I’m sure your page popped up in my feed because I began researching about getting into medical school, and I’m so happy it did! Your videos have given me more of an insight on what to research and plan for. I never would have thought to search on CZcams for these answers so thank you for having this channel!
I respect that Dr. Gray reccognized that he could not fully relate to this situation but he acknowledged his oppertunaties and priviledge. I kind of understand this student,s situation. English was not my primary languague. Some students do not have the resources to afford private tutoring. Some collages are not good for premeds because they lack resources to be able to reliably help these students reliably matriculate into medical school. Examples of such institutions are community colleges and private four year institutions that do not have a medical school associated with them. Students who are forced to complete the first two years of their undergraduate education at a community college miss out on oppertunaties like learning about research, shadowing, and being assigned an academic advisor who is a MD and who might be the dean of admisions at a medical school. Statistically, many medical schools judge premed students who begin undergrad at a community college in a unfavorable fashon. Consequently, it might result in a higher likleyhood that they might be denied admision into medical school after they complete all of the basic requirments because of the disadvantages attending a community college places students at. I went through a situation kind of like this student,s situation.
As a black non-hispanic student who is a Spanish major I COMPLETELY understand how speaking one language at school and another at home is very very challenging!! My medieval Spanish literature class is kicking my behind right now lol!!
I love your series! You've helped with my journey. Can you talk more about do it yourself post bac work? Because I'm a nontraditional and I have to continue to work until after med school acceptance, I looked into a formal post bac $60k! I need every option possible and want to explore the community college route. Your suggestion has piqued my interest. Can you talk more on creating your own post bac? Classes needed? Load while working and what looks good on apps for interviews. Thanks for all that you do!
For those struggling academically I recommend Justin Sung and I Can Study on CZcams. Both are great at teaching you how to learn and build strong study systems
This was very helpful thinking through the post Bach versus masters tracks. I have 3 questions: 1)For do it yourself post Bach’s, does it matter where you do them? Community college versus university? 2) Or if you do them across two different schools (due to work schedule conflicts if also working full time)? 3) does your post Bach coursework have to be the same intensity as an undergrad student? (Again for folks who are working and/or doing this as a second career).
Soooooo I have listened to almost all of your podcasts Dr. Gray. I know you talk about research is not required but people think there is a cause and effect kinda relation between not getting into med school if you don't have research. Would you mind making a video about just research and talk about it. Me and other non trads would appreciate it, who dont have 20 hours/week to sit in a lab that they are not passionate about and not have the time either.
Gurpreet Malhi if you feel you need research you could do clinical research. Chart reviews, etc. requires MUCH less time than bench work and you can still make it meaningful
Garrett, just like the comments explained, depending on the med schools you're applying (look at their requirements and talk to their deans/advisers). However, I have received feedback also from the Dr. I shadowed for and they never did research undergrad, however they had lots of EC and that aided on their application. Best of luck!
I think a good study plan is important. I came to US at age 23, that’s about the time I began to speak English . School in my country was poor, so my intellectual back ground is also poor. I went to college here for 3 years (3.98 gpa) calculus, chemistry, economics, tons of English. I had to stop to be a full time mom. I now speak 2 other languages (besides English) at home to help my children speak those languages. I am now going back to school. I can say based on experience, time is gold for studying. You need to put in the time . Going back now to get a feeling if I can put the time in (due to family commitments), if I can’t , I might need to wait a bit more.
