First Take debates what Chief Wahoo logo removal means for other teams | First Take | ESPN
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- čas přidán 29. 01. 2018
- First Take's Stephen A. Smith and Max Kellerman, along with guest Will Cain, debate what the removal of the Chief Wahoo logo by the Cleveland Indians means for other sports teams.
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I’m Native American, Seminole/Creek, and I could not care less. We have bigger issues than the name of a professional sports team.
What doesn't ESPN get some natives on their show to explain why these things are so discriminating instead of having white and black dudes debate it
You hit the nail right in the head.
I'm native American and I like the logo personally
Yup i liked it
they are possibly gonna change the team name back to Cleveland Broncos or The Spiders. That's my guess.
flame bot198 Thank you for not being offended over this.
here go the identity politics
flame bot198 love yourself beloved
Max wants to fight Will Cain so bad lol
Reginald Pippin I got 10 on max
Dog 😭😂
Max is a G. He'll fight you and call his own fight.
Max vs Will UFC 221 Main Event
Rckless ur music is terrible
The irony of the Redskins debate is that many Indian reservation high schools use the Redskins name for their teams.
No they don’t lol
I've lived on my rez for years and have not encountered one redskin nickname. You don't know us, gtfo
Just cuz black people say nigga don't mean white people get to say it but yet they do n don't know nothin bout da struggle
Patrick Fennell so it 90% of native Americans like the name but 10% find it offensive I guess minority rules?
+Tidwell1988 Shut your bitch ass up
Dallas Cowboys need to change their name. My grandpa was a cowboy and i find it extremely offensive
Cody was he in broke back mountain
indians are referring to a race of people... when did cowboy refer to your grandpa's ethnicity/race? you're 100% white
1ightskin 1eo lmfaooo
Wolfwarrior We must remove the yankees as well. It was a derogatory term. Except its okay now why? Oh because people weren't offended by everything.
Daz and the LA Dodgers must change their name because it offends draft dodgers like Trump and Cheney.
They're changing the logo because it offends people like Max Kellerman who find everything offensive when most native Americans don't find the logo or the name offensive.
I love the Chief Wahoo logo, dammit man!
There is not one god damn Irish person offended by the term fighting Irish
Eugene Bridge
Because it portrays your culture in a noble light. Who wouldn't want to be associated with a bad ass mascot like that? The Cleveland Indians logo is a demeaning 1940's caricature of how Americans viewed Native Americans during that time. And we all know what that was.
LongSnappersLivesMatter no it doesn't... stop it already, there's no bottle of booze in the fictional leprechauns hand. That's one dumbass justification lol
Aw yes, the Drunken Louts of Notre Dame. Kinda has a ring to it, no?
curt spins
Okay so everybody is now supposed to feel sorry for Irish people? GTFOH! Your ancestors are the ones who committed genocide against the Native Americans and then they turn around and mock them with a demeaning mascot and team name. As for the Irish themed mascots, who do you think came up with them? Not Native Americans. Most likely it was Irish Americans themselves who coined those names, logos and mascots. No coincidence that all the teams with Irish themed names and mascots are located in regions that are predominantly Irish. You pricks are proud of being drunks and brawlers so how can anyone expect you to be sensitive towards issues that affect the lives of other races.
Glacius -- You misread me. The Irish are NOT my people. OK? I mean, there "might" be just a wee bit of Irish blood, but not any way that I culturally identify with. I'm MOCKING the Irish with the Drunken Louts.
I will keep wearing it
Max just said they should change the fighting Irish 😂😂
being Irish myself, you can call me a Mick to my face and i wouldnt give a shit. Hell, if they made a sports team called "The Drunken Micks" id be there number 1 fan haha. Most irish people dont give a shit.
jessesam lol I'm American but almost all my descendency is Irish. Shoulda worded that better
I'm part Irish and am in no way offended by the fighting Irish or leprechaun of Notre Dame Mr Kellerman.
