I heard for the breakers on the bus bars it's something along the lines of 120% for a thermal trip or slight over current, and 200% for a magnetic trip or a dead short. So does that mean it saw maybe 200 or more amps then? 😮
@@jasperc.2398 Yes. Lucky it was a QO breaker. They are fast. I once mistakenly hooked up a contractor across the line. When it turned on it dead shorted. It instantly tripped the branch, the sub feed, and the main breaker. All square D QO’s
Yeah. If it was just a few hundred amps it wouldn’t have tripped for a while and the wire would have melted away. This is probably 500+ amps, maybe a kA or two.
100 meters of #12 copper wire is about 5 ohms, or 0.05 ohms per meter. As power = I²R, each meter of wire at 100 amps is dissipating P = 100² * 0.05 ohms = 500 watts. I hope you have fire insurance!
It looks to me like someone removed the breaker that wire was using. The wire was not touching the bus bar by design, but the door hitting the wire pushed the wire into the bus bar. If it is connected now, it is because it got welded there when it shorted. The bare short to the box is from the wires being trapped between the box and the cover. Many licensed electricians do not take the time to tie wrap or otherwise ensure all the wires stay within the box while the cover is installed. The connectors look like ones that are UL approved and many licensed electricians use them. Wago-like connectors are legal, although I agree with the suspicions regarding their use. I still prefer Buchanan crimps, especially in a panel or other places where things get pushed and pulled while servicing them. Wire nuts are fine for switch, outlet, or light electrical boxes, but if it moves or vibrates, crimps should be (and sometimes are) required. What you ended up with is a combination of problems that produced an emotional response. After about 50 years of working on properties, you take things like this is stride. Sure, the DIYer is prone to get it wrong, but stuff happens even when the professionals do it. My approach is either to just walk away or make it right. A long tirade with cussing is not helping anyone, including yourself.
@@Bapuji42 The video is moving around a lot and not very clear, but those look like the In-Sure connectors made by IDEAL. The In-Sure ones look a lot like Wago 773 series connectors, but are different enough that you can easily recognize which one is which.
@@Bapuji42 I don’t know. I doubt they are much different, but I don’t really use any of them. I have the same boxes of Wago connectors I bought something like ten years ago, and they are still almost full. When I found a broken one, I just eliminate them and have not kept track of which brand it was or figured out why they failed. Same with backstabbing failures on devices - I just replace them and use the screw terminals. Hopefully someone who uses both Wago and Ideal can reply with a comparison.
@@Bapuji42 They look like the kind of push-in connectors made by IDEAL rated up to #12 but there are also some Chinese noname clones of all kinds of push-in and levernut connectors out there. We would use the ones in this video a lot for things like lighting retrofits or something where you might have a lot of lampholder wires in a fixture. Both the WAGO and IDEAL connectors that use the stab-through ports are legit but I would prefer WAGO lever nut connectors. Some of the noname clones out there of both the stab-through and lever nut styles are noticeably poor quality and can often easily be defeated by just rotating the wire just right. You can do that with IDEAL or WAGO stab-throughs but it takes considerably more effort. I wouldn't really worry about either if it was just something like LED fixture wiring.
More likely the door pinched the conductor to cause the exposure. More like hundreds of amps, if not over 1k to get that device to trip that quickly. More importantly; please watch Mike Holt’s video about these wire connectors. He’s one of the leading authorities in the electrical field (on code making panels and does code content for most of the major trade periodicals).
They are ul listed and slightly better than the backstabber on outlets I've found when using them that the slightest twist like pushing into a box causes them to release the wire. I only have the yellow 4 port and was using 12 gauge solid wire
At the Atomic Energy Authority ( UK ) at Culham , Oxfordshire .... their lightning test facility uses a whole row of ( freezer sized ) capacitors ! to store megajoules of energy .... these are connected with domestic Copper water pipe ( ! ) ... when a short circuit occurs .... the pipes collapse with the HUGE current ( looks like a copper Cadbury's flake ! ) .. DAVE™🛑
Those particular connectors I call quick light fitting connectors. Have your solid wire run into the fixture and push on the light connections. I will use a WAGO before I use them anywhere else. I hate wire nuts to a degree and they are second on my list of wire connections for AC power.
there is nothing wrong with those connectors. but people in the trades take a really long time to adapt to new things. so, this guy is right that whoever did that "was not an electrician" because an electrician would have used a twist on wire nut. The twist on wire nut is not better in any way, it's just the way it's been done for decades and electricians hate change.
