Tragic Backstory: Developing a Villain
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- čas přidán 10. 09. 2024
- The Tragic Backstory is a very popular way for writers to develop a villain in their stories. It can be great way do to so but not always. In this video I talk about the ways it should be used effectively to the benefit of that character. While including examples of the best and worst uses of this trope. Hope you enjoy the video! Please don't forget to like and subscribe if you did :)
Follow me on Twitter: / tahkawa
Movies and Tv Shows talked about:
Toy Story 3
Black Panther
101 Dalmatians
The Silence of the Lambs
Hannibal Rising
The Dark Knight
Psycho
Saw II
Game of Thrones
Les Miserables
Schindler's List
Sources:
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tvtropes.org/p...
www.indiewire....
/ why_do_people_dislike_...
screenrant.com...
en.wikipedia.o...)
MUSIC:
Divider by Chris Zabriskie is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution licence (creativecommon...)
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Artist: chriszabriskie....
Disco Sting by Kevin MacLeod is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution licence (creativecommon...)
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Artist: incompetech.com/
The “both of my parents failed to show up” Doofenschmirtz scene is comedic genius
Yea. I think the backstory is based off of movie logic that every villain was extremely abused. They made it silly tho....
He was abducted from his real family.
@@krishellenberg5715 The Second Dimension had fun with this by having the eviller Doof-2's backstory be not getting a train and Doof-1 being utterly flummoxed by how dumb that was
"If I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice!"
- Joker, in "The Killing Joke".
bet his orgin is Everything and more
I remember really enjoying Kilgrave's backstory in Marvel's Jessica Jones, because the other characters tell him that having a bad childhood is not an excuse for being evil. And that whole backstory doesn't make him likeable/sympathetic to the audience ; on the contrary, it reenforced the idea of Kilgrave being a terrible obsessive maniac
Kilgrave is one of the most terrifying villains of all time.
It was even better because throughout the season we end up hearing conflicting perspectives on why his childhood sucked both from him and his parents, and it helps paint this picture of a man that has no real understanding of himself and doesn't actually know what he wants, which is perfectly in line with his actions across the season.
Kilgrave was very well written and wonderfully portrayed by the amazing David Tenant. It's true what they say about your movie/show is only as good as your villian.
@@brainrich1358from what the movie/game you are talking about here ?
Tbh
"cool motive, still murder"
Nine nine!
Judit Csenge Vizi cool cool cool cool no doubt no doubt no doubt
And then there are people like Maurice Bavaud. If his 1938 murder plot had been successful, he would have gone down in history as the lunatic who murdered a very popular political figure whom he referred to as an 'incarnation of satan'. He would have still been executed without much fanfare. No one, including himself, would ever know that he was actually a hero who prevented one of the bloodiest wars ever and the genocide of millions of Jews.
What if it was self defense?
Nice, a Brooklyn-99 reference!
"Yes, I'm sorry, Mister Hitler, but I believe art school is not for you."
"But... what else am I to do?"
If you think about it, he still stuff with polish and colours...
@@lordodysseus oh my fucking god XD
And know ... EUROPE SHALL KNOW PAIN.
Yeah, that obviously isn't his whole backstory. You know he also did fight in WWI, where he lost a testicle to a gunshot wound. And also he was highly psychotic in many ways, some of which can be explained by his upbringing and the toxic culture he grew up in.
@@jimihenrik11 Jokes buddy
Koba from the planet of the Apes reboot is my personal favorite movie villain because his actions make complete sense from his perspective while not being justifiable
Was Killua's backstory tragic?
@@dontyoufuckinguwume8201 of course but he's the hero we deserve
@churrokat Meruem is just the icon I go by Mr.Idealist
Also he died for our sins T T
mine is kylo ren and darth vader
Christ, the tone is so serious and then you slap a #ThanosDidNothingWrong with that music, it caught me so off guard my brain just shut down for a second there
I think that the truly great "villians" are those who would still be deranged, or creepy/threatening even with their backstory revealed, or even while given a moral arc or even while being shown with good intentions.
