Video

That is Bambu poop. Besides the purge tower, the Bambu wipes its nozzle and creates filament poop. The Bambu is a very nice printer but very wasteful.

Thanks for the info!

XL 5T owner here, have it for 6 weeks now and it is running 24/7 without issues. It is fast, super quality, super reliable and no waste. But it is a comprehensive machine that requires proper setup and tuning. That is evident for a machine with 5 toolheads, and the setup process is easy and straightforward. Nothing to do with beta testing. (It is properly designed and tested)

We have definitly spent some time as beta testers. I think Prusa has made a number of improvements since I recieved my printer. I haven't had time to try out all the updates made since posting this video, but they seem be resolving issues over time.

Actually a little longer then 5hrs. Almost every layer has a color change so my bambu X1C has to purge at every layer. This is using standard settings on the X1C. The Prusa XL has no purging.

I have a feeling you’ve purged more material than you actually used for the print itself! 5h! That’s ridiculous! 😮

Very good points.

I agree, the print failed, waste and time are irrelevant comparisons when the Prusa print is a failure. He should re-do this video with successful prints.

I would agree that it prints faster since it has little to no purge with multicolor/material prints, but I am still not sure of the value considering time spent setting it up. I see Prusa is now going to include the 0.4mm nozzle instead of the 0.6mm with is has lots of stringing issues. That will be a big improvement for new customers purchasing the XL. It would have been nice if tech support would have told me this before I purchased 5 0.4mm nozzles.

@@timzebra You might talk to them about it. They have reduced the price of the.4 nozzle for current owners who had the .6 delivered. I got 5 nozzles for under $80 including $15 shipping to the US

I agree it is better at this time and I am not sure if Pursa will ever get the XL to the level of a bambu X1C. But I still can get faster multicolor prints from the XL, just not the best quality and still very picky with filament stringing, even with the 0.4mm nozzles.

And using a P1S you can get the same performance at even lower price from Bambu.

I agree. I have used the MMU in the past and ended up selling it. There were too many filament feeding issues for me.

The video was recorded with a gopro camera then use a video editing software to speed it up.

@@timzebra Thanks. I have a gopro , but don't edit

@@woodwaker1 GoPro also has a timelapse mode.

@@dennishodge4516 Thanks, I will try to figure it out. Not that great at getting it to do what I want it to do

But then you lose a decent percentage of money on all the filament waste.

@@aaronchamberlain4698as someone who literally sells multicolor prints printed with Bambulab AMS, I print in bulk so I’m usually printing 16-30 items at a time, the filament swap waste means nothing. Literally workout me spending an extra 10% on filament to make product which is an entire batch of even a lower number like 16 sell for a total of $160 and I am only using 1kg of filament even at the highest waste which could be 150g, I’m wasting $2.50.

You could buy a filament extruder too

XL can do multi materials more reliably than Bambu, I think that's the big difference. And I'm not knocking the Bambu

@@krollmond7544 I don’t know about that. Everything I’ve seen from people with both. The Bambu is way more reliable.

Sure. The filament for the Bambu Labs X1C purging (waste) is 12.79m. The Prusa XL wipe tower (waste) used 1.05m. The models are the same but here is what the slicer says: Bambu Labs used 9.13m and Prusa XL used 6.5m. Both models have 15% infill, 2 perimeters, 3 top and 3 bottom layers. These are slicer numbers and not actual measurements from printing. I also did not try to optimize the purging of filament on the Bambu Labs for this comparison.

@ravenblackfeather4612 It is mainly to wipe the nozzle between tool changes, but it can be printed without it. I have another video of a larger benchy printed without a wipe tower and it seemed to print fine.

@@timzebra cool! Thank you!

The bambu has a 'wipe' or 'purge' tower, the Prusa XL has a 'prime' tower. A prime tower is used to prime the extruder (ensure proper pressure and flow) before it continues printing. The waste of a prime tower is marginal compared to a wipe or purge tower and the XL can do without it but it improves print quality.

Less waste but more problems

Yes I agree the two tool heads used for this are slightly off. I am not sure if it was something that happened with calibration or something I will need to manually adjust after calibration. I have the 5 tool head version and every time I switched a nozzle from 0.4mm to 0.6mm I have to re-run the calibration which I would expect.

XL 5T owner here, have it for 6 weeks now and it is running 24/7 without issues. It is fast, super quality, super reliable and no waste. But it needs to be setup and calibrated properly. It seems that the misalignment comes from a nozzle change without recalibration. That is an operator error not a machine deficiency.

