How To Get Good Bass In Small Rooms - www.AcousticFields.com
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- čas přidán 14. 10. 2014
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- In today's video we're going to talk about how to get good bass in small rooms. Good bass usually is a thing that happens in larger rooms but obviously real estate's expensive and we all have to be relegated, if you will, to a smaller volume and space requirements. So how do we get good bass in small rooms?
So in today's video you'll learn:
1. Why matching the size of your driver to the size of your room is critical (and I give you some examples),
2. Why matching the right kind of acoustic treatment to the problem is imperative and
3. Why the location of that treatment must match the problem area or it won't work.
So enjoy the video and as always please let me know if you have any follow up questions.
Thanks
Dennis,
P.S. To learn more about room acoustics, please sign up for my FREE private room acoustic training videos and ebook at www.acousticfields.com/free-eb... - Věda a technologie
this guy was kind enough to answer me to a lot of questions regarding my build of home studio!! These videos are really helpful and he really knows what he's talking bout
N, Thank you for your support. If you have any topics you wished covered, let us know info@acousticfields.com
I know im asking the wrong place but does any of you know of a tool to get back into an Instagram account?
I somehow lost my login password. I appreciate any tricks you can offer me.
@Cullen Juan instablaster =)
Huh. He was pretty bogus and shitty on the phone w me. Total scammer
Look at the way this guy answers all of these questions! What an awesome guy to take the time to do that!
Thank you for appreciating all of our hard work and effort. If you have any topics you wish covered, just send us an email to: info@acousticfields.com
Acoustic Fields Thank you for the offer! I don't know enough about hifi to really come up with a topic that would be suitable for your level of expertise. But thank you very much!
G'day Dennis and greetings from Australia, Thank you for great input with the subwoofers, I've watched a few of your tutorials now, the one where you talked about frequency wave lengths and the measurements of different wave lengths was very helpful, I watched many others on CZcams and your the only one to go into this, cheers it's very helpful.
Sometimes I think this channel is overboard...but wow what a revelation.
I have mixed music to broadcast standard.
But never even thought about this.
Thanks!
Awesome topics + great teaching, i can't thank you enough!
Thank you for this! A lot of these things I hadn't thought of, and they really helped me since I have a very small room to work in. A few minor adjustments suggested here really helped control the bass in my room! Cheers.
--Chris
Great info and video
This is excellent !
Learned tons.
Thanx 4 uploading.
Hi Jeroen, Thank you for your support and following.
Thanks! Real useful.
Thanx for sharing your knowledge
I have a small listening room and it's at the attic, co the ceiling is angled. Perfect summary of things to address in such cases in this video. Thank you. I think it will be useful to me! :)
Great video and a very nice presentation. It looks like a very short tutorial which helps us get an introduction about very fundamental stuff. Thanks for doing that!
Glad it was helpful!
You are the BEST Dennis!!!! thanks man!
Hi Phat, Thank you for your support and following.
Thank you so much!
great video, i will build my studio this month, learning from you, thanks
F, Noise, size/volume, and treatment are your guiding principles. Make sure you measure outside / inside noise frequency and amplitudes, have the correct room size and volume to match usage, and the correct type, amount, and position of all absorption/diffusion treatment.
You are the go to guy for room treatment. Great videos.
Thank you for your support.
Appreciate that ceiling tip for a last resort for the sub placement. I'll definitely have to check it out.
We have 3 sound fields within a room to treat for both low, middle, and high frequency energy. We have floor to ceiling, sidewall to sidewall, and front to rear walls. All three of these produce unwanted lower frequency pressure issues along with reflections that must be managed.
Your explanation in vedio is very helpful. It’s just great. Thanks.
Thank you for your support.
This is great !
Thank you.
I live in Europe and told my Friends Here about Dennis and His Channel and His Homepage. More and more of my Friends and buddys Share your Channel. You deserve more followers because your knowledge is enormous. Move on Dennis and Cheers
R, Thank you for your support.
thanks this video is super useful
Hi Diego, Thanks, much appreciated.
You're the man , Dennis! Your videos are light years ahead of anything else on youtube! Im learning so much and really appreciate the time you take to educate guys like myself! Thanks again bro!
Hi Joe, Thank you for your support and following.
now i understand thanks 😊
Great video! Thank you for posting it!
This was the first of your videos hat I've seen and I loved it. I look forward to watching your others. Most listening environments are based off listening squarely in the room but 'm curious how setting up speakers so the listener is facing a corner changes the sound. Like if you have your TV and speakers in the corner of a room.
Hi Tp, The corners of rooms are the worst place to place to put speakers. They exaggerate room sound and all other modal issues. You must keep speakers away from room boundary surfaces.
Hi Dennis, thanks so much for all the knowledge you've been giving out to the audio community.
I would like to go a bit more into the specifics, maybe showing some examples in the following videos? so far I've been learning a lot of theory on your videos. I would be super helpful to have some practical examples too.
Again, thanks thanks thanks danke, gracias,
for all your info
Cheers
A
Alejandro Speranza thanks for the comment. I will answer this in the next hangout as its a very good question and I will explain what can and can't be done as far as teaching this stuff.
Thanks
Dennis
Hi Alejandro Speranza
How are you? Hope your build is going well. I answered your question in this week's Google Hangout. You can see the part where I answered your question on this snippet of the video:
czcams.com/video/oF9ch7NTW1c/video.html
I hope it helps. Let me know if I can be of further assistance.
