What even are AAA games anymore?
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- čas přidán 22. 05. 2023
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#AAA #tripleaaa #gaming - Hry
Thanks for watching folks! I know it's a bit more of a rant than anything but hey it is what it is lol
Ooohhh ooooo you wanna sip oooo waaaaah
this was a good rant bricky.
Some thoughts (that will probably come across as horribly negative though that's not necessarily the intent):
1. Spot on about the quality of games being ass, but this does also extend to more than just technical quality. Try reading the script to God of War Ragnarok divorced of the spectacle, the actual writing quality is a fucking embarrassment.
2. Increasing the price point of games in no way means that price point will come back to the dev team as increased wages, because y'know, corporate greed.
3. Corpos are more than happy to throw their reputation in the garbage because they know normies will endlessly eat up their trash as long as they make a proper investment in the marketing campaign and show off the pretty pictures. Vote with your wallet.
4. Definitely right about the quality (or lack thereof) of higherups/admins/managers in game studios and game companies in general. Just look at wizards of the coast repeatedly crashing and burning from sheer lack of being in touch with their audience.
5. It's funny you mention destiny grind because nowadays it feels so much like AAA dev studios replace game quality with garbage RNG loot systems and incredibly bloated run times. Even as far back as 2013, I'd never choose to spend 80 hours on dragon age inquisition when I could instead spend 20 on dragon age origins.
At this point i feel like "AAA" should not be something a company can call there own game, let it be an award or something at the end of the year because if it was up to the community Hades would be AAA and Redfall would be a D-
bro be like "you know youngsters of this ancient game Infamous" when I was really hoping he was gonna talk about my favorite game series every, Sly Cooper which has a very cute reference in Ghost of Tsushima.
Working in a game store, and watching every 3rd customer spend $70 on the same sports game that hasn’t changed anything significant for the last 15 years makes me sad
Sports games are a weird market.. the people that buy them are probably "gamers" in only the loosest sense ( I know coz I used to play Madden and nba2k religiously) it's all about the competitive aspect and/or being able to reproduce the sports you watch on TV. Alot of the criteria true gamers use don't apply with sports gamers.
@@gman7497 tRuE gAmErS
Every product has its target audience
In Latin America we take it a step further, you'll see many people whose entire reason for buying a console... Is to play the new FIFA soccer game, some will eventually buy 2 or 3 other games eventually, but they never miss the FIFA ones, doesn't matter if it has minimally changed in the last 5 years, it always sells well.
@Weba Azul yup.. there's a divide between the gamers that buy all the new releases, delve into indies and keep up with the industry and the gamers who wouldn't even call themselves gamers, they just buy Fifa, Madden, nba2k or CoD to play their friends online.
AAA games are the friends we made along the way.
Friends? ... Well shit
United by "we agree corporations and greed are corrupting video games"? I mean sure, but I prefer when we all just talk about our personal favorite pick of masterpieces? How awesome video games are?
Mine was Vice City. Not for mechanics or art style. But it just felt relatable as a kid for me (I didn't even understand English as an Asian student). But overtime, I grew fond of the game, and Tommy Vercetti was like a good early role model: always gets the job done, reliable to anyone around, confident, and a little naive.
And it they secretly “invest” our money
Be funnier.
@@ShadowWolfQc You still got Aphrodite from Hades love 😍
There is a big reason why the price did not go up. They were producing physical copies of games and then digital downloads took off and they got to drop physical production but were still charging the same price.
This was known and talked about at one point, but apparently everyone forgot. They did not just keep prices the same our of kindness, they were making out like bandits and still are.
They didn’t drop physical at least not entirely
Doing so would cause stores to stop selling the digital only consoles as that hurts them
Instead you get the digital only physical copies
@@jmurray1110 Yeah, obviously they still make some physical copies, they are in every store. However you used to ONLY have that option. So if you made a game, you had to have a physical copy made. This is not the case at all now and played a huge part in keeping prices down on games. Simple math can prove this. Kind of like being able to get pizza beamed to your kitchen instead of paying the delivery fee but many companies still kept charging the delivery fee anyways, so they were now making extra profits. You could claim their prices never went up, but they were still charging the same for doing less then they were before.
They didn't drop the price of digital copy to avoid angering retailers
@@jmurray1110
I'm pretty sure that most game sales are digital these days. I have no data or sources to back that up, but it would really surprise me if it's not the case. As such, the physical releases are simply being subsidized by the more profitable digital sales.
I was hoping you would talk a bit more about Nintendo as they have the two perfect examples for what should and shouldn’t be a AAA game, that being Pokémon and Zelda. TotK was in development for 6 years and Eiji Aonuma even revealed that TotK was finished over a year ago, but they delayed it spending the entire last year of its development play testing, debugging, and polishing the game’s mechanics and it shows with articles being amazed at how smoothly the game runs on the switch. On the other hand you have Pokémon, during TotK’s 6 year development, Game Freak made 5 mainline Pokémon games Ultra Sun and Moon, Let’s Go Pikachu and Eevee, Sword and Shield, Legends Arceus, and Scarlet and Violet, and as the cost of making the games went up and the amount of development time needed also went up, the yearly deadline stayed the same causing the games to rapidly decline in quality.
Why would gamefreak not do it when they know people will keep on buying it since its pokemon
@@zerosam5541 exactly that’s the problem, I’m hoping Pokémon will get a better schedule thanks to scarlet and violet being so buggy that Nintendo had to give out refunds. I’m not going to buy the next Pokémon game and I hope many other won’t after scarlet and violet
Honestly the whole "my $70 is not your $70" is something we really need to remind ourselves of constantly. Not everyone is in the same situation as you, and sometimes that $70 dollars can be better spent on a friend in need than on some game.
We have CZcamsrs and Twitch streamers who earn $4 million per month saying "oh yeah, this game is definitely worth $70 to me" and there are people watching them earning only $300/month who think they're going to get the same value from the game because they trust that content creator's opinion
@@cleverman383 Do you know any of them that earn that much?
@@cindermoth3421 Almost certain he was exaggerating, but there are certainly some content creators who can make 100k in a month easy especially if they do a subathon or a content collab.
or a me in need
@@alecjones8286 Oh yeah no doubt about that, though we should keep in mind the difference between how much they make, and how much they actually get. Considering the cuts both youtube and twitch like to take. Twitch especially likes to take a lot. So the amount they actually make is on average a lot lower.
