@@Jupue I kinda stopped watching Clash a while ago, so I must've just missed that episode. The episodes are just too long for me. If there is a channel/series with the length of Game Knights and the style/format of commander clash, that'd be perfect, I think.
@@jordangroblewsky2087 the trick is to either watch it at increased speed or just listen to them and occasionally check the vid if a card you dont know pops up.
unless you never play a land again though thats still garbage outside of some wierd green white deck where you you're trying to use both green land ramp and white catch up land ramp and need to keep destroying your own lands.
City of Traitors seems pretty good in lands decks. Some Azusa style effects with Crucible of Worlds can ramp you pretty hard out of nowhere. Drop City, next turn tap it for mana, play a land, play City again, tap it again, and repeat the process as many times as you can. It seems really good in that context. OG Titania will also give you a 5/3 every time this gets sacrificed.
Im so glad (and surprised!) that y’all chose to talk about mirrormade. I agree with crim, the base is a man’s rock and the ceiling is infinite. One time I actually did copy an opponents omniscience (like Richard mentioned) and won off of it! I’ve also used it to copy just value artifacts and enchantments I have on the board just to double up. I’ve never found it to be a dead card and really enjoy it. Than you all for talking about it!
Missing land drops for sire is NOT the same as not paying for rhystic study Seth. Rhystic study is one mana per turn. Skipping land drops escalates exponentially. On the first turn, you're down 1 mana, second turn you skip another land drop that's now 3 mana. Then 6 mana.
Yeah there's no way you stop making your land drops so your oponent does not draw 2. Even in turn 10, I always procure to make every single land drop I can.
Surprised they didn't think of Hinata when discussing Open into Wonder, it's absolutely busted in the Hinata go wide build (and in general nowadays, whenever I see "X target", I instantly think of Hinata!)
Another x spell commander likes it too, Zaxara. All those big dumb hydras you made? Send them in unblockable and draw some cards for it too. Can be used to finish with big bodies or draw cards when needed.
So a friend in my pod is the friendly neighborhood eldrazi player and Sire of Stagnation is an absolute house against the entire table. Sire is basically playing two rhystic studies. If they wanna miss land drops, it’s a win, if they play their lands, it’s an absolute home run and it is absolutely bruuuuuutal. I hate this card, but I gotta respect how good it is 😂
Culling ritual is INSANELY underrated. Are people not playing against treasures still?? Sol Rings are still a swingy effect that need to be answered. So many low mana threats nowadays too. But treasures is one of the most ubiquitous threats to the format lately.
Guided passage is incredible. It's almost never the three worst cards in your deck, but it's almost always a way to solve the table's problems which makes people happy with you. You could also get a favor before even casting this card. Sometimes people mess up and give you things they thought would be bad, but are actually great. At the end of the day it's also deck thinning to get non-relevant cards out.
Oakhame Adversary sees some play in cEDH, where most people don't have a ample supply of blockers and lots of green manadorks hit the field on T1, think thats why it was suggested. For regular EDH i agree with the C/D rating. Not enough guaranteed impact for the cost.
I think they misrated it pretty badly. even in casual, deathtouch on a 2/3 body is a very strong disincentive to stopping your 2 mana draw engine - besides the obvious of a 2/3 body being relevant just for stats.
I love guided passage in my krak/kydele deck, it's mostly just a fun meme deck but I love the reaction of people at a table when I ask them to go through my deck to pick things out, most creatures in that deck are quite good and krark also allows me to copy it. Just fun to see them read through the cards in my deck and stumble upon goblin game
I'm also a Guided Passage enjoyer. I play it in a Pako and Haldan pile of bulk rares. I've cast Passage like seven times now, and never have I gotten the same cards.
Open into Wonder is amazing in many decks Orvar, the All-Form - your creatures draw cards + you get a copy of one you target Zaxara - make your big hydras unblockable and get a new Hydra from Zaxara Kediss, Emberclaw Familiar + any blue partner - your commanders deal damage + even more with Kediss Volo Guide to monsters - You will have a ton of mid-large tokens here, make them unblockable Captain N'ghathrod- Horrors will mill your opponents and you get value at the same time Hinata- X spells that target, basically cost 0 with Hinata. Magus Lucea Kane- copy the X spell make more creatures unblockabale Miirym, Sentinel Wyrm - Your Dragons hit big and draw cards Queza Augur of Agony- Draw a bunch of cards, deal a lot of combat+ noncombat damage. Be'lakor, the Dark Master - Your Big demons draw cards Octavia, Living Thesis - make your 8/8 creatures unblockable Koma - make your serpents unblockable Kinnan - make your big monsters unblockable
Precise Moment: Choose target spell you control that is currently on the stack. Counter that spell. Create a copy of that spell(move to the top of the stack), you may choose new targets. The copy gains split second(as long as this spell is on the stack, players can't cast other spells or activate abilities that aren't mana abilities.)
