Debate: Should trans athletes be allowed in competitive women's sports?
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- čas přidán 26. 08. 2024
- 'I'm more in favour of individual assessment rather than a blanket ban'
'It comes down to fairness, women's sport is for women'
Human rights campaigner Peter Tatchell and Debbie Hayton, trans teacher and journalist, debate whether trans athletes should compete in women's sports
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There is a reason why men and women compete together on quiz shows and compete separately in athletics.
.
You don't know much about sport do you ?
Peter is a fool. So sick of people like him who caused the problem in the first place.
Stonewall have jumped on the trans bandwagon in an attempt to stay relevant and keep the money rolling in.
100%
He advocates that children can give consent to sexual relationships with adults and enjoy it 🤢🤮 vile man!
@@HelloKittykat21 WTF really?? Creep
@@ilan9588 He really is!
That small transgender football player is still taking the place of a real woman.
yes exactly. Taking a real women spot.
@@kismet256 it’s also the one example he trots out every time this subject comes up. I’m starting to wonder whether the small transgender football player exists.
@@littlecatfeet9064 even if he is small doesn’t make much of a difference.
I m 1.58, 47 kilos, I compete with women 1.70 it doesn’t really make much of a difference, but a man even 1.65 or 1.70 it’s a huge difference especially in sports that require contact.
What he is trying to say, it’s find the one guy who wants to transition who has never exercised, it’s so thin and short who thinks that playing tennis on your laptop is actually a sport.
"Should *males* be allowed in women's competitive sport?"
There - fixed it for you. And the answer is, of course - NO.
BLOKES have their own category.
What a silly question when the obvious answer is No,if they want to compete have your own teams ,if not enough to get a team then recruit some .wether or not there are small men a man is a man,and biological woman is a woman end of.
Why is this even a question? Sport is divided by biology, not gender identity. It doesn’t matter what gender a person identifies with, it’s their biological make-up that categorises them. Would it be fair to allow abled-bodied athletes to compete in the Paralympics? By it’s very nature, sport has to be exclusionary, in order to ensure competitiveness.
You put it clearly.
You clarified that very well Taj. And you are completely right. Whenever we're born the midwife tells our mother it's a boy or a girl. That never changes, and sport is divided into those exact categories. The wannabes can form their own sporting category, although they are 0.1% of the population and might find competition difficult to find.
that is one hell of a reply,
it says everything that most of us are thinking 👍
True, I don't understand why biological sex classification, all of a sudden has become a complex issue. By the way, why is the activist not advocating for transgender men to be allowed to compete against biological men in sports? Is it because there is no advantage there?🤔
Notice how the actual trans person says it's perfectly fine while the 'activist' with the rainbow tie is doing all kinds of mental gymnastics to come up with a reason why it's wrong. Very telling.
Seconded
Autogynephilic you mean 🤔
Try Googling him….much more telling.
@@HelloKittykat21 that gender typology is discredited
@@AyeshaNicoleSmith101 Hmmm not sure on that when Debbie Hayton even acknowledges it.
Of course not.
Why are we indulging such silliness?
Peter Tatchell's arguments are not sensible. In sports, women (and men) compete against the best in their category and are usually similar in physiology and ability.
THERE MUST BE SOME ROUGH WOMEN WHERE YOU COME FROM .
@@bazrobb6242 yes you are right. It's a recipe for small women to compete against 10 year old boys? Same weight? Tatchell....do they have the same level of testosterone? No! Tatchell's opinion is just an example of being contrarian. A decade ago he was arguing for men having sex with boys! Note the LGBT fascist flags behind Tatchell!
@@bazrobb6242 but they would still be women.
The logic in that argument has sail a looong time ago...
That dude just demonstrates to know nothing of how sport competitions actually works
Yes. And in some sports they DO further differentiate by weight categories (boxing, wrestling, weight-lifting), but they remain segregated by sex, as they should. If more sports wanted to do this because the numbers warranted it, that would be fine but small men are not women, and tall/heavy women are not men.
the guy in question was crap in the mens swimming so now says he's a women and wins lol what a joke to real women who train bloody hard
How dare you not call her a real woman?! 🙊😂😂😂
i am betting that now he is not allowed to compete, his transition back to male will begin very soon
@@mariaf4396 that takes balls
@@dogfriendly1623 🤣then he is halfway there
With the mental gymnastics we are all expected to do in order to keep these minority groups happy perhaps we all deserve a fkking gold medal?
