yep I agree { thermal expansion } add time in there too but for most part ya I agree I work with really big presses w/ really big molds that have horn pins bout 2 inches round I do a pretty good job at setting mold protect but UBE 15000 ton w/ big horn pins / { or slide pins if that's what ya call em plus at what angle these pins are It can be really difficult Id like to see more on mold protect on diff presses diff sizes and diff leader pins n sizes
You forgot to mention time for a mold protection setting. Older Nessie machine use this time as the last cycle so if your guide pins are picking up and it takes a little longer to close it may take the mold seizing up and not being able to close any more to notice this. Wondered why a machine was 5 seconds over cycle and looked at the graph and it was a tenth of a second longer for every cycle to close. And think of pressure as a ball pean hammer - if you take this ball pean hammer (Pressure) and touch it to a piece of aluminum (let's say) you would probably see a mark on it going as slow as you could. But if you take the same piece of aluminum and hit it with a feather (Pressure) you could go as fast as you want, and I doubt you would do any damage. It's the pressure that will do the damage not the speed. And start of mold protection is usually determined by the thickness of the part or like you said the "Horn pins" but another thing to consider is if you are over molding on to an insert you are putting into a mold. If the part with the insert was to hang up in the mold and an operator put another insert in the mold, (And not remove the part) the mold would essentially close on two inserts. (Could happen) so start of mold protection would be the height of two inserts if there were no horn pins in the mold. Good video just needs a little more detail as this is a very important setting.
Some molds I experienced thru my nearly 40 yr career was molds w extra large cam springs, they can be a little more tricky to precisely get a good balanced low pressure close setting at the lower end of the pressure range setting of the machine, especially if it's a family mold that contains some very tiny parts that could possibly get closed in there as well. Very good basic video of how to set your low pressure protect though, keep up the good work RJG
You are correct , there is usually a timer used as a maximum time to travel from mold protect start to mold clamp. If the machine reaches this timer , a clamp alarm will be triggered. Some machines have this timer very visible to be used by the person setting up the mold protect and some machines have it in the background and is automatically set.
This is incorrect!!!!!, lowest mould safety pressure as possible yes and mould safety start position before the mould halves meet yes, but then dry cycle it and keep reducing mould high pressure position after set up like shown and you will find it will work at a lower position 9 out of 10 times. Direct lock machine not so much but if you don't do it on an older toggle machine you can have a bad day. Remember always go to far and then come back, it's the high clamp pressure that will do serious damage and on some machines 0.1 mm on the clamp position on the screen can be 2mm on the hydraulic cylinder, so if you was 1mm to early that is really 20mm on the cylinder to early on older toggle machines. 🏴🇬🇧🧐
Thanks for your comment, James. It seems you are very knowledgeable on setting mold protect with the molding machines and the molds that you run. Kudos to that. The reality is that different machines behave slightly different than other machines, and the little details can be different from press to press. The purpose of this video is only to show the basics of setting mold protect. Thank you for sharing your input.
I'm sorry my comment earlier I think was a bit rude of me, I was just trying to get across to people mainly the inexperienced how toggle machines can be more dangerous. I myself are not perfect, many years ago in 2003 I was working for a company and we had a new Sandettro series 9 or 10 it was 500 or 550 metric tons on loan and I was loading a tool that didn't hang straight on the crane, I was used to series 7's and 8s but this machine was new. I closed the clamp using the maintenance hand button to push the tool flat onto the fixed platen. There was a big who har when the day shift came in because the location ring sliced about 3/8 of a inch out of the side of the hole in the fixed platen. I had reduced the high pressure clamp position to the minimum and the mould safety pressures all to 15 bar and the speed looked really slow so at first I was surprised. The managers was looking at all the setting history to try and find out what stupid thing I had don't. Anyway long story short the Sandretto engineer who installed the machine on site found a toggle bush picked up due to some defective lub system. So he had to replace a bush before handing it over to the company and production, which landed on me. Well the maintenance speed was left on 5mm/s but the pressure was on 135 bar if I remember wright I think he had to pull a tie bar half way out to pull a pin, 135 bar that's maximum and I didn't think about looking at that at the time never mind were it was. So always check the settings all of them and never ever use the moving platen to push the location ring and tool onto the fixed platen. If the pressure was on say 15 to 20 bar it probably would not have happened but the maintenance hand button setting was set at 135 bar pressure and override all other settings . It's always best to measure the tool when it's on the floor and set the mould height with the machine empty with it 20 mm or more smaller when lock fully over, that's if it's possible, then if you do get the urge to use the platen on low low pressure of course to push the tool straight the machine has not got the macanical advantage to do any damage, but then put a ticket on the tool for the toolroom to balance the tool so it's leans straight with say a negative 1 degrees compared to the fixed platen, then the crane can do it's job and you don't loose yours job because they have to buy a 1/4 to 1/2 million pound machine. I don't know if they had to buy the machine and I didn't get the sack I think they released it was one of them things.All the best,Jim🏴🇬🇧
Good Vid, You may have to go back and re-set after awhile for thermal expansion also.
You are absolutely correct!
exactly, re do the set after mold getting hotter
Good video! Looking good Jason!
