How Should You Break In A Diesel Engine?
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- čas přidán 25. 07. 2024
- Breaking in a Diesel Engine is a very subjective and contentious subject for how to do it properly. This video discusses what is happening during the break in process.
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I had my 3406E rebuilt in 2013 , mechanic told me to run it like i always do. I hooked to a load of paper and hammered down. Runs great , uses no oil , great motor.
That 9:00 minute mark after mention of the "keystone" piston ring shape and it's purpose being to push out against the cylinder wall is what i came for. Most people don't realize that idling a diesel washes the cylinders resulting in premature cylinder and cylinder pack wear.
That is true Brian, I don't know of a single manufacturer that recommends idling their engine.
briansmobile1 what about high idle? Say 1,100 rpm
briansmobile1 I live in Canada and it gets real cold sometimes, whenever i idle my diesel I high idle it, I've often considered installing an exhaust brake because I imagine with that load on the engine even at idle it would create more EGT's keeping your motor warmer and create that pressure for the rings to seat properly, what do you think of that idea?
@@AdeptApe idling anything is not good for it. 2 strokes. rotorys. gas motors. diesels especially but anything. motors were ment to produce power. freewheeling under no load like you said. the pressure is what helps seat the rings which is also what keeps them from getting blow by. for a diesel idling makes it not fully burn the fuel and it just washes the oil off the side of the cylinders so they get less lubrication and the rings not being seated from the cylinder pressure helps you get fuel in your oil and most diesels like to make that knocking sound at idle or low rpm cause the expanding gas just smacks the piston instead of pushing it which i imagine doesnt make it last longer. as far as i know the smacking makes the piston smack in the cylinder and that can hurt the piston and even erode the outside of the cylinder liners cause it cavitates the coolant
Josh Simpson high idle is fine. You just don’t want your rpms low. Low rpms cause diesel slobber (carbon sludge) that gums up the piston rings and causes piston sticking, liner scoring, and all the problems that come with piston/cylinder clearance issues.
My uncle spent his career as a diesel engine mechanic. Mostly with Cummins. When they'd rebuild an engine they start it up, apply a full dyno load at maximum power, and leave it there for 30 minutes. If it survived it was broken in and perfect. If the slightest flaw was present it would seize. All or nothing.
That's pretty well what I've been taught and experienced. It it's gonna break it'll break when you load it to full power.
One of the best and clearest explanations of this procedure! Thank you for this info, you are a great teacher and your channel deserves more attention!
Coming from a cummins tech, I love your videos and still gather so much information from them!
This guy knows his job well only if I knew where his shop is
just ask him lol
@@raven4k998 He's not gonna tell you, you know that right? I THINK he's in Idaho, but don't quote me on that.
Wisconsin. I'm pretty sure
@@jaysontryka509 where in Wisconsin?
Idaho falls area Idaho would be my guess. Western states cat and it isn’t in Missoula.
This is such a great detailed video. I just finished learning about the basic operation and components engines in my diesel class. I could have watched this video and passed the test without any prior knowledge.
Finally some sound advice on breaking in an engine. 100% agree with this method. 👍
You the MAN Josh ! ! ! 👍🏻👍🏻✊🏻👊🏻
Currently breaking in my new tractor.First diesal engine.Mowing 40 acres of Pasture at 75 to 85 percent of max recommended rpm.
Fantastic information as always...thankyou.
Excellent work. Wish more mechanics thought like this about engines. Succinct, good enough for diesel apprentice class.
Great info. 👍👍
Josh, thank you. You are my teacher!
Thank you for sharing all this info
I love your videos. Very clear cut information that can be used in exponentially unknown situations. Thanks big guy and keep your stick on the ice
I bought a new cummins diesel truck and ram/cummins recommends in agreement with Adept Ape that I should give it some good loaded runs, tow something during the break in period. But I didnt have anything to tow, so the best I could do was to accelerate the vehicle up ever hill I came to during the first 10k miles. I dont know if that helped but it was the best I could do.