But that aside, there's no real accounting for the differences between what people can afford, especially not with a vast audience.
Probably best to just view it as a game being significantly more worth its price point than others. So if you have to choose you know what's the better choice. If you can't afford it, then why worry about which is better?
The fact that indie games often lean heavily into weirder and more uncommon artstyles, instead of aimming for photorealism, I think only helps them both stand more out, and it lets them last. When you aim for realism it often dates your game by the current graphical capabilities, you can only fit so many polygons.
This has also fused in my brain with a question I asked my parents when I was young, about why the norwegian sculptor Gustav Vigeland made his statues naked. He said that if you have clothed subjects, it immediatly puts them in a time period, but the naked form will always be there.
Also the fact that photorealism is absurdly expensive and not that pleasant over stylized graphics
I mean imo wind waker still looks good
You forgot to mention that since every AAA game aims at photorealism, they all look the same at the end of the day. I'd also like to mention sound design. Every AAA game aims for some realistic sound for their guns and it led to Halo Infinite's sound design to sound generic and uninspired instead of the creative and fun sound it was before when under Bungie.
also the fact that some marketing exec will shoot down the idea just because "Nobody plays this anymore" which is, because, every marketing exec shooting down the same idea with the same excuse for the last 15 years because the first one saw the last one who tried fail. See also there was a huge gap of single Player horror games until amnesia hit the scene.
and in reverse you see one thing succeed and you see a billion copies of it churned out for 3 years. After WoW everything wanted to be THE next MMO, after CoD 4 we had that sludge of grey-brown modern milsim shooters
All this comment section is on point, i love it.
Elden Ring and Tears of the Kingdom were the only big games that I have bought recently and I am very happy with both, however they're both quality. Normally, I buy indie games for $1-20.
For me it's Street fighter 6, they really nailed it with the semi open world, world tour mode like the Yakuza titles and the online netcode for battle hub is good. Mixing it with smash bros like content in fighting ground.
Zelda is close to becoming above AAA games being an ironic franchise that popular ascends games like mario and Pokémon
@@gregoryfuller9736you mean iconic?
For me it was Ghost of Tsushima. I didn’t sell because I loved it so much and then Legends mode drops out of nowhere for free 3 months later and I ABSOLUTELY loved the multiplayer mode with its super natural elements mann thats the best value I’ve ever gotten out of just $69 AUD bought Ghost of tsushima Day 1 too..
@@bruhm0ment6000
And don't forget the real reason
I was in college in 2006, totally remember when games went to $60. It coincided with games becoming HD and online console multi-player becoming mainstream, so I think people kinda got it. That was also when they finished games before releasing them, which was wicked neat.
There hasn't been a fully finished triple a release since 2019
I want to give a massive shoutout to AA games here. So much attention gets thrown to Indie or AAA games, but AA games are the ones that have captured me, Remnant: From the Ashes being a prime example. AA has more budget and manpower than indie studios, but tends to not be restricted as much as AAA titles by deadlines and such.
I couldn't have said better than you did. I wish more people would talk about it more.
I never even knew the term AA existed for game studios, but yeah I totally agree with you.
@@dappercoat249 There aren't alot out there (atleast in my experience, and I gladly get proven wrong), but it's well worth looking into. I've had more fun with Gungrave GORE than most triple A titles on my ps4.
@@YaeLisa Hi Fi Rush counts as a AA game too right?
@@unigon794 It's kind of ambiguous as they were from Tango Gameworks, who had a history of big, AAA releases and the support of Bethesda. They made the Evil Within series and Ghostwire: Tokyo, neither of which I'd call "AA."
Personally I always identified "AAA games" as games made by big teams and big studios that are affiliated to a company with like, a ton of management and all that shit, contrasting with indie games that are usually made by smaller, more independant and autonomous teams with less limits on what they can do and how they can create
I go with the Indie AA and AAA scale.
AAA games are Fullpriced "Premium/Freemium" games with Big budgets and Big marketing backed by a large Corporate entity
AA are Smaller Projects, They can be related to said Large Corporation but It's not held to the same standard, with lower-budjets. AA games tend to be more experimental and lower priced
Indie. Should speak for itself. Small, Private Entities. With little to no Corporates backing. And hardly any marketing Prices Vary wildly but Indies tend to be anywhere between 5-40$ Extremally experimental and Niche genres are their bread and butter with Non-standard artstyles.
@@BlueBD also to add to that, indie games are games that the developers and publishers are the same (seld published games). For example The Witcher series are indie games.
AA are like indie games but with a publisher that is different from the developer. Vampyr and Boneworks for example.
At least in my mind.
Yeap, like in Banking AAA stands for by the Money for the Moneys :)
indies are limited too just by money and the fact that there is less quality controll. there are plenty of great indies dont get me wrong here. but there are way way more bad ones that are basicly just as scammy as the broken aaa games. both can be great and both can be shit.
@@TheErikjsm yeah, it does seem like the good indie games have much more passion put into them than AAA games though.
...but all those abandonware early access games....
My biggest gripe with the price hikes and deluxe editions with all this is that the publishers want their cake, to eat it, then have your cake. Releasing buggy, full priced games with confusing special edition tiers filled with transactions in various ways. That $70 is the entry point, it's to get into Disney World. It doesn't get you the full experience with it though.
Games going up to $70 USD has made it so in my province in Canada, a base edition of a game costs over $100 after sales tax now 😵💫
Yup. Buying Zelda was worth it, but damn dude. The final price was like 104.5 dollars. I’m glad this game was worth it, but that’s still a lot.
@@luisdabest5396 Bro, where are you getting your copies from? Where I bought it, it was 50 dollars and it even came with a little key holder thingamajig with the crest of Hyrule on it. And the game is $70 base. For the money you spent I could buy 2 whole copies!
We also got hit with a price increase around 2014 where they jumped to $80
A $70USD game in my country sells for $500 - $600. If I were to buy the digital version instead it would cost around $490....needless to say I wait for sales in the playstation store.
"I don't sell people half a goddamn shirt!"
Bricky, my dude, don't threaten us with a good time.
Crop tops next month
The issue of game devs' wages has long been used to justify increasing game prices. But how much do you think that Activision/Ubisoft/EA are _actually_ gonna raise their devs' salaries to correspond with the price increase?
