For me, the real epiphany was not discovering where I should switch between F and B-flat; it was discovering that I could switch AT WHIM however I felt like it. Passage involves a lot of twisted fingers? Try changing that note from the B-flat side to the F side to make the fingering easier. Can't make that F below middle-C loud enough on the F side? Switch to the B-flat side, where it comes out a little stronger. Big octave jumps? Just stay on the same side the whole way through.
Absolutely. Once you understand how both sides work you can be creative using both sides to solve problems. I think sound needs to be the main driver: if it sounds good, then use whatever side works. The only word of caution I’d add is that on top quality horns, you can usually match the sounds of the F and Bb sides pretty well. On lesser instruments there may be a too noticeable change in sound colour to freely move between the two sides.
Certain fingerings on each side of the horn open up lip slur possibilities, along with alternate fingering possibilities. Sometimes, rather than fiddling with fingers it's easier just hold the fingering in the same position, or alternate one finger only to do a run. Once you know which side is easier to do the passage on, practice that until you've got it, because you'll generally only need to work on getting the embouchure/airspeed rather than complicated fingering too.
Hornist for 35+ years. I play primarily on the Bb side, too. Even in high school and college, I would request parts in F when marching with a Bb instrument, then use the fingerings from the Bb horn. Matter of fact, my next horn will most likely be a single Bb with either high F or Eb descant and an A stopping valve. I'll keep my double for 2nd and 4th horn parts, but I rarely need the F side for horn 1 or horn 3. As for the G4 and F#4 on the Bb side (C5 and B4 concert), T13 is only 2 cents out of tune for the G and T123 is only 2 cents out of tune for the F# (as opposed to 14 cents playing T1 or T12, respectively). Theoretically, those fingerings should be more in tune for G5 and F#5 as well, but T0 and T2 should only be 4 cents off, but some of that depends on the throat size and flare.
I'm actually working now to build myself an F-Bb-High F triple horn, so I've made a nice little spreadsheet of tube lengths at required frequencies and their respective harmonics. It's amazing how changing the taper of the lead pipe and tail section can alter the overtones. I'm hoping to end up with a modular design that will allow me to swap not just a screw bell, but the entire tail section and lead pipe. Or even remove the valve assembly to swap between rotary and pumpenvalves (or even convert to a natural horn). The fittings should work like compression fitting for copper plumbing, with thumb screws to remove the supports.
Concernant the compensated system, it’s not always bad for the F side. Example : the f horn of the olds Selmer’s pistons double horn is really good, much better than Alexander 103 for example ! It’s a very good system for euphoniums or tubas for example. I don’t know why it’s not more developped for the French horn !
Completely agree, mine stands in Bb and use F side like you do or depending on the passage. Sometimes it's just easier to play major arpeggios in the F horn rather than using cumbersome fingerings on the Bb one. Also, not all horns are equal sounding in both registers or equal in tune, so that also plays a factor.
Yep, alternative F fingering can be useful. Like you say, depends on instrument quality and also the skill of the player, to make sure that sound quality is not compromised
For me, the real epiphany was not discovering where I should switch between F and B-flat; it was discovering that I could switch AT WHIM however I felt like it. Passage involves a lot of twisted fingers? Try changing that note from the B-flat side to the F side to make the fingering easier. Can't make that F below middle-C loud enough on the F side? Switch to the B-flat side, where it comes out a little stronger. Big octave jumps? Just stay on the same side the whole way through.
Absolutely. Once you understand how both sides work you can be creative using both sides to solve problems. I think sound needs to be the main driver: if it sounds good, then use whatever side works. The only word of caution I’d add is that on top quality horns, you can usually match the sounds of the F and Bb sides pretty well. On lesser instruments there may be a too noticeable change in sound colour to freely move between the two sides.
You're absolutely correct
Thank you!
Certain fingerings on each side of the horn open up lip slur possibilities, along with alternate fingering possibilities. Sometimes, rather than fiddling with fingers it's easier just hold the fingering in the same position, or alternate one finger only to do a run. Once you know which side is easier to do the passage on, practice that until you've got it, because you'll generally only need to work on getting the embouchure/airspeed rather than complicated fingering too.
Hornist for 35+ years. I play primarily on the Bb side, too. Even in high school and college, I would request parts in F when marching with a Bb instrument, then use the fingerings from the Bb horn. Matter of fact, my next horn will most likely be a single Bb with either high F or Eb descant and an A stopping valve. I'll keep my double for 2nd and 4th horn parts, but I rarely need the F side for horn 1 or horn 3. As for the G4 and F#4 on the Bb side (C5 and B4 concert), T13 is only 2 cents out of tune for the G and T123 is only 2 cents out of tune for the F# (as opposed to 14 cents playing T1 or T12, respectively). Theoretically, those fingerings should be more in tune for G5 and F#5 as well, but T0 and T2 should only be 4 cents off, but some of that depends on the throat size and flare.
I'm actually working now to build myself an F-Bb-High F triple horn, so I've made a nice little spreadsheet of tube lengths at required frequencies and their respective harmonics. It's amazing how changing the taper of the lead pipe and tail section can alter the overtones. I'm hoping to end up with a modular design that will allow me to swap not just a screw bell, but the entire tail section and lead pipe. Or even remove the valve assembly to swap between rotary and pumpenvalves (or even convert to a natural horn). The fittings should work like compression fitting for copper plumbing, with thumb screws to remove the supports.
Concernant the compensated system, it’s not always bad for the F side. Example : the f horn of the olds Selmer’s pistons double horn is really good, much better than Alexander 103 for example !
It’s a very good system for euphoniums or tubas for example. I don’t know why it’s not more developped for the French horn !
Completely agree, mine stands in Bb and use F side like you do or depending on the passage. Sometimes it's just easier to play major arpeggios in the F horn rather than using cumbersome fingerings on the Bb one.
Also, not all horns are equal sounding in both registers or equal in tune, so that also plays a factor.
Yep, alternative F fingering can be useful. Like you say, depends on instrument quality and also the skill of the player, to make sure that sound quality is not compromised