5 Mistakes Beginner Songwriters Should Avoid
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- Äas pĆidĂĄn 18. 05. 2024
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00:00 Introduction
01:21 Mistake #1 - Pronouns
06:02 Mistake #2 - Chords
11:16 Mistake #3 - Melody
14:35 Mistake #4 - Output
17:03 Mistake #5 - Titles - Hudba
Iâm not sure who first said it but Iâve never forgotten this. âGreat songs arenât written, they are re writtenâ. This has helped me so much.
There's a podcast called Songwriter Theory and the guy says : writing is editing. Same kinda thing
Original: "Great books aren't written, they're re-written," commonly attributed to Michael Crichton.
Do you interpret this as rewriting your own song or reference songs?
I think they mean to rewrite your own song. Fine tuning it, looking for better verbs and words etc... â@@jeffrey.a.hanson
Thank you! Iâm writing a song right now and just realised I use âyouâ for two different people in the verse and chorus đ€ŠđŒââïž
Songwriting tip: channel your subconscious, there are no rules. Technique and meaning are overrated. Make pretty sounds with syllables instead of trying to "say" something.
Also more first lines from Ed âwhen I was six years old I broke my legâ, âI took an arrow to the heartâ, âit hit like a trainâ. Great stuff Keppie.
Great video! I just wanted to make a comment on point number 2. You called it a mistake to start your sections on the same chord. I wouldn't call it a mistake cause it's a matter of taste and what you might feel that the song needs. There are great songs that use the same chord progression throughout the whole song and there's a clear distinction between sections because good songs and good arrangements don't only rely on chord progressions to create a journey.
Something Iâve come to realise is that I can reuse my old ideas in new songs, it doesnât have to be 100% original every time. I mean fleetwood Mac reused the baseline in the chain, and it makes that song what it is.
I would add that if youâre starting the song on the relative minor, it is a useful technique to employ a pre-chorus which provides a greater âliftâ to the tonic major chord.
John Lennon kinda got away with #1 in Nowhere Man but he said it like "Isnt He a bit like you and me"
I loved this. It helped me a lot. I often hit the wall with a song idea because I go from the beginning. I find that if I start with a cool idea and write it as a bridge, whether melodically or lyrically, I can build out from it. Itâs just a recent thing that Iâve done, but it works great!
Thank you Keppie! Great stuff as usual.
Thanks so much! That was so helpful.
Love this! Needed it
Thank you for the tips specifically the one about landing always on the beat, hadn't thought of that!
Very well said THANK YOU!
I appreciate these songwriting nuggets. I especially like how you focus and reference what the listener needs and wants. Kudos
Very very helpful thank you!
#5 really got me. Thanks so much!
Once again Soo good! Discovered your videos a week ago and it boosted my knowledge to a level i wanted it to be since like 2 years and never could archieve it. Im finally at a point where i can actually say i write songs and not just mess around with random chords in a Key and now i know how to built and release tention
Wonderful tips, beautifully presented and demonstrated, thank you. Cheers Dave
Again an amazing tutorial! I take notes and transfer it to a worksheet that remains by my side when I get stuck. Thank you so much for this channel.
Helpful tips. #4 and 5 spoke to me the most. Both are tips Iâve heard before, especially on this channel, but always helpful to be reminded again⊠and again. Thank you!
Great tips đđ
Once again great information and encouragement. I have fallen into some of these avoidables, particularly overusing the tonic in my songs and starting verse and chorus on the same chord.
Mistake #3, nice advice...it sounds more soulful
beautiful chords!
Amen, sister!
Naming something gives it power.
You are the best teacher, â€â€â€â€
Great tips Keppie on improving songwriting. I am so thankful for your channel. All through college and my graduate studies songwriting has been looked down upon by my professors, but more and moe, I am realizing how difficult songwriting is versus writing an Avante-Garde 12 tone composition.
Good stuff! â€
Thanks for the video.. really great food for thought.. I write from the title often but I learned some great ideas from the earlier part of the video.. Good stuff
Really helpful Thankyou
This channel is setting my writing free, been writing years, but this has channel has been a massive help!
Switching to "you" from "he/she" could work, if the song changes more dramatically for that part (say, a rock song that goes pretty quiet) and then moves back to "he/she". It COULD work even in the example, though it's not optimal.
The tonic chord and the same chord starting every section sounds very dull. Good thing I'm not using it.
Anyway, very helpful video!
