I wasn't even of driving age yet, but I remember when the Center High Mount Stop Lamp (CHMSL) became mandatory on cars in 1986. At the time, it seemed like a gimmick and some people speculated that any reduction in rear end crashes was due to the novelty/newness of the 3rd brake light. I recall some cars didn't get them until a bit later (Accord hatchback comes to mind, no idea how some cars got exempt). Now we have modules that can make the center brake light flash a few times to get driver's attention because we've become so used to them.
@@erictaylor5462 I remember it too, but I didn't get my full driver license with no restrictions until almost a year after you did, on October 13, 1986. Prior to that, at 16, I had a license that stated that I must have a parent or legal guardian in the front seat, and they had to have a valid driver license. They also had to have their wits about them, so playing the designated driver card was out. The next year, at 17, if there were no infractions, it was upgraded to anyone over 18 with a valid license in the front seat with me, and finally, at 18 years old, that's when we were finally able to drive alone, as long as we were able to pass a final driving test at the DPS. The next year, in 1987, my Dad was finally able to buy his first almost new car, a 1986 Chevrolet Celebrity wagon, which was our first car with a high mount stop light. He bought it for Mum so she had room to do her Avon deliveries, he kept his 1977 Chrysler Newport 2-dr hardtop, and I inherited the 1982 Plymouth Gran Fury Police Interceptor. Funny thing about those high mount stop lights, and I just found out about this the hard way a few months ago, they're only effective if the person coming up behind you at 35 MpH while you're sitting at a stop light, is paying attention. Mine worked, as did both of the ones in the tail light housings. This guy missed all four red lights right in front of him; the three on my car, and the fourth one hanging from a cable around 13 - 14 ft in the air.
You know that is a good question, because even cars like the Lincoln Town Car which looked straight out of the 1970s, still put them in for their 1986 model year
Usually old models get grandfathered in for things like this. Like, if the 85 and 86 models are identical they wouldn't need to add the light. At least, that's what I suspect.
In heavy traffic, I use the third brake light of the second car ahead of me to start braking when a slowdown occurs. I can often see it through the car ahead of me.
I look far enough up the road to not need it at all. I identify traffic jams half a mile before I'm close enough to need to take any action because of them and 99.975% of the time am able to slow down for them without touching the brake at all. Look more than ten feet past your hood and you won't need those lights. Also stop tailgating.
@@TestECull Tbf there is a problem with the car in front of you also tailgating and will only slam break when it's close, and sadly this rather not too uncommon. Some of these tailgater somehow can control their speed of the car to creep in behind another car enough not to make a collision. It gives false sense of security that the traffic in front still moving until the red tailight lits up then only will do a complete stop. But yeah, still best advise is to keep a safe distance and don't tail gate. Which helps to prevent collision to the vehicle in front that may be doing tailgating.
@@TestECull I look far enough up ahead to predict when a traffic jam is about to happen and steer off to a different road in the nick of time. I never need to slow down to traffic, because by the time it happens, I am either on another road or stopped by a predictive lack of acceleration. I use a very tall periscope to see 10 football fields ahead of me.
I remember when this 3rd break light was introduced. In fact, it happened the year I got my driver's license (I actually got it December 30, 1985, but it was so close to 1986...) I very much remember thinking what a great idea it was, because it made it much easier to see when someone was stopping.
I remember when they started appearing as an aftermarket modification in the beginning of the 90s here in Hungary. They were illegal for a period of time, because "unsafe modification".
Am I the only motherfucker in this entire country that doesn't need a 3rd brake light on the car in front of them to tell that car is stopping or something?! Or indeed any brake lights at all? It seems like such a simple concept: 'solid object approach --> reduce speed until it isn't approaching anymore'.
I've always said that the 3rd brake light was one of the best ever CHEAP safety features added to cars. Young people just take it for granted that they've always been there and don't even think about it. But for those of us who are much older, we drove many cars without that 3rd brake light.
@@Shadow79XXX not tryna say that the third or same lights are bad, but with how common powerful LED lights are, it's really hard to differentiate like the light just active or the brakes initiated without having the third one to double check that it's active
I remember when I was a kid we had a Ford Granada at the time these became popular and my dad bought a kit at the flea market that mounted on the back window and ran wires in the trunk to the brake lights to add a third brake light.
Maybe boomers struggle to see a light turn on, I personally don't. Every time I'm behind a truck with a burned out 3rd brake light, I'm able to recognize when they're braking.
I remember that before the third brake light became standard, kits of brake lights to mount under the roof behind the rear window were kind of popular in Europe. One argument not mentioned in this video: They are easier to see not just by the vehicle directly behind, but further behind as well, helping to avoid mass collisions in dense traffic, which became a problem in that era because many drivers didn't keep enough safety distance. From 1938 to 1983 Germany (and probably other countries) allowed yellow brake lights. Interestingly the third brake light is still not required by German law. It is installed as a standard in new vehicles however, to be legal in all countries.
This reminds me, vaguely, of the mid 70s to early 80s G. M. cars that didn't just not have a 3rd light, *but had the only 2 lights in the bumper.* As someone born in 1991 who never saw those cars in their prime years, that's the stupidest place I can think of to put tail lights.
@@101Volts It was dumb to put brake lights in the bumpers. If the bumper got tweaked, the brake lights would Crack and you couldn't easily fit a new brake light in there. Some cars also had front turn signals in the bumper, too.
that's incorrect, the third braking light has been required on newly registered cars in the EU since 1998. The requirement is not explicitly codified in German law - but it doesn't have to be as EU regulations apply automatically.
I remember working on cars in Germany in the early 80s (I moved to the UK in 82) that had these kits, often a pair of brake lights mounted on vertical bars that fitted inside, in the back window. They were made by Hella so far as I remember, and the rationale was that they could be seen through the windows of several cars, giving advanced warning of a car up front braking. Later, single-light kits started to appear and then it became standard fitting.
@@PedroConejo1939 yes, single third brake-lights were originally not allowed. Until some time in the 1990s, braking lights were only allowed in pairs. Hence these pairs of what used to be called "Pufflampen" or "Rentnerleuchten" (brothel lamps / pensioner's lights). They are actually still street legal in old cars that don't have the third brake light yet. Although they are less than ideal for a variety of reasons. For once, because the lights were in the inside of the car, behind the rear window, they would cause severe glare if they were mounted incorrectly, or when the window was fogged.
I was a automotive mechanic from the mid 1970's and remember when they came out. They used to sell retrofit kits for cars back then that could be installed in the back package shelf of sedans. I know I could install a retrofit kit with a template for lights either drill holes or if it positioned correctly with a punch in a matter of a half hour. String the wire to the brake light wires I strip a small section the brake light wire on the car and fit the small control box for the 3rd brake light so it would not blink with the turn signal and then solder the wire connection and tape it up. Then position the brake light control on the outside of the trunk support and then secure the wiring. I made good money for a couple years from the folks who retrofitted their cars with those third brake lights. I also did it to my older car just for the safety aspect of it all.
I had a 1982 Dodge Aries sedan when the 3rd brake light became required, and I also added a 3rd light kit to the center of the rear package shelf. I think I bought the kit from J.C. Whitney. The light housing came with a soft black plastic lip that wrapped around the edge where it met the windshield, and it was easy to cut it to try to match the angle of the glass surface. If you did it well, then all of the light would reflect out the back window, and look like a factory option. I had another car with dedicated rear turn signal bulbs, and so for that car, you did not need the control box.
I made my own version for my classic Beetle, 3D printed the housing. Especially with how low the tail lights are, and how high most vehicles (SUVs/crossovers) are these days, I think it's better to have something in drivers line of sight. Some purists, like "My Pronoun is WTF" here, complain that it's not stock or original, but I figure regardless of looks if it has a 1% chance of preventing my car - which I actually use as a regular vehicle - being rear-ended, it's totally worth it.
3rd brake lights were made mandatory about the late 90's in Europe (in france it was in '97) my Peugeot 205s didn't have them, and i had to source tailgates from latest models after 97 so i could have 3rd brake lights on them
was it made mandatory also for older vehicles because my car is from 1990 and doesn't have a 3rd brakelight and it doesn't matter for cars build before it was made mandatory
I do inspections on vehicles and sometimes when peoples 3rd brake lights are out they want to argue on why they need the 3rd one. This video will be a good pointer to show them why we need them.
There are actually two advantages: 1) As mentioned in the video, the third brake light is more prominent than the other two (which are in the same clutter with rear lights). 2) A brake light installed high enough (i.e., above or on the top part of the rear window) can be seen "through" the car behind it. Thus there is more reaction time (you can start braking at the same time as the driver in front of you). In this respect I do not understand why in some models the third brake light is positioned on the rear spoiler (convertibles have an excuse).
A while back I would of been one those arguing with you, not because I felt like it wasn't necessary, but because the TBL is part of the rear wing and it is discontinued and I couldn't find another one. But I ended up buying a couple led strips and adapting them to the original housing.
@Bad Drivers of AZ & NV Because you can't just cut a spot out for it in the tint? Or because some people will just be stupid and cover it without thinking? Much like they cover the other two lights with tint.
Failing to have one when you get rear ended could potentially let the driver running into the back shift some liability to the driver they ran into in states with tailgating laws.
1:28 In 1914 Florence Lawrence developed an early version of the vehicle turn signal we use today. Not the man you mention 14 years later. She developed a mechanical signalling arm that at a press of a button, raised or lowered a flag on the car’s rear bumper that told other drivers which way the car was going to turn. At the time, turn signals, brake lights and windscreen wipers were not part of many or any motor vehicle's offering. Not only did Lawrence create this indicating signalling system, but she also built a brake signal that when the brake pedal was pushed, a STOP sign flipped up from the car’s rear bumper. A standard and expected feature in today’s vehicles but at the time, these were truly unique and groundbreaking.
Some early cars had "semaphore" turn signals that popped out of the B pillar, sort of like what you describe, though they were also lit (and I assume flash). Early VW Beetles had them, though they switched to conventional front/rear flashing lights fairly early on - surely cheaper and more reliable. Ones with the semaphores are now very rare and revered by enthusiasts.
@@mcn1583 technicalities, but it would be like saying someone invented the first gasoline powered car without crediting the person who invented the first petroleum powered car, because is ran on distilled ligroin, versus the type of refined petrol we use today.
I remember being a little kid in the 80's and I knew the cars were new if they had the 3rd brake light. Made sense to me as a kid. Especially when there were still 60's and 70's cars running around with one brake light not working, or one tail light is twice as bright as the other one. Sometimes you had to second guess if the car was stopping or turning
I remember being about 6 at the time and demanding that the car we got have a 3rd tail light because it looked so cool. By that point, it was the only legal option other than a used car.
So you spent time while driving, focusing on cars that had electrical issues or tail light lumen issies, so you could "second guess" what you had predicted or hoped they would do. Wow, it's a good thing you typed your comment so you could feel momentarily validated.