Its all about surface area. The wago's and cheap copies have a "Blade" in the them that contacts and locks in the round wire. This only touches the peek of the wire and not the full wire. Less surface area = more current to flow through a small area = more heat and potential of fire. Wire nuts twist the whole wire around each other and uses all the area and prevents issue. But only IF installed correctly..!!!
Sure I get that theoretically they have more resistance. But do they in practice? Are fires actually happening from properly installed wagos and friends? I've seen plenty of loose wire nuts. Wagos can come undone if the little lever gets lifted up. I tape them shut whenever putting them in single gang boxes. But generally I find them more reliable. I am curious if there are actual instances of them overhearing when properly used.
@@user-zq6pj5jo8j That's just not true. The amount of surface area that is in contact with theses "wago style" connectors is more than enough. go look at any in-depth tear down of these connectors and you will see that the wire makes contact in several places and that is more than enough surface area. For reference, look a the blade style connection that is made between the panel and the circuit breaker. look a the blade type connection between the outlet and the device. it all works on the same principle. there is a pinch point that transfers all of the current, and that is enough.
@@ajcarrico1 Also, i think part of it is cost. Wago's cost more. If you doing a new construction whole house wire. The extra cost of each adds up. HD has 50 of the 2 wire ones for $20, where as the "Acorn" wire nuts are $8.
Weinermeter is pegged off the scale on this one! Nobody would do this except landlord, homeowner, or their nephew Clem (apologies to the better Clems out there). Too cheap to call for backup, pick up a DIY book, or check online.
I am waaaay more concerned that there are SPLICES inside of a breaker distribution box, and all these hot wires just hanging all Peloosey-goosey in there…. YIKES! I’d repopulate the breakers and get rid of all those splices in a heartbeat, like, no, just no, why?
Those ideal push ins ive found to be great for multi ground j box points(another youtuber Peterson electric as well as the uk sparks have brought up its a nightmare to seperate twisted grounds/earths for troubleshooting and testing )and ive used them to extend wires in an old outlet box but other than those instances or maybe for light fixtures ya not a big fan of them.
Seen that before on a window A/C. Hot line on the bus and neutral twisted around a ground…. The actual ground wire …. Cut off …. I forgot to mention 14-2 and merely laying on the baseboard thru a hole to the cellar….
Well, who’s the genius? Are you blaming a contractor or yourself? And there is nothing wrong with those push connectors. None of them failed. Only the stupid work failed because it was left dangerous.
There was magic blue smoke that came out of that wire into the box. Just be glad it didn’t burn your place down. Who ever left that? Left a trap for the next guy.
Something is wrong with the AC then for it to trip the main like that and not have any short circuit protection outside of the undersized conductor for it
A few years back I tripped a main breaker when I got careless with a pair of pliers in a transfer switch. The wire was a short section of #18 and it didn't melt!
Don’t Take His Word For Anything Shit 💩 Happens Am 68 Been a Electrician For 40 Years 😮 Don’t Loose Your Mind …..Video Guy You Most Likely Got Another 25 Years To Go Buddy …..So Don’t Worry About Stuff You Can’t Control
You wanted the cheapest, well you got the cheapest , don’t come crying to us when realize you should have gone with the licensed electrician and not some illegal that no hablow the English
@@93da9tegsmom6 The push on connectors are for solid wire, not Stranded. The shorted wire was solid not stranded. You could twist the push on connector if you wanted to make it more secure.
well u lucky u didnt touch that wire 100amp will blow ur ass back to the dry wall across the room lol ..... my uncle had a older house remodel and he found the same DAMN thing he didnt see the wire was hook in the main lug got zapped blew him 5ft to the back off the room .....