Stop asking stupid questions - of course they shouldn't they are basically blokes in frocks making a mockery of women's sports and at worst being perved upon in the changing rooms - its absolutely stupid
The Gender Recognition Act and the Equality Act (and similar legislation in the western world) make these once "stupid questions" IMPORTANT ones to ask. It was more pressing for our modern politicians to virtue signal their inclusive 'woke' ideologies by legislating legal fiction, than to use their positions to protect women in every strata of life.
Im sorry - why are you asking two biological males for their opinions on women's sport like they're some kind of authority, GB News? 🤔
AND calling him 'she'!
@Stacey A there are two female reporters, one male and one trans woman who acknowledges sex differences in the conversation so I would say on balance, as these issues effect everyone, its legitimate to have a mixture of views and people, as reflected here. I think it is a huge mistake to say particular peoples opinions or views should not have a platform based on their anatomy...women fought a long hard battle against exclusion based on sex, and that cuts both ways.
@@shelleyphilcox4743 And not one of those people is an elite female athlete! Not a single one! Im quite sure the producers could have found someone more suitable than Tatchell, who is a bloody disgrace to the LGB community, to debate this!
Lol good point
We should support the transgender people. who speak up. They get a lot of abuse for not supporting the madness
Yeah those biological women who have an advantage in size and strength over other biological women are called bronze, silver and gold medalists. That's how sport works Mr Tatchell.
It’s the dumbest argument. Instead of a male/ female category the NBA need a:
black 5”8 65kg skill level 8 category
White 6”2 122kg skill level 7.1 category
Mixed race 5”1 75 kg skill level 9.4 category
South Asian 5”4 90 kg skill level 8.5 category
Etc etc etc
The list is ENDLESS. All this just to included the trans. It’s beyond dumb. 99.9% of people are happy with 2 categories
@@memyselfandi2506 NO.
Female category and male separate. We arent only different in height and weight
We have different ORGANS and skeletons.
@@DeAnnaParisRN when u so “no” do u realise that I’m saying Peter tatchells argument is dumb and that I believe that men and womens should be separate like u do
@@memyselfandi2506 thank god.
He's woke as fuck. The tie speaks a thousand words. The flag speaks a thousand more
He's also a strong advocate for the lowering of the age of consent and pushes the vile idea that children can consent to sexual relationships with adults and enjoy it 🤢🤮🤮
Two blokes, neither of them athletes, debating women's right to single sex sport...
The fact that this was even asked and debated shows how much society is fucked.
Totally.
Androgyny is one of the last signs of a declining civilization
western society
It is not for men such as Peter Tatchell to decide what women should accept in women's sports. Women are adult human females and they should not be discriminated against in their own sport by biological males who have general physical advantage (larger hearts, more bone density and more muscle mass). Women's sports should be just that - for women (definition adult human females).
What a silly argument Peter.
Going by what Peter Tatchell says, what is the point of having sport segregated at all? Let's just make it a free for all - and watch women give up competition altogether.
True, I even like what the trans-woman said, if you have an open category with trans-woman and trans-men then the trans-woman would always dominate because they still have the biological attributes of a man, and trans-men still have the biological attributes of a woman but look like a man so they will always lose, so even within the trans category you still have to have separation or risk the trans women wining.
The best way is to have a separate category trans women compete with trans women and trans men compete with trans men, if they are not a lot of trans people then it is tough luck on your part there are sports that we can't compete in professionally unless we meet the requirements e.g basketball is one of them, players are typically seven-foot-tall, sumo wrestling, the under twelves football team, etc.
I would never have believed the world could come to this
Loved listening to these ladies talk about this. Im fed up of us being told what we are and arent and being "gas lit" into thinking the opposite. Thank you for talking about this more
That is why GBNews is the best!
Zip it Tatchell …listen to a trans who speaks bloody sense
Peter Tatchell is out of touch with reality. Does he think sport should be based on height and weight, not sex? Can you imagine how long the Olympics would go for if there was a race for every height and weight category? There would be millions of events stretching over months to accommodate all the various combinations.
The high jump for short people category would be fun - I would watch that!
Why is there even a "debate" about this???
Permitting men and women to try and change sex has brought many biological, legal, sporting and social conflict that was foreseeable.
My Ferrari( with me driving it,) should be in the women's marathon, because" Freda", my Ferrari, identifies as a woman.
Leave the medal at the podium, I'll be there in half an hour,( safety first, - - - - - - - dontcha know) slowly but surely does it.......
