BioShock Infinite SPOILED GAMES! Adam Sessler with Jeff Gerstmann and Kevin VanOrd
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- čas přidán 3. 04. 2013
- It's been over a week since BioShock Infinite came out, so we decided that it was time to stop biting our tongues, and start spoiling the game. We asked Jeff Gerstmann of GiantBomb.com and Kevin VanOrd of Gamespot to join Adam Sessler im this special two-part edition of Spolied Games.
And of course - this show is called SPOILED GAMES! There are spoilers. Act accordingly.
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Jeff Gerstmann's review: www.giantbomb.com/reviews/bios...
Kevin VanOrd's review: www.gamespot.com/bioshock-infi...
Adam Sessler's review: • BioShock Infinite REVI... - Hry
That doesn't row part is just pure genius. It basically gives you a hint of what is actually at play. It's only after completing the game that part finally makes sense. They obviously tried to rescue Elizabeth multiple times and failed. The heads or tails part actually showed how many times they tried helping Booker save Elizabeth if you look closely at the board the Lutece guy is wearing it shows it always the same outcome everytime lol. It goes back to the constants and variables explanation the game tried so hard to hammer home at the end
"The universe doesn't like its peas mixed with its porridge" is the basic explanation for why Elizabeth has powers. Her little finger is in one universe and the rest of her is in the other, thus giving her the powers. The tale is very complex but nothing is really left unexplained.
I never felt it was very complex since the narrative is pretty straight forward. I never really understood why so many people needed to plot explained since the game does a fine job just in the cutscenes and dialogue.
The Vigors originally come from Jeremiah Fink observing Dr. Suchong, from the original Bioshock, through a tear, like Albert Fink, Jeremiah's brother, observed future musicians and stole their songs.
This is also expanded upon in "Burial At Sea" through an audio diary of Suchong's.
I haven't played Burial At Sea yet but how does that work? Sure Fink observing Suchong through a tear makes sense but the Plasmids of Rapture were only possible through the sea slugs there, and not only do such slugs not exist in Colombia but Vigors don't have the mental degradation that Plasmids do.
Just because you steal someone's ideas doesn't mean that you steal their methods. Likely for the convenience of the story, Fink's vigors are made from something else and don't cause mental degeneration.
I think i heard that Fink took an expedition to the Atlantic where the slugs were after learning their location from the tears
Wait, Jeff at the end said "Why does Elizabeth have these powers to begin with?" I thought it was because part of her exist in two separate realities like Rosalind Lutece said.
But then Booker/Comstock should have powers too
zxjacko Yeah but Booker and Comstock are from separate realities. One where he accepts the baptism (Comstock) and one where he doesn't (Booker). Elizabeth is one person physically existing in both realities, allowing her the ability to open tears.
Chris Sousa +'S' Plays Well this is my theory, at the start of the game you ring the bells and the sky goes crazy, then there is a flash of purple light-that is when I think you have opened a tear to Comstock's world, you go through, now you are in com stocks world but you are not also in Booker's New york apartment world, where as elzibeth/anna her finger was in one world where she was in another, giving her the ability to open and create tears, rosalind lutuce her other half (forgot his name) was in another tear meaning that her metaphoric finger was in another dimension giving her powers, our booker was never in two worlds at once meaning no powers, the bloody nose means you have died in a world that has had a tear opened to yours or you are in a world where you are dead, or have recently died, when you come into a new world you can sift through your brain and discover memories of the world your in versions of yourself for example booker remembering leading the rebel uprising or maybe i just made that memory up, i played bioshock over various sessions, this would be how comstock knew about the mark of dewitt's hand unless comstock also had the power to open tears and it was unexplained.
Chris Sousa I can see that but I think Booker being drown stopped the cycle because elzibeth can see all "doors" therefore she knows to drown booker there to stop the cycle, but I do think its infinite well at least to certain point.
Chris Sousa You mentioned earlier that Booker got vigors and no one else really has that in the game but there are plenty of Zealots of the Lady and Firemen around. Vigors are just as plentiful as plasmids as shown near the beginning of the game where Fink Industries were showing it off at the fair. And I second the fact that it is an amazing game :D
Here it is, at long last: BioShock Infinite SPOILED GAMES! Adam Sessler with Jeff Gerstmann and Kevin VanOrd from ***** and ***** gather around the table to talk in full, spoilerific detail about BioShock Infinite's world, characters and ending. But, yeah: spoilers, you guys. Watch out!