Agree
If not too hard, could you provide me three examples to study? I'm writing a book and I'd like to see what would constitute such a villain
Gregory Efs I personally think Grindelwald is a great villain. He’s one of the only characters I can’t choose whether I support or not. His motive is very clear, and it’s not something the author created in 5 minutes. It’s easy to see why the characters and other villains in the book support him, he’s a well made villain and has actual character behind him.
@@gregoryefs9898 maleficent. Not the Angelina Jolie version but the original.
@@gregoryefs9898 Azula from Avatar the Last Airbender cartoon.
Other tropes I’d love to see you cover:
- The twist villain (this has been very prominent but an annoying trope in modern Disney films during the 2010s and it seems like they have traded the traditional villains for the twist ones now...Pixar has been known for doing twist villains since Toy Story 2 and generally does them better than Disney does, but I wonder why this is a thing these days)
- The fakeout death
- The misunderstanding
Twist villains also worked on Spy Kids franchise where the villain's assistant revealed to be the REAL threat and somehow shunned away the main villain.
Schaffrillas Productions did a very spot on analysis going over which Disney/Pixar villains did the twist villain shtick better and which ones failed at it.
While restricted to Disney/Pixar movies, it’s still a credible analysis.
Otherwise, I am with you on more people highlighting the frustrating failures or phenomenal executions of various tropes.
Schaffrillas Productions already covered Disney Twist Villains. He covered it so thoroughly, there really isn't much to add.
Turbo was well foreshadowed but Hans, Bellweather and Callaghan were not.
@JB Yeah wreck it Raplh made it work. And the reason why it's simple. It's not his role as the villain that is the twist. The twist is his identity. So we already see him develop as a villain in the story and then we get the reason why he's the villain
Something I thought was interesting that Cruella De Vil is that she doesn’t have a tragic backstory and she isn’t evil for evils sake. She’s just a massive hedonist who will stop at nothing to satisfy herself. She doesn’t care how much pain she causes Anita and Roger as well as the puppies; she wants what she wants everyone and everything else be damned.
posted 2 years before the cruella movie haha
@@whathow3109 Or as it might as well be called Disney's Birds of Prey.
An important aspect is also how the villain breaks when the tragic catalyst occurs. In Lotso's case, Lotso is already prone to selfishness and egotism. When he breaks, he projects his pain onto others, despite the fact that his friend immediately recognizes that "she only replaced you"; both he and Big Baby pause before they react--they aren't sure what to make of the scene--while Lotso jumps to a conclusion that is all about him, and demands that his friends recognize it that way, and with the implied threat of violence in his repetition of "She replaced us!" in a louder voice. Lotso was a personality already fragile and selfish (his egomania and cruelty may be a result of this too) but we never saw how much so until after this moment.
Theomite he also roughly grabbed Big Baby as he tried to reach for the window.
If only he'd realized that the reason he was replaced so quickly, and mostly just him, was because he was loved too much and Daisy couldn't be consoled at the loss of her beloved teddy bear, so she was given another one, quickly, most likely to hush her up and make her happy again. If she's anything like my children, even though I got them a second of their favorite toy so if something happened we'd be okay, they knew which was the one they loved first and which was the replacement, and though both received love, when the original was returned from the wash or lost and found or whatever, they were ecstatic at their beloved toy being returned, even while the replacement was sitting in bed next to them.
Yeah, I loved that. I made a comment about the "warped tragic backstory" as well which is a twist or rejection of the "used to be a sweet kid" sympathy angle for the villain sometimes. The backstory can show that even with tragedy, they were still selfish, entitled, delusional, or toxic people. The "tragedy" only made it worse.
Like Syndrome. He CLAIMED that Mr. Incredible completely rejected him when he only wanted to help him as a sidekick, but we see in his embellishment, that he excluded everything else going on in that scene. He was being an obsessive fanboy and he had a BOMB planted on his cape by the villain. Mr. Incredible actually saved him and only wanted to keep him out of trouble.
It's telling that Syndrome leaves this out. Mr. Incredible even apologizes for his behavior but Syndrome rejects it.
So far, your channel's quality seems to be on point.
This and Overly Sarcastic Productions is where I'm going for writing advice in the future...
Yeah, I'm just worried all that film footage is gonna bite him in the butt eventually...
