity to fire a couple of these whoppers through a CZ....Ouch!!! Had no doubt after the second round that this baby mortar shell was not for me. Never knew a thing about it, except it hurt a lot. Thanks for the knowledge.
Thank you for sharing this information, very informative and satisfying to watch the 505 Gibbs an awesome cartridge designed as a stopper against dangerous game.
DD, Your videos about different exotic rifle rounds have always driven home one point to me; if you’re unable to find ammo or load for it, you own a paperweight! I like safari calibers but if it’s not easily available, I’m hesitant to own the rifle. Safari bolt calibers in 375/416/458 are easy enough to find, the same with double ammo in 470/500NE. If your bang stick doesn’t go bang, it’s a stick!
You should not let difficult to get ammo put you off, these calibers are not something you will shoot hundred of shots with, and because of the low pressures involved the cases last a long time, once you have a stock of cases you are set up for many years, you can even shoot hard lead projectiles for range work. Buy one and enjoy, you will not regret it! Chris B.
@@453421abcdefg12345 Chris, I primarily deer hunt and any of my 7x57’s will drop a deer, and, I suppose, any random elephant that happens to be meandering through the woods near me, lol! I’ve owned a few safari/DG chambered rifles over the years and they have all been fun to shoot but some of the calibers are hard to find at times. I stay away from exotic chamberings because not only is a box of ammo really expensive if you can find it but sometimes the brass simply isn’t available and the bullets can be hard to locate, especially if there’s only one round using that diameter, thinking of the 505Gibbs and 405Win. If I were really smart, I’d simply use the 30-06 because every company loads it and it’s available worldwide. And, it’s a reloader’s dream and it’s one of those great rounds that will do whatever needs to be done!
I grew up in the '70s and '80s reading about hunting in Africa. The .505 Gibbs seemed to be mentioned quite often as a good, hard to find dangerous game round. I have shot many 'African' rounds, but the .505 Gibbs was a unicorn. It was a unique round for a unique time, a round that brought about long range shooting as we know it today.
Thanks for the informative video Desert Dog, I always enjoy these episodes. That's one impressive cartridge, and I love the history of it, as well as tales of African hunting. I should've guessed that you'd have one.
George Gibbs was partnered with I M Crudgington who were gunsmiths in Bristol and Bath. I recall handling a 505 built on a Mauser action at the shop in Bath in the 1970's. I saw it again in "Gun Digest" later. The author, O'Connor? came to England to hunt and was hosted by a friend of mine. He went to Crudgington's and probably photographed it there. I wonder where this rifle is now?
The George Gibbs gunshop on park road was open in the 1980s if memory serves me. I used to get airgun pellets there and I seem to remember a small shop full of interesting stuff 👍
Great to see a cartridge ànd gun manufacturer from my home town of Bristol. Anything about gun or shooting is a taboo subject in Britain at the moment so keep the flag flying 👍🇺🇲🇬🇧
About a decade ago, a company named Vigilance Rifles made a semi-automatic rifle, chambered in 505 Gibbs, called the VR1 PSR, and had made a high BC projectile for it, but I don't know if it's still available.
Or the 450/500 Akley used one for many years as a Ph same belistricts as the lot or What but with a slightly larger case (it can do more ) slower burning powders could be used bringing chamber pressure down one does not need more than a 500 grain bullets doing more than 2150 ft per second on any dangerous game
Thanks, very informative video. Subscribed, I like how you went about giving great information on a great cartridge that was used by a legend. Hemingway.
@@mikga45 I don't believe that Hemingway personally used a Gibbs. But, his fictional character, professional hunter "Robert Wilson", used a 505 Gibbs to great effect.
Bristol's George Gibbs builds rifles chambered for the .505 Gibbs calibre along the original pattern. Several excellent British and continental European rifle makers, most notably Reimer Johannsen, build rifles for this calibre. .505 Gibbs cartridges are produced by Kynoch, by Norma, and by Labor Für Ballistik. An African stopper should be stocked to measure in high grade straight grain walnut.