Was completely offended by that!!!! The point could have been elucidated better to be a white man telling a non English speaker to speak more English was completely unprofessional and ignorant and the fact that no one called you out about that is ludicrous
Generally, I really enjoy Dr. Gray’s videos and the very specific, actionable advice he gives. However, I have to heavily disagree with his advice to not speak Spanish as much at home. This used to be the general advice of ELL (English Language Learner) programs because the old-school thought was the home language is a barrier not an asset. Better understanding of ELL has actually made this advice outdated. Firstly, fluency in a home language actually improves a student’s ability to learn English. Secondly, encouraging students to speak less Spanish could have damaging affects to them personally by decreasing their ability to communicate with loved ones who aren’t fluent in English and can’t communicate effectively in English. As a child of immigrants, I can also confidently say that it’s unlikely that having more English in the household (or even conversing with the average native English speaker) will improve reading comprehension needed for MCAT, standardized testing, or higher education in America. Just from the conversation with her, it’s clear her speaking fluency is not the issue (which if it was, would be when you might suggest protected English speaking time through extracurriculars). However, people have gotten into medical school and are doctors with less English speaking fluency than her. Additionally, bilingualism is a highly marketable/transferrable skill, if we’re only going to focus on career advancement. I would say a much better solution is reading and writing. Even for native English speakers in America, our language doesn’t advance drastically past middle school or high school (supported by the fact that the average American reads at an 8th grade level). As a young adult, I can still remember being in middle school and being frustrated with this. However, amazing English teachers during my education have shown me that reading and writing are two easy, effective strategies to improve reading comprehension and overall language ability. By reading, you’re absorbing hundreds of pages of work from different people with varying styles who have worked for years on each book. I mostly read science fiction and fantasy in my free time. Conversational English people think of on the fly and isn’t nearly as well developed. Even writing a daily journal (which isn’t anything fancy) has helped improves writing skills greatly as it’s a repetitive practice with small daily improvement that accumulates overtime. I hope this helps someone, but I have to say I strongly disagree with Dr. Gray on this one and wanted to put better advice out there for anyone facing similar issues.
Thank God I found this video. I am in the same exact situation. However, I don't have all the Biology for Medical School. I graduated with Chemistry and the only Biology I have is General and Human Physiology
Dr. Gray, I am in a similar situation here. I have a BA from Rutgers in Math with a physics minior (overall gpa 3.42/sci gpa 3.33) and decided to take bio/chem/orgo at my local county college. I never took those classes as an undergrad as they were not required for my program. So, I guess this is sort of a “self made post bacc.” So far I’m on track for a 4.0 with the courses at my county college. Is it wise to continue to take them there or would it look better to go back to Rutgers to take some of them at the upper level? Also to note, my gpa is not the strongest but I did work full time to pay rent/car ins/other living expenses during my entire time there. Is this something that I will be able to explain on an application? Is it even worth bringing up as it feels like a sort of pity plea? Thank you for your time. I hope to hear from you.
Thomas, he has explained before thay when you write your personal statement, you can explain as to why your GPA was at that point due to SE needs. It actually is appreciated more and it's not a pity plea, it's shows character and maturity and the ability to work under pressure as a person and student. Med schools would want someone like you (I'm also in the same situation as you with working and going to school). And per my mentors and Dr. I shadow, they all agree and said the same thing. Trust yourself and hope you have successfully accomplished what you wanted.
When they calculate the science gpa,do they just look at the required science classes or all the science classes you took throughout undergrad? Thank you
Hey! Question for you if I went to community college and did a bunch of courses like my pre reqs etc and got a really good gpa but my matriculated bachelors degree before that was only a 3.1 in a completely different field would I still get filtered out or would they use my community college gpa ?
That's terrible 3.0 is what I have right now but am on my second year so a 4.0 is not that far. Am sorry to say this but I came to the country around 9 years ago. My parents spoke arabic all the time. I spoke English at home. I can never say Arabic is my primary language. This is a tough excuse.
Yes, I see what you're saying. I grew up speaking Spanish until I learned English around 7 years old. I worked on it, even though my family spoke Spanish my entire life. I ended up getting full scholarships to couple of universities AND had to work to provide for my family. I see how solely dedicating full time to school and STILL getting a low GPA is concerning. I think maybe she just needs to change her mindset and study habits.
@misuzu9254 yeah, word problems are no joke when you speak another language. You have a cery strong upward trend that i think will benefit you OP, and like you said, you are trying to get as close to 4.0 as possible. Keep going!
I speak arabic too, moved to US when I was 15, my parents only speak Arabic and when I started college I had some problems too but she was born here and went to school here so I do not see why it should be such a big issue
In my opinion, this is the type of student who should go to a Caribbean med school. At a certain point it is almost too late to go back and try to fix all of your mistakes from the past. Any thoughts?
