Budget Mods for Big Power! | Engine Masters | MotorTrend
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- čas přidán 5. 09. 2020
- Let's face it, right now everyone wants to find as much power as they can on their engine, for as little money as possible. On Engine Masters, Freiburger and Dulcich test some dirt cheap parts and tweaks to add more power to stock engines. #EngineMasters #Engine #EngineMods
- Auta a dopravní prostředky
Idk, slapping a turbo bigger than my future on every bone stock engine sounds like a good plan
I can hear the rod knock caused by this post across the planet.
Check out "Richard Holdener". He works in the same building on the same dyno and tests MANY different combos back to back...
🤘🤘
P
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Motor trend subscription numbers must be down were getting free samples again
The people who were interested have already subscribed, no doubt their subscriptions have stagnated
Mcdc
Your not really these are just old EP's that are already up on youtube. Id imagine covid have boosted there numbers if anything. I rebought my sub and watched everything from hotrod garage, roadkill and roadkill garage I didn't see during this time. Then bought a project car as one does
I pay $4.99 a month on Prime Video and I think it's *WELL* worth it. I'm not rich, but I'm not a penniless hippie either.
Hey Mr fishin fool I pay good for my subscription so you won't get free content lol
Remember when all these episodes were free? I remember.
I member
Pepperridge farm remembers
not only that, but freiburger specifically stated they would always be free.
ohhhh, I member
No lie kinda lost interest because they want you to buy everything
Love this episode and episodes like it. It would be SOOOO much fun to have the ability to do these tests like they do. Can you imagine the quality of the engines you could produce.........*drools*. haha
Everybody has "the ability" but few have the knowledge. A dyno isn't needed to build killer motors & can actually be a detriment, since loadings in "the REAL WORLD" are nothing like a dyno. My buddy builds his own motors(& quite a few for friends), & his ALL MOTOR Olds Cutlas has gone 7.96 / 168mph at Wild Horse Pass in June with 4,000ft air. Single ProSystems carb on race gas, No juice, No huffer & No hair dryers! Always remember that magazines(& videos) are produced to sell their sponsors products, NOT always give factual information.
Yeah but you don’t know what your doing bro.
LOL, I went hydraulic flat tappet and used the money I saved over a roller setup to add nitrous.
That boys and girls, is what we call a WIN-WIN situation!!!!
Out of curiosity, how much was that nitrous set up?
@@monahumada7535
Old, used plate system I picked up for $150, I think. Low buck build, because I'm CHEAP!
Since you are cheap, how much for a v8
build but keeping the budget at bay?
@@monahumada7535 just put nitrious on mine for around 800 dollars using purge valve gas valve and nitrious valve
@@jonathanlawson4667 Thank I might look into that on another build
Whoah. The hp increase from those upgrades was jaw-dropping. Over 50 extra ftlbs and way over 100 extra hp??
Love this channel cause you guys always dyno the engines. Keep it up!
Really cool show and great video. You guys talking my language...as being close-to-broke but need to enjoy life. As many times I’ve seen you guys blowup motors that cost three times as much as my entire build, this show really puts feet to the ground with concepts and real world dollars. Thank you! Can’t say how much this can add to the many people out here with dollar signs in their eyes, and lint in their pockets. Cheers!!
6:02 - Zip tie spotted, throttle linkage.
Always has to be one.
plug wire separators...
Great catch
❤️ the video, fun to watch you guys running engines on a dyno.
Omg Robert Duvall is an engine tech!
I was thinking the same thing! LOL
Holy $@#&% it is Duvall !!
It's the Steve, Steve and Dave show!
1++
It's Dave and the Steves!
Thank you for posting these again.
Id rather take the $750 that only upped HP by 4%(?) and put it toward forced induction
Well, the 750 dollar turbo setup is gonna need a new motor every year and hurt driveability
@@michaelmccuskey8113 uhhh....lol, thats not true at all.
@@michaelmccuskey8113 It's only the tune that would do that. If you don't have a good tune you're gonna have issues. It's not hard to learn how to tune for reliability.