Iâve been writing for 20 years, just decided I was going to when I was around 14. Iâve never thought to be analytical about how the process works. This was interesting, and thankfully the only rule I STILL break is the lyrical one. After my years of doing it Iâve realized one simple thing: EVERY MOMENT OF THE SONG HAS TO BE INTERESTING TO YOU AND THE AUDIENCEâŠIT NEEDS TO CONSTANTLY BE POPPING AND MOVING. Music is MOVEMENT đ
Good stuff! I'm getting songwriting lessons from my hubby and your video confirms everything he's been teaching so far. Thank you!
Inspirational â€
Thank youâ€đ
tip #4 is definitely the most important
Very much agreed, i think they say this in another vid as well, much more expanded, with quotes from many great writers. I thought just today, exactly like a tennis vid from My Tennis Hq - dont put everything into feeling good when you play, or you will only play brilliantly once in a while, and lose otherwise. In sport its called âwinning uglyâ - we need to look for inspiration, but we also need to âwrite ugly.â
Thank you.
All good suggestions. I would add song form. I think it is really important for beginners to be well grounded in song form and then experiment. Most pop is Verse-Chorus-Bridge, maybe with a pre-chorus. However, it's great to try writing an AABA, or even 12-bar blues. Or, try different variations on the V-C-B (does your song really need a bridge?). Also great to be able to hear all your favorite songs and understand what form is being used.
A really sensational video. It is packed with so many valuable insights that can really help in improving my songwriting quality. Wow, I am ashamed to say how long I have harbored a lot of these habits.Thanks so much, Marty
Youâre awesome. Great video. As an aspiring songwriter, I would love to thank you so much for sharing this with us â€ïžâ€ïž. Keep up the great work. Blessings.
Damn! I learned a LOT from this. I think Iâll watch it again. Thank you.
I wrote this song, called Memories a couple months ago (sorry itâs very long):
Everything that happens
And everything I do
No matter the deed or action
Leads me back to you
The way you walk and talk and smile
And the way you wear your hair
That look in your eyes tells me for sure
That youâre beyond compare
And our memories will stay with me
Till the day I pass away
Iâm hoping you will know
I love you
Send some loving my way
Place your hands in mine
How can I ignore you
When you look so fine?
I wish I met you sooner
You make everything so clear
You give my life direction
So stay with me my dear
But do you really love me?
Weâll find out as time flies by
But just for now words will have to do
So say that youâll never say goodbye
And our memories will stay with me
Till the day I pass away
Iâm hoping you will know
I love you
Send some loving my way
Place your hands in mine
How can I ignore you
When you look so fine?
I wish I met you sooner
You make everything so clear
You give my life direction
So stay with me my dear
Everything that happens
And everything I do
No matter the deed or action
Leads me back to you
You are a amazing human đŒđ€đ»đ€đ»đ€đ»
I started this rolling my eyes w an attitude..but by mistake #4 I'm am đą.. Thank you for this video
Brian Wilson and Phil Spector were perfectionists :)
Both were arguably a little cray cray too đ
@@officialWWM Indeed - but then what really great artist isn't..?
@@spooky1304 correct. Most great artists walk that fine line between brilliance and insanity đ
Mistake #4 is golden. Good one. Mistake #2 can be not just black and white. Start in third person then rope in the listener with second person. Best to do once in one direction to shift the perspective. 19:00 sums up the heart and soul of refrain-based writing. Good info.
Loved the perfectionist quote in the video. It really put my songwriting journey into perspective. (Hundreds of half-songs on the hard drive for over a decade and only a few see the light of day.) Also, you could absolutely KILL a Fiona Apple song any day of the week. 10/10 thank you again for another great vid! TY
Whatâs the video youâre recommending at the end of the video? Great tips!
I really need to mind number 4 in terms of composition. Keep threatening to start giving myself a one-hour time limit from improv to full track and spend a couple weeks with that just to tune myself. I know I can do it, but I have to unlearn discernment with my inspiration - couple years ago I forced myself to stem the tide bc I have *so many unfinished pieces.
The funny thing is, I learned a lot of these things naturally as i practiced songwriting. But it was after i had written most of my debut album, and I released it even with these little tendencies only because im so excited for my listeners to watch as my writing develops as i release more and more music đ
*alright time to start over and over again*
How might purchase your music,Keppie?
Some things that we tend to take for granted in writing songs, are musical or lyrical arrangements and compositions.
But that would be for more advanced teachings and learners. Can you teach that?
Thank you for the tips. I really enjoy your content. It has helped me a lot.