Thanks
Dennis
Well would have liked to know how to find the frequency problems and calculate that ...
You are genius, and whether you are aware or not... you are an electrical N. Tesla ! Gave great insight into inductance and capacitance and delivered power here :D
K, Thank you for your support. Just did a video on resistance in room "circuits". Let me know your thoughts.
Thanks for the video, they help explain a lot of things. Just wondering whether you have any advice for dealing with very large windows in a 10x13 feet room? I have one on the right wall (left wall is solid throughout) and and front wall between the speakers (rear wall is solid). There are curtains (but not so thick). Noticed that if I place the speakers on the window side, the low frequencies and imaging aren't as good as the solid wall side.
Problem is I need to place the speakers on the window side since the door is on the other side. Makes it difficult to get in and out if I put the speakers on the good side of the room.
T, You must find another room or cover the window.
I have a question.
Is the room size more important than woofer size in the low end frequency?
Behind a certain diameter, increasing it, the lowest frequency that the driver can produce it can be heard: it's correct?
I don't know why everytime I need to know about the audio in my room and whats going on I come straight to this channel. Maybe cuz about all the people on youtube talking about sound treatment this is the only one who really knows whats he's talking about. He just point out stuffs that I never heard before but they make so much sense. Like the driver to room match...I was like WTF thats so obvious but everybody makes the same mistake including me. No wonder why I'm having so much bass response issues.
I’ve got my sub on the floor I love the klipchs sub! Shakes my walls! Also bi amped rf28 Yamaha rxa740 very happy any suggestions welcome!
M, If wall shaking is your objective, then coupling to the floor is desirable.
hello Dennis, first off i want to say this was a very informing video. Im novice to acoustic treatment solutions, all i know is to throw up some bass traps and foam lol however im moving into the top floor of my building and im going to use one of the bedrooms for my recording/mixing space. I dont have to worry about how loud i play but im a studying audio engineer so i want my mixes the best possible. One of the walls in the bedroom is concrete and the other is just a regular wall. To the north is a glass sliding door that connects to a sunroom and the south wall is where the entrance to the room is. The ceiling is concrete as well. It has carpet floors and is about your avg size bedroom with 8/9 foot ceilings. From a novice perspective how would you recommend me to start treating my room other than your foam typical auralex foam and bass traps?
Scheduled a acoustic consolation . Want to consider my options
NICE!
J, Thank you for your support and following.
My listening room is 11.5 feet wide and 14.5 feet long which is apparently too small to get decent sound or bass from a pair of speakers but my speakers (Bose 601 series II) sound just fine to me.
B, Personal listening preferences are subjective. What is pleasing to one person, may not be to another. None of this subjective opinion has any influence on the laws of physics. Room size and volume does impact presentation. If you enjoy your room and the speakers you have, then you have achieved your goals, despite the issues your small room present.
thanks.
V, You are welcome. If you have any topics you wished covered, let me know.
I have a makeshift home theater in my basement, and the bass cancellation is so bad that I don't know where to start. The room is 20ft x 15ft, but with an L-shape since there is a 4ft x 10ft closet walled off in one corner. The ceiling is only 6.5ft high. It seems like no matter where I put the subwoofers, it will be boomy in one spot and no bass whatsoever in another.
Since the seats are located in the smaller part of the L, I was going to treat that area first. Would a simple set of foam panels and a couple corner wedges help at all, or is this room hopeless?
M, Foam is not a low-frequency sound absorption technology. With a 6.5 height, you will need large square footage low-frequency technology coverage throughout the room.
Maxxarcade I’m having same issue in a 12’ x 24’ room with an open stairway at one end. I have 2 SVS subs with variable phase controls, still a huge null in the center of the room and boomy in 2 corners.
Have you looked into fan-subwoofers?, I am examining how a stationary pitch controlled blade system could be implemented with a air turbine system.
S, I have no experience with this design.
Can you offer more detailed insight regarding size of drivers in certain size spaces. I’m in a 11’x12’ room 8’ ceilings. Not ideal, but can you recommend a driver size based in how small it is? Currently using mackie824’s and a K 10s sub. Thanks for the videos and knowledge
H, For the red zone in this link use a 4-6" , yellow 6-8", green 8" - 10" . www.acousticfields.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/Good-Room-Volumes-Large.jpg
When you talked about diaphragmatic filters, where do I find data on building those ? < Helmhotz I understand .
Sir, Thank you so much for a wast knowldege you share. I am a beginer and i am planing to build home theater, i want to understand how to locate the pressure areas in my room...? Any device or formulas i need to use to get the results.
Hi Siddiq, Room size and volume must match your intended usage. This is the biggest mistake I see people making. They try to do too much in too small of a space. Use our data base as a guide. Fill out the information requested in this link: www.acousticfields.com/free-room-analysis/. I will then compare your room size/volume/usage to our data base of now over 130 built and measured rooms. We will look at low, middle, and high frequency issues in your room and then we can better understand what the room is capable and not capable of. It is much better to understand the capabilities of your room before you try to assign a usage.
Super grateful for the information. I understand that in small rooms, most times it is better to have small boxes and add a subwofer in the correct position, right ?. Most of the time the opposite is done to what should be done, to put bigger boxes than it should be. What do you think of the different configurations of the boxes of the subwofer ?. Is there a difference in having the port below or on the side? In the market there are many models, which would be the most suitable considering the configuration of the sub speaker?
