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An outlandish proposal, but I would like to turn it into a tube line & extend it underground to connect Harrow & Wealdstone to Harrow-on-the-Hill (because getting between the two is a pain). From Harrow, it should continue to Roxeth, South Harrow, Northolt Park and Greenford to take over the shuttle to West Ealing, then through a new tunnel under Haven Green to connect with the Ealing Broadway branch of the District line. Or alternatively from Northolt Park to Northolt, Target, Yeading, Willow Tree, Hayes Bridge and Southall, then above-ground to Windmill Park, Trumpers Crossing, Wyke Green and Brentford West.

i was born 2 minutes away

hmmmm.. I was stationed at Bentley Priory a couple of times in the 1990s. A big part of my past. Never knew there was a railway line....

we used to play near by and on and around the Schweppes factory . Happy days as a child ...room for adventure. I always thought the name " Rattler" was cos we used to collect slow- worms there and slow worms were little ' rattler like snakes' I learnt alot by this video. enjoyed my primary school years having carefree fun and walking for miles . Thank you

Breerly Hill? River Ree? Are you local? Curiously King's Norton Station is in Cotteridge. You do overuse the words now and however in your script. You're right about frequency. The cross city line is very busy and needs frequent services especially at peak times. The main areas that need a rail connection are King's Heath and Moseley. The problem is the camp hill line operates a bypass for cross country routes.

As this is England, opening a new/ reinstated passenger service with diesel trains is normal🙄. East-West Rail is another prime example, where project cost escalation led to electrification and the Aylesbury-Claydon upgrade being cut. Many projects are 'one step at a time' and where reasonably decent modern DMUs available to start with they are better than nothing. I don't know the detail of Moseley Tunnel but these days discontinuous electrification techniques are available. This is fine where all trains can coast through the 'missing' sections without risk of stranding, but as this is rarely feasible on suburban lines it does mean having to build (or retrofit) a fleet of hybrid AC/Duracell trains.

I think if the funds were with governments TFL and local council , as London is expanding a lot of lines and railways stations should reopened, but recently as one or two lines across the country have been put back into the network! As for this, line could become part of the overground service link with Willesden via Bakerloo branch ? There purposals to build on fright line around Neasden to west London! It's possible and with pollution of vehicles case for the Mayor maybe put it to TFL?

This returns memories of my ad hoc pleasurable visits to Brent Cross. Shopping centre. Spending hours mooching !❤ could be back there soon.😊

Billionaires are very stingy. They want everyone to pay for their kids to go to school

May I add that the 146 also serves Hayes school which is one of the highest achieving schools in SE London. My brother actually went there for sixth form and got all A's.

It’s for the staff who work in the houses

Was the 631 once the H1?🎩🤔

hi there, good video, i have all the books on this line which are hard to get now,the "rattler was the DMU" not the steam loco and rolling stock,all first generation dmu's used to rattle.the dmu on this line was a park royal 2 car set,final service from belmont wasthe13,39 to harrow,in 1951 a fowler2-6-2t locowas used.these were based at watford shed,if you were lucky a Bowden- Cooke 0-8-0 tank loco could be seen running up to stanmore,

Another excellent video. I've often been curious about this line. All the best from Kuala Lumpur.

Great video. I've shared it onto my Threads account.

I recall seeing a single car DMU at Belmont in the early 60’s and can remember the station at Stanmore Village

I mapped some of London’s lost lines, including this one, here: www.google.com/mymaps/viewer?mid=19ORudIUHIDnlQqMZXF38xCma_CR0C3rN&hl=en