City of Traitors is great in Simic landfall decks. Especially Tatayova. It sacrificing itself is actually a really solid upside. Being able to make it your your land drop repeatedly from the yard draws you cards.
I will say in my meta most of the green players build their decks with Mana dorks into three Mana ramp. Which makes oakhame adversary really good. Pretty regularly draw me anywhere from 2-5 cards a game, which is obviously great.
The Guided Passage discussion is so perfect. Seth and Crim are like “cards can be situational, having someone else tutor up 3 cards for you means you get the worst cards for that particular board state!” Richard is saying “all my cards are equally bad!” And Phil, of course, is going “well, if I only have one noncreature spell, this tutors it every time! Combo!”
Ok but, even if I get the 3 worst cards in my deck for this specific scenario, they're still going to be helpful, just to a lesser extent than the best cards. Just don't put cards in your deck that do absolutely nothing and you just played a 3 mana draw 3. The only time you should be getting a dead draw is if you're already at 15 mana and draw yet another basic land. Otherwise, you built your deck wrong.
Crim is right. Open Into Wonder is a great card in the evasive blue decks. I use it in Becket Brass, and it's fantastic. Alot of those creatures are not as evasive as you'd think, but connecting is key to those decks. Basically look at the card as saying, "x creatures are unblockable, draw x cards, AND trigger all your tribal payoffs." The same is true for ninjas. They are only evasive the turn they come out, then they're just sitting there.
I play Oakhame Adversary in a couple of my decks and I can say I've never payed 4 for it and it has drawn me a handful of cards each game it appears. Especially awesome in my Ukkima & Cazur deck.
City of Traitors is great in an Azusa deck. So firstly this helps play Azusa on turn 2. But then more importantly there are now many Crucible of Worlds effects available with the very nice Conduit of Worlds being added with Phyrexia: All Will Be One. A turn can work like this: 1) Play City. Tap City for 2. 2) Play a land. Sacrifice City. 3) Play City from graveyard. Tap City for 2. City made 4 mana in one turn! What other lands can do that? Cradle, Cabal Coffers - pretty good company. These extra available land plays also synergize with landfall cards. This can get even better with Oracle of Mul Daya out or some other way of getting additional land drops in a turn: 1) Starting with City in play. Tap City for 2. 2) Play a land. Sacrifice City. 3) Play City from graveyard. Tap City for 2. 4) Play a land. Sacrifice City. 5) Play City from graveyard. Tap City for 2. So there's potential for City to perform even better than 4 mana in a turn - here it made 6! I don't play City in any other decks, but if there are enough ways to play lands from the graveyard in a deck then there's potential for City to be good.
I think City of Traitors is fine in Gitrog Monster, where it draws you a card. Also Crafty Cutpurse is a cute, niche gotcha card. Plus I think Crush Contraband is an okay upgrade to Return to Dust.
If your opponent stops making land drops in order to play around Sire of Stagnation I think you're in a really good position. I'd imagine most decks want to play all of their lands, there is always something to work towards with your mana in EDH, even if it's just recasting your commander. Sire of Stagnation + Yarok is also a noteworthy interaction. I have yet to laugh at an opponent who has resolved a sire, my reaction has always been "That thing needs to die, now."
I think something to note about Long-term Plans is its usefulness in self-mill graveyard decks. This is essentially a tutor to your graveyard in those cases, which can be very useful as well
it works awesome in Shorikai polymorph deck. Place card third from the top, draw 2 with Shorikai ability and draw 3rd during you turn normally. Long Term wins me so much...
I have a clone theme deck with Braids, Conjurerer Adept in the commander slot and Mirromade has won me three games (out of only 5 or 6 played). Duplicating your big enchanments/artifacts (like Extravagant Replication) can easily be game winning, and stealing your opponent's win conditions can be surprisingly effective ways to close out the game or get way ahead, because you didn't pay 6 mana for Caged Sun or whatever, just 3. Also, Mirrormade can hit any artifact or enchantment creatures: Solemn Simulacrum, Myr Battlesphere, Meteor Golem, Platinum Angel, any of the Theros Gods, etc. Usually you can find those sitting around at the table too.
City of Traitors doesn't die on ETB of lands. It dies when you play lands. So if you are just ramping it won't be dying. Still oppressive but I think folks were misinterpreting how it works during the rating.
This is a great episode. Something a little cheeky I thought of. Holding a draw three with long term plans after playing approach the second sun. You could have this ready and have a way to grab approach. Not super powerful but I would love to see this interaction 😊
watches a couple of cEDH podcasts where they talk about how powerful final fortune effects are and how people should run them more because it allows you to bypass turn order and win with your combo after people have spent their interaction. watches mtggoldfish, "Final fortune is literally unplayable in any deck aside from maybe Obeka"
I didn't even know guided passage existed, but the card seems pretty sick. I could see someone effectively making this a tutor + draw 2 bad cards in a lot of situations (politicking, spell-focused decks with powerful creatures, creature-based decks with powerful spells and so on), which is pretty good for 3 cmc.