Andres Smith I have to agree. A 3.03 gpa makes it very difficult to get accepted into any DO or MD schools. Like a 3.3 is the border imo for getting accepted in the US
There have been many stories here and stories online (and stories of people I know) getting into md or do with these stats. The difference was having an upwards trend tho. I think if she did get into a post bacc/smp and showed she could do well in an academically rigorous environment, she would get it. Or, she would need to contiue talking to deans to get her story and passion understood, and that would get her foot in. A medschool that values spanish speakers, students from latin/spanish backgrounds, and first gen may snatch her up, especially if they have a very specific mission that she can fit (like Rush in chicago). If she sees this or anyone like her see's this meharry is a medschool that would give you the resources you need. Emory HealthPREP helps facilitate the entry into medschool (minimum 2.7 sgpa), and other medschools offer similar programs (morehouse used to have one, but idk if they still have it?). But look around, you may have to call schools sometimes lol. You get connections, academic rigor, and the chance to prove yourself. Goodluck!
No no please no. Watch Dr. Andre Pineset's videos on Caribbean schools. Not worth it. The debt she will have after a carib MD program will dwarf any debt she might get in a postbacc/taking extra classes.
Hey Doc, I think the premeds (including me) would benefit most if you went into detail about postbaccs, for example how to do a cheap diy Postbacc.
He has a video on it, it’s called “the formula for successful DIY premed post bac”
I’m sure your page popped up in my feed because I began researching about getting into medical school, and I’m so happy it did! Your videos have given me more of an insight on what to research and plan for. I never would have thought to search on CZcams for these answers so thank you for having this channel!
I respect that Dr. Gray reccognized that he could not fully relate to this situation but he acknowledged his oppertunaties and priviledge. I kind of understand this student,s situation. English was not my primary languague. Some students do not have the resources to afford private tutoring. Some collages are not good for premeds because they lack resources to be able to reliably help these students reliably matriculate into medical school. Examples of such institutions are community colleges and private four year institutions that do not have a medical school associated with them. Students who are forced to complete the first two years of their undergraduate education at a community college miss out on oppertunaties like learning about research, shadowing, and being assigned an academic advisor who is a MD and who might be the dean of admisions at a medical school. Statistically, many medical schools judge premed students who begin undergrad at a community college in a unfavorable fashon. Consequently, it might result in a higher likleyhood that they might be denied admision into medical school after they complete all of the basic requirments because of the disadvantages attending a community college places students at. I went through a situation kind of like this student,s situation.
As a black non-hispanic student who is a Spanish major I COMPLETELY understand how speaking one language at school and another at home is very very challenging!! My medieval Spanish literature class is kicking my behind right now lol!!
She’s lived in the US since she was born?
I'm not a premed, but this was excellent advice!! I love how he is so down to Earth and answers all of her questions honestly and concisely!
I love your series! You've helped with my journey. Can you talk more about do it yourself post bac work? Because I'm a nontraditional and I have to continue to work until after med school acceptance, I looked into a formal post bac $60k! I need every option possible and want to explore the community college route. Your suggestion has piqued my interest. Can you talk more on creating your own post bac? Classes needed? Load while working and what looks good on apps for interviews. Thanks for all that you do!
For those struggling academically I recommend Justin Sung and I Can Study on CZcams. Both are great at teaching you how to learn and build strong study systems
This was very helpful thinking through the post Bach versus masters tracks. I have 3 questions: 1)For do it yourself post Bach’s, does it matter where you do them? Community college versus university? 2) Or if you do them across two different schools (due to work schedule conflicts if also working full time)? 3) does your post Bach coursework have to be the same intensity as an undergrad student? (Again for folks who are working and/or doing this as a second career).
Soooooo I have listened to almost all of your podcasts Dr. Gray. I know you talk about research is not required but people think there is a cause and effect kinda relation between not getting into med school if you don't have research.