Not to mention mixed up adults who resort to suicide which MSM and advocates like to blame society for they not being accepted. Look at any "PRIDE" parade is this not lunacy and degrading behaviour.
No biological man should ever be in womens sports or indeed in any biological womens spaces. This is allowing access to paedophiles when its girls and children's space. This insane delusion that you can change sex is wrong full stop. It has been pondered too for far too long and is eroding womens and children's rights to safety and dignity.
Peter is revolting
He has got a degree in talking a load of 8ollocks I know that
That's because you're a decent human being. Peter's thoughts on children have no place being tolerated in any civilised society.
@@grief1 Good question, and one I'd genuinely like an answer for.
@@grief1 💯
So is Dave.
Yet again GB News shows all the other channels how to have these discussions. No one shouting over anyone, none of the dreaded 'so what you're saying is...' and no one claiming that being offended means you win the argument. Just a calm, sensible debate.
But still no woman interviewed on the topic just two blokes, one a pervert that advocates children can give consent to sexual relationships with adults and enjoy it 🤢🤮
I agree. My partner calls it BNP TV - his ultra leftie ignorance and vitriol is starting to really p*** me off
Peter Thatchell, Gods created man and woman.. He didn’t make a mistake!!
It's only complex when you want it to be complex, in reality it's simple, create a 3rd category and allow trans men and trans woman to compete with each other.
That's too sensible for today's world
How about they just participate in the category of their born sex?
Why does this need a debate?
This guys tie. Virtue signal of the week.
He owns only one shirt and one tie.
In fairness, he is a long time gay rights campaigner. You'd expect him to wear a rainbow tie.
No individual assessment, too often these "regulations" are abused. A blanket ban is essential
Well done Debbie...yet again the calm inteligent voice of reason on this matter.
It doesn't matter what you say Peter, a man is a man a d a woman is a woman, and of.
What was he saying??? That there is a natural range of physical ability in biological women? And thats not fair? Well I never. They are clutching at straws now, and the straws keep getting smaller.
Have seen Debbie several times on different shows and everytime she is intelligent and reasonable. Listens to the opposite view and gives reasonable and calm replies.
Everytime I've seen her she's being told by activists she's wrong about what it is to be trans!
*He. "Debbie" is a dude. He knows the gig is up. He was responsible for same sex bathrooms. He is a perv.
He not she. Debbie is a man.
Again, should NOT. And now the decision has been done to ban trans in women's swimming, it will be expanded to the rest of the sports fields.
Peter Tatchell used to be relevant. Now he's just another person inviting us all to share in his delusion. Give it up Peter, the crowds have all gone home.
This is where Peter's LACK OF MEDICAL KNOWLEDGE shows through. He should keep QUIET.
When my daughter was 12 she played waterpolo, the teams where mixed. Most of the girls at this age were larger due to going through puberty earlier than the boys. But when they played against the boys you could see how much stronger the boys were even though they hadn’t gone through puberty.
Tatchell has changed his tune on this and still manages to get it wrong. He is in fact relentlessly wrong. A good lesson for trans women [men] athletes, you don't get everything you want in life, nobody does!
I would love to see Lia Thomas swim at the Olympics because she would win gold by a mile and standing on the podium the whole world would see how ridiculous this is, Tatchell as a man should not be talking on this subject, also as a gay man he is never going to go against trans people.
Tatchell is not the brightest fairy on the tree.
He still has his penis so not a she.
Should they be allowed? No, their gender is on their birth certificate. End of.
Peter doesn't know his arse from his elbow. Best ignored.
Quite right to.
Peter is being utterly ridiculous. How could you possibly assess each individual taking place in all in sports. This regulation is clear cut and leaves no room for doubt. Men are generally bigger and stronger than women. Of course you will have varying levels of strength and size amongst a group of women, that’s what makes it a competition. But to throw a few blokes into the mix completely changes the dynamic.
Evert single time i have heard peter tatchell discuss this issue he has brought up this one friend who is smaller than the rest of the team ,ridiculous argument
Seconded 😂
Pete how can he be for Human rights whilst Only supporting Men's rights n Speaking for women he's No Clue. Debbie is Brilliant n watching ppl call her a Terfs is funny. She's Trans n gets turfed off.
We played the modified softball/baseball game in Australia and beat the girls 25 to zero in year 4.
A few years before puberty for sure.
