I wonder if Tywin was just setting things up for when she took over, he suggested to his enemy Oberen that he should fight them. My headcanon is that Tywin was just going to give up at that point, because there’s no beating motherfuckin’ dragons.
@@marco7838 Don't forget that Red Keep was the seat of every single Targaryen dragon lord and lady, so pretty every dragon that ever graced the sky of Westeros ended up with his skull displayed in Red Keep.
I love that Tywin’s like “y’all need to relax about the whole dragon thing” and then when it’s just him and Oberyn he’s like “yeah I’m not relaxed about this dragon thing... pls help”
@@rafaelfarias4359 They weren't really a "match" tho. Yes, the Ullers managed to down Rhaenys and Meraxes but her siblings Aegon I the Conqueror and Visenya then went on to burn 'every' settlement in Dorne repeatedly for the next two years (dubbed the Years of the Dragon's Wroth). Then during King Jaehaerys I the Conciliator's reign, he invaded Dorne atop Vermithor to put down the Vulture King. The Dornish didn't dare oppose him. Next, when Morion Martell tried to invade Westeros, Jaehaerys and his sons burnt him, his entire army and fleet in just one afternoon with 0 casualties (dubbed the War of the One Hundred Candles). The only thing that stopped them from flying directly to Sunspear and crushing it underfoot was Jaehaerys' reluctance to acquire the clusterfuck that was Dorne. He already had his plate full with his reformation of his Kingdoms. Then, Daeron I the Young Dragon invaded and conquered Dorne with 0 dragons. Dorne only escaped when they slew Daeron under a Peace Banner (something akin to the Red Wedding) and his successor; Baelor I, was a wimp. Eventually, Daeron II the Good brought Dorne into the fold with a marriage pact.
@@princepscivitatis4083 But in the end Dorne always managed to resist forced subjugation, Dorne is basically like Afghanistan, the Targaryens can defeat their armies, burn or occupy their cities, force the nobility to bend the knee, it doesn't matter the result will be the same, Daeron lost 10.000 men conquering Dorne and another 40.000 - 50.000 men (depending on the source) trying to hold it, even if Daeron hadn't been killed the occupation of Dorne was impossible to maintain in the long term, Dorne effectively resisted all the invasion attempts through various means and in the end Dorne kept a very significant amount of autonomy and special rights that no one else had after joining diplomatically.
first of all, these scenes were a season apart. plenty of time for him to research more about her. and its before he learns Dany's got 2 seasoned Westerosi knights backing her
Tywin is in a state down with his grandson twice over. He knows once those dragons are full grown their screwed, ALL of them. But if he shows one moment of weekends to his king then he will forever be just another hand whipping for the king.
I feel Tywin knew Daenerys would be a huge problem, he just didn't want to show himself worry, unlike Cersei who trully believed Dany was just a girl with pets. My only regret is that Tywin didn't live to see his army destroyed by the girl who's father he betrayed.
Prateek Mehta I agree. And I think Tywin could do something that would trick Dany into doing something foolish. Eliminate her in a similar way like Robb
- Why nobody tell me Daenerys is gonna ride three dragons towards me and burn me alive? - Majesty, what would you do to someone who would tell you this would happen? - I would behead him. - Any more questions?
I always laugh when Cersi tries to downplay the dragons all the time like in the scene she says "baby dragons." Bitch! By the time she said that Drogon was already a good size
The Littlefinger scene is funny because in the books it’s not a lie at all, the iron throne is literally made of thousands of swords all twisted together several feet high. Much cooler than the chair with a few spikes in the show, but I get why that would be difficult and expensive to recreate.
The throne room in the books is massive! GRRM has described it as the size of Saint Peters Basilica. The thrones is about forty feet high and the seat is twenty feet up and has a staircase made of swords to get access to it
@@cochulito7023 I just found out a recent update about the release date, which I posted on my channel. HBO has confirmed that HoTD will be released after July, in the second half of the year.
Nah he would have been rubbing his hands with glee first confident that he kill them all with Qyburn's Scorpion first. Then piss his pants when realized the futility. Too bad Joffrey never got eaten by one or charred boiled to ash on the spot.
Three dragons? Already Aegon discovered that three dragons are overkill. One dragon per city is all you will ever need, and already one is quite plenty.
I think he likes some particular history that gets his attention. Something 'awesome' or just cruel in nature. He idolised Maegor the Cruel, and even learns about the deep dark torture dungeon under Red Keep. Dragons is infamous with carnage, so our ol Joffrey is absolutely right to be restless 🤭
@@finnkyrie4569 To be fair, Maegor had the right idea when it came to fighting the rebels and killing Maesters. The only problem came when one of his nephews turned on him after being prompted by others.
Probably a "Super runaway" moment whilst crying, similar to the Battle of the Blackwater. Joffrey in the series reacts to real danger with fear and expecting others to spirit him away to safety. I would be much more interested in Tywin's reaction to the girl whose family he slaughtered turning up with dragons.
If you watch only this video and know literally nothing else about Game of Thrones, you would literally think Joffrey is a level headed, rational young king concerned about a very real threat
- When they grow up we will be fucked. - If they do. - They do. - We are all fucked! - Yes we are. - For sure. - Aye. - Want some wine? - Let us drink!
Tywin thought like a great leader. He was only downplaying the dragons bc he didn't want to send everyone into a panic. Tywin knew very well about the history of the Targaryen dragons and what they were capable of. His many spies told him about how the dragons, The Dothraki and Unsullied were fkn shit up. But He was trying to squash a few rebellions, control Joffrey, secure The North, the Reach and Dorne, get rid of Tyrion and wake Jamie tf up. He knew he couldn't fight Deanerys if the kingdom wasn't united. Tywin was very worried. His comment " armies win wars" was just another downplay to give hope to his allies against Her dragons. He didn't want his allies freaking out then quickly bending the knee to Danerys once she crossed the sea. He knew he was outmatched against the dragons. Every night he would sit on the pivy from leaving the brothel he would say to himself. "THIS BITCH REALLY GOT THREE DRAGONS"
the problem is even if he could unite the 7 kingdoms he would not have had a chance if Dany could also unite the dothraki as she did.. Ned and Robert were talking about that if Drogo's khalasar crosses the narrow sea then they will camp them out in their castles because they don't have a chance in an open battle against them and the dothraki are famously bad in sieges.. but Dany managed to unite all of the khalasars (it is hard to tell the exact number, but we know that Khal Drogo had 100k men in his army, so as there were 10-12 khals in Dosh khaleen we can assume that she had like 300-500k dothraki in her army) and she also got the unsulied and 3 dragons +Dorn would never ever side with the Lannisters against Dany and there is no way Tywin could have force them to obey
@Alpha Wolf you mean you googled and the wiki said 40k without any exact source (like book and chapter) xd I was talking about the show where it was said that Drogo had 100k men.
denial is not a good means of avoiding panic. and this does not explain downplaying the threat in private. and he shouldn't have even been trying to unite westeros against dany, for that matter he shouldn't have bothered trying to play the game of thrones the conventional way. he should just have tried to marry joffrey to dany and let them conquer westeros. what a power couple!
That "There's not a thousand swords' line is genuinely pretty funny considering George RR Martin said he imagined as the staircase leading up to the throne, then the area around it, then the spaced from the throne to the wall behind as all being swords
He was stupid, psychotic and an all around brat, but Joffrey knew the history of the Targaryens. The scenes of him showing Sansa Balerion’s skull and how Raneyra died shows us that. So his concern was not only a valid one, but the one moment Joffrey was capable of using his knowledge to come to a good judgement
@@kennethnwebb It'd be easier to refer to historical events with an approximated timespan anyways, for example the Hundred Years' War which actually lasted for 116 years.