The literal worst case scenario is that you filtered your 3 dead draws out of your deck. That's the floor. The FLOOR is better than Faithless Looting, which does the same but is only 2 cards while be a -1 on card advantage, while guided passage is +2.
I think City of Traitors works in Gitrog/Titania because they turn the downside into draw/a token and is the deck's plan anyway. It's especially good with a Crucible of Worlds. That's about all I can think of.
YAY The Cod Father! Edit: I wrote that literally the second you showed up on my screen, and then Richard said, "Hey guys its me Richard, the Cod Father."
I would love to see more of this as well, mainly because I'm sure there will be cards on the list I"ve never seen before or just want to know how some of my pet cards rate.
Decks that take full advantage of City of Traitors will usually sacrifice it to another card, like Squandered Resources. The Gitrog Monster works quite well with it too, using Crucible of Worlds to bring it back again and again, while drawing a card each time it dies. But outside of specific decks, the card is very much a D.
Richard and Phil absolutely get it. And yeah, politicking with it absolutely works. 1 guarantee a land drop, get a card that can help answer something on the board, and maybe one card that isn't great now.
1:12:34 Seth: calls Forsake the Worldly "a hard D" outside of cycling decks. Crim: Licks lips, (casts Savor the Moment) but shows restraint on the obvious response. Instant classic!
51:11 You could use strict proctor to keep city of traders while playing a staxx deck. You could also use it as a sac on harrow or any of the other similar lands on turn 2
Sad that the card I suggested didn't make it into the video, but this was cool to look at regardless. (P.S. Cultural Exchange is a super trolly card that people should be playing, even if it's expensive.)
People need to respect the fog, I play fogs in all of my decks, red is the only color that can't and People always learn to never count me out until the attacks land.
I agree that Guided Passage is really good. If you cast this on turn T, they gave you the 3 worst cards for turn T, isn't that still good because you can't draw these on subsequent turns where missing an above average draw is actually more impactful ? Also, it seems really fun to play with
I think three mana draw threes are becoming much more common, but they do almost always have a restriction on them. Guided passage also has some upside in multiplayer
Would love to see a "pet cards" tier list or week for commander clash. Also croaking counterpart is my personal favorite pet card and imo is incredibly underrated
I used to play Chance for Glory randomly in my feather deck, and I must say, it was actually pretty good. Actually won a couple games off of it, it enabled me to swing out with everything without having to worry about blocks, then blow people out with the indestructible before swinging in again with all the best combat tricks I used last turn.
S: Mirrormade A: Culling Ritual, Sire of Stagnation B: Forsake the Wordly, Long Term Plans, Destiny Spinner, Guided Passage (should be A but takes too long to resolve) C: Dawn Charm, Open into Wonder, Hullbreach, Final Fortune (only for combo decks, bottom of D if played fairly) D: Aurification, Oakhame Adversary, Snapback, Force of Despair, City of Traitors
They are so off on Oakhame Adversary it's absurd. I get that they have their own inbred meta based off what we've seen with Commander Clash over the years with their decks and suspect threat assessment for entertainment purposes, but this card's ceiling is a 2/3 Deathtouch for 2 that will likely draw you 2-3 cards before it dies. Opponents don't want to spend their precious targeted removal on a threat like this and it'll just end up generating more value than expected. Baleful Strix is a good card, a Baleful Strix that will likely draw you 2-3 cards for that little mana investment is well above rate. I can count the number of times I've played it for 4 mana on my two hands; someone is almost always playing green in a pod. It's not a stone-cold staple, but you should play it any green deck that wants to rumble and isn't just some goodstuff battlecruiser pile. Incremental advantages are how you win against veteran EDH players. Enjoyable content, I've been watching Clash for years, but their meta is so absurdly out of wack with what you'll run into with a established playgroup that these hot take podcasts always have a few wild takes that never make sense to me.
fully agree with Richard on Sire of Stagnation. its always done serious work for me. NO ONE plays around this. nobody intentionally misses a land drop, sorry
I made an incredibly decadent "sealed" commander deck with a box of Double Masters, helmed by Intet. I cast Guided Passage, and killed the last opponent in the game with the lightning bolt they got me.
As someone that has played Guided Passage in my Riku deck for over a decade, this never takes that long to resolve. Most every time this is a tutor for the answer that we need with the bonus of a dork and your next land drop. That takes a couple min at most. Other times, it gets you a basic, a dork, and a ramp spell and again doesn't take long. Riku is mana hungry so that is always a very efficient win. Then in the right setup, it is cracked. If it is late, board has been wipe a few times, last turn I cast Riku, then I top draw Passage. Cast it, copy it with Riku, copy with Resonator/Lithoform. Get the "worst" 9, 12, or 15 cards in my deck. Prob gonna win that game.