Ray Davies is my favorite song writer. He said he teaches songwriting. But it may only be in England. He should have a CZcams channel, I bet it'd be popular. He is very prolific. I just got a book of Irish folk songs and it looks pretty easy for me and it is about my bedtime and I'll obsess over it all night.
Guilty of #2 . When fixing the problem, I find it easier to change the chord that starts the verse.
I am not a songwriter but play guitar since many years. Lately I wanted to play a love song for a girl friend. My first approach was to understand her musical character. 1. I know she does not like this âboomer bendsâ. 2. I know, she does not really understand music theory, so switching between unfitting cords would not be an issue 3. It should not be too complex or too long, but maybe a little bit flamenco like and surprising. I started the song by stealing some parts from other songs and then made only the links in between. As a result, this was more fun for me then for her, playing her character without words đ€đđ€«đ.
Wow
Isn't it good to use more weak chords (ii, iii, vi, vii*) in the verse and more dominant chords (I, IV, V) in the chorus?
Thanks for the tip on starting/not starting each section on the same chords!!!
By the way, you have a very nice singing voice! Reminds me a little bit of Fiona Apple, just the sound of it when you both sing in that range.
Here are some more: 1) Although you might be a beginner songwriter, you shouldn't be a beginner at your instrument.
2) Avoid trite chord patterns (e.g. I-IV-V, I-VI-IV-V and 2-chord songs). Although many greats have gotten away with it, you can't because these types of patterns are boring and predictable.
3) Include a bridge, as it makes your song more interesting.
4) Expand your chord knowledge. For each common guitar root chord, you should know the major, minor, seventh, major seventh, minor seventh, diminished and augmented for each. Learning basic jazz and bossa nova chords will make your music more interesting.
5) Have someone who knows grammar check your song for mistakes.
6) Don't force a rhyme because your story will become stupid.
7) Most important - interesting music is more important than interesting lyrics. We're no longer in the 1960s/70s. Most people don't pay attention to lyrics. Listen to virtually any David Bowie song and there's no way to know what the heck he was talking about. You're not going to hook anyone with your lyrics but you will with an interesting chord progression, tempo and beat.
I donât find this advice to be that good. A lot of these should only be given on a case-by-case basis and arenât good to just say flatly because they donât apply to everyone.
#7 is just bad advice. Play to your strengths and do what you love doing.
This is QUALITY
Hey I've written. A song that it starts with I in every line of the verses is this a good idea or not.
On the subject of output, should I scrap a song half way through writing it if I can tell itâs bad? Or should I continue and finish it for the sake of practicing finishing writing a whole song?
Finish it.
Many times youâll find the gold right at the end. Then you can go back and adjust the things that got you there.
Quitting also reinforces the bad tendency to doubt yourself.
Try to see every line as a challenge to make the rest of the lines better.
Be your own best listener.
If you donât like a line, try giving it context with the next line.
Itâs a great formula for surprise.
Lots of great tips here, especially the âstart with a target in mindâ bit. Iâll have to try that out! I think there are always exceptions to the rule, though. The mixing pronouns one especially. Radioheadâs song âCreepâ does that. It starts, âWhen you were here before, I couldnât look you in the eyeâ etc⊠and later in the song he sings, âSheâs running out the door.â I think Thom Yorke gets away with it because itâs such a well composed song.
There's a Stevie Wonder vibe on "happy again" chords/melody. I can't think of which song, but my ear can detect it.
Resolving on the Major instead of minor (again). He does that a Lot.
@@user-gf3fg5go1s I think it may be more specific than that.
weirdly enough, with that specific example about switching pronouns, given the first line i already as a listener assumed the speaker is an observer of both the he and she and the description is all internal monologue, so the "will you ever be happy again" was automatically interpreted like if you in your internal monologue imagine a conversation with someone you were observing in a different way previously.
But using you throughout definitely does shift to a different feel that's really useful and i definitely feel like it's good advice
I like, how your little demo song switches to major at âhappy againâ but then falls back to minorđą
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There are no mistakes when it comes to art, just honest expression.
I hate songs that are completely predictable after you hear the first verse and chorus. I like something that surprises me.
Iâd love to connect with other songwriters. Any online adult groups around? I do not promote or currently post any music. Not looking for fame or wealth. Just great musical experiences with fellow music lovers. I play guitar, uke, and write/sing
Check out our Songwriting Groups here: howtowritesongs.org/songwriting-group-info-and-registration/
Any advice for someone whoâs just a singer that writes lyrics? Thatâs my hang up, Iâm writing, and it is getting better, but my God, do I feel like Iâm flying absolutely blind, and difficult given I canât play any instrument. Just a voice, and a pen. lol.