I still remember my great grandpa telling me stories about when he first got turn signals and everyone in town would stare at his truck because he didn't have to open the window to turn. His truck didn't come with turn signals, he just made his own
I'd love to see a short-form like this that documents the colors used for turn signals, much like Alec did on Technology Connections, just because of how terrible they are. The more people made aware of how bad they are, the better.
Here's an interesting thought: You are traveling an unfamiliar area late at night on a back country "primitive" road. It's pitch black around you but when you checked the google map earlier you know that this area has roads with steep drop-offs on either side and rather narrow roads. It's raining heavily and you see two flashing amber lights ahead of you not moving but nothing else. Which side of the two lights do you move toward to pass it?
@@transtubular you should already be traveling slowly under such conditions (and sketchiness), so reduce speed further, approach cautiously while staying in the middle of the road (you are legally allowed to straddle the line if conditions are hazardous enough to warrant it) and only after you have made a positive identification of what the thing is with flashing amber lights should you determine your course of action. it could be a trailer that's stretched across the majority of the road, preventing travel on either side.
@@transtubular that event is not common enough to justify having the turn signal share the same lights as the brakes. What is very common is taking a few seconds to realize if someone is braking or signaling. Even worse if one light is out. In driving, every second counts. We should be able to instantly determine if the driver in front is braking or signaling.
Brake and tail lights have the perfect color, red, it signals for danger, and isnt blinding like blue or green, just like traffic lights. Red is to stop, and amber is like a warning, turn signals are technically a warning that informs the other drivers of your next move, it cant be flashing red cause it will cause confusion with the brake lights, and it has to be flashing for the same reasons. In my country turn signals have to be amber, sometimes we see a car with broken taillight glass and both lamps are white. It's confusing for a second to tell wether the car is braking, turning or even reversing cause those are white
@@transtubular You found one hypothetical situation possibly favoring red turn signals, out of 99+% that would favor amber. And in your situation most likely the red tail lights or (less bright) amber running lights would be on too, if they aren't I'd blame that on the other vehicle's driver, not that it has amber turn signals. As others say here, in that situation you should be driving so slowly that you can see what's going on.
To be honest, there’s been many a time I’ve been driving in traffic and an older vehicle begins braking without that third brake light, and I don’t notice immediately. I got my licence in 2013, well after their introduction though. I’d still say they’re super effective, especially in reducing ambiguity. Now for us North Americans to recognise how effective amber turn indicators are as opposed to our red does all situation.
What scares me most about being on the road is we have so many dipshits that need a third brake light to realize the car in front of them is slowing down in the first place.....
@@AB-ou8ve Because I'm sick and tired of society coddling dumbasses. If someone can't tell they need to stop their car to avoid a crash seeing two brake lights the correct thing to do is yank their license until they can prove they dont need the third brake light anymore.
I first saw a high center brake light sold as an accessory in parts stores. The reason they worked, according to the literature, was that they could be seen through the greenhouse of the next car, giving the driver behind that one more time to react. Made sense, like stick-on blind spot mirrors.
Great video. I love lighting, automotive lighting included. Do you watch Technology Connections? He has some great videos on turn signals. In ECE markets, the third brake light is allowed to be off-center. USDOT requires it to be centered. If you look at some Euro-style vans with barn doors like the Transit Connect, you can see where the Euro light would go but they had to stick the light on the roof for it to be centered. Most cars do have the center light higher, but the GM Dustbuster vans got away with having it lower, just above the license plate while the main lights were alongside the back window. Until the 1960s, front parking lights were not required to be on when the headlights are on. The '65 Mustang you showed is like that. The problem is that if a headlight burns out, the car's width is no longer indicated. The '68 FMVSS Act made a rule that the front marker lights must stay on. 70s cars sometimes had a pair of extra brake lights on in the back window or deck lid. They were linked to the standard lights. I've considered retrofitting one to my '84 Jeep. There's a hole in the center of the spare tire carrier that would be perfect for a 3/4" grommet mount light. I would have to run a new wire from the brake switch to the back. Two lights to do it all is a little disconcerting and the turn signals are short on/long off because I have higher-wattage bulbs on the original flasher. If mine was a little older and had the back sidemarkers on the body I would convert it to the Euro-style lights with separate yellow turn signals. My daily driver Taurus wagon wears '97 amber turn signals in place of the factory red because yellow is safer. The colors are separated and unambiguous.
You should be able to get more modern digital flasher modules that could fit in the stock slot which would solve the flashing issue as they are not reliant on wattage
@@DEVILTAZ35 Why should animated turn signals be banned? They function like turn signals, but animated. Should blinking turn signals also be banned by your logic?
Just wanted to say I love your videos and I found you because I’m thinking about getting a 79 rx7 myself and found your videos really helpful, keep up the good work I can’t wait to see more
I learned about this when I noticed that my car (a 1989 Mercedes S-Class) has its third brake light sort of just mounted at the bottom of the back window. It wasn't as integrated into the car as you'd expect, and that's because it was added mid-generation to meet the requirement. Quite a few cars of the time did similar additions, like what we've seen with some rear-view cameras sticking out because they were mandated a few years ago before new generations of cars with them better integrated are released.
In the UK there was a trend in around 1984-'85 among boy racers for two small square aftermarket high level brake lights mounted at the top corners inside the rear window which was originally seen on rally cars, although I think it was considered illegal at the time. Then the benefits of having high level brake lights (especially the single centrally mounted one) became more obvious as they could be seen better as well as being seen through other cars in heavy traffic where drivers several cars behind the one braking would see it and brake much sooner. They weren't standard equipment until the mid '90s by most European makers - the Mk3 Golf didn't have them to begin with which shows how late they were to the party.
The 1971-78 Oldsmobile Toronado and 1974-76 Buick Riviera also had pairs of center-mounted lights positioned between the rear windscreen and the trunk lid. However, they illuminated when the brakes and turn signals were activated just like their lower-mounted regular taillights.
This was pretty awesome... I had a rough take on why and thinking it was safety related. I figured it was in case one brake light went out you still have a back up... Ive seen so many newer Hyundais and Kias that have both brake lights out already.. that 3rd break light seems to be the only thing that lasts
Something interesting I've noticed is that on almost all cars from the last 15 years or so the third brake light is almost universally LED, while the main brake lights on many cars, even currently, are still incandescent. I'm guessing because LEDs can be put in a slimmer housing, while incandescent are cheaper. The LEDs typically don't burn out, I suspect that's why the main brake lights burn out but the third brake light keeps working. There's also the issue that replaceable bulbs might get loose in the socket, or the socket corrodes, while non-replaceable LEDs everything is soldered in place, avoiding this issue.
@@quillmaurer6563 led lights run at a much cooler temp.. hence why h.i.d's I think are getting phased out unless you have an older vehicle with glass and not plastic lights... Also kinda sounds like a one hand washes the other... 🤔
@@jdmandsuch6739 LEDs really make total sense for many reasons - run cooler, last longer, come on quicker, use less power, brighter. I've converted basically all (excluding a couple gauge lights) of the lights on my classic Beetle to LED, isn't even all that expensive.
While it's just a single line in here, it's one of those things that give the wrong impression along the same lines as European folk having a problem with American cars with red/combined stop/turn signals instead of separate amber ones. The high mount provides better visibility, which is good,but this video suggests the popular misconception that people confuse braking and turning without a unique light just for braking. In reality, the worst case scenario from lack of high mount or amber turn signals and only seeing a red tail light come on is that a driver behind you slows down when they might not actually have to. Now can we talk about how it's 2022 and people still don't know their tail lights are not turned on? Between running lights that light up the road ahead and modern/digital dashes today that are always illuminated, idiots need a "your lights are not turned on" warning.
I actually agree with you on that and I think it should be mandatory that all new vehicles should have automatic headlights when ever it gets dark or the wipers are on. If GM can do it like in my Chevy it can be done across the board.
@@mikeske9777 there’s no technical reason not to. My 95 town car had automatic lights. It takes a 15 cent part and the computer the car already has. I’d settle for a message on the dash that says “lights are off” as from what I can tell the issue is caused because you no longer need to turn on your lights to see your instrument cluster at night. On the side, I generally like the fact my lights turn on automatically when the wipers are on, but paradoxically there is no way to turn them off, so I can’t flash my headlights at idiots driving with no lights on when my wipers are on.
@@xmanhoe I mean, yes, and most modern cars do just that to warn drivers of other problems, however it could get really annoying if you have your lights off on purpose. With pretty much all cars today having screens of some sort in the dash, you can display any message you want. The cluster flash would just be part of the normal programing that happens under any warning, flashing once or twice, then returning to normal operation. Since a cluster flash is already understood as 'check for warnings' it doesn't seem like a good idea to try to repurpose it as 'turn on headlights'
They have issues with it, because it's a stupid design decision. Also, why don't all cars come with daytime running lights while we're at it? It's incredibly hard to judge the distance of white and grey cars without their headlights on.
At night, I feel the changing pattern of light makes the brake light more obvious and noticeable. Some of the brake lights by one manufacturer in the 1960's relied on reflected light only and were pretty lame. You should do a video on collapsible steering columns. They came out in the 1960's an were a big safety improvement. I was at a car show and there was a Crosely (I think). The steering column was a straight shaft pretty much to the front bumper. A cute car, but in a front end collision that would be fatal.
I remember when this happened. I was a teenage driver. We bought a 1985 Dodge Omni, and a few months after getting it the 1986 models began hitting the road. It was neat seeing the numbers of rear brake light cars gradually increase on the road.
@@automation7295 You missed the point of his comment so badly I wonder if you're just randomly spamming. My local classic rock station actually mocks the same thing in one of their bumpers: "Welcome to nashville, where the lightning bugs use their blinkers more than the drivers".
There were a lot of American cars in Finland in early nineties. You had to disable third brake light from those to pass yearly registration check. Just removing the bulb was not enough, you had to remove wires, paint it black or otherwise make it much harder to get working again. And couple of years later those brake lights were mandatory. I'm not 100% sure, but I think you had to install third brake light also to older vehicles, as there were diy sets to glue on a rear window and just about every car suddenly had them on.
Talk about dumb. It shouldn’t have mattered to have an extra safety feature. “I’m sorry, Sir, you’ve failed the inspection because your bumper is too large.”
man i really love your videos! i prefer them because you explain information well in a digestible way. i have an interest in automotives for a long time now, but couldnt develop it much because other videos ive watched don't hold my retention for long. Thank you very much! :D ps: i also appreciate your old car reviews, i love them bc i prefer the aesthetics (current cars looks like soaps, like yea sure aerodynamics)
A VW Jetta that I had as a rental in 2006 had the three-flash lane change mode when you bumped the turn signal stalk. I am unsure if VW was actually the first, or what year it first appeared in the Jetta, but I do know they had it long before Ford. Just an FYI.
Yeah. I've seen cars from the early 2000s with this feature. And it was not only limited to luxury cars. My 2002 Opel Vectra had this exact feature. I'm sure he got it wrong.
