Just helped by boy Darkninja with a new video he made about a basically unknown spotting mechanic. He was the first person I had ever heard mention it in my life and I almost guarantee there is no chance you or anyone you know had any idea it existed. It's worth checking out even if you just skim through. czcams.com/video/OhkALCdKIWE/video.html
One small tip I think a lot of people don’t realise is your ability to spot through and be spotted through a dead player’s tank. You can use it to your advantage, but I’m sure a lot of players assume it hides your spotting points to enemy players
Seriously ? been playing ten years in june and agree that WG did a terrible job early on. That said is four years ago they put out video showing all the points and how to use them.
iyouxin shouted out your video, and I'm glad he did. I was aware about the obvious stuff like the checkpoints and stuff, but the explanation on the math helped a lot. It really makes me make a doubletake on CVS. Thank you, sir.
Earned my sub. Good effort and explanation. I have a fairly good understanding of the mechanics, 3 marked my ELC and T-100 abusing it as much as possible lol. Regardless, was a good watch, keep it up. Hope to see some epic gameplay
Hey man, i have watched a lot of WOT tutorials, but your explaining man its perfect to understand. Can you do more tutorials? Like using that StratSketch show were light tanks should go, best TD spots to hide etc...
I dont have any plans of making anything else at the moment. If you are looking for that sort of thing my friend makes all sorts of videos like that. www.youtube.com/@darkninja___
Thanks for posting this analysis, this is something that I really was looking for to underatand the game's spotting mechanics and why I'm spotted through bushes when I thought I should not
This is hands down the go to video explaining this stuff. I've been trying to help people figure this out for a while now and you break everything down exceptionally. This video should be pinned on the forums in the new player section and forced to watch. There is not a single WG employee that understands this at this level and could explain it this well.
Probably one of best explanations of this you seems a bit rushed so I will need to watch again to pick up what I missed. Still a very good video thanks for posting. Cheers
Thanks. I found you through darknija's vid on cammo after fire. There's a lot of fuzzyiness surrounding the spotting mechanics and you've cut through it a little bit.
Thanks for the upload, very interesting. With so many changes since i joined in the Beta its good to keep things fresh. Do fallen tress really act as concealment, they didnt used too.
Personally a lot of your info is on WG videos now but you did a good job explaining it. Also your tips on the math is well done and your explanation of how it works with the camo. Now not a real disagreement but your view on the CVS is only valid on other classes. Personally run full optics on all my lights (vents, optics, cvs) this allows me to spot the other lights first by enough to turn away and not be seen. Now I also run a camo set up with battlefield mods (optics, vent, muffler & food, directive) but that's only good on the open maps. I do find that the mediums & TDs that run a CVS are no problem with the same tactic of turning away. Now what I have said is from a Light Tank perspective because of their better starting camo as you pointed out you can even fire your gun(unspotted) if you understand mechanics and know where enemies are. Being a medium spotter is good second set up for times there is no lights but find its about your vision being better as your camo is terrible compared to the lights .Also warn people about prems having the ten crews in them, like my Even 90 runs my 105 crew and that means in camo mode I have a 63% camo going and can hide out in the open ....lol This is just my opinion but I do have more then 23K games in lights and are close to marking every light tank in the game...... I know many players have done that already and lots don't run the vents like myself but my 100s of games with more then 10K spot mean I can use their system :)
OK thanks, yeah it did help. Going to need to watch it 12 more times but yeah, it gets better the further you go. You are aware that the spotting line that comes out from your barrel on the minimap is broken in I think it is 100m increments? Albeit the new T marker is like the best thing ever. The reason why people think the bushes on fish bay are broken is because you used to be able to use them to fire behind and not be spotted. Though I understand how that works now, so maybe they were just broken before. But yeah that wasn't how I understood it before, albeit I haven't played since 2019, and quickybaby showing us how to double bush just meaning that the bush needed to turn opaque and we would be good. So that alone is a great help, so thanks! How do you know bush density? I don't think you covered that. Though with the tree you said 25% is that just because the leaves aren't very dense? Are there bush density maps for common bushes? For example the bushes behind north cap on Fjords are insane. Combined with them having multiple layers of bush after bush do you need to calculate for each layer of bush? Damn I never felt my virginity dripping so heavily discussing bushes with other nerds but not referring to beavers.
Looool. Yeah there really isnt anything that definitively tells you what camo percentage specific bushes provide unless you really want to go test them. Its usually pretty obvious though because things that are worth 25% would be dead trees or ones with really sparse leaves. There are also some really small foliage that would be worth 25% but most trees and bushes that you would be using in 99% of scenarios are going to be 50%.
@@paddii Ok Stat, well, used it quite a bit and must say things are much more comfortable. Even on Fish Bay. I just didn't fire and got a lot of work done. I am not exposing myself mysteriously now! Got a couple aces on my VK 28.01, and real strong games in my Skoda T25, which is focus atm. Tier 6 BP I have 88/100 and it is on track so the constant x5 for wins and 157k/200k for the 20k free xp. The Skoda has really bad camo values though, but still making it work even as a termporary scout is really rewarding. Thanks again.