On Ghostly Prision vs Aurification: The benefit of ghostly prision is that if you don't have the mana, it prevents you from getting hit period. It requires someone to dedicate mana that they could be instead using to advance their board and makes it less likely that they will have mana for interaction. As a result it doesn't just incentivize, it can also actively harm a player's position if they go fro it. It also works significantly better than aurification when token decks go extremely wide and attempt to kill everyone, they often don't have 20 extra mana lying around unless they had 1k to spare for a cradle.
Long term plans is quite sick. It does indeed feel very smart when you can pull it off. It does kind of require you to cast it ahead of time, but the fact its an instant really helps it too. I run it in Niv-Mizzet Parun cause there's no way to search for his combo pieces besides gamble effects. But I've also used it to put a free counterspell there, which lined up perfectly for when someone tried to remove my Niv in response, triggering him, drawing that Fierce Guardianship I put there, which I could then use to protect him.
What I don't like about Guided Passage: -It can backfire if played whenever. -It will take a looong time for the process to happen. -It reveals the future of the game that you will maybe draw into. What I love about Guided Passage: -The opponent choice and potential politics. -The fact it strikes a balance between card types.
Guided passage is a fun card, just seeing the look on someone’s face when you tell them to pick three different cards out of a massive library. Especially if they’ve never played against it. You see their eyes get wide when they see something busted saying “definitely not that”. Worth it. 2 legit 2 quit. I play it in a five color Jared Carthelion deck so the mana dork, mana rock or ramp spell, and basic or tapped land is welcome to fix my mana. The mana rocks I do have in the deck tap for any color so it’s always a good hit.
I'm glad I learnt about guided passage from this. I'm totally using it for the politics of asking someone "hey I'm down to destroy that problem creature, mind getting my removal for me?"
honestly probably my favorite most underrated card is phyrexian etchings, essentially a budget necropotence that after about 3-4 turns the cumulative upkeep doesnt matter because youre going to be hitting your land drop anyways with all the cards you draw or possibly ramp, its not as obviously busted as necro so it flies under the tables radar
It's nice to finally see Phil and Richard on the same episode.
so we now know theyre not the same person in disguise
Well, they were in clash before
@@Jupue I kinda stopped watching Clash a while ago, so I must've just missed that episode. The episodes are just too long for me. If there is a channel/series with the length of Game Knights and the style/format of commander clash, that'd be perfect, I think.
@@jordangroblewsky2087 the trick is to either watch it at increased speed or just listen to them and occasionally check the vid if a card you dont know pops up.
I love Seth's "regenerate isn't useless, think about Terminate," because Terminate actually has the "can't be regenerated" clause
Nice to see you Richard.
we miss the codfather 😭
For the City of Traitors into Explosive Vegies, you start turn 4 with 5 lands, as the city requires you to play a land, not a land etb.
unless you never play a land again though thats still garbage outside of some wierd green white deck where you you're trying to use both green land ramp and white catch up land ramp and need to keep destroying your own lands.
Gotta love editor Tomer popping in to give his opinion at 34:41
Surprised no one mentioned blink decks. It wrecks Brago and the like.
Also at 1:19:43
Yeah I’m so glad they had my back on this one 😎
The card Phil was thinking of with "City of Traitors" is "Blood Sun" from Rivals of Ixalan
49:11
One of my pets cards, love it so much. You haven’t lived until you played a Lotus field with blood sun in play
Yup 100%
Tomer having Crims back on Force of Despair is nice to see
god it is so nice to have richard back. i didnt realize mow much i'd miss him until he was gone
Every time Tomer cuts in with an edit are so good, I love that we're stanning all these niche cards.
City of Traitors seems pretty good in lands decks. Some Azusa style effects with Crucible of Worlds can ramp you pretty hard out of nowhere. Drop City, next turn tap it for mana, play a land, play City again, tap it again, and repeat the process as many times as you can. It seems really good in that context.
OG Titania will also give you a 5/3 every time this gets sacrificed.
Im so glad (and surprised!) that y’all chose to talk about mirrormade. I agree with crim, the base is a man’s rock and the ceiling is infinite. One time I actually did copy an opponents omniscience (like Richard mentioned) and won off of it! I’ve also used it to copy just value artifacts and enchantments I have on the board just to double up. I’ve never found it to be a dead card and really enjoy it. Than you all for talking about it!
Whoever it was that put out an Omniscience and didn't win with it really needs to revise their deckbuilding lmao
I played Mirrormade the other day as a copy of someone's smothering tilthe and it won me the game of the mana it made me
Missing land drops for sire is NOT the same as not paying for rhystic study Seth. Rhystic study is one mana per turn.
Skipping land drops escalates exponentially. On the first turn, you're down 1 mana, second turn you skip another land drop that's now 3 mana. Then 6 mana.
Yeah there's no way you stop making your land drops so your oponent does not draw 2. Even in turn 10, I always procure to make every single land drop I can.
