Did Boeing Fail with the 747-8?
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- čas přidán 11. 02. 2021
- In this video, we’ll talk about the journey of the newest variant of the Boeing 747 family - the 747-8I. The aircraft has had a troubled journey, and we’ll discuss the issues faced and where its future could be headed.
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Long live the Boeing 747!❤
Could the 747 return in the future?
With a carbon fibre fuselage, also engines are getting more reliable and powerful with each gen of planes. Due to the pandemic people are craving holidays and that will likely last for a few years and then some so could a rework of the 747 be viable?
@@lagdroid0017 Quad jets are no longer attractive to airlines, even the A340 and A380 which were more recent and efficient designs are also being retired.
@@LexWinchesterr I meant to add that with a rework of the wings, could the 747 be powered with 2 incredibly powerful engines albeit reducing the MTOW
@@lagdroid0017 Could be an option but, it would be no different from the 777, and the 777 was created for that purpose so it will likely fail. Even the 777x is too big and unwanted by today's standards. It's sad to see a beautiful bird like the 747 leave but it had a very good and long life.
@@LexWinchesterr I agree but the 777 will never come as close to my heart as the 747 did but yes it did have a good run in it’s 50 years
I don't think the 747-8 program was a failure, but what I think it did was take away capital and resources from developing a replacement for the 757
They had a replacement-797 but Boeing has big problems nowadays. They seem not to be able to produce it
@@kirilmihaylov1934 No they didn't. The so-called 797 is a recent thing. They opted to expand the 737 variant rather than develop a direct replacement for the 757
@@timothycook2917 well you can call it whatever you like . They wanted to replace it with a new jet but didn't do it till now .Boeing has a lot of problems nowadays
@@kirilmihaylov1934 - Boeing needs to get the 'B797' NMA Project started like ASAP, as Airbus has the 150-280 seat market covered with the A320neo and A321neo/lr/xlr and lessor extent the A220. Don't forget, that the French Government being on of the shareholders and provided bail outs to Airbus, wants Airbus to start looking at a new clean sheet single aisle airframe design to replace the A320/A321 family.
@@chrismckellar9350 they didn't provide anything .Boeing has fucked up big time themselves. By putting money and stock prices over lives
The 747-8 was a tactical move to push Airbus to commit time and resources for the A380. Boeing knew the market was going to the direction of the long and skinny routes - aka point to point.
It also probably banked on the freighter market to break even on the project, something Airbus didn't have.
You'd be right if Boeing didn't sink Billions into their full double decker programs.
The 747-8 was a smart move. It cost pennies to make and really just existed for A380 to remember just how much they spent on the A380 just for the break even point to not come close, whilst taking away a little order
The 747-8 is THE most beautiful aircraft in the sky, and the Queen of the Skies has certainly had one hell of an amazing run. All good things must come to an end at some point...sadly. But at least we'll still be able to enjoy them as freighters...and AF One. :)
Boeing might come to an end soon ...
AF One will likely become a 777X in the future.
@@kirilmihaylov1934 No it won't, The US government wont let that happen.
@@mattevans4377 nope. 2 new -8Is are already being reworked into AF ones. replacing the older -200s they use now.
@@wil8115 By future I meant after the current replacement.
i’ve flown a lufthansa 747-400 to dulles 3-4 years ago and it was amazing. thats why im so attached to this jet.
I am 13 years old i remember in 2011 that i was on a 747-400 of the klm( i live in the netherlands) i have only flown on 777-300er's, a320's and 737's to that point. When we went to the gate i was so exited because it was my dream to fly on a 747. When we were gonna do the trip back I was confused because my parents said that we were gonna take 2 flights to get home but I now know why.
The first flight was with asiana airlines with their 747-400. And then on the second flight we were greeted by an Klm Asia 747-400. This was an wonderful flight expiernce. (Note that when we another time got on vacation to that country that we flew on a 747-400 of thai airways
In all the years, I’ve never flown on a 747. Not by choice but simply because the domestic routes I’ve regularly flown didn’t offer them. But I’m sorry to see them go.
In the future, when the B-747-8 is no longer in production, some cargo carriers will wish they had ordered some
B-747-8's.
Luckily I will be flying on the 747 relatively often again, because I mainly fly from Frankfurt or Munich.
I've never gotten to fly on one, but I have toured the factory in Everett and watched them assemble some of the UPS freighters. I looked at flight radar today and there are lots of 747 freighters in the skies. Still a beautiful aircraft.
Its quite likely that Amazon would order the 747-8F
Really???
Nope. Amazon likes smaller jets like 757s and 767s as seen by their leasing commitments and the recent purchase of used 767s.