_It all started on the day of my actual birth. Both of my parents failed to show up._
I hate Phineas and Ferb, but there are times where I respect it.
Lol it's mostly mediocre, but Doof is a brilliantly written character. I watched it just for him.
Poor Doof. All he wants is to be loved. I’m so glad things get better for him.
I can't even laugh coz in todays age of science and technology and all the surrogate and ivf births it's very much possible.
I adored the show so much as a kid. But I have no longer watched the show unless if I have to. Doof is a character that everyone related to. Because he maybe just a cliche villain with simple goals but there's more than that.
Why do you hate Phineas and Ferb, I remember it as a really fun show. I wouldn't want to watch it today, but that's because it is a children's show.
There's a nice "twist" on the tragic backstory: It's the twist that shows that the evil was already in them. The "tragedy" only pushed them further in their bad behavior.
This kinda happens to Gaston in Beauty and the Beast. He started off as a jerk. Not a villain. Not a killer. Not a psychopath. But his egocentric, entitled behavior made him escalate his actions where he was doing some truly despicable things.
Great video! I'd love to see you take on the gay best friend trope. Specifically gay men who exist solely to either deliver a few one liners for the female protagonist or give her a makeover then disappear and have no bearing on the plot nor have any character development beyond this sole utility to it.
I think this could also apply to a few other characters that aren't necessarily gay. Katniss's dresser from the Hunger Games was a minor character given just enough flesh to be likable before disappearing for the rest of the movie. In contrast, her sponsor (forget her name too, it's been too long) fills a similar niche, but her relationship with Katniss is built up in a such a way that she eventually becomes emotionally invested in Katniss's well being and helps her develop more than simple improving mannerisms and practicing etiquette.
Scott pilgrim style
Or every "black friend" character ever who's just there to make you laugh and say stereotypically black things.
I agree with you on the fact that we should deconstruct this trope, it's stupid but you can't make every character in a story have a really compelling character arc because otherwise the story would get really complex really quickly and unless done perfectly will no doubt end confusing and bloated. Some characters exist just to charm and affect the story and characters in minor ways, such as giving them a makeover like you said, or helping them out a little bit. You can't expect every character to be complex. That being said, yeah, doing this using preexisting tropes is just kinda stupid. If you're gonna do this, you don't have to make them gay or black or whatever other trope you can use to tokenize and crowbar a character into the story.
We'll get there.
i think you could do a generalized video on "token" characters and side videos for said token characters (black, gay or any other ones that come to mind).
The backstory doesn't always have to tragic. I like to see villains develop from being too pampered like Geoffrey on GoT.
Speaking of Got, why did he call it deep love? Cersei has more of a narcissic obsession of herself and Joffrey, and does not care much about the others. You can still feel bad for her, but she isn't sympathic.
"He abandonned me"
-Cersei about Tommen's suicide.
Absolutely loving your channel. Definitely agree that just including "tragic story boo hoo" to a villain doesn't make them relatable, and that the severity of the wrongs against them should line uup with the severity of the wrongs they cause. I liked that you included Thanos. In my opinion, he is both the villain, and the protagonist of Infity War, while the rest are the heroes and antagonist. Other great examples of villian/protagonist are in Nightcrawler, the Netflix show You, Breaking Bad. Just because they are the main characters in their story, doesn't mean they aren't the evil one, which makes sense for a 3D villian, they don't believe they are wrong.
Yeah. Walter White kept justifying his criminal actions as "doing it for his family" when really he liked the respect he was getting for his skills, which led to his prideful manner and led to his fall.
Tragic backstory or no explanation. Both are tools and can work when used well.
R.B. Agreed
Tools?? This is called life my friend!
Exactly a tragic back story can be used well for a villain as long as it's done right as explains it but not excuses not excuses it because nothing excuses it it's an explanation but it never excuses it
I subcribed after your adaptational attractiveness video since from that I knew it would be in-depth quality analysis that seems to be missing from the top channels now adays. Keep up the great work
thank you :)
Exactly the same for me
Ironically, the Devil himself does have a tragic backstory. In some versions of the myth at least.