All these free episodes are old ones that already were on youtube in the first place...
Eh, just a mash-up of episodes on low-buck power. I hadn't seen the fuel pump test before so it was worthwhile for me
I don’t think so, most of the engine masters stuff never saw the light of CZcams, don’t think this stuff was on CZcams
I pay the $4.99 a month for the MotorTrend subscription on Prime Video, so I can stay up to date, plus watch the old (full) episodes over and over ...which I do! Plus the old episodes of Wheeler Dealers when Edd was still on the show, when it was good.
Been buying from Scoggin Dickeys out of Lubbock, Texas for years. Great group to work with.
I planned on copying this but during the build I snuck a bigger cam in it lol. I did run the big 2.02 valves in it. Did run the 600 Holley originally but I’ve since put an edelbrock avs2 on it. I didn’t save any money using salvage yard vortecs. I had $80 in heads and then another 800 in machine work. Could have bought the ones done already but I’m happy with mine. They’re clearanced for any cam, have the big valves. Surprisingly I still made 15-16 inch of vaccuum on the motor too. Enough for power brakes. My cam is 303/303 and I think in this episode they used a 280 comp? The power band isn’t great with my larger cam but it’s okay. It starts at 2800 but it doesn’t stop making power til I don’t wanna spin it any faster! Lol
"Scrounge" haven't heard that word in a while. Great word ! :)
Hilarious! I also used a PAW cam back in the day. I think David and I are the same age. I feel a connection.
Great educational info. Thanks guys.
In the 70s my dad ordered a 327 chevy motor from a catolog it had camel hump heads he put in a fireball camshaft. That beast made 350 horsepower had a lot of fun with it.
The vortec heads work very well on a 383 as well. My motor has about the same compression ratio at 9.3 to 1 and with a cam spec out at @.050 206 and 216 with the lift at the valve with a 1.6 rocker at .476 with 112 Lsa made 450 lb at 4000 and 370hp at 5000. THIS IS A TRUCK MOTOR NOT A RACE MOTOR. That is why the power is so low but the cam will work with the factor efi in a late 90s truck or suv with a little tune work and the motor pulled 17 inches of vacuum at idle.
(Edit) I forgot to say that this is at the flywheel
Great points ,great cam grind 👍😊 flat & bossy🏁
What a confirmation! I was getting fuel starvation last summer on my marine 383 with 5/16 fuel lines.
It already had a good pump ((Holley Red). So I redid the fuel system to 3/8 ID and added a return to keep the fuel cooler.
Took some doing. The filter/separator housing was 5/16 so I drilled it out and tapped it to the next thread size. And I had to jump through some hoops to do a return. But I am really excited for next summer. Bonus is, it looks cool since the lines are made of nicely bent copper. I had to do it with metal because rubber is not allowed except for a short piece.
Worse thing is, I have the paid Motortrend app and never watched this video til February during a snowstorm.
Yeah, the 5/16" was spec'd for bone stock small blocks. Cars with a bigblock option were 3/8". As always, build your car rear to front.
This was good, better than I thought it would be
A couple more pro-roller items. I’ve done a cam change and I was able to keep my roller lifters. Can’t do that with flat tappers. Pretty good chance I’ll do another cam swap before I retire this engine. Also, I’ve been hearing a lot of flat tappet cams getting flattened lobes. I’ve been running my 385 roller for 12 years now. No wear problems.
A 400” Chevy had to have an aftermarket crank in it. When guys started stroking their 350’s to 383” we were inundated with broken factory cranks. If it was me? A 283, 302, 307 or 327. I think the 307 was the answer Chevy needed for their 5.0 liter smog engine. A friend of mine was working on one of the first HEI units to come into our HS Auto Shop for a tuneup. The problem was a bad set of wires. The insulation had cracked. He started by trying to adjust the timing. Leaning over the fender and his one hand on the timing light, the other on the Distrubuter cap he took 50,000 volts to his best friend and doubled over in pain sounding a bit like a Michael Jackson as he swore!
lol!