Won't happen. Atlas took the last 4 747's. Suppliers have begun shutting down production of parts for the 747 line. September is when the line will shut down.
the 747-8 was a brilliant move by Boeing, making sure that Airbus would stay committed to their A380 and its insane development cost kept racking up. The upgrade from -400 to -8 was a small investment to make sure Airbus would hemorage money through the A380 programme. Boeing knew Jumbo Jets were a thing of the past and that's exactly why they developed the -8.
Could've been brilliant in another time, no airline wants a quad jet anymore. Both A340 and A380 being newer and more advanced planes also failed now, the future is in medium sized twin engines and single aisle long range planes. Boeing is just doomed at this moment, not even the 777x is attractive to airlines and the reputation of the 737 is damaged beyond repair, they already lost in the single aisle market. The smartest thing to do is focus on the 787, which has proven to be reliable so far, and develop another single aisle model... But IDK, they are just spiraling down.
If they knew they were a thing of the past they wouldn't have spent the money making the 748
@@visionist7 Try reading comments fully. Your question has been answered already in Martijn de Geus's comment. Read it again :)
@@bmused55 An all new wing alone had to have cost Boeing ten figures to develop.
@@visionist7 like I said it wasn’t a decision based on market conditions, but it was a strategic move to make sure airbus would have an enormous amount of money tied up in developing an all new quadjet.
Im hoping it will live on and more orders will come for the best aircraft ever, its just an icon.
Long live the Queen of the sky's.
I think the airlines that retired her missed s trick as its the customers choice the fly in her there for filling the flights, i know what id book on to fly on this truelly great plane.
I remember as a child in 1973 rushing to change planes in Toronto while flying between Nassau and Vancouver to make an earlier connection and being amazed to board Air Canada's first 747 (or at least my first). Back in those days us kids could go up and visit the pilots in the cockpit! Mind blown!
UPS has 6 more coming and Altas Air has purchased the last 4. I doubt any more will be built unless a substantial order is placed very soon and that is unlikely.
At the beginning of the video you mentioned that the 747 is Boeing most successful aircraft in it’s history. Actually despite it’s recent major issues with the Max, the 737 is actually Boeing most successful airliner. Over 10,400 have been built.. I think that in the future the big fright company’s like Atlas Air and UPS will be left with nothing to replace their 747’s. They will need like 1.5 / 2 777F’s to replace every 747... Will be interesting to see what happens..
The most successful aircraft in Boeings history depends on how you are defining successful. Number of units sold goes to the 737, but the effect the 747 had on the industry and on Boeing is more than number of planes and direct cash flow. Looking at the big picture over time, you can say the 747 had the biggest impact overall.
747 is a much larger aircraft than the 737. Although not 6 times larger.
I agree with Dave's line of thinking what the 747 did for Aviation was a revolution the size of it it strongly reduced ticket prices and even a blind person recognizes one. I'm not disparaging the blind I'm just making a point and 50 years is one hell of a production run and the plane went from paper to production in thirty months or slightly less. I have to give Joe Sutter a lot of the credit for that r i p Joe, the right man for the job. I was honored to fly one from Manila to Honolulu.
I don’t think the 747-8 was a failure. While it had disappointing sales, Boeing made the right choice to make an updated derivative rather than design a whole new plane. The -8 did not sell because it was a bad plane, but because the market position it filled changed. Remember, Airbus launched two 4 engine airplanes during the 747 production run, and both did meet generate their expected sales goals. The both the A-340 and A-380 will have ended production before the 747-8 does. And both of those aircraft are also being retired by their operators long before they have reached the end of their planned design service life spans.
it is very sad not to see jumbojet in the skys. it certainly was the most beautifull aircraft after concord
Wild the last 747 is being delivered to Atlas sometime this month
Boeing 747 the best airplane .
Lucky had a chance to fly few times, l like it
Boeing 747-8 will Rise again! Long live the “Queen of the skies!” E Pluribus Unum! Semper Fidelis!
Long live the Queen of the Skies!
If the 747-8 was a failure, at least it was a better effort than the 797 that they ignored until the AB models control the segment.
I think there will continue to be a need for the 747-8 freighter
Like many commentators, the B747-8 in my book wasn’t a success but it wasn’t a failure. It was made to put pressure on Airbus. You don’t have to make money on a plane to make it a success. Sometimes its created as way to apply pressure on competitors.
747-8f will rise demand in freighter as it is safest and economic with high payloads
Hmm?
The 747-8 is still the only choice for a 4 engine freighter; the a380 never made that cut.
As am airliner, it has twice the engines but not twice the passengers AND same range. But as a freighter, the only things that come close are actually military planes. You can't beat having the ability to smile.