Mercedes had it in early 2000s, maybe even earlier. I know the facelift w210 e-class that came for MY 2000 has both tripple flash and the side turn signals mounted on the mirrors
The reason for the High level/3rd Brake light in Europe was so not just the following vehicle could see you were braking, but others further back. In Europe the turn signal as you call it (indicators) on the rear of a vehicle are amber, so can’t be mistaken for brake lights.
I had an 85 Ford Aerostar and later a 94 that had the european type turn signals. Our 1930 Model A came from the factory with only a single brake light. I really don’t like driving the A at dusk.
@Phillip Banes I know Europe isn’t a country, Volvo which is a European car Manufacturer started the third brake light as a safety idea, just as they pioneered other safety ideas.
Thank you so much for this informative video. Infact Center High Mount (ESL) Emergency Stop Lamp always fascinates me to the point that I keep a close eye to it's operational state in all the Cars I currently own 😆 The taxi cab experiment was infact a breakthrough achievement in order to bring another safety marvel to the automotive world where adapting precautionary measures in response to variable driving conditions is a compulsion for everyone. ❤️ It's really impressive to see how automotive technology has evolved over the course of decades and we are optimistic to see further advancement in the future. Cheers. 👍
Can you please also make a video explaining why some American cars have red rear turn signals instead of amber? I’ve done some research but couldn’t find any definitive answers. Thanks.
I've notice with the addition of the third stop light, size of the taillights have gotten smaller. For example my fusion has two bulbs for the taillights, my 77 versailles has 6 bulbs and the lens are of course much larger.
Thank you for this history lesson. I've always wondered the history of the third brake light. It's funny when vehicles that were designed from a different era that later implemented the required third brake light. Some vehicles got clever and integrated it into the design but other vehicles that were riding on a 10 year old design instead just tacked it in the rear window or on top of the trunk. It makes it look like an afterthought. One good example is the 1971-1989 Mercedes-Benz SL. 1971-1985 received no third brake light but then in 1986 it was required so they just simply tacked it on top of the trunk. Very minimal thought was put into the location. That wasn't until the redesign for 1990. Also, American cars such as the Cadillac Deville, Chevy Caprice, Ford LTD Crown Vic, Dodge Diplomat, etc. were originally designed in the 70s that carried over well into the 80s and when the third brake light requirement was enacted, all they did was simply tack it in the rear window which was the only differentiator between older and newer models. I would say the 1990s was officially when cars started implementing the third brake light into their design since cars were drastically redesigned to implement these new safety requirements.
In the early 1970's, the "Oldsmobile Toronado" was already factory-equipped with dual high-mounted brake lights/turn signals just below the huge rear window. Still remember seeing aftermarket self-adhesive plastic ones available for sale in automotive stores, so any car can look like a "high end" luxury car... 🚗
"In 2011, Ford pioneered the three-flash turn signal..." Even though my 2003 Mercedes C240 sedan and 2005 C230 coupe had three-flash turn signals. Pioneered? Perhaps not.
I remember when they installed those 3rd brake lights on those taxis in San Francisco back the mid-70's. Local TV news did a story about it, they did call it a safety trial probably because of the high rate of rear end accidents with taxis. Some would blink when the brakes were applied, others would just stay on. I never known the history of the 3rd brake light started there. Thanks for a little tibit of auto history.
My father put on the trunk of my mother’s 1985 with a 3rd brake light. It was a cheap plastic around the light. I remembered seeing the 3rd brake light in 1986 on a lot of cars back then. I even drove a 1986 Ford Tempo in driver’s education in high school during the 1st semester of my junior year. All of my vehicles had that 3rd brake light from the late 90’s on my first car to the present. It is so common to see it now these days.
That is of course a U.S. perspective on the third brake light. I owned a 1997 Fiat Punto in the U.K. which didn’t have a third brake light at that time, but part of its distinctive styling was high level tail lights in the C pillars, something I first saw on the Volvo 850 station wagon which also had tail lights high in the C pillars. The video suggests the reason for the centre high level brake light was because the regular tail lights used multi filament bulbs to light the car at night, brake and indicate a turn, all in the same light cluster. I believe it is now illegal for a car manufactured in the USA and imported for sale in the U.K. to have that feature, they have to have amber rear turn signals like European cars, but American servicemen based in the U.K. that drive vehicles that came here with the military and which still operate on United States license plates are exempt from this. I have also seen classic American cars registered in the U.K. with altered rear turn signals - usually the reversing lights have been adapted to flash amber. I’m not sure if that is a legal requirement or something done to make the intention to turn more obvious for U.K. drivers used to seeing amber turn signals. This was not always the case. When I was young there was something mildly fascinating about seeing a large American car from the 50s or 60s and watching the red tail lights flash red to signal a turn. However in the mid 1980s, by which time I was a licensed driver, I realised the disadvantage of this system while walking the dog near to home. A 1970s Camaro came past me slowly and as it approached a T junction the driver began to indicate his intention to turn right. The whole right rear light cluster began to flash on and off, but as the driver approached the junction he began to repeatedly dab the brakes, meaning the left lamp cluster began to flash on and off too! For the duration of the ‘on-off’ application of the brakes, the impressive light show gave no clear indication of which way the car was going to turn! So if the third brake light was intended to be a method of clarifying which red stop light was indicating a turn, which is what I interpreted from the video, in Europe that wasn’t necessary because we’ve had amber turn signals for years that are separated from the red stop and tail lights. What developed in the U.K. from the early 1930s were the semaphore turn signal, the little illuminated amber arm that popper out horizontally to signal a turn, usually mounted on the B pillar, and in some cars these were fitted as late as the early 50s. I do seem to remember as a child some of this type of car (the Morris Minor for example) having the small red tail light flashing as a turn signal as per an American car - I think this was a conversion done to eliminate the semaphore signal. It was also legal at one time to combine the front turn signal with the front white side light (parking light? running light?) so at night that would flash with a dual intensity. However I think pretty much by the mid sixties every car on the U.K. market had dedicated amber front and rear turn signals. Returning to the third brake light, my 1997 Fiat Punto did not have one, but my 1999 Mercedes C200 did - in the back window, like a lot of 80s American cars had. Added to the rear shelf, as the Mercedes-Benz C Class was not originally designed to have a third brake light. I believed at the time that this was a progression of the high level tail lights I’d seen on the Volvo 850 station wagon and Fiat Punto, and somewhere I read an account where it said this ‘new’ feature enabled following drivers to see cars ahead beginning to brake by being able to see the high level brake light through the glass of the car you were following. I’m not sure how many drivers are actually that alert...anyway the third brakes light’s widespread adoption was probably as much to do with European and Japanese cars having to comply with U.S. regulations if they were sold there, as it was a safety feature elsewhere. Of course I’m used to them now but early on, if I was stuck in traffic at night with somebody holding their car on the foot brake in front of me, I hated the third brake light as it was right in my face blinding me! Now of course, ALL the lights are LEDs, twice as bright as filament bulbs used to be, so ALL the lights are blindingly bright....progress often comes at a cost. Personally I think some VW-Audi cars have got the unnecessarily brightest rear lamps that dazzle at night, in the car industry.
You're not theonly one blinded by modern lighting in cars. I have taken toi putting my sunglasses on after dark when I'm in traffic because modern lighting is way too bright. I say we just get rid of this LED bullshit entirely and go back to 1157 bulbs in marker/tail/stop lights and halogens for head lights. It will make cars less ugly during the day as these technologies will force some of the 'angle grinder to the eyeballs please' styling away, and at night they won't blind the fucking piss out of everyone. Or hell even in the daytime it can be blinding! Perhaps it's because I'm just adapted to it due to people never using them, but I've learned how to derive people's intentions from context well enough that IDGAF if the blinker and tail/stop are the same bulb. It's fine. I know they're stopping and a quick glance at what's nearby will usually clue me into why they're stopping. People love to make a big deal about it but it really *isn't* a big deal.
Cool comparing the FB to the FC since I like those cars... Even in the same generation/body style cars, model year 1985 versus 1986 is an interesting comparison to see it on the 86 models but not on the 85. Case in point is the 1st gen MR2 aka AW11. (By 1989, the final year, they integrated it into the rear spoiler and it was LED; but from 86 to 88, it was this ugly tacked on thing that didn't require changing anything to the body/spoiler, so purely meant to satisfy the law).
That's the problem with the government mandate stuff like 3rd brake light during production run, they're usually tacked on cars originally started production in the 1970's or early 1980's. 1986 Buick Regal GNX and many other 1986 model year have 3rd brake light tacked on because they didn't had other spots for them, they also couldn't integrate them neatly.
I own a 1987 MR2, so I know exactly what you mean. I also own a 1987 Nissan 300ZX and quite impressed with it has a stock modern LED 3rd brake light (even though the ‘86 model year had a single filament 3rd brake light).
@@automation7295 We we’re impressed with LED brake lights in 1987 as they were finally bright enough for that application. Until then, LEDs were very dim (easily washed out in sunlight) and relatively expensive. LEDs were primarily used as indicators on appliances, stereo equipment, and other applications that didn’t need much lumens. It took another 20 years for LEDs to be bright and durable enough to used as low beam headlights on the 2006 Lexus LS460. Several more years until a high beam LED headlight was first introduced on the Audi R8. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haitz%27s_law
So, after it was confirmed that the third brake light reduced accidents and repair costs due to fewer collisions, we all saw appropriate reductions in our car insurance premiums, right? (Let that sink in as to just how truly effective it really must have been.)
Insurance isn’t going down $ meanwhile safety crash avoiding systems are standard in most cars let that sink in. Also having liability why is my premium high when I add a new car compared to old ? Don’t you think it should cost the same ?
@@Viggggggr Yes, they have become standard in new cars, as have many other "safety" features. Yet we still keep paying more for insurance accident premiums as we're told those are becoming fewer in number. A lot of what we're told has sunk in ... and I ain't buying it. Highway deaths are on the rise with 2020 being one of the highest on record. We're being sold a false bill of goods.
Amazing that a huge government agency that was implemented specifically to increase road safety (and that we citizens pay for), didn’t come up with this concept - a private citizen did. Just a note for you folks that think if the government throws money at a problem, it’ll get fixed. #freemarket4ever
A private citizen developed the idea, but without a mandate, the car companies wouldn't have added them. It was not obvious even to consumers that these were needed.
I was behind a car in the early 70's that had a little traffic signal mounted high in the back window. When he was on the gas, the green light was on. When he was on the brake, the red light was on. When he was coasting, the yellow light was on. Greatest thing I ever saw to this day. The yellow was a major help, because you could lift as soon as you saw it, not having to notice his deceleration first. It took me a few minutes to figure out what was going on, having never seen anything like it before or since. Don't know if it was custom built or an accessory, but you can believe I combed through my next JC Whitney catalog looking for one!