That was a fantastic discussion.
Don't do this to me! It's going to be months before I get around to playing this game, and I really want to play it spoiler free.
"At long last"? You guys know most of us just got it last week, right? Running this now is in direct opposition to what Adam said in his review about taking your time with it... In the future, you should probably wait at least a month after the release of a game before putting out the Spoiled Games ep.
***** These guys play games for a living. I'm sure it took buckets of restraint just to wait a week to talk about a game they all so clearly enjoyed.
***** Yeah I beat it a day after it came out and I still "took my time" with it I even collected all the trophies. Just because he said take your time doesn't mean play it in extremely short intervals.
He doesn't row.
Explains everything.
What is the significance of that? Please explain
@@Benjamin_WolfsonRobert Lutece referring to the fact that this has all happened before, and in each timeline/reality, Booker just sits there looking at the box and doesn't end up helping them row the boat 😊
One of the voxophones does explain that it was the amputation of her pinky by the tear that gave her the powers. Although I suppose that's more justification than explanation, suspension of disbelief in that mystery is definitely mor satisfying than a true explanation, literally speaking.
"I guess the universe doesn't like it's peas mixed with its porridge."
Thank you guys so much for making this series! I just finished Infinite and had seen these "Spoiled Games" episodes in my feed. I'd been looking forward to watching these discussions after completing the game. It's so refreshing to hear games talked about with such reverence and intelligence. I'm a huge fan and I look forward to your work in the future.
Bioshock 1 and Infinite are my favorite games of all time
I just got the "He doesn't row, I see what you mean" it's not his part to row, not he doesn't want to row.
I have a shirt that says that. I love that convo, it's all but explains the entire game.
By "He doesn't row" were they saying 'row' but actually meaning 'know'? If not then i don't think i get it.
Mathew Day Nope. Remember the 'heads or tails?' Well that's how many times they've tried this. The entire first convo in the boat is one big spoiler. It's just so out of context when you first hear it seems meaningless. What she says is 'why don't you ask him, I suppose he has just as much incentive to get there' (true). To which he responds '...i suppose he does but there's no point in asking him, because he doesn't row.... no I mean he DOESN'T row.' Meaning, that's not his purpose and in the previous like 125 times they've tried this, he's never volunteered or ended up rowing the boat. Constants and variables. Many little things may be different, some stay the same. One constant apparently is, Booker DOESN'T row the boat. He never has, and probably never will. There's always a man, there's always a city, He DOESN'T row.
Ohhh.. wow, thank you very for clearing that up. Only just played this game a few days, and still trying to understand everything in the story. But this part just went over my head. The story in this game has got to be one of the bests in a game, never thought so much about a game's story especially even after I've beaten it.
Mathew Day No problem. It took me awhile to figure it out. And only after having a few long conversations. The story seems simple at first (go get the Princesses in the castle) but by the end it's like O.o?
The very beginning of the game is the point in which Booker goes through a tear into the realm where Comstock(other him) originates, or rather was created during Bookers 1st baptism. As he passed the tear, his memory was partially lost(side affect). The phrase "bring us the girl, wipe away the dept" was so strong that he remembered it but his mind manufactured a new meaning for it to compensate for the new reality. So he kinda remembers Anna. Everytime his memory encounters a paradox, he bleeds.
I love how they took idas from the butterfly effect movie, with the bleeding nose part, Matrix reloded, with the multiverse perspective, and your playthrough being the one that makes a closure, and how they approached us the players, thrusting our intelligence, but at the same time challenging it, in order to tell a complex story full of social, ethical and religious critisism, as well as "non popular" historic references (which were well portrayed)
Just beat this game for the 10th time(in general) on 1999 mode(2nd time). I will never get enough of this game. The characters, the storyline, the environment, Columbia itself, the artwork, just everything. Call me obsessed but this game to me is one of the greatest games to date.
can i contact you somehow ?
This is such an awesome game
One thing that people don't realize about vigors, as stated in this video, is the fact that the Lutece field allowed the people of Columbia to see tears. Tears of Rapture specifically. The birth of vigors came from seeing a tear of Rapture and these fascinating pasmids being used in a city of the future. It cleverly explains how vigors came to be, while keeping the famous gameplay mechanic that we know and love in the Bioshock series. Vigors fit in perfectly, "it's just a matter of perspective."