Thank you
Hi I, The room does not care how the energy is generated. Ported or non makes no difference. Output is output. Maybe more energy out of a ported but maybe not depending on driver diameter. It doesn't matter to the room. Its all frequency and amplitude.
Thanks for all your excellent videos. Can you tell me if an open window behind the listening position will be an effective bass trap? (the window opens to several km of flat farmland)
Hi HM, An open window is a perfect absorber. Sound leave through the window and never returns. As long as the noise levels are low outside, then I would leave the window open.
Thanks for the prompt reply!
How do you determine the proper driver size for a particular room once you have your room dimensions? What if you have a room that is L shaped and you have to provide sound to each side? Would you treat each as a separate room?
Hi Maurice, If it is two channel, use the space with the side walls and front wall joined. Let the additional volume assist the lower frequency pressure.
outstanding :)
Thank you kindly! What one thing did you find interesting?
@@AcousticFields Hi Dennis. I've always enjoyed and learned from your videos.
I guess the ONE really simple adjustment that works is the woofer size.
I'm not usually signed into youtube/google.... this time around I was signed in and decided to comment.
I may have to opportunity/funds to do custom build in the future.
Now, it's all about just doing the best with what I have and always learning more.
Thanks for saying Hi. My Name is Donat Kazarinoff.
Do you have any video explaining how to do an anechoic box? for small acoustic measurements. Thanks for your videos. Thumbs up!
Hi Didac, Noise measurements would have to be taken of all outside sources. Frequency and amplitudes would have to be measured and the appropriate barrier designed to deal with those frequencies and amplitudes. Reflections inside the box would have to be treated correctly to create a reflection free environment.
Wow, I wasn't expecting an answer, and so fast. Thank you very much, I really appreciate it. I'll watch all your videos to see if I can learn to controll all those aspects you mentioned here. Thanks again!!
Thanks for the advice, one question, having a smaller room size would it be a good idea to put a subwoofer inside a bigger wooden cabinet with the front open and wall behind it, still raised a few inches from the floor? would the bass frequencies be easier or more difficult to control for mixing?
Hi Remshaw, Once the Low frequency energy from the sub (bass) is released into the room, it is the property of your room size and volume. The room tells you what you will hear and what you will not.
I have a basement that I use as my man cave. it is unfinished and it is completely open. listening to the video it sounds like a big room is ideal. Right now I have a an old Home theater in a bo and planning on upgrading to a powered sub plus a nice receiver. I would say the basement is probably no more than 30 ft by 30ft. what size sub would you recommend and what are some inexpensive thing to do to the basement to increase quality of sounds? Example sound panels. ETC. Thanks for your time and knowledge.
Hi james martin
Thanks for the comment. Basements provide for good open spaces but caution must be used in selecting a low frequency source. With concrete and earth as the barrier material, low frequency energy has no where to go and most will stay within the room. It is always the low ceiling height in a basement that causes all the issues. Rythmik Audio makes a good product. I would use their 12" diameter model to begin with and see how that works for your personal low energy requirements. In a space this size and only with proper room pressure management treatment, you could use two units for more impact in a home theater environment.
If you fill out this form on our site and provide as much detail as possible including photos of your room, I'll be better able to advise on specifics:
www.acousticfields.com/free-acoustic-treatment-room-analysis-tell-us-about-your-room/
Thanks
Dennis
Thanks I will do that.
Hi Dennis. I've got a question about bass frequencies in a car versus in a room. I've got 8" studio monitors just a few inches from the wall in my 11w 13L 8h bedroom. (I know it's too small but just bought them and am moving to a larger room soon.) But, I've been screwing around with mixes and what I'm trying to understand is why a car stereo with 4" speakers produces much more bass on the same mix than my Mackie 8" monitors in the bedroom. I understand that my room is too small for bass waves but how can 4" car speakers in even a smaller environment where there is hardly any space, produce much more bass? Even with the EQ settings flat? Thanks for any response!
A, The dimensions and volume of each space are working for and against you. Smaller driver produces less output in a smaller volume. The dimensions of the car are more favorable for the 4" driver.
I would like to learn your insights on how the absorber frequency response may show changes while moving it around in the room, such as leaving air gap between the wall and a diaphragmatic absorber unit. Thank you for your consideration @Acoustic Fields
Diaphragmatic is a pressure based technology. An air gap is for missle and high frequency technology
@@AcousticFields Thank you for your fast reply. As far as I've understood this answer means the operating frequency range of the unit itself wouldn't be affected by its position in the room.
So when we're talking about tuning these devices, is there any way to do that other than modifying the cabinet's internal design?
The questions never stop, thank you for your objective and heartbreakingly truthful answers. I truly appreciate the knowledge you have brought to us with your videos.
DO NOT STOP THESE VIDEOS..
Or I will have Tantrums!
They are very useful ...
Thank you ever so much. 😉
P, Thank you for your support. I will continue them through next year. After that, I am uncertain.
I have a 390 by 315 cm room and I can only use the longest wall as the front wall due to doors. I wonder, what size studio monitors would you recommend? I will be making a lot of EDM so I need good bass.
Hi Petter, Lets take a look at everything about your room before we discuss speaker size. Fill out the information in this link and lets take a look. www.acousticfields.com/free-room-analysis/
Helpful, but can you discuss HOW you discover bass frequency issues and where they're located?