Gallen Norris I'm Irish american and even the concept of being offended by the fighting Irish logo never crossed my mind.
Because it’s a compliment. It means you guys have fighting spirits. If they called you alcoholic soulless gingers instead, would you still feel the same?
TheTinyTimmyTimTim the "Fighting Irish" is a negative connotation based on Irishmen getting drunk and fighting.
kalel33 No it's not. Read up on the history of Notre Dame sometime.
King of all BLACKS You have no concept of Irish American history shut your mouth
First take used to be better with Skip and Stephen A
Skip is just a troll for ratings
WutInTheButt agreed
Ryan Kaawach god damn
f ten that is sick and Anti-Semitic. And the Final Solution didn't answer the question! Never forget Sobibor!!
I agree with you
I'm Irish, I dont complain about Boston Celtics Logo. I freaking love it🔥🍀🍀
ESPN HAS NO CREDIBILITY.
So dont watch
Daniel Bencosme Honestly I watch almost no ESPN now. It's also completely Leftist and even the quality of the sports coverage has declined. Max Kellerman is a douche. Remember when ESPN actually was sports/entertainment and not SJW?
Thats why i watch fox sports
Will Cain is spot on with this sick of this BS hope he still works at ESPN.
I'm so glad the Indians changed it. I was losing sleep at night knowing they had a negative stereotype(sarcasm)
ChronoJack 😂
ChronoJack of course you weren't... it doesn't fuckin involve you or your people.
Cy The Grate I'm sure you were thinking about the Cleveland Indians logo every day mate. Most Native Americans don't care about it or the Redskins. In fact, a lot of them like it. Look at the stats and numbers
ChronoJack fuck you're stats and numbers based off a handful of a remaining people just looking to survive.. I'm far from a friend "mate".
Their still gonna use the logo for merch
Bring back Chief Wahoo
And the real USA too
I’m Irish and I do not give a shit that Notre Dame has the name fighting Irish. Just because SOME people find it offensive does not mean you should just change it.
I heard that after Max gets the Fighting Irish logo banned, he's going after the guy on the Lucky Charms box.
Ughhh I wanted to see what Steven a smith said
MrNiceGuy80x5 search "ESPN first take wahoo" on CZcams and the full 25 minute clip is there
Who gets offended by the fighting irish????
Jason Mellone I just think EVERYONE should be wrapped up in bubble wrap in case one person doesn't like a certain word used to describe anything, and no one should ever have a different opinion on any topic ever is that so hard?
nothings gonna happen to the leprechaun because coz its white. if white people gonna react, theyll just call you bunch of snowflakes.
deicide well regardless of your race if you have a problem with something as small as a team name or logo then you are a snowflake/baby
The polite Irish duh
There's more Irish presidents than native American presidents. Plus Irish are proud they have that stereotype. Natives never drank alcohol before Europeans gave us it. It's so far abused that were worse than any European with that drug. Not to mention we were given handouts like nothing but to serve corporate alcohol.
Stephen a got some nerve saying let him speak. Really. Who do you allow to speak?
Muzukashiijinsei Ichibandaijina lol i was just thinking that
Hell yea man I was thinking the same too
I let other men hold my dick when I take a piss, I let other men have sex with my wife. I'm an SJW
Zidane Steiner well if your wife is hot. I’ll accept.
I was thinking the same thing like wtf? When did SAS become the mediator. Did he take over for Molly or something? Who gave SAS the power.
My great grandparents are both Irish Immigrants....that old man never missed a Fighting Irish game. However, at least Max is consistent. Most people I have talked to who are appalled by the Redskins say there is nothing wrong with Fighting Irish. It's a bit refreshing in a weird way, to find someone with some consistency.
I’m a Native American and I love my Redskins proudly. Y’all should be really having Natives have a say in this debate cause we’re the ones who know how they feel.