@Paddington there are the videos Wargaming put out called "Explaining Mechanics." They cover virtually everything you ever wanted to know about vision and concealment.
Honestly. The game would be much more immersive and interesting to new players if these mechanics, which we learn with time, were stressed more in game from the development side. Maybe active tips while playing or a gameplay that sets it in focus. But that's just throwing words in the air. I'm a new player myself, so I'm not trying to sound like I know stuff others don't. We can nerd out about it, but only nerds will appreciate that. And I do. Awesome video, cheers!
Thanks for this, so I guess I understand how bushes work a bit better. In my head, I was not subtracting the 50 meters from the formula so camo was a bit stronger than it actually is. Also I also guess trees are quite strong-ish. I have one question though, does small grass offer any camo? I am talking about the ones you find in El Halluf for example, there are some short ones on that hill with houses in the middle which could provide camo just so you spot. My guess is they would work but I am not 100% sure. Thanks.
Very neat equasion!! I'd like to know more...why is the reticle jumping when an enemy tank runs through it while the tank and barrel are not moving, and why does an aimed slow shell has a high arc while the same shell rockets off in a nearly straight line when fired just above the horizon. subbed with bell
If I understand your question correctly I think I know the answer. It is because wot automatically corrects for shell drop over distance. That's why slower velocity shells need to have a higher launch angle compared to shells with high velocity. This is why it will look a bit weird sometimes when what you are aiming at suddenly has a large change in distance. Also why if you are pre-aiming a tank over a ridge sometimes you will fire before the shell drop is properly adjusted and the shell will just fly over the tank.
The percentage on the map should be the other way around. If you calculate your Camo 25% and the bush 50% there should be a 75% at the 150m circle. Ok i got 50% camo its the 2nd, im on the open field its 25% so it will be 350m.
Do you know that Wargaming already put out videos pretty thoroughly explaining the spotting/concealment mechanics. They are called their "Explaining Mechanics" series. They had one for view range and two for concealment. I think they were pretty definitive.
Cheers for the info .would you say cvs is pretty worthless to equip.i tried it out in a training room and it didn't seem to give any advantage that I could see.i don't use it anymore
It is very useful if your objective is to spot enemies that are going to be behind foliage. Basically a must have for open maps if you are playing a light tank. You can take it on mediums but it is really not going to be more useful than other equipment. There are a lot of maps where you can probably get away without running cvs if you know how to properly counter enemy lights, but on maps like prok/mali etc you are essentially throwing if you dont bring cvs on your light.
This was very interesting. I have some questions. How can we determine weather certain bushes are 50% or the percentage camo values of various bushes in general? In order to take advantage of the camo of the bush do we just need to be have the spotting points covered in the direction relative to the enemy tanks that are capable of spotting us? I have another question. Let's say we're playing a bc25t with 30% camo and we're in a 50 percent bush. That means that 20 percent remains which implies that the spotting range would be 80m past proxy aka 130m assuming the enemy tank has 450m like your leopard example?
Yes everything you asked is correct assuming the enemy has 450m view range which is a very safe assumption. As for knowing what bushes are 50% they are honestly going to be the only thing you encounter 95% of the time. Its very uncommon to find 25% foliage outside of obscure positions. But they will usually be very easy to differentiate because they wont be very dense at all.
I have a question... If there are two enemy light tanks with same view range and camo, both using CVS, for example in the Prokhorovka bushes and one is trying to move forward to spot enemies, while the second one is not moving... Will they spot themselves at the same time ? Or the second one will spot the first one earlier due to CVS and reduction of camo of moving tanks ?
One important thing to mention (and why CVS is so "broken") is that, WITHOUT CVS, you would NEVER be able to spot TDs behind bushes (they would always have 100% camouflage, which is the maximum value your TOTAL camo can reach btw) unless you get in proximity range of 50m, getting both of you spotted and probably resulting in your light tank getting killed in 0.5 seconds. With the CVS however, you can spot the stealthiest of TDs behind bushes at about 55-60m or more (depends on their foliage camo value and their own camo value) while your light tank stays unspotted. CVS is not really broken, because it counteracts another broken aspect of this game, in the form of invisible TDs that could've only be spotted at 50m away. You would've died way before reaching 50m away from them, while they remained hidden in the bushes.
@@MrPatrickpiet I meant the total camouflage of their vehicle. Most TDs have way more than 20% stationary camo + 80% from bushes means 100% camo (it caps at 100). Therefore, without Commander vision system, you'd only be able to spot those "invisible" TDs at 50m proxy range, according to the spotting formula. But the CVS reduces that 100% camo, therefore enabling light tanks to spot TDs before the 50m proxy range is reached. An actual game changer.
I have a question regarding Fisherman's Bay. 1 light tank per team (both tier X with same equip) rush to bushes mid. North spawn tank goes to the middle of E5/6. The South spawn goes to the bushes F4. Why is it that the tank at F4 always outspots the tank at E5/6. I do this all the time and never get spotted in return. Does it simply come down to different bushes values?