I would reopen the line as a tramway. This tramway would stretch from Harrow & Wealdstone/Bushey on the west to Finsbury Park/Alexandra Palace on the east. The tramway would take the former platform at Harrow & Wealdstone and split it into two like at Wimbledon. The Harrow branch would call at the intermediate stops of Bryton Park, Belmont & Stanmore Village. The Bushey Branch would called at the intermediate stops of The Grange, Melbourne Road, High Bushey, The Common and Stanmore Hill. The Harrow and Bushey branches would join up at a junction by the interchange by Sainsbury near Stanmore Hill. The Finsbury Park branch would call at the intermediate stations of Stroud Green, Ashmount, Stanhope Road and Highgate. The Alexandra Palace branch would have stations at Cranley Green, Muswell Hill and Alexandra Park. The Finsbury Park and Alexandra Palace branch would join up at a junction by Highgate Depot. Where they would run togther and calling at the intermediate stations of: East Finchley, Long Lane Pasture, Finchley Central, Dollis Brook, Mill Hill East, Chase Lodge, Mill Hill Broadway, Edgware Broadway, Park Grove and Stanmore. There would be a possibility of also doing a Edgware Town branch would would come off the joint running between Park Grove and Edgware Broadway on a triangle Junction. The Edgware Town Branch would have intermediate stations at Edgware, Holland House, London Gateway, Elstree Fields, Elstree & Borehamwood, Elstree Studio, Elstree Industrial, Hertsmere and Hertsmere North. The tramway would reuse the old tunnels by Highgate as well as the Northern Heights alignment. It would take over the Northern Line Mill Hill East Branch. There would be an extra pair tracks built for tram between Finchley Central and Finchley East. Each service would operate at 4tph off peak and 6tph in the peak, so there would be four services without the Edgware town branch. With the Edgware Town Branch there would be eight services running at 4tph all day due to the mixed traffic nature of the line it is no possible to run at more than 24tph on the streets with traffic hence to provide 12tph on each branch while providing a direct link to branches on the without Edgeware Town and three branches with Edgeware Town. If you would like the maps, I made please do feel free ask then I can send them across in the best way.

I went everywhere on the Belmont Rattler, lived in the same road as it! Very sad when it closed in October 1964.

The station house at Stanmore is still there

We used to know it as the The Belmont Rattler in the 1950's and often played on the almost disused track. I can recall seeing the odd goods train, just a couple of carriages.

What a treat to see such a thoroughly detailed and well researched video about my very very very local area! (The street I grew up on got mentioned!!) I’ve given this old line a lot of thought. While it’s always sad to see a railway closed, with my sensible hat on, this does seem to be one of the very few cases where Beeching was right to close it. Having to change at Harrow and Wealdstone to get to central London would never be able to compete with the Jubilee line. Also, the 186 is more frequent (and, from what I’ve read, probably faster!) than the Rattler ever was. Thanks for making such a great video! 🙂

I worked as a surveyor for Harrow Council in the 1980s and had a bit to do with setting up the Belmont Trail walkway (keeping the route free of dumping and encroachments at that stage). You mention that the trail stops at Vernon Drive and that was the site of a rare foot-crossing on London's railways, allowing walkers to access Wemborough Road.

A lot of people living in belmont either drive, get dropped off or take the bus to Preston road or Northwick Park for a quick met line into the city 😊

Fantastic, well researched video. I’ve done extensive reading about this former line to learn more about local history. You’ve summed it up so well. Thank you.

I hope you get to make a video on the Croxley and Rickmansworth lines that were almost reopened as part of the plan to extend the Met to an actually useful station in Watford. The whole story of the Met and LNWR in the Watford area is fascinating to me and I was studying near there back in 2010-13 when the plan to extend the Met looked like it might go ahead. Also, the Alban Way is a great orbital route that might warrant a video; I've walked it and it's a nice hike (except for the bit where the M1 cuts across your path).

Bishops Avenue, the naffest place to live in London.

Interesting - I hadn't realised it had ever had a service every 10 minutes, even in the peaks! As you say, it would probably be difficult to rebuild the line as it was. The least good bit of the transport network in the area is getting from H&W to HotH - there are frequent buses, but ithey take ages for the less than two miles, which a rail connection would probably do in three minutes. But that would have to be underground! Perhaps it might be possible as part of a new/re-opened north London orbital rail route: Harrow-on-the-Hill > H&W > Stanmore (Jub) > Edgware > Mill Hilll B'way (T-link/WLO) > Mill Hill E > Finchley Ctrl > E.Finchley > Highgate (surface level) > Crouch End > Stroud Gn > Finsbury Pk. Personally I'd then join it to the Piccadilly, giving that line two branches at its north-east end, to match its two branches in the west; that would also make any tunnelling cheaper - tube sized. But it could also join the Overground - perhaps re-using the Palace Gates line. Look forward to your next video

I remember playing on the remnants of the Rattler as a child, before it was a trail. With my friends, I would cycle up from Kenton Park to Belmont to thrash a few hundred yards through the jungle towards Stanmore. My first Saturday job was with Donaldsons Estate Agents on Belmont Circle

Great video..Belmont history in particular.. except for locals it's hard to believe the line was built in the first place!...I'm close to Harrow leisure centre (Trial beginning)- which is relatively poorly served - As u said buses are ok - also incl 324 at Stanmore & H19 at Belmont. Any time delays can be offset by fast trains to Central London

good vid g

How else are the staff expected to get to work?

There is a proposal to push the tramway on from New Addington to Biggin Hill Valley. As always it's a question of money.

