Rachmaninoff's 4th Concerto is Criminally Underrated (ft. Lugansky, Giltburg, Ohlsson)
Vložit
- čas přidán 16. 12. 2023
- www.tonebase.co/piano?...
Ben Laude probes Rachmaninoff's unsung masterpiece, the Fourth Piano Concerto, featuring segments from exclusive tonebase Premium interviews and courses with Nikolai Lugansky, Boris Giltburg, and Garrick Ohlsson.
Explore tonebase Rachmaininoff's complete library: app.tonebase.co/piano/home?tb...
Listen to Michelangeli's iconic recording: • Sergei Rachmaninov - P...
---
tonebase gives you instant access to knowledge from the world's greatest classical musicians, performers, and educators. Learn more by visiting tonebase.co/piano
Facebook - / tonebasepiano
Instagram - / tonebasepiano
Questions? Contact us: team@tonebase.co - Hudba
![[UNBANNED] A SCANDALOUS Theory about Horowitz's peculiar Piano Playing Technique](/img/n.gif)
2:39 MEDTNER MENTIONED 🗣️🗣️🗣️💯💯🗣️🔥🗣️🔥🔥💯🎹🎹🥶🥶
LETS GOOOOOOO
RAHHH YESSS
I still recall a solo recital by Rachmaninoff (Ann Arbor, 1938). I don't remember much else from those early years, but this I will never forget.
That's incredible. You are a very lucky person to see Rachmaninoff play and remember it after all these years.
Fantastic!
how old are you? wow!
I've been listening to Rach for 25 years, I'm 41 now. I know all his works, piano, orchestral and otherwise. I never considered any moments as suicidal, nor have i ever thought of his music as "dark". This is because our dear SVR always, ALWAYS, provides us the balance, the resolution. Does it sound sometimes dark? Absolutely. Does it sometimes also sound like the most beautiful thing ever in existence? Yes it does. His music is it's own very complicated and organic universe. But it's always counter weighted / balanced. Thanks for the video!
I’m with you, I’m a huge Rachmaninov fan, having records/CDs of literally everything he composed😂 What amazes me is that he’s not just a fabulous pianist composing flashy music to show off his skills. He’s also a genius composer with music that is mature and complex and downright innovative in the times in which he lived!!! In my opinion, Rachmaninov can stand as a composer right up there with the rest of his Russian comrades (Stravinsky, Prokofiev, Shostakovich, etc…).
Well said! It's a masterwork! ❤
I believe Rachmaninoff's demon was depression, and the effort needed to overcome it. The tension is whether or not he is able to overcome it. The welcome resolution is never clear or pre-supposed.
When I grow older I come to appreciate Rachmaninoff's 4th Concerto
The narration about Rachmaninoff had a deep touch with me. Disillusioned by the world by getting older. I say this because my dad passed away 2 weeks back. I watched this over and over again. He didn't mind classical music, but he wouldn't listen to it on his own. I always played the "classics" as it were. I'll miss you old boy🙏
I heard Daniil Trifonov play this live and it was magical
Agreed
Trifonov is a genius
He’s one of the best at the moment imo
2:40 Thank you tonebase for mentioning the dedicatee of the Rach 4, Nikolai Medtner, whom this Rachmaninov concerto often reminds me of. Two kings of the romantic era, easily the two successors of Franz Liszt's middle period.
The best recording of it I have is coupled with the Medtner 2. Sudbin plays the original unrevised Rach 4 on that album and the connections between the two concertos are very apparent in that version.
@@Quotenwagnerianer Rach thought Medtner was the better composer. I'm not sure I agree -- but I do love Medtner.
I know where Rach was coming from. From a pure point of skill, Medtner was better.
But audiences want less cerebral music that is why Medtner never took off while Rach did. Medtner sounds too much like Rach without the sweeping melancholic melodies.@@KenBreadbox
Absolutely love your work! But could you please, PLEASE cover Nikolai Kapustin? An absolute gem and very underrated composer
In good time!