THAT'S THE PROBLEM....Native Americans won't take a stand. They'll let blacks and whites debate it, but they won't say jack! 👎
Why did u let redskins go away?
Man WTF
LOGOS hurt peoples feelings now
I'm done
Maxanitschpro It does if its RACIST. Dumbass
Jimmy Bonez bro the redskins logo isn't racist dumbass. A Native American tribe leader even said its okay if they use the logo. Do some research before you call someone a dumbass.
Maxanitschpro put a black guys face as a logo and see what happens
theres a john oliver episode on this, you are wrong
whats exactly is racist about it? You know what i would suggest: Stop crying and leave your safe space
I’m Irish and I find the Notre Dame logo no way offensive like most people do. I find it stupid that people like Max Kellerman ASSUME that we are offended. My entire family is from Ireland and moved to Michigan in the 1940s. My great grandfather is one of the biggest fighting Irish fans! None of us find it offensive
I have a MBA and I’ve been working in marketing for over 10 years now and I can tell you rebranding any existing company is a major pain in the ass and for a big well known business not only is it a pain but it costs millions.
Max said who care about what fans think, dude fans are the lifeline. Fans control the outcome.
Max just left the fans out of it. I think the fans of the team would want to keep it.
CheezuS most of the fans are not offended. Others are
CheezuS of course the fans are not affected. If tomorrow some arab team changed it's name to 9/11's and made it's mascot two burning towers, you wouldn't take issue with it? It's common sense not over sensibility, and its certainly not up to the fans specially because they would cheer for the team regardless...
Jerome Marshall because SPOILER ALERT: most of the fans ARE WHITE!!
CheezuS dumb comment. True FANS will not stop being fans as a result of changing a name or a logo however you will alienate those who would perhaps be Fans or be patrons of the sport of organization if you aren’t aware of the perception of those outside of and within the sport. I say pander to everyone as best you can
Don't throw FSU into this stupid ass conversation. FSU has a permission from the Seminole tribe. FSU honors the Seminole tribe. Don't bring that politically correct bullshit to Tallahassee, FSU will ALWAYS be the Seminoles and Chief Osceola and Renegade will ALWAYS be the mascots. GO NOLES!!!
I don't think most people have a problem with FSU because the logo doesn't look comically stupid. It actually makes the Seminoles look fierce and proud. Chief Wahoo, on the other hand, looks exactly like one of those old school racist cartoons, except it's painted red instead of black. Not really a mystery why they're getting rid of it, I think your Noles should be fine though Rabbit.
If you feel that passionately, as a grown adult, about a fuckin' mascot, then I can't take you seriously. I love my college, and I wouldn't want anyone changing the symbols I grew up with. If I ever go on a rant about it with capitalized words and exclamation points, I hope someone makes me go outside and get some fresh air. Genuine passion should be reserved for less silly things.
It's red...it's offensive it's basically calling Native Americans redskins like the NFL does....u don't think people would be offended if we had team with a pale white male logo and called it the pasteskins? Or black logo and called it the blackies? Put yourself in that position just because the Natives were slaughtered off doesn't mean what's left of them deserve respect
Revenge of Tupac Shakur
You’re not native american, stop speaking for them.
Fighting Irish is offensive? This is a skit.
tito22212 It’s not the name that’s offensive. It’s the logo.
nnorush85 Leprechauns aren't real though
C.J. Love I never knew Irish found it offensive till this interview. I thought it was part of Irish culture. Kind of like Chinese and dragons. But if they are offended who am I to tell them they shouldn’t be.
nnorush85 Dang, that's crazy
C.J. Love No, it isn't. You think it's fun being a short guy of Irish heritage. Shockingly, there's like 3 jokes you can make about leprechauns and they get tiring after the 2nd time hearing it.
People like Max make espn almost unwatchable these days.
R.I.P CLEVELAND INDIANS WAHOO LOGO
R.I.P CLEVELAND INDIANS WAHOO LOGO
Good riddance!
where is the rest of the clip?