Love the interview and review Adam Sessler. I have only played the game once all the way through and I was looking for some resolution to the story I watched... well game I played. And it was nice to have some perspective from the 3 of you on those highlighted moments of the game that made me think where the story was going to go. I admit I did not like the ending because I wanted a happy ending and have Dewitt end up with his daughter, but from a story perspective and for the sake of the story they were able to deliver the ending it deserved, or rather the drowning was the only way you were ever going to resolve the issue of defeating Comstock.
Actually they did answer who the guy in the lighthouse was and how Elizabeth got her powers.
The lighthouse guy is the lighthouse keeper (surprise) told by Comstock to kill Booker when he arives. He is killed by the Luteces as is evident by the picture of him in their lab with the note saying: "the only obstacle".
Elizabeth got her powers by having a part of herself in two worlds at once (her pinkie finger in one, herself in the other) as is explained in one of Luteces voxophone recordings.
Amazing! This is why I play games! I'm still talking about it with friends over and over again as they (finally) finish it and it seems like every one of us finds something new/ takes something different away from the experience. Great job by the team at Irrational! (Can't wait for the dlc)!
Adam and Rev3Team - great job covering this title, loved all the sit-downs with Levine and hearing Adams thoughts, keep up the good work! (Any plans on discussing the whole Adam Orth situation?)
Another little subtle nod is Elizabeth is dressed in the same color scheme as the little sisters and as soon as Songbird sinks toward the sea-floor and Rapture is revealed, there is a little sister visable sobbing over a defeated Big Daddy (You can even see it in the video at around 25:53)
just noticed something i missed when playing. when the statue right after the two cops are talking about skyhooks changes from robert(?) lutece to rosiland(?) lutece. Initially i chalked it up to general weirdness but in actuality it was dewitt's brain adapting from his universe, where robert originated, to rosiland's universe where she is the genius physist.
Can someone explain to me what the difference is if you choose the bird or the cage necklace? I beat the game twice choosing the total different choices i made the first time i played. But i didnt see any difference at all. Or mayby there was but i just missed. Anyone know?
Counting the heads on the chalkboard that the male Lutece holds for the coin flip means that they have attempted to rescue Elizabeth 122 times and this was the 123rd.
We got to see 2 time zones where we know what Booker did. One being that he joined the resistance and died.
Though it may be that he just was trying to get the weapons; perhaps he succeeded but then didn't escape, therefore Daisy may have just let Booker become a martyr for her cause.
The second being the the one we played as.
They sort of explained how Elizabeth/ana got her powers. In a voxaphone on monument island, it says that pretty much because there's parts of her that exist in two universes, via her finger getting stuck in the boker universe, that she can now tear between any two universes, or something.
As a father of little girl myself, the scene where Booker gives over Anna and the hastily tries to fight for her back left me in sheer panic and terror. And I'm man enough to say that when they slow mo on Booker and Baby Anna reaching for each other, just for the tear to close on her pinky left me crying so hard that it still affects me to this day
The question near the end about why Elizabeth even had powers is when she was pulled into the tear that lead to comstock's reality as a baby in the struggle, her pinky was cut off and left in that reality meaning she existed in two realities. This supposedly gave her the ability to open tears.
Elizabeth has the ability to open years because her finger was cut off by the closing tear, making her also exist in more than one dimension/reality. This allows her to access more than one reality. And the guy under the hood in the lighthouse was sent by comstock to kill booker when he got ther, but the lutece twins killed him before he had the chance. The answer to the finger is in a voxophone, and the answer to the guy under the hood is in the lighthouse.
I don't remember the exact room I was in but Elizabeth told me how Battleship Bay was created and possible, told me she read it in one of her books in her tower. I found two rooms with pipes in them and she explained this to me in one of those rooms.
I may have worded my response weirdly with the timeline references. Liz says that sometimes when she opens tears the universes she sees is identical except a pillow is blue instead of red. The universe I'm talking about is the one at the end where you see old Liz, in 1984 she'd be about 90 years old, this universe would be the kind that simply has a blue pillow. Songbird stops Booker, but because she intervened in your universe Booker is not stopped by Songbird and that outcome is avoided.
can anyone tell me if choices matter? does it matter if a choose the cage over the bird necklace or vice versa?