Bambu Labs have some great printers and you really can't go wrong with what you get for the price. My X1C just keeps printing great without a lot of tinkering. I was waiting as long as possilbe to see if they would come out with a larger build volume printer, but final deciced to complete my pre-order for the prusa XL. The Prusa XL is really amazing to watch print, but very frustrating when it doesn't print well. I am hopeful Prusa will continually improve and it seems the printer is getting to a point where new owners will have less issues. My XL is still very sensitive to filaments and now I print temperature towers to find the best lowest stringing temperatures. I also wish Prusa had installed 0.4mm nozzles or gave a choice with the nozzle size....or included multiple nozzle sizes similar to what Bambu Labs did with the first printers ordered.

@@timzebra such an expensive machine like the XL shouldn't require so much fiddling. it seems you can release half finished product, expect end users to fix all your bugs for you, and any criticism can be dismissed with "BuT iTs OpEn SoUrCe". like that makes it ok somehow.

where did you get the idea from the the XL can only do 2 colors?

@@Pixelplanet5 The XL can only do ONE colour for the €2000 he named. If you want 5 colours it's an eye watering €3700 and that's semi-assembled! Basically, you can buy three X1Cs for the price of one XL with 5 colours.

@@redavatar yea obviously if you buy a single tool head XL it can only do one color at a time, but you know that when you buy it and will buy that for a reason. Also no matter how many X1C you can buy for the price, if you need the build volume you can buy 10000 x1C and they will all still be too small. The XLs build volume is 3 times larger than the X1C so you simply buy the right tool for the job that you need it to do.

@@Pixelplanet5 For the very specific use case of huge multi colour prints, yes you're correct. I don't see myself printing anything multi colour that big myself but I'm sure there's a niche market for it. It's still a very expensive machine and you can't equate build volume to price - I'm sure Bambu is working on a large format printer too, maybe not enclosed and if it will be 50% more expensive, it will be a lot because that's generally what you pay extra for a bed twice the size in cm².

@@Pixelplanet5 in a single print it can only do as many colors as heads. This video has 2 heads, thus 2 colors for this $2000 spec'd printer.

The video says they're both using 0.4 nozzles

Good luck fitting 10 lizards on the Bambus much smaller bed Even then the waste isn't comparable

Using the original size of this model, downloaded from Thingiverse, 7 lizards do fit on the plate of an X1 or P1 series Bambu. You will be able to fit 13 of them on the XL plate. OTOH you can buy 3 Bambu Lab P1S each including a 4 spool AMS and 1 additional P1S without AMS for the price of 1 Prusa XL with 5 Toolheads. And you can upgrade each of the P1S to a max of 4 AMSs, resulting in 16 colors you can print at once. The waste should be about 6cm of filament per color change using the Bambu AMS if you tune it down to what's really necessary and there is a working filament change hack (6 lines of G-Code you'll have to insert into the custom G-Code of your printer profile) which will save 2cm on each filament change, so it could be as low as about 4cm per change. Also the Bambu printers do print at higher speeds with better quality than what I've seen from the Prusa XL so far. Do the math. If your goal is to save maybe 2cm of Filament per color change, print very large objects in one piece (which will still take a long, long time on the XL) or print multicolor soft TPU which will supposedly be easier with a toolchanger than with the AMS and you have a lot of money to spend, then go for the XL if not I would consider buying a Bambu Lab P1 or X1 series machine or something comparable.

@@thomasscheiblauer9775 the XL has input shaping, and while the firmware is in the works, it'll have speed rivaling the bambu soon enough, just like the qidi or k1. The XL can print things like TPU and PVA which the bambu just full stop can't do, and prusa is much more consumer friendly then bambu (why does bambu encrypt log files) also this is all assuming I want 13 lizards, which you're intentionally doing to bias in favor of the bambu. I dunno about you but I generally don't need more then one lizard, and the XL is miles faster in that regard