Would you mind making a video about just research and talk about it. Me and other non trads would appreciate it, who dont have 20 hours/week to sit in a lab that they are not passionate about and not have the time either.
Gurpreet Malhi if you feel you need research you could do clinical research. Chart reviews, etc. requires MUCH less time than bench work and you can still make it meaningful
@@joshmcgoo that's what I'm planning for my senior research....
some schools require research, not all
not all schools require research. if you are trying to get into a top 10 med school then yeah you would probably need research under your belt
Garrett, just like the comments explained, depending on the med schools you're applying (look at their requirements and talk to their deans/advisers). However, I have received feedback also from the Dr. I shadowed for and they never did research undergrad, however they had lots of EC and that aided on their application. Best of luck!
I think a good study plan is important. I came to US at age 23, that’s about the time I began to speak English . School in my country was poor, so my intellectual back ground is also poor. I went to college here for 3 years (3.98 gpa) calculus, chemistry, economics, tons of English. I had to stop to be a full time mom. I now speak 2 other languages (besides English) at home to help my children speak those languages. I am now going back to school. I can say based on experience, time is gold for studying. You need to put in the time . Going back now to get a feeling if I can put the time in (due to family commitments), if I can’t , I might need to wait a bit more.
"Just speak more English"...huh? Lol
Was completely offended by that!!!! The point could have been elucidated better to be a white man telling a non English speaker to speak more English was completely unprofessional and ignorant and the fact that no one called you out about that is ludicrous
Generally, I really enjoy Dr. Gray’s videos and the very specific, actionable advice he gives. However, I have to heavily disagree with his advice to not speak Spanish as much at home. This used to be the general advice of ELL (English Language Learner) programs because the old-school thought was the home language is a barrier not an asset. Better understanding of ELL has actually made this advice outdated. Firstly, fluency in a home language actually improves a student’s ability to learn English. Secondly, encouraging students to speak less Spanish could have damaging affects to them personally by decreasing their ability to communicate with loved ones who aren’t fluent in English and can’t communicate effectively in English. As a child of immigrants, I can also confidently say that it’s unlikely that having more English in the household (or even conversing with the average native English speaker) will improve reading comprehension needed for MCAT, standardized testing, or higher education in America. Just from the conversation with her, it’s clear her speaking fluency is not the issue (which if it was, would be when you might suggest protected English speaking time through extracurriculars). However, people have gotten into medical school and are doctors with less English speaking fluency than her. Additionally, bilingualism is a highly marketable/transferrable skill, if we’re only going to focus on career advancement.
I would say a much better solution is reading and writing. Even for native English speakers in America, our language doesn’t advance drastically past middle school or high school (supported by the fact that the average American reads at an 8th grade level). As a young adult, I can still remember being in middle school and being frustrated with this. However, amazing English teachers during my education have shown me that reading and writing are two easy, effective strategies to improve reading comprehension and overall language ability. By reading, you’re absorbing hundreds of pages of work from different people with varying styles who have worked for years on each book. I mostly read science fiction and fantasy in my free time. Conversational English people think of on the fly and isn’t nearly as well developed. Even writing a daily journal (which isn’t anything fancy) has helped improves writing skills greatly as it’s a repetitive practice with small daily improvement that accumulates overtime. I hope this helps someone, but I have to say I strongly disagree with Dr. Gray on this one and wanted to put better advice out there for anyone facing similar issues.
Thank God I found this video. I am in the same exact situation. However, I don't have all the Biology for Medical School. I graduated with Chemistry and the only Biology I have is General and Human Physiology
Dr. Gray do you think it’s appropriate to apply to a online masters program?
Dr. Gray,
I am in a similar situation here. I have a BA from Rutgers in Math with a physics minior (overall gpa 3.42/sci gpa 3.33) and decided to take bio/chem/orgo at my local county college. I never took those classes as an undergrad as they were not required for my program. So, I guess this is sort of a “self made post bacc.” So far I’m on track for a 4.0 with the courses at my county college. Is it wise to continue to take them there or would it look better to go back to Rutgers to take some of them at the upper level? Also to note, my gpa is not the strongest but I did work full time to pay rent/car ins/other living expenses during my entire time there. Is this something that I will be able to explain on an application? Is it even worth bringing up as it feels like a sort of pity plea? Thank you for your time. I hope to hear from you.