I've been wondering about this detail for a long time now and the main conclusion I came to was when you're running lights are on it's easier to tell at night when someone is hitting the brakes by a third light turning on that was not originally on. So 2 main lights get brighter, but incase you didn't notice the brightness change, they added the 3rd light that's off by default
My 1986 supra has a third brake light and it almost kinda looks like a retrofit even though it's factory which is cool cause none of the other models had them to my knowledge. When mk2 supra production stopped in 1985 because of the release of the mk3, there was a delay in its release so they decided to do a re-release of the mk2 but mixed both the L and P types together into one car and added the third brake light. It only lasted half a year before the mk3 was released and that's why when you're looking for service/repair manuals, they'll often say 1986.5 and I think that's pretty fun
I had an 85 Pontiac 6000LE, it came with the third brakelight from the factory. It took some getting used to, always showing up in the windshield rearview mirror looking like someone was tailgating you. It's kind of a good addition for cars, as most days I'll see a car in traffic that has only that brake light functioning.
I remember in Australia, the only factory fitted 3rd brake light was on Volvos. But you could start buying aftermarket ones to retrofit it. I don’t know how I managed to install mine but I did. I think manufacturers ended up including them before they were actually mandated.
My dad worked for a dealer so I don't remember the car, but one of the demos he drove had a third taillight that looked like it was tacked on at the dealership to retrofit it before sale. Wish I could remember more.
I remember the super-low in-the-bumper taillights lights in the 1971-'73 Dodge Coronet that were increased in size for '74 but remained in the bumpers when the Coronet was renamed _Monaco_ for '77-'78. Also, Olds Toronado added extra turn signal lights under the rear windows in he early '70s. The '38 _Spirit of Motion_ ("Sharknose") Grahams had the main taillights mounted in housings below and at the outer corners of the rear windows. The late-forties Lincoln Continental models had taillights mounted low on the rear fenders, but those did not include the brake light function. The only brake lights were center-mounted high on the trunk lid. Chrysler-made cars (Chrysler, Dodge, DeSoto, Plymouth in the late forties had CHMSLs in addition to the taillight brake lights. Studebaker and others catalogued a "WIG WAG" brake light accessory, a motorized housing that moved the single brake light side-to-side in an arc under the left-side-mounted license plate. There are probably dozens of other examples out there.
I was working for CSAA (AAA) and we were installing 3rd brake lights on our company cars as part of the test program. We also installed relays to the headlight system that turned on the low beams (at a slightly reduced brightness) when the car was started. This resulted in the Daylight Running lights being implemented by some car manufactures in America in 1995.
I was constantly getting cut off in my little car so I started driving with my headlights on during the day before daytime running lights were introduced, and it greatly reduced how often traffic pulled out in front of me. I then started using my bright beams during the day, and it reduced it even more. Even now I still drive with my headlights on instead of just the daytime running lights. The brighter beam makes the car more prominent and appear closer. Try it for yourself.
Northern California had lots of rural highways which were Headlights required day and night, like CA-12 through most of the delta. When Canada mandated DRL head on collisions went down considerably.
I lived this one tangentially. In the years after 1986, aftermarket 3rd brake lights were pretty popular and my father sold and installed thousands of them in 1987. We had boxes and boxes of them in our house.
Also semaphore indicators. Those of particular curiosity are the ones fitted on early French buses. The semaphore arm was long and would wave up and down when in use. When these were replaced a number of bulbs in a vertical row attempted to replicate the waving effect.
About 22 years ago, a colleague of mine did a study on brake lights, specifically looking at rear-end crash rates for vehicles based on if the brake and rear indicator lights are combined vs. separate. (That's to say: at night, the outer brake lights are either off or on, not dim or on.) I don't remember how big the crash rate difference was, but it was statistically significant. And yet, here we are, 22 years later and a lot of cars still have combined brake and indicator lights. (That's not even getting into the issue of vehicles that still have combined brake and turn signals.)
In the early/mid 80s, Dad had an '84 Cutlass Ciera, and bought a new '87 one. When the '84 got transferred to my Mom, they got and installed an aftermarket high-mount brake light that installed on the rear shelf up against the glass, more or less in the same position most of the early factory installed ones were in as they were basically retrofitted into the current production cars, sedans at least, before the makers had the time to redesign around the new requirement.
When I was 12 my mom bought a new 1986 Plymouth Horizon. The third brake light was a wart on the hatch at the base of the rear window, the only way you could tell it was a factory installation was that the housing was painted body color. It also had a rear wiper with a separate washer-fluid tank at the back of the car, convenient since the front washer tank was an even 3 liters and it was easy to put the rest of the gallon in the back one.
yup, I've had many Pontiac Fiero's, from their 1st year in 1984 to their last in '88. I personally had a '84,'85, & now still '87 GT. and I remember that clearly, from no 3rd, to suddenly having one, and it never looked right on a Fiero. but you know, safety... I had a mod on mine for a while where I killed the factory 3rd, and replaced it with a caddy sts long led bar 3rd along the top of the rear window. that was slick. ahh the memories... :) I even noticed in your clips I seen you in a fiero for a moment.!
I remember semaphore arm turn signals mounted on the B pilar of 1930s British cars. Also had a brake light. Dad had a 1936 Wolsey 18HP. Blinkers only came in the 1950s
When I was in high school (1986) I added a third brake light to my 1969 Firebird. Made back the purchase price in one month since the insurance premium went down.
I remember this being a new thing. "Center High Mount Stop Lamp (CHMSL)" I remember rattling off this acronym at people. lol I always thought they were a great idea. I've added extra tail/brake lights to many vehicles I've owned. It makes it easier to "read" traffic, now that I can see the brake light of the car in front of the one I'm following.
Prior to mandate by law, the additional break lights were also tested in New York city where I saw them on livery cabs everywhere. They all had these two additional lights mounted behind the rear window. It was done in a hap-hazard way where the wires were hanging out. They were definitely mounted temporarily. You just know it was a test progrmam.
If I'm not mistaken, the third brake light is higher so that it might be visible throught the windows of the vehicle behind it so divers two or more cars back can have some indication of what traffic ahead is doing.
The first production american car yo have high mounted brake lamps was the 1971 Oldsmobile Tornado, they were mounted on each side, forward edge of the trunk lid. I thought they were soo cool as a kid growing up.
I remember those. My 70 Thunderbird shows them I the brochure but, never made it to production. These were located inside the rear window mounted vertically on the outer edges.
The 3 flash lane change indicator was out well before 2011 I can remember it on an 06 Vectra my dad used to own. I even have a 2010 Scirocco with that function
I was in a thrift shop once and I saw a center brake light kit still the Box center for people that wanted to add them to their cars that didn't originally come with them.
I remember being a kid when the Chevy Lumina minivans came out, they had brake lights at the top of the rear corners. I've only seen that done on a couple of other cars since then, like the Kia Soul.
In 1979 at a big rig manufacturing company in Nashville Tennessee called Matlock Trailer Corp. A man on the assembly line used to make and 3rd brake lights that flashed when you applied the brake to it. He showed it to several car companies(Ford, Chevrolet, Datsun) that told him it was a dumb idea.....My dad worked there and brought one home and installed it to our Maveric when I was 7 years old.
There was a time when vehicles only had a single rear position/brake light usually fitted to the centre or the rear end. Another reason why cars were required to fit a third light was so if one or both of the side lights failed, you'd still have a brake warning light
CARS WERE BETTER IN THE 80’s STICKER NOW AVAILABLE!
www.zackpradel.com/product-page/cars-were-better-in-the-80-s-sticker
Better than what? I think you got the wrong decade son, try the '60's.
@@richardrice8076 yea 80s were a pretty BAD decade for american cars
@@ghostrider-be9ek the malaise era
@Shooting Cars, you forgot to mention why turn signals became orange instead of the regular red that was used alongside the red brake
@@battosaijenkins946 why?, because most cars still don't have orange turn signals.
I wasn't even of driving age yet, but I remember when the Center High Mount Stop Lamp (CHMSL) became mandatory on cars in 1986. At the time, it seemed like a gimmick and some people speculated that any reduction in rear end crashes was due to the novelty/newness of the 3rd brake light. I recall some cars didn't get them until a bit later (Accord hatchback comes to mind, no idea how some cars got exempt). Now we have modules that can make the center brake light flash a few times to get driver's attention because we've become so used to them.
I actually reached driving age on December 30, 1985 so I must be a bit older than you.
I reached driving age about the same time they were introduced.
@@erictaylor5462 I remember it too, but I didn't get my full driver license with no restrictions until almost a year after you did, on October 13, 1986. Prior to that, at 16, I had a license that stated that I must have a parent or legal guardian in the front seat, and they had to have a valid driver license. They also had to have their wits about them, so playing the designated driver card was out. The next year, at 17, if there were no infractions, it was upgraded to anyone over 18 with a valid license in the front seat with me, and finally, at 18 years old, that's when we were finally able to drive alone, as long as we were able to pass a final driving test at the DPS. The next year, in 1987, my Dad was finally able to buy his first almost new car, a 1986 Chevrolet Celebrity wagon, which was our first car with a high mount stop light. He bought it for Mum so she had room to do her Avon deliveries, he kept his 1977 Chrysler Newport 2-dr hardtop, and I inherited the 1982 Plymouth Gran Fury Police Interceptor.
Funny thing about those high mount stop lights, and I just found out about this the hard way a few months ago, they're only effective if the person coming up behind you at 35 MpH while you're sitting at a stop light, is paying attention. Mine worked, as did both of the ones in the tail light housings. This guy missed all four red lights right in front of him; the three on my car, and the fourth one hanging from a cable around 13 - 14 ft in the air.
You know that is a good question, because even cars like the Lincoln Town Car which looked straight out of the 1970s, still put them in for their 1986 model year
@@sped6954 That's the thing huh? People paying attention to their driving. Unfortunately these days, people pay more attention to the smartphone.
Usually old models get grandfathered in for things like this. Like, if the 85 and 86 models are identical they wouldn't need to add the light. At least, that's what I suspect.
DOT: "Safety #1"
Also DOT: "Red turn signal light shared with brake light is okay with us."
As usual, government entities being nonsensical.
Meanwhile, rest of the world: "Amber turn signals separated from the main light"
The best part is it's not legal to put Euro-spec taillights on your car in the US.
For the uninitiated: czcams.com/video/O1lZ9n2bxWA/video.html
we had amber for a while then the idiots went back to red for turn signals
We have some US imports here in the EU. And still can't get used to those lights. When the US cars are sold by a dealer they have the amber lights.
In heavy traffic, I use the third brake light of the second car ahead of me to start braking when a slowdown occurs. I can often see it through the car ahead of me.
I look far enough up the road to not need it at all. I identify traffic jams half a mile before I'm close enough to need to take any action because of them and 99.975% of the time am able to slow down for them without touching the brake at all.
Look more than ten feet past your hood and you won't need those lights. Also stop tailgating.