There is one interesting novel where Lucifer is described as a hero with a tragic backstory. Of course, this is because he is the one telling this version and it is clearly a justification. The devil does not want to be the villain in his own story.
This is probably why some people view Milton's Lucifer in Paradise Lost is sort of the hero instead of the villain
@@kaypat23 He's an anti-hero in Paradise Lost. He's the protagonist, but accomplishes his goals (or attempts to) with morally questionable or even reprehensible techniques (like raping Death's daughter for eons until she bore his child Sin so they could all cross back into the Garden of Eden from Hell). That's not to say he isn't justified in his feelings. He was God's first son, yet God gives dominion over all of Earth to the fragile and inferior mankind instead, so Satan rebels to earn his birthright as it was. This would've actually been a perfectly sensible opinion to hold in ancient days, as the eldest sons were always the first in line to inherit their father's property, so slaying your own father if he had other ideas would probably not be an awful thing to do in the eyes of the law.
Of course, none of this excuses everything Satan did to try and reclaim what he believed his, but it's a good way to understand how the story ties into the culture and family structure of the ancient past.
Now that you mention it he does. I never gave it a 2nd thought.
@soulryder585 He's kinda awesome in the Quran. God is a giant tyrannical asshole that creates demons and most humans just as fuel for Hell. The Devil is not the architect of evil - that's God. Instead he's the first one to disobey God. The book insists that the Devil is evil, but that seems totally at odds with his actual actions, which seem more like a dude who's tired of God's bullshit and stops putting up with it.
3 videos
24k subscriber
When you're destined to be great
I only saw 2 videos, and after some time it seems the first one is blocked in my country and CZcams won't even show its existence. Found it on a mirror though.
A great example of quality over quantity. With a bit of luck from CZcams's algorithms.
It's still a rare sight though, because CZcams rewards the opposite.
The first video mentions there is a previous video on 100 days of summer, but I also only see 3. I wonder how many there really are?
Now 35k subs. How did he do it? What’s his secret?
54 k now
I always love the scenes where the villain has that one chance to redeem themselves with full knowledge of knowing things will go better if they do so and ultimately turn it down so you know they're the true villain.
It also effectively shows that they aren't a victim of circumstance; they became the way they are by their own choice.
Exactly what happened to Woody.EXE; he was abandoned but accept me as his new owner. I didn’t expect Woody.EXE to redeem himself for that and made friends with my 2009 Woody. Woody.EXE later saves me, my 2009 Woody, my sister and Mummy from Jessie’s reign of terror
This is crazy, I just got you in my recommended feed today, and subbed hoping for more even with only 2 vids, and then this gets released a few hours after I sub. Nice!
Saw him in my recommended today as well, Literally subbed a couple minutes into his adaptational attractiveness video. Awesome how he got so many views on his last videos, but he deserves it
Same here! I look forward to the next upload already, I need more haha~
same ahah
I only just found you a couple of hours ago too and I was upset u only had one video. But then this one popped up. Really enjoyed your last video and this one. Turned my notifications on for the next one.
thank you!
SAME just subscribed!
SAME yesterday I discovered this channel and was ready to binge watch some good shit but NOPE. Can't wait for more!!!!
he has 3
The part in Toy Story 3 in which the villain _doesn't_ have a change of heart totally took me by surprise. It's such a common trope in children's movies, and them not adhering to it made for a really good story - and especially, a good villain.
This channels is up there with cinemassacare, lessons from screen play and super eye patch wolf. Good work man
"Making scenes about Cruella's past would be a waste of screentime..."
Dinsey: NAH!
I agree with all of this. In some cases a tragic backstory and a scene of two of kindness can work for villains, but for villains who are meant to be a force of evil and/or mysterious and twisted, a tragic backstory or kind moment(s) being applied to them only downplay what made them so horrifying to begin with. Sometimes, like with Hannibal Lecter, it's best to just leave them alone.
I think it can work if there is a balance. I find GRR Martin a great example of constructing morally gray characters, some more conflicted than others, while a minority of more villainous ones are irredeemably evil. In this Epic fantasy series I am writing, there are a couple sympathetic villains, but there is one particular villain in the story I consider to be a living embodiment of supreme evil.