Either a 100 amp breaker or 1 amp breaker will do the same. It was the voltage, not the trip current rating of the breaker, that gave him a jolt. Probably touched both hot legs and got hit with 240v.
Please watch Mike Holt’s video on these listed wire connectors. He also did one recently on how a lot of us electricians aren’t moving into modern times so well (he used the term “dinosaurs”)
Hey, the 100A breaker did its job!
And apparently the connector did too, maintaining dead short resistance allowing the main to do its job.
"Arc Welding at Home" does NOT include your electrical panel!
The world has way too many fuckin' geniuses and not enough ordinary geniuses.
I think it's easy to forget "Temporary" also needs to be safe.
If I had a nickel for every excuse made to justify hazard quality by American engineers.
Also a fast trip on that main breaker will be alot more than 100 amps...
I heard for the breakers on the bus bars it's something along the lines of 120% for a thermal trip or slight over current, and 200% for a magnetic trip or a dead short.
So does that mean it saw maybe 200 or more amps then? 😮
@@jasperc.2398 Yes. Lucky it was a QO breaker. They are fast. I once mistakenly hooked up a contractor across the line. When it turned on it dead shorted. It instantly tripped the branch, the sub feed, and the main breaker. All square D QO’s
Way more. It's whatever the upstream transformer can supply; until the breaker trips.
My first thought too.
150 at least I'd bet.
Yeah. If it was just a few hundred amps it wouldn’t have tripped for a while and the wire would have melted away.
This is probably 500+ amps, maybe a kA or two.
100 meters of #12 copper wire is about 5 ohms, or 0.05 ohms per meter. As power = I²R, each meter of wire at 100 amps is dissipating P = 100² * 0.05 ohms = 500 watts.
I hope you have fire insurance!
It looks to me like someone removed the breaker that wire was using. The wire was not touching the bus bar by design, but the door hitting the wire pushed the wire into the bus bar. If it is connected now, it is because it got welded there when it shorted.
The bare short to the box is from the wires being trapped between the box and the cover. Many licensed electricians do not take the time to tie wrap or otherwise ensure all the wires stay within the box while the cover is installed.
The connectors look like ones that are UL approved and many licensed electricians use them. Wago-like connectors are legal, although I agree with the suspicions regarding their use. I still prefer Buchanan crimps, especially in a panel or other places where things get pushed and pulled while servicing them. Wire nuts are fine for switch, outlet, or light electrical boxes, but if it moves or vibrates, crimps should be (and sometimes are) required.
What you ended up with is a combination of problems that produced an emotional response. After about 50 years of working on properties, you take things like this is stride. Sure, the DIYer is prone to get it wrong, but stuff happens even when the professionals do it. My approach is either to just walk away or make it right. A long tirade with cussing is not helping anyone, including yourself.
why does he say those aren't wagos?
@@Bapuji42 The video is moving around a lot and not very clear, but those look like the In-Sure connectors made by IDEAL. The In-Sure ones look a lot like Wago 773 series connectors, but are different enough that you can easily recognize which one is which.
@@kenchilton are they actually worse than wagos?
@@Bapuji42 I don’t know. I doubt they are much different, but I don’t really use any of them. I have the same boxes of Wago connectors I bought something like ten years ago, and they are still almost full. When I found a broken one, I just eliminate them and have not kept track of which brand it was or figured out why they failed. Same with backstabbing failures on devices - I just replace them and use the screw terminals. Hopefully someone who uses both Wago and Ideal can reply with a comparison.
@@Bapuji42 They look like the kind of push-in connectors made by IDEAL rated up to #12 but there are also some Chinese noname clones of all kinds of push-in and levernut connectors out there. We would use the ones in this video a lot for things like lighting retrofits or something where you might have a lot of lampholder wires in a fixture. Both the WAGO and IDEAL connectors that use the stab-through ports are legit but I would prefer WAGO lever nut connectors. Some of the noname clones out there of both the stab-through and lever nut styles are noticeably poor quality and can often easily be defeated by just rotating the wire just right. You can do that with IDEAL or WAGO stab-throughs but it takes considerably more effort. I wouldn't really worry about either if it was just something like LED fixture wiring.