@@TestECull Tbf there is a problem with the car in front of you also tailgating and will only slam break when it's close, and sadly this rather not too uncommon. Some of these tailgater somehow can control their speed of the car to creep in behind another car enough not to make a collision. It gives false sense of security that the traffic in front still moving until the red tailight lits up then only will do a complete stop.
But yeah, still best advise is to keep a safe distance and don't tail gate. Which helps to prevent collision to the vehicle in front that may be doing tailgating.
@@TestECull I look far enough up ahead to predict when a traffic jam is about to happen and steer off to a different road in the nick of time. I never need to slow down to traffic, because by the time it happens, I am either on another road or stopped by a predictive lack of acceleration. I use a very tall periscope to see 10 football fields ahead of me.
@@kornkernel2232 I'm already lifting well in advance and that is part of why. Most days I can whoa up for a jam on engine braking alone.
@@TestECull he said in heavy traffic I'm pretty sure that means bumper to bumper or close to it.
I remember when this 3rd break light was introduced. In fact, it happened the year I got my driver's license (I actually got it December 30, 1985, but it was so close to 1986...)
I very much remember thinking what a great idea it was, because it made it much easier to see when someone was stopping.
I remember when they started appearing as an aftermarket modification in the beginning of the 90s here in Hungary.
They were illegal for a period of time, because "unsafe modification".
Am I the only motherfucker in this entire country that doesn't need a 3rd brake light on the car in front of them to tell that car is stopping or something?! Or indeed any brake lights at all? It seems like such a simple concept: 'solid object approach --> reduce speed until it isn't approaching anymore'.
*brake
It has nothing to do with enhanced visibility; it was implemented as a backup to a burnt out brake light bulb, that's it.
American problems.
I've always said that the 3rd brake light was one of the best ever CHEAP safety features added to cars. Young people just take it for granted that they've always been there and don't even think about it. But for those of us who are much older, we drove many cars without that 3rd brake light.
Maybe if turn signals were the right colour you wouldn't need them
@@Shadow79XXX not tryna say that the third or same lights are bad, but with how common powerful LED lights are, it's really hard to differentiate like the light just active or the brakes initiated without having the third one to double check that it's active
I remember when I was a kid we had a Ford Granada at the time these became popular and my dad bought a kit at the flea market that mounted on the back window and ran wires in the trunk to the brake lights to add a third brake light.
Maybe boomers struggle to see a light turn on, I personally don't. Every time I'm behind a truck with a burned out 3rd brake light, I'm able to recognize when they're braking.
@@Shadow79XXX that comment makes no sense.
Third brake lights are also mandatory in the EU where turn signals are the right color.
I remember that before the third brake light became standard, kits of brake lights to mount under the roof behind the rear window were kind of popular in Europe.
One argument not mentioned in this video: They are easier to see not just by the vehicle directly behind, but further behind as well, helping to avoid mass collisions in dense traffic, which became a problem in that era because many drivers didn't keep enough safety distance.
From 1938 to 1983 Germany (and probably other countries) allowed yellow brake lights. Interestingly the third brake light is still not required by German law. It is installed as a standard in new vehicles however, to be legal in all countries.
This reminds me, vaguely, of the mid 70s to early 80s G. M. cars that didn't just not have a 3rd light, *but had the only 2 lights in the bumper.* As someone born in 1991 who never saw those cars in their prime years, that's the stupidest place I can think of to put tail lights.
@@101Volts It was dumb to put brake lights in the bumpers. If the bumper got tweaked, the brake lights would Crack and you couldn't easily fit a new brake light in there. Some cars also had front turn signals in the bumper, too.
that's incorrect, the third braking light has been required on newly registered cars in the EU since 1998. The requirement is not explicitly codified in German law - but it doesn't have to be as EU regulations apply automatically.
I remember working on cars in Germany in the early 80s (I moved to the UK in 82) that had these kits, often a pair of brake lights mounted on vertical bars that fitted inside, in the back window. They were made by Hella so far as I remember, and the rationale was that they could be seen through the windows of several cars, giving advanced warning of a car up front braking. Later, single-light kits started to appear and then it became standard fitting.
@@PedroConejo1939 yes, single third brake-lights were originally not allowed. Until some time in the 1990s, braking lights were only allowed in pairs. Hence these pairs of what used to be called "Pufflampen" or "Rentnerleuchten" (brothel lamps / pensioner's lights).
They are actually still street legal in old cars that don't have the third brake light yet. Although they are less than ideal for a variety of reasons. For once, because the lights were in the inside of the car, behind the rear window, they would cause severe glare if they were mounted incorrectly, or when the window was fogged.
I was a automotive mechanic from the mid 1970's and remember when they came out. They used to sell retrofit kits for cars back then that could be installed in the back package shelf of sedans. I know I could install a retrofit kit with a template for lights either drill holes or if it positioned correctly with a punch in a matter of a half hour. String the wire to the brake light wires I strip a small section the brake light wire on the car and fit the small control box for the 3rd brake light so it would not blink with the turn signal and then solder the wire connection and tape it up. Then position the brake light control on the outside of the trunk support and then secure the wiring. I made good money for a couple years from the folks who retrofitted their cars with those third brake lights. I also did it to my older car just for the safety aspect of it all.
I had a 1982 Dodge Aries sedan when the 3rd brake light became required, and I also added a 3rd light kit to the center of the rear package shelf. I think I bought the kit from J.C. Whitney. The light housing came with a soft black plastic lip that wrapped around the edge where it met the windshield, and it was easy to cut it to try to match the angle of the glass surface. If you did it well, then all of the light would reflect out the back window, and look like a factory option. I had another car with dedicated rear turn signal bulbs, and so for that car, you did not need the control box.
My grandma bought a 1983 lesabre that was retrofitted. It would flash when the 4 way flashers were activated.
I remember when those kits came out in Australia. The ones we had just mounted on the rear windscreen with suction cups.
I made my own version for my classic Beetle, 3D printed the housing. Especially with how low the tail lights are, and how high most vehicles (SUVs/crossovers) are these days, I think it's better to have something in drivers line of sight. Some purists, like "My Pronoun is WTF" here, complain that it's not stock or original, but I figure regardless of looks if it has a 1% chance of preventing my car - which I actually use as a regular vehicle - being rear-ended, it's totally worth it.
Nobody cares boomer
3rd brake lights were made mandatory about the late 90's in Europe (in france it was in '97)
my Peugeot 205s didn't have them, and i had to source tailgates from latest models after 97 so i could have 3rd brake lights on them
was it made mandatory also for older vehicles because my car is from 1990 and doesn't have a 3rd brakelight and it doesn't matter for cars build before it was made mandatory
@@robingoessler4628 no, it's not mandatory for elder vehicles. It's just safer so I'd do the mod if it can be done well enough to not stick out oddly
@@robingoessler4628 My 01 Puma has a 3rd brake light but the 2000 Puma didn't have it yet.
I thought the 3rd brake light became mandatory in North America for either 1985 or 1986 models.
@Frank De Ruiter this is quite interesting, and very traditionalist Dutch behaviour of course ;)
I do inspections on vehicles and sometimes when peoples 3rd brake lights are out they want to argue on why they need the 3rd one. This video will be a good pointer to show them why we need them.
There are actually two advantages:
1) As mentioned in the video, the third brake light is more prominent than the other two (which are in the same clutter with rear lights).
2) A brake light installed high enough (i.e., above or on the top part of the rear window) can be seen "through" the car behind it. Thus there is more reaction time (you can start braking at the same time as the driver in front of you). In this respect I do not understand why in some models the third brake light is positioned on the rear spoiler (convertibles have an excuse).
A while back I would of been one those arguing with you, not because I felt like it wasn't necessary, but because the TBL is part of the rear wing and it is discontinued and I couldn't find another one. But I ended up buying a couple led strips and adapting them to the original housing.
@Bad Drivers of AZ & NV Because you can't just cut a spot out for it in the tint? Or because some people will just be stupid and cover it without thinking? Much like they cover the other two lights with tint.
Failing to have one when you get rear ended could potentially let the driver running into the back shift some liability to the driver they ran into in states with tailgating laws.
@Bad Drivers of AZ & NV Or some random object block it entirely.
1:28 In 1914 Florence Lawrence developed an early version of the vehicle turn signal we use today. Not the man you mention 14 years later. She developed a mechanical signalling arm that at a press of a button, raised or lowered a flag on the car’s rear bumper that told other drivers which way the car was going to turn. At the time, turn signals, brake lights and windscreen wipers were not part of many or any motor vehicle's offering.
Not only did Lawrence create this indicating signalling system, but she also built a brake signal that when the brake pedal was pushed, a STOP sign flipped up from the car’s rear bumper. A standard and expected feature in today’s vehicles but at the time, these were truly unique and groundbreaking.
Some early cars had "semaphore" turn signals that popped out of the B pillar, sort of like what you describe, though they were also lit (and I assume flash). Early VW Beetles had them, though they switched to conventional front/rear flashing lights fairly early on - surely cheaper and more reliable. Ones with the semaphores are now very rare and revered by enthusiasts.
@@quillmaurer6563 The 'trafficator', as you described, was very popular on cars in the UK during the 40s and 50s.
ok, but this video is specifically about lights
@@mcn1583 technicalities, but it would be like saying someone invented the first gasoline powered car without crediting the person who invented the first petroleum powered car, because is ran on distilled ligroin, versus the type of refined petrol we use today.
Could you do a documentary on the bench seat?
I remember being a little kid in the 80's and I knew the cars were new if they had the 3rd brake light. Made sense to me as a kid. Especially when there were still 60's and 70's cars running around with one brake light not working, or one tail light is twice as bright as the other one. Sometimes you had to second guess if the car was stopping or turning
I remember being about 6 at the time and demanding that the car we got have a 3rd tail light because it looked so cool. By that point, it was the only legal option other than a used car.
So you spent time while driving, focusing on cars that had electrical issues or tail light lumen issies, so you could "second guess" what you had predicted or hoped they would do.
Wow, it's a good thing you typed your comment so you could feel momentarily validated.
@@gavinvalentino6002 You're miserable. Go find some help.
@@gavinvalentino6002 gurl are you illiterate??
I still remember my great grandpa telling me stories about when he first got turn signals and everyone in town would stare at his truck because he didn't have to open the window to turn.
His truck didn't come with turn signals, he just made his own
I'd love to see a short-form like this that documents the colors used for turn signals, much like Alec did on Technology Connections, just because of how terrible they are. The more people made aware of how bad they are, the better.
Here's an interesting thought: You are traveling an unfamiliar area late at night on a back country "primitive" road. It's pitch black around you but when you checked the google map earlier you know that this area has roads with steep drop-offs on either side and rather narrow roads. It's raining heavily and you see two flashing amber lights ahead of you not moving but nothing else. Which side of the two lights do you move toward to pass it?