Hey! Lawrence from North Georgia here... With the problems of ammo availability, and its extreme expense when it can be found, what are your thoughts on something like Pedersoli's Gibbs African Hunter Rifle in 72 caliber? Pedersoli also makes double rifles in .72 and .58. For the budget minded individual or someone with a love of history, while going to Africa with black powder might pose a few issues, what about going out west or to Alaska with something like these?
All the other African Calibers have been revamped with newer powders and bullets. The 505 Gibbs should be a 750 grain bullet at 2150 fps. Why would anyone want a big Gibbs to shoot a 525 grain bullet at 2150 fps when a 458 Win Mag does the same?
Pretty sure Bertram here in Australia is still doing runs of 505 Gibbs brass, and Woodleigh were doing bullets too, likely as is Bertram. From memory, I think at least one US retailer was importing them…maybe Grafs? BTW, didn’t Kynoch come back with Kynamco as the manufacturer? There’s good info on them in Graeme Wright’s book on the English Double rifle…..well worth getting if you don’t yet have it in your library.
@@ammocraft Woodleigh had not made 505 bullets for a while before the fire, and haven't made any after the fire. As stated in the video, Kynoch hasn't made a batch of 505 Gibbs ammo since 2019. When CZ discontinued the 550 in late 2019, manufacturers started backing off support for the cartridge. Bertram stopped importing brass into the United States.
505 lists max pressure as 39,000 psi, I’d be willing to bet a good bolt gun could handle 50,000 psi without any problems. That’s why it’s inefficient and outdated. 458 win mag lists 60,000 psi max and 458 Lott lists 63,500 psi max, so you get almost the same performance with a much smaller case and less recoil because higher working pressure.
@@ryanehlis426 It's inefficient because it takes twice the powder to achieve the same velocity with the same weight-class projectile as the Lott. As stated in the video, some people fill that case up with a fast ball powder for crazy loads achieving almost 10k ft/lbs. the 505 brass itself isn't made to handle that safely. When Cheytac began using the 505 as a parent case for the Cheytac rounds, they manufactured thicker brass to handle the pressure.
As Ross Seyfried wrote in the Wolfe publications, the .585 Nyati, which he intended as a substitute for the .577 Nitro, was too much power, unbelievable power, and that any man contemplating getting one should sit alone in a dark corner and ask himself if he really needs all that power, or if a lesser cartridge like the .458 Lott would be enough. Same applied to the .577 Tyrannosaur.
Being german, for german gun law i don' t own guns, and have only few times fired .22 lr firearms. A question of a nonexpierienced armchair theoretic: In old days before 1914, was it possible in case of emergency, to reload the big cartidges with black powder?
@@brittakriep2938 Yes, theoretically. Black powder would work in a 505 case, but the load would be considerably underpowered. BUT, primers and reloading tools weren't readily available to the public in the time period you describe.
Hearing the history of this cartridge is very interesting. Thanks for the video.
I purchased a CZ 505 in 2015 took to African what a hammer! I used Norma PH 600 grain Woodleigh I have not reloaded or attempted to. Sounds like gathering some components will prove difficult. Thanks for sharing your knowledge
Thank you for a great history video! The 408 Chey-Tac as you point out, was derived from the 505 Gibbs. It has a strengthened case as well. Perhaps, if someone wants to popularize the old Gibbs round, they could use 408 cases and neck them up? Custom rifles are being made by several gunsmiths. George Gibbs Gunmakers in the UK even advertises original barrels from the 1930s that they will build you a rifle with. Perhaps, there's life left in the old chambering, albeit in very expensive custom rifles only...
Great information and history on the 505 Gibs.
would love to see a vid on the 404 Jeffery!
Have been watching for years, and it's been gratifying to watch your Videos "mature." The production values (video clarity, sound, organization, and narration) have steadily improved. In addition to the great shooting lore and teaching moments (Scope videos, for example), your channel is just great fun to watch!