I think there is a small gap between the bush and the building. What is more interesting is that you can outspot bush at E4 from same position, wonder if there is also a gap.
Hey nice Video i still have a question Di you know how the Perk Works wich extends your viewrange ? ( is it then possible to Spot Tanks behind 455m ) For example Maus or Tanks With Minimum Camo value I am Playing for 10 Years wit 9.5 k ratin and still don’t know it
I'm pretty sure it is just a slightly less powerful situational awareness. As far as I know they both do the same thing but the wording is really bad so it makes it seem like it extends max spotting range.
Great video. But can I ask for a favour? Can you kindly adjust your mic settings so that it does not cut in/out your words and sound? It's super tiring to the ears/brain to a point where I had to pause the video couple of times. I'm very sensitive to such things. I'm pretty sure I am not the only one Otherwise great video.
Hey, what mod is it that tank parts turn green when they are in a bush, seems like usefull mod, sometimes its hard to know if my manticore is fully in a bush or not.
Do you know the relation between camo after shooting and tanks like the su-122 44 and the e25… I know they have a special thing that they have better camo after firing
Usually tank camo is related to its height and camo after firing is dependent on tank class and caliber of gun. If you are interested in that can check out this video. czcams.com/video/OhkALCdKIWE/video.htmlsi=stQOzVRm_rFLHqSu
Hello, thanks for the video. Even tho I somewhat new most of the stuff, it was great to refresh my memory. According to the field mods, I've got a question. Let's take a classic light tank (non EBR), that can either buff its view range and decrease its camo or the other way (field mod VII), which one is better most of the time? For example on my 13 105, I have CVS, bounty optics and bounty exhaust, food and all essential perks. I can either have 49% camo with 484 m view range or 45% with 504 m. (So far I've been fine with more camo less view range.) Does it really matter that much? Since I marked only 1 tier 9 light so far, I don't have much practise with this field mod (lower tier lights don't have this field mod). I've seen you had + view range - camo on your Flipwagen, but concidering running turbo, you probably wanna active scout a little more in it, which I guess maakes sense to take more view range. So, I'd rather ask anyway. Thanks for answering.
Yea more recently I have gone for maximizing camo on my light tanks. This is mostly because I believe it is much easier to scout effectively if it is harder for you to get spotted. It also helps a lot for countering other lights since most people don't set them up very well. I honestly can't really remember why I took +view range over camo on the panzerwagon since its been a while since I played it. I think its probably because I was playing it with cvs, low noise, and turbo so I was taking the slight buff in view range since I wasn't running a piece of equipment to buff it. Overall I think now I would most likely be taking low noise and +camo if there is a field mod for it on all my light tanks just because of how powerful it is versus other lights. In most scenarios the only thing you really have to worry about out spotting are enemy lights since it is so easy to out spot regular tanks.
@@paddii Thank you sir. Sure, outspotting lights / not being outspotted is really the only thing to be worried about. However, I wasn't 100% sure which one actually helps more. (staying unspotted longer vs spotting the enemy quicker, in terms of few meters). Camo it is then.
Spotting in this game is random I swear I'll go months of doing the same things in the same tanks and then out of no where bam all of sudden no matter what I do I'm spotted
There's one thing about bushes not in your video. Whenever you fire your gun, all foliage within 15 meters of your vehicle disappears. Not literally, but it does in the concealment mechanics. So, when you fire your gun, not only does your concealment value decrease, but you also lose any concealment the bush provided. To maintain the concealment value of a bush, you have to fire from more than 15 meters behind it.
I wish the monkeys in the NA server from the SA/EU servers would watch this video but that might be to much for them to comprehend even if this explanation was dumbed down even a monkey would understand.
I find it baffling when people who are not just casual sunday gamers don't do any research on the game they are trying to perform well in. It takes you maybe an hour to watch some youtube videos (including this amazing specimen) to have a pretty comprehensive understanding of the game mechanics. Also an interesting side note: wargaming wiki says (updated years ago) that bushes within 15m lose 30% of their camo value instead of the 100% that they lose now so some old school players might be used to that.
That is simply not true. You actually have to be 49 meters away from someone to proxy them, you cant even proxy someone if you are 50 meters away from them.
Why's your microphone so low? Also you're wrong about the 25% and 50%. While its true the 50% is the top bushes, the amount per most bushes is different and varies wildly (8%, 38%, 15, etc), all the way down to 0 (a good bit of fake bushes and foliage on maps). For example when i quit over a year ago, on overlord's center most of the bushes where entirely fake (not the trees tho so you could only stay hidden there and peek-shoot if you knocked a tree down, meanwhile if you peeked normally you'd get spotted even on the sneakiest light tank.