HECK YEAH PLEASE
Even more of an underrated composer is Sergei Bortkiewicz. I really want to hear people talk more about him. His Piano Concerto No. 2 is incredible, and his Symphonies just as much. He even wrote pently of chamber music, and his works for solo piano are just wonders for the ears.
Rach 4 is criminally underrated BUT... all THREE of Nikolai Medtner's Piano Concerto's are even more underrated. He was a good friend of Rachmaninoff - and Rach considered him to be his greatest contemporary composer.
He is the dedicatee of Rach 4 so it's especially appropriate to mention this - and Medtner also dedicated his second concerto to Rach!
Did you see the video, Medtner is mentioned as the dedicatee, and noted as being underrated (though I agree he deserves his own videos)
The greatest modernist musical work IMO. In it he keeps his romantic, but working through chromatic modernism, filled with difficulty, at points crowning with beautiful melody.
Michelangeli interpretation is astonishing
I’m a guitarist, but I watch so many piano videos. My love and fascination toward M. Lugansky’s interpretations are enormous. I wish he could write a book someday about Rachmaninov…
His haunting melodies are just gorgious. My favorite piano composer AND a magnificent pianist himself. I doubt there will ever be another like him.
I first became hooked on the 2nd, then the third, then the fourth, and finally the 1st. They are all incredible, just like these documentaries you've put together. Thank you.
I know it might sound crazy but In my opinion, Earl Wild's renditions of the Rachmaninoff's Piano Concertos with The Royal Philharmonic Orchestra under conductor Jascha Horenstein are unparalleled. The synergy between Wild's virtuosity and the orchestra's performance is truly exceptional. I highly recommend giving those recordings a listen to experience the brilliance of Rachmaninoff's concertos brought to life.
I agree, they are absolute perfection.
I agree. Earl wild is unmatched
The best Rach concerto no 1 is Pletnev/Pesek! Pletnev the best structure! Pletnev most powerful! The best Rach no 2 Sviatoslav Richter the most genius and monumental! Rosa Tamarkina the most fierce! Grigory Sokolov most creative and best genius ideas!
I heard Earl Wild play No. 3 live in Carnegie Hall, with the New Jersey Symphony. I thought it was downright vulgar and self indulgent- even worse than Lang Lang. But i also own his recording of No. 4 and I don’t have the same feeling at all. I agree that it’s a great recording. I think his 3rd live performance was maybe the least enjoyable I’ve heard of that piece. I played for him once and he seemed nice enough, but other students have told me some unpleasant stories. Just sharing that. I sensed that he felt very bitter about not being a bigger “star,” and he ended up being very disagreeable.. I’ve heard from conductors, students and others who knew him. After hearing that, I was glad I studied with Abbey Simon instead of Earl.
Wild’s 4th is a knockout. And in fabulous sound from London.
Such a gorgeous Concerto.
Totally agree with you when you said “…the most authentic expression of the composer’s personal journey and spiritual identity.”
One could say, it took Rachmaninoff 3 concerti to sound more like Rachmaninoff.
All the longing and retrospection that you get from the second and third, now culminating in much more introspection and maturity.
Awesome video Ben!
Thank you.
I've always adored the sweep and triumph in the opening of the concerto. It also makes me dream of what a Rachmaninoff Piano Concerto No. 5 may have been.
To me, Rachmaninov's 4th Piano Concerto is one that Listen to at least 4 times a week ... I even enjoy and love both the 1st and 4th before Rachmaninov revised them. Rachmaninov to me is why I learnt piano on the first place having my mother being concert pianist and as a small kid in France, I was completely hooked to his music ...
I absolutely love Rach 4! Thank you for making this video. tonebase never disappoints.
Always such a joy to watch your videos! Thanks.
Such good content!!
Thanks so much for this vid
Thank you for all of this Ben 🙏
I'm so grateful for this video. I am even more interested in this music now. Ben your recording is amazing.
Wonderful stuff, Dr Ben. Just superb.
This gives us a much greater appreciation of this particular concerto. Thanks so much!
Excellent vídeo, Thanks for that!!❤
Thanks Ben, for this analysis of one of my favourite pieces. Rach 4 deserves to be heard by more people. Your three guests (all of them superb pianists) offered valuable perspectives.
