Jordi Cortes: "Around Here E-Bikers = Lowest Common Denominator"
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- čas přidán 10. 04. 2024
- Jordi Cortes has never been one to shy away from controversial subjects, and on this occasion we turn his attention to E-Bikes.
Opinions on EMTB's are polarising, especially amongst a strong contingent of riders in the USA. Which side of the fence do you think Jordi falls on?
No doubt this one will bring the keyboard warriors out in force! - Sport
This is obviously an EBike channel so the perspective is gunna be a certain way. But the philosophy comes from 4x4ing where trails are intentionally built with “gatekeepers” as the first obstacle right at trail start without bypass. If you can’t get past it, then you WILL get stuck in a much worse spot to recover later. Jordi’s basically saying 1) the climbing/pedaling used to be the gatekeepers. Now there’s no gatekeeper to what can be very technical dodgy riding deep in the woods w/o cell signal& difficult rescue and 2) if ebikers are getting 5x the laps in the same time, that’s = 5x increase in rider traffic. I don’t see them doing 5x the trail maintenance. this issue compounds on illegal trails like UCSC where maintenance is hard to execute once or twice a yr. Now it needs to be done bimonthly, which coupled with less experienced riders & more laps, means the odds of illegal networks getting bulldozed is much higher.
Subjective, that hasn't really happened here in socal (but like Jordy said it's a different place)... We have as many guys on ebikes doing trail work as non ebikes... It's hard to get ANYONE to come out and do it so that isn't specific to ebikes and I find them even better for trail work cause you can carry shit with them. Also... the gatekeeper should be the squirrel catcher on the trail.... if you're riding mountain bike specific trails then that isn't an issue... Honestly since covid has ended most of the "get out and learn" types have all but recessed back into their cubicles. 90% of the riders I see on them are competent, a lot of them more so than guys still soley on mtb.
@@_Jake.From.Statefarm_ for sure… I would say the diff with squirrel catchers are that you can usually bypass them easily by walking. For those inexperienced, they might be more familiar with dismounting the bike than with the concept of a catcher. And many places don’t have them for a variety of reasons (either already a mixed use trail or illegal so can’t have a loud thing at the start). Either way the experience/access will end up being location dependent. In the UK where weather ruins trails every week and maintenance keeps up, e-bikes are the least of worries in many trail centers. In Moab where it’s the opposite, we already share trail & access with motos & jeeps without real issue because it’s a lot of slickrock. In between is where there’s a grey area of issues that need to be dealt with case by case. Like even in climbing, the Czech scene bans bolting, any placement of metal trad protection, and even chalk. Only allowing like rope monkey fist nuts. Part of this is practical due to unusually soft sandstone that erodes very quickly. Part of it is also philosophical in their community belief that nature should be left as natural as possible, including from chalk marks and scarring that certain pro involves. Many areas ban bolting but allow all trad protection and chalk. Etc etc.
@@cmacblue42 Yeah and they aren't going away either.. I mean clearly they need to differentiate between e-mtb and e-moto. That will be a huge step forward. I also see more trails and bike parks starting to form all over the place with the influx in newer riders the past 5 years. So while a lot of many natural preserves or mix use multi trails etc might still discourage any type of riding they can, the more riders the better when it comes to access. Those people live there and pay taxes so with enough pressure things get built. In the future I see more bike parks with lift and ebike access, which will always be my preferred type of riding.. It also thins out the packs on the local trails quite a bit much like the plethora of skateparks did for street skating in the 2010's once they started going up in every neighborhood.
The trail maintenance kvetch is real, that said, having been mtb'ing since the 80's (and have a few trail systems under my belt along the way) the conclusion I've come to is very few mtb'ers ever help work on trails. Those that have helped, will notice it's typically the SAME core bunch of people who continuously have a hand in keeping trails going, with the inevitable ebb and flow of involvement over the years. Wish it were otherwise, but blaming e-bikes for that is missing the mark. In a way, adding a new source of rider demographic may increase the odds that perhaps one new person ( just one more person!) might get involved & help maintain & build trail. Gotta think of the positives first.
@@_Jake.From.Statefarm_ I've noticed the same - most of the 'what's this mtb thing all about' covid-era pandemic-tourists riders have essentially disappeared from the scene. I doubt they've doubled down ($$$$$) and hopped onto e-mtbs. Hopefully they're all on one-wheels, terrorizing mall parking lots instead.
Awesome content dude! Audio all over the place though. Buzzing you got out to this Fox thing :-) good work fella
Jordi’s mic didn’t work sadly. Sorry about the audio, it pains me too 😭
Here in Michigan, we're about 1 month away from the change in State policy regarding e-mtb access on non-motorized natural surface trails. It's taken about 2.5 years to get it to the finish line, and it wasn't easy. I hope we see an influx of riders on e-bikes 'not earning their turns' on our trails here in Michigan, as we have many long time mtb riders in the aging-up demographic who want to add a Class-1 to their quiver, but are not doing so because of the current situation barring them from many popular trails state-wide. It's only going to make things better for the people who want to experience mtb'ing, in whatever format that's available legally. And while I don't yet have an e-mtb (I'm also 56), I am glad that when I do, I'll be still able to pedal on nearly all of the trails I like to ride state-wide.
is that southern comfort up on the shelf?
Dang, around here since covid fox been the lowest common denominator with quality/warranty issues 😂
At 8.36 Fox failures on suspension because of frame design causes stress. I found this 2022 5 shock body failures due to cracks in the same place on my Fox DHX2 coil shock body casting joint, eventually Fox swapped it to a Fox Factory X2 air as the Specialized frame was causing a twisting motion on the shaft.