Surprised they didn't think of Hinata when discussing Open into Wonder, it's absolutely busted in the Hinata go wide build (and in general nowadays, whenever I see "X target", I instantly think of Hinata!)
Magus Lucea Kane too! Copying it doubles those draw triggers.
Another x spell commander likes it too, Zaxara. All those big dumb hydras you made? Send them in unblockable and draw some cards for it too. Can be used to finish with big bodies or draw cards when needed.
So a friend in my pod is the friendly neighborhood eldrazi player and Sire of Stagnation is an absolute house against the entire table. Sire is basically playing two rhystic studies. If they wanna miss land drops, it’s a win, if they play their lands, it’s an absolute home run and it is absolutely bruuuuuutal.
I hate this card, but I gotta respect how good it is 😂
Culling ritual is INSANELY underrated. Are people not playing against treasures still?? Sol Rings are still a swingy effect that need to be answered. So many low mana threats nowadays too.
But treasures is one of the most ubiquitous threats to the format lately.
but your opponents sac in response
@@surfinggarchomp2820 Then they don't get to use those treasures on their turn!
Every game someone has played Culling Ritual against me they have won the game usually on the same turn. Super underrated card.
Really any token deck at all, treasure are the worst offender
Guided passage is incredible. It's almost never the three worst cards in your deck, but it's almost always a way to solve the table's problems which makes people happy with you. You could also get a favor before even casting this card. Sometimes people mess up and give you things they thought would be bad, but are actually great. At the end of the day it's also deck thinning to get non-relevant cards out.
Oakhame Adversary sees some play in cEDH, where most people don't have a ample supply of blockers and lots of green manadorks hit the field on T1, think thats why it was suggested. For regular EDH i agree with the C/D rating. Not enough guaranteed impact for the cost.
I think they misrated it pretty badly. even in casual, deathtouch on a 2/3 body is a very strong disincentive to stopping your 2 mana draw engine - besides the obvious of a 2/3 body being relevant just for stats.
I love guided passage in my krak/kydele deck, it's mostly just a fun meme deck but I love the reaction of people at a table when I ask them to go through my deck to pick things out, most creatures in that deck are quite good and krark also allows me to copy it. Just fun to see them read through the cards in my deck and stumble upon goblin game
I'm also a Guided Passage enjoyer. I play it in a Pako and Haldan pile of bulk rares. I've cast Passage like seven times now, and never have I gotten the same cards.
This is actually one if the few tutors i might play if i ever build a deck in these colors
Open into Wonder is amazing in many decks
Orvar, the All-Form - your creatures draw cards + you get a copy of one you target
Zaxara - make your big hydras unblockable and get a new Hydra from Zaxara
Kediss, Emberclaw Familiar + any blue partner - your commanders deal damage + even more with Kediss
Volo Guide to monsters - You will have a ton of mid-large tokens here, make them unblockable
Captain N'ghathrod- Horrors will mill your opponents and you get value at the same time
Hinata- X spells that target, basically cost 0 with Hinata.
Magus Lucea Kane- copy the X spell make more creatures unblockabale
Miirym, Sentinel Wyrm - Your Dragons hit big and draw cards
Queza Augur of Agony- Draw a bunch of cards, deal a lot of combat+ noncombat damage.
Be'lakor, the Dark Master - Your Big demons draw cards
Octavia, Living Thesis - make your 8/8 creatures unblockable
Koma - make your serpents unblockable
Kinnan - make your big monsters unblockable
As someone who used to spam Holy Day, I actually forget that fog is green.
Precise Moment: Choose target spell you control that is currently on the stack. Counter that spell. Create a copy of that spell(move to the top of the stack), you may choose new targets. The copy gains split second(as long as this spell is on the stack, players can't cast other spells or activate abilities that aren't mana abilities.)
City of Traitors is great in Simic landfall decks. Especially Tatayova. It sacrificing itself is actually a really solid upside. Being able to make it your your land drop repeatedly from the yard draws you cards.
Respect to the Cod-father, the best member of the podcast
I will say in my meta most of the green players build their decks with Mana dorks into three Mana ramp. Which makes oakhame adversary really good. Pretty regularly draw me anywhere from 2-5 cards a game, which is obviously great.
The Guided Passage discussion is so perfect. Seth and Crim are like “cards can be situational, having someone else tutor up 3 cards for you means you get the worst cards for that particular board state!”
Richard is saying “all my cards are equally bad!”
And Phil, of course, is going “well, if I only have one noncreature spell, this tutors it every time! Combo!”
Ok but, even if I get the 3 worst cards in my deck for this specific scenario, they're still going to be helpful, just to a lesser extent than the best cards. Just don't put cards in your deck that do absolutely nothing and you just played a 3 mana draw 3. The only time you should be getting a dead draw is if you're already at 15 mana and draw yet another basic land. Otherwise, you built your deck wrong.