@@joshf9074 in this analogy it's more like tywin is stalin: he's got his head in the sand regarding an inevitable future invasion because he knows how bad it'll be. but dealing with many enemies at once is only a problem if you fight them conventionally, which doesn't work with dragons anyways.
@@urmama54 Aegon the conqueror had a dream about something horrific happening to the world, and wanted to bring all of the realm under one crown so they can prepare for that eventual danger. Because he and his sister-wives had dragons, Frighteningly large and war trained dragons, they conquered everything and everyone. Except Dorne. Aegon made the iron throne from the sword of his enemies, and thus began the Iron Throne and Targaryen Rule. Until Robert’s Rebellion. Basically, Targaryens belong on the Iron Throne and are the rightful rulers of Westeros. Everyone thought no more, when Rob Baratheon took over and the dragons were dead. But Daenerys was a major threat because she is the mother of dragons…Then D&D fucked it all up and we are waiting on the last two books to find out what really happens
Interesting how Tywins power over Joffrey was highlighted the most when Joffrey was actually being a competent ruler…. It goes to show who holds the real cards… in the show, and in history.
Some people missed what is happening in the scene with Joffery and Tywin. Tywin definitely sees her as a future threat which is why he was working to undermine her. For example he sent the letter to Jorah knowing Barrison would read it where they basically tell them their top military advisor is a spy working for westeros. He also appointed Oberyn to the high council and was willing to sell out the mountain just to get Dorn on board against Dany and her dragons. This scene had nothing to do with Tywin not seeing Dany as a threat, this scene was showing that Tywin dgaf about what Joffery thinks.
@@Anthony_RIZZelneck No he knew he would read it, they specifically sent it to him. They talked about it in a small council meeting, Tywin instructed Varys to do it. It's literally shown on screen.
@@Anthony_RIZZelneck You're mixing up the episodes. In season 4 episode 6 after being briefed on Danys status in Mareen Tywin says he will deal with her, with force if it comes to it. He then asks Varys if he can get his birds to deliver a message and Varys replies "most certainly". Tywin then tells Mace Tyrell to fetch his quill and paper. That is the letter Selmy got.
Tywin didn’t pay close attention to the history of Aegon’s conquest. “Armies win wars all the time.” Armies we’re laid waste to many times over due to dragon fire.
Also he was wrong about dragons not winning a war for 300 years. They very much played the primary part of the Dance, and it was 170 years before the series' start
@@misterrominade7928 Dragons didn't win the Dance since both sides had them. Of course, you're still right in principle because if one side hadn't had dragons they would have been wiped out in less than a year.
Man I freaking love Tywin. One of the proudest Lords in Westeros. Ruthlessly savage when necessary, and shrewd politician and administrator. But smart and humble enough to admit to a known enemy that he needs them to fend off a greater threat. Such an awesome character
Tywin’s greatest feat is making people think he’s actually all that great. He was a cruel monster who really thought and reacted from emotion and not pragmatism as he has others think. Kevan, his brother, actually fits the description you described of Tywin. Tywin is massively overrated and is at best one of the most proficient administrators westeros had, except for when he got rid of some rights that gave the small folk more protection, so he’s also against civil rights. Tywin L
@@neneray310 he remove aegon the unlikely's laws because nobles don't like it and are not really following it. It also sounds like something that curb a lord's power in their domain to give a little bit to their smallfolks. That's probably when they realised the throne no longer have the power to enforce its law so long as they band together and agree to the same thing, which is remove the law for the rights of smallfolk, which led to king egg going desperate with dragons and dying in summerhall
Interesting that HotD made sure to add a crap ton of swords surrounding the Iron Throne. They wanted to make it clear "Yes, the legend was real. You imbeciles."
As for the iron throne not having a thousand blades. With House of the Dragon being out. I think what happened was they removed swords over time because of either rust, injury, or just flat out discomfort.
The Funny thing is that Drogon, even at the end was not fully grown. He was still a child, but so huge. I can't wait to see the huge dragons in House of the Dragons.
Coming back and watching this after watching HOTD is so sad. Knowing they did exist and were strong at one point but a war between themselves is what ruined it all.. also makes Dany even more incredible, the last Targaryen (before we find out about Jon) with not 1 but 3 dragons under her command whewww…
Notice how quickly Daenerys and Jon turned against each other once Jon's parentage was revealed. The Targs were always going to eat each other alive, always. They were strong only because of the dragons. Take the dragons away, and they were just ordinary men.
Tywin was remarkably stupid when it came to the tactical advantage of Dragons. “Dragons haven’t won a war in 300 years”. Difficult for them to win wars when they aren’t present. It’s like someone in 1945 saying nuclear bombs have never won a war, but swords have won many.
He wasn’t stupid. He knew exactly how terrifying and dangerous the three Dragons are. Buts he’s downplaying it to everyone, so they don’t panic and start bending the knee en masse to save themselves from a fiery demise. He knows him bending the knee will get him and his house destroyed because of how he betrayed the Mad King. So his only choose to fight. Be he can only fight once he’s dealt with all the other problems, like the wildlings, the literal war that’s going, the Greyjoy rebellions and all the other crap he has to deal with. So he downplays it until he can united Westeros as seven kingdoms. That’s exactly why he visits Oberon in the last clip, even though the hatred between the Lannisters and Dorne. He’s very serious about the threat. He needs them to fight the dragons.
@@theAEDan reading between the lines is a critical skill in literacy. If you know what the rest of book are like (if you’ve actually read them). George has little to zero plot holes, and he doesn’t directly explain everything yo the reader. Like how Jon’s parents is never told (in the books), but we can all assume it’s Rheagar. Why else would Tywin speak to Oberyn unless if he really needed the help? Especially when Oberyn is likely just to kill him there and then for what he did to his sister. Oberyn was probably there to kill Tywin and Gregor as well. But that didn’t work out.
@@weedsmoke8776 true, equally you could just idealise the author/ character. Fans have an amazing capacity for generating theories and excuses for a characters silly decisions if that is the case.
Some people argue that Joffrey would probably go the way of cersei and believe in the power of scorpions against dragons, but I think as a scholar and admirer of Targaryen history he knew that dragons, if fully grown, would be invulnerable against scorpions. He would most likely surrended at the first sign of Dany's army on the horizon
The bad writing in the show prevails here. In the books a scorpion is only effective if it hits a dragon square in the eye. Which happened once. They’re mostly useless against a dragon’s scales.
@@weedsmoke8776 yes, and it's stupid that in the show, Qyburn and cersei believed that scorpions could be useful just for crossing balerion skull. as if living dragons don't have seemingly invulnerable skins over their bones
Wtf are you taking about? Queen Rhaenys and her Dragon were shot down and liquidated by a Scorpion bolt in Dorn. Scorpions certainly could kill dragons.... its just that aiming and pulling it off is very difficult. But it can be done.
@@daddy_1453 you seem to forget that the dragon that was killed in dorne was struck in the eye. Pulling a shot off like that would be like asking you to shoot at an A-10 buzzing you and hitting the pilot. It’s pretty much impossible. Scorpions are not effective weapons against dragons, they can’t pierce the scales and if a Dragon is targeting them, they can get 1 shot off
@@weedsmoke8776 That's not exactly true. Dragon scales hardens as the dragon age. Which means younger dragons generally have softer scales compared to the older ones, and Daenerys dragon's were only, at least 3 years old if not mistaken. So, her dragons' scales can most definitely be penetrated by scorpion bolts
Sometimes i wonder how characters in GOT would react if aegon the conqueror just randomly showed up from the dead with no explanation, what would their reaction be to him after telling his story’s as if they’re all just lies to scare ppl.
i like that baelish says that the iron throne has less than 200 blades because in house of the dragon we see that the throne is twice as tall and surrounded with hundreds of blades
One thing about Tywin that confused me was his indifference to the dragons. He knew she had dragons. She knew they were growing. And there were THREE of them. Why wasn’t this a bigger deal? The only person who seemed to care was Robert - and even HE didn’t know about the dragons because they didn’t exist yet!