Majority of a game budget is spend on game marketing not on dev wages so keep this in mind every time they say we increased the price to increase our wages
It never been about the devs. Its about ceos and shareholders. The devs are just a meansd to an end and often overworked to the bone for minimal pay.
@@elvfrem This is simply literally true. A publicly traded games company is a means to use developers as tools to make money for shareholders (and bonuses for CEOs). The developers do not matter, money is the only thing that matters. Anything done 'for' the developers is done only if it means there's a chance it will _lead_ to making more money.
People write this as a moral condemnation of publicly traded companies, of how terribly they're behaving. But it's _literally_ what they were _designed_ to do. I'm not saying that to defend them, I just need people to be aware of what the system is. You know how Valve is so odd and different from most games companies? Their shares are not publicly traded. Indie game developers are not publicly traded either. _That's_ the difference.
Indie games have not increased their prices. Funny that.
reminds me of that year activision had record earnings, so they fired like 800 people, gave their CEO a raise and started crying about how little money they make to justify more predatory monetization.
regarding the base price point of AAA games not changing, there are 2 factors you didn't discuss which is that games sold digital copies for the same price as physical ones, which was imposed in order to keep retailers happy and not put them at a disadvantage, and 2nd the consumer market demand for video games was increasing at rapid pace, which meant that games were selling to a much wider market and still growing. Since games a software, there is no additional cost to make and sell more copies.
I just commented exactly this. It’s very obvious and yet always conveniently gets left out of the discussion
I thought that the 70$ price tag was reserved for masterpieces like ToTK, then I learned about Redfall
Acronyms make you look like an idiot child.
Dam, I got Elden Ring for 45 pounds (roughly 55 dollars)
As much as I love TOTK, no game should be worth 70 dollars. Allowing exceptions leads to complacency and then eventually that exception becomes a rule. That’s what the companies want. Don’t cave.
I bought Zelda for £48 (roughly 60 US dollars) which is what it should be priced at. It was a physical copy from an official retailer online so rest assured the money reached nintendo.
@@callinater6133 I never said I liked the 70 price but I just thought that it was reserved for like, actual well developed things, then I saw a CoD infinite warfare for 70 dollars and I’m kinda just pissed
@@Null82085 fair enough
When Bricky made me feel old with his point about Sucker Punch Studios my mind went directly to Sly Cooper. Once he dropped Infamous I went from feeling like an 80 year old to a god damn fossil.
Too real, bro. Felt the same way.
Ah, a fellow Sly Cooper enthusiast.
Is your hair gray already as well, or are you going bald?
@@Box-O-Soldier ...going bald.
I started panicking when he said Infamous. I didn't think I was that old...
Bro I remember borrowing it from my friend and having the time of my life😭😭😭😭
Thank *you* Bricky for not just going the content creator/e-celeb high road and going "my 70 dollars is not the same as *your* 70 dollars."
Cause i have a feeling some of us viewers forget that about some of you creators when you dont make that apparent.
Yeah like when Critikal had to assure his audience that he will not go bankrupt from buying Yu-Gi-Oh cards. CZcams is just a very casual medium, so riches are not as immediately apparent.
@@oliverholm3973 It's best to assume if they have like over 1k views, constantly with 1k subs, that they are a part of yt partnership so can possibly be getting paid back in what they spend so shouldn't be compared to the regular viewers
Amazing, every single word you just said was wrong.
@@TheReZisTLust and the games themselves are also tax deductions as long as you make a video about it (which is also why theres so many unboxing youtubers)
A bit of a correction on the price: Let's not forget that there are more people playing games than back in 2006-ish. So, the $60 is still reasonable for a game, that deserves it.
Sonya best sellers used to mean it sold 100k copies. Then 1m. Now good games sell 5-6 easily. And the digital world removes most distribution costs. The gaming industry has been making record profits for years, they don't need more money.
@@Nick-ue7iw Need and deserve are 2 different things.
That isn't their issue though if more people are buying it. We accepted a fair price for games was £40 back in 2005, we are paying less than that now for them adjusted for inflation, they could be asking for £80 from everyone, after all that is the same fair price we were paying, the fact that more people are buying it isn't relevant to whether that is a FAIR price.
If McDondalds only sold 1 hamburger next year, but it spent the same amount of money it would need to sell that hamburger for like 500 Million Dollars, to make the same amount of money, but that wouldn't make it a FAIR price to pay just because McDonalds makes the same or slightly less than they did the year before...
Not to mention micro-transactions. While, yes, what used to be 60 dollars is now 80 dollars, plenty of people also give plenty more than 20 dollars in dlcs, skins, lootboxes, cosmetics, characters, on and on. Between them currently being the biggest media industry in the world and having record profits, I think they're fine.
@@tumultoustortellini Been more profitable than movies since the 80’s. They’re fine.
You know things are bad when "your game needs to work before you release it" is a hot take 😅
I'm not sure you know what a hot take is, bricky's take is very uncontroversial
I can remember playing massive studio horror games not getting scared once and then watching an iron lung video and being absolutely terrified. Sometimes I wonder if AAA is just something to steer clear of now
I operate on a "burn me once" mentality for large AAA franchises. Not strictly companies, but the franchises. Zelda and Fire Emblem haven't let me down yet, so I'm happy to get them right out the gate until such a time that I am burned by one. Pokemon, however... Is a different story. Halo? Ha- no. It feels good to trust and have faith in a dev team to put out something good. And if that team hasn't let you down yet, then there's no need for *their* trust to be tarnished to the same extent.
You really got scared by Iron Lung?
Iron lung is like the most boring horror game right before fnaf
@@medugmbh997 Did you play it?
@@SzandorKing gonna be honest you got me there but i just like hating and i dont see how it could be scary or fun. Watched markiplier play it and it was like the least scared or entertained ive ever been
One of the biggest reasons Meme Man Bricky has my respect is that he is in touch with the reality of his situation. "My $70 is not your $70".
This idea is something that so many of us forget. Thanks for always keeping it real, bricky!
actually a really good point. some people are well enough off they can spend 70$ without much worry. for others 70$ is most of the spare cash they have after monthly expenses. i do kind of hate on the internet how everyone sort of takes only their viewpoint and applies it broadly. people have different value systems for everything so you can't blame another person for seeing apples where you see oranges.