A 747-8I Combi, built with a front gate and passenger cabin of your imagination up front, would be very versatile and could even function as a backup AF1 or a mobile home for someone out in the Middle East.
Imagine Lufthansa trolls everyone and orders 50 747-8i
One possible factor you didn't mention was the unfortunate 757 experience: Boeing lived to regret and maybe still does, what turned out to be the early termination of that program, so perhaps the 747-8 was, as much as anything else, an "insurance policy" against a repeat of that misfortune. In that sense the 747-8 would be a "success" in that it did fulfill the purpose it was meant for.
But barring a huge upswing in demand for a long-haul freighter, it does look as if the 747 must go, as the 4-engine airliner is dead, certainly as long as the jumbo is not in sufficient demand. And it is well past time Boeing got serious about modernizing its fleet, not wringing the last cent out of everything. It also needs to hire some engineers who actually went to school, who understand basic concepts such as the essentialness of redundant critical components.....
Think you might be right once the oversized cargo Antnovs are gone the nose door on the 747F will be the only very large freighter
th 47-8i was a failure in that if came to late and was against the now superior twin jets for equal range with the twins having better fuel economy. the 47-8f however could have had a great run as heavy lift freighter given its larger internal volume, higher gross weight cap and nose loading option. Sadly, the pandemic hit and prompted airlines to retire their 47's including the 8i due to extremely low demand and low foreseeable demand. Rather than sell them though, many of the 47-8i operators are having them converted into freighters or combies for continued use with their fleets (KLM, BA, lufthansa) which is actually cutting into the sales of the 8f. We will still the see the 47-4 and 8 for decades, just not as passenger aircraft. for proof of that just look at the number of freight companies that operated the DC-8 clear into the early 2000's
The B747 programme hasn't been a failure, in fact it has been a success as the programme has produced both passenger and freight aircraft but times have change and it is time to move on with new aircraft types to meet the challenges and effects of a warming planet.
No, it wasn’t made for passenger. They designed the 747 in general for Cargo in mind. Passenger was the perk for the 747.
The 747-8 was never designed to succeed it was designed to stress Airbus
Boeing only committed to the -8 because of the A380.
Anderson Cooper, The Queen of the Skies!
It never went wrong, it’s just at end of its 50 year old lifecycle
the 737 is the most successful product from Boeing
In terms of impact and revolution
@@navgeekaviation that’s one perspective.. I agree it’s the most iconic shape in the air. But the 737 brought jet travel to tiny airports and dirtstrips. Having flown over 2 earths population since it first took to the skies.
I agree pal
The 747 - 8 was a success. Boeing new the passenger model would not sell very well, as they we're more focused on getting the 787 ready and flying for customers. The 747 was more so an update for freighters who were looking to replace their aging 400. It was nice to see Airlines like Lufthansa and Air China make use of the passenger version, but in the age were twin jets are simply more cost-effective, this plane was only due to serve for about 20 years before it would be replaced by something else.
Spreadsheets, spreadsheets :(
I realize 747 hold its place in aviation history but I am surprised by so many as to its how its flying experience is so amazing or whatever. Honestly, compare to modern A380 and A350, B747's ride is nothing in comparison, even the new B747-8 version. It's a transformative aircraft but the world has moved on and I much prefer to ride on a A350 or A380.
I booked flights specificall to catch a few rides on 747-400s. For one trip I upgraded specifically to get on the top deck. I Did not regret it. Wonderful aircraft. Just the right amount of engine noise for an Avfan like me to enjoy. The A350 and A380 are boring. Absolutely no character to them at all.
@@bmused55 I've flown on B747, in the upper deck, many times. I really don't understand your reaction. I think it's your personal preference or bias that's at play. If it's the upper deck, then A380 also has it. If it's the space, then the B747 upper deck has much lower ceiling height/clearance, and A380 is much better in that regard. If it's the stairs, then A380's is much wide and less steep for climbing up with luggage. The upper deck, in a strange way, is low class - why would rich/well-off people paying extra money want to struggle with their luggage up the spiral stairs? That's why many airlines configured economy only upper deck. If it's the 4 engines, then A380 has it and it's more powerful and take off with a more stable grace. As far as comfort is concerned, the A350 has significantly higher humidity and much much quieter engines and cabin than the B747, so you arrive much more rested. Would I avoid a ride in a 747, no... but would I go out of my way to book on it, also no. The only unique and interesting thing about 747 is the lower deck, at the very front where the radome is located. The only thing "boring" is the technology in B747 by today's standards.
@@_w_w_ Finally, a rational comparison not tainted by Boeing Fanboyism.