There's a voxophone that explains that part. Rosalind Lutece is pondering what makes Elizabeth different and decides that it's not what she is, but what she is not. "A part of her remains from where she came. It would seem the universe doesn't like it's peas mixed with it's porridge." I believe the quote was.
it's explained in one of the Voxophones, just before the final battle, Lutece explains that "one of the subjects seems to be aging faster than others" after the ending it's obvious that she's speaking about Booker/Comstock, almost as if they were lab rats in a twisted experiment.
They also actually explained why Elizabeth has the powers. I can't remember where but I do remember it's an easily forgettable line. They said that when she lost her pinky she simultaneously existed in two worlds. Both The world with Booker and the world with Comstock, giving her the abilities she has. She, in a sense, transcends the dimensions.
I agree. At 27:00 Gerstmann talks about not stopping Comstock's reality. It sounded like Sessler was about to argue with him but changed his mind. The whole point of the drowning scene was to end the Comstock reality before the baptism effectively removing Comstock's existence.
The thing with such a story as Bioshock Infinite, one dealing with metaphysics and alternate dimensions is that you can basically make up explanations that render plot holes useless.
It is plausible that since Elizabeth existed in that universe, she "entered into" her own body. Which didn't happen with Booker since he was dead in that universe. Or its also plausible that Daisy's revolt may have killed her.
In Bioshock you had splicers that were cool looking & unpredictable in every fight you had with them. They would stick on walls & attack you, Crawl on walls, backflip left & right to dodge your attacks, disappear, & they had different attacks like hooks, bombs, fire, & so much more. 2 Big daddys types that were hard to fight & attacks, big sisters that were super fast & freak out a bit when you heard them come from no where, big brutes that were the bigger splicers that threw shit at you....
Booker going to the baptism is a constant, Booker getting baptized was a variable. All Bookers in all timelines eventually go to the baptism, half decide to get baptized while the other half run away. By baptizing and then drowning Booker it essentially cuts off the entire 'Comstock' branch of the Booker timeline.
I think the guy under the hood in the beginning was another Booker that failed to rescue Elizabeth, and the reason that Elizabeth has her powers is because she's in two timelines at once (her pinky is in the original Booker timeline) which causes her to be able to open tears, much like what happened to the Letuce twins and the powers that they have now.
My opinion with the end is that when Dewitt is drowned he has already accepted the baptism so their not actually drowning Dewitt their drowning Comstock and that's post credit's sequence because it shows that Dewitt has finally broken the infinite loop and he and Annabelle are finally free of Comstock. This is also hinted to in the scene where all the Elizabeths disappear bar one as only one universe, the universe seen in the post credits sequence, remains.
The way I took there being multiple Bookers at the second baptism (the dialogue/scene is different than the one Booker walks away from) and Elizabeth being represented by all possibilities was to show that all the Bookers that went on to be Comstock were killed by Elizabeth (or that it's one of two paths).
Some food for thought:
First, remember the the tears were originally created by the Luttece machine (the woman version), which was the technology that also kept the cities floating (it's in one of the voxophones).
Second, both Lutteces (they are the same person but in different realities) could've made the machine, but the man didn't have the unlimited founding that Comstock gave.
Okay so the reason why Elizabeth (Anna Dewiitt) has these power is because when Comstock (Booker Dewitt) gives the lettuces his daughter through that portal you see near the end, notice that Elizabeth's finger comes off the reason why she can open tares is because parts of her exist in two different reality's, it's like she is given the powers to reach back to her finger
In one of the voxaphones from the Luteces say that she has the powers because part of her is still in Booker's dimension, her pinkie. It says something about "peas in the porridge." Since she is living in multiple dimensions, she has the power to traverse them
I figured the dead guy in the lighthouse was a guard that the Luteces killed, because not anyone can just go to Columbia. He is wearing overalls.
As for Elizabeth's powers...two theories. The Luteces experimented on her as a child to give her powers, or her pinky being left in another universe helps her have the powers.
Lutece does theorize why Elizabeth has her powers in a voxophone
(Voxophone 16, "What makes the girl different? I suspect is has less to do with what she is, and rather more with what she is not. A small part of her remains from where she came. It would seem the universe does not like its peas mixed with its porridge.")