Foliage used to have varying values like that however at some point they changed it and now they are only 25% or 50%. Wargaming video on concealment: czcams.com/video/pZVWmHQVuVI/video.html
@@paddii Is there any newer ones? Because its from 3 years ago, and at the very least invisible bushes (so, a third type you didn't mention) definitely existed then (also about a year ago when i still played)
@@paddii I meant fake. Also that video might as well oversimplify things, because explaining bushes have various values would take far more time. Of course i'm not denying they could have simplified and streamlined the bushes only to 25%, 50% and 0% ones instead of all those varying values, but again, of the 0% bushes i'm certain, a few examples are those central bushes on the hills in overlord, tiny hill bush on a6 at el haluf upper spawn (tried using it to shoot from in my hyper camo udes but after getting spotted even before shooting through it several times i realized its yet one more of the purely cosmetic ones).
Nice explanations, but, no offense, your game looks like it's from 2015. Judging by your FPS, I think you have enough power in your pc to improve it...
Yeah lol I have a 3090 and 12900k but prefer min graphics for playing competitive because it makes the game a lot simpler. Although I do switch to max sometimes just for a change of pace
Pretty good explanation but camo is still one of the most broken features of this game. Not even close to realistic. A 90mm has a 40ft muzzle flash. That one bush isnt gonna cover that. Also the amount of smoke that comes with firing the gun. Camo is very broken. Lastly how can you have a feature that detects an arty shot across the map.... but cant see a light 100 meters away?
The bush doesn't cover it. Whenever you fire your gun, all foliage within 15 meters of your vehicle disappears in the concealment mechanics. Wargaming put out several videos in their "Explaining Mechanics" series through their World of Tanks North America CZcams channel. You should watch both Part 1 and 2 of the "Everything about Concealment!" videos. They also had videos for vision, penetration, and armor.
@eyecatcha27 Yes, it has. Ignorance of the game's concealment mechanics isn't evidence of it being broken. You mention muzzle flash and smoke. The game not only reduces your vehicle's concealment rating whenever you fire your gun, but it also negates the concealment effect of all foliage within 15 meters. Last I checked, 15 meters was more than 40 ft.
@@johnryan6658 i encourage you to go watch a vid of tanks firing their weapon....if you think there is any bush that would cover it then you have won todays award.
@@eyecatcha27 So you're saying that a tank's camo rating should be significantly reduced when it fires its gun? The spotting/concealment mechanics already work that way, eyecatcha27.
Nice vid , alot of effort put into this too. The only thing that bothered me was the non existing fluidity of your voice/sentence, your like shooting part of your lines out sudenly stoping and shooting the rest. That was partly so iritating that i had to wind back a few seconds and watch again to understand what you was saying. Talk slower or write down what you want to say and read it slower. Otherwise i really apreciate this vid ! It took me awhile to figure out camo on my own with some streamer gameplay and some pieces of info in those plays. Watching light tank replays helped too. For some reason ppl couldnt explain it spot on like you did.
No, the density of the bush or knocked down tree matters. If I remember correctly, it was thin, medium, and thick. They have three different camo values. Wargaming explained the difference in their "Explaining Mechanics" videos.
Just helped by boy Darkninja with a new video he made about a basically unknown spotting mechanic. He was the first person I had ever heard mention it in my life and I almost guarantee there is no chance you or anyone you know had any idea it existed. It's worth checking out even if you just skim through.
czcams.com/video/OhkALCdKIWE/video.html
One small tip I think a lot of people don’t realise is your ability to spot through and be spotted through a dead player’s tank. You can use it to your advantage, but I’m sure a lot of players assume it hides your spotting points to enemy players
dead tank doesnt influence spoting ..... its just transparent like enemy or frendly tank...u cant hide behind any tank dead or alive ( what sucks bad)
@@1ordof1o1 At least you can use it to cover your tank against the enemy.
@@GregorianMG my bad i missread the original comment... was high AF sry
now i understand what he ment
Even alive tanks doesn't affect spotting
For 10 years i ve waited for a 5Head explanation, thank you sir, you've done a great job!
Seriously ? been playing ten years in june and agree that WG did a terrible job early on. That said is four years ago they put out video showing all the points and how to use them.
I wish there were more videos like this.
Simple tricks and explanations go a long way for newer players.
iyouxin shouted out your video, and I'm glad he did. I was aware about the obvious stuff like the checkpoints and stuff, but the explanation on the math helped a lot. It really makes me make a doubletake on CVS. Thank you, sir.
Obvious? I don't think I've ever heard anyone speak on this kind of stuff. This all new to me and I've been playing since 2011.
Bro you literally made the best and most informative video on this topic. I knew most of it already but most people rather don't so well done mate.
Paddington making educational content? I never saw this coming.
Earned my sub. Good effort and explanation. I have a fairly good understanding of the mechanics, 3 marked my ELC and T-100 abusing it as much as possible lol. Regardless, was a good watch, keep it up. Hope to see some epic gameplay
Hey man, i have watched a lot of WOT tutorials, but your explaining man its perfect to understand. Can you do more tutorials? Like using that StratSketch show were light tanks should go, best TD spots to hide etc...