My brother and I were just discussing this very topic a few days ago. I loved the examples you used to highlight the different ways to use 'tragic backstory' with villains.
i agree that a villain doesn't need to have a tragic backstory to seem like a better character, i love when villains are shrouded in mystery. nowadays it seems that everyone is obsessed with redemption arcs, which are fine on their own, but i've noticed that there are plenty of people who want redemption arcs for characters who really don't deserve them.
i also enjoy sympathetic villains as well! villains in general are very interesting to talk about.
honestly i love channels that talk about tropes, and i'm excited to see this one get more popular!
I’d love to see you talk about either the ‘Liar Revealed’ archetype or Love Triangles! Your stuff is great btw
woah I was just thinking of making one on Love Triangles because of Valentines day so maybe :)
Yeah, I DESPISE that trope.
"Oh hey, I lied or didn't reveal something to everyone. This is the first time this has happened, and now, everyone hates me and wants nothing to do with me. They don't want to know why or what extenuating circumstances kept me from telling the truth, but they just hate me now."
Funny how he was talking about Cruella De Vile not needing a backstory because she's evil and now a movie exists about her backstory
Omg... I so glad you decided to upload another video!
I like to say that Disney saw this video and went like “challenge accepted”
one of the creepiest things about Cruela DeVil was the fact that she was friends with Anita like it made me think of all the people in my life who might use me and follow me around wanting stuff bc that is a true nightmare
“You don’t give up do ya ?”
“It’s not that , I’ve fallen ,died,got let down , and disappointed so many times... I learned how to rise back up , giving up will show that I’m weak “
“A warrior indeed”
My favourite tragic backstory is Zuko from Avatar The Last Airbender. Yes he got a redemption arc (and the best one ever) but for Season One it doesn't come across as lazy writing. It shows his desperation and motives and a lot about his character. He has one of the only tragic back stories where I genuinely want to cry for him
2021 update: the cruella segment made me laugh soooooo hard
Please do in-depth analysis on ensemble/multiple protagonists and how their motives can connect to each other and the story
That's why I don't like Grinch's backstory. The story creates a much bigger impact, when he has no reason to hate Christmas other than that it has become materialistic.
He also used Christmas to express his love to Martha May via his handmade present, only to have the entire class literally pointing at him and laughing. The teacher was openly ok with him being bullied because of his hairy face and cut marks.
I honestly like his backstory from the live-action/CGI adaptation. It doesn't try to justify his hatred, it is blatantly clear his hatred is irrational and delusional. It explains why he hates Christmas in a very understandable way. Because the movie doesn't take the justification route it doesn't need to portray his hatred as proportional to the suffering he felt as a kid, his hatred is entirely over-blown and obsessive.
Yes but I think it leads the story in a different direction. Grinch in the book was just a bitter old man, who didn't understand Christmas and thought it was only about presents. He had no personal reason to hate Christmas (or the people). Therefor the realization that Christmas might be about a little more, was all the more rewarding and created a real impact. He was a stand-in for all men that grew bitter over the years and forget what Christmas was about. Giving him a backstory took that away.
I've always took it as The Grinch's hate for Christmas was that it was too materialistic.
i wouldnt call the grinch a villain more like a grouchy hateful antagonist
Tai Lung is another example of a villain who, despite having a tragic backstory, isn’t excused because of it. He was angry at Shifu for not defending him when Oogway denied him the dragon scroll and the title of the Dragon Warrior, despite Shifu having trained and pushed him so hard previously. It’s understandable why Tai Lung would be, at the very least, shocked. After all, he trained so hard in Kung Fu, yet got nothing to show for it, and the one person who believed in him and pushed him to be the best did nothing to defend him when the title he worked so hard to achieve wasn’t given to him. However, Tai Lung’s reaction is what takes the audience’s sympathy away. Instead of accepting Oogway’s decision and focusing on improving himself in Kung Fu, Tai Lung chose to let out his anger on the villagers, who had nothing to do with his denial of the Dragon Scroll, and his masters. Not to mention that, when Shifu apologized to Tai Lung for his part in Tai Lung’s start of darkness, which was pushing him to train so hard that he ended up becoming entitled to the Dragon Scroll, Tai Lung didn’t care and tried to kill Shifu again. At that moment, the audience knows that Tai Lung is beyond redemption and deserves everything Po dishes out on him afterwards.