I enjoyed your presentation. Well done!
Really enjoy the history lessons! Have a great weekend Desert Dog!
Thanks for the history lesson. As a teenager I used to take various Rifle magazines and heard about George Gibbs and his big game rifles based around Mauser actions. All the more interesting because his shop in Park Row was only a couple of miles from my house
This is the best hunting/rifle/cartridge channel on CZcams! Thank you D.D.! I love .505 Gibbs. Buffalo bore and Aria ballistics research are both loading
.505 Gibbs. Woodleigh is back up and running, and I've been lobbying for .505 bullets. You can get bullets from Barnes, Hawk, C.E.B. and probably more im not thinking of. This is a fantastic cartridge, lets keep it alive. Thanks
"Short, ugly, and of shockingly big bore..." and suddenly you realize that Hemingway isn't talking about ammunition any more.
Thank you for that great video! As some of your other viewers have said, I really enjoy the dangerous game history lessons. I remember back in the '70s when Outdoor Live published that monthly series by Peter Capstick about dangerous game. I subscribed at that time, and each month I'd read the story to my kids. Great stuff.
Great presentation of little known subject matter. While hunting in Alaska, I had the opportunity to fire a couple of these whoppers through a CZ....Ouch!!!
Had no doubt after the second round that this baby mortar shell was not for me. Never knew a thing about it, except it hurt a lot. Thanks for the knowledge.
Thank you for sharing this information, very informative and satisfying to watch the 505 Gibbs an awesome cartridge designed as a stopper against dangerous game.
DD, Your videos about different exotic rifle rounds have always driven home one point to me; if you’re unable to find ammo or load for it, you own a paperweight!
I like safari calibers but if it’s not easily available, I’m hesitant to own the rifle. Safari bolt calibers in 375/416/458 are easy enough to find, the same with double ammo in 470/500NE.
If your bang stick doesn’t go bang, it’s a stick!
You should not let difficult to get ammo put you off, these calibers are not something you will shoot hundred of shots with, and because of the low pressures involved the cases last a long time, once you have a stock of cases you are set up for many years, you can even shoot hard lead projectiles for range work. Buy one and enjoy, you will not regret it! Chris B.
@@453421abcdefg12345 Chris, I primarily deer hunt and any of my 7x57’s will drop a deer, and, I suppose, any random elephant that happens to be meandering through the woods near me, lol!
I’ve owned a few safari/DG chambered rifles over the years and they have all been fun to shoot but some of the calibers are hard to find at times. I stay away from exotic chamberings because not only is a box of ammo really expensive if you can find it but sometimes the brass simply isn’t available and the bullets can be hard to locate, especially if there’s only one round using that diameter, thinking of the 505Gibbs and 405Win.
If I were really smart, I’d simply use the 30-06 because every company loads it and it’s available worldwide. And, it’s a reloader’s dream and it’s one of those great rounds that will do whatever needs to be done!
I grew up in the '70s and '80s reading about hunting in Africa. The .505 Gibbs seemed to be mentioned quite often as a good, hard to find dangerous game round. I have shot many 'African' rounds, but the .505 Gibbs was a unicorn. It was a unique round for a unique time, a round that brought about long range shooting as we know it today.
Thanks for the informative video Desert Dog, I always enjoy these episodes. That's one impressive cartridge, and I love the history of it, as well as tales of African hunting. I should've guessed that you'd have one.
I really enjoyed this escape into Africana this Sunday morning! I have an original 1950 print JA Hunter "Hunter" I found in a Goodwill for $1.😃
George Gibbs was partnered with I M Crudgington who were gunsmiths in Bristol and Bath. I recall handling a 505 built on a Mauser action at the shop in Bath in the 1970's. I saw it again in "Gun Digest" later. The author, O'Connor? came to England to hunt and was hosted by a friend of mine. He went to Crudgington's and probably photographed it there. I wonder where this rifle is now?