The 146 runs an efficient schedule to get an hourly service out of 1 bus. Extending the route to Biggin Hill would add 30 minutes to the round trip time, meaning either reducing the frequency to 90 minutes, or running more buses. You could viably have 3 buses interworking the 146 and R8, running Bromley > Biggin Hill > Orpington > Biggin Hill > Bromley on a 3-hour cycle, giving an hourly service on each route and a half-hourly service between Downe and Biggin Hill, but that seems like overkill for the very low passenger numbers. A village like that in Not London would be lucky to get 3 or 4 buses a day, at best!

This was one of the first LT bus route Awarded om competitive tender. When Crystal's won the route in the 80s

Thanks for covering this delightful route. Growing up around Sevenoaks, this was not unfamiliar territory, and I remember double-deck RTs on the 146 which ran, I'm sure, more often than half-hourly. For the present, I would have thought that more frequent buses would generate more passengers. It is great though that the timetable is from 6am to nearly midnight. Maybe better, though, to increase the R8 to hourly and have it connect reasonably with the 146. I know that TfL are probably wrestling with the practicalities of staff schedules and how to get quarts out of pint-pots, but this is an era when we need to get people out of cars and into public transport, and frequency is a key generator of custom - even on rural routes. And for individual passengers, their travel needs are mostly the same whether they live on an urban estate or in a cottage down a lane. What I'd really like is for TfL to use the bus numbering system to give an idea of frequency - like the 600 series are generally school buses. So maybe 500s for hourly, 400s for half-hourly, 300s for quarter-hourly etc.. I'm not sure that the letter prefixes (R etc.) have ever stood for anything useful! But to look at a bus map, or the list of route numbers on a bus stop flag, and to be able to see immediately which buses are most likely to come soon, would make bus travel a lot easier and more popular.

Another little route to add to my list of ones you do a video on - going to do all of these just because I can really... Also, love how the shot of the red car on the corner shows it has a parking ticket

I literally did this the other day

re Brentford: only a minor addition, but in 2014 the Didcot steam centre ran their Steam Railmotor up and down the line for a weekend - czcams.com/video/eL-CudtGfEk/video.html. I guess with ther Southall depot still in use by West Coast Railways (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southall_Railway_Centre), heritage trips would be possible at weekend, but like anything, it needs the effort and money. The GWRPG folded in 2021.

It’s Mose-ley, not Moserley; Bordes-ley, not Bordersley. And economy, not e-conomy. Not a bad vid, but not sure about the commentary though.

I worked on the development of Tramlink from 1989 so have some background knowledge. Woodside to Selsdon closed in 1983 due to low passenger numbers. Addiscombe also had very low passenger numbers due to its location and with East Croydon offering faster and more frequent services to London, but Woodside had better use. The Addiscombe to Elmers End line only survived because the EPB stock was stabled at Addiscombe, and British Rail already had plans to close the branch once the new trains were in service. Closure would have happened with or without the Tramlink project. One of the objectives of Tramlink was to improve links between Croydon and Bromley borough, so use of the line to Elmers End was an obvious option, which also kept a service to Woodside (with the branch to Beckenham Junction added later during the project development). We considered a route option that would use the branch through to Addiscombe Station, but that would then have required street running of trams on Clyde Road (southbound) and Canning Road (northbound) to reach Addiscombe Road and East Croydon. So following the then-disused Selsdon Line provided a better option, and which also connected with the route to New Addington.

Breerly Hill???????????????????

Not that complex with the superloop buses now, but orbital trains would be useful

Excellent video my friends awesome like 👍🏻 Greeting from Argentina nuevo subcritor suscribete 😊

Interesting, I wasn't aware of the Addiscombe plans as I only moved to the area in 2010 and Blackhorse Lane is now my local tram stop. It was nice to see a photo of Woodside in the steam days.

First time I've ever heard anyone say ceased the same as seized.

If the Croxley Rail Link (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Croxley_Rail_Link) ever gets built (yes, I know, dream on), a heritage railway from Croxley to Watford (Met) would probably be a great success given its proximity to Cassiobury Park with its miniature railway, as well as the River Colne and various other recreational amenities.

Great work, once again. Here's the link to Part 1, covering Grove Park-Bromley North and Custom House-North Woolwich: czcams.com/video/aKXmVd8RWA8/video.html

How do i get envoled in heritage railways? Best Regards Terence.

The extension to Brentford SWR would need a new bridge across the Thames with clearance for navigation. Probably a non starter because of the cost (the only thing that matters today).