Toward the end the Luctese twins say something about how by pulling you through the rift when bringing you to Columbia your memories got messed up, as a result you start to "create" memories of your own. I dont remember quite clearly but that was how it happened.
also hearing the songbird in Bioshock 1 while fitzgerald is on the piano is trippy as hell
Someone has probably already answered but since I'm not seeing the comment I'll do it too: I believe that, yes, they are different Bookers. You have Booker A selling his daughter, Booker B taking A's daughter to his universe, Booker C loosing his wife and daughter and being hired to bring A's back and, I imagine, that the one you saw after the credits still having his daughter must be a Booker D; that was never involved in anything thus was allowed to survive the baptism drowning.
I believe that Elizabeth has her powers because when she is given to Comstock, she extends her hand to Booker, which cuts her pinky finger off. Since a part of her still remains in another world, the world that Booker delivers her to Comstock, she has the ability to create a rip in the fabric of space and time, because she -technically- is in two places at once. if that makes any sense.
i always thought that that the most likely explanation is that there are many lighthouses around the world and all of them are guarded by keepers to ensure nobody gets into Columbia that isn't supposed to, being that the city became very restricted from the rest of the world after it's secession from the U.S. i think either the Lutece twins or maybe a former Booker simply offed the lighthouse keeper to allow access into the city incognito.
If I remember correctly this is confirmed, in the scenes when you first see Elizabeth in the tower, in one of Rosalind's Voxaphones. At least, she theorized that too. She says something like "What makes her special isn't what she is but what she isn't"..."A part of her is somewhere else"..."It seems the Universe doesn't like the mixing of its porridge and its peas" yadda yadda. So, you're probably right!
It's the lighthouse guard. In Lutece's Laboratory you can find a photograph of the lighthouse with the words "only one obstacle" scribbled on it. The Luteces killed him and used him to scare and therefore motivate Booker to give it his best shot.
The guy in the lighthouse was meant to kill Booker. The Letuces killed him first.
Elizabeth (Anna) has her powers because her finger was cut off before she was taken. This resulted in her existing simultaneously in 2 different realities at once.
There's a great thread on the NeoGAF forum that has diagrams, quotes voxophones and everything which helps explain a lot of this stuff.
The reason why Elizabeth has her universe tearing powers is because when she was an infant and lost her pinky, she was from then on in two different realities at once. This granted her the power to see tears, and with years of reading, studying, and experimenting while she was locked up in her tower and tied to the siphon - she had the ability to even open and walk through them.
that song they played when you find Elizabeth. "Tears for fear - Everybody wants to rule the world" in a way it describes the game. Every faction wanted to rule with power and the fears of going through tears and how the outcome would change. I guess the fear of the unknown type thing. I don't know, just a speculation.
The exact thing you're looking for is "It would seem that the universe doesn't like its peas mixed with its porridge" ~ Rosalind Lutece
Basically, because she's partly existing in another universe, she is beyond others in her connection to the threads themselves.. According to Rosalind.
Constants and variables. Constants: Booker-like character, guardian, over-zealous leader, young/little girl, water, lighthouse, utopian city. Variables: Instead of Booker, it's a different man, instead of Songbird, it's a Big Daddy, instead of Elizabeth, it's a Little Sister, instead of Comstock, it's Ryan, instead of Columbia, it's Rapture.
As a voxophone stated in the game, the universe does not like peas mixing in its porridge. The ability to open/create tears was essentially the universe's way of attempting to return Anna/Elizabeth to where she belonged.
Elizabeth had the powers because when Comstock brought Anna to Columbia where her pinky is gone, now a part of her is in another universe(the pinky) that's how she could control the tears but the guy who got executed? I don't know
That's what the ending seems like it's trying to say, yes. But ultimately what it then boils down to is "Elizabeth is exerting a power over the timeline which is not visually apparent" by funneling all possible Comstock-Bookers into the single body of the one she drowns. Which doesn't really make much sense since there's no precedent or explication.
Adam and Kevin on the same stage talking the same game.... This is a new era and the era is great.
The way I read the Booker/Comstock thing is that when Elizabeth drowns you she stops you from making the choice of being baptized. She stops you from becoming Comstock by accepting it, and stops you from being the Booker that gives Anna to the Lutece twins.
Elizabeth has her powers because she (that exact same one) existed in two planes, her cut off pinky in Bookers world and the rest of her in columbia world. "the univers it seems does not like to have it's peas mixed up with it's porridge." IMO
Just finished Infinite last night and I was pretty blown away and just in awe having a complete wtf just happened moment when the credits rolled..Such a good game.