Thanks for watching! :)
yep I agree { thermal expansion } add time in there too but for most part ya I agree I work with really big presses w/ really big molds that have horn pins bout 2 inches round I do a pretty good job at setting mold protect but UBE 15000 ton w/ big horn pins / { or slide pins if that's what ya call em plus at what angle these pins are It can be really difficult Id like to see more on mold protect on diff presses diff sizes and diff leader pins n sizes
Vet good and detailed explanation about mold protection. Keep it and share more videos on injection molding topics
You forgot to mention time for a mold protection setting. Older Nessie machine use this time as the last cycle so if your guide pins are picking up and it takes a little longer to close it may take the mold seizing up and not being able to close any more to notice this. Wondered why a machine was 5 seconds over cycle and looked at the graph and it was a tenth of a second longer for every cycle to close.
And think of pressure as a ball pean hammer - if you take this ball pean hammer (Pressure) and touch it to a piece of aluminum (let's say) you would probably see a mark on it going as slow as you could. But if you take the same piece of aluminum and hit it with a feather (Pressure) you could go as fast as you want, and I doubt you would do any damage. It's the pressure that will do the damage not the speed.
And start of mold protection is usually determined by the thickness of the part or like you said the "Horn pins" but another thing to consider is if you are over molding on to an insert you are putting into a mold. If the part with the insert was to hang up in the mold and an operator put another insert in the mold, (And not remove the part) the mold would essentially close on two inserts. (Could happen) so start of mold protection would be the height of two inserts if there were no horn pins in the mold.
Good video just needs a little more detail as this is a very important setting.
Some molds I experienced thru my nearly 40 yr career was molds w extra large cam springs, they can be a little more tricky to precisely get a good balanced low pressure close setting at the lower end of the pressure range setting of the machine, especially if it's a family mold that contains some very tiny parts that could possibly get closed in there as well. Very good basic video of how to set your low pressure protect though, keep up the good work RJG
Yes, those cam springs and even compression bushings need extra pressure to close up. Thanks for the feedback.
use one layer of your note pad paper to proof the setting
Well explained but should have explained mould protection time too.
You are correct , there is usually a timer used as a maximum time to travel from mold protect start to mold clamp. If the machine reaches this timer , a clamp alarm will be triggered. Some machines have this timer very visible to be used by the person setting up the mold protect and some machines have it in the background and is automatically set.
and yes if you are a Tech like me THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT
This is incorrect!!!!!, lowest mould safety pressure as possible yes and mould safety start position before the mould halves meet yes, but then dry cycle it and keep reducing mould high pressure position after set up like shown and you will find it will work at a lower position 9 out of 10 times. Direct lock machine not so much but if you don't do it on an older toggle machine you can have a bad day. Remember always go to far and then come back, it's the high clamp pressure that will do serious damage and on some machines 0.1 mm on the clamp position on the screen can be 2mm on the hydraulic cylinder, so if you was 1mm to early that is really 20mm on the cylinder to early on older toggle machines. 🏴🇬🇧🧐
Thanks for your comment, James. It seems you are very knowledgeable on setting mold protect with the molding machines and the molds that you run. Kudos to that. The reality is that different machines behave slightly different than other machines, and the little details can be different from press to press. The purpose of this video is only to show the basics of setting mold protect. Thank you for sharing your input.
I'm sorry my comment earlier I think was a bit rude of me, I was just trying to get across to people mainly the inexperienced how toggle machines can be more dangerous. I myself are not perfect, many years ago in 2003 I was working for a company and we had a new Sandettro series 9 or 10 it was 500 or 550 metric tons on loan and I was loading a tool that didn't hang straight on the crane, I was used to series 7's and 8s but this machine was new. I closed the clamp using the maintenance hand button to push the tool flat onto the fixed platen. There was a big who har when the day shift came in because the location ring sliced about 3/8 of a inch out of the side of the hole in the fixed platen. I had reduced the high pressure clamp position to the minimum and the mould safety pressures all to 15 bar and the speed looked really slow so at first I was surprised. The managers was looking at all the setting history to try and find out what stupid thing I had don't. Anyway long story short the Sandretto engineer who installed the machine on site found a toggle bush picked up due to some defective lub system. So he had to replace a bush before handing it over to the company and production, which landed on me. Well the maintenance speed was left on 5mm/s but the pressure was on 135 bar if I remember wright I think he had to pull a tie bar half way out to pull a pin, 135 bar that's maximum and I didn't think about looking at that at the time never mind were it was. So always check the settings all of them and never ever use the moving platen to push the location ring and tool onto the fixed platen. If the pressure was on say 15 to 20 bar it probably would not have happened but the maintenance hand button setting was set at 135 bar pressure and override all other settings . It's always best to measure the tool when it's on the floor and set the mould height with the machine empty with it 20 mm or more smaller when lock fully over, that's if it's possible, then if you do get the urge to use the platen on low low pressure of course to push the tool straight the machine has not got the macanical advantage to do any damage, but then put a ticket on the tool for the toolroom to balance the tool so it's leans straight with say a negative 1 degrees compared to the fixed platen, then the crane can do it's job and you don't loose yours job because they have to buy a 1/4 to 1/2 million pound machine. I don't know if they had to buy the machine and I didn't get the sack I think they released it was one of them things.All the best,Jim🏴🇬🇧