Tywin very well considered Danaerys a threat, which is why he sought alliance with Oberyn and Dorne. He wasn't indifferent, he was keeping Joffrey and the council in check by downplaying their significance. It's easier to handle threats if ur allies aren't panicking which was Tywin's aim
@@browniebear none of what you said can really be validated or verified by watching the show. Maybe he sought that alliance because of Dany… maybe not. And it’s never explicitly revealed he was trying to downplay the significance; who would he be downplaying it to? Joffrey? Who cares what he thinks? He has no real power, Tywin won’t let him. Whose he going to incite? I’m not saying you’re wrong. I’m just saying it’s not something you can say with absolute certainty.
@@gnarlynicholasreviewsscroll through the comments. One guy explained it perfectly. Tywin just might be the only man in the west who took the threat in the east seriously. He already had plans set in motion. - rebuilding a relationship with the dorne - breaking up Daenerys' inner circle (exposing Jorah's secret) And more, some guy put it all together nicely in this very comment section.
It apparently only took 7 years for Drogon in particular to get as big as he did by season 8. The only legitimate wisdom Jeffrey ever had was they should have done something right then. I'm curious to how he would have done things faced with Daenerys in the end with a massive Dragon and no hope of winning. Would he have been as vicious still or would he have cowered and backed down?
I think he would’ve tried to come up with some plans but he would’ve panicked and hid when push came to shove and it’s hard to say who would lead the charge then
Joffrey is a sadistic cunt but was shown many times to be a coward. The moment he sees one of those dragons he would've yielded or the most likely case he would've forced someone else to do the work and end up getting betrayed.
1:57 Even though Joeffery was the worst possible king a kingdom could ever ask for, his line “but how do we know these dragons are just curiosities and not the beasts that brought the whole world to heel?” is by far the smartest line of king Joefferys dialogue
I just love the fact that Tywin is constantly lying about history, but is too convincing for others to see OR too dreadful for others to speak up. “Balerion died 300 years ago”, “haven’t won a war in 300 years” are both untrue statements. I understand that the show probably made mistakes on it... I mean sure. But I love the little headcanon. Balerion died a little over 200 years ago... and the many non-conquest wars against Dorne... the War in the Stepstones... or even the Dance of the Dragons were won with dragons. All happend after Aegon’s Conquest and about 150 years before the events of GoT.
Tywin isnt admitting a dámn thing for the simple reason he just wont admit that the Targaeryen girl with her dragons would be a threat to him, his armies, his wealth: his Power! If he would, people might get ideas... like secretly plotting behind his back, wíth the Targaeryen girl! Which is exactly what happened when Tywin was dead and Cersei's maniacal rule took over: Cersei pushed too hard, and too far! Thats why the Realm started to turn on Cersei: The Dornish and the Reach sided with Danaerys! Thát is what Tywin managed to prevent! Cersei never realised that. No, for as long as Tywin lived/ruled, he MUST project that hé is and remains thé most powerful man in Westeros, and the rest of the World! He's not delusional, he knows! But as long as people believe that HE is the most powerful one in the world... "Power resides, where men believe it resides....". Tywin is just repeating that power resides with him, and no one else!
@@WritingGeekNLThe war didn't end there...With Rhaenyra and Daemon dead the new leader of the Black faction was Aegon 3... That's why the Black army countinued fighting
1:54 _Tywin's gonna roast Joffrey, just watch._ "Because we have been told as much by the many experts who serve the realm by counseling the King *on matters about which he knows nothing."* _Ahhhh. There it is._
In the books it never really comes up since Daenerys is so far away and the spread of information is so slow. Occasionally, someone brings up rumours of dragons but they're brushed aside since there's often rumours of lots of things
that makes no sense, spy networks should do better than that. if information exchange is no better than that organizations like the iron bank couldn't function.
“And then there will be nowhere to hide.” Modern air forces, fighter jets, drones, bombers are pretty much nonbiological dragons. Whoever controls the skies rules the world.”
@@brianchapman8531 Nah. Daenerys is the Daughter of the Mad And his sister wife Raella Targaryen. Elia was the wife of Daenerys' brother Prince Rhaegar who gave him two children the Prince Aegon and the Princess Rhaenys who was murdered by the men of Lord Tywin Lannister, Amory Lorch and the Mountain. She was stabbed to death and Aegon was presumably murdered by the Mountain who dashed his skull to pieces on a wall. However in the books their is a Young man in command of the Golden Company, a mercenary army, claiming to be Prince Aegon and claims to be the rightful King of the Seven Kingdoms. Whether the real Prince Aegon was murdered by the Mountain or a substitute was made while the real Aegon escaped is a matter of much speculation.
@@marcelrodriguez2067 It's simple swords not valyrian steel. And that's not how valyrian steel is made, you dont just blow dragonfire on normal steel to make it valyrian.
Whats funny to me as a history buff is that this reminds me of when Germany became a single entity (the first time) and great Britain among others had a "quiet" freak out at the thought of an industrial power house popping up across an all too narrrow sea, just knowing that sooner or later they were gonna have to deal with them.
People forgot to realize that Tywin is right. The westeros is at chaos, they just done fighting the wars of 5 kings. Their bannermen are tired, and realm need to be stabilized at this point. March to Essos for the small scale of problem wouldn't be the wise thing to do at this point. There are million things need to be prioritize. To prevent their problem, they still kep their army prepared and ready, and a spies sent to fed them the information. That would be enough during these scenario. Thing Tywin missed is that how badly he treated his children. Tywin and the peace of realm died in the hand of his children. By forcing Cercei to marry Loras, making her having no more options but to sided with the Religious army, and whatever the hell he put Tyrion through throughout his entire life. Well. Aside from that, he is indeed very wise with this decision.
@@xxwhispersxx2856Oberyn wasn’t that childish or immature. He wouldn’t blame Daenerys for Rhaegar’s mistakes, she hadn’t even been born. He wouldn’t have “hated” her. If he were that ridiculous, he would have hated Myrcella for being Tywin’s granddaughter.
Everyone calling Joffrey smart is missing the big picture. He's not smart for calling Dany a threat. Everyone knew she was a threat. Hell, Robert tried to kill her long before she had dragons. As long as the Targaryen name is alive, she would always be a threat. Joffrey was idiotic because he was placing more focus on a threat thousands of miles away instead of the threat a few miles away. By that point in the series the Lannisters were exhausted by war with the Baratheons and the Starks. They needed to still protect themselves from the Tyrells who were becoming a threat (despite being allies). There's no point to worrying about Dany if your not alive when she finally does invade. Like Tyrion told Varys when he was first warned about Dany and her dragons, "a girl at the edge of the world is the least of our problems".
Mannnn those were the times... So much nostalgia when I used to wait a whole year to watch game of thrones... ,😭😭 Say what you will about the ending the first few seasons were awesome!!!
"There aren't a thousand blades" Yeah cos they the showrunners changed the Iron Throne's look from the books where there is literally a steps to the throne made of blades.