I hadn't seen this one yet, but it's very informative.
Best show out here, also really like how dave doesn’t hide prices on things and actually talks more of a modern back yard garage build. Unlike power nation
BTW I ran that Carter pump back in the 80's too. It worked very well and never failed. I went through a bunch of pumps before I settled on that one.
Old Carter mechanical pumps were good back then. Supported decent power. Always ran them on basic Pontiac builds as well.
Don't care if old episodes....I subscribe to the Motortrend channel and still watch this stuff.
Same here. Making quality content takes money, I’m not afraid to chip in a little bit.
@@dougherbert7899 yeah coming from a guy who runs an NHRA speed shop
I fought vapor lock from first to second gear at the track and changed fuel line size, fuel tank pickup and went larger and larger mechanical pumps and nothing fixed it until I installed a electric pump at that backend and Presto! Fixed. Moral of this journey, ethanol on a very warm to hot days liked to be pressurized not sucked. Sucking creates bubbles due to low pressure but pushing fuel creates high pressure and eliminates this issue. BTW the mechanical pump is still in line so now if one fails I have a backup.
Note: my 1967 camaro has no return line so if your car has a return line you may not experience this problem
That 3/8 hose was suprising
The last Carter pump I bought leaked horribly from the gasket. Had to take it apart and lap the bottom section for over an hour to get it flat enough to seal. When the surface was fly cut during production only about half of the surface was finished.
Absolute favorite show. Next to RoadKill of course. Sorry Mike, gotta have Dave with ya, but the garage is kickass also
I just checked the speedmasters intakes. Prices went up $100. Crazy.
Cost of raw materials is hurting because we had 3 years of very little production
i been circle track racing for 30 years , started out with holley fuel pumps, pretty much garbage, always leaked oil , switched to carter fuel pumps i run the same one for 4-5 years and finally only change it cause i figure its time. never had one issue with a carter, very well made and reliable.
Oh my god.... did he just say PAW?? I just ran across an old PAW catalog just the other day... them was the good ole days.... :-)
Yup. I probably have one laying around. Started buying parts for my 67 fastback in 2000.
P A W does old 1950's hemis now... Summit and Jegs put a dozen mail order speed shops out of business... and a 1,000 local speed shops out of business... although a large local/online speed shop has opened up here in Toledo... I think it's picking the bones of the closed ones...
There was also P.A.M. and PAM'S HOT BOX !
If you take a flat tappet cam nitride it, put in 1.7 rockets on the intake, 1.6 on the exhaust, it will equal or exceed the roller up to durations of about 284.
The reason you nitride the cam is if you don't there so much pressure on the lobe from the large rocker it will not hold up.
I love my 327 with vortec heads. She may not win races but that motor makes my four door feel like a roadster on the street.
Drill lightening holes in each valve can really change your power output.
when 3 out of 10 flat tappets wipe out before the break in is done the roller makes way more sense
The 350ci small block started in 1967 in the RS/SS Camaro.
True...
As always, love it, great video guy's 😇 . I had a .30 over 1970 Buick 350 block w/ 68' 32cc heads & 9.2:1 dished pistons and a Comp 468H. Cam and that thing was impressive. With the HEI ignition and the Carter 675 carb running 6.75 psi @ the fuel rail, with a Holley blue it would starve out at 1/2 throttle. I finally had to go to a high-flow Blackstone fuel pump which was new at the time that ouflowed the Holley Blue Pump. Idk what the hp #'s were, but it was a lot of fun and I'd love the chance to recreate another one just like it .
GM started putting bypass lines on all their carbed motors in the 70s to cure "vapor lock". Your problem was the small fuel bowl on the Carter, same with Q-Jets. I ran a Carter HP(100 gph) mechanical pump with a bypass on my Q-Jet carbed 406 SBC & never ran out of fuel. I now run a stock TBI type in tank electric pump on my 409 SBC at 6 lbs pressure with a Holley Street HP & can't run it out of fuel.
great episode
I ran a Comp. 292 magnum in a stock 70 400 motor with Fuelly heads, Victor Jr. ,750 double pumper, and 1 5/8 headers on a daily driver 68 Camaro 30 years ago and it ran like the Dickens!