@@user-zx4vq4uk9c The XL Input Shaping firmware is still in alpha and the XL does not have an accelerometer in its print head so it has to rely on measurements done by Prusa Research. It's not clear that this will work as well as letting the printer itself do its measurement because it also depends on how you set up your printer. The Bambu Printers can of course do TPU, just officially not multicolor, although some people manage to print TPU with a shore hardness of >=95A from the AMS. I print TPU with a shore hardness of 98A with a volumetric flow of 10mm³/s (faster is possible but I want to be on the safe side) which results in an effective print speed of 120mm/s when printing with 0.42mm line width and 0.2mm layer height. 85A still works at at least 8mm³/s. TPU softer than about 85A is not easy to do, you have to tune the filament profile very carefully and you can't print fast but I manage to print Recreus Filaflex 70A and even 60A consistently and beautifully with a volumetric flow of 3mm³/s, which results in 35mm/s print speed using the aforementioned line width and layer height settings. If you only need one lizard then it shouldn't be a problem, waiting an hour or whatever longer but there are people who print commercially and those usually have to put as many objects as possible on one plate and print as fast as possible. I don't do this myself but I know some people who print lots of tiny snowman and Christmas tree key chains at the moment which they put on sale in stores nearby. Also what I said is that you can put 13 lizards onto the XL plate and only 7 onto the Bambu, this is not in favor of the Bambu! I'd only be interested if the XL could print those 13 multicolor lizards (or at least only 7) quicker or at least as quick as a Bambu the 7 ones with about the same quality output, because this would also have to be considered if you do it commercially and have to have a high multicolor throughput. Printing just one lizard does not provide this information.

Prusa will still print them faster lmao. Considerably faster. An MK4 with IS can already print as fast as any bambu printer. XL will be even faster than the MK4.

No problem!

I think that’s part of the design

I was thinking the same and the model does seem to have some gaps, but looking at my latest comparision print between bambu labs X1C and Prusa XL of the normal size lizard it looks like the tool head calibration is off very slightly.

I will try to show another smaller version of the model is a separate video that compares both prints on bambu and Prusa XL. It is not possilbe to print the same size model on a bambu X1C because it exceeds the print area. Since the quality is now about the same between the two smaller models I am really looking at the print time improvements with multi material prints. The Prusa XL has been very very difficult to work with, but the time saved when printing multi color prints so far seems worth it.

@@timzebra Thank you for the reply.

Working on it. I ordered some 0.4mm nozzles from Prusa. My biggest concern is still with the stringing. I haven't tried the latest info I have from Prusa tech support since it requires taking sometime to verfiy the nozzles are fully inserted into the heatsink, and also that their grub screw is tightened securly.

I will take a look but I am using the latest alpha firmware from their github. In Prusa's blog post they did indicate they have a stringing problem they are working on. I did not see an update yet from Prusa, but again I will take a look.

Yes, That is what comes with the Prusa XL. It can print down to 0.15mm with the prusa slicer settings for the Prusa XL. The larger nozzle detail is lost more in the horizontal plane then the vertical plane. I am trying to get 0.4mm nozzles for the Prusa XL to see if printing improves. Overall the quality on other prints I have done is not too bad. Even the video of the 200% larger 3DBenchy with no wipe towor is acceptalble to me.

I am thinking that as well. I have few 0.4mm nozzles ordered to try out.

@@timzebra If you can assign different nozzles to independent prints, do two of the two color benchy at the same exact time, but with 2 nozzles rocking the .4 and two rocking the .6, and then we'll get to see a real time side by side comparison.

@@grantdeisig1360 That would be an interesting test for sure.

I switched to 0.4mm nozzles and still have plenty of stringing. The only things that helps is reducing temps, but it does not completely eliminate stringing.

@@gpt10 Really? Well I guess we'll just be waiting for Prusa to update the firmware and printer profiles.

Yes print speed setting are slower on the XL vs the X1C. For this print I only used the profiles provided by the manufacture without tuning the settings. The profile provided in the Prusa slicer was for the Prusa XL 5 Tool Input Shaper (perimeters are 125mm/s, infill 200mm/s), which is the 0.2mm speed setting. I have made no other modifications except to move the wipe tower and model. Same with the bambu lab printer, I used the standard 0.2mm profile setting (outer wall 200mm/s, inner wall 300mm/s, infill 270mm/s). I am basically trying to see what I get with an out of box experince and no tuning, which seems fair to compare. For another print I used the same filament between the Prusa XL and Bambu X1C (not shown yet) to see if the stringing followed the filament. It printed fine on the bambu, and some stringing on the XL. Nozzle alignment calibration has been repeated a couple times on the XL and I don't see any issues with the alignment. Right now my main issue is with stringing on the X, so now I am looking at what to tune on the XL. I have ordered a few 0.4mm nozzles to try, and I am drying some filamenent out, and looking at adding some additional cooling. I also have a follow-up with Prusa tech support, but still awaiting a responce to see if they have any suggestions. Prusa's blog post on Input Shaping does talk about stringing issues and that they are trying to address them in some way. The post also states that some people have improvements with lowering the print temperature, but I have not. I have multiple stringing tests on single filaments and all but one has stringing issues, so maybe drying the filament will help as others have suggested. I realize this is still Prusa's alpha firmware for IS, so I expect Prusa will improve over time.