Hey. I wonder if you could talk about Scriabin’s concerto in a video I think it would be really cool btw your videos are really cool and the fact you got Lugansky as a guest proves the quality of your production definitely 😂
Extremely underrated and beautiful concerto!
Rachmaninoff has always been able to dissect and analog every visceral emotion. His climax’s are drawn enough to indulge but quick enough to really appreciate. All of his works has their own unique and surprising appeal to life which have granted them an invaluable worth to me. Tonebase sees and translates that’s to all and I am forever greatful❤️❤️❤️
Hello Mr. Laude, everything by Rachmaninoff speaks to me, so I feel blessed to have experienced his repertoire. Thank you for sharing with listeners a way to hear his music with reduced judgements.
Great! Rach 4 has always been my second favorite of all 4 concertos.
Definitely the most underrated Rachmaninov piano concerto. Thanks for making a video of it 😁
Are the other three also underrated?
@@Pablo-gl9dj Rachmaninoff’s 2nd and 3rd are considered his greatest while his 1st and 4th are highly underrated
@@Classicallybase maybe underrated but to what extent? Better than Brahms, Chopin, Beethoven, Schumann?
What a wonderful episode, and high time that the 4th Concerto received some love! In recent years, it is the Rachmaninov concerto that I have listened to the most (the equally underrated 1st Concerto coming in a close second), and much as Ben stated, one can revisit it a thousand times. It grows and makes ever more sense with repeated listening. I don´t know how many listenings it took before I was hooked, maybe it was 10, maybe 20. It was Michelangelis famous 1957 recording with Ettore Gracis and the Philharmonia Orchestra, and I am glad that it was mentioned here. He championed this concerto and he absolutely nailed it in the first take. He reportedly was so satisfied with his performance that he uttered that he did not think he could do it better.
Others such as Trifonov and Ashkenazy have put in very fine or even great performances, but Michelangelis reading is the one that I keep returning to. Just a few of many details in his reading: the whole build-up to the climax starting from about 4:44, the climax at 6:10-6:44, the calm immediately following this. And in Michelangelis recording, the climax of the 4th Concerto does not make me wish for the heights of the 2nd Concerto, it towers in its own right. Celibidache said that Michelangeli was the only one who was aware that the climax of a piece is in a steady relation to the beginning and the end. I do not pretend to understand exactly what Celibidache meant, but the Rachmaninov 4th Piano Concerto seems to me a perfect demonstration of this ability of Michelangeli.
Captivating stuff.... Ive always loved piano concerto no. 4. At 13 I discovered it after no. 2 and before no. 3.....what a shock to the system it was then. Truly underated. 50 years on I am still mesmorised by its beauty.
Great! Idk if you mentioned that in full version, but it is so impressive how the whole 30 (25) minutes of music is built by just one entrance theme of the first movement. Amazing “lisztian” tradition when one part of theme could be in different (often - in opposite) moods.
Thank you for making a video about Rach 4, it is truly a beautiful piece
Simply -fantastic!
One of the orchestras whose channel I subscribe to did a live broadcast of this work a few days ago. I was stunned. I mean, wow.
Right on cue, your video turns up.
No - thank YOU! Best wishes from Vermont 🍁
YES! Thanks for talking about the Etude Op. 33 no. 3! I just happened to hear that etude last week somewhere on youtube, and thought to myself, "Hold up, this ending section sounds just like Rach's 4th concerto! He must've liked it so much that he recycled it." Glad to see tonebase make the link too - and so cool that you got Lugansky to demonstrate that moment. Love your content!
I love Rach 4. I’ve played through the first movement and love the middle part in 6/8 laden very heavily with a low melody and gradually moves up the keyboard and increases in intensity until a brief two-hand chordal explosion and then he ends going off on a sprint
Yuja Wang played this very well this year in Philadelphia - I saw her play it twice. As well as every other concerto, and the rhapsody four times. She is a machine.
Speaking of criminally underrated Rachmaninoff pieces, his first piano sonata is THE most underrated of his work, in my opinion. I think it's one of the pinnacles of 20th century piano literature, but it's hardly ever performed or recorded. It sits in the shadow of his second sonata, but it's just as good or even better if you ask me. I would love to see a video on that!