R, Modal structures are located through out the room. Their locations are dependent on frequency (wavelength) and the dimensions of your room. Fill out the info. in this link: www.acousticfields.com/free-room-analysis/
I'm an audio technician that is about to build my own home studio. I have not even put up a wall yet. I heard you say in this video that you could treat the walls for low end absorption. What does that look like and what materials would be used? My room dimensions are not set in stone, but I have approximately 17' x 8' area with a 3.5' x 4.5' box off to one side that can be a vocal booth.
A, That is our CAW in wall system. Here is link to process: www.acousticfields.com/carbon-absorber-wall/
hii sir can you make a video on selecting and fitting glass for recording studios
Hi Gaurav, What a great idea! I will add it to my list. Thank you so much.
most welcome sir
Hello Sir, thank you for your videos and much respect.
Question: My tracking room has 4 walls that have different measurements 17'W x 23' L x 8'W x 19L and 8.5"H can you provide some quick tips at what problems i might have with the walls different sizes and the low ceiling..
Thank You
+Mixskywalker note: this is the tracking room with drums being the #1 reason
+Mixskywalker Fill out the information in this link: www.acousticfields.com/free-room-analysis/. Take photos of all surfaces. Include photos with form.
Best!
Thank you for your comments and support.
Hi,
Is there any ratio or so called formula to calculate how big a driver (subwoofer) i need for my room.
For example, my room is 16ft 8 inches long, 16 ft wide, 8ft 4 inches high, im planning to go with dual subwoofers to help tackle with room modes (square room horror :( !). So should i go with two 10 inch driver subs or 12 inch ?
Thanks in advance. Great channel & website btw ! Cheers.
D, Additional subs will not help you with room modes. In your stated room size and volume, I would use a single 10" driver.
Hey Dennis, thanks for the informative videos. I am putting together a live jam room in my basement using the room in a room design. My current room ratio after sound proofing materials are 1 x 1.96 x 3.11 (79"x155"x246"). How should I change this to make for the best sounding room? There will be guitar, drums, vocals, and bass. Thanks!
+Yoshisakan The ratios you are suggesting will not be adequate for a basement subterranean structure. The density of the concrete and earth forces all the energy up through the structure and first floor area. Low frequency energy will be a major issue. Fill out the information in this link and and give me the maximum footprint you have to work with. www.acousticfields.com/free-acoustic-treatment-room-analysis-tell-us-room/
+Acoustic Fields I filled out the form. I found a calculator that said the nearest known ratio can be obtained by shortening the length of the room from 20.5 to 17feet. is this acceptable? I don't have much room to work with here due to the low ceiling height.
Hello I have a small room that I wish to turn into a dedicated listening space.
Dimensions are 12FT x 12FT x 6FT Height (low heigh ceiling) Its in my basement and already enclosed by 4 concrete walls.
I have a pair of Martin Logan Electromotion ESL's and a Velodyne DSP15 (15 inch woofer) Driven by a rotel RSX1560.
Its a simple setup. However what do you recommend in terms of sound absorption / diffusers etc?
Appreciate your assistance,
It would be best to find another room. Your ceiling height is much to low to accommodate any type of audio playback. Vary all dimensions by at least 25% from each other. Stay away from same dimensions for width and length.
I have a bass issues, what bass I listen in my room comes different when I mix and listen in different systems.
So please do let me know what can be done?
R, Fill out the information in this link: www.acousticfields.com/free-room-analysis/
If I have a fully sound proofed room.. 4.6m wide x 4.7m length x 4. 5m height walls covered with built in acoustic foam... and acoustic foam placed in good locations on the ceiling. What is the best way to create natural natural reverb in the room? ... ive heard it might be best to get some quadratic diffusers on the wall ... If so what kind?
R, What is your usage? How much foam do you have in the room? What is the rate and level of absorption of your foam? What have you done to manage low frequency issues?
Hello Denise, I apologize for this question, but I'm still learning. Anyhow bc I can't afford it, I'm running 2 passive subwoofers to a 5.1 reciever and both connected to the same sub out. My question is, am I running the wires right as is or do I need to do that bridge thing from the receiver to one sub to the next?
Use a splitter on the sub out so you can run two speakers from one receiver output.
do bass traps, bass abortion benefits being from floor to ceiling. or just speaker hight?.
thank u
colin
Low frequency absorption surface area requirements are based upon many issues. You must locate the unwanted pressure areas and apply the correct square footage of the treatment that can deal with the problems in that specific room area. Each room boundary surface area may have different requirements because of the room size and volume, low frequency driver diameter, and listening pressure levels.
It seems obvious to me that improving on room acoustics for the purpose of critical listening is both a practical and empirical process. The relationship between the volume of air present in a room and loudspeaker response must exist but, as an engineer, I would not like to try and calculate it! I was wondering if - considering your practical experience - you have come across a rule-of-thumb that can be applied as a good starting point for sizing and matching a driver to a room?
C, Speaker height no greater than one half ceiling height.
18' is the proper minimum depth of a studio. This dimension allows for an unbroken wave length of 60Hz This does not mean lower frequencies can not be duplicated. It means that 60Hz is reproduced without reflection. 60Hz is by no mistake the main resonant frequency of a 15" speaker and a 22" bass drum. It is not a mistake that the low frequency EQ on a classic Neve console is set at 63Hz-- also called the English drum sound.