More likely the door pinched the conductor to cause the exposure. More like hundreds of amps, if not over 1k to get that device to trip that quickly.
More importantly; please watch Mike Holt’s video about these wire connectors. He’s one of the leading authorities in the electrical field (on code making panels and does code content for most of the major trade periodicals).
Short circuit current can reach into several kiloamps depending how long and what gauge the feed cable is._
if anything that shows that those connectors are a go lol. idk if they're UL listed but if they are then they are definitely a go
They are ul listed and slightly better than the backstabber on outlets I've found when using them that the slightest twist like pushing into a box causes them to release the wire. I only have the yellow 4 port and was using 12 gauge solid wire
It's a conspiracy, Hank.
I'm positive about the negative, but i'm a little negative about the positive.
At the Atomic Energy Authority ( UK ) at Culham , Oxfordshire .... their lightning test facility uses a whole row of ( freezer sized ) capacitors ! to store megajoules of energy .... these are connected with domestic Copper water pipe ( ! ) ... when a short circuit occurs .... the pipes collapse with the HUGE current ( looks like a copper Cadbury's flake ! ) .. DAVE™🛑
Those push in wire connectors are UL listed and superior to twist on wire nuts.
Those particular connectors I call quick light fitting connectors. Have your solid wire run into the fixture and push on the light connections. I will use a WAGO before I use them anywhere else. I hate wire nuts to a degree and they are second on my list of wire connections for AC power.
Honest question. What is wrong with wire nuts? Properly used they work great. I have never had issues. Thanks
Commercial fixtures usually come with those push in (wago-esque) connectors.
JESUS CHRIST!!! 100 AMPS ???
Scary, I thought the 60 amp sub panel at my new house run on 10 gauge was bad. I only use wagos in led connections, everything else is twist and cap.
We use those wagos for smoke / carbon detectors / heat alarms (we call them suicide detectors lol)
What is wrong with those connectors? I generally prefer Wagos but I've used those in a pinch.
there is nothing wrong with those connectors. but people in the trades take a really long time to adapt to new things. so, this guy is right that whoever did that "was not an electrician" because an electrician would have used a twist on wire nut. The twist on wire nut is not better in any way, it's just the way it's been done for decades and electricians hate change.
Its all about surface area. The wago's and cheap copies have a "Blade" in the them that contacts and locks in the round wire. This only touches the peek of the wire and not the full wire. Less surface area = more current to flow through a small area = more heat and potential of fire. Wire nuts twist the whole wire around each other and uses all the area and prevents issue. But only IF installed correctly..!!!
Sure I get that theoretically they have more resistance. But do they in practice? Are fires actually happening from properly installed wagos and friends?
I've seen plenty of loose wire nuts. Wagos can come undone if the little lever gets lifted up. I tape them shut whenever putting them in single gang boxes. But generally I find them more reliable.
I am curious if there are actual instances of them overhearing when properly used.
@@user-zq6pj5jo8j That's just not true. The amount of surface area that is in contact with theses "wago style" connectors is more than enough. go look at any in-depth tear down of these connectors and you will see that the wire makes contact in several places and that is more than enough surface area. For reference, look a the blade style connection that is made between the panel and the circuit breaker. look a the blade type connection between the outlet and the device. it all works on the same principle. there is a pinch point that transfers all of the current, and that is enough.
@@ajcarrico1 Also, i think part of it is cost. Wago's cost more. If you doing a new construction whole house wire. The extra cost of each adds up. HD has 50 of the 2 wire ones for $20, where as the "Acorn" wire nuts are $8.
Must have made quite a memorable noise.
"Some genius"... sir, was it you? Did you leave a live wire unsecured? 😅
It was the uncovered breaker box plus a loose wire.
Weinermeter is pegged off the scale on this one! Nobody would do this except landlord, homeowner, or their nephew Clem (apologies to the better Clems out there). Too cheap to call for backup, pick up a DIY book, or check online.
Pay attention to the video. This is clearly new construction
Yes, this is under construction, but with old wood in the walls? More likely 3rd flip. Maybe not landlord, maybe previous flipper…
I am waaaay more concerned that there are SPLICES inside of a breaker distribution box, and all these hot wires just hanging all Peloosey-goosey in there…. YIKES!