I’ve performed both sonatas many times, and the cello Sonata. I think the First is the weakest, in the sense that it meanders a bit much. I wish he had revised it. Rachmaninoff wasn’t happy with it and stopped performing it by the time he wrote the second. He said it was of “dubious” merit. It’s a tremendous amount of work and overwhelms the rest of the program. My best experiences with it were when I played it as the entire performance at midday concerts. When you can pay total attention to it, it’s less daunting. I feel the cello Sonata is by far the best of the three. It has the best tunes and is the least unfocused. The Second is extremely popular these days, mostly due to its effective ending, and beginning. The tunes aren’t so memorable, in my opinion, although it is a fun piece to play. Horowitz was absolutely right when he told Rachmaninoff that the revised version cut out too much. He made his own hybrid version, which puts some of the best material back into the piece. It’s what I do, also.
I agree, the cello sonata is by far the most lyrical and almost feels as the sonata counterpart to the second concerto, the second sonata is excellent but does feel often more like the etudes, than the lyrical Rachmaninoff. In lots of ways I wish people would stop thinking of Rach as a ‘lyrical’ and ‘melodic’ composer, because really the entire bulk of his music is much more complex than that, and lots of it is derived from material not many would say is lyrical (looking at the opus39 etudes and multiple of the march style preludes). I think it’s this oversimplification that leads to people not understanding the fourth concerto, because we want or expect to hear the second concerto again, but really the second concerto stands fairly isolated in Rachmaninoffs work, and i think is almost the outsider of the 5 pieces for piano and orchestra that he wrote.
@@lukeharrison8753 excellent observations, with which I agree. Another great work is the 2nd Symphony, which he also revised. I think most conductors these days choose the longer original version. Someone stole tunes from it for pop songs!
There’s a piano concerto version of it by Alexander Warenberg. Have you heard it? Also, there’s a piano concerto version of the Elegaic Trio No. 2. Technically we have six works for piano and orchestra by Rachmaninoff and his transcribers. I recently learned the solo transcription of the Cello Sonata by Asiya Korepanova. It’s on my channel.
@@danielgloverpiano7693 I will check those out, thank you. Listening to all of Rachmaninoffs canon is something i’ve been trying to complete, it seems possible but there are multiple second and third editions that always escape me! I adore the second symphony, and I guess from my earlier observations it is one of his more lyrical works, especially the gorgeous third movement. I think Rachmajinoffs solo works for piano give a totally different character to the man, especially the two sets of etudes which I personally adore most of his set of works. Truly he was one of the most astounding composers and pianists of the 20th century, and I’m loving his growth in popularity, but wish people would delve further than just his second concerto!
@@lukeharrison8753 the gap in my knowledge of the master are his operas. I have a recording of Aleko, but have never heard the other operas. He was also a great writer for the voice and his songs are well worth delving into. It’s a testament to his stature that his popularity has only grown and it is safe to say his piano concertos are perhaps the most often performed. His contemporaries who felt he was out of step have been proven wrong. His music will likely become immortal, just as Bach‘s music has become.
Excellent video. Especially given the fact that you have Mark Andre Hamelin on often, you should do a deep dive and/or series on Medtner. His Sonatas are arguably unrivaled in the 20th century repertoire and he is horribly neglected. His fairy tales are also so unique and worthwhile.
Wonderful, wonderful.
One, two, and three were were "Close Encounters" four was an autobiographical "Saving Private Ryan" The second movement contains true tragic despair.
You’re into something. But…who will flesh it out?
I always loved this concert a lot...it is so interesting
I love op. 40.
It feels uncompleted, fragmented, tortured, confused… like the modern world. I like all 3 versions, but even the last one (mostly the finale) feels incomplete. While a young composer sometimes fails and Rachmaninoff always had (unnecessary) doubts about the quality and length of his works, he seems to have had serious doubts during the composition of his op. 40 over the years and when listening to the 3th version of it I like to guess that if he hadn't died early he'd composed a 4th version 20 years later.