Crim is right. Open Into Wonder is a great card in the evasive blue decks. I use it in Becket Brass, and it's fantastic. Alot of those creatures are not as evasive as you'd think, but connecting is key to those decks. Basically look at the card as saying, "x creatures are unblockable, draw x cards, AND trigger all your tribal payoffs." The same is true for ninjas. They are only evasive the turn they come out, then they're just sitting there.
Thank god, Richard returns!!! He's a mad genius and I'm playing guided passage now in every deck that can fit it!
Ngl I’d love to see an episode like this every other month
I play Oakhame Adversary in a couple of my decks and I can say I've never payed 4 for it and it has drawn me a handful of cards each game it appears. Especially awesome in my Ukkima & Cazur deck.
City of Traitors is great in an Azusa deck. So firstly this helps play Azusa on turn 2. But then more importantly there are now many Crucible of Worlds effects available with the very nice Conduit of Worlds being added with Phyrexia: All Will Be One.
A turn can work like this:
1) Play City. Tap City for 2.
2) Play a land. Sacrifice City.
3) Play City from graveyard. Tap City for 2.
City made 4 mana in one turn! What other lands can do that? Cradle, Cabal Coffers - pretty good company. These extra available land plays also synergize with landfall cards.
This can get even better with Oracle of Mul Daya out or some other way of getting additional land drops in a turn:
1) Starting with City in play. Tap City for 2.
2) Play a land. Sacrifice City.
3) Play City from graveyard. Tap City for 2.
4) Play a land. Sacrifice City.
5) Play City from graveyard. Tap City for 2.
So there's potential for City to perform even better than 4 mana in a turn - here it made 6!
I don't play City in any other decks, but if there are enough ways to play lands from the graveyard in a deck then there's potential for City to be good.
I think City of Traitors is fine in Gitrog Monster, where it draws you a card. Also Crafty Cutpurse is a cute, niche gotcha card. Plus I think Crush Contraband is an okay upgrade to Return to Dust.
The audio quality is much better on this episode than other recent ones. Keep it up! I love a good community card grilling
If your opponent stops making land drops in order to play around Sire of Stagnation I think you're in a really good position. I'd imagine most decks want to play all of their lands, there is always something to work towards with your mana in EDH, even if it's just recasting your commander. Sire of Stagnation + Yarok is also a noteworthy interaction. I have yet to laugh at an opponent who has resolved a sire, my reaction has always been "That thing needs to die, now."
I run Sire in my Lazav Dimir Mastermind deck and people absolutely hate it when it enters the battlefield
City of traitors only sacs when you play. If an an effect would put a land onto the battlefield it gets to stay
Glad Richard changed his stance on Guided Passage, I remember him being super down when Tomer casted it during a Commander Clash
What episode is this? I honestly think this card is S+ tier. Should be played in the next CC
@@Arcadious10 Season 10, Episode 7!
@@WendigoNet maaaa man. U the real one! Thank u
I think something to note about Long-term Plans is its usefulness in self-mill graveyard decks. This is essentially a tutor to your graveyard in those cases, which can be very useful as well
it works awesome in Shorikai polymorph deck. Place card third from the top, draw 2 with Shorikai ability and draw 3rd during you turn normally. Long Term wins me so much...
Man oakhame consistently eats my lunch in cEDH
Open Into Wonder seems like an auto-include in Hinata, Dawn-Crowned.
As a Hinata player, can confirm this is true!
man I wish I had seen the post for this.
alhammerrets archive and teferis ageless insight are something id love Seth's opion on
I like that with “Long-Term Plans” you don’t have to reveal the card. Makes it nice not having to divulge information.
I have a clone theme deck with Braids, Conjurerer Adept in the commander slot and Mirromade has won me three games (out of only 5 or 6 played). Duplicating your big enchanments/artifacts (like Extravagant Replication) can easily be game winning, and stealing your opponent's win conditions can be surprisingly effective ways to close out the game or get way ahead, because you didn't pay 6 mana for Caged Sun or whatever, just 3. Also, Mirrormade can hit any artifact or enchantment creatures: Solemn Simulacrum, Myr Battlesphere, Meteor Golem, Platinum Angel, any of the Theros Gods, etc. Usually you can find those sitting around at the table too.
This podcast and topic was just....great!!! Please more of those "under-the-radar" gems!!!
City of Traitors doesn't die on ETB of lands. It dies when you play lands. So if you are just ramping it won't be dying. Still oppressive but I think folks were misinterpreting how it works during the rating.
This is a great episode. Something a little cheeky I thought of. Holding a draw three with long term plans after playing approach the second sun. You could have this ready and have a way to grab approach. Not super powerful but I would love to see this interaction 😊
Or in a deck that wants to cast off the top of its library, gives you a shuffle and a near-guaranteed combo piece or something. Seems decent in budget
I actually cut mirrormaid out of my enchantment deck. I wanted cheaper enchantments and too many games it either sat in my hand or I had bad targets.