K, Yes, but carry your thinking further. To treat that 60 Hz. resonance with proper rate and level of absorption, you need 10" of real estate on all wall surfaces that cause said resonance. You will need to treat at least two opposing wall surface areas thus losing 20 - 25" of internal dimension. If you plan your internal dimensions to be 18' net then allow for another say 24" for treatment, you end up with O.D. of 20'. and a room treated completely down below 60 Hz. Quantifying the problem and qualifying the solution all in the same structure is the way to go.
Hey buds love your videos, I have a quick question for you. What size Driver do I need for my small home theatre room.
Room size is 16' x 15.5' with 8 foot ceilings. The volume of the room I think would be, 1984 cubic meters
Thanks in advance.
Hi Charles, I will need a bit more data. Where is the room located ? How is the room constructed ? Is it frame or concrete? Is noise transmission to other rooms an issue?
OK the room is located in my basement with two walls concrete foundation and two walls framed interior. Safe and sound insulation plus going with Quiet Rocl 5/8 Drywall.
Hey do you guys think that 3d pannels made from bamboo abd sugar cane fibers can be used as ceiling defusers?
I, I do not have any personal experience with these materials. We like softwood types for smoother mid-range frequency tonal quality.
Sir, plx suggest how to control thrilling and heavy bass of soundbar and its subwoofer in room, when we play any song in which bass are heavy compare to common sing, its thrill the wall and increase BP, while old one get irritated, while our old one see a movie in cinema hall or multiplex they feel relexed
A, This is a pressure related issue due to room modes and listening positioning.Fill out the information in this link: www.acousticfields.com/free-room-analysis/
How's it goin Dennis? My name's Jef Kim. I'd like to start by saying that I really respect and appreciate you. For your time. For your knowledge. And for the amount of time you choose to spend sharing your knowledge with others on CZcams. Your videos are great. Thank you Dennis. (Moving on.)... So I'm an independent/freelance, sound production engineer. ( Freelance meaning I do not have a degree in sound engineering.) I have a question for you about sub woofer isolation. In your personal opinion, how important is isolating the sub from the floor, in any kind of controlled listening environment? A big thank you to Acoustic Fields and Dennis Foley. I Iook forward to your reply.
Hi Jef, Thank you for your support. Isolation of any moving or vibrating source from another surface is always a good thing to do. Subs emit energy into the room through the driver component. This air born energy then strikes the floor. The cabinet vibrations are also transferred to the connecting surface which is usually the floor. Elevating them off of the floor is also welcome. Every room size and volume dictates that any low frequency device will produce a smoother response curve if elevated to certain distances above the floor. These three facts are the design impetus behind our carbon platforms: www.acousticfields.com/product/subwoofer-platform-absorber/
Thank you for the speedy reply. I checked out the platform absorber on your site. I was under the impression that it's more on the side of absorption than isolation. Which I understand in that, 18" can probably isolate the source from the receiver with the right materials. But I guess maybe I was searching for a different answer. The reason I asked was because I'm currently building my fifth sub iso unit. The first two types i designed and built were both of a platform style that used absorption. The third and forth were both towers. Less treatment. More isolation. Am I investing to much of myself into this concept? I feel that the time and money i've put into the R&D is well worth the results i've already seen up to this point. I don't know,... Maybe I just hate low end vibration to the point of questing to eliminate it forever. What are your thoughts on this? Oh and, i'd love to see what kind of support structure and design you use, in your sub platform. We can talk later about that though... ty again for your time..
Please could you go into a bit more detail on what speaker size is optimum to choose for various room sizes? Also if you have bigger speakers but run them at a lower volume to compensate is there any downside to doing this or any issues I should be aware of? I currently have a quite a small studio room 240 x 215 cm - what would be the optimum size for this room? I currently own Focal CMS 65 6.5 inch monitors. Are they too big for this room and should I be looking at 4 or 5 inch ones? I tend to run them about 50 - 80% volume. I'm looking to buy a sub to get more detail and info in the low end since I make a lot of techno music. Should I be looking at 8 inch, 10 inch or 12 inch subs? Would I really benefit from an 8 inch sub that isn't really much bigger than my current monitors?
M, Fill out the information in this link and let's take a complete look at your room. www.acousticfields.com/free-room-analysis/
So, how about appropriate speakers for a parade float. The float is small (not a 40 foot float). Would you please teach about what happens to music sounds when speakers are outdoors, elevated on a vehicle. If this not match your topic area, I understand. Judi
Hi Judi, The term is sound reinforcement. You are electronically reinforcing the sound using amplification. It is all about matching the output of the speakers using size, radiating patterns, and power. I would have to know much more about the distance the sound needs to travel and how wide of an audience area you need to cover.
Fundamentally correct however a few corrections (there are more but I'll stick to 2): 1) WRT the statement that a 10" vs. 12" driver is 20% "larger" is incorrect. Using the simple area of a circle formula, A = Pi (R squared), 10" = 78.5, 12" = 113.1 which is ~44% larger. 2) WRT 10" vs. 12" is 2 - 3DB louder, true, however output can be managed via subwoofer output levels making driver size primarily superfluous.
All varaibles matter. Driver is directly related to speed of the driver and the output presentaion value. I have owned drivers from 10" - 24". Manufacturers claim that they can get a large driver size to move as fast as a smaller driver. I have never heard that in over 50 years of listening.