You see im not even living on freedom country that my 70 is not your 70 really hit hard to me since that 70 could feed me entire month or more
It make me wonder if every gamer living like me probably theres no preorder or even video game are dead
people forget that not everyone uses freedom dollar or colonist euro
@@Vysaircolonizing dem savages
More like 400 Reais here in Brazil. The minimum wage here is 1300 Reais 💀
Bricky has my respect for understanding the average consumer and kepping in mind that 70 dollars can be A LOT for the average gamer
Ori and the Blind Forest was a masterpiece developed by an (at the time) Indie studio called Moon Studios, and to this day one of the best games I've ever played.
me too
It got a sequel in 2020 that's arguably just as good.
@@qu1253 The Sequel was amazing as well. I just mentioned the original because they were still an indie studio at the time and managed to pull off such an amazing game. As far as I've heard, they were bought by Microsoft before they released the sequel, however it didn't seem to affect their quality at all.
TL;DR they made Ori as an indie studio, which was a masterpiece.
Great game, too bad they sold out to Microsoft. It’s unlikely they will ever be able to produce games like that again which is a shame. I’m just praying team cherry doesn’t end up doing the same in future.
@@samihookings8241 would you blame them if they were offered hundreds of thousands of dollars? They could give their children and their children's children a life without any monetary problems.
You hit the nail on the head several times. Upper management having no idea what they're doing. Who didnt get there because they are passionate about the gaming scene but because they are the frontrunners of a ratrace to the bottom.
multiple major company Execs are, as far as I remember, former execs of mostly stores and physical-goods-suppliers. Reggie Fil-Ames was the head of Pizza Hut at some point
Just like in most things, if the people deciding actually ever tried the job of those under them, it would make it a lot easier for EVERYONE involved.
Ps1 games were 40 dollars new. Getting tired of people lying about game prices. It's lazy and incorrect
What does AAA games mean? Assanine, Apologetic, Aggravating.
Bricky is a multidimensional philosopher asking questions mankind desperately needs answers for, respect
what
@@Bricky yes
Also Cutter, your beloved
@@Bricky He's calling you a modern philosopher, but instead of asking the universe why we're here you ask companies and business owners "what the fuck is this, man!?"
@@MommyViper Indeed
The thing that really chaps my ass is that in countries like Australia, games can go for up to $120 for a STANDARD edition, its absolutely insane and out of control in some circumstances.
That moment when in Brazil, those games can go upwards of $220 (and i saw some selling for $500)
I don't even bother anymore, I don't buy games here in Australia unless they're on sale. I can afford them but I don't want to afford them haha
I am once again saying how grateful I am that Supergiant Games is getting the recognition they deserve. I wonder how many sales of Bastion, Transistor, and Pyre came because people enjoyed Hades.
Honestly Supergiant have the best batting average of any studio I can think of, every game they have made is incredible. I genuinely think their studio culture is why they can keep their talent pool around, everyone who worked on Bastion in 2009 was still their on Hades. They have a minimum number of days off, not a maximum. If you haven't watched the noClip. documentary series on the Hades development its eye opening.
As someone that is currently studying to be a part of the industry, specifically character modeling, I really appreciate Bricky helping to show how much time effort and talent goes into it, thank you so much
as someone who works in the industry, go to hard surface, better chances at AAA. If youre going to AA ou indie, do both, a generalist is really valued at AA and indie games.
good luck man! I've been busting my ass to learn prop modeling in the past 2 years and only a few months ago companies started to give me offers or contracts. And I'm really starting to feel how much i still don't know yet :D
As someone studying to be in the writing part of the industry, I’m scared for my future and praying that something will force a change soon.
Sucker Punch and Super Giant are what some in the industry have been calling AA studios. Too well established to be considered indie, and too small or low budget to be AAA. But that doesn't mean they can't make games as good or better quality than the big teams, they just usually have to be a little smaller in scope. Sometimes in ways that you don't even notice on a casual playthrough.
I played Bastion around the time it came out, still recognized its soundtrack in a random video a few months back. AA is a good way to put it, I think.
Would that make infamous a AA game
@@andruwgreen2531 I'd say so, even though the term wasn't really in use much at the time the first inFamous game was released. Though the company has grown considerably since being acquired by Sony. I'm not sure Ghost of Tsushima can be considered to be AA, but is probably more of a AAA title. But Second Son was kind of borderline between the two.
They tend to have better gameplay too.
@@andruwgreen2531 I think Subnautica classifies
A bit late, but I wanna just say; Bricky, the fact you're conscious about not wanting to be one of those "Silicon Valley Guys" means you have done 100 times more self-reflection than said Silicon Valley Guys. I'm sure whatever ideas you've got cooking up for a video game won't be tainted by your investing, because you actively take steps to avoid becoming "just another investor".
And also you respect the medium of video games far more than any of those guys ever will, so you're already a step ahead of the game.
I recall these Masqurades being called Double AA back in the day. An example of that wouldve been the first Call Of Juarez. It being a cowboy game with story, characters, massive open world and side quests in 2006. Made by a couple devs in like, Poland.
I miss the human element of AAA games. They were still hell to make with the same corporate money lust behind them, but there was a lot more human element to them. I hope more studios are allowed to pull a Hi-Fi Rush. Allowing a talented studio under a big publisher to just make a lower profile, fun game, that feels like that in itself is the goal, instead of driving up quarterly profits.
I remember when Yahtzee of No Punctuation talked about the idea of big AAA studios starting to invest more in subteams of AA games and have always wished they would do that. Hi-fi Rush and Riot Forge really give me hope, but not much
Many of the AAA companies today started as smaller developers making their passion. Success and the money with eventual corporatisation inevitably wears that individuality and dedication away, for an expensive shiny looking yet generic conservative design.
I miss unlockables in videogames. To me, that was a mark of AAA-quality, even if it wasn't from a AAA developer. Wanting to see everything and 100% complete the game you paid money for informs you onto how quality the game is.
Also cheat codes like the fun ones those were great
Obviously they shouldn’t be available for online matches but for a replay of a campaign what’s wrong with that
@@jmurray1110
Like the LEGO games' red bricks, those were so fun
@@davisdf3064 not so much to get
Or maybe because I’ve exclusively played the complete saga and for 0.1% of the completion since I only played the levels and not all the bonus shit
I think part of why games stayed 60 for this long is that the industry grew so much in terms of how many people play videogames. Its HUGE now, whereas if you were a gamer 10+ years ago you were a weirdo, a nerd... So every game gets more profit just based on how many more people buy the game now.