I dont have any plans of making anything else at the moment. If you are looking for that sort of thing my friend makes all sorts of videos like that.
www.youtube.com/@darkninja___
im very pleased to see a video about topics and information already known re released in a 20 minute format.
That center of mass proxy tip at the end was very usefull, was never sure which part counted.
Thanks for posting this analysis, this is something that I really was looking for to underatand the game's spotting mechanics and why I'm spotted through bushes when I thought I should not
This is hands down the go to video explaining this stuff. I've been trying to help people figure this out for a while now and you break everything down exceptionally. This video should be pinned on the forums in the new player section and forced to watch.
There is not a single WG employee that understands this at this level and could explain it this well.
no way man i went to Harry Ainlay High School as well!
Hello, chemicals.
This was a very good explanation of the mechanics. Nice vid paddy
Hey man! Thanks for a very well done instructional video. Thanks for the hard work.
Good video, clearly summaries what we need. Found it useful as purple light tank player.
More like this video please! Not boring, very good info.
Probably one of best explanations of this you seems a bit rushed so I will need to watch again to pick up what I missed. Still a very good video thanks for posting. Cheers
Thanks. I found you through darknija's vid on cammo after fire. There's a lot of fuzzyiness surrounding the spotting mechanics and you've cut through it a little bit.
Great video ! Definitely will implement this in my games. Thanks
just found your channel very informative and very helpful
More effort gone into this video than wg have done in the 10 years I've played. Gg. Subbed.
Awesome dude! Thanks for the great info!
Great video! Thanks for doing it
Good content bro !!! Keep up the good work
Bro thanks i am starting the light grind and this will help so much 😊❤
well i guess the saying is true, ''u learn something new every day''
Really well explained video
many thanks :)
OMG, Awesome Video!! :) huge amount of useful knowledge here. Greetings
13:31 - I never thought that little cover would work as camo. Interesting.
Iyouxin is your kickstarter lmao
Nice vid
OMG, that’s so helpful tysm
Thanks for the upload, very interesting. With so many changes since i joined in the Beta its good to keep things fresh. Do fallen tress really act as concealment, they didnt used too.
Very informative!:D
thx man. nice work. there was one new thing
Great Video!
Good vid, thanks!
Personally a lot of your info is on WG videos now but you did a good job explaining it. Also your tips on the math is well done and your explanation of how it works with the camo. Now not a real disagreement but your view on the CVS is only valid on other classes. Personally run full optics on all my lights (vents, optics, cvs) this allows me to spot the other lights first by enough to turn away and not be seen. Now I also run a camo set up with battlefield mods (optics, vent, muffler & food, directive) but that's only good on the open maps. I do find that the mediums & TDs that run a CVS are no problem with the same tactic of turning away. Now what I have said is from a Light Tank perspective because of their better starting camo as you pointed out you can even fire your gun(unspotted) if you understand mechanics and know where enemies are. Being a medium spotter is good second set up for times there is no lights but find its about your vision being better as your camo is terrible compared to the lights .Also warn people about prems having the ten crews in them, like my Even 90 runs my 105 crew and that means in camo mode I have a 63% camo going and can hide out in the open ....lol This is just my opinion but I do have more then 23K games in lights and are close to marking every light tank in the game...... I know many players have done that already and lots don't run the vents like myself but my 100s of games with more then 10K spot mean I can use their system :)
You just earned a like and subscribe
Just knowing the spotting mechanic and knowing how to utilize it to its fullest is the difference between a decent player and an amazing player.
Very very good video.
OK thanks, yeah it did help. Going to need to watch it 12 more times but yeah, it gets better the further you go. You are aware that the spotting line that comes out from your barrel on the minimap is broken in I think it is 100m increments? Albeit the new T marker is like the best thing ever.
The reason why people think the bushes on fish bay are broken is because you used to be able to use them to fire behind and not be spotted. Though I understand how that works now, so maybe they were just broken before. But yeah that wasn't how I understood it before, albeit I haven't played since 2019, and quickybaby showing us how to double bush just meaning that the bush needed to turn opaque and we would be good.
So that alone is a great help, so thanks!
How do you know bush density? I don't think you covered that. Though with the tree you said 25% is that just because the leaves aren't very dense? Are there bush density maps for common bushes?
For example the bushes behind north cap on Fjords are insane. Combined with them having multiple layers of bush after bush do you need to calculate for each layer of bush?
Damn I never felt my virginity dripping so heavily discussing bushes with other nerds but not referring to beavers.
Looool. Yeah there really isnt anything that definitively tells you what camo percentage specific bushes provide unless you really want to go test them. Its usually pretty obvious though because things that are worth 25% would be dead trees or ones with really sparse leaves. There are also some really small foliage that would be worth 25% but most trees and bushes that you would be using in 99% of scenarios are going to be 50%.