HotD shows a closer similarity to the Iron Throne in the books. Its not unthinkable that Robert Baratheon ordered a majority of those thousands blades to be removed, to show the END of the Targaeryen sovereignity, yet kept the last 200+ ish blades of the seat, to maintain the iconic Iron Throne
“Dragons haven’t won a war in 300 hundred years” I think someone gotta explain Tywin that’s maybe because they were thought extinct? That or that they were fighting each other during the dance of dragons or they didn’t have a war to fight before that🤷🏻♂️
May be screwed up but, I find Joeffrey’s straight forward attitude and mindset very relatable to mine own in this scene. Been a while since I’ve watched the show, but I felt like Joeffrey would have made a good King given the right advisor. Or in the very least upbringing.
Tbf Tywin deserves far less admiration than he usually receives. People claim that he was the only intelligent person in a sea of idiots, but do you think that was a coincidence? Tywin constantly suppressed everyone’s opinion around him because he had to be right all the time, most sadly with his children. A good father would’ve raised them to be self-sufficient, but what did they turn out to be? Incestuous murderers. Clear deficiencies in parenting. Joffrey too, Tywin just gives orders, thinking that with force, everything’s possible, but humans don’t function that way, emotionally. For a short period of time, force is indeed the best control, but no human likes to be consciously controlled, so they’ll revolt- and the only way you could truly change & shape them is through teaching, making them develop their own understanding (and if you’re machiavellian, you can easily manipulate their education to make them become exactly what you want them to be), as Tywin started to do with Tommen at the end. Philosophy, not force, so it was indeed a misstep of Tywin & Cersei that Joffrey turned out to be this cruel, and even though he was a sadistic, narcissistic tyrant, he wasn’t entirely stupid, meaning that there was always potential within him to become a good king, it’s always about education in such trifles.
![Tyrion Plays The Game Of Thrones [HD]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Di8Z7rJ9vnI/mqdefault.jpg)
For all of Joeffrey's stupidity he was the only one right about the dragons lol
He talked so much sh#*t that when he was saying something relevant nobody took him seriously.
I wonder if Tywin was just setting things up for when she took over, he suggested to his enemy Oberen that he should fight them.
My headcanon is that Tywin was just going to give up at that point, because there’s no beating motherfuckin’ dragons.
Who’s and what dragons were under the red keep in kings landing? The one of the skulls. There were 2 or 3 under there which died years back
What was he right about?
@@marco7838 Don't forget that Red Keep was the seat of every single Targaryen dragon lord and lady, so pretty every dragon that ever graced the sky of Westeros ended up with his skull displayed in Red Keep.
I love that Tywin’s like “y’all need to relax about the whole dragon thing” and then when it’s just him and Oberyn he’s like “yeah I’m not relaxed about this dragon thing... pls help”
He needed Dorne bc they were the only ones who were a match for the Dragons in Aegon's Conquest.
@@rafaelfarias4359
They weren't really a "match" tho.
Yes, the Ullers managed to down Rhaenys and Meraxes but her siblings Aegon I the Conqueror and Visenya then went on to burn 'every' settlement in Dorne repeatedly for the next two years (dubbed the Years of the Dragon's Wroth).
Then during King Jaehaerys I the Conciliator's reign, he invaded Dorne atop Vermithor to put down the Vulture King. The Dornish didn't dare oppose him. Next, when Morion Martell tried to invade Westeros, Jaehaerys and his sons burnt him, his entire army and fleet in just one afternoon with 0 casualties (dubbed the War of the One Hundred Candles). The only thing that stopped them from flying directly to Sunspear and crushing it underfoot was Jaehaerys' reluctance to acquire the clusterfuck that was Dorne. He already had his plate full with his reformation of his Kingdoms.
Then, Daeron I the Young Dragon invaded and conquered Dorne with 0 dragons. Dorne only escaped when they slew Daeron under a Peace Banner (something akin to the Red Wedding) and his successor; Baelor I, was a wimp.
Eventually, Daeron II the Good brought Dorne into the fold with a marriage pact.
@@princepscivitatis4083 But in the end Dorne always managed to resist forced subjugation, Dorne is basically like Afghanistan, the Targaryens can defeat their armies, burn or occupy their cities, force the nobility to bend the knee, it doesn't matter the result will be the same, Daeron lost 10.000 men conquering Dorne and another 40.000 - 50.000 men (depending on the source) trying to hold it, even if Daeron hadn't been killed the occupation of Dorne was impossible to maintain in the long term, Dorne effectively resisted all the invasion attempts through various means and in the end Dorne kept a very significant amount of autonomy and special rights that no one else had after joining diplomatically.
Tywin to his grandson “do not worry about dragons my lord.”
Also Tywin to his worst enemy “We need you to fight these dragons.”
It was also a tactic to try turn one of the most dangerous men away from causing problems for his family
first of all, these scenes were a season apart. plenty of time for him to research more about her. and its before he learns Dany's got 2 seasoned Westerosi knights backing her
Yea-- his grandson was an ass.
Tywin is in a state down with his grandson twice over. He knows once those dragons are full grown their screwed, ALL of them. But if he shows one moment of weekends to his king then he will forever be just another hand whipping for the king.
@@SpottedHares those the dragons are screwed by D&D.
I feel Tywin knew Daenerys would be a huge problem, he just didn't want to show himself worry, unlike Cersei who trully believed Dany was just a girl with pets.
My only regret is that Tywin didn't live to see his army destroyed by the girl who's father he betrayed.
Emilce Diaz ikr! It sucks how a lot of important characters died before they could see the dragons. I would’ve loved to see their reactions.
WOAH WOAH WOAH, ARYS WAS AN ASSHOLE TO TYWIN. HE DESERVED WHATEVER HE GOT.
Prateek Mehta I agree. And I think Tywin could do something that would trick Dany into doing something foolish. Eliminate her in a similar way like Robb
Aerys kind of deserved it after all the things he put tywin through, if anything it was more satisfying to see aerys betrayed by tywin.
He treated the wildling army the same way
The one time Joffery acted like a king.
- Why nobody tell me Daenerys is gonna ride three dragons towards me and burn me alive?
- Majesty, what would you do to someone who would tell you this would happen?
- I would behead him.
- Any more questions?
@@u.v.s.5583 - Any last words?
...and Tywin owned him for évery pathetic second of it!
I always laugh when Cersi tries to downplay the dragons all the time like in the scene she says "baby dragons." Bitch! By the time she said that Drogon was already a good size
Noah Suptho she was in such a denial when Drogon burned King’s Lansing and she said “the red keep never fell and it won’t fall today”
@@marcelomenacho7832 red keep roof fall on her. 😂
@@marcelomenacho7832 MIND U , the Targaryens BUILT the Red keep I’m sure they can burn it.
😒Tywin: don't distrust you because you're a woman.
I distrust trust you because you're not as smart as you think you are.
How cersei can be stupid . Red keep has never fallen. Thanks for D&D
The one time joffrey was actually right
There's another scene where he suggested the creation of a royal army trained by the best soldiers. I'd say that he made a good point in it.
and then was promptly shut down by Cersei pointing out the logistical problems with maintaining singular loyalty amongst that royal army.
and yet what does each country have today.. One army
Logan smith it’s funny how Joffrey was so insane he forgot he lived in medieval times.
Another incident...when jofree says my father fought the real war when u hide on castle rock to tywin
The Littlefinger scene is funny because in the books it’s not a lie at all, the iron throne is literally made of thousands of swords all twisted together several feet high. Much cooler than the chair with a few spikes in the show, but I get why that would be difficult and expensive to recreate.
The throne room in the books is massive! GRRM has described it as the size of Saint Peters Basilica. The thrones is about forty feet high and the seat is twenty feet up and has a staircase made of swords to get access to it
They are adding more Swords to the Throne/steps in House of the Dragons...
@@cochulito7023 There was a rumor I heard that it might come out in July but nothing has been confirmed yet.
@@cochulito7023 I just found out a recent update about the release date, which I posted on my channel.