Thanks to Crim and Tomer for acknowledging Force of Despair is a A. I LOVE it in my Braids Deck. Huge blow out when used with wisdom.
Just for the record, I believe the most commonly played spell that targets an opponent is, according to EDHREC, Jeska's Will.
watches a couple of cEDH podcasts where they talk about how powerful final fortune effects are and how people should run them more because it allows you to bypass turn order and win with your combo after people have spent their interaction. watches mtggoldfish, "Final fortune is literally unplayable in any deck aside from maybe Obeka"
I didn't even know guided passage existed, but the card seems pretty sick. I could see someone effectively making this a tutor + draw 2 bad cards in a lot of situations (politicking, spell-focused decks with powerful creatures, creature-based decks with powerful spells and so on), which is pretty good for 3 cmc.
The literal worst case scenario is that you filtered your 3 dead draws out of your deck. That's the floor. The FLOOR is better than Faithless Looting, which does the same but is only 2 cards while be a -1 on card advantage, while guided passage is +2.
Great idea for an episode! Very entertaining.
Would love to see this kind of video more often! I find the rating of community submitted cards really interesting. Gj guys with this episode ;)
I love that their only A tier card is Dawn Charm. I can’t say I’ve ever seen this card played (except when I tried it).
I think City of Traitors works in Gitrog/Titania because they turn the downside into draw/a token and is the deck's plan anyway. It's especially good with a Crucible of Worlds. That's about all I can think of.
Omg. Tomer takes 10 minutes for the intro.
Richard kills it in 20 seconds.
Thank you!!!!!
YAY The Cod Father!
Edit: I wrote that literally the second you showed up on my screen, and then Richard said, "Hey guys its me Richard, the Cod Father."
Snapback is sick in my mutate deck. Definitely situational, but in certain decks it is great.
Mirrormade is sweet. You should read it as a Smothering Tithe, Rhystic Study, Sylvan Library, etc. Plus you can blink it to choose the new best thing.
I would love to see more of this as well, mainly because I'm sure there will be cards on the list I"ve never seen before or just want to know how some of my pet cards rate.
Love guided passage, didn't know this card existed too
Open into Wonder would be good with all those mites from All will be One
Decks that take full advantage of City of Traitors will usually sacrifice it to another card, like Squandered Resources. The Gitrog Monster works quite well with it too, using Crucible of Worlds to bring it back again and again, while drawing a card each time it dies. But outside of specific decks, the card is very much a D.
Richard and Phil absolutely get it. And yeah, politicking with it absolutely works. 1 guarantee a land drop, get a card that can help answer something on the board, and maybe one card that isn't great now.
1:12:34
Seth: calls Forsake the Worldly "a hard D" outside of cycling decks.
Crim: Licks lips, (casts Savor the Moment) but shows restraint on the obvious response.
Instant classic!
51:11
You could use strict proctor to keep city of traders while playing a staxx deck.
You could also use it as a sac on harrow or any of the other similar lands on turn 2
Sad that the card I suggested didn't make it into the video, but this was cool to look at regardless.
(P.S. Cultural Exchange is a super trolly card that people should be playing, even if it's expensive.)
This episode was everything I had hoped it would be.
I love Phil's take on dawn charm. "I don't play it but I respect it."
People need to respect the fog, I play fogs in all of my decks, red is the only color that can't and People always learn to never count me out until the attacks land.
I agree that Guided Passage is really good. If you cast this on turn T, they gave you the 3 worst cards for turn T, isn't that still good because you can't draw these on subsequent turns where missing an above average draw is actually more impactful ? Also, it seems really fun to play with
I think three mana draw threes are becoming much more common, but they do almost always have a restriction on them. Guided passage also has some upside in multiplayer
It's really fun to play! And most of the time the two players not choosing cards will decline to search your deck.
Compare guided passage to cultivate. You don't get the ramp, but you get a land to hand and 2 other cards. Always loved guided passage.
glad to see the codfather is back ! hope is garage cleaning is going well !!
Would love to see a "pet cards" tier list or week for commander clash. Also croaking counterpart is my personal favorite pet card and imo is incredibly underrated
Richard’s “Finnegan’s Wake” style deck idea is absolutely brilliant
I would love to see another episode like this! I think the concept is great.
I used to play Chance for Glory randomly in my feather deck, and I must say, it was actually pretty good. Actually won a couple games off of it, it enabled me to swing out with everything without having to worry about blocks, then blow people out with the indestructible before swinging in again with all the best combat tricks I used last turn.
this is great episode : D always wanted to see a review of viewer jank
This was the perfect episode to bring Richard in for lol
This was great I'd love to see this be a recurring type of episode.