They did make swirl port heads with 64 CC chambers. I have them on my truck. Really good low RPM torque.
Having the Season #' and/or the Episode #'s would have been nice.
PAW lol they still around that takes me back
I still have my PAW Bibles
That's was very interesting, I had that problem on 68, 400 firebird. I thought it was the carbarator.
Roller is always better yes more expensive up front but the camshafts last longer less friction no break in and no need of using special oil slicks it’s not sinc additives or zddp
What about the deep sump stock fuel pump used on HP SBC & BBC's? And did you have to change the valve springs when you from a flat taper can to a roller cam?
Got a PAW sticker on my back door love it lol .
I used to cruise around in a '68 Dodge charger 440 Magnum and yes it didn't have a big enough fuel line and fuel pump because around 170 mph it would start to run out of gas it would run about175 mph then 17 years old it was a blast this was around 1974 I put the second motor in it with a 4-speed fastest car I ever rode in and I rode in 426 Hemi roadrunners with two fours they were almost brand new then but that car would smoke the tires for about a whole quarter mile that's how I blew the original motor up because my friend let me drive it couldn't stop getting on it
im about to pull some of those vortec heads from my junkyard that i scouted out the other day. but im going for a 383 stroker so i guess im defiantly going to need machining for the valve lift
Solid roller every time.
Me doing a '65 383 with a Mopar Performance Street rod cam 280/280 with dual springs. That's about $500.00. Engine kit from Mancini Racing with cast aluminum psitons, moly rings. I just want a nice rumble and hellacious response. Going with a single plane Holley 750 and stock mopar ignition. Heads are the 516's with back cut valves. Going in my '60 Fury with a 813-9B 4spd, hurst shiter. All old school and fun.
I would like to see what you could do with a mid 70s two bolt main 350 and keep it reliable.
I think the two barrel was 145 hp and the four barrel was 155 hp.
And for a finally see what it takes to grenade it.
The results might be interesting.
On the rotating mass episode! You didnt do a steady state test!! What if the sinusoidal piston velocity is advantagous for cylinder filling?
Planning the Vortec upgrade for my C1500 this summer.
same with my 1989 C2500
Great job men
The one good benefit about a flat tappet cam is there's less moving parts and it weighs less
What cam did you guys used on the first run the flat tapped cam. I'm doing a rebuild on a sbc 400 and the flow numbers on the blueprint heads H8002K look really good. Nice run by the way.
Thanks.
If you're looking for some ideas on what cam to use, send me more information about the vehicle and engine. I'll see if I cant point you in the right direction.
Vehicle info
Make, model
Weight
Trans (converter too if applicable)
Gear, tire
What is desired
(All out average power, fuel economy...)
Carbureted or injected (if injected is a professional tuning it)
Desired rpm range
What you want to spend...
Do you desire a roller
Intake, exhaust, cr
A little bit of a picture will help. I got 400 and the heads (but are you porting the heads)
Greetings from the international space station!
People dig the early 327 because it had a FORGED crank.
good lesson
LOVE the show guys, can we see the difference between small and large valves. Someone told me to pick small valves for low end torque in a truck I'm building. Engines are a weird dynamic, so I wouldnt be surprised if this was a thing
Small valves are an ancient fallacy. John Lingenfelter always said bigger valves are better because they flow more air at very LOW lift. The limiting factor in valve size is the cylinder wall because the larger the bore, the more distance between the edge of the intake valve & the wall itself, which "shrouds" the valve & is detrimental to air flow. Chevy finally realized this & reduced the size of their valves for Performance 350s from 2.02/1.60, to 2.00/1.55, & they make well over 400hp with a 208* cam with their CT-400 crate motor(advertised 405 but actually make 440-450hp, according to every Modified owner I've talked to).