I'm half Navajo and l like that hat
Lmao WILL KKKAIN out of nowhere for this topic 😂
Jareth Cruz 😂😂😂💀
Jareth Cruz stfu
What kinda weenie name is “Jareth”
Frosty Days lmfao 😂😂😂
So because someone has a take you don’t agree with you think they have ties with the KKK? Willing to bet you’re one of those “AmeriKKKa” people aren’t you? Which would be sad, seeing how America gives you the right to type that, and America gives you that right to even speak that. Try that in Russia, China or other countries without democracy😂
Let's bring back Cheif Wahoo!
No!
@@billybeason350 Snowflake
It’s so stupid that people find offense to a name or logo of a PRO TEAM you should be honored to have that.
HAHAHA Stephen A texted Max to apologize to Will for interrupting. "apologize bitch, don't be so disrespectful"
Why does max act like he represents every race on earth
This is pathetic some people are so damn sensitive, there’s no negative intent behind the names or logos...
THANK YOU
Ask the natives how they feel. I've seen countles interviews where the natives did not care about the logos AT ALL and their was one where he said he like the logos. Liberals are the only ones complaining.
Dude are you stupid. It’s like having a team named the n word and saying “It’s okay don’t get offended”
Look up intent vs impact...drops mic
If there was no intent, the name wouldn’t happen.
I don't think anyone is truly offended by these logos because most mature adults wouldn't even care. However, it's hard to look at that logo and not think it's in bad taste.
I remember putting gold rhinestones on the teeth to make the logo look like he had a gold grill back in the 90's lol
Max just says whatever is politically correct on everything controversial. I don’t like Will but he at least has unique takes.
KingB77 Tx
The alt ride side.
Damn Will Cain cold blooded!
Cleveland named Indians in 1915, Washington named Redskins in 1933. Question is why is this a problem now?
Actually it kinda was an issue since the 70s but wasn't given much Attention
“It’s not that hard” thank you Max
Didn't even see that Will Cain was on this clip until after clicking on it. Fortunately for me, CZcams allows you to fast forward videos.
Yea don't allow opinions from you liberal agenda bubble.
People are way too soft nowadays.
And of all generations to get so easily offended, it's the one who grew up on South Park and Family Guy
Serious question, how are Seminole and fighting Sioux offensive?
Who’s head to reflect back to this
I'm Native American and I don't find any name referring to my people as 'racist.' Our people, our culture is pretty much dead. Why not celebrate our rich history & heritage? Teams are using our Native names as powerful symbols as representations of their organizations; this shows Natives are strong. I don't find the Redskins offensive.
142 thats what im saying!!! We are almost forgot about
Until the Redskins join the Browns with a 0-16 season...
142 well said
Awww is Max gonna cry?
Back to the trailer hicky boy
Says the white guy with a bunch of shitty "rap" music in their favorites.. the irony smh
Cy The Grate lmao what kind of comeback is that?
Ryan Kaawach that's pretty racist
Can we not be anti-semetic please? Thank you
Anyone else missing the 70's and 80's.
i love it when max and cain got beef lmao
The "Cleveland Transgenders" would have been great name change 👍
I'm native American and Iam glade to see Clevland change there logo.
Cleveland is probably going to change the team name back to Cleveland Broncos or Spiders
Now go to cry
so you admit you are a snowflake huh
Jason S how is that even offensive
Andr3w066 If you can't see why it's wrong you're and idiot.
Will Cain went savage mode on max 😂😂
There are no Irish Americans offended by Notre Dame
I thought the seminoles was one of the more reverent and historical ones though? How is chief wahoos goofy azz the same as the seminoles logo? Ijs
AQUAPHREESH193 Exactly
I suggest that the Cleveland baseball club has not gone far enough. Here's a modest proposal guaranteed to offend no one in these sensitive days: Change the team's colors to green and white, rechristen it the Cleveland Legumes, and bring in a new head-of-broccoli mascot. Vegetarian baseball fans, in particular, will love it!