S: Mirrormade
A: Culling Ritual, Sire of Stagnation
B: Forsake the Wordly, Long Term Plans, Destiny Spinner, Guided Passage (should be A but takes too long to resolve)
C: Dawn Charm, Open into Wonder, Hullbreach, Final Fortune (only for combo decks, bottom of D if played fairly)
D: Aurification, Oakhame Adversary, Snapback, Force of Despair, City of Traitors
They are so off on Oakhame Adversary it's absurd. I get that they have their own inbred meta based off what we've seen with Commander Clash over the years with their decks and suspect threat assessment for entertainment purposes, but this card's ceiling is a 2/3 Deathtouch for 2 that will likely draw you 2-3 cards before it dies. Opponents don't want to spend their precious targeted removal on a threat like this and it'll just end up generating more value than expected. Baleful Strix is a good card, a Baleful Strix that will likely draw you 2-3 cards for that little mana investment is well above rate. I can count the number of times I've played it for 4 mana on my two hands; someone is almost always playing green in a pod. It's not a stone-cold staple, but you should play it any green deck that wants to rumble and isn't just some goodstuff battlecruiser pile. Incremental advantages are how you win against veteran EDH players.
Enjoyable content, I've been watching Clash for years, but their meta is so absurdly out of wack with what you'll run into with a established playgroup that these hot take podcasts always have a few wild takes that never make sense to me.
fully agree with Richard on Sire of Stagnation. its always done serious work for me. NO ONE plays around this. nobody intentionally misses a land drop, sorry
I made an incredibly decadent "sealed" commander deck with a box of Double Masters, helmed by Intet. I cast Guided Passage, and killed the last opponent in the game with the lightning bolt they got me.
Long term plans: timewalk yourself. The whole podcast: generally good, B!
As someone that has played Guided Passage in my Riku deck for over a decade, this never takes that long to resolve. Most every time this is a tutor for the answer that we need with the bonus of a dork and your next land drop. That takes a couple min at most.
Other times, it gets you a basic, a dork, and a ramp spell and again doesn't take long. Riku is mana hungry so that is always a very efficient win.
Then in the right setup, it is cracked. If it is late, board has been wipe a few times, last turn I cast Riku, then I top draw Passage. Cast it, copy it with Riku, copy with Resonator/Lithoform. Get the "worst" 9, 12, or 15 cards in my deck. Prob gonna win that game.
On Ghostly Prision vs Aurification: The benefit of ghostly prision is that if you don't have the mana, it prevents you from getting hit period. It requires someone to dedicate mana that they could be instead using to advance their board and makes it less likely that they will have mana for interaction. As a result it doesn't just incentivize, it can also actively harm a player's position if they go fro it. It also works significantly better than aurification when token decks go extremely wide and attempt to kill everyone, they often don't have 20 extra mana lying around unless they had 1k to spare for a cradle.
great and fun episode! i love force of despair, mostly because i love making enemies ❤
Id say the best card I play that has cycling and I often cycle is Nimble obstructionist. Massively underrated card.
Oakhame Adversary is a cEDH semi-staple
Guided passage is 10/10 just for the uniqueness and troll factor alone
Long term plans is quite sick. It does indeed feel very smart when you can pull it off. It does kind of require you to cast it ahead of time, but the fact its an instant really helps it too. I run it in Niv-Mizzet Parun cause there's no way to search for his combo pieces besides gamble effects.
But I've also used it to put a free counterspell there, which lined up perfectly for when someone tried to remove my Niv in response, triggering him, drawing that Fierce Guardianship I put there, which I could then use to protect him.
city of traitors is good in land decks especially crucible builds
The crew wondering where you would play Open into Wonder... It was included in the Zendikar Rogues precon!
Good to see The Codfather again!
Open into Wonder in Magnus the Red. Each token pays for it's own evasion and draws you a card
You gotta let us do a shark tank episode where viewers pitch cards and you rate the pitches
What I don't like about Guided Passage:
-It can backfire if played whenever.
-It will take a looong time for the process to happen.
-It reveals the future of the game that you will maybe draw into.
What I love about Guided Passage:
-The opponent choice and potential politics.
-The fact it strikes a balance between card types.
Guided passage is a fun card, just seeing the look on someone’s face when you tell them to pick three different cards out of a massive library. Especially if they’ve never played against it. You see their eyes get wide when they see something busted saying “definitely not that”. Worth it. 2 legit 2 quit.
I play it in a five color Jared Carthelion deck so the mana dork, mana rock or ramp spell, and basic or tapped land is welcome to fix my mana.
The mana rocks I do have in the deck tap for any color so it’s always a good hit.
I love this idea! Please make this recurring!
I'm glad I learnt about guided passage from this. I'm totally using it for the politics of asking someone "hey I'm down to destroy that problem creature, mind getting my removal for me?"
honestly probably my favorite most underrated card is phyrexian etchings, essentially a budget necropotence that after about 3-4 turns the cumulative upkeep doesnt matter because youre going to be hitting your land drop anyways with all the cards you draw or possibly ramp, its not as obviously busted as necro so it flies under the tables radar
Long term plans is a diabolic tutor that burns a card.