I’d repopulate the breakers and get rid of all those splices in a heartbeat, like, no, just no, why?
My bad
They said get it done 😂
Hey the breaker worked looks like a meth house wiring job glad your ok
Those ideal push ins ive found to be great for multi ground j box points(another youtuber Peterson electric as well as the uk sparks have brought up its a nightmare to seperate twisted grounds/earths for troubleshooting and testing )and ive used them to extend wires in an old outlet box but other than those instances or maybe for light fixtures ya not a big fan of them.
That’s probably more like a 1000 amps
Seen that before on a window A/C. Hot line on the bus and neutral twisted around a ground…. The actual ground wire …. Cut off …. I forgot to mention 14-2 and merely laying on the baseboard thru a hole to the cellar….
Well, who’s the genius? Are you blaming a contractor or yourself?
And there is nothing wrong with those push connectors. None of them failed. Only the stupid work failed because it was left dangerous.
There was magic blue smoke that came out of that wire into the box. Just be glad it didn’t burn your place down. Who ever left that? Left a trap for the next guy.
The Darwin Electrical Company.
I can put 100amps through wire no problem and I do it all the time.
Something is wrong with the AC then for it to trip the main like that and not have any short circuit protection outside of the undersized conductor for it
it shorted to the box
Lots of stuff on CZcams but not all legal in America or other countries where they have building codes. Just saying
Those aren't wagos??
And I thought running 20 amps through a #14 wire was bad!! This is a BILLION times worse!!
Only for a fraction of a second. #12 wire can handle 20 amp continuously.
I did that shit.
A few years back I tripped a main breaker when I got careless with a pair of pliers in a transfer switch. The wire was a short section of #18 and it didn't melt!
Don’t Take His Word For Anything
Shit 💩 Happens
Am 68 Been a Electrician
For 40 Years 😮
Don’t Loose Your Mind
…..Video Guy You Most Likely Got Another 25 Years To Go
Buddy
…..So Don’t Worry About Stuff You Can’t Control
it can be done....for about a second
Scary stuff
You wanted the cheapest, well you got the cheapest , don’t come crying to us when realize you should have gone with the licensed electrician and not some illegal that no hablow the English
Cant form a sentence without cursing like a pirate.
Even if they were Waygos.... Not good. No self respecting electrician that knows anything will use them.
Very true, a wirenut is a much more secure connection. Only time I use them is on solid copper. Stranded copper leaves too much room for error
@@93da9tegsmom6 The push on connectors are for solid wire, not Stranded. The shorted wire was solid not stranded.
You could twist the push on connector if you wanted to make it more secure.
Wagos are rated and tested for solid wire. They are fine and are used by master electricians like myself
Horseshit. I've seen them on big commercial jobs. Commercial lighting fixtures come with them.
@@tomhora4381yes
Cussing not necessary
Craig is a funny name for a nun.
@@93da9tegsmom6 unnecessarily cussing is against my vocabulary religious beliefs, makes one sound illiterate
Lol talking isn't necessary either. Watching CZcams isn't necessary.
Tell me you don’t understand in rush current without telling me you don’t understand electricity.
well u lucky u didnt touch that wire 100amp will blow ur ass back to the dry wall across the room lol ..... my uncle had a older house remodel and he found the same DAMN thing he didnt see the wire was hook in the main lug got zapped blew him 5ft to the back off the room .....
Either a 100 amp breaker or 1 amp breaker will do the same. It was the voltage, not the trip current rating of the breaker, that gave him a jolt. Probably touched both hot legs and got hit with 240v.
Turn your phone horizontally.
Wagos are for CZcamsrs, not for electricians.
I think they are fine.
Apparently quite common in Europe, which has pretty solid regs and standards.
Wagos are great for low voltage
Yes, I'd use them for low voltage, especially for rigs that get reconfigured from time to time.
Please watch Mike Holt’s video on these listed wire connectors. He also did one recently on how a lot of us electricians aren’t moving into modern times so well (he used the term “dinosaurs”)
They are listed for the use.