@@paddii Ok Stat, well, used it quite a bit and must say things are much more comfortable. Even on Fish Bay. I just didn't fire and got a lot of work done. I am not exposing myself mysteriously now! Got a couple aces on my VK 28.01, and real strong games in my Skoda T25, which is focus atm. Tier 6 BP I have 88/100 and it is on track so the constant x5 for wins and 157k/200k for the 20k free xp. The Skoda has really bad camo values though, but still making it work even as a termporary scout is really rewarding. Thanks again.
@@chris_hisss Nice man glad it helps
@Paddington there are the videos Wargaming put out called "Explaining Mechanics." They cover virtually everything you ever wanted to know about vision and concealment.
Honestly. The game would be much more immersive and interesting to new players if these mechanics, which we learn with time, were stressed more in game from the development side.
Maybe active tips while playing or a gameplay that sets it in focus. But that's just throwing words in the air. I'm a new player myself, so I'm not trying to sound like I know stuff others don't.
We can nerd out about it, but only nerds will appreciate that. And I do.
Awesome video, cheers!
Thanks for this, so I guess I understand how bushes work a bit better. In my head, I was not subtracting the 50 meters from the formula so camo was a bit stronger than it actually is. Also I also guess trees are quite strong-ish.
I have one question though, does small grass offer any camo? I am talking about the ones you find in El Halluf for example, there are some short ones on that hill with houses in the middle which could provide camo just so you spot. My guess is they would work but I am not 100% sure.
Thanks.
Ily, Paddy Daddy.
So cvs reduces it, multiplicatively, not additively. That's super important to know, thanks!
Thank you!
Very neat equasion!! I'd like to know more...why is the reticle jumping when an enemy tank runs through it while the tank and barrel are not moving, and why does an aimed slow shell has a high arc while the same shell rockets off in a nearly straight line when fired just above the horizon. subbed with bell
If I understand your question correctly I think I know the answer. It is because wot automatically corrects for shell drop over distance. That's why slower velocity shells need to have a higher launch angle compared to shells with high velocity.
This is why it will look a bit weird sometimes when what you are aiming at suddenly has a large change in distance. Also why if you are pre-aiming a tank over a ridge sometimes you will fire before the shell drop is properly adjusted and the shell will just fly over the tank.
Thanks man!
QB running cvs on every tank
"Imma end this mans whole career"
The percentage on the map should be the other way around. If you calculate your Camo 25% and the bush 50% there should be a 75% at the 150m circle. Ok i got 50% camo its the 2nd, im on the open field its 25% so it will be 350m.
thanks paddy
OP sent me :)
Do you know that Wargaming already put out videos pretty thoroughly explaining the spotting/concealment mechanics. They are called their "Explaining Mechanics" series. They had one for view range and two for concealment. I think they were pretty definitive.
lol I linked them in the description
You didn't mention double bush. But overall nice video
Cheers for the info .would you say cvs is pretty worthless to equip.i tried it out in a training room and it didn't seem to give any advantage that I could see.i don't use it anymore
It is very useful if your objective is to spot enemies that are going to be behind foliage. Basically a must have for open maps if you are playing a light tank. You can take it on mediums but it is really not going to be more useful than other equipment.
There are a lot of maps where you can probably get away without running cvs if you know how to properly counter enemy lights, but on maps like prok/mali etc you are essentially throwing if you dont bring cvs on your light.
This was very interesting. I have some questions. How can we determine weather certain bushes are 50% or the percentage camo values of various bushes in general? In order to take advantage of the camo of the bush do we just need to be have the spotting points covered in the direction relative to the enemy tanks that are capable of spotting us? I have another question. Let's say we're playing a bc25t with 30% camo and we're in a 50 percent bush. That means that 20 percent remains which implies that the spotting range would be 80m past proxy aka 130m assuming the enemy tank has 450m like your leopard example?
Yes everything you asked is correct assuming the enemy has 450m view range which is a very safe assumption.
As for knowing what bushes are 50% they are honestly going to be the only thing you encounter 95% of the time. Its very uncommon to find 25% foliage outside of obscure positions. But they will usually be very easy to differentiate because they wont be very dense at all.
iyouxin made vid bout brokem trees with hevy will post link ,,,,, im curious what thought u have
I have a question... If there are two enemy light tanks with same view range and camo, both using CVS, for example in the Prokhorovka bushes and one is trying to move forward to spot enemies, while the second one is not moving... Will they spot themselves at the same time ? Or the second one will spot the first one earlier due to CVS and reduction of camo of moving tanks ?
Same time, coz camo is the same sitting or moving for lights. ...should have read your question more thoroughly, the 2nd for not moving.
CVS will negate the camo of the moving tank, even if it's a light tank.