@@AcousticFields It's more complicated than driver size and speed especially with woofers and subwoofers. Driver cone size, weight and excursion are all interrelated (e/g: you don't need as much excursion with a larger driver for the same SPL) however, cone weight (including the spider) affects what most people call
speed or "fast" bass. In my 45+ years listening along with my engineering background I have owned woofer drivers from 6" - 18" and heard many, many more. There are "fast" large drivers - in the right application. One example - Rockport Arrakis with 15" dual drivers.
Do you formally give recommendations for given room dimensions? If so, what is your preferred contact method?
G, Fill out the information in this link. If you are unsure of room size/volume/usage then give us the largest foot print you have to work with. www.acousticfields.com/free-room-analysis/
Sir, please do clear my thoughts; Are subwoofers take advantage of concrete walls, floor, ceilings? Never mind the vibration which thin woods causes. But just the audible low frequency disregarding vibration. We'll hear deeper bass due to the bouncing-back of the low frequency from the concrete wall right? Say, if we have a plywood walls, then the low frequency passes through the thin wood and goes outside the house, thus we lose some of the sounds. But if we have concrete (cement) walls, the low frequency cannot pass through so it will bounce back to the room and thus making us feel more lows because the sound is not waisted, right? Please correct me if Im wrong.
G, All barrier structures do three things. First, they lower the amount and frequency of energy that is transmitted through them by their design. Their structural design is frequency and amplitude dependent. Second is vibration management and third is absorption. All surfaces are sound absorbing at some frequency, even concrete. Will a more rigid and dense barrier such as a concrete wall let less low frequency energy pass through it, then the answer is a question. What frequencies are we discussing? I would answer by saying yes it will stop most frequencies above 50 Hz. assuming the concrete wall is at least 6" thick. The density of the wall has a direct impact on the resonant frequency of the wall or the frequency at which the wall absorbs energy. Any energy above the resonant frequency will be restricted, any energy below that frequency will not.
Great video again.
Will you be going into detail with each point in future videos?
It's good to say match the driver to the room but how do we go about doing that? I have a small 13'x16'x10' room and I'm after 16Hz performance for my 2 channel system. I would be hard pressed to find a 10" driver that would work for my needs.
Plus, I figured Subs where all about moving air so wouldn't a 10" driver moving more be the same as a 15" driver moving less???
Blacklighting Sorry for the delay in responding. I will sure I answer this in the next hangout and send you the link to your specific question and answer.
Thanks
Dennis
Hi Blacklighting
I answered your question in this week's Google Hangout. You can see the part where I answered your question on this snippet of the video:
czcams.com/video/4nmZBrMBN-g/video.html
Please also go to this blog post where you will see a graphic showing the driver to room volume ratio's we suggest from our extensive R&D:
www.acousticfields.com/get-good-bass-in-small-rooms/
I hope it helps. Let me know if I can be of further assistance.
Thanks
Dennis
Acoustic Fields Thank you very much. What great Service.
It's really nice to see audio questions being asked by real people and being answered by experts in the field.
Blacklighting It's our pleasure. Really appreciate the positive feedback. We're here to help so let us know any time you have further questions we can help with.
Thanks
Dennis
I have an approximate 10 x 10 space, give or take a foot with 8' ceiling. I am in the planning stages with intent to build a vocal studio over the next 3 months. With the dimentions listed what recommendations do you have for preplanning?
T, How many vocalists? Male or female ?
I remember hearing you talk about the nonsense of bass traps in corners in another video. Which one was that? And if I have wooden floor ceiling and roof and 3 cement walls, is 1/2 of my room already capable to let bass pressure pass? Focus of other frequencies reflecting on the 3 walls and the roof?
By definition it takes two parallel walls within our rooms to produce axial modes. It takes four of the same to produce tangential modes and six walls to produce oblique modes. It is not two parallel corners. Corners only represent a small percentage of the complete wall surface area. It takes two parallel wall surfaces at a minimum to produce unwanted low frequency issues. You must treat at a minimum 60% of each wall surface area to manage unwanted axial modal issues.
I have a question Dennis, would it be possible to build a Diaphragmatic Absorber inside a couch? most studio's and home studio's have a couch, and to be able to build inside it would avoid some space loss in the room. Just thinking out loud
P Kaos Great question. Yes it is possible but I'll provide a more detailed answer in the next hangout and send you a link to the part where I answer your question.
Thanks
Dennis
Acoustic Fields Awesome, I look forward to it. I was also thinking for bedroom studio's is it possible to build a Diaphragmatic Absorber in a bed frame or to make a Diaphragmatic Absorber build which slides/stores the under the bed? An idea for avoiding space loss for a bedroom studio.
Thanks
Michael.
Hi Michael P Kaos
I answered your question in this week's Google Hangout. You can see the part where I answered your question on this snippet of the video:
czcams.com/video/LFw7Sw_Il5g/video.html
I hope it helps. Let me know if I can be of further assistance.
Thanks
If there are two speakers and one is next to a wall but the other is next to a open space then can this speaker sound weaker than the other please let me know thanks.
You must have equal distance from each sidewall for two channel sound presentation. If you have an open sidewall, you need to change your set up to include a front wall and two sidewalls.
Can anyone tell me the formula to calculate cubic footage for a room with a canted ceiling? 7'/6" on the low side to 11'/3" on the high side, the room's width is 10'/8", length is 12'/6". Thanks :)
Hi Donny, Take the 7.6 and the 11.3 and add them together and divide by 2 to get an average height for volume calculations.