I also think it's important to evaluate the change in migration from retail to digital sales.
In 2006, the absolute majority of games were sold in physical stores, and the physical cost + logistics + store cut took up about 70% of the value.
Today digital sales predominate and rates vary from 30% or less on Steam, 12% on Epic or even less if you own the store, as in the case of Blizzard.
In addition, there was gain in volume. The cost may have gone up, but it's infinitely easier to sell a game to a much larger audience today.
That is, in addition to all the additional sources of income for game companies, a larger target audience, greater access to financing, much better tools for game development (efficiency gains), there was this 50% difference in the amount of money that goes to the developers.
Does even with all this justify the need to raise prices or are they the result of poorly managed companies and shareholder value creation?
This is a great point
Profits in big game companies are 10 times what they were 20 years ago.
Bricky brickin’ on our favorite games
I like it when he said “it’s brickin time” and then bricked on all my games.
I always use the dollar per hour stance. If I spent more than 60 hours enjoying the game then its 60 dollars well spent.
At this point TOTK is a 300 dollar value
I think there's two main reasons games were at $60 as "full price" for so long. 1 is because digital distribution cut costs by an astounding amount and 2 that it was probably an over inflated price to start.
One of the core problems with AAA development is that they are disallowed from scrapping bad ideas and will fall into the sunk cost fallacy every time. Every time they want to get rid of an awful addition to the game they have to explain that to the investors that just see wasted money. A good example of this is the Deus Ex prequels which if you listen to them talk about their development, they put up a wall of ideas during pre-dev and had to stick to it religiously regardless of how poorly the idea translated.
There's also the other way around: Good ideas unable to be implemented (or implemented half-assedly) due to having to control costs and meet hard deadlines. Not only can they not afford to waste money by removing bad ideas but they're also restricted from spending money to implement good ideas.
The bit about not knowing how to make a game but having ideas hit me pretty hard. I got some ideas that I myself find would be fun in a game, but no clue how to even start. I've decided to start learning it because the passion to want to make something fun seems to be bigger than my fear of failing it. Brick and an amazing video as usual!
I had an idea for a single fighting game character. An immortal who could care less about winning the tournament or whatever, they’re just here for some fun. So they have two different move sets depending on their health. Full to half gives you a set full of hard-to-perform moves that are goofy but high-damage if you can pull them off right, whereas below half health you get something more practical as they get excited by a worthy opponent.
Win or lose, the character is always having an absolute blast, like a metal-head in a mosh pit, because they’re just here for fun.
Problem with new ideas is most of them are 1: untested if it even works in practise until alot of development and testing goes into it. 2: near impossible to convince people to play something they've never played before 3: hard to stand out against the mountains of other games on the market.
Indie studios (generally) perform better than huge studios because they have not only the passion to make their game good, but also the time to polish it which huge studios' developers will not have, regardless of whether they're passionate or not
As a game and level designer who work(ed) for both indie and big companies, I have to say :
Thank you Bricky.
Thank you for everything and your for your honesty.
We, as develloppers, are mostly kept shut because of a damn big law of silence which plagues the entire industry. Even if it is larger now, the video game industry is still small. You talk too much ? You complain ? You dare to point that your high end manager is making 10 000 bucks each month while you work for a small 2000 at best ,for 10 to 15 hours a day ? You don't want to crunch of you just want to see your kids growing ? You dare to disagree with a uterly stupid idea from upper management ? You don't want to make your game pay to win ? ....
You're out. For good. You talk, you can change your career immediatly.
Some studios tries to break the curse. But its mostly little studios, with little money to spend in making this changes AND a good game. And its, lets be honest, mostly out of the US.
Anyway, I can make a damn wall of text about that and thats not the point.
I just wanted to say thank you, from all the devs who are sick of this, for all the players we are too (were in some hard cases)... Thank you for talking true, for being honest AND nuanced in your analysis and opinion. Thank you for asking the good questions.
I don't know if you'll succeed to make or help to make a game one day, but you allready understood and know more than most of these freaking greedy investors.
I think I wont be the only one around here to be interested working with you on that kind of project, whatever the concept may be. Looking at the state of the industry now, game concepts are now less important than respect respecting your team, your players and the final quality of your product.
It is something, the AAA part of this industry have ""forgoten"", drunk in money.
Thank you again man.
I can't really say I care too much about the current prices of new games since I usually wait until sales or buy used games that are dirt cheap by comparison. Considering my current library of games, I can't say I'm missing out by doing that.
r/patientgamers 👍🏻
Same what I do. Haven’t bought any game on release so far this year. The only one I plan to buy day one is Starfield.
@@Rainbowhawk1993 don't buy starfield day one. Bethesda games have always been broken at launch, and tend to stay that way, so I doubt starfield will be any different
@@lordofthebricks2818 Hey that is the charm of bethesda games though, running around and funning those funny glitches or bugs.
Eh, I'm the opposite, I don't care about prices going up because it was bound to happen sooner or later. Games have generally been the same price now for years. with games costing more to make and inflation being a bitch, it was literally bound to happen.
The fact bricky didn't mention sucker punch making sly cooper as well is an absolute crime.
Isn't that a ps2 game?
@@sosukelelethe fact you had to ask hurts my soul 💀
@@hiro4830ify that fucking hurt me when I read it lol
I've been playing almost exclusively indie games for years and I'm quite for it.
Part of it is that my computer is old, but I'm pretty sure even when I finally get to getting a new one, I'll still mostly play indie games.
16:05 "over and over i hear voices"
Same, mate
Not gonna lie, games based on Bricky can be comedic masterpieces.
Video games not going up in price had a lot to do with new people starting to play video games. It's not mainly about inflation, but the product sold per customer. In the last 5 years customer levels have flattened in a way, so that is why prices are going up based on money spent on the products.
considering game makers can now sell directly to the user, or go through only 1 filter (Steam) that amounts to a server farm, versus printing CDs, shipping to thousands of stores, and buying back any unsold units. there is a major savings using the download distro model. When they first talked about it, we were promised it would result in cheaper game prices.