@@transtubular you should already be traveling slowly under such conditions (and sketchiness), so reduce speed further, approach cautiously while staying in the middle of the road (you are legally allowed to straddle the line if conditions are hazardous enough to warrant it) and only after you have made a positive identification of what the thing is with flashing amber lights should you determine your course of action. it could be a trailer that's stretched across the majority of the road, preventing travel on either side.
@@transtubular that event is not common enough to justify having the turn signal share the same lights as the brakes. What is very common is taking a few seconds to realize if someone is braking or signaling. Even worse if one light is out. In driving, every second counts. We should be able to instantly determine if the driver in front is braking or signaling.
Brake and tail lights have the perfect color, red, it signals for danger, and isnt blinding like blue or green, just like traffic lights. Red is to stop, and amber is like a warning, turn signals are technically a warning that informs the other drivers of your next move, it cant be flashing red cause it will cause confusion with the brake lights, and it has to be flashing for the same reasons. In my country turn signals have to be amber, sometimes we see a car with broken taillight glass and both lamps are white. It's confusing for a second to tell wether the car is braking, turning or even reversing cause those are white
@@transtubular You found one hypothetical situation possibly favoring red turn signals, out of 99+% that would favor amber. And in your situation most likely the red tail lights or (less bright) amber running lights would be on too, if they aren't I'd blame that on the other vehicle's driver, not that it has amber turn signals. As others say here, in that situation you should be driving so slowly that you can see what's going on.
To be honest, there’s been many a time I’ve been driving in traffic and an older vehicle begins braking without that third brake light, and I don’t notice immediately. I got my licence in 2013, well after their introduction though. I’d still say they’re super effective, especially in reducing ambiguity. Now for us North Americans to recognise how effective amber turn indicators are as opposed to our red does all situation.
What scares me most about being on the road is we have so many dipshits that need a third brake light to realize the car in front of them is slowing down in the first place.....
we had amber turn signals then went back to red i had amber on a 77 chevette
Amber turn signals are great in the city, but are terrible in the country. You end up half blinded by the turn signal of a guy in front of you.
@@TestECull
The fucking thing is part of the brake light system, why be a smart ass?
@@AB-ou8ve Because I'm sick and tired of society coddling dumbasses. If someone can't tell they need to stop their car to avoid a crash seeing two brake lights the correct thing to do is yank their license until they can prove they dont need the third brake light anymore.
I first saw a high center brake light sold as an accessory in parts stores. The reason they worked, according to the literature, was that they could be seen through the greenhouse of the next car, giving the driver behind that one more time to react. Made sense, like stick-on blind spot mirrors.
This how I remember them be sold in the 80s - you can see when car in front of car in front it braking.
Unless there is a big truck right in front of you.
Great video. I love lighting, automotive lighting included. Do you watch Technology Connections? He has some great videos on turn signals.
In ECE markets, the third brake light is allowed to be off-center. USDOT requires it to be centered. If you look at some Euro-style vans with barn doors like the Transit Connect, you can see where the Euro light would go but they had to stick the light on the roof for it to be centered. Most cars do have the center light higher, but the GM Dustbuster vans got away with having it lower, just above the license plate while the main lights were alongside the back window.
Until the 1960s, front parking lights were not required to be on when the headlights are on. The '65 Mustang you showed is like that. The problem is that if a headlight burns out, the car's width is no longer indicated. The '68 FMVSS Act made a rule that the front marker lights must stay on.
70s cars sometimes had a pair of extra brake lights on in the back window or deck lid. They were linked to the standard lights.
I've considered retrofitting one to my '84 Jeep. There's a hole in the center of the spare tire carrier that would be perfect for a 3/4" grommet mount light. I would have to run a new wire from the brake switch to the back. Two lights to do it all is a little disconcerting and the turn signals are short on/long off because I have higher-wattage bulbs on the original flasher. If mine was a little older and had the back sidemarkers on the body I would convert it to the Euro-style lights with separate yellow turn signals. My daily driver Taurus wagon wears '97 amber turn signals in place of the factory red because yellow is safer. The colors are separated and unambiguous.
The extra brake lights on the rear deck debuted in the U.S. in 1971 on the Oldsmobile Toronado.
You should be able to get more modern digital flasher modules that could fit in the stock slot which would solve the flashing issue as they are not reliant on wattage
Some are just too distracting for other road users though. They should ban the animated ones.
@@DEVILTAZ35 You mean the ones that go
-
--
-->?
Those aren't distracting, and I've got pretty severe ADHD so a lot of things are distracting
@@DEVILTAZ35 Why should animated turn signals be banned? They function like turn signals, but animated. Should blinking turn signals also be banned by your logic?
Really enjoying this video format. Reminds me of the channel "Technology Connections," but more automotive-focused. Great content, keep it up!
Yes
But these are much shorter than technology connections!
@@FeartheCyr611 I thought everyone liked a good 30-60 minute ramble about tech devices and their history!
@@MrJJandJim hahaha maybe but not me!
@@MrJJandJim I know I do :D
@@MrJJandJim I do too, that channel is so good!
Loving learning some more stuff in these videos, keep it up!
Just wanted to say I love your videos and I found you because I’m thinking about getting a 79 rx7 myself and found your videos really helpful, keep up the good work I can’t wait to see more
I learned about this when I noticed that my car (a 1989 Mercedes S-Class) has its third brake light sort of just mounted at the bottom of the back window. It wasn't as integrated into the car as you'd expect, and that's because it was added mid-generation to meet the requirement. Quite a few cars of the time did similar additions, like what we've seen with some rear-view cameras sticking out because they were mandated a few years ago before new generations of cars with them better integrated are released.
In the UK there was a trend in around 1984-'85 among boy racers for two small square aftermarket high level brake lights mounted at the top corners inside the rear window which was originally seen on rally cars, although I think it was considered illegal at the time. Then the benefits of having high level brake lights (especially the single centrally mounted one) became more obvious as they could be seen better as well as being seen through other cars in heavy traffic where drivers several cars behind the one braking would see it and brake much sooner. They weren't standard equipment until the mid '90s by most European makers - the Mk3 Golf didn't have them to begin with which shows how late they were to the party.
Love your video essays. They are concise and without super long introduction.
This might be my favorite type of shooting cars content! Love it.
*me* _too_
The 1971-78 Oldsmobile Toronado and 1974-76 Buick Riviera also had pairs of center-mounted lights positioned between the rear windscreen and the trunk lid. However, they illuminated when the brakes and turn signals were activated just like their lower-mounted regular taillights.
This was pretty awesome... I had a rough take on why and thinking it was safety related. I figured it was in case one brake light went out you still have a back up... Ive seen so many newer Hyundais and Kias that have both brake lights out already.. that 3rd break light seems to be the only thing that lasts
That's EXACTLY WHY the 3rd brake light was mandated..... Redundancy..... Period.
Something interesting I've noticed is that on almost all cars from the last 15 years or so the third brake light is almost universally LED, while the main brake lights on many cars, even currently, are still incandescent. I'm guessing because LEDs can be put in a slimmer housing, while incandescent are cheaper. The LEDs typically don't burn out, I suspect that's why the main brake lights burn out but the third brake light keeps working. There's also the issue that replaceable bulbs might get loose in the socket, or the socket corrodes, while non-replaceable LEDs everything is soldered in place, avoiding this issue.
@@quillmaurer6563 led lights run at a much cooler temp.. hence why h.i.d's I think are getting phased out unless you have an older vehicle with glass and not plastic lights... Also kinda sounds like a one hand washes the other... 🤔
@@jdmandsuch6739 LEDs really make total sense for many reasons - run cooler, last longer, come on quicker, use less power, brighter. I've converted basically all (excluding a couple gauge lights) of the lights on my classic Beetle to LED, isn't even all that expensive.
@@quillmaurer6563 No, that is absolutely not true.
Great videos my friend, great quality, short, and informative! And I love that you use a lot of footage from RX-7’s, one of my favorite cars ever. :)
I HIGHLY suggest making a video about implementation of amber turn signals. It would shed light on a massive safety issue in the United States.
While it's just a single line in here, it's one of those things that give the wrong impression along the same lines as European folk having a problem with American cars with red/combined stop/turn signals instead of separate amber ones. The high mount provides better visibility, which is good,but this video suggests the popular misconception that people confuse braking and turning without a unique light just for braking. In reality, the worst case scenario from lack of high mount or amber turn signals and only seeing a red tail light come on is that a driver behind you slows down when they might not actually have to.
Now can we talk about how it's 2022 and people still don't know their tail lights are not turned on? Between running lights that light up the road ahead and modern/digital dashes today that are always illuminated, idiots need a "your lights are not turned on" warning.
I actually agree with you on that and I think it should be mandatory that all new vehicles should have automatic headlights when ever it gets dark or the wipers are on. If GM can do it like in my Chevy it can be done across the board.
@@mikeske9777 there’s no technical reason not to. My 95 town car had automatic lights. It takes a 15 cent part and the computer the car already has.
I’d settle for a message on the dash that says “lights are off” as from what I can tell the issue is caused because you no longer need to turn on your lights to see your instrument cluster at night.
On the side, I generally like the fact my lights turn on automatically when the wipers are on, but paradoxically there is no way to turn them off, so I can’t flash my headlights at idiots driving with no lights on when my wipers are on.
They could make the dash lights flash off and on to let them know they have no lights on 😉
@@xmanhoe I mean, yes, and most modern cars do just that to warn drivers of other problems, however it could get really annoying if you have your lights off on purpose. With pretty much all cars today having screens of some sort in the dash, you can display any message you want. The cluster flash would just be part of the normal programing that happens under any warning, flashing once or twice, then returning to normal operation. Since a cluster flash is already understood as 'check for warnings' it doesn't seem like a good idea to try to repurpose it as 'turn on headlights'
They have issues with it, because it's a stupid design decision. Also, why don't all cars come with daytime running lights while we're at it? It's incredibly hard to judge the distance of white and grey cars without their headlights on.
At night, I feel the changing pattern of light makes the brake light more obvious and noticeable. Some of the brake lights by one manufacturer in the 1960's relied on reflected light only and were pretty lame.
You should do a video on collapsible steering columns. They came out in the 1960's an were a big safety improvement. I was at a car show and there was a Crosely (I think). The steering column was a straight shaft pretty much to the front bumper. A cute car, but in a front end collision that would be fatal.
Another great short documentary. Thanks! Great stuff!
I remember when this happened. I was a teenage driver. We bought a 1985 Dodge Omni, and a few months after getting it the 1986 models began hitting the road. It was neat seeing the numbers of rear brake light cars gradually increase on the road.
Turn signals might as well be optional on new vehicles since a lot of people don't use them
All new cars since 1960's have turn signals, they're mandatory.
@@automation7295 You missed the point of his comment so badly I wonder if you're just randomly spamming. My local classic rock station actually mocks the same thing in one of their bumpers: "Welcome to nashville, where the lightning bugs use their blinkers more than the drivers".