I like really high ceiling house, wonder how much it will effect the sound : 17' W x 20' H X 23' L size living room. Thank you.
K, You have good size and volume to match your usage. Fill out the information in this link: www.acousticfields.com/free-room-analysis
Actually that would be the size of my future listening/living room; just wondering how the high ceiling would effect the sound, or should I just reduce the ceiling down to 12 feet instead, thank you. (the lower-half side wall would be concrete covered with curtain, carpet floor.)
Hey - thanks for the video. much appreciated :)
i'm setting up a mixing/mastering studio. the space is 3.8m L x 2.75m W x 2.4m H.
i suspect i'm going to have to bring the dimensions in to 3m L x 2.4m W x 2.1m H after soundproofing (i'm thinking wooden framework, rock wool and plasterboard....). what kind of advice would you have in terms of most effective acoustic treatment?
or indeed any advice on those sound proofing materials that might assist in the acoustic treatment process?
thanks, James
+James Moss Hi James, there is no such thing as "sound proofing". You build barrier technologies to minimize the impact of noise transmission through room boundary surfaces. Do not "think about building" anything First, measure the issues and build the barrier that satisfies the magnitude and frequency of the noise transmissions. Noise does not care about what you are thinking because most of the material out in the public domain is not accurate. The common misconception I see a lot is the double wall concept. Building a double wall will impact noise transmission above 125 Hz. It has minimal impact on frequencies below those numbers.
+Acoustic Fields thanks very much for the thoughts. much appreciated!
Hello James, I'm curious because it's same measurements of my music room, I have Kef R300 bookshelves speakers. Do you have bookshelves too or towers ?
Found a 4 year old video. Subscribed immediately.
My room size is 10X10 ft and ceiling height is 10ft too. What size the Subwoofer driver should be?? Ideal Size...
Room is too small for a sub woofer.
Hi and thanks for the video. Just a basic question if I may. All things being equal, is there an optimal distance or perhaps a minimum distance between listener and speaker. Am considering a 5 inch vs 6.5 inch speaker and can put 2-3 feet between my ears and the speaker. Is the 6.5 speaker even worth considering. Small room of course :) Some very amateur treatment is there, and more is underway, but will take time. Thanks.
Smaller drivers produce more detail and less output. These are both good qualities in small rooms.
@@AcousticFields Thanks for the reply! So what’s the optimal distance for my ears / head / listening spot from a 6.5 inch woofer. Can it be quantified.
So if i have a room 4m by 4m and 2.2m in height? what would be the right choice of driver?
Hi Diego, You have good width and length but your ceiling height is some of the lowest I have seen. Any energy below 100 cycles is going to be a large issue. Stay small . No larger than 125 - 150 mm.
Hello fellow members ive been facing a major problem that im unable to find the bass in my listening position. The moment i hit the back row the bass is 10x tighter the lower frequencies are audible aswell as felt but the moment i move in the front row, while standing the bass is audible and fine but the moment i sit in my perfect triangular position the bass is gone. I tried different speaker positions aswell as distances but the problem remains. If im facing bass nulling how to direct bass a bit forward? If i need bass traps how exactly will they help?
Attaching a small video of my room if im doing anything wrong please guide me.
Room dimensions are roughly 20ft hy 16ft
Thanking in advance
You need to reduce the amount of low frequency energy within your room due to room dimensions. Fill out the information in this link: www.acousticfields.com/free-room-analysis/ Lets take a look at the total situation.
- My listening room is w8xl10xh8
- I can't use another room
- I have a large window on the length wall
- I have laminate with a large area rug on it
Any suggestions to treat the room for the best audio playback?
Hi Kur, Your room is simply too small for accurate audio playback. There are improvements you can make, especially to the lower frequencies, but from a cost and audio quality standpoint, It would be best to get another room size to work with.
Acoustic Fields I see that tip constantly throughout these comments - I understand it's not ideal but not everyone can't create the perfect room. I just want to take advantage of what I have been given to work with.
KurVibes, while you won't be able to enjoy clean articulate bass at lower frequencies you can still enjoy quite good sound via a near field setup. I would focus your energy on more of a home studio type environment utilizing bass traps and primarily absorption. Also, you are correct, most of us don't fit into the >30' room dimensions but make do with what we have and still get quite goods results. Above all - happy listening!
So how do you know what problems are where?
J, The dimensions of the room boundary surfaces along with the room usage determines frequency and amplitudes.
I have a question for you and for the community here:I bought two yamaha hs7 monitors,i am amazed from the sound quality and detail,the problem is i have a medium to small room,so i cant place the speakers away from the wall(they are rear bass ported)Also the bass can be heard along the whole house and it corners too much in my room.The question is : is acoustic treatment gonna block some of the bass and isolate it in the room or i am forced to go on with this situation?Also the bass i here in the corner is the true bass response or it is eqed by reflectionbass?Also i have wooden closet and desk.Thanks in advance
X, The goal of acoustic treatment is not to "block" anything. Treatment comes in two types: absorption and diffusion. Your issue is a noise transmission issue and must be dealt with using barrier technology which is a permanent build. You must measure the frequency and amplitude of the noise and then build the proper barrier to reduce the noise transmission.
Acoustic Fields ok thanks for the tip
from a video I watched by Bobby Owsisnki, using weather stripping along the interior of your door and a door stop/door sweep combo can help isolate sound significantly.
Steven Sampson i will check it out man,thanks
So what are some good ratios for driver size to room size? - Pair of 8 inches in a 12' x 12' Room?