Interesting info, thank you William Ambrogio
A big hell yea thanks for all the advice
Another great video, and get oil samples every change
Always reassuring when “break in” opinions match your own!!
🇦🇺. Thanks for sharing always very interesting
Respect to this guy
Very professional Josh! You would make a terrific teacher. The shop is fortunate to have you.
Thank you for saying that. I would like to be an instructor one day perhaps.
Adept Ape you’re welcome Josh. Always enjoy your videos. Only ones I feel compelled to watch because I know they will be interesting and informative. You and your family have a great Memorial Day.
@@AdeptApe Hey, Josh. Would love to get in contact with you. Is there an e-mail for that?
We had a problem with a brand new slow running trawler engine It was fitted with a variable pitch propeller so that full power could be used at slow towing speeds. The skipper thought he was looking after the engine by running on just above idle with the pitch wound down, lightly loading the engine. He also shortened the manufacturer's recommended interval for the first oil change, replacing the running in oil which the engine had left the factory with, with the recommended grade for normal running. The running in oil had a lower viscosity to allow an initial amount of wear during the first period, combined with light load the result was glazed bores. Oil consumption was abnormally high with grey exhaust smoke. After busting the glaze on the bores and fitting new rings the problem was solved. The skipper was instructed to run the engine on maximum revs (1200 RPM) while increasing the propeller pitch (load) until black smoke appeared from the exhaust (overload condition) then turn the pitch back until the exhaust cleared. No more problems, oil consumption was normal. Keep a new engine working at varied speeds above half speed, maintain the temperature of the engine and the oil at the temperature it is supposed to be at. Avoid black exhaust smoke start as you mean to go on. Work an engine within its limits.
Great as usual🥇
The only recommendation I would make, is to change the oil and filter(s) immediately after the dynamometer session, before delivering to the customer. Those initial oil changes are as, or more critical than the actual break-in procedure.
Great video. Thank you.
Yet another great video Josh! How do you feel about exhaust brakes and do they play any role in breaking in whether good or bad? Should they not be used for a period of time or are they beneficial during warm up or while descending grades etc...? Thanks buddy!
Good explanation. That's what I was taught as well. Load the engine early and load it heavy. Properly sealed rings should last a while.
Here's a question you might have an answer for. I did an in frame on an isuzu 4.8L ( I specialize on Isuzu trucks). In the rebuild I did bearings ( overhead cam) pistons/liners, injector tips gaskets etc. Original cam and polished the crank properly. I got the timing 180 out on the cam, no big deal its non interference apparently. So I pull the VC and go to pull the cam , just from cranking it over for maybe 30 seconds the cam bearings looked scored , no scoring on the cam journals which was interesting. Any ideas as to how I messed up ? I changed the cam bearings again and it's been running fine with good oil pressure for about 2 years now.
Thanks Adept Ape! You explained this clearly. It is valuable information, and sure beats all the conflicting anecdotes from different sources.
It makes me wonder how well an engine could get broken in, when rebuilt by a shop with no dynamometer.
Good video man. I agree put a diesel to work!
I also like to put 2 stroke oil in the tank every fill up for the first 25k. After that I tone it back, but alwasy put it in my tank. I have an older 6.6 Ford diesel, and a lot of older Ford guys in my area do the same, and told me about this.
Exelent video very helpfull, Thx
Thank you bro!
just what i was looking for. however what would you do if do if the loads are light.
Excellent video mate.
Would you recommend the same process with smaller 3l in line 4 diesels say in a 4x4 .
Looking for this answer too.