@@bradgriffith4231 I'm building a 331, very similar to what freigburger had in that contest of compression ratios. With the 4.030 bore, how big of valves would you recommend running. I'm not going for earth shattering performance. I'm trying to build a street strip truck that can do 14s in the quarter, NA, pump gas compatible, and gets ~25 mpg. I don't think it's that unreasonable. With my stock 350 I'm getting close to 20 already
@@cerneysmallengines I'm sure all the "experts" on here will tell you I'm wrong, but I've had race cars & street cars for over 50 years. Chevy has dropped from 2.02/1.6 to 2.00/1.55 valves on their best GMPP heads, even with 220cc ports. Your biggest obstacle is the 25mpg. Trucks are heavy & NOT aerodynamic. Even the newest "Displacement On Demand" & "shut off at stop" bullshit motors in trucks don't get 25mpg. Personally, I have a mild 350 with the GM "LT-1" 203* hyd roller cam, 1.6:1 rocker arms, & built Vortec heads with 1.94/1.5 valves. It runs great. Keep the cam duration short & comp BELOW 10:1. I run a lunatti hydraulic roller in my 409 small block that's 211* @ .050" lift & around .540 lift with 1.6:1 rocker arms. Both my 350 & 409 have around 9.5:1 comp & run great on 87 octane gas. Chevy makes well over 400hp with their CT-400 circle track crate motor(advertised 405hp but 440 actual) with 10:1 comp & a 208* hyd roller cam. Big cams & big compression is for real race cars. A street car needs to idle smooth, good vacuum, make big torque from just off idle, & run on 87 octane pump gas. Frieberger & Dulcick always run too much comp & cam on everything that's supposed to be street cars / Daily Drivers, & magazines/videos stay in business selling their sponsors parts! My buddy built a mild 355 with a 235* hyd flat tappet cam in a nostalgia dragster that ran 10.19 first pass out of the trailer. His Olds Cutlas has run 7.96/168 @ Phoenix in June with 90+ degree ambient temp & 4,000 ft corrected air density. The sum of the components makes the power, not 1 "magical" piece. Hit me up on FB with a personal message if you want to bs. I won't put my phone number or private email on here.
@@bradgriffith4231 what's your Facebook
@@cerneysmallengines Brad Griffith, Pahrump, Nevada
derp. start with an engine that came with a hydraulic roller cam in the first place. like a 6th Gen 454 L29
With that low compression cylinder head on the right u definitely can go turbo.. just need to gap the piston rings for blowby.. I may use those heads on a 62 to 70s model sbc 350
I'm wondering, if you were racing, you never considered the g forces on the fuel pulling toward the rear of the car under acceleration. It would create somewhat of a vacuum or low pressure on the negative side of the pump. Back in the 70s the fuel would get hotter from the higher temperature of what the engines ran at which in turn caused many problems with deiseling and vapor lock. Since the fuel was under negative pressure on the back side of the pump. If remember right alot of racers ran the moon fuel tanks in front of the motors to help with positive pressure before electric pumps really took over.
Are there any intake upgrades for the 96-2000 GM truck EFI? (spider injection) P.s. great episode!!!
I know they make aftermarket intakes so you can convert to carb if you so desired, paired with a holly sniper you probably have a decent upgrade... (I've heard from multiple sources that the spider injection systems were not great but honestly I don't know for certain that it would be any major benefit.)
I'm doing a rebuild on what was once a spider-injected block but since I'm tearing it down completely (and bought it without an ECU) I'm planning on doing the above and then finding a chassis to throw the motor into later. The issue with you doing something like that is that if it's still in the original truck you then have to start messing with the ECU it would be extremely involved from an electronics standpoint at that juncture, even if you somehow managed to just toss the thing entirely.
I love how they show the little man's budget builds
Freiburger, Dulcic, Steve, maybe at least once a video about V6 engine?
Maybe about GM 3.8, like this one from 4th gen Firebird?
👍
If they ever did youd probably have to pay for it
Or 225 dauntless?
What I want to see is a old motor that’s worn on the dyno compared to the same motor from crate engine power loss of the years of rag
Yesss
Used engine with less friction prolly make more power...