Keep the out put low and treat the front wall behind the speakers.
@@AcousticFields Thank you, is there any general rule of thumb for monitor selection based on room size? And for treating the front wall, would primarily dampening be the appropriate type?
u dwell on the Donts, but no example, so what size room, for a speaker size?
Hi Y, There is no one size fits all. You have to look at speaker to ceiling height, array distribution of speaker, side wall distances for primary, secondary, and tertiary reflections, size and diameter of low frequency drivers, and some others. You use certain guidelines in the beginning of the process. and for purposes of illustration.
is 11'x9' way too small for a control room? should i just scrap the idea of turning it into a studio?
Thanks
+Narudh Areesorn Way to small. Find a room that has a dimension of 17 w x 11' h x 23' l
this is control room only? wow ... so big
I have a similar sized room, because I am forced to operate in my bedroom as an engineer only mixing on the side. My room is 8' h x 12 1/2' l x 9 2/3' w. I have no choices, so I have to have my mixing position in this room, and although not necessarily right in the corner, basically at a corner of the room. I could pull the desk farther toward the center of the room, but the loss in floor space is extremely detrimental to it being a bedroom. As a result, I have extreme influence from a 139.5 Hz mode increasing response at that specific frequency by something like 200%. I've to this point though the best option would be to mount a 24x48" ceiling cloud of 4" thick fiberglass boards something like 2' below the ceiling, hoping some Auralex LENRDs I have (I know... foam) would help by occupying the wall/ceiling corners. Any thoughts?
what about the ceiling, sir? is concrete ceiling good for bass?
G, Walls or ceilings that have more mass or density move less causing less vibration issues especially for lower frequency energy. Walls can actually become speakers by going diaphragmatic if they lack the required density. A 2" x 4" wood framed wall is a good example. Try closing a door hard that is mounted to a 2" x 4 " wood framed wall. You can hear the whole wall move or shake.
Thank you for the quick reply sir. Sir, my room is dead, what I have here is a room that 3 to 4 meters in width, 6 to 7 meters in lenght and a low ceiling. the problem is that the three corner walls are half concrete, cement of about 3 feet tall from the concrete floor, and the rest is a thin double plywood to the ceiling, and ceiling is plywood too. and the other remaining wall is all plywood. And I guess all these plywoods are absorbing all my low frequency sounds, and i think it causes all the dead spot around my room. But we're builing a full concrete structure soon. Planning to have a concrete (cement roof) cement walls, and floors, cement all, with some sliding windows. Do you think this will improve the low frequency? Will a full cement roof (ceiling) and walls boost low frequency?
oke i have Much to Ask I want a Onkyo Reciever i want to Used for Beamer And laptop when ia to Come to A simpel store i Have Seen the are have reciervers i want use for in de living room so ,i want to Know if they can be Used Dolby atmos When do i have exactly how this Mode Work. At home.
Hi G, Signal processing is a way to move sound around within a room. Atmos moves it around using multiple channels. You must design your room to match the usage and sound energy displacement into room.
6' by 9' by 9' bedroom... 9.2 focal 5.1dome/4.0 sib Denon x4400h, x900f 65"... 🙃
C, You need to find another room. www.acousticfields.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/Good-Room-Volumes-Large.jpg
Acoustic Fields nah I'm a monk my bedroom is like a palace to me and the sound is awesome I think you'd be surprised! I've had a lot of surround sound setups, I got the audio and video synced to the millisecond, speaker positioning to the milimeter, audyssey xt32 fine tuned with some custom stuff, ect... any way mmaybe I'm barkin up the wrong tree ok peace! 😉
C, We all have different reference standards. If you are happy with your rigg/room then objective achieved.
i have a room with 10 ft hight width and lenth (square size room ) please help me to design this
Hi India, I would strongly suggest you find another room size and volume. Having three dimensions the same compounds you low and middle frequency modal issues by factors of 200 - 400 %.
i have 2bhk flat of same size of rooms then can i use my lobby approximately 12 by 18 ? its the area of my homes main entrance so can i use this in like open space studios
plz can u give ur mail id i want to send u the pics of that area
thankyou for helping sir
Just a small point. A 12 " woofer is about 40% larger than a 10 " woofer not 20% as mentioned.
C, Let me see how you arrived at that number. Show me the math that you used to derive that percentage difference.
Acoustic Fields are of circle for 10" driver is 78.5 square inches and area for 12" driver is 113 square inches. Twenty percent larger of 78.5 is 15.7.
78.5+15.7 = 94.2
far short of 113
Easiest way to do this is to square off the drivers, thus a 10" driver would be 100 and 12" driver would be 144. It's not accurate but it
allows comparison between area of drivers in one's head quickly. For example a 21" driver would be 21x21 or 441 square inches
a 12" driver would 12x12 or 144 square inches and if you multiply by 3 equals 432 which makes 3 -12" woofers equivalent to 1- 21" woofer. This of course doesn't take excursion into consideration and only deals with area of cone but all else being equal works nicely.
Area equals pi radius squared.
C, Rather than focus on surface area, focus on output. Your room only cares about energy. Show me the calculations for the difference in output from 10" - 12".
C, Not deflecting. Good work on the percentage calcualtions. This is an educational channel. I am using your math skill set to educate. People get tired of reading me.
Acoustic Fields I don't think people are tired of reading you. Sorry for misreading your intentions. Take care.