The feminists teacher wanted to give them a go instead of the regular mixed teams...she humiliated them for her agenda. No, not ever and for zero circumstances, non whatsoever.
25 runs to zero runs or just a big fat 0.
The World has pandered long enough to a miniscule group of 0.003% of society backed up by the whole glad rainbow crowd and all the straight friends and relatives that have been too scared to offend them and they have ruined Girls Sports Worldwide with no regard for all the sacrifice the training the money, the coaching.
Yep their own category... in the special Olympics, that covers all challenged people.
Has anyone seen Tyrant Finder uk and the way the trans community treated a group of women in Bristol yesterday , utterly disgusting.
I used to think Peter Tatchel was an intelligent man. I was wrong. Debbie is quite right.
I'm with Debbie all the way. I always think transpeople just wanted to live like the other sex but accept that they are not, and have no interest in actual being in their spaces. I do believe it's these activists like Peter who are causing all this mayhem around transpeople. Most of them just want to be left alone and carry on living their lives without imposing on anyone
When a trans woman speaks more sense than a rainbow hugger, tells you where the problem is.
A rainbow hugger. 😆
I'm gay and I have always hated that these lame ass rainbows are our symbol.
Why don't GBNews speak to any women on this matter? I don't want to hear from Peter Tatchell (PIE) and Debbie Hayton (Man) about an issue affecting women's sports. Have one of the girls that were on Lia's swim team on, even if you have to mask their identity by showing them in shadow with a voice changer.
See Tatchell's chapter in the book _The Betrayal of Youth_ to see why this man should not be on television.
good question
Does Peter identify as a pie?
@@Umbrella2 No it is because of his association with the Paedophile Information Exchange:
"The veteran LGBT campaigner Peter Tatchell has told Gript that he wishes to “apologise unreservedly” for putting his name to a review of a book which promoted sexual relationships between children and adults. The review was published in a June 1987 edition of 7 days, the newsletter of the Communist Party of Great Britain. The book in question, Betrayal of Youth (BOY), was edited by Warren Middleton, a former vice-chairman of the Paedophile Information Exchange (PIE). Tatchell himself contributed a chapter to BOY, although Tatchell has repeatedly said that he was unaware of the book’s connection to PIE and that, had he been aware of that connection, he would have refused to write for the book."
Source: _Positive review of paedophile book “terrible mistake” - Peter Tatchell_ - 31/7/21 - gript . ie
Well the interviewers are women. Gbnews prides itself in it's diversity of opinion. I think it's ok.
if you take your pug to crufts and try to enter it in the cocker spaniel category you would not be allowed because a pug is not a cocker spaniel
Its not complex peter women and men full stop
1) Peter that he’ll thinks sex between a 9 year old and an adult can be “joyful”. Hence ignore everything he says.
2) yes! We should all accept ourselves and love ourselves as we are.
If there is an issue with a separate category it will show they are aware of the advantage they have over women and want it to remain to ensure their continued but unfair success
Otherwise known as cheating
@@JaneA544 Right 👍
Chromosome XY compete with chromosome XY while chromosome XX compete with chromosome XX. That's biology and simple common sense.
No.
Next.
NONONONONONONONONO HOW MANY women have broken mens records oh yes none.
That's Life....yes, yes, yes....they even wrote a song about it! Thank you ladies for such a calm, relatable, sensible debate. You are a breathe of fresh air.
Why is Tatchell relevant anymore?!
His comments on paedophilia should have cancelled him already..
The fact that this is even a debate shows how ridiculous our society has become. Is this really what we’re choosing to waste our time and energy on?
My thoughts exactly. It was disturbing to listen to.
Debbie answered the non debate, end of it.
i am a firm believer in trans right s , i am also a firm believer in womens rights . there has to be a point when you say "no" , that point is when it affects someone elses' rights . during the 80s it was simple , if you were MTF , you were banned from womens sports .
can't have both worlds exactly
The sooner these trans whatevertheyare are put firmly in their place and their crybaby howlings and demands ignored the sooner they,re shut up . A tiny vocal minority trying to change the world and being listened to is crazy .
Peter is seriously coping now 😂😂
Why do Lefties always say "Woman" and not "Women", too?
We're talking about elite level sports here, not your local athletics, but even that would not be fair if boys kept winning in the female category. Why can't people just grow up about this and face facts.
In every interview he gives he keeps saying "woman" instead of "women". He never uses the plural. I can't believe that nobody ever picks him up on it.