I realized very quickly in my 20's that this was a very special concerto. The finale is absolutely thrilling in it's stark pianistic economy of notes and harmonies. The sheer drive to the end grabs you by the throat and pulls you over the edge. I found myself listening over and over again to the last few minutes of the finale.
YES IT IS!!! i saw yuja wang perform 3 & 4 live in orlando last january 🥹
The first day that I arrived at the US, I listened to Rach 4, almost cried at the end of the second movement.
Nice to hear a bit of the original version of the 4th.
15:13 that chord progression always makes me smile.
I always enjoy hearing about how rachmaninov had an affinity for humor and would laugh heartily.... Such a great personality, and the music.... All of it is great!!
Amazing video. How about that Yamaha CFX? I like a good Steinway but this piano is something special.
8:16 I agree!! I didnt like the Rach 4 very much the first time i listened to it. However, i discovered more perspectives from this concerto and realized just how great this piece of music is, the more i listened to it. This concerto does feel intimate, profound and rhapsodic, it has a feeling of being lost and wandering, i believe this is what makes it special and different from the other 3. I enjoy listening to it now much more than i used to.
Bill Evans turned Miles Davis onto the Michelangeli recording of Rachmaninoff 4 (pw Ravel Concerto) and this was the music he was listening to when they recorded "Kind of Blue"
My favourite recording of rach 4 got taken off CZcams a few months ago, I have been searching either for the recording or a replacement ever since. I can’t believe I never checked who was playing in the recording
It is indeed under rated i didnt know this existed until a year into knowing rachmaninoff music
I would LOVE if you made a video about Medtner
Please make a video about the Prokofiev Piano concertos 2/3 :))
I second this request. The Prokofiev 2nd is a particularly attractive concerto, although the last movement leaves me wanting more.
It has always been my favourite Rachmaninoff concerto, and I have never understood the lack of appeal. It is a much more emotionally complex work, it is true, but the harmonic language is also so much more elaborate.
Yuja Wang was "blown away" by Michelangeli's interpretation of this masterwork, now she "blows us away" with her interpretation. This is Rachmaninoff at it's best. ❤❤❤
Blown away to where? To concertos 2 and 3?
@@Pablo-gl9dj Rach4
You guys should totally do a video on Medtner
Yes. Rach’s many revisions suggest that it is indeed a very personal affective journey, played out here. And therefore more revealing than the first three concerti. A reading of it that draws seriously upon his biography is necessary - and not imposed upon the music.
You're from Shepherd!! Well I'm not but I'm from Houston and have friends from there!
Rach 1 please!!
Michelangelis Rach 4.. 👌 Thats the one for me
The Fourth, along with the Symphonic Dances, is one of my favourite pieces. Rachmaninov was the original emotional goth; he was dark. This is the pinnacle of his almost jazzy chromaticism counterpointed with his most economic orchestration. You seem to have glossed over the second movement, which for me is the entire musical point of the concerto.
Damn! I wish it was about Rach 1. It’s literally my favourite. He wrote it when he was 19 🤯 I think the only reason why it’s not so popular is because no one really plays it properly. The only people who seem to “get” the concerto are Trpčeski and Trifonov
I'll get there! One thing to know about Rach 1 is that the version we know was completely transformed by a much older Rachmaninoff in the mid-1910s. Except for the themes (which he did think of as a teenager), just about everything we like about the concerto is the product of the mature Rachmaninoff. It's worth going and listening to the original version: it's much more evident that it was written by a student enthralled with the Grieg Concerto. It's almost like the older Rachmaninoff de-Griegified the piece, and re-orchestrated/recomposed whole sections to become truly special.
13:44 What is that ww insert? Which bars? Does this define the fourth version?
Do a breakdown of Rach 1! The best of the 4
I have loved Rach 4 since I first heard it. Good music does not necessarily require fireworks or technical bravado.
Best!