When I first started writing lyrics, I used melodies from instrumental video game songs and wrote what I thought would sound nice if someone were to sing the same melody.
Maybe you could try practicing with any instrumental tune, like a film score or something that has a distinct melody, and write stuff that âsings wellâ using the same melody.
Any free DAW like GarageBand or Audacity has tools you can use to make your own instrumental music, even if you donât know the theory behind it, and maybe you could try that too!
There are lots of music producers on CZcams who I'm guessing would be happy to help, some even do it for free!
This is incredibly important for you to hear.
You can learn an instrument. You should learn an instrument. The best way to help yourself write is to learn an instrument. It is easier than you think. What you need to be able to do what you want is far more simple than you think.
Just the basics of guitar (only 8 open chord shapes, 4 barre chord shapes and about 4 right hand guitar rhythms) is the absolutely only thing you need to know how to do on the instrument. This can be learned easily over the course of one summer. And then you have it for the rest of your life.
Borrow a guitar. Get on CZcams. Learn songs you like to sing. Play them slow at first, give yourself time to change chords. You'll get there before you know it.
@@Oleg_K. Seconded!
You can still learn about tone and cadence without having to lean to play an instrument. Get a cheap keyboard and find your vocal range on it. You can find melody then add lyrics or start with lyrics and then add melody. Do both because dynamics.
#1 Yes. Don't be selfish. Sing about others. Not yourself. (Theoretically but not a 'rule').
that first tip is one i notice all the time and it confuses me as to the message
đš
My opinion on #1. As a guy I don't want to listen to another guy singing about his man feelings. I want to hear him sing about MINE.đ If a female wants to sing about herself and how she's crying about needing a man I'm totally cool with it.
If there is no imagine there is no artists
My attention span must be like a 5 yr old. All I hear is:
Fine place for a day full of breakdowns.
Takes more than a meltdown to show us how.
Throw a tack on the road stop the meatplow.
Got a bullet but it ain't mine.
Meatplow-The Purple Album-STP
One of my faves. đ
These are, indeed, cringy aspects of nearly every local songwriter (outside of Nashville, maybe). Bless your attempting to stamp them out
the pronoun thing is a fair but subjective crit. However employing the third person S on whisper(s) does not relate that verb to the first person subject and would confuse even more than the injudicial shifting of pronouns.
Sting seems to have made mistake #1 when he wrote the bed's too big withoit you. Er
I agree with most of this, but not the thing about writing the title first.
To me, that is the formula for predictability.
Like talking to someone who isnât really listening, but rather, just waiting for their turn to talk.
Itâs the same problem with improv, if players go in knowing where they are going, it destroys the journey and becomes predictable.
Life is linear.
Express yourself in that manner, then, if needs be, go back and adjust.
Obviously, there are a million ways to make art, but the main thing to avoid in life, is becoming predictable and not in the moment.
My 2 cents.
I write a few songs a day, btw, so, I totally agree that persistent & consistent doing is the most important aspect in achieving quality.
Sorry, like going from She/He to You. Boo on the Grammar Police. It's not confusing and singing You and then You again is redundant. Rules are meant to be broken. Who wants to sound like everyone else? The idea is to create/project your own style and unique sound, thx.
The pronouns thing I dont find that important or jarring. The example was fine. Sure, is she asking him? Is she asking herself? or are she asking the reader? I think no matter what, you can misunderstand the direction. The way the context is going, I would guess the question could be something that "she" is thinking to herself, and I would decide to read it as such, but also there's an element of asking the question to the reader, there is a sense of breaking the 4th wall, that people will connect to, almost as if the lyric is asking them?
So I don't agree on the whole sentiment. Sure you could call it confusing. You could also call it multidimensional. You could also interpret the question as something the writer is asking themselves..
Prose/lyrics is not really all about being clear and logical and direct.
Rule # 1 for songwriting... Forget everything take the first thing you play first words in your mind... there is your song. Don't work it out take is as it comes if it sucks go through with it get that out of your system... write another song... after 100's of songs you will have ONE GOOD SONG>
Song writers are not pros.
@@gabself Don't think so much.
How many million sellers have you written?
Why would that matter?
in the KFC
Are we even allowed to use pronouns anymore? đđ
Have you ever wrote a hit
LMAO
@@billy2896
It's a genuine question, I can't seem to find any of her hits
What happens if she/he identifies as you? That's what you get with woke madness...confusion.
Your Looper hands you this...
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