How would you recommend breaking in an engine that’s in a bucket truck that runs a PTO all day
explained very well
As usual, professional advice ROTB (right off the bat). Keep on the pro work
and keep those dogs happy!
excellent
We typically start our race motors for Atleast 60 seconds without coolant so you don’t have any hotspots in the bores from air in the cooling system. Hasn’t failed me yet. Good video.
we have a series 60 Detroit Fire Engine type 6 . that has a 5 Speed Trans. With Jake brake . holds 650 gal. water. 46.000 gr. Wt. it is harder to maintain proper rpm. for brake in period as it will shift in auto. also during brake in is using Jake advised for brake in process? Lee
Hi. I have an old L70c and thinks it need more fuel. Is that possible to adjust? It does not smoke and takes about 5-10sec to start coold and warm. And when driving The turbo and rpm takes time to boost up.. Thanks
Awesome thanks
Hey my name is Al we have a 88 Lt8000 cid 240 Ford/International we recently had a rebuild on it it's oregenal problem was a dropped valve in number six cylinder I believed it was the intake side. Not using allot of rpm coming to a stop light not using rpm down sh iffling.I locked up the whole motor the motor has been rebuildt it seems to have a small vibration in it at low rpm could it be afront balancer issue other than that great oil pressure
Hello,
I have a 2005 Renault Laguna 2 1.9 Dci (F9Q 750) (120 HP) that have been rebuilt on Feb 11. Everything has been renewed with new ones except crankshaft, camshaft and piston rods. The reason of rebuilding it was burning oil (350ml / 1000km and blue smoke especially on cold) and high blowby at idle on oil cap. The cylinders has been bored by 0.5mm and new oversized pistons inserted. The car runs fine without any leaks, without any smoke at operating temperature and it's powerful now. Still has a little bit of blowby smoke on pcv valve at idle at operating temperature but i hope it'll be gone when break-in procedure is finished.
My concern is, the service put a factory suggested Elf Evol 900 SXR 5W40 "Fully Synthetic" oil as initial oil and then they tested the car without my approval. They even said they redlined it on highway and went to 170 kmh which is contrary to break-in period and initial break-in hours. I researched about the break-in oil and break-in procedures and learned a few things but it was too late to tell them to service. They already done this stage. They didn't know about break-in oil anyway and said "use the oil which is recommended by factory as we did it like this". When i asked them about break-in procedure, they said drive it like you want it, it won't matter...
Since rebuilt, i've driven the car for 300 kilometers in 7 days and following the break-in procedures. Not lugging it, not overreving it, not passing 3000 rpm and avoiding full throttle sudden accelerations. I've been avoiding idling it for extended time. I've been using the RPM band widely as much as i can to help seating the rings to walls. In 3rd gear, accelerating smoothly from 2000 to 2800ish rpms then letting the foot off the gas and it drops slowly to 2000 again and repeating it on different gears when driving. Not driving it like a cruise control on same RPM.
My question is, should it break in like this with fully synthetic oil which is on the car for 260 kilometers? Should i stay with the synthetic oil inside until i reach 800kms and change it or should i change the oil and oil filter to mineral oil like Castrol GTX Essential 15W40 etc. immediately? I fear to glaze the cylinder walls or rings and can't successfully do the break-in procedure with the synthetic oil inside. I fear to damage the healthy turbo or other components with mineral oil too but the turbo repair is much more cheaper than an engine job which i paid significant amount of money. Is it too late for switching to mineral oil? Are my cylinders have been already glazed and rings wont seat as i fear this to happen? How should i test that?
What do you recommend in a situation like this? I was planning to do the first oil change when i reach 800kms after rebuild, then the second at 1300km and the 3rd at 4000km. I just want the engine to have a healthy break-in procedure and have a long life and decent performance. The money spent on oils and oil changes is not that much important. I want to drive this car healthy for 3-4 years, equals to 30.000 or 40.000 kilometers with my recent driving hours. I bought the car at August 2020 and have been fixing the problems caused by previous owner, sadly. I’m waiting for your advice, thank you for reading this and thanks for helping.
What is the best gear ratio for a balance fuel economy and pulling power for up to 82,000 pounds
exelente video
Do you possibly know if a DT12 Auto/Newer Freightliner Transmission can be mated to a Pre emissions 12.7L Detroit 60 Series engine?
I did a platinum rebuilt by Cat on my truck and they never told me this, i don’t even think it says on the paperwork that i got from them! Now i have low oil pressure, lots of blow by check engine light and diesel in oil! I took it back, they said they will check it out, i have 2.5 yrs warranty so hopefully they’ll get it done soon.