Also about that little special ending after the credits, I'm surprised they didn't say anything about the idea that the entire story could have been a dream brought about by Booker's Drunken stupor, because it could have very well been plausible.
I think this was overlooked by them giving their last statements at the end: Anna is Elizabeth, killing Dewitt prevented Anna/Elizabeth, preventing Comstock from doing anything further
I think at the end ALL the Bookers were killed. At the end we saw different Bookers and Elizabeths at every lighthouse. Elizabeth said that even though each was different, each came to the same end or something like that. Because Elizabeth could see every possibility in every universe the Elizabeths could coordinate themselves and kill every Booker. So none of them every became Comstock. Or something like that. Love this game, ahhhhhh!!!
The dead guy was hired buy Comstock to kill DeWitt once he made it to the lighthouse. The Luteces subsequently killed him. They mentioned him as "an obstacle" in the game.
Yeah, thanks :)
Also, I just realized something. I think what Rosalind Lutece meant with that is that the reason that those tears exist is in fact BECAUSE the finger and I also think because Elizabeth isn't in fact from that specific universe (there wasn't an Anna/Elizabeth in any of the Comstock universes)
Everyone seems to skip over the scene where booker players the guitar and Elizabeth sings a song... Beautiful moment in recent gaming.
played it again after finishing, I love the moment when you get to battleship bay, when I played it the second time I heard that there is a piano which plays "girls just want to have fun" from the future. It is this attention to detail that I had missed in a lot of games in the past.
in the universe where booker becomes baptized, he comes back after initially rejecting it, so it would have only been the priest, maybe out of embarrassment and humility. also, there are universes where booker rejected the baptism flat-out, so at the end when you wake up in booker's house it still makes sense
About two weeks before the game was released, i came across the Comstock entry in the bioshock wiki and its his brief description, it said real name Booker Dewitt. That got me thinking, about two days later, that bit was removed from the entry, but the bottle had been opened...
Adam: "Did you see that ending coming?"
Kevin: "Half of it maybe? I think I saw Comstock is Elizabeth's father, like Anna is Elizabeth kind of thing... but obviously not how that was structured, how it manifested."
So no, you didn't.
But I just want to jump in at 29:48 and tell Jeff, "Oh, they mention why Elizabeth has those powers in the game. In one of Rosalind's voxophones', she theorizes it's because Elizabeth's finger is in one universe, while the rest of her is in another. In the Voxophone, Rosalind thinks that because Elizabeth/Anna exists now in two realities, that this opens up the possibility for her to jump around between realities."
on the beach at battleship bay, elizabeth says that they waterfall is a system of pumps and rain catchers. i imagine they brought the water up to Columbia in the first place the same way they brought up all the people.
They went to that baptism location specifically because they could prevent ALL Comstocks there. It wasn't just "one" reality, it was THE main branch that the other branches came out off, and they wanted to cut it off.
I wish I could just jump into this conversation and add my two cents too it, because the conversation is so profound and even casual in the sense (like gamnman159's top comment) that you feel like it's something you talk about with your friends.
Also, my own theory: I believe, since you saw multiple Elizabeth's at the end, they were all possibly talking to a collective, somewhat singular Booker from the infinite universes, cause she's pretty darn possible, and the others wouldn't have vanished. This doesn't explain how in the end, he sees his daughter and he's still alive, but that's good enough for me.
Elizabeth obtained her powers when she was brought into Comstocks dimension, since she existed in Booker's and now exists also in Comstocks, it gave her the ability to open the tears into other dimensions
I really enjoyed hearing this discussion. The only thing that "dissapointed" me was towards the end of the discussion about how Elizabeth got her powers. This is explained in one of the voxophones from Lutece. Simply because her pinky got ''chopped'' off and remained in (lets say) Universe A, and Elizabeth herself being in Universe B, she got her powers.
Quote from the game:
“It would seem the universe does not like its peas mixed with its porridge”
I believe the line, "are you afraid of god?-No but I'm afraid of you" means that Booker is afraid of Elizabeth not because he is afraid of her powers, but because she reminds him of what he has done in the past that he is so ashamed of, especially how he gave her to comstock. My theory is that Booker knew Liz was his daughter the entire game but couldn't face it, and repressed it.
Comstock was turned sterile so he had the luteces open a tear to a world where the booker that refused to be baptised(never becoming Comstock) had a child. This booker also had the emotional "debt" from his war exp. and was told it would be wiped away if he gave them his daughter.Shortly after he does that he changes his mind and thats when Anna/Elizabeth gets her pinky cut in half thru the rift...Which in turn gives her the powers she has because part of her was still in the alternate universe.