But broccoli is NOT a legume!
I eat meat so I'm offended by vegetarians
SAS was actually a good moderator here.
The real story should be how the American Indians were destroyed and how they land was stolen. It’s a dark part of American history that is not discussed to the public. They should know so they learn from history and not repeat similar behaviour that is even happening with many wars etc...
Nothing will said was wrong tho. I have many members of my family including me who are part or even all native American and none are offended by the logos or the team names of any of the 3 teams.
I lose respect for anyone who actually watches ESPN.
It's funny how people complain about others being offended by racist nicknames/pictures, but if a team removes a cartoon logo those same people act like the sky is falling. Will Cain sounds like he's about to cry arguing over this
Why is the logo a problem
I side with Will Cain on this topic.
With a name like Dalton, you basically inform everyone that you're from some kind of inbred lineage.
Not sure why you have to insult me because my name is different. It's people like you who I'll be defending once I finish Law School this year, have a good day sir.
Get Wrecked by the Lawyer
Dalton Johnson - Crying about someone insulting you but you can't empathize with some Native Americans..... seems like you have a huge problem.
Dalton Johnson Charge them extra!! lol
If you’re offended by it , it’s because you’re told to be, An can’t think for yourself .
Exactly and you wonder why everything is becoming more and more PC everyday
Nathan Keelin or because you have a shred of empathy in your body.
What does it symbolize? Does the logo mok or make fun of how the American Indians were treated. The sad part is most Americans don’t know how there land was stolen from the American Indians.
Max is pretty much saying if 1 person finds it offensive you must change it if that’s what this world is coming to damn it let it end this year Jesus Christ
Hahahahahaha
Will KKKain at it again 😂😂😂
Murphy Jones he disagrees so he’s a racist. Typical
stfu kid go back to class
Shane Caudill talking to me?
Murphy Jones 😂😂😂
Shane Caudill what’s your disagreement? I know that’s a big word for ya
To be real the "C" caps look better than the original offensive logo
Movie matics No it doesn't crybaby sjw. The other logo is way more popular.
Crips gonna find offensive
The Cleveland Cunts does make sense now.😂👍🏻
Why the fuck are these videos shortened?!
“OH NONSENSE!” Will Cain is my favorite!
I was attacked by an eagle once. I demand the Eagles be renamed as I am highly offended by that name. I wake up at night in tears and I cant concentrate on my work because an NFL franchise is named after this vicious animal. Max, please stick up for me!!!
Fx Garden apparently the Eagle fucking lobotomized you in the process.
We are never changing the name! Its not racist! Get over it!
Exactly. It's just the team's play that is offensive
How's those ratings doing ESPN?
i am the notre dame mascot, literally a photocopy of it and i dont find it offensive and also just because a few find it offensive doesnt mean it needs to be taken away
Damn Will Cain is the king of debating!
- David Duke
You're new here aren't ya
Louie Ramirez No I listen to his show every day on the radio
john lucas III Nope, not even close
john lucas III yes he is, but he lost this debate by Knock Out in the first round.
I find max kellerman offensive
Wheres SA in all this? I really want to hear what he has to say
Why now? Is my question.
I guess what's next is that the Boston Celtics should change their logo because it's a white Irish guy.
Over Killa if they were called the Boston Palefaces they'd have to.
Cagon415 lol I'm white and I would honestly not care if they were called that. It's just a character it's not like it's a real person. Sooo many sensitive people now a days.
you shouldn´t apply your sensibilities to other people, if you dont care that people for example: make fun of your family or something doesn´t mean other people can´t
Ugh will cain is just unbearable
Darkangel220a stfu
SJW Kellerman is not?
Darkangel220a Why?