Could you shed some light on how to run in a rebuilt LD23
What kind of oil you recommend? Thanks
After I've rebuilt an engine I bleed it as fast as possible using vacuum bleeding. I then tell the owner to load her up don't let her lug down low in the revs but don't over rev it just keep the revs nice n healthy fully loaded. All of my rebuilds I've done haven't used oil or coolant and no oil leaks so far
Bro you the best
Thanks for the tips, just got my 6NZ C15 rebuilt after 1.2million Miles of service, now is time for a second round of miles,🐈the best,,
Did a Cat/Mitsubishi engine last yr and they wanted break in to be in 4 steps 25,50,75,100 percent load/time with cooling periods between steps
I drove from semi's for 42 years, and I always worked them without overheating them. The last I owned had over 1.26 million miles when I sold it. The next guy got a year out of before he rebuilt the 3406 cat 425 air to air.
I just got my C-15 built and put the new rerate in with the IVA deleted. Hooked it to a 35 ton load of wood and let her rip! Shes ripping too🔥💯
Dear Adept Ape,
I rebuilt an STC Mechanical L-10 300 Cummins with an aftermarket Interstate-McBee kit. I set the overhead with it running at idle (10 minutes tops). I then put it to work. Had excessive blowby. Still have excessive blowby at 50,000 miles. Took to Cummins, they indicated that it needed rebuilt!!! Yikes! So evidently then rings didn't seat. What do I do to make them seat? Truck is not worth the cost of another inframe rebuild. I did have a reliable source suggest putting scouring powder in the air intake with it running to scratch the cylinders to aid in break in. I don't feel comfortable doing that. Ideas??????? I have rebuilt many other gas and Diesel engines successfully, now this is a problem child.
With the 10-24 litre marine engines we do once the engine is up n running we tie the vessel to the wharf, drop into gear once up to temp and pretty much try to pull the wharf down. Running at just below max rpm for anything up to 6 hours or longer.
As a fellow truck mechanic I've made lots of mistakes over the course of my career. That being said, I have never gotten into engine work. I think it would be a very interesting video if you talked about some mistakes you have made as a mechanic.
It would be such a short video though! Just kidding. I could discuss that, could be an interesting video.
Mechanics don't make mistakes silly! It's always the customers fault. LOL
Danger Ranger when u work on The Best of the Best of the best, u gotta be good! No mistakes. Haha
So your just a lube tech?
Sameul Jones lmao no, I actually have to work on 6+ OEMs. We do everything except internal engine work. How would that make me a lube tech?
Ok so I’m getting a 2022 ram 2500 6.7L Cummins. Am I going to have to go to a dyno? And what break in procedures should I fallow
Does this apply to 3/4 & 1 ton 6.7L Cummins vehicles or just semis?
Awesome video! I always learn something when I watch this channel.
So here's a question... How do you break in an engine without a dyno? I am currently having a CAT MXS inframe done and although the shop is exceptionally reputable, they do not have a dyno. Any thoughts and ideas would be appreciated.
Thank you
What temperature should a 375hp marine 3208 run with 190° thermostat? My port motor runs Around 200°
I watch too many of your videos and you're great however I was very curious about this one I didn't expect you to say it but I can tell you what an old guy named Johnny Barnett would have said go get you a load driver and drive it like you stole it
Can someone please clarify what he means by load? Is it just different RPM or an actual trailer. Because dyno was just different RPM
I’m picking up a truck in Kentucky in about a month and driving it back to CT. How do you guys recommending breaking it in during the trip?