HBO has confirmed that HoTD will be released after July, in the second half of the year.
@@ultimatebookmaniacs have you seen the throne the new series what y'all think of it?
if joffrey survived his wedding I can see his face seeing dany with the unsullied dothraki and 3 full grown dragons outside of kingslanding
if joffrey survived his wedding he would execute twyin for not listen to him about the dragons, i like twyin but he really fuck up here
Nah he would have been rubbing his hands with glee first confident that he kill them all with Qyburn's Scorpion first. Then piss his pants when realized the futility. Too bad Joffrey never got eaten by one or charred boiled to ash on the spot.
Three dragons? Already Aegon discovered that three dragons are overkill. One dragon per city is all you will ever need, and already one is quite plenty.
@@xAVErRvISCARRa Tywin's entire life is one massive fuck up.
@@concept5631 In the books he was pretty bad ass when he was younger
Joeffry in a couple episodes showed he knew his history as he loved to read, he knew from the stories how strong a threat they could be
Poor Joffrey. We shall not see his like again.
I think he likes some particular history that gets his attention. Something 'awesome' or just cruel in nature. He idolised Maegor the Cruel, and even learns about the deep dark torture dungeon under Red Keep. Dragons is infamous with carnage, so our ol Joffrey is absolutely right to be restless 🤭
@@finnkyrie4569 To be fair, Maegor had the right idea when it came to fighting the rebels and killing Maesters. The only problem came when one of his nephews turned on him after being prompted by others.
@@mr.k418 kill a few poor fellows, burn one sept, and suddenly you're the bad guy
@@osmundkettleback5815 exactly, you get it. And I love the name.
I really wish Joffrey lived to see the dragons. Would've loved his reaction.
He probably would have been like "I told you so!" and then surrendered.
Probably a "Super runaway" moment whilst crying, similar to the Battle of the Blackwater. Joffrey in the series reacts to real danger with fear and expecting others to spirit him away to safety. I would be much more interested in Tywin's reaction to the girl whose family he slaughtered turning up with dragons.
If you watch only this video and know literally nothing else about Game of Thrones, you would literally think Joffrey is a level headed, rational young king concerned about a very real threat
Watching this again gives me chills, then I remember how everything ended and everything fades away.
lmao i know right! im never gonna recover tbh
I wish there were more conversations like this during the show
Samee. I really enjoyed seeing how everyone in Westeros spoke about Daenerys' progression.
- When they grow up we will be fucked.
- If they do.
- They do.
- We are all fucked!
- Yes we are.
- For sure.
- Aye.
- Want some wine?
- Let us drink!
@@keanancupido Yeaaaaaassss
Tywin thought like a great leader. He was only downplaying the dragons bc he didn't want to send everyone into a panic. Tywin knew very well about the history of the Targaryen dragons and what they were capable of. His many spies told him about how the dragons, The Dothraki and Unsullied were fkn shit up. But He was trying to squash a few rebellions, control Joffrey, secure The North, the Reach and Dorne, get rid of Tyrion and wake Jamie tf up. He knew he couldn't fight Deanerys if the kingdom wasn't united. Tywin was very worried. His comment " armies win wars" was just another downplay to give hope to his allies against Her dragons. He didn't want his allies freaking out then quickly bending the knee to Danerys once she crossed the sea. He knew he was outmatched against the dragons.
Every night he would sit on the pivy from leaving the brothel he would say to himself. "THIS BITCH REALLY GOT THREE DRAGONS"
the problem is even if he could unite the 7 kingdoms he would not have had a chance if Dany could also unite the dothraki as she did.. Ned and Robert were talking about that if Drogo's khalasar crosses the narrow sea then they will camp them out in their castles because they don't have a chance in an open battle against them and the dothraki are famously bad in sieges.. but Dany managed to unite all of the khalasars (it is hard to tell the exact number, but we know that Khal Drogo had 100k men in his army, so as there were 10-12 khals in Dosh khaleen we can assume that she had like 300-500k dothraki in her army) and she also got the unsulied and 3 dragons
+Dorn would never ever side with the Lannisters against Dany and there is no way Tywin could have force them to obey
@Alpha Wolf you mean you googled and the wiki said 40k without any exact source (like book and chapter) xd
I was talking about the show where it was said that Drogo had 100k men.
It is often that the harder you try to hold on to power, the quicker the rope slips from your hands…
denial is not a good means of avoiding panic. and this does not explain downplaying the threat in private. and he shouldn't have even been trying to unite westeros against dany, for that matter he shouldn't have bothered trying to play the game of thrones the conventional way. he should just have tried to marry joffrey to dany and let them conquer westeros. what a power couple!
😆 🤣
Imagine Joffrey's face to seeing zombie Viserion haha.
The way Daenerys made a name for herself, causing everyone to talk about her😭
Queen shit
@waves5777😂😂😂
All up in her business😂
That "There's not a thousand swords' line is genuinely pretty funny considering George RR Martin said he imagined as the staircase leading up to the throne, then the area around it, then the spaced from the throne to the wall behind as all being swords
CXVII 117 R what does that even mean? Foreshadowing kind of has to be intended
@@ethanhogan2463 He's just laughing because the show Iron Throne =/= the book IT which is fuck massive and a thousand is an understatement.
The rest of the swords are beneath the ground, the throne is like an iceberg.
@@aruakise9803 yeah, according to the artist who drew what GRRM considers the definitive depiction of the Iron Throne it has 50,000 swords
I think that’s what House of Dragons showed in their first episode! There were swords everywhere
He was stupid, psychotic and an all around brat, but Joffrey knew the history of the Targaryens. The scenes of him showing Sansa Balerion’s skull and how Raneyra died shows us that. So his concern was not only a valid one, but the one moment Joffrey was capable of using his knowledge to come to a good judgement
It wasn't Sansa he was showing that to, it was Margaery
Honestly would have loved to see the reaction of all these characters shitting themselves to witness Drogon, Viserion and Rhaegal full grown. Lmao
They really portrayed the fear of the dragons and House Targaryen very well.
Balerion did not die 300 years before this, more like 200. He did returned to valerya even.
Was probably easier for TV to relate everything back to Aegon’s conquest (300 years) than always change the timeline for each event.
in real life sometimes we forget some facts...so I didn't expect the characters to have such detailed memory....maybe Tyrion but not everyone else
@@kennethnwebb It'd be easier to refer to historical events with an approximated timespan anyways, for example the Hundred Years' War which actually lasted for 116 years.
tywin said "to whom it belonged to". so he is saying aegon died 300 years ago.
@@lewis0705 Tywin was refering to Balerions skull, not Balerion himself.
This is like the one time Joffrey was actually smart lol
Poor Joffrey. We shall not see his like again.
@@thereaction8648 yeah it’s sad but I miss him lol
You don’t fight 10 battles at once. Just ask the Germans.
@@joshf9074 in this analogy it's more like tywin is stalin: he's got his head in the sand regarding an inevitable future invasion because he knows how bad it'll be. but dealing with many enemies at once is only a problem if you fight them conventionally, which doesn't work with dragons anyways.
Knowing the history of the Targaeryen’s conquest changes the whole viewing experience of this show.