He’s right
BPayne Beats Why is someone racist if they agree with Cain? What did he say thats racist? Seriously someone answer. Because I'll I hear is, "Will KKKain" and "will Cain is racist" but I have yet to hear someone give a damn good reason why?
I love max kellerman... but will is 100% right here
2 years later and now we have the Washington Football Team. Max is that dude.
My words of wisdom to Max, once all native American associations in sports is gone many will scream because it's missing. This is driven more by political correctness vs actual feelings by many.
The Redskins and Notre Dame shouldn't change their logos. They are NOT offensive. Get out of here with that trash
danerook you’re probably a white boi saying this.
cody shlorgens I'm Irish. Being offended by the notre Dame fighting Irish is the most pussy shit I ever heard
96 So Irish people's opinions on the Notre Dame fighting Irish don't matter because the Irish are white? I swear to god the CZcams comment section STILL finds a way to get stupider.
REDSKIN is so racist, it can´t be used in the streets, no one calls an native american a "redskin" unless you´re an racist
I’m irish, and a huge ND fan. Not at all offended. Redskins? That’s a different argument, as it was once used as a racial slur.
As a white person I find the New England Patriots logo offensive
What about the cowboys, the Vikings, the raiders, the patriots, etc?
I have Native American in me and I don’t find it offensive.
Thank you for not being offended over this.
Noah Weehunt what you mean that 00000000.00.09% side of you?... let me take a wild guess as to what the majority percentage is lmao smh
White people that say this shit got less than 1% percent lmao
Yup and fuck you white boy. The whole world is sick of y’all shit. Even white women speaking out now. Get it together.
Adrian K you clearly are a fan of “black entitlement” yet a person that doesn’t agree with your side and claims Native American blood, is lying for government benefits? You’re the real low life, insensitive, ignorant, racist here you dingleberry.
Just keep liberals away from college football and I'm fine
Yes will
Will Cain's argument was completely founded on those survey numbers, which as Max pointed out are clearly skewed since the majority of participants did not identify with their Aboriginal tribes. Not sure I agree completely with Max but definitely on the point about marginalized groups being subjugated to such stereotypes and belittlement of their heritage.
Will Cain’s probably the only bearable person working at espn.
J Dogg L
Jordan Davis too lazy to type out the rest of the word? Can guess what you are in real life...
J Dogg
Lovable?
J Dogg You're kidding
Agreed
Max as always make no sense in his discussion and is the softest person on tv probably. If one person is offended by something that makes it ok to get rid of everything in Max Kellermans eyes, as Will Cain said “the Max Kellerman theory”. And when talking about the leprechaun being offensive to Irish people, tell that to Conor Mcgregor lol he represents that symbol when he started walking to the octagon.
LoL
Jesus Robles Look I know when something is overblown, but the Indians logo actually is very offensive and just in bad taste. Imagine if somebody made a team called the Chinamen and had a logo of a yellow grinning face with slit eyes and a rice farmer's hat. Thats basically what the Indians logo is for the Native American people, harping on stereotypes.
and there's nothing offensive about a leprechaun, leprechauns originated from Irish folklore! You are talking about two completely different things
YouCanCallMeReTro I can see perspective on the Indian logo, but my problem is people like Max Kellerman who’s logic if some people or even 1 are offended like he showed the example with leprechauns then we should get rid of that to please everybody. That’s ridiculous, but back to the Indian topic if Will Cain and that Washington post article is correct that Native American don’t find the Indian logo offensive then why should we.
I’m Native American and I do not think the redskins name is offensive. That does not mean they should not get rid of it. I believe anything that has stereotypes like this should be changed. Also don’t believe the 9/10 survey that was probably with a group of wealthy native Americans in the nations capital. They should be asking the people in Oklahoma, N/S Dakota, Nevada etc. The natives living in the reservations. See if they think it should be changed.
Why does Will Cain always going that hard? LOL
Daniel Maia he has to justify his racist views.
It's crazy how when a small group of people get offended we have to change everything for them.