"Not overwhelmed. Not underwhelmed. Just ... whelmed." Geez, okay, Robin from Young Justice.
Another important thing about developers and their skill level is it helps when a developer is not being micro-managed by people who are higher than them and don't know what they are talking about, or give them a task that is far outside what them or their team are capable of.
I've seen some of the most talented people churn out nothing but crap, solely because those in upper management demanded far too much or just never understood how the process worked to begin with.
You are AAA in our eyes Brick
Could be both a compliment and an insult
I prefer indie Bricky.
Expansions were arguably much more than just DLCs. They were usually fully fledged new games, not just two new levels or quests and a few items for the same game.
Imagine saw this person’s video for the first time and he shows you 2 mins of advertisement without the actual content.
I have to say, i was completly OUTRAGED at TOTK costing 70 whole dollars/euros! I then bought the game for 62 thanks to some points discount, and honestly, if i had bought it for 70 it would have been 100% worth it. The same can't be said for most 70$ games, but TOTK actually earned the price tag
Thats the thing though, before you buy the game you dont know if its gonna be worth the 70 bucks. Back in my days there used to be a thing called a "Demo" that you could download for free and play maybe an hour or two to see if you like the game. Nowadays its a gamble between microtransaction hell or broken borderline unplayable releases
@@cherryrook8684 facts. That's why I barely try new games out anymore and just stick to the ones I like. Demos should be popularized within the gaming industry again.
Just some correction dollars and euros aren’t interchangeable because they aren’t equal
Nintendo is one of those rare publishers who tend to still turn out good, functional games.
With the fact that a lot of people are being underpaid while companies are shrinking their products, I think it’s totally fine to say that $70+ is a lot of money to the average consumer.
Not to mention games nowadays will have some kinda DLC or micro transactions in order to make you spend more money on it.
I feel like a lot of this weird transition period with the gaming industry (where AAA studios are missing the mark so badly and often along with indie studios showing them up so bad) is that gaming is still a very new industry to the world, still only been around in the span of one lifetime. I'm sure there's gonna be a big cycle turning over in the next 2 or 3 decades, where the current AAA studios will implode or get liquidated or just bought and sold into a corporate-level identity crisis, and some of our current indie studios will come out with a big enough product to push them up a pedestal high enough to replace those former AAA studios spots, just hopefully with a little more wisdom and care.
I think that's exactly what's happening. So much developer talent has moved to smaller studios or they're doing their own thing. Big name publishers are shackled by shareholders and kinda have to keep big IPs going, but with less time and less talent.
@@gman7497 best part. Pirating is still here and is not going anywhere. The only games i buy are games that i play through pirated and wanna come back to. Then i buy them. Otherwise to the bin and forgotten as the rest.
@@zDemoGODz wish there was a way to pirate console games, i should really start saving for a pc at some point
@@username172 depends on the console, but there are for most.
Let’s hope we get our movie epic situation
7:20
Sega from 1973-2023: “NAH! I don’t really feel like it.”
*Proceeds to release Sonic 06 2
I'll willingly die on the hill of never purchasing a 70 dollar game. I've yet to see one that's worth it, and even if one is, I'll just wait for it to be on sale for a price we peasants can more easily afford without cutting into my groceries for the week.
I had extra money and I'm a Zelda guy so I bought it. I knew it wasn't gonna go down in price but for Jedi I can wait
I could LIVE with the $70 price tag, but what annoys the fuck outta me is when I pay full price for a game just for half of that games content to be locked behind some in-game store or battlepass system. I’m ok with the live service mantra and DLCs but games recently aren’t so much about delivering an experience and are more so about keeping you playing and putting in money, a simple cosmetic bundle that may include 1 character and a few weapon skins is often minimum $20 in numerous different games out on the market at the moment it’s absolutely insane.
@@coolfrymaster that you have a point in. It's why I likely won't get mk 1 till the ultimate edition with all the dlc we already know is coming. Gotta have some standards if you are gonna be spending a lot of money
The problem is not the price tag. $70 is a sound price when considered the fact that $60 for a game has been there for years now.
The problem is with what you get from the $70 which is extremely lackluster recently.
I mean just look at some of the true good AAA games recently (Tear of Kingdoms, Elden Ring, and GOW) they are surely worth the $70 that they ask for. Junk like Cyberpunk at launch? Thats a different story
TOTK is 100% worth the price. I'm only getting bored after 120 hrs and I'm only 30% through the game. There is no mtx, no battle pass, everything in the game can be earned in the game for free. It also isn't a broken buggy mess. I still think that $70 is too much for a game, but if there was ever a game worth the price, it's TOTK
I agree so much to everything that you spoke here. We could start saying that this is the "Age of Indies" when it comes to gaming. I could buy a bug-filled, expensive and unfun AAA game. Or I could buy a masterpiece indie game from 2 years ago and have a great time.
for one sixth of the cost!
@@dafire9634 And still getting bug fixes and free expansions today
10:33 thats literally the pokemon developers
Unfortunally
You should really check out a game called "Angels Fall First", it came out in 2015 by a small dev team(runs on UE2 or 3, plus is still classified under "early access"), doesn't have more then 20-30 players online at any given time(though not a big deal since you can play both online/offline with bots), but is honestly one of the best sci-fi/space shooters out there, has 64/124 player/bot capacity, tons of different space ships, and land vehicles and also a lot of customization for each class type(has two factions currently). It's still being worked on to this day by a very dedicated team, with new weapons, maps, and vehicles being added every so often.
Bricky pulling the ‘back in my day’ with Sucker Punch and using Infamous as the example hurt my Sly Cooper kid’s heart
I've been slowly falling off AAA games for YEARS now. Bastion and Skullgirls showed me how magical the indie game scene is, and now I only really look to AAA titles for Nintendo games and fighting games
you dont pay for a car and have the dealer say "we will just fix it later"
Hyundai, Chevrolet, Ford: ...um
Bricky I gotta say, your music choices in these videos are stellar!
Tears of the Kingdom is probably one of the only "AAA" games Ive played lately that I felt was worth 70$ and it is well worth it, I would have spent 90$ for it
Agreed, I just wish I could play it on anything but the switch and it's slow laggy hardware. Get things up to a consistent 60fps on any other console or platform and that game may well be a perfect masterpiece
Even then, I think BOTW has the better story and structure.