And I just want him to go away.
Guess if you want to be a women you have to sacrifice some ambitions; that truly allows you insight into how it feels to be a woman, sacrificing desires comes with territory.
So, next week Andy Murray changes his name to Anthea and a few weeks later walks off with the Silver Plate at Wimbledon without dropping a single game. According to the activists, not only is this perfectly fine, but this will mean that Anthea has always been a woman and we should also change the record books and the engraving on the mens trophy to set the record straight.
Peter Tatchell is talking rubbish.
In a word - No. separate Trans category is the only fair way to handle this.
Thatchell “ individual assessment “ ffs 😂
Does not seem to be a clamour of women trans-ing to men in order to compete in mens sports. Why’s that then?
Oh...... I wonder......
There isn't any clamour the other way either, tbf.
It sounds like you're suggesting that trans athletes are going through the expense and trauma of transitioning just so they can win at sporting events. This would obviously be a mental opinion to have, so I've presumably misinterpreted what you've written
just give trans people their own competitions. They will more than likely have to compete as amateur's due to lack of funding. But at least they will be happy in their own bodies. And not infringe on the long struggle for women's rights in life and sport .The only worry about the ban for post puberty trans athlete's is that it will give the activists more reason to target the very young.
pushy parent, my child can't compete with their own sex, ...so manipulates the trans route....... "it'll never happen 🤔 Yeah Right
The science is 100% clear.
Women and men compete in sports that match their body and skill set. So female gymnasts are usually small whereas female rowers are tall.
I love Debbie she is so fair and sensible.
Debbie is a man and says she is, so why say ‘she’ - it’s ‘he’.
@@sueedwards9334 you contradicted yourself in that sentence 🤣
Especially to his wife and kids.
WE "REALLY" NEED MENTAL HEALTH CARE FACILITIES!!! - YOU ARE - WHAT YOU ARE -
Stamp feet. - Thats so unfair. 😂🤣
Peter Tatchell talks nonsense
utterly nonsensical argument from Peter
There are only 2 games i can think of that trans should be allowed to cross over. Chess and checkers. EVERY other sport, if you have even a shred of integrity, the answer is a resounding, "OH, HELL NO! As it should be
Its a typical case of feelings before facts… i can’t imagine where this fucking road ends up..
No drugs whatsoever in sports. That should do the trick.
Categorically NO, Women are women, men aren't women, and our biology is determined at conception.
Well now trans women and their parents have the message. Transition your kids at age 12 medically and document it is the only path to full equality and no bigotry . Got it. Let's get started
They should put all the transgender swimmers together .. and then, let them swim .. putting them with natural women .. is wrong .. at the end of the day ? They are still men competing with , women .. and they do have a disadvantage, in there strength ..
I'm almost 6ft all, I'm no chance of being a jockey ....
No , they should have their own category and compete with each other , it’s simple really.
Tatchell gives the usual strawman argument, ONLY saying about how women are different shapes, sizes, heights etc.. Well, so are MEN. Why is it - according to him - 'unfair' because some women are stronger than other women but not 'unfair' because some men are stronger than other men?! These Woke kinds ALWAYS think they are so clever, yet make no sense. Mind you, HE will know that really; he is just a grifter.
The trans woman in this discussion after say is amazing she is completely right and talks sense always sad there is trans people out there that are fed up with all this nonsense remember genuine people with genuine gender problems must be respected and protected that goes for anybody with genuine problems..
Tatchells logic makes no sense. As Nana says it's not realistic to think historically men's bodies and women's bodies have the same strength. Why is it deemed acceptable now.
Peter talks rubbish , just trying to over complicate issues .
Can’t stand Tatchell
OMG Peter Tatchell splitting hairs, talking nonsense, trying any which way to conjure up a reason why the FINA decision was somehow wrong. Unless you’ve transitioned before puberty, so you don’t have an irreversible unfair physical advantage, you don’t get to compete with women Peter, end of!
For once common sense prevails.
Don't have 2 male guests discussing woman's sport.
Well done debbie 👍
As a 5 ft 2 inch woman I will never play professional basketball or be an Olympic swimmer but in my youth, I was the perfect body for gymnastics. The basketball player and swimmer are never going to be able to do gymnastics. These are things that we know and don't even try because we do not have the body for it. For this man to use this type of comparison is just stupid. You compete in the sport that your body is made for. Tossing a man into the mix and say that he doesn't have any advantage is just pure lies.