A common occurrence so I’ve heard
Trails are only crowded on weekends (mostly)
People surprised about Jordi being honest. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Like mountain biking, Fox forks should be difficult, unlike those easier fork brands with the lowest common denominator ebike-like preload % marks printed on the tubes
🤣
funny, got an e bike and the first place I rode it was in Santa Cruz with a couple of local dudes on ebikes & one was an engineer at Specialized. Dude's been riding ebikes there since the time they were an idea ! Bet Jordis take on ebikes will change when he gets older and needs a new knee/hip; that'll change his tune.😂ps...best thing I ever bought....oh & swapped out to a Fox 38 and a coil shock...game changer!
According to his logic, all riders have to earn the turns. But shuttling is okay?
Ha! Good point. Then consider how many DH riders ride their DH rigs to the top…
Shuttling (DH) is a much more specific activity in specified areas vs the typical e-bike “shuttle” turning ANY trail into a shuttle zone. That’s what he is specifically discussing.
@@energ8t Yeah, just taking the piss to him! Jordi reminds me of a telemark skiier yelling at resort skiers for getting in his way as he ratchets his way to the top of the hill for his single run of the day.....
Interested/curious to know the data supporting ebikes “hugely negative impact on ecosystem”
Glad I live in central Appalachia and can ride for days without seeing another rider.
I have mobility issues and struggled to ride after buying a specalized emtb I can now keep up with mates it's helped my fitness and mental health people shouldn't judge
Great to hear it 👍
Unfortunately people do judge, but I don't give a crap. I have an EMTB and use it for what it's best @, getting out in to the countryside . Leave the trail center's to the stalwarts stuck in their ways. The same happened with the DJ scene, it move on and progressed, yet you still get the purists who say you aren't a DJ unless you use vinyl!
Well said jordie. I couldn't agree with you more. You just need to look at the innerleithen golfie trails to see how much damage with the under skilled skidding there way down the trails.
Nobody cares about your trails
Because you just picked up a bike and went straight to pro level sender with out any experience or learning process!?🤦🏼♂️ world cup winners started out skidding down trails!
@@RobHill00 I guess the unskilled should learn on blue and red trails before they attempt black off piste stuff. No?
Obviously but it’s called progression at some point people are going to hit their first black trail and be cautious! What about the riders that think their auditioning Deathgrip 2 and shralping the living hell out of everything in site, that’s worse than someone over braking because they know their destroying the trail but do it anyway!
@@RobHill00 yeah, the schralping fetishization one sees in EVERY mtb video these days really does not help the average trail steward.....at my age, progression is just keeping the menu of skills I've amassed in my 40 years of mtb'ing.....its minimizing the dwindling!
Pretty disappointing to hear, as an xc and e biker.
Another reason I’m glad I don’t live in crowded California (and I don’t even have an ebike)
California has a bazillion epic places to ride - he is talking a about a very specific honey-pot area, close to where millions of people live...
Mtb should be hard, true. I guess all those pro riders that shred redbull hardline who ride their e-bikes for training are just taking the easy route. If only they could be as tough and strong as this 🤡
Whether people like it or not eebs are the future! They out sell naturally aspirated bikes now🤷🏼♂️ I have a DH rig for uplifts/bike parks and an eeb for everything else both have Fox 40’s! Think most trail damage now is from Surons!🤷🏼♂️
If we didn't have ebikers at UC, who would provide endless mediocre gopro vids
🤣
So he doesn't like ebikes because they get more people out mtbing 😂 (and in turn buying FOX products) what a 🤡 outlook. 😂
Idk there’s just not enough spots and not enough maintenance happening. Imagine surfing if someone launched an automated e-jetski device to tow whoever into waves. All the breaks would become even more overcrowded than they already are. Competition for each wave would be crazy. And you wouldn’t even need to know how to swim until you fell. If you can’t paddle out to a line up and paddle into a wave, you need to work on your fitness before you go surfing. You don’t need a device cloaked in the false virtue of “accessibility”
E bikers are notorious in my area for not digging and poaching in progress trails. Localism is only annoying if you’re a kook
@@cmacblue42well said dude
This is only a Southern California poser problem…the rest of the country doesn’t suffer so many mtb clowns squished into the same dust bowl
Typical elitist attitude in reference to e-bikes.
Haha it’s the reverse. E MTB’ers are the elitist
I don't know he just sounds like a bitter old man not getting with the times.
I think he has some valid points that are quite location specific, but yes, I also disagree with some of his opinions
What’s wrong with not wanting motorized dirt bikes on our MTB trails?
@@jakesherron2390 Nothing. Do what ever you want. But you have to understand that it's not your decision to make who uses the track and who doesn't. If you don't want to ride with ebikes, go somewhere else.
@@jakesherron2390agreed, motorized dirt bikes should not be on MTB Trails, motorized dirt bikes have a throttle…class one E bikes do not
What a stupid take on ebikes and on mountain biking in general 🤦♂ I think the most stupid I've ever heard.
Dang. This guy is such a snob. Or he comes across as one for sure.
Jordi couldn’t be more wrong about e-bikes. They have not had a negative impact on trails or the environment. It just allows people to do much more riding in a day than they normally would be able to do. I just lost a bunch of respect for him.
He is wrong, but not 100%... at the end of the day, all these trails are public spaces, so he (or anyone else) has no more right to dictate who rides what and where...
However, I have been surprised how many [younger] people who are riding eMTBs are still very novice riders in general - that this is their first 'real' mountain bike, and are perhaps attempting to ride steeper and longer trails (which typically require more climbing to get to) where a few more miles experience on less aggressive trails at lower elevations might have helped build their skills first... and I think that was the point Jordi was trying to make?