This lazy piece worth 70 bucks? Breath, maybe but Tears is not even worth 40
Considering Bricky's point, inflation makes this game 'cheaper' than breath of the wild. Either way, I'm loving my playthrough. I really appreciate their take on crafting things for your adventure. It's free but not too free. The temples are larger but they keep the sense of "handle it your way" that literally none of the Zelda's before Breath and Tears have done.
@@Shrilack 🤡
Tears of the Kingdom, worth the 70. It is NOT a buggy mess. Speed runners have broken it, but that's their job. If you ignore them, you can find it pretty difficult to break the game. Every bug I've met (under 4 so far) has been so minor I hesitate to call them bugs.
One thing to keep in mind when discussing video game prices is the swith to pure software buys. We should factor in the cost of making and shipping DVDs and cartridges.
About 70$ (current value) is what games have cost in Denmark since at least the mid-2000s (which is as long back I can remember game-prices). That was until about 6-7 years ago when it jumped to about 85$. And just recently I paid about 90$ for Jedi: Survivor's standard edition on PS Store (this was a mistake on my part, as literally every other supplier sold it at about 75$ 🙃)
It is worth noting that the US dollar has risen in value. So the actual price in Denmark back in the mid-2000 is equivalent to about 95$ dollars back then.
The danish prices has essentially risen from 499DKK to 549DKK to 599DKK and now it is not uncommon to see games at 600DKK+ on the PS Store (I put the prices in danish currency, so you can convert on your own and be delighted in the prices you have to pay
(Disclaimer: I did all currency conversions to US dollars based on memory and calculations done in my head. As such, they are not precise, and there may be mistakes. Also, some games are still priced at 499DKK or especially 549DKK and there seems to be no pattern to this).
Edit: I checked the current currency conversions, and
500DKK= about 72$
550DKK= about 79$
600DKK= about 86$
These are the prices games have been in Denmark for years now. Especially 550-600 is the norm now.
AAA has always been indicative of the size of the team behind a project. For example marching bands are ranked differently depending on how many people are in the band. AAA is the largest group AA is a medium size and A is the smallest size. For video games A is just referred to as indie games with AA being companies like Arkane and AAA being companies like Naughty Dog.
Idk if this is a regional thing, but in my high school marching bands were ranked from single to five A, similarly to the levels of high school football.
@@kaminsod4077 it could be a regional thing to the best of my knowledge Indiana only goes up to AAA which is where I’m from.
One thing about the Cost not rising with inflation, that is often overlooked, is that the logistics of games got significantly cheaper.
A 60 dollar game 20 years ago had to be put on a CD, which first had to be purchased, then shipped into stores, which took a chunk of the profits for selling and storing them, and stored until they were sold, so you needed to produce a bunch of extras so they don't run out.
Today Most people buy games online, and even if you buy a hard copy, it often has just a download code. Also significantly more people buy games now.
All this leads me to believe that the 60 dollar price should have gone down at some point, which no Publisher would ever do. But maybe we are now at a point where it should go up.
But those are just my 2 cent on the first 5 minutes of the video.
Eh, CDs are still the cheapest medium to put something onto (including DVDs and even Blurays), I don't think distribution took that much money. At least not as much as 10% or however much Steam takes from big publishers.
@@MrProthall Doesn't Steam just take a flat 7%? (Actually looking into it, Valve takes 30% Whilst Epic Games takes 12%) Which sure, is a LOT in the long-run. But to say that Steam alone takes more cost than distributing hundreds of millions of physical copies of games across numerous countries, AND across numerous consoles/devices is a little ludicrous on your end.
That's not even mentioning advertisements on top of distribution.
@@SxfetyPin Steam take 30% for the first $10m sales after that they only take 20% . 30% is industry standard
@@s0meRand0m129 Damn, that's way steeper than I recalled it being. I must've mixed it up with Epic-- Even so, Epic takes 12%. I wonder where I got 7% from?
@@SxfetyPin your butt.
5:25 Don't go there Bricky. You are going the path of Extra Credits!
Everything you've said has really resonated with me. $70 for an unfinished game that might be fixed in 6 months or 5 years is insane how did we get here? Everyone kept letting gamers know not to pre-order games and to vote with their wallets, told them not to buy it on release without knowing if the game will be good. None of that worked so what's the option now? Pirate the game and make it easier for the average person? If a piracy scare is what it will take for companies to get in line I'm happy to do it, it worked for the music industry and it temporarily worked for the film industry. There's no reason it won't work for the games industry.
the most amazing one that went from indie to AAA over a golden goose is Larian in my opinion. They used to be burdened by being forced to try and emulate the Diablo formula, found a bit of success in early 00's with Divine Divinity which is basically isometric Skyrim, and with the two Original Sin games really cemented the three virtues of AAA as you describe them here. I am very curious how they will handle Baldur's Gate 3
So far, from what I've seen of BG3's early access...... "eXceptionally". With a capital "we need them to dust off some of the old CRPGs; because they've basically figured out how to revitalize that whole subgenre of games".
I've sunk just over 70 hours into Baldur's Gate 3's early access and all I can say is, August 31st can't get here fast enough. The game is excellent.
I played through most of the first zone when it first came out, aka at its buggiest and obviously way less polished, and even then I thought it was a really great game.
FUCK YEAH i feel so happy that you mentionned the Infamous franchise, it's probably THE franchise that stuch with me the most through my childhood, i'd love to see you play one of them!
I’m still surprised it never took off. I was impressed as a kid when I saw ads for those games in the mall’s Gamestop.
Recently I got PSVR2 and have been having the most fun I’ve had in years with the games. The developers of these games have crafted some of the most unique experiences I’ve played, and interestingly the “Triple-A” space isn’t touching it, perhaps a good thing?
Elden ring was the only triple AAA game in recent memory that did not disappoint and lived up to or surpassed the hype
Tears of the Kingdom and God of War: Ragnarok come to mind as well. Maybe even the RE:4 Remake too. And the Dead Space Remake. Come to think of it actually there are probably lots of great AAA games that came out in the last few years neither of us were interested in so we don't know them.
@@gagec6390 2 of those are remakes. Those don't count.
I don’t know about all of you, but i feel the necessity of a deep rock galactic video by bricky. Rock and Stone brothers.