One important thing to mention (and why CVS is so "broken") is that, WITHOUT CVS, you would NEVER be able to spot TDs behind bushes (they would always have 100% camouflage, which is the maximum value your TOTAL camo can reach btw) unless you get in proximity range of 50m, getting both of you spotted and probably resulting in your light tank getting killed in 0.5 seconds. With the CVS however, you can spot the stealthiest of TDs behind bushes at about 55-60m or more (depends on their foliage camo value and their own camo value) while your light tank stays unspotted. CVS is not really broken, because it counteracts another broken aspect of this game, in the form of invisible TDs that could've only be spotted at 50m away. You would've died way before reaching 50m away from them, while they remained hidden in the bushes.
bushes will maximum give 80% according to WG
@@MrPatrickpiet I meant the total camouflage of their vehicle. Most TDs have way more than 20% stationary camo + 80% from bushes means 100% camo (it caps at 100). Therefore, without Commander vision system, you'd only be able to spot those "invisible" TDs at 50m proxy range, according to the spotting formula. But the CVS reduces that 100% camo, therefore enabling light tanks to spot TDs before the 50m proxy range is reached. An actual game changer.
This guy seems to know what he is doing, must be in crakd
I have a question regarding Fisherman's Bay. 1 light tank per team (both tier X with same equip) rush to bushes mid. North spawn tank goes to the middle of E5/6. The South spawn goes to the bushes F4. Why is it that the tank at F4 always outspots the tank at E5/6. I do this all the time and never get spotted in return. Does it simply come down to different bushes values?
I think there is a small gap between the bush and the building. What is more interesting is that you can outspot bush at E4 from same position, wonder if there is also a gap.
Hey nice Video i still have a question
Di you know how the Perk Works wich extends your viewrange ?
( is it then possible to Spot Tanks behind 455m )
For example Maus or Tanks With Minimum Camo value
I am Playing for 10 Years wit 9.5 k ratin and still don’t know it
I'm pretty sure it is just a slightly less powerful situational awareness. As far as I know they both do the same thing but the wording is really bad so it makes it seem like it extends max spotting range.
nope it's impossible to spot tanks past 445
I understood like half of it. I shoot cupola, nothing more, nothing less. :D
I see tank shoot tank
Great video. But can I ask for a favour? Can you kindly adjust your mic settings so that it does not cut in/out your words and sound? It's super tiring to the ears/brain to a point where I had to pause the video couple of times. I'm very sensitive to such things. I'm pretty sure I am not the only one
Otherwise great video.
Hey, what mod is it that tank parts turn green when they are in a bush, seems like usefull mod, sometimes its hard to know if my manticore is fully in a bush or not.
Its not a mod. For some reason with my settings that is what happens, not sure why.
Do you know the relation between camo after shooting and tanks like the su-122 44 and the e25… I know they have a special thing that they have better camo after firing
Usually tank camo is related to its height and camo after firing is dependent on tank class and caliber of gun. If you are interested in that can check out this video.
czcams.com/video/OhkALCdKIWE/video.htmlsi=stQOzVRm_rFLHqSu
Turn on subtitles and enjoy at 10:41some lesbian range
Hello, thanks for the video. Even tho I somewhat new most of the stuff, it was great to refresh my memory.
According to the field mods, I've got a question. Let's take a classic light tank (non EBR), that can either buff its view range and decrease its camo or the other way (field mod VII), which one is better most of the time?
For example on my 13 105, I have CVS, bounty optics and bounty exhaust, food and all essential perks. I can either have 49% camo with 484 m view range or 45% with 504 m. (So far I've been fine with more camo less view range.) Does it really matter that much? Since I marked only 1 tier 9 light so far, I don't have much practise with this field mod (lower tier lights don't have this field mod).
I've seen you had + view range - camo on your Flipwagen, but concidering running turbo, you probably wanna active scout a little more in it, which I guess maakes sense to take more view range. So, I'd rather ask anyway.
Thanks for answering.
Yea more recently I have gone for maximizing camo on my light tanks. This is mostly because I believe it is much easier to scout effectively if it is harder for you to get spotted. It also helps a lot for countering other lights since most people don't set them up very well.
I honestly can't really remember why I took +view range over camo on the panzerwagon since its been a while since I played it. I think its probably because I was playing it with cvs, low noise, and turbo so I was taking the slight buff in view range since I wasn't running a piece of equipment to buff it.
Overall I think now I would most likely be taking low noise and +camo if there is a field mod for it on all my light tanks just because of how powerful it is versus other lights. In most scenarios the only thing you really have to worry about out spotting are enemy lights since it is so easy to out spot regular tanks.
@@paddii Thank you sir.
Sure, outspotting lights / not being outspotted is really the only thing to be worried about.
However, I wasn't 100% sure which one actually helps more. (staying unspotted longer vs spotting the enemy quicker, in terms of few meters). Camo it is then.
is the proxy range a sphere or a circle around your tank?
A sphere.
Spotting in this game is random I swear I'll go months of doing the same things in the same tanks and then out of no where bam all of sudden no matter what I do I'm spotted
There's one thing about bushes not in your video. Whenever you fire your gun, all foliage within 15 meters of your vehicle disappears. Not literally, but it does in the concealment mechanics. So, when you fire your gun, not only does your concealment value decrease, but you also lose any concealment the bush provided. To maintain the concealment value of a bush, you have to fire from more than 15 meters behind it.