If any engine is being broken in on a dyno at full load and the outside temp is high, then have someone spray the radiator with a garden hose. Unhook all wires going to the alternator because if the fan is running it's going to blow water all over it and short it out. Also tape the end of the heavy power wire and the field wire plug to keep water off both. Most semi's are going to have a switch where it's easy to shut the fan off so that wouldn't be necessary. Also use a battery charger set to enough amps to keep the voltage between 13 - 14.5 volts if it's not handy to shut the fan off. The best time to break in an engine like a semi on a chassis dyno would be in the winter in 0 degree temps. Just need several freeze plug block heaters to preheat the block or use space heaters to preheat the engine and then open up the shop doors to get the dyno area cold after the engine is started. It would be difficult to convince someone to stand at the front of a truck for 6-10 hours spraying down the radiator if it's hot out. Or a bracket could be rigged up to hold the hose and nozzle in the correct position with the nozzle set on a fan pattern to hit the entire radiator. If it's not possible to shut the fan off, then it is mandatory to unhook the alternator as described previously and also not shock the exhaust manifold and turbo that are going to glowing orange with water being blown over the engine by the fan. Air cooled piston aircraft engines have that problem because if a plane is going 200mph into a rain cloud it can cause shock cooling . Heavy amounts of rain and hail can cause turbine engines to flame out. Course the plane can glide out of the rain and restart the engines once past the heavy rain. And turbine engines on big commercial jets are made with very expensive alloys that can take shock cooling a lot better than a typical exhaust manifold and turbo on a land based machine.
hey josh whats your opinion on doing a run in on a genset engine ? where from startup it just runs up to high idle of 1400 to 1500 rpm ? because in my experience unless you have a load bank it can be a bit hard to vary amperage depending what it is being used for. in my case it was a c18 used to run a mobile aggregate crushing plant. any thoughts other than running it on a loadbank and varying the amperage load for the first 20 hours or so.
Was it ran in on a dyno?
Would you say the principle of properly loading the engine applies to gasoline engines as well? Proportionally normal loading for said engine, that is. Thanks.
Good video. Wish we all had dynos.
You seem to have short oil change intervals, we used to run 100,000k between changes, manufacturer actually specified 150,000k, used to change the filters every 4 months, but the oil was good for a lot longer, running a 13ltr 480bhp Total fully synthetic 5w30 E7 @44 tons or 97000lbs
E7 oil is designed for extreme long oil change intervals. That is what the e7 rating means.
I had a rebuild on a dd15 engine in a small shop because I know the mechanic and he was pretty good at his job. But when I picked up the truck he has it running at 500 RPM for 24 hours right after the rebuilt I knew this is not right. The oil pressure was 10 pounds lower than usual at high loads but withing the limits according to the dealership. The engine stalled one month after the one year warranty expired... Now thanks to you I know what could be the reason.
We have just picked up a 4.5 litre V8 twin turbo diesel 200 series Landcruiser. Is it the same in the the 4x4 with a overhead cam twin turbo diesel. The motor redlines at 4500 rpm.
Spoken to my workshop after a new long block install, I was told get a heavy load on a trailer and give it a good workout for a few hundred km
He recommended pulling uphill under high load also.
Often when you are doing an engine rebuild, the piston ring manufacturer will get you a set of rules. If you have a flat lifter cam, you are usually also given a set of rules. If you do a stock type rebuild, see if you can find your vehicle owner's manual. Sometimes the manual will give you special driving instructions for the early miles.
4:01 Bearings are important, proper machining of the crank is important. I have seen way too many people buy a used car that says it has a rebuilt engine. All the previous owner did was roll in a set of standard bearings, without any wear measurement of the crank. Those engines run like crap a few months after the used car is sold. Also, they often fit a set of rings and quick hone the cylinder bore. They don't measure the piston and bore, and usually they are out of specification at that time. That's another reason cars that advertise rebuilt engines quickly run like crap.
5:01 Also look for what brands work and which ones don't. Some flat lifters and flat lifter cams are made with low grade metal, and will shred no matter how well you follow your directions. I have read that Comp should be avoided.
Although modern OHV engines usually have roller lifters, many SOHC and DOHC engines have flat lifters. I don't know if replacement SOHC and DOHC cams have certain rules for break in. However, flat lifter OHV engines definitely do.
8:26 When I was at UTI, I was told that most people are instructed to load up their tractor trailer and pull a load like they always do. The break in typically happens properly.