Ikr! Really excited for the house of the dragons
can anyone pls write out a short summary of said conquest history? thanks
@@urmama54 dragons go vrrrrrrrooooooom and destroy every army
@@doranduwang8541 k, dragons r op
@@urmama54 Aegon the conqueror had a dream about something horrific happening to the world, and wanted to bring all of the realm under one crown so they can prepare for that eventual danger. Because he and his sister-wives had dragons, Frighteningly large and war trained dragons, they conquered everything and everyone. Except Dorne. Aegon made the iron throne from the sword of his enemies, and thus began the Iron Throne and Targaryen Rule. Until Robert’s Rebellion. Basically, Targaryens belong on the Iron Throne and are the rightful rulers of Westeros. Everyone thought no more, when Rob Baratheon took over and the dragons were dead. But Daenerys was a major threat because she is the mother of dragons…Then D&D fucked it all up and we are waiting on the last two books to find out what really happens
Joffrey: "but I haven't been counseled"
Tywin: "you are being counseled at this very moment"
Interesting how Tywins power over Joffrey was highlighted the most when Joffrey was actually being a competent ruler…. It goes to show who holds the real cards… in the show, and in history.
I wish I WISH Tywin could've witnessed the dragons burning his entire army alive.
Some people missed what is happening in the scene with Joffery and Tywin. Tywin definitely sees her as a future threat which is why he was working to undermine her. For example he sent the letter to Jorah knowing Barrison would read it where they basically tell them their top military advisor is a spy working for westeros. He also appointed Oberyn to the high council and was willing to sell out the mountain just to get Dorn on board against Dany and her dragons.
This scene had nothing to do with Tywin not seeing Dany as a threat, this scene was showing that Tywin dgaf about what Joffery thinks.
That's weak sauce, though. He needs to be taking much stronger actions than merely inconveniencing dany.
Yea he had no idea Barrison would read that scroll. They send out multiple of the same message in case a Raven doesn't make it
@@Anthony_RIZZelneck No he knew he would read it, they specifically sent it to him. They talked about it in a small council meeting, Tywin instructed Varys to do it. It's literally shown on screen.
@@Bitchslapper316 the hand wax seal was Ned's, Vareys sent it when instructed by Ned on Robert's death bed.
@@Anthony_RIZZelneck You're mixing up the episodes. In season 4 episode 6 after being briefed on Danys status in Mareen Tywin says he will deal with her, with force if it comes to it. He then asks Varys if he can get his birds to deliver a message and Varys replies "most certainly". Tywin then tells Mace Tyrell to fetch his quill and paper. That is the letter Selmy got.
Tywin didn’t pay close attention to the history of Aegon’s conquest.
“Armies win wars all the time.”
Armies we’re laid waste to many times over due to dragon fire.
It's cause he thought they wouldn't grow to be big at all. As he said, some dragon skulls were the size of an apple.
seeing Tywin almost smile at the end was funny
@@shelneselie7532 I so wish he would’ve lived long enough to see Drogon descend on Kings Landing, just so he could eat his words.
Also he was wrong about dragons not winning a war for 300 years. They very much played the primary part of the Dance, and it was 170 years before the series' start
@@misterrominade7928 Dragons didn't win the Dance since both sides had them. Of course, you're still right in principle because if one side hadn't had dragons they would have been wiped out in less than a year.
Man I freaking love Tywin. One of the proudest Lords in Westeros. Ruthlessly savage when necessary, and shrewd politician and administrator. But smart and humble enough to admit to a known enemy that he needs them to fend off a greater threat. Such an awesome character
I love him too, but he dropped the ball here. Never dismiss a dragon
@@YamatoTre That’s what I was saying. When he said he needed the help of the Martells as they were the only one to resist Aegon’s dragons.
Tywin’s greatest feat is making people think he’s actually all that great. He was a cruel monster who really thought and reacted from emotion and not pragmatism as he has others think. Kevan, his brother, actually fits the description you described of Tywin. Tywin is massively overrated and is at best one of the most proficient administrators westeros had, except for when he got rid of some rights that gave the small folk more protection, so he’s also against civil rights. Tywin L
@@neneray310 he remove aegon the unlikely's laws because nobles don't like it and are not really following it. It also sounds like something that curb a lord's power in their domain to give a little bit to their smallfolks. That's probably when they realised the throne no longer have the power to enforce its law so long as they band together and agree to the same thing, which is remove the law for the rights of smallfolk, which led to king egg going desperate with dragons and dying in summerhall
Well... they do have bones..so complete disbelieve might indeed be hard, but they did a good job of showing the skepticism.
Only victim in game of thrones was Elia martell, everytime when I see Oberyn he was full of vengeance against the mountain and lannisters.
Only victim? What did Myrcella ever do wrong? Same with Shireen Baratheon.
Interesting that HotD made sure to add a crap ton of swords surrounding the Iron Throne. They wanted to make it clear "Yes, the legend was real. You imbeciles."
Using auto captions and Tywin says “you are being cancelled” 🤣
The only time Joeffrey was intelligent and acted like a king. Asking the important questions and considering different possibilities
As for the iron throne not having a thousand blades. With House of the Dragon being out. I think what happened was they removed swords over time because of either rust, injury, or just flat out discomfort.
I think it was Baelor the blessed when he put all the religious faith of the 7 symbols in the throne room.
@@ansaranduin Heh... you were wrong with that ;)
The answer is, they didn't want to do that huge design for the throne.
The Funny thing is that Drogon, even at the end was not fully grown. He was still a child, but so huge. I can't wait to see the huge dragons in House of the Dragons.
Pls is that another movie?
@@emmanuelisa3196 it is a HBO series coming in August 21
What do you think about the show and the size of them dragons so far?? Pretty amazing huh
@@rogermazuca4582 The dragons in HOTD are more realistic
@@buzzkill36 or budget friendly
Coming back and watching this after watching HOTD is so sad. Knowing they did exist and were strong at one point but a war between themselves is what ruined it all.. also makes Dany even more incredible, the last Targaryen (before we find out about Jon) with not 1 but 3 dragons under her command whewww…
Notice how quickly Daenerys and Jon turned against each other once Jon's parentage was revealed. The Targs were always going to eat each other alive, always. They were strong only because of the dragons. Take the dragons away, and they were just ordinary men.
Tywin is one of the top characters in GOT, and Charles Dance is easily the best actor on the entire show.
Despite being a vicious fool, Joffrey had enough sense to be concerned about the dragons and Danerys
02:14 wait..did I hear Snape speaking?!?
Now after HOTD, it seems One Thousand Swords story isn't a lie. Just one random king decided to put them out of the throne room.
Tywin was remarkably stupid when it came to the tactical advantage of Dragons. “Dragons haven’t won a war in 300 years”. Difficult for them to win wars when they aren’t present. It’s like someone in 1945 saying nuclear bombs have never won a war, but swords have won many.
He wasn’t stupid. He knew exactly how terrifying and dangerous the three Dragons are. Buts he’s downplaying it to everyone, so they don’t panic and start bending the knee en masse to save themselves from a fiery demise. He knows him bending the knee will get him and his house destroyed because of how he betrayed the Mad King. So his only choose to fight. Be he can only fight once he’s dealt with all the other problems, like the wildlings, the literal war that’s going, the Greyjoy rebellions and all the other crap he has to deal with. So he downplays it until he can united Westeros as seven kingdoms.
That’s exactly why he visits Oberon in the last clip, even though the hatred between the Lannisters and Dorne. He’s very serious about the threat. He needs them to fight the dragons.
@@weedsmoke8776 and does it say all this somewhere? Or are you just assuming?
@@theAEDan reading between the lines is a critical skill in literacy. If you know what the rest of book are like (if you’ve actually read them). George has little to zero plot holes, and he doesn’t directly explain everything yo the reader. Like how Jon’s parents is never told (in the books), but we can all assume it’s Rheagar. Why else would Tywin speak to Oberyn unless if he really needed the help? Especially when Oberyn is likely just to kill him there and then for what he did to his sister. Oberyn was probably there to kill Tywin and Gregor as well. But that didn’t work out.
@@weedsmoke8776 true, equally you could just idealise the author/ character. Fans have an amazing capacity for generating theories and excuses for a characters silly decisions if that is the case.