There were a lot of American cars in Finland in early nineties. You had to disable third brake light from those to pass yearly registration check. Just removing the bulb was not enough, you had to remove wires, paint it black or otherwise make it much harder to get working again. And couple of years later those brake lights were mandatory. I'm not 100% sure, but I think you had to install third brake light also to older vehicles, as there were diy sets to glue on a rear window and just about every car suddenly had them on.
Talk about dumb. It shouldn’t have mattered to have an extra safety feature.
“I’m sorry, Sir, you’ve failed the inspection because your bumper is too large.”
I am really enjoying you efforts and content. Thank you, Sir!
man i really love your videos! i prefer them because you explain information well in a digestible way. i have an interest in automotives for a long time now, but couldnt develop it much because other videos ive watched don't hold my retention for long. Thank you very much! :D
ps: i also appreciate your old car reviews, i love them bc i prefer the aesthetics (current cars looks like soaps, like yea sure aerodynamics)
A VW Jetta that I had as a rental in 2006 had the three-flash lane change mode when you bumped the turn signal stalk. I am unsure if VW was actually the first, or what year it first appeared in the Jetta, but I do know they had it long before Ford. Just an FYI.
Yeah. I've seen cars from the early 2000s with this feature. And it was not only limited to luxury cars. My 2002 Opel Vectra had this exact feature. I'm sure he got it wrong.
Mercedes had it in early 2000s, maybe even earlier. I know the facelift w210 e-class that came for MY 2000 has both tripple flash and the side turn signals mounted on the mirrors
Loved it!
I effing love these history series... I just watched the automatic seatbelt vid... Keep them coming Zack... Well done
This video made me order a 3rd brake light for my 62 Cadillac in an instant! Thank you!
I would like to see more videos like this on historical changes to automotive tech, it was really interesting. Keep ‘em coming!
The reason for the High level/3rd Brake light in Europe was so not just the following vehicle could see you were braking, but others further back.
In Europe the turn signal as you call it (indicators) on the rear of a vehicle are amber, so can’t be mistaken for brake lights.
I had an 85 Ford Aerostar and later a 94 that had the european type turn signals. Our 1930 Model A came from the factory with only a single brake light. I really don’t like driving the A at dusk.
@@janderson8401 lots of early British/European cars had only one stop/tail light.
@Phillip Banes I know Europe isn’t a country, Volvo which is a European car Manufacturer started the third brake light as a safety idea, just as they pioneered other safety ideas.
There are few channels with envolving narrative as yours. Thank you for your work, its enjoyable to learn from you lml
Thank you so much for this informative video. Infact Center High Mount (ESL) Emergency Stop Lamp always fascinates me to the point that I keep a close eye to it's operational state in all the Cars I currently own 😆
The taxi cab experiment was infact a breakthrough achievement in order to bring another safety marvel to the automotive world where adapting precautionary measures in response to variable driving conditions is a compulsion for everyone. ❤️
It's really impressive to see how automotive technology has evolved over the course of decades and we are optimistic to see further advancement in the future. Cheers. 👍
I hope you enjoyed it! April 20th we will revisit automotive lighting: The Rise And Fall Of Pop-Up Headlights!
Yes pls🙏🏽
You should do on on rear amber turn signals and their effectiveness vs red brake/turn signals.
Should follow up with the hyper flash third brake lights nowadays.
@@feelingafnar8885 bro what?! 🤨
Can you please also make a video explaining why some American cars have red rear turn signals instead of amber? I’ve done some research but couldn’t find any definitive answers. Thanks.
I've notice with the addition of the third stop light, size of the taillights have gotten smaller. For example my fusion has two bulbs for the taillights, my 77 versailles has 6 bulbs and the lens are of course much larger.
You aren't very bright, seriously.
You're right, have you seen the brake lights and indicators on a Tesla Model 3? They're pathetic
Always interesting information from you.
Thank you for this history lesson. I've always wondered the history of the third brake light. It's funny when vehicles that were designed from a different era that later implemented the required third brake light. Some vehicles got clever and integrated it into the design but other vehicles that were riding on a 10 year old design instead just tacked it in the rear window or on top of the trunk. It makes it look like an afterthought. One good example is the 1971-1989 Mercedes-Benz SL. 1971-1985 received no third brake light but then in 1986 it was required so they just simply tacked it on top of the trunk. Very minimal thought was put into the location. That wasn't until the redesign for 1990. Also, American cars such as the Cadillac Deville, Chevy Caprice, Ford LTD Crown Vic, Dodge Diplomat, etc. were originally designed in the 70s that carried over well into the 80s and when the third brake light requirement was enacted, all they did was simply tack it in the rear window which was the only differentiator between older and newer models. I would say the 1990s was officially when cars started implementing the third brake light into their design since cars were drastically redesigned to implement these new safety requirements.
5:20 I don’t think Ford „Pioneered“ the 3-flash-turn signal in 2011. My 2004 VW Polo has that too.
In the early 1970's, the "Oldsmobile Toronado" was already factory-equipped with dual high-mounted brake lights/turn signals just below the huge rear window. Still remember seeing aftermarket self-adhesive plastic ones available for sale in automotive stores, so any car can look like a "high end" luxury car... 🚗
Great job on this video!! I remember my dads new Mustang getting the new 3rd light. I thought it was awesome!
This was excellent. Well done!
Omg can someone tell me that songs name pls
Edit: I mean the second one 0:31
"In 2011, Ford pioneered the three-flash turn signal..."
Even though my 2003 Mercedes C240 sedan and 2005 C230 coupe had three-flash turn signals. Pioneered? Perhaps not.
I remember when they installed those 3rd brake lights on those taxis in San Francisco back the mid-70's. Local TV news did a story about it, they did call it a safety trial probably because of the high rate of rear end accidents with taxis. Some would blink when the brakes were applied, others would just stay on. I never known the history of the 3rd brake light started there. Thanks for a little tibit of auto history.
My father put on the trunk of my mother’s 1985 with a 3rd brake light. It was a cheap plastic around the light. I remembered seeing the 3rd brake light in 1986 on a lot of cars back then. I even drove a 1986 Ford Tempo in driver’s education in high school during the 1st semester of my junior year. All of my vehicles had that 3rd brake light from the late 90’s on my first car to the present. It is so common to see it now these days.
That is of course a U.S. perspective on the third brake light. I owned a 1997 Fiat Punto in the U.K. which didn’t have a third brake light at that time, but part of its distinctive styling was high level tail lights in the C pillars, something I first saw on the Volvo 850 station wagon which also had tail lights high in the C pillars. The video suggests the reason for the centre high level brake light was because the regular tail lights used multi filament bulbs to light the car at night, brake and indicate a turn, all in the same light cluster. I believe it is now illegal for a car manufactured in the USA and imported for sale in the U.K. to have that feature, they have to have amber rear turn signals like European cars, but American servicemen based in the U.K. that drive vehicles that came here with the military and which still operate on United States license plates are exempt from this. I have also seen classic American cars registered in the U.K. with altered rear turn signals - usually the reversing lights have been adapted to flash amber. I’m not sure if that is a legal requirement or something done to make the intention to turn more obvious for U.K. drivers used to seeing amber turn signals. This was not always the case. When I was young there was something mildly fascinating about seeing a large American car from the 50s or 60s and watching the red tail lights flash red to signal a turn. However in the mid 1980s, by which time I was a licensed driver, I realised the disadvantage of this system while walking the dog near to home. A 1970s Camaro came past me slowly and as it approached a T junction the driver began to indicate his intention to turn right. The whole right rear light cluster began to flash on and off, but as the driver approached the junction he began to repeatedly dab the brakes, meaning the left lamp cluster began to flash on and off too! For the duration of the ‘on-off’ application of the brakes, the impressive light show gave no clear indication of which way the car was going to turn! So if the third brake light was intended to be a method of clarifying which red stop light was indicating a turn, which is what I interpreted from the video, in Europe that wasn’t necessary because we’ve had amber turn signals for years that are separated from the red stop and tail lights. What developed in the U.K. from the early 1930s were the semaphore turn signal, the little illuminated amber arm that popper out horizontally to signal a turn, usually mounted on the B pillar, and in some cars these were fitted as late as the early 50s. I do seem to remember as a child some of this type of car (the Morris Minor for example) having the small red tail light flashing as a turn signal as per an American car - I think this was a conversion done to eliminate the semaphore signal. It was also legal at one time to combine the front turn signal with the front white side light (parking light? running light?) so at night that would flash with a dual intensity. However I think pretty much by the mid sixties every car on the U.K. market had dedicated amber front and rear turn signals. Returning to the third brake light, my 1997 Fiat Punto did not have one, but my 1999 Mercedes C200 did - in the back window, like a lot of 80s American cars had. Added to the rear shelf, as the Mercedes-Benz C Class was not originally designed to have a third brake light. I believed at the time that this was a progression of the high level tail lights I’d seen on the Volvo 850 station wagon and Fiat Punto, and somewhere I read an account where it said this ‘new’ feature enabled following drivers to see cars ahead beginning to brake by being able to see the high level brake light through the glass of the car you were following. I’m not sure how many drivers are actually that alert...anyway the third brakes light’s widespread adoption was probably as much to do with European and Japanese cars having to comply with U.S. regulations if they were sold there, as it was a safety feature elsewhere. Of course I’m used to them now but early on, if I was stuck in traffic at night with somebody holding their car on the foot brake in front of me, I hated the third brake light as it was right in my face blinding me! Now of course, ALL the lights are LEDs, twice as bright as filament bulbs used to be, so ALL the lights are blindingly bright....progress often comes at a cost. Personally I think some VW-Audi cars have got the unnecessarily brightest rear lamps that dazzle at night, in the car industry.
You're not theonly one blinded by modern lighting in cars. I have taken toi putting my sunglasses on after dark when I'm in traffic because modern lighting is way too bright.
I say we just get rid of this LED bullshit entirely and go back to 1157 bulbs in marker/tail/stop lights and halogens for head lights. It will make cars less ugly during the day as these technologies will force some of the 'angle grinder to the eyeballs please' styling away, and at night they won't blind the fucking piss out of everyone. Or hell even in the daytime it can be blinding!
Perhaps it's because I'm just adapted to it due to people never using them, but I've learned how to derive people's intentions from context well enough that IDGAF if the blinker and tail/stop are the same bulb. It's fine. I know they're stopping and a quick glance at what's nearby will usually clue me into why they're stopping. People love to make a big deal about it but it really *isn't* a big deal.
Cool comparing the FB to the FC since I like those cars... Even in the same generation/body style cars, model year 1985 versus 1986 is an interesting comparison to see it on the 86 models but not on the 85. Case in point is the 1st gen MR2 aka AW11. (By 1989, the final year, they integrated it into the rear spoiler and it was LED; but from 86 to 88, it was this ugly tacked on thing that didn't require changing anything to the body/spoiler, so purely meant to satisfy the law).
That's the problem with the government mandate stuff like 3rd brake light during production run, they're usually tacked on cars originally started production in the 1970's or early 1980's.