15:50 Now many companies formulate a complete break in oil, rather than an additive for standard engine oil. I prefer this method anyway, engine oils were designed with a certain additive pack working as a team. Adding something breaks up the teamwork. The break in oil is sometimes recommended for roller cams. That is because break in oil may be good for new piston rings and bores.
So replace the entire injector or just the o rings? I have seen this on gas engines too but what do
Engines with flat tappet cam shafts use should use an oil that has zinc in it.
All oils have zinc, but specialty oils have much higher zinc.
Break in depends on cylinder honing and ring rype.
I just got my engine rebuild, how what's the best way to break it inn? Can I I run my truck with 45,000 ponds and for 750 miles round trip or should I just wait running it that much until it breaks.
How high should I run my rpm with a 45k pound load?
What do you recommend for people that dont have access to a dyno. How would we have to do it to brake it in
Heavy load, long drive.
So..."drive 'er like you stole 'er"... LOL Nice!!
Hey John, quick question what would you say the first oil change should be on a new rebuild 3126?
Plug in the block heater, oil pan heater and even fire up the Webasto if the truck has one. Crank it up, check for leaks and give it hell.
Hi friends, Break-In apply in gas engine? We were overhauling a G3616, we had problems during the start the temperatures dont´s stablishes and always shutdown by detonation, the solution was increase 30 rpm in idle high speed.
So even though I was a OO and ran a few trucks over my career, for a long time (18 years) I was in marine engineering. Breaking in marine engines is easy. They are always loaded, so it's just vary the RPM :-)
Concise
Which method would be good to get in contact with you
I bought a military truck through an auction with less then 4000 miles on the odometer. Does the info you gave apply the same for a 2.5 ton military vehicle?
It applies to all engines. At 4K you "may" still have a chance to do the right thing. I guess you could always buy a borescope camera, check your cylinder's condition and see if it's too late or not.
To late, just run it
Manuel Serrano absolutely not this Info only applies to ford pintos and AMC pacers and gremlins with gas motors
If you mean a US Army vehicle, I bet that the contract required the manufacturer to dyno the engine to meet MIL specs before installation.
Imo first 1000 miles just daily drive without load or excessive idle s then fully use send it
Don’t no how to chat with you have a question what will cause bent valves fresh rebuild new head everything is all set to spec can a Jake brake cause this or what else to look for
Too much pressure in the chosen oil feed for the Jake brake supposedly can cause bent exhaust valves. What caused yours?
So I’ve got a newly rebuilt D24t ..
It’s in a VW camper….
So how do I put a “load on it”?.
Find a long steep grade and do laps at max speed up ,and down shift for load coming down the grade. Throw all your camping gear in and some fire wood to bring the camper up to max GVWR .
My newly overhauled engine has oil coming out exhaust manifold....is this normal during breaking process
Not so much . Poorly seated rings , bad turbo compressor seal(s) , or bad valve guid seal
I agree with you on your procedure that’s what I do.
We have a fleet of brand new Fords 6.7l and I’ve been looking at everyone’s idle hrs and they’re between 50%-90% compared to the engine running hrs. Fml
Cfass1 too many folks think idling is no biggie with a diesel. Can they handle it? Yes. Should they be idled anywhere near half of engine time? Not unless you’re trying to waste money/screw the boss.
I see guys idle their diesel trucks on summer days at the grocery store, on winter days where it’s near freezing, or just leave it all day outside the shop. I guess it’s their truck, so they can waste fuel and longevity if they want.
I have a 6.5 GM in my rv i drive it like i stole it ,, I work it hard and she never soots up , I just replaced the Glow plugs they came out near clean ,,,, I change the oil every 5000 miles
Pretty much how I like to break things in. Get it running, make sure it sounds and looks right. Get some heat in it, then full tilt. I do caution about not adding zinc to a new flat tappet valve train. Newer ails do not seem to do as well in some instances. At least for break in periods.
Shain Andrews that's a old wives tale from cam company's to cover they're asses for guys who couldn't get a rebuilt motor started in 45min and kept cranking and cranking till it finally started and it wiped out cam