@@theAEDan Still doesn't explain why Tywin asked Oberyn for help if he didn't think he needed it.
The look that he gives him at 3:05 is everything 🔥🔥🔥🔥
Joffrey actually being smart...holy shit.
Poor Joffrey. We shall not see his like again. 😉
Some people argue that Joffrey would probably go the way of cersei and believe in the power of scorpions against dragons, but I think as a scholar and admirer of Targaryen history he knew that dragons, if fully grown, would be invulnerable against scorpions. He would most likely surrended at the first sign of Dany's army on the horizon
The bad writing in the show prevails here. In the books a scorpion is only effective if it hits a dragon square in the eye. Which happened once. They’re mostly useless against a dragon’s scales.
@@weedsmoke8776 yes, and it's stupid that in the show, Qyburn and cersei believed that scorpions could be useful just for crossing balerion skull. as if living dragons don't have seemingly invulnerable skins over their bones
Wtf are you taking about? Queen Rhaenys and her Dragon were shot down and liquidated by a Scorpion bolt in Dorn. Scorpions certainly could kill dragons.... its just that aiming and pulling it off is very difficult. But it can be done.
@@daddy_1453 you seem to forget that the dragon that was killed in dorne was struck in the eye. Pulling a shot off like that would be like asking you to shoot at an A-10 buzzing you and hitting the pilot. It’s pretty much impossible. Scorpions are not effective weapons against dragons, they can’t pierce the scales and if a Dragon is targeting them, they can get 1 shot off
@@weedsmoke8776 That's not exactly true. Dragon scales hardens as the dragon age. Which means younger dragons generally have softer scales compared to the older ones, and Daenerys dragon's were only, at least 3 years old if not mistaken. So, her dragons' scales can most definitely be penetrated by scorpion bolts
Sometimes i wonder how characters in GOT would react if aegon the conqueror just randomly showed up from the dead with no explanation, what would their reaction be to him after telling his story’s as if they’re all just lies to scare ppl.
The throne belongs to the Targaryen family only. Seeing anyone else sit on it makes me so mad.
i like that baelish says that the iron throne has less than 200 blades because in house of the dragon we see that the throne is twice as tall and surrounded with hundreds of blades
Who else ended up here after watching House of the Dragon season 1? 🙋🏼♂️
Man even when Tywin was utterly wrong (the scene with Joffrey) it still felt like he was right, man speaks with such authority.
yea u gota fact chek dem mfz
Aegon I really left a legacy
The legacy should continue somehow after Season 8 finale.
One thing about Tywin that confused me was his indifference to the dragons.
He knew she had dragons. She knew they were growing. And there were THREE of them. Why wasn’t this a bigger deal? The only person who seemed to care was Robert - and even HE didn’t know about the dragons because they didn’t exist yet!
Tywin very well considered Danaerys a threat, which is why he sought alliance with Oberyn and Dorne. He wasn't indifferent, he was keeping Joffrey and the council in check by downplaying their significance. It's easier to handle threats if ur allies aren't panicking which was Tywin's aim
@@browniebear none of what you said can really be validated or verified by watching the show. Maybe he sought that alliance because of Dany… maybe not. And it’s never explicitly revealed he was trying to downplay the significance; who would he be downplaying it to? Joffrey? Who cares what he thinks? He has no real power, Tywin won’t let him. Whose he going to incite?
I’m not saying you’re wrong. I’m just saying it’s not something you can say with absolute certainty.
@@gnarlynicholasreviewsscroll through the comments. One guy explained it perfectly. Tywin just might be the only man in the west who took the threat in the east seriously. He already had plans set in motion.
- rebuilding a relationship with the dorne
- breaking up Daenerys' inner circle (exposing Jorah's secret)
And more, some guy put it all together nicely in this very comment section.
Its so interesting to see that many of the things they thought to be tall tales were very much true stories
It apparently only took 7 years for Drogon in particular to get as big as he did by season 8. The only legitimate wisdom Jeffrey ever had was they should have done something right then. I'm curious to how he would have done things faced with Daenerys in the end with a massive Dragon and no hope of winning. Would he have been as vicious still or would he have cowered and backed down?
I think he would have surrendered the throne to her in exchange for Casterly rock. That's what Cersie should have done.
I think he would’ve tried to come up with some plans but he would’ve panicked and hid when push came to shove and it’s hard to say who would lead the charge then
Joffrey is a sadistic cunt but was shown many times to be a coward. The moment he sees one of those dragons he would've yielded or the most likely case he would've forced someone else to do the work and end up getting betrayed.
now you see, if drogon got that big in just 7 years of lifespan then just imagine how big was balerion coz he was said to be 200 yrs old when he died
@@Bitchslapper316 and what makes you think that she will stop there?
1:57 Even though Joeffery was the worst possible king a kingdom could ever ask for, his line “but how do we know these dragons are just curiosities and not the beasts that brought the whole world to heel?” is by far the smartest line of king Joefferys dialogue
2:15...Tywin sounded EXACTLY like Snape!!
Incredible. I was wondering why it felt so familiar.
He, moff tarkin, and snape are on the same spectrum of stern, drawling englishmen
Obviously.
Damn 😁
I just love the fact that Tywin is constantly lying about history, but is too convincing for others to see OR too dreadful for others to speak up.
“Balerion died 300 years ago”, “haven’t won a war in 300 years” are both untrue statements.
I understand that the show probably made mistakes on it... I mean sure. But I love the little headcanon.
Balerion died a little over 200 years ago... and the many non-conquest wars against Dorne... the War in the Stepstones... or even the Dance of the Dragons were won with dragons. All happend after Aegon’s Conquest and about 150 years before the events of GoT.
Tywin isnt admitting a dámn thing for the simple reason he just wont admit that the Targaeryen girl with her dragons would be a threat to him, his armies, his wealth: his Power!
If he would, people might get ideas... like secretly plotting behind his back, wíth the Targaeryen girl! Which is exactly what happened when Tywin was dead and Cersei's maniacal rule took over: Cersei pushed too hard, and too far! Thats why the Realm started to turn on Cersei: The Dornish and the Reach sided with Danaerys! Thát is what Tywin managed to prevent! Cersei never realised that.
No, for as long as Tywin lived/ruled, he MUST project that hé is and remains thé most powerful man in Westeros, and the rest of the World!
He's not delusional, he knows! But as long as people believe that HE is the most powerful one in the world...
"Power resides, where men believe it resides....". Tywin is just repeating that power resides with him, and no one else!
Technically the dance of the dragons ended with an army in kings landing with the dragons wiped out
@@nicmagtaan1132
It didn't. The war ended when a dragon ate his meal. And the last dragon would only die years, if not decades, later.
@@WritingGeekNLThe war didn't end there...With Rhaenyra and Daemon dead the new leader of the Black faction was Aegon 3... That's why the Black army countinued fighting
Joffrey should've started barking decrees the second Tywin confirmed his suspicions. You're the king goddammit
One of the only times joffrey was actually acting like a king
Imagine if this had stayed good the entire length of the series
"The biggest was the size of a carriage"
*Sees Vhagar*
Is this in Season 4 when Cercei says : " Baby Dragons " ?
Watching after House of the dragon
Funny thing how Joffrey turned out to be right to be concerned about Dany’s dragons
The only time joffrey was thinking about something crucial and important. He was turned down.
1:54 _Tywin's gonna roast Joffrey, just watch._
"Because we have been told as much by the many experts who serve the realm by counseling the King *on matters about which he knows nothing."*
_Ahhhh. There it is._
In the books it never really comes up since Daenerys is so far away and the spread of information is so slow. Occasionally, someone brings up rumours of dragons but they're brushed aside since there's often rumours of lots of things
that makes no sense, spy networks should do better than that. if information exchange is no better than that organizations like the iron bank couldn't function.