The George Gibbs gunshop on park road was open in the 1980s if memory serves me. I used to get airgun pellets there and I seem to remember a small shop full of interesting stuff 👍
@@cedhome7945 I do recall the address at the time I went there as Green St, Bath. THey did move.
Thanks for giving the Dagga Boy a well-deserved channel appearance and for the excellent content, as usual.
Another great history lesson DD.
Thanks for the .505 Gibbs History 👉⏳. Cheers from 🇨🇦🍻🙏.
Great to see a cartridge ànd gun manufacturer from my home town of Bristol. Anything about gun or shooting is a taboo subject in Britain at the moment so keep the flag flying 👍🇺🇲🇬🇧
Another great episode. You are now my number 1 guy for info on guns and hunting. Keep up the great work.
I wouldn't be surprised if George Gibbs and John Rigby were friends. Because they designed cases that look like each other, apart from the size.
Musgrave in South Africa can make you a 505 Gibs still. They make 500 Jeffrey from the website but the 505 gibs can be made
Great stuff!
What a fantastic video and piece of history . This is the first time I’ve seen this channel. I want to handled .
Great video, as usual!!
Oh yea....love the Dangerous game calibers
Thank you for the video.
Very well put together, enjoyed that! Have a great day!
youre good alright. Thanks for taking the time.
This was a really great video... Thank you
About a decade ago, a company named Vigilance Rifles made a semi-automatic rifle, chambered in 505 Gibbs, called the VR1 PSR, and had made a high BC projectile for it, but I don't know if it's still available.
Great video. Loved the history lesson.
I really like these videos DD. I always learn something
Wonderful breifing! Thank you so much.
Well done and Thanks, again!
Love the cartridge history vids.
Cordite, AKA angry spaghetti
Yes, that's how its inventors referred to it.
Similarly, I refer to my mother-in-law as "angry meatballs". 😅
Great video DD if I remember right Buffalo Bore is now making the 505 Gibbs ammo now. Along with other odd balls. I enjoy these history videos.
Thank You
Just prove things can go to far in the extreme for diminishing returns. 458 Lott is about goldilocks as a stopping cartridge.
Or the 450/500 Akley used one for many years as a Ph same belistricts as the lot or What but with a slightly larger case (it can do more ) slower burning powders could be used bringing chamber pressure down one does not need more than a 500 grain bullets doing more than 2150 ft per second on any dangerous game
Great video! If loving .505 is wrong i dont wanna be right!
Whoa ! Thank you ! 👏
Great video as always Desert Dog. I really enjoy the history of the dangerous game cartridges.
Parabéns pelo Exelente vídeo, obrigado
Thanks, very informative video. Subscribed, I like how you went about giving great information on a great cartridge that was used by a legend. Hemingway.
@@mikga45 I don't believe that Hemingway personally used a Gibbs. But, his fictional character, professional hunter "Robert Wilson", used a 505 Gibbs to great effect.
Bristol's George Gibbs builds rifles chambered for the .505 Gibbs calibre along the original pattern. Several excellent British and continental European rifle makers, most notably Reimer Johannsen, build rifles for this calibre. .505 Gibbs cartridges are produced by Kynoch, by Norma, and by Labor Für Ballistik. An African stopper should be stocked to measure in high grade straight grain walnut.
@@hubertusvenator5838 Kynoch stopped making 505 Gibbs several years ago. Watch the video.
Hey! Lawrence from North Georgia here... With the problems of ammo availability, and its extreme expense when it can be found, what are your thoughts on something like Pedersoli's Gibbs African Hunter Rifle in 72 caliber? Pedersoli also makes double rifles in .72 and .58. For the budget minded individual or someone with a love of history, while going to Africa with black powder might pose a few issues, what about going out west or to Alaska with something like these?