The 747-8 is not a failure yet. Ryanair must have its shot at getting some ultra-high density 800-passenger "747-8800", featuring seating in what should be the cargo hold.
Would never happen. Boeing stopped accepting orders for passenger 747's a few years ago so it would take a pretty large order for Boeing to accept orders for a passenger 747.
@@yoyoyoyoshua For Ryanair, nothing is impossible... except legroom.
@@texasabbott nah that for sure is impossible sadly
Nothing went wrong.
No it was not their most successful aircraft. And they have formally announced it’s end
The most successful aircraft in Boeings history depends on how you are defining successful. Number of units sold goes to the 737, but the effect the 747 had on the industry and on Boeing is more than number of planes and direct cash flow. Looking at the big picture over time, you can say the 747 had the biggest impact overall.
And they did announce the end, and then a few more orders came in, and they are still open to more before they shut it down.
It wasn't their most successful or even their longest produced aircraft. Both of those honors go to the 737. As far as most successful wide body that goes to the 777 with the most orders of any widebody aircraft in history.
It was the most revolutionary jet the differences between it and any other commercial passenger liner in the early 70s was very very Stark nothing compared to it and it easily carried more than twice the passengers than the 737 of that era. It drastically dropped ticket prices. Its impact on Aviation was phenomenal young kids recognize the jet. And you have to look long and hard to find. a jet for 50 years that is any safer as that was one of the biggest concerns of Joe Sutter.
Not really. It was the next step in the very successful 747 program and most of the development was already paid for.
Nothing went wrong. The 747-8 did exactly what it was supposed to do, take the wind out of the A380 sales. It was, in industry terms, a fairly cheap upgrade to the 747 and made Airbus sweat. Orders for the A380F were cancelled once Airbus admitted the 747-8 Freighter would get enough orders as to make Airbus's share of the market not worth the expense of modifying a niche aircraft into a freighter.
The 747-8 was a tactical program. Boeing knew the market would prefer a twin jet over a 4 engined jet. They have been steering toward that for years, beginning with the 757/767 programs.
The 737 Max issue has absolutely NOTHING to do with the 747-8 program. The decisions were made on the 747 long before the 737Max even first flew. Please don't twist the 737 MAX issues into having even the slightest thing to do with 747 sales.
It is a failure on the commercial side, but a success on the business side as it was built to compete with airbus meaning that airbus were a few years late with there A350.
Boeing, like most American corporations, needs to be smashed up into much smaller corporations.
No, they just need to throw out their current leaders. All of whome came from McDonnell Douglas after driving that corporation into the ground.
Bigger corporations have much more potential to do much bigger things Airbus is an example of that. If Boeing wore a small company in the 70s they probably would not have succeeded with the 747 as a result of its success Boeing grew exceedingly it's kind of a natural result or an ebb and flow type reaction. And they do need to fire the McDonnell Douglas executives and I use that term loosely. Boeing could use another Joe Sutter he was the right man for the job r i p Joe.
You did not explain why Boeing is stop the manufacture the 747. That is the subcontractors that makes the body of the aircraft contact has finished and they do not want to extend it
And I don't think Boeing wanted to extend it either unless the demand was there which it is not in business most any business cost-effectiveness wins the day and twin Jets are much cheaper to operate the triple 7x is a very good replacement on the 747 passenger jet etops regulations have favored twin jets for quite a while now Landon Aviation less fuel consumption is King
Yes there is small demand cargo aircraft but a not to make finding a new subcontractors
Boeing seems to be in a very bad position ...
That may be very temporary as commercial Aviation has been predicted to increase drastically once the virus is eliminated and bowling owns the freighter Market the biggest percentage of it and that is obviously growing and the two biggest candidates to take advantage of that would be the triple 7X and the 747 freighter the A380 exceeds its weight limit far earlier than it fills its volume it's too heavy to be a successful freighter and to thirsty. I'm guessing the triple 7X will complete the job with the United Arab Emirates that the A380 started. The triple 7x with its fuel efficiency pretty much dictates that and the Boeing is a lot easier to fill than A380. The a380s average field percentage was 77% the other 23% would all the profit that they weren't collecting due to the empty seats the A380 just may have been too big some Boeing Executives have admitted that they bought the 747 could have been a little too big . And if they build the 797 that could change their fortunes the lawsuits from the max crashes will cost them and they should but they will recover from that so I don't think they're in that bad of a position. Airbus lost their shorts on the A380 I'm not sure if they recovered the 25 or 30 billion that was spent for start-up and research and development
@@garyhughes9649 they have problems with their planes . So this is not due to the pandemic
Boeing have failed at being Boeing. An era is gone that will never return.