Great
The original 4th Concerto is even greater than this revised version. Lugansky at 4:00 is on another level.
i absolutely agree with this, it's more fleshed out and i feel in the final revision he only trimmed it down a lot and sort of tried to make it more of a crowdpleaser by inserting a big tune to the finale
Please do a survey on Rachmaninoffs Suite #2 for two pianos opus 17. The 'Valse' 2nd movement is Rachmaninof celebrating the joy of life in all its glory .(Argerich/Friere are incomparable)@@unnamed_boi
excellent plea for this piece, very detailed and informative. I know this piece since I was 18 . now I am 68 and got to know the original version and I must say that I find it superior to the 1941 version. it is structural more cohesive and has passages that are simply overwhelmingly fascinating. The 1941 version is in my humble opinion too "cut", too much is thrown out of it.
Yes , I love 2 and 3 concerto ,but this one has been a fascination all of my live, because, as is mentioned in the documentary, the longing for Russia and at the same time the modern hectic life in the States made him misunderstood and solitair, I believe
The first version works better for me than the last revised one. It makes better musical sense.
Agree with this
Also his third Symphony is so underrated
I know what you mean and I know what you mean.
I have tried to rate this concerto along with the 2 & 3 and I honestly do appreciate how much emoting you try to bring out of the excerpts you play. I find its brevity unsatisfying and its melodies as a collection - NB as a collection (I with there was an italics function) - just don't merge and flow with the same urgency. I hear in it an overabundance of complexity which does not resolve into the clean-lined sonic landscapes of the two preceding concertos (and the Paganinni Variations).
For italics you put your text between two underscore symbols. _This is proof it can be done._ If you run into difficulties, I imagine a Google search may provide extra information.
Im just commenting to salute Nikolai Lugansky and Boris Giltburg. I don't know Rach's fourth concerto, but I would be delighted if you'd do a little something about Prokofiev 8th sonata ! And Shostakovich was not that suicidal, for someone probably always living under threat fearing being executed. Love your channel, many thanks for the light you bring !
Your request should be addressed to Barbara Nissman, as she is considered the biggest specialist on Prokofiev in the United States, but she does not particularly appreciate the 8th Sonata. The host of the channel does not understand this work at all as he has showed recently.
@@Alex-oy6ss thanks for the ref. Havent found Prok mentioned anywhere here ? Ill keep looking.
@@Dnmk2007 check out the previous Juilliard ep. The girl played exc. from the 8th. + great ep. with Barbara Nissman. on her channel you will find ep. with some Prkfv works. But she does not pay attention to the 8th, believing that the 6th is Prkfv best. A.Gavrilov explained the 8th well.
in general, in the West the 8th sonata was not performed as often and was not appreciated as in the USSR. Horowitz said that Western audiences do not understand Prokofiev's last sonatas. esp the 8th. Perhaps that's why he didn't play or record 6&8. It would be interesting to hear the 6th & esp. the 8th played by Horowitz. But we have a wonderful Gilels' recording of the 8th.
@@Alex-oy6ss oh yes this is why I mentioned this work, Boris Giltburg's performance is one of the most astonishing Ive ever heard...These are weird pieces true and too difficult to perform, with immense beauty hidden in allegro moderato !! Many thanks for your time giving me all these clues, appreciate :) I've listened to that poor student struggling with the same piece than me haha she has the speed alright its a nightmare really !
@@Dnmk2007 Thanks! For me personally, there is only one performer of the 8th sonata - Gilels. I wouldn't call his sonatas weird. The younger generation has little understanding of the historical context and the atmosphere in which they were written. and it's not just about the war, but the situation in the USSR as a whole. before the war, during, and after. repressions, executions of millions of people, denunciations, false accusations and much more. The Red terror. it is clear that the Western public has passed by this Soviet context. they were simply not interested in these "deep meanings". But I just love it when performers like Barbara Nissman or Gavrilov give their explanations of these works. Once, Gavrilov shared on some classical forum his thoughts about the meanings inherent in the 8th & 7th sonatas and how it should be performed. I no longer remember all of Gavrilov's comments, but he said that his vision of Prokofiev's last sonatas changed over time. The older he got, the deeper he understood the meanings of Prokofiev's military sonatas. In a video from 1990 posted on CZcams, his explanations differ from later ones.
It was championed by Michaelangeli, who made the benchmark recording.