@@timzebra But to even add time into the mix, the nozzles would need to be the same size. It can affect the level of details you can achieve, amount of stringing, top surface finish, retraction, speed of printing perimeters. 0.4mm will be able to do more of the fine detail. And if you look at the port holes on the XL version, on one side the port hole isn't attached to the model, and the other side it's larger. Makes me believe the nozzles aren't perfectly aligned in the X and Y direction. Or that the 0.6mm nozzle is affecting this section. I would like to see how using the same size nozzles for a more fair comparison. Also appears that the XL needs more purging between swaps, it's currently bleeding badly between the colors.

@@timzebra Good luck with the further testing!

@@drpainnuk3d Each nozzle has a dedicated color so there is no purging of color on the Prusa XL. Unless I am missing the point. Bambu would have the color purgeing issue. I guess prusa built the XL for big prints so the 0.6 nozzles were include to print parts faster. It would have been nice to have the option for 0.4mm from the start. Anyway a few 0.4mm nozzles are ordered.

print speed is irrelevant what matters is time to finish. the XL will obviously be slower, it has more than 3 times the build volume and a tool changer so it cant move faster for obvious reasons.

I didn't change any parameter other then using the Input Shaping 5 Tool configuration

Generally the tower is needed as a wipe tower before the next tool head starts printing. Single color prints will have not wipe tower. I did post of video of a two color print with no wipe tower to see how it came out and it seemed fine. The wipe tower should help prevent blobs from being deposited on the print during the filament changes. It does seem like it can be minimized with Prusa's XL multi tool head design

Right now all the poop is mixed in with other prints, but definintely there is a bunch.

Yes I need to get some 0.4 nozzels for the XL

Hope you enjoy it!

I understand that. I spend significantly more time with just trying to get the XL printing good, but the multple tool heads are what got me to purchase the XL. I think the XL has a lot of potential but price and quality issues will stop a lot people from trying it.

Of course, the thing with the toolheads is super strong, so generally speaking, prusa products are just unfairly expensive. Compared to the competition. I basically don't care which company the printer or hardware comes from, but I have to charge a price like that for them The quality that an Anycubic I3 Mega easily achieves is simply cheeky. As long as you don't really want to "mod" the printer and just want to print out of the box in a super relaxed manner without a headache, I would recommend a printer from Bambulap to everyone. Not necessarily the A1 mini but everything is correct P1S or P1p. It doesn't even have to be the x1Carbon. With Bambu, not everything that glitters is gold (Ams Rectract failur cough cough* but out of the box it's significantly better than the Prusa Xl. @@timzebra

@@skyblazer5361 Very true. It was really hard to complete my order for the Prusa XL knowing some of the issues people were having. In the end I hit the order button and was interested in multi material capablity and lower waste in purge towers (some prints don't need a purge tower). Single color seems to work very well now but still some stringing gets in the way. For mulit color/material, I am still testing prints. For the most part my Bambu printers just print when I ask them to, but I know they are not perfect. I have had a few jams in the AMS, but they are not overly complicated to fix.

True, I think I will need to try drying out the filiment and get some dry boxes for the XL and feed directly from them to the printer. For the purge tower, my Bambu definetly uses more filament, although I have never tried to reduce it. I saw some people getting good prints without the purge tower on the XL. I tried a larger benchy print with no purge tower and it seems fine, but more stringing then I would like to clean up.

I would like to try the voron build someday. The XL definetly took much more build time then I was expecting as a semi-assembled printer. I just reprinted a couple small parts for the XL per Prusa's request to see if print quality improved. I am still testing that change and hopefully it helps.

I have the 0.6 nozzles installed. I did run another 3dbenchy with 0.20 layer and it seemed to look a little better but probably not as good as I would like. Just recieved an email from Prusa regarding my original tech support chat and they suggested loosening the Z-axis bearing housings (a couple turns on the screws) on the sides of the bed, to give more tolerance in that area, then re-run the tool calibration. After that re-run the test print. They also sent a new design revision of the Z-axis bearing housings files to print and install if the prevous steps help. So I have some more work to do.

The latest alpha firmware for the XL seems to improve the print quality significantly. I did not need to re-calibrate and I repeated this print a couple times with very good results using the alpha firmware for input shaping release a couple weeks ago.

I would agree, but I think they are improving. It may also be the minimal infill used to make a fast test print for the XL.

yeah definitely disappointing... tool changing speed: 5/5... print quality: 2/5.

@@shenqiangshou Tool changes are amazingly fast. Faster if you can avoid the wipe tower, which seems possilbe for some prints.

It is a very easy to setup and use 3D Printer. Packaging was great. I would like to see more printer profiles for other slicers like prusa slicer.