@@scottmatheson3346 sure, but it's not really in varys's interest to let the truth be known.
It’s scary when Joffrey’s the one that’s thinking straight 😂
Reading Fire & Blood this hits differently knowing alot of the game of thrones lore
Oberyn in his mind „I‘ll be on her side so quick“
One of the biggest regret I have is to not see joffrey and Tyron actually see Daenerys dragons
Like I imagine them being shocked
You mean, Tywin
1:20 That only moment Joffrey actually used his brain by purpose
“And then there will be nowhere to hide.”
Modern air forces, fighter jets, drones, bombers are pretty much nonbiological dragons. Whoever controls the skies rules the world.”
Kind of bold of Tywin to ask Oberyn to stand with him against his niece, no?
Daenerys is not Oberyn's niece. Where did you get that idea?
@@gerardjagroo I'm not hip to all the inner-workings. I thought Elia was Daenerys's mother, but I see that Elia was her sister-in-law.
@@brianchapman8531 Nah. Daenerys is the Daughter of the Mad And his sister wife Raella Targaryen.
Elia was the wife of Daenerys' brother Prince Rhaegar who gave him two children the Prince Aegon and the Princess Rhaenys who was murdered by the men of Lord Tywin Lannister, Amory Lorch and the Mountain. She was stabbed to death and Aegon was presumably murdered by the Mountain who dashed his skull to pieces on a wall.
However in the books their is a Young man in command of the Golden Company, a mercenary army, claiming to be Prince Aegon and claims to be the rightful King of the Seven Kingdoms.
Whether the real Prince Aegon was murdered by the Mountain or a substitute was made while the real Aegon escaped is a matter of much speculation.
If that throne was made out of melted sword blades, wouldn't it be a bit rusty after 300 years?
mattwho81
Not unless they're Valerian steel
Eric Jones
That was the dumbest thing you could say.
I think it's forged in Dragon's breath..Dragons are magical..
Not to mention its been cared for..polished.
@@andrejanastasovski1189 how is that stupid? Valyrian steel never loses its sharpness or rust. Its made with magic.
@@marcelrodriguez2067 It's simple swords not valyrian steel. And that's not how valyrian steel is made, you dont just blow dragonfire on normal steel to make it valyrian.
epic battle we never had, daenerys and her dragons versus cersei and her elephants.😂
Whats funny to me as a history buff is that this reminds me of when Germany became a single entity (the first time) and great Britain among others had a "quiet" freak out at the thought of an industrial power house popping up across an all too narrrow sea, just knowing that sooner or later they were gonna have to deal with them.
I wished that Joffrey lived long enough for Drogon to eat him
Tywin: No need to worry about dragons.
Also "Tywin": She (Daenerys) must be dealt with...
threatened by Aegon I
Petyr roasting the iron throne because of
showrunners couldn't make the actual throne is most petyr thing to do
"And the largest was the size of a carriage"
Balerion's skull - clearly larger than a carriage.
People forgot to realize that Tywin is right. The westeros is at chaos, they just done fighting the wars of 5 kings. Their bannermen are tired, and realm need to be stabilized at this point. March to Essos for the small scale of problem wouldn't be the wise thing to do at this point. There are million things need to be prioritize. To prevent their problem, they still kep their army prepared and ready, and a spies sent to fed them the information. That would be enough during these scenario.
Thing Tywin missed is that how badly he treated his children. Tywin and the peace of realm died in the hand of his children. By forcing Cercei to marry Loras, making her having no more options but to sided with the Religious army, and whatever the hell he put Tyrion through throughout his entire life.
Well. Aside from that, he is indeed very wise with this decision.
I would have loved Dany and Tywin to meet and see the conversation. Even more so between Dany and Oberyn. Could have been legendary.
Oberyn would have hated her because of what her brother did to his sister.
@@xxwhispersxx2856Oberyn wasn’t that childish or immature. He wouldn’t blame Daenerys for Rhaegar’s mistakes, she hadn’t even been born. He wouldn’t have “hated” her. If he were that ridiculous, he would have hated Myrcella for being Tywin’s granddaughter.
my favorite line about dragons: "Perchance, ponder me Dragon mine own family heirlooms 'cross thine countenance." :)
Everyone calling Joffrey smart is missing the big picture. He's not smart for calling Dany a threat. Everyone knew she was a threat. Hell, Robert tried to kill her long before she had dragons. As long as the Targaryen name is alive, she would always be a threat.
Joffrey was idiotic because he was placing more focus on a threat thousands of miles away instead of the threat a few miles away. By that point in the series the Lannisters were exhausted by war with the Baratheons and the Starks. They needed to still protect themselves from the Tyrells who were becoming a threat (despite being allies). There's no point to worrying about Dany if your not alive when she finally does invade.
Like Tyrion told Varys when he was first warned about Dany and her dragons, "a girl at the edge of the world is the least of our problems".
When Joffrey says biggest was the size of a carriage, does he mean Balerion cus that's one big ass carriage
Mannnn those were the times... So much nostalgia when I used to wait a whole year to watch game of thrones... ,😭😭 Say what you will about the ending the first few seasons were awesome!!!
"There aren't a thousand blades"
Yeah cos they the showrunners changed the Iron Throne's look from the books where there is literally a steps to the throne made of blades.
HotD shows a closer similarity to the Iron Throne in the books.
Its not unthinkable that Robert Baratheon ordered a majority of those thousands blades to be removed, to show the END of the Targaeryen sovereignity, yet kept the last 200+ ish blades of the seat, to maintain the iconic Iron Throne
I wish Tywin had scene Drogon!🤣🤣🤣
“Dragons haven’t won a war in 300 hundred years” I think someone gotta explain Tywin that’s maybe because they were thought extinct? That or that they were fighting each other during the dance of dragons or they didn’t have a war to fight before that🤷🏻♂️
Joeffrey reminds me of the boy who cried wolf.. the one time he had something meaningful to say it wasn't taken serious
God I wish Tywin could have been alive still when Dany showed up in Westeros
i like how joffrey tests Tywin...its so amusing
I hope we get an Aegon I prequel and his conquest
0:46 im pretty sure its not a lie I mean there's giant freaking skulls in the basement
May be screwed up but, I find Joeffrey’s straight forward attitude and mindset very relatable to mine own in this scene. Been a while since I’ve watched the show, but I felt like Joeffrey would have made a good King given the right advisor. Or in the very least upbringing.
Funny how nor Tywin nor Joffrey ever lived to see the actual dragons that did come to Westeros a few years later.
Tbf Tywin deserves far less admiration than he usually receives. People claim that he was the only intelligent person in a sea of idiots, but do you think that was a coincidence? Tywin constantly suppressed everyone’s opinion around him because he had to be right all the time, most sadly with his children. A good father would’ve raised them to be self-sufficient, but what did they turn out to be? Incestuous murderers. Clear deficiencies in parenting. Joffrey too, Tywin just gives orders, thinking that with force, everything’s possible, but humans don’t function that way, emotionally. For a short period of time, force is indeed the best control, but no human likes to be consciously controlled, so they’ll revolt- and the only way you could truly change & shape them is through teaching, making them develop their own understanding (and if you’re machiavellian, you can easily manipulate their education to make them become exactly what you want them to be), as Tywin started to do with Tommen at the end. Philosophy, not force, so it was indeed a misstep of Tywin & Cersei that Joffrey turned out to be this cruel, and even though he was a sadistic, narcissistic tyrant, he wasn’t entirely stupid, meaning that there was always potential within him to become a good king, it’s always about education in such trifles.