"This Rachs" 😂 broke me right at beginning 😂😂
also in the red ridinghood piece I always remember a part during the climax where there is many rapid high notes, and I always like to imagine that Rachmaninoff wrote that to be red redinghoods screams, about 2:08 in this video: czcams.com/video/wXmL55DwuaQ/video.html
I love the original version, and think the 3rd movement works so much better.
his best concerto!
whats that at 6:30? i melt
I'm always left conflicted by these types of analysis.
On one hand, I do find the history and the context in which the artist creates, absolutely fascinating. That knowledge can add colors to a piece that otherwise might have been missed.
But on the other hand, they almost deface the work. Just as adding new colors to a painting would ultimately deface the presented image as originally created and intended.
In these cases I have to intentionally turn off the intellect and simply try to let the music take me on a self guided journey, and let the destination be a mystery every time, with each new listen.
Can anyone tell me the name of the Richard Strauss music played around 6:25?
It' still Rach. The reference is that it's in the same key (C-major) as Strauss 's tone poem Death and Transfiguration.
@@jasonklein8102What piece is he playing though?
1st concerto is even more underrated
Exactly! Such an amazing piece…
Not rlly, I hear it quite a lot in concerts. Never heard rach 4 though
absolutely agreed! I heard Howard Shelley's recording not long ago and it practically knocked me out of my chair... incredible music.
Nah, rach 1-3 are trash (I would rather hear 4’33”) and rach 4 is actually good XD
It’s not as underrated as Rach 4. From my experience, I’ve come across rach 1 more, rach 4 almost not at all.
Rachmaninoff 🖤
medtner video when (maybe with hamelin????) (please)
In the case of the Second Symphony, which used to be performed with substantial cuts, a consensus seems to have been fairly well established that the work is best heard uncut; more and more pianists these days seem to me to be favoring either the original version of the Second Piano Sonata, or a conflation of the original and the revision, as opposed to the pared-down revision.
But - there seems to me to be no clear consensus yet as to which version of the Fourth Concerto will be accepted as the preferable version by a majority of performers and listeners. I will concede that at the moment, the latest revision still appears to be the most often heard, but I am not sure that one of the two earlier versions will not gain ground in the future. I think there are some who feel strongly that the original is superior, especially in the case of the finale, but I think there have as yet not been enough performances of either of the first two version (especially the middle one, which appears to have attracted very few champions since the release of the first recording by William Black and Igor Buketoff back in 1991. Perhaps some iconic version of the original might someday gather a following and an influence comparable to those of Horowitz or Cliburn's 3rd Concerto, or of Michelangeli's 4th. So far, I don't think this has happened - might that be simply because we haven't yet heard a sufficient number of alternative performances, or has the final "streamlined" version already won out?
I agree the 2nd revision is too severely reduced.
I've never felt this to be a dark piece, no matter the version to be honest. In fact, I found it very playful and jazzy. I like the 1926 version more, but all the versions feel experimental, and just plain adventurous.
How can people not hear the romance in the 2nd movement...its right there! Maybe I need to see a therapist?!😂
Very much loves me lots of Rach. Wonderful analysis here.
Rach 4 deserves to be heard because it's beautiful music! "Suicidal energy?" My foot!
How about the second piano sonata?
The equivalent of this for Prokofiev is his 5th concerto
1:42 that Dr Laude?
It is well known that Rachmaninoff was deeply "homesick" for Russia. But there were aspects of the US and the West he adored: Among them: GREAT American cigarettes (?), which he could easily afford. He resented his punishing virtuoso pianist schedule. But he also loved the fast cars he could afford to buy and the luxurious homes he could also afford. He liked to have his friends come to his estate and had the freedom to associate with fellow ex-patriot Russians. He was never completely comfortable in English, and it probably consumed his thinking.
He was very sad for the plight of fellow Russian musicians during the War. I don't think he was ever as "gloomy" as Stravinsky liked to say. Rubinstein reported that when he visited the Maestro, they had great conversations (in Russian) about the money they made and the money they lost. They drank and laughed about it into the night.
Sanjosemike (no longer in CA)