No, he DID give away his own daughter, which was Elizabeth. Which pretty much became a trauma for him.
But it always haunted him and made him this "I need redemption" person.
Going through a Tear also means your memories get mixed with the You in that "new" reality.
Exploring the voxophones adds a layer of that theoretical plot points you were talking about. Also the new DLC Burial at Sea seems to be headed in that direction as well. Try reading the essay, "Constants and Variables-Exploring the Many Doors of Bioshock Infinite" at Scribd. It goes into more detail.
That's how I understand it. Because her finger exists in another reality she has the ability to open rifts, which is an attempt for the "universe" to get the two pieces of her back to where they belong. As the Luctese lady said "...it seems the universe does not like its peas mixed with its porridge."
Also one more thing people have failed to see is the indoctrination aspect of the game. When Lutece was experimenting on baby Annabelle, she was trying to give her these powers to open tears between universes. It's similar to parts of history where people would take children and indoctrinate them because it's only possible at a young age, where Comstock is too old to adopt such powers. Africa, 1930's Germany, and so on. I've yet to see anybody make this connection.
Love it! Although I thought it was kind of short. Hope they will explore the different story lines in Infinite with the DLC. The could have it pick up after the game ends or something..I saw a lot of scenes or concepts from E3 not used, maybe they will in the future. Can't get enough of this game! Oh and Meg you're AWESOME! ;-)
It's kinda hard to explain, but here goes; Think of the Luteces, the two talking in the very beginning of the video, as the Cheshire Cat In wonderland. They know everything, but they don't always tell. So they know how this scene plays out. When the woman says "He doesn't row?!" she's really asking "He won't row?!" when the man corrects her in saying "No, he DOESN'T row." he means it in the past tense. Like if they where sitting somewhere talking about this scene after it happened...
Ever notice that the door to Anna's room in the scene after the credits opens the opposite direction as it does in every other scene?
What;s the song at the end?
Hear me out, the man in the hood is a DeWitt that was killed for his gambling habit, in a world where he didn't trade Anna for an out. In that sense 'Don't disappoint us' could be seen as don't be a DeWitt that kept Anna, be a DeWitt that gave her up, because being the latter allows you to be alive, and therefore play the game.
For all the emphasis on there being many, many off shoots of DeWitt, it should be remembered that only one was drowned; the one you play.
This made a lot of moments make sense to me now that I didn't understand playing through it like meeting old Elizabeth in 1884. I don't know I how I didn't get it at first.
There's also a point in the story where one of the characters (I can't remember which) That says the city can fly because of quantum mechanics, and at the end they disregard the fact that there are infinite universes where they didn't do that thing at the end
Voxophone 60! ""Dear brother, these holes in the thin air continue to pay dividends. I know not which musician you borrow your notes from, but if he has half the genius of the biologist I now observe, well...then you are to be the Mozart of Columbia."" - Jeremiah Fink
The guy who was executed at the beginning was sent by Comstock, which is shown by the note on the wall, to kill Booker when he enters the lighthouse. He succeeds in killing Booker the first time so the Lutece twins killed him every time after that.
In my eyes, the drowning scene was the ultimate self-sacrifice. She knew by drowning her father she would create a paradox, and that the universe would delete her, and all the suffering she inadvertently caused along with her (both to those in Columbia and to her father).
That's the thing that led to her powers, but that isn't really a reason for why she has the powers. It's explained in-game that the tears occur when a particle which exists in two realities is affected to create a split: this is how Rosalind and Robert found each other. It's not explained how Elizabeth can do it by herself.
Anybody know what happened to the character Saltonstall? Was he just cut because he didn't quite fit in with the story, or will he appear in a dlc?
And third
The source of power that Elizabeth has is in the finger (I think there is even a reference somewhere), because she is physically split in 2 worlds (which in turn create an infinite of probabilities), thus having some ability to somewhat open those tears.
The reason Elizabeth becomes the new Comstock and destroys New York is that Comstock successfully operates on her, making it so that she can't use her powers without severe pain. That combined with years of waiting for Booker breaks her will. She even says that time was the only thing capable of making her fulfill the prophecy. The reason it takes so many years for her to bring you to her is because she spends that whole time saving up the power to bring you to her.