Also, amazing video as always, totally agree with your point, and looking forward to all those “indie game” with overwelmingly positive review on steam!
technically speaking, rocking is more legal than stoning
Funnily enough, the only $70 game I've felt has given me more than my money's worth is Tears of the Kingdom. Pretty much everything has been improved in some way, while also expanding on the world. You're not only tasked with exploring the surface, but also the numerous Sky Islands and the Underground. Both of which are also really, really, really big. There's more Shrines, there's side quests, there's temples, there's an actual story to follow now, there's hidden goodies like strong armor and weapons. It's honestly pretty overwhelming, but god damn is it fun. The freedom is still there and even expanded on, which I thought was impossible after BotW.
Honestly? For a game that is basically glorified expansion pack it's in no way worth 70$. But Nintendo fans will suck ANYTHING up.
The last game I really felt was worth the price before totk was GoW ragnarok. I’m glad that the Zelda devs are willing to put so much effort into their games to develop a good story and fun mechanics. Only complaint is the dogshit that is the switch, but that can be mostly fixed with an emulator
@@Guciom the same guy that buys cod every year
@@Guciomit’s not tho lol
@@Guciom My guy, let me explain: for starters, there are the sky islands and the depths, two whole-ass, brand new layers to breath of the wild's already excellent open world. Secondly, said open world from the first game has changed quite a bit: there's a new town, you have the skyview towers instead of the sheikah towers, all the shrines are different, the lava on the volcano has dried up, tons of caves have opened up (some small, some big), there are at least a dozen new enemies... and i could go on and on. Third, all of link's core abilities are replaced. I still renember the crazy shit people pulled off with stasis and magnesis, and we're already seeing the crazy shit people are pulling off with ultrahand. And lastly, if it feels superficially like it's dlc, it's because the game WAS initially dlc, but the devs kept on adding so much stuff that they decided to just turn it into its own game with proper new game budget. Plus, the game was delayed multiple times to make sure they came out with the best product they can (unlike scarlet and violet), within switch's limited capabillities.
Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk
You know returning back to this video after Palworld, Helldivers 2 and Last Epoch. Feels right.
Damn that point about advertising hit the nail on the head
I would gladly pay $80 for a complete game without micro transactions. I can count on one hand how many AAA games came out complete on release in the last 6 years
one thing to mention as well is while prices have gone up, so have profits. Obviously u want to make as much profit or more profit to counteract the cost even if u still are making money so prices get increased. Basically they are putting the cost onto consumers yet not delivering on said expectations. Especially considering the market is heading toward digital it means companies dont have to pay the usual 30% that comes with physical media
Wanted to play the new Jedi Survivor game. Remained spoiler free, been looking forward to it for a while. Bought it on steam for $70, "Guess we'll see if it's worth 70 then..." I told myself. Installed, booted up, title screen, AND... crashed. Probably nothing major, booted up, title screen, crashed. Rinse and repeat trying everything under the sun. Verifying files, reinstalling, booting as admin.
Then I looked at game reviews only to find out that people had either the EXACT SAME PROBLEM or could barely get it to work AT ALL. I sent a refund request to steam and got it WITHIN THE HOUR. (Took that same $70 bucks to Legend of Zelda and I think I'm addicted).
I while remind you Bolt gun was made by a team whos previous work was a bear making sim and its the most fun ive had with a game this year. Last year it was Daemon Hunters
Not only is Moonbreaker fantastic in the ways you mentioned, it’s got the genius of Brandon Sanderson behind the lore. Shit is on par with GRRM for Elden Ring
Thank you for talking about the inflation reasons. As someone into economics it frusterated me seeing everyone yell "Greed!" When we havent seen a gaming price increase in almost 2 decades. Because the cost of that stavle price was microtransactions and wage stagnation in the industry in relation to rising costs.
However im not defending the bad practices, state of the industry and crapppy releases in recent years. I just wish people understood how impactal these economics forces push and pull people into certain decisions
The "AAA" stands for your internal screaming
about the ABCs of AAA gaming, it seems that quality is now completely optional, same with size because most of those games have nothing to do in them expect tedious fetch quests and a half-assed combat system that's extremely unfun
Recently, I played through both of the Plague Tale games with a friend, and at the end of Requiem, we started talking about how beautiful the game is, what we did and didn't like, and then he asked me; "What if Asobo Studios had AAA money?" I had a visceral reaction to that question. AAA money means that developers like Asobo are now beholden to investors and possibly a publisher above them. With all the recent sub-par AAA releases, I never want indie/AA developers to get AAA money. The games those developers put out today honestly always blow AAA out of the water, either by being just as, if not more, visually beautiful than AAA games, or by have more in-depth mechanics and game systems, or simply having something that draws the player in better than AAA games. I'm probably projecting when I say that I think AAA devs are burned out or lost their passion since they've become AAA or maybe they're just forced to make minimum viable products to please their over lords. I want AA developers to succeed, but I don't want them to have AAA money.
The issue is down to the developers not having the final say on their own project because it's being funded by out-of-touch executives and shareholders who couldn't care less about the game itself. It's a fundamental issue of capitalism that we value simply already having money over the necessary skills needed to actually do the work to make something.
BRICKY over here distracting me from watching my safety videos
As a person who has worked in the restaurant industry, i hate overcooked. It’s too realistic. The questionable restaurant practices, dumb architecture, and chaotic communication within your “team”. Lmao.
I will say I think tears of the kingdom really does deserve the $70 price point I mean the amount of shit it has
Bricky, I'm a game developer by trade while keeping an IT job at the same time. I've been wanting to make video games as a full time job for years but avoid AAA studios like the plague. If you started a studio I'd submit my resume so fast my fingers would break from how fast I would be editing my resume to be game focused rather than IT focused.
Fuckin' refreshing to hear someone in Bricky's tax bracket not try to convince us we're spending the same money.
EA letting the Skate devs take as long as they need is the most unexpected W of this year
Probably finally learned something after being in the hot seat for nearly a decade
Well, to then completely forget that lesson when they made the next game
Also ea doing really well with single player games like dead space remake and the Jedi fallen order? Like where did that come from?
we don't expect a purchased car to be fixed later but it is something we actually do. automotive recalls are just car patches and I can't be convinced otherwise.
"please buy this dodge grand caravan, the Takata airbag might just be an antipersonnel mine aimed at the occupants for the first 4 years its on the market but don't worry about that!"