I want to know about this as well
Thomas, he has explained before thay when you write your personal statement, you can explain as to why your GPA was at that point due to SE needs. It actually is appreciated more and it's not a pity plea, it's shows character and maturity and the ability to work under pressure as a person and student. Med schools would want someone like you (I'm also in the same situation as you with working and going to school). And per my mentors and Dr. I shadow, they all agree and said the same thing. Trust yourself and hope you have successfully accomplished what you wanted.
When they calculate the science gpa,do they just look at the required science classes or all the science classes you took throughout undergrad?
Thank you
Biology Chemistry Physics Mathmatics
Thanks
All science
how do I get myself onto one of these?
I was wondering the same thing!
each program has their own requirements. Set up an appointment and talk with them
@@issasecretsecret7814 I think they mean get into a youtube video with Dr. G
Hey! Question for you if I went to community college and did a bunch of courses like my pre reqs etc and got a really good gpa but my matriculated bachelors degree before that was only a 3.1 in a completely different field would I still get filtered out or would they use my community college gpa ?
Man, she keeps pointing the finger at others
Just what I needed 🙏🏿🙏🏿
Don’t go to hunter! It’s way harder!
Hunter pre-med post bacc was disbanded in 2018
how can I send a questio?
That's terrible 3.0 is what I have right now but am on my second year so a 4.0 is not that far. Am sorry to say this but I came to the country around 9 years ago. My parents spoke arabic all the time. I spoke English at home. I can never say Arabic is my primary language. This is a tough excuse.
Yes, I see what you're saying. I grew up speaking Spanish until I learned English around 7 years old. I worked on it, even though my family spoke Spanish my entire life. I ended up getting full scholarships to couple of universities AND had to work to provide for my family. I see how solely dedicating full time to school and STILL getting a low GPA is concerning. I think maybe she just needs to change her mindset and study habits.
I don't think you can get a 4.0 gpa anymore.
@misuzu9254 yeah, word problems are no joke when you speak another language. You have a cery strong upward trend that i think will benefit you OP, and like you said, you are trying to get as close to 4.0 as possible. Keep going!
Somethings come easier to others. It’s not an excuse it’s real life and it’s not easy.
I speak arabic too, moved to US when I was 15, my parents only speak Arabic and when I started college I had some problems too but she was born here and went to school here so I do not see why it should be such a big issue
In my opinion, this is the type of student who should go to a Caribbean med school. At a certain point it is almost too late to go back and try to fix all of your mistakes from the past. Any thoughts?
Andres Smith I have to agree. A 3.03 gpa makes it very difficult to get accepted into any DO or MD schools. Like a 3.3 is the border imo for getting accepted in the US
There have been many stories here and stories online (and stories of people I know) getting into md or do with these stats. The difference was having an upwards trend tho. I think if she did get into a post bacc/smp and showed she could do well in an academically rigorous environment, she would get it. Or, she would need to contiue talking to deans to get her story and passion understood, and that would get her foot in. A medschool that values spanish speakers, students from latin/spanish backgrounds, and first gen may snatch her up, especially if they have a very specific mission that she can fit (like Rush in chicago). If she sees this or anyone like her see's this meharry is a medschool that would give you the resources you need. Emory HealthPREP helps facilitate the entry into medschool (minimum 2.7 sgpa), and other medschools offer similar programs (morehouse used to have one, but idk if they still have it?). But look around, you may have to call schools sometimes lol. You get connections, academic rigor, and the chance to prove yourself. Goodluck!
@@coleolson2133 not if you get a 510+ mcat for DO school
No no please no. Watch Dr. Andre Pineset's videos on Caribbean schools. Not worth it. The debt she will have after a carib MD program will dwarf any debt she might get in a postbacc/taking extra classes.
@@Limitedonathios Thank you for sharing. Any suggestions on key words to use to facilitate researching for programs like the emory health prep?