The British also loaded the 303British coredite
All the other African Calibers have been revamped with newer powders and bullets. The 505 Gibbs should be a 750 grain bullet at 2150 fps. Why would anyone want a big Gibbs to shoot a 525 grain bullet at 2150 fps when a 458 Win Mag does the same?
Wow ! That’s a cool cartridge!
Woodleigh is the premier source of bullets for the .505 Gibbs calibre.
@@hubertusvenator5838 But.....they haven't made bullets for the 505 Gibbs in 4 years.
Pretty sure Bertram here in Australia is still doing runs of 505 Gibbs brass, and Woodleigh were doing bullets too, likely as is Bertram. From memory, I think at least one US retailer was importing them…maybe Grafs? BTW, didn’t Kynoch come back with Kynamco as the manufacturer? There’s good info on them in Graeme Wright’s book on the English Double rifle…..well worth getting if you don’t yet have it in your library.
@@ammocraft Woodleigh had not made 505 bullets for a while before the fire, and haven't made any after the fire. As stated in the video, Kynoch hasn't made a batch of 505 Gibbs ammo since 2019. When CZ discontinued the 550 in late 2019, manufacturers started backing off support for the cartridge. Bertram stopped importing brass into the United States.
@@desertdogoutdoors1113 I’ll ask at the club and see what the latest is…..a few there have a Gibbs. I have a 500Jeff.
Rhino also make bullets , some other makers also . Many a dedicated user of it through the years. Richard Harlan åd,,Kevin Robertson and,many others.
I think Bell is making brass for the 505
Bertram in Australia make 505 Gibbs cases
Bertram no longer imports brass into the United States. (it was really bad brass anyway).
505 lists max pressure as 39,000 psi, I’d be willing to bet a good bolt gun could handle 50,000 psi without any problems. That’s why it’s inefficient and outdated. 458 win mag lists 60,000 psi max and 458 Lott lists 63,500 psi max, so you get almost the same performance with a much smaller case and less recoil because higher working pressure.
@@ryanehlis426 It's inefficient because it takes twice the powder to achieve the same velocity with the same weight-class projectile as the Lott. As stated in the video, some people fill that case up with a fast ball powder for crazy loads achieving almost 10k ft/lbs. the 505 brass itself isn't made to handle that safely. When Cheytac began using the 505 as a parent case for the Cheytac rounds, they manufactured thicker brass to handle the pressure.
👍👍👍
What do you think about the 460 Weatherby?
Works great for jack rabbits.
Seems like the 505 Gibbs might be a good candidate for black powder propellant.
If you want a good laugh, look for "Doctari's" account of his first shot with his then new [to him] 505.
Can we have a history lesson on the 577 T-Rex and why there only 24 in existence
And one its more of is .585 Nyati
A wildcat designed by Ross Seyfried btw it is
As Ross Seyfried wrote in the Wolfe publications, the .585 Nyati, which he intended as a substitute for the .577 Nitro, was too much power, unbelievable power, and that any man contemplating getting one should sit alone in a dark corner and ask himself if he really needs all that power, or if a lesser cartridge like the .458 Lott would be enough.
Same applied to the .577 Tyrannosaur.
I wrote a comment but it went away, Trex developed by Asquare and Art Alphim on request from some African phs
Being german, for german gun law i don' t own guns, and have only few times fired .22 lr firearms. A question of a nonexpierienced armchair theoretic: In old days before 1914, was it possible in case of emergency, to reload the big cartidges with black powder?
@@brittakriep2938 Yes, theoretically. Black powder would work in a 505 case, but the load would be considerably underpowered. BUT, primers and reloading tools weren't readily available to the public in the time period you describe.
Wonder if not it will have a revival now lead is on the way out.
Lead isn't on the way out.
@@jasonshults368 It's is in Europe (EU - minus Sweden). Can't have the minions making something they can say NO to the state with
do my eyes deceive me or is that a 602 action on that rifle?
It is a CZ550, which evolved from the ZKK 602.