The heads and fuel pump/line size were the biggest WTF moments for me.
Solid roller ftw
Those Swirl Port heads aren’t the ones for performance cars. However, if it’s low end grunt you seek then these can be ported and polished and they’re great for below 4K rpms. Put ‘em on a 305 block with a 400 crank and you have a stump puller that won’t confuse your computer too much.
Test the Bone stock 8,1l vortec that sit in the chevy suburban, gmc yukon,,,, what is option to add more tourqe in that
Did he say the 350 came out in 1969? The 1967 SS350 Camaro would like a word.
After less than perfect results on electric pumps I went to a mechanical pump. After a few years running it, heading home on the freeway car died. My kid brought a spare electric pump to zip tie in and get home. Autopsy on mechanical pump was pivot rod broke the case where it was staked in. I had never had a pump do that before. Told my kid and he had it happen less than a month later. Mine was a Speedway his was a Napa.
Why not an episode on the ins and outs of the Dyno including all hardware and software. How does all this setup work?
The tpi style intake can be found on evil bay for 130 with free shipping. Hei dizzy 50.00 free shipping.
Solid roller !!!!
Had a 350 in my 52 3100 chevy stepside
this is one of my favorite episodes. what specific cam did you guys put in this 350??????????i swear you guys are the best keep doing dyno test !! i love to see the results
I think they used a 280 comp
Yer I missed what cam and what carby, the summit cheapie was a roller block.
Would that have stock dished pistons or flat tops? He said it went from 8.25 to 9.2 cr, but never said what pistons it had or gasket thickness…
Oops had to re do my comment. He said he liked that 292 Mega cam. And, that be an Isky!
I love the way you take into account that most of us gearheads don’t have thousands of dollars to put into an engine when we are trying to get something that’s fun together under ten thousand dollars ( I like to eat as well as drive a cool car)
Looks like the bowls in the heads had a little room for the roller to tap into. I'm surprised the lower rpm curves are near a dead match, truthfully. Still... that hyd/flat is nice. Wish we had more specs on this build/these cams.
PLEASE share your knowledge of boosting power on modular 5.4 3v. Which power mods make the most power. Are there any intake manifold mods available? Thank You
The question I have in regards to hydraulic roller vs hydraulic flat tapped is are both camshaft specs are the same in regards to duration @ 50 and lift? As a matter of fact you guy's never mentioned cam specs at all. We the viewers would love to know. Thank.
I don't see why they conduct a test using different size cams. I mean that wouldn't be a test in itself. I'm sure they used same size cams otherwise, what would be the point, right? It's possible they are tricking us, but based on my understanding of all these vids, this show doesn't seem to be about tricking the audience, so.
Can you guys start doing tests like these on a Ford 4.6L engines please
Lol I run dual 120gph electric pumps on a 610hp 434w with 12an feed and 10an return . My second pump is set up on a low pressure switch that kicks in if I run below 6.5psi . Only time I've ever had the second pump kick on was running both my 125hp and 300hp n.o.s kits.
Can you remove one of the spark plugs and install a Computer Interface Pressure Gauges to see the increase of the pressure at low speeds and high speeds also check the vacuum on various speeds.
I just bought a 400 sbc core bored 60. What would you recommend building it up on a budget but pack some hp and torque
I LOVE IT!!!! This is my favorite show. Because the dyno does not lie. The dyno tests everything and tells you what works and what does not. That is why I learn so much. So I know what parts to buy for my own project. Great video and thanks for sharing. I learned so much.
If you like dyno proven results search CZcams for “Richard Holdener” he’s hands down the BEST and the information in his content is unbelievable that he gives it away for free! He’s helped me make hundreds more HP on the cheap!
A dyno can lie sadly there are plenty of companies with optimistinc numbers.
What are the numbers of the cam on the smallblock with the vortec head upgrade?
This was a great video🤙
Right on
Episode #'s would be nice.
I believe The SBC 350 was first available in ‘67 for the SS camaro. Not 1969
Vortec 350 was in vans until 02