I wish the monkeys in the NA server from the SA/EU servers would watch this video but that might be to much for them to comprehend even if this explanation was dumbed down even a monkey would understand.
I find it baffling when people who are not just casual sunday gamers don't do any research on the game they are trying to perform well in. It takes you maybe an hour to watch some youtube videos (including this amazing specimen) to have a pretty comprehensive understanding of the game mechanics. Also an interesting side note: wargaming wiki says (updated years ago) that bushes within 15m lose 30% of their camo value instead of the 100% that they lose now so some old school players might be used to that.
How do i get graphic settings like this?
What part
SD-Client
No cvs? Qb has failed you
Proxy is actually 51 meters.. Then your spotted.. I learned this the hard way.. So if your 52 meters your fine... Until its 51.. Then yoir proxied..
That is simply not true. You actually have to be 49 meters away from someone to proxy them, you cant even proxy someone if you are 50 meters away from them.
Why's your microphone so low?
Also you're wrong about the 25% and 50%. While its true the 50% is the top bushes, the amount per most bushes is different and varies wildly (8%, 38%, 15, etc), all the way down to 0 (a good bit of fake bushes and foliage on maps). For example when i quit over a year ago, on overlord's center most of the bushes where entirely fake (not the trees tho so you could only stay hidden there and peek-shoot if you knocked a tree down, meanwhile if you peeked normally you'd get spotted even on the sneakiest light tank.
Foliage used to have varying values like that however at some point they changed it and now they are only 25% or 50%. Wargaming video on concealment: czcams.com/video/pZVWmHQVuVI/video.html
@@paddii Is there any newer ones? Because its from 3 years ago, and at the very least invisible bushes (so, a third type you didn't mention) definitely existed then (also about a year ago when i still played)
@@mkzhero The fact that that video is 3 years old means they have been using that system for at least 3 years. And what on earth is an invisible bush?
@@paddii I meant fake. Also that video might as well oversimplify things, because explaining bushes have various values would take far more time. Of course i'm not denying they could have simplified and streamlined the bushes only to 25%, 50% and 0% ones instead of all those varying values, but again, of the 0% bushes i'm certain, a few examples are those central bushes on the hills in overlord, tiny hill bush on a6 at el haluf upper spawn (tried using it to shoot from in my hyper camo udes but after getting spotted even before shooting through it several times i realized its yet one more of the purely cosmetic ones).
Nice explanations, but, no offense, your game looks like it's from 2015. Judging by your FPS, I think you have enough power in your pc to improve it...
Yeah lol I have a 3090 and 12900k but prefer min graphics for playing competitive because it makes the game a lot simpler. Although I do switch to max sometimes just for a change of pace
Pretty good explanation but camo is still one of the most broken features of this game. Not even close to realistic. A 90mm has a 40ft muzzle flash. That one bush isnt gonna cover that. Also the amount of smoke that comes with firing the gun. Camo is very broken.
Lastly how can you have a feature that detects an arty shot across the map.... but cant see a light 100 meters away?
The bush doesn't cover it. Whenever you fire your gun, all foliage within 15 meters of your vehicle disappears in the concealment mechanics. Wargaming put out several videos in their "Explaining Mechanics" series through their World of Tanks North America CZcams channel. You should watch both Part 1 and 2 of the "Everything about Concealment!" videos. They also had videos for vision, penetration, and armor.
Nothing you have. Said has addressed anything i said.
@eyecatcha27 Yes, it has. Ignorance of the game's concealment mechanics isn't evidence of it being broken. You mention muzzle flash and smoke. The game not only reduces your vehicle's concealment rating whenever you fire your gun, but it also negates the concealment effect of all foliage within 15 meters. Last I checked, 15 meters was more than 40 ft.
@@johnryan6658 i encourage you to go watch a vid of tanks firing their weapon....if you think there is any bush that would cover it then you have won todays award.
@@eyecatcha27 So you're saying that a tank's camo rating should be significantly reduced when it fires its gun? The spotting/concealment mechanics already work that way, eyecatcha27.
Nice vid , alot of effort put into this too. The only thing that bothered me was the non existing fluidity of your voice/sentence, your like shooting part of your lines out sudenly stoping and shooting the rest. That was partly so iritating that i had to wind back a few seconds and watch again to understand what you was saying. Talk slower or write down what you want to say and read it slower. Otherwise i really apreciate this vid ! It took me awhile to figure out camo on my own with some streamer gameplay and some pieces of info in those plays. Watching light tank replays helped too. For some reason ppl couldnt explain it spot on like you did.
I have the perfect solution, dont play this scam of a game
What about the tree which hase no leaves, only branches..dose it give same camo?
To be perfectly honestly I dont know for sure but I think it is just 25% with a very small outline
No, the density of the bush or knocked down tree matters. If I remember correctly, it was thin, medium, and thick. They have three different camo values. Wargaming explained the difference in their "Explaining Mechanics" videos.
@@johnryan6658 yes the density does matter, that's what differentiates between 25% and 50%