1986 Buick Regal GNX and many other 1986 model year have 3rd brake light tacked on because they didn't had other spots for them, they also couldn't integrate them neatly.
I own a 1987 MR2, so I know exactly what you mean. I also own a 1987 Nissan 300ZX and quite impressed with it has a stock modern LED 3rd brake light (even though the ‘86 model year had a single filament 3rd brake light).
@@tomkato6400 Why are people impressed with LED brake light in 1987? LED existed back them.
@@automation7295 We we’re impressed with LED brake lights in 1987 as they were finally bright enough for that application. Until then, LEDs were very dim (easily washed out in sunlight) and relatively expensive. LEDs were primarily used as indicators on appliances, stereo equipment, and other applications that didn’t need much lumens.
It took another 20 years for LEDs to be bright and durable enough to used as low beam headlights on the 2006 Lexus LS460. Several more years until a high beam LED headlight was first introduced on the Audi R8.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haitz%27s_law
I like your background music. Very Nintendo Home Screen. Great content as always!
So, after it was confirmed that the third brake light reduced accidents and repair costs due to fewer collisions, we all saw appropriate reductions in our car insurance premiums, right?
(Let that sink in as to just how truly effective it really must have been.)
Oh, they are effective. But the insurance companies are (insert 4-letter words here) .
Insurance isn’t going down $ meanwhile safety crash avoiding systems are standard in most cars let that sink in. Also having liability why is my premium high when I add a new car compared to old ? Don’t you think it should cost the same ?
@@Viggggggr Yes, they have become standard in new cars, as have many other "safety" features. Yet we still keep paying more for insurance accident premiums as we're told those are becoming fewer in number. A lot of what we're told has sunk in ... and I ain't buying it. Highway deaths are on the rise with 2020 being one of the highest on record. We're being sold a false bill of goods.
@@stevepettersen3283 Not as far as saving lives goes. In 2020 the number of highway deaths is near an all-time high.
Amazing that a huge government agency that was implemented specifically to increase road safety (and that we citizens pay for), didn’t come up with this concept - a private citizen did. Just a note for you folks that think if the government throws money at a problem, it’ll get fixed. #freemarket4ever
A private citizen developed the idea, but without a mandate, the car companies wouldn't have added them. It was not obvious even to consumers that these were needed.
I was behind a car in the early 70's that had a little traffic signal mounted high in the back window. When he was on the gas, the green light was on. When he was on the brake, the red light was on. When he was coasting, the yellow light was on. Greatest thing I ever saw to this day. The yellow was a major help, because you could lift as soon as you saw it, not having to notice his deceleration first. It took me a few minutes to figure out what was going on, having never seen anything like it before or since. Don't know if it was custom built or an accessory, but you can believe I combed through my next JC Whitney catalog looking for one!
I've been wondering about this detail for a long time now and the main conclusion I came to was when you're running lights are on it's easier to tell at night when someone is hitting the brakes by a third light turning on that was not originally on. So 2 main lights get brighter, but incase you didn't notice the brightness change, they added the 3rd light that's off by default
I like it. It helps me see through the car ahead of me, to the brake lights of the car in front of them. It reduces multiple rear end crashes
My 1986 supra has a third brake light and it almost kinda looks like a retrofit even though it's factory which is cool cause none of the other models had them to my knowledge. When mk2 supra production stopped in 1985 because of the release of the mk3, there was a delay in its release so they decided to do a re-release of the mk2 but mixed both the L and P types together into one car and added the third brake light. It only lasted half a year before the mk3 was released and that's why when you're looking for service/repair manuals, they'll often say 1986.5 and I think that's pretty fun
This was very informative!
I had an 85 Pontiac 6000LE, it came with the third brakelight from the factory. It took some getting used to, always showing up in the windshield rearview mirror looking like someone was tailgating you. It's kind of a good addition for cars, as most days I'll see a car in traffic that has only that brake light functioning.
The center trunk mounted brakelight was available on some 1948 Chrysler products, particularly Dodge and Plymouth models. I've seen dozens of them.
I remember in Australia, the only factory fitted 3rd brake light was on Volvos. But you could start buying aftermarket ones to retrofit it. I don’t know how I managed to install mine but I did. I think manufacturers ended up including them before they were actually mandated.
My dad worked for a dealer so I don't remember the car, but one of the demos he drove had a third taillight that looked like it was tacked on at the dealership to retrofit it before sale. Wish I could remember more.
I remember the super-low in-the-bumper taillights lights in the 1971-'73 Dodge Coronet that were increased in size for '74 but remained in the bumpers when the Coronet was renamed _Monaco_ for '77-'78.
Also, Olds Toronado added extra turn signal lights under the rear windows in he early '70s.
The '38 _Spirit of Motion_ ("Sharknose") Grahams had the main taillights mounted in housings below and at the outer corners of the rear windows.
The late-forties Lincoln Continental models had taillights mounted low on the rear fenders, but those did not include the brake light function. The only brake lights were center-mounted high on the trunk lid.
Chrysler-made cars (Chrysler, Dodge, DeSoto, Plymouth in the late forties had CHMSLs in addition to the taillight brake lights.
Studebaker and others catalogued a "WIG WAG" brake light accessory, a motorized housing that moved the single brake light side-to-side in an arc under the left-side-mounted license plate.
There are probably dozens of other examples out there.
I was working for CSAA (AAA) and we were installing 3rd brake lights on our company cars as part of the test program. We also installed relays to the headlight system that turned on the low beams (at a slightly reduced brightness) when the car was started. This resulted in the Daylight Running lights being implemented by some car manufactures in America in 1995.
I was constantly getting cut off in my little car so I started driving with my headlights on during the day before daytime running lights were introduced, and it greatly reduced how often traffic pulled out in front of me. I then started using my bright beams during the day, and it reduced it even more. Even now I still drive with my headlights on instead of just the daytime running lights. The brighter beam makes the car more prominent and appear closer. Try it for yourself.
Northern California had lots of rural highways which were Headlights required day and night, like CA-12 through most of the delta. When Canada mandated DRL head on collisions went down considerably.
I lived this one tangentially. In the years after 1986, aftermarket 3rd brake lights were pretty popular and my father sold and installed thousands of them in 1987. We had boxes and boxes of them in our house.
Thanks doc for saving more lives :)
Also semaphore indicators. Those of particular curiosity are the ones fitted on early French buses. The semaphore arm was long and would wave up and down when in use. When these were replaced a number of bulbs in a vertical row attempted to replicate the waving effect.
About 22 years ago, a colleague of mine did a study on brake lights, specifically looking at rear-end crash rates for vehicles based on if the brake and rear indicator lights are combined vs. separate. (That's to say: at night, the outer brake lights are either off or on, not dim or on.) I don't remember how big the crash rate difference was, but it was statistically significant. And yet, here we are, 22 years later and a lot of cars still have combined brake and indicator lights. (That's not even getting into the issue of vehicles that still have combined brake and turn signals.)
Amazing video!
In the early/mid 80s, Dad had an '84 Cutlass Ciera, and bought a new '87 one. When the '84 got transferred to my Mom, they got and installed an aftermarket high-mount brake light that installed on the rear shelf up against the glass, more or less in the same position most of the early factory installed ones were in as they were basically retrofitted into the current production cars, sedans at least, before the makers had the time to redesign around the new requirement.
I liked your short documentary.. I would love to see more
You have earned a subscriber my guy
5:14 that turn signal design looks cool
I always thought the third brake light was just made to look cool/aesthetically pleasing. Neat to know it was for a safety reason!
Figured that out all by yourself, Kelly ?
interesting reason, thanks for the video!
When I was 12 my mom bought a new 1986 Plymouth Horizon. The third brake light was a wart on the hatch at the base of the rear window, the only way you could tell it was a factory installation was that the housing was painted body color. It also had a rear wiper with a separate washer-fluid tank at the back of the car, convenient since the front washer tank was an even 3 liters and it was easy to put the rest of the gallon in the back one.
yup, I've had many Pontiac Fiero's, from their 1st year in 1984 to their last in '88. I personally had a '84,'85, & now still '87 GT. and I remember that clearly, from no 3rd, to suddenly having one, and it never looked right on a Fiero. but you know, safety... I had a mod on mine for a while where I killed the factory 3rd, and replaced it with a caddy sts long led bar 3rd along the top of the rear window. that was slick. ahh the memories... :) I even noticed in your clips I seen you in a fiero for a moment.!
I remember semaphore arm turn signals mounted on the B pilar of 1930s British cars. Also had a brake light. Dad had a 1936 Wolsey 18HP. Blinkers only came in the 1950s
When I was in high school (1986) I added a third brake light to my 1969 Firebird. Made back the purchase price in one month since the insurance premium went down.
Awesome video. We call it indicators in South Africa 🇿🇦
Good video. Thanks.
Some auto manufacturers in the 1920s fought the introduction of brakes on all four wheels, ostensibly as being unsafe but really to avoid the expense.
I remember this being a new thing.
"Center High Mount Stop Lamp (CHMSL)" I remember rattling off this acronym at people. lol
I always thought they were a great idea. I've added extra tail/brake lights to many vehicles I've owned.
It makes it easier to "read" traffic, now that I can see the brake light of the car in front of the one I'm following.
Prior to mandate by law, the additional break lights were also tested in New York city where I saw them on livery cabs everywhere. They all had these two additional lights mounted behind the rear window. It was done in a hap-hazard way where the wires were hanging out. They were definitely mounted temporarily. You just know it was a test progrmam.
If I'm not mistaken, the third brake light is higher so that it might be visible throught the windows of the vehicle behind it so divers two or more cars back can have some indication of what traffic ahead is doing.
The first production american car yo have high mounted brake lamps was the 1971 Oldsmobile Tornado, they were mounted on each side, forward edge of the trunk lid. I thought they were soo cool as a kid growing up.
I remember those. My 70 Thunderbird shows them I the brochure but, never made it to production. These were located inside the rear window mounted vertically on the outer edges.
The 3 flash lane change indicator was out well before 2011 I can remember it on an 06 Vectra my dad used to own. I even have a 2010 Scirocco with that function
I was in a thrift shop once and I saw a center brake light kit still the Box center for people that wanted to add them to their cars that didn't originally come with them.
I remember being a kid when the Chevy Lumina minivans came out, they had brake lights at the top of the rear corners. I've only seen that done on a couple of other cars since then, like the Kia Soul.
In 1979 at a big rig manufacturing company in Nashville Tennessee called Matlock Trailer Corp. A man on the assembly line used to make and 3rd brake lights that flashed when you applied the brake to it. He showed it to several car companies(Ford, Chevrolet, Datsun) that told him it was a dumb idea.....My dad worked there and brought one home and installed it to our Maveric when I was 7 years old.
There was a time when vehicles only had a single rear position/brake light usually fitted to the centre or the rear end. Another reason why cars were required to fit a third light was so if one or both of the side lights failed, you'd still have a brake warning light