This channel is great already. Can't wait for you to blow up.
You could have had tenfold the views you got on this video if you had Thanos or Joker in the Thumbnail. But you decided on a Teddybear because it made more sense. You have my respect.
Could you talk about the trope where being physically strong equals a strong female character?
This was another great video by the way. :)
Oh, that's a good one. It's the same for men. We naturally follow people who project strength because all abstract forms of fear aside, the one about being beaten and eaten is still a fundamental one in humankind.
But taken to the next level, Harry Potter is the strongest and most resilient specimen, too, only on the level of magic. It is rare for a protagonist to be an average Joe/Jane with just a courageous heart and kind spirit. We want to give them the superpowers needed to best all foes. Would be interesting but not commercially viable to see a hero out of his league and failing repeatedly, then dealing with loss in a positive way, but ultimately never defeating the bad guy.
Movies about the everyday normal guy becoming the protagonist usually end up in him fulfilling all hero tropes within two hours, beating the enemy (with smarts or by recruiting allies with his charisma, through deceit or by winning over the hearts and minds of the enemy), then getting the girl and the support of many.
Basic storytelling with a happy end is the most popular, and I would love to understand why.
@@onkelpappkov2666 Yeah, what you wrote makes a lot of sense and you put into better words than I could. Basic storytelling is a reliable method to profit I guess. Also as unrealistic as it is, it does help people ease into a movie and step out of their own lives for the moment. People love happy endings because they hope that despite all obstacles they will get happy endings too. I know Hollywood loves happy endings and it might be because of the American Dream culture. I need to watch more foreign movies because I'm sure less ideal endings can occur more often. If that all makes sense.
Cloie We love happy endings in escapist media. It gives us a positive high. It’s also why most “good” media isn’t very happy. Happy doesn’t make you think, but it’s needed because we can’t be worrying about the human condition all the time.
@@adorabell4253 Still interesting though. Most movies don't leave anything unresolved, instead opting to double down for the sequel.
Let's say, hypothetically, you are a magic boy who wants to compete in a broom riding tournament called Kaddutch. At the end of the movie, you will be the best, absolutely unrivaled, without anything left to achieve. BUT trouble is brewing on the horizon as aliens are coming. The end.
That's the formula and it is bothersome because it doesn't feel real, it doesn't feel challenging, it just feels satisfying like having an almost finished puzzle and inserting the last piece. The audience doesn't get to play the game, they get to finish it, which gives a fuzzy feeling and that's it.
There are movies, not only European ones, that play a little more with the concept of not achieving everything. The Ballad of Buster Scruggs (I think it's called) is a nice compilation. Just good stories. Rarely a happy ending. Flawed people. You feel disappointed at first but then you feel the weight of it all, you start thinking.
And it IS escapism of a sort, because it takes you to far away lands and into interesting settings, bizarre shit is going down, but it does not pander.
Maybe it's really just a matter of how much you're willing to invest when listening to a story.
I like that kind of train of thought. Thank you for feeding into it.
@@onkelpappkov2666 I agree. The kind of ending you describe, where everything isn't perfectly done, can be more satisfying. I guess it really depends on what you want. If I'm looking for something to make me thing, and consider the world, I'll go for a less perfect ending, while if I'm down and want a pick-me-up I'll go for an old musical or pre-code movie (or more usually an old Soviet movie) that gives me that perfect ending high.
As an aspiring writer, I found this video very interesting and extremely helpful. It is also very entertaining! Good work!
This is fantastic content. I for one could’ve watched an hour on this subject. I might like to see your take on the subverting expectations idea that has been relevant recently. It’s been done since all of human history, and I would be curious to hear your thoughts on it. That being said, whatever you do a video on next will no doubt be as riveting as this one, and count me as a vote for longer videos.
I really enjoyed this video. As I am getting older, I see my taste in movies and what they contain is more important than how flashy they are. Your view on backstories is how I want my movies to be, a 2 dimensional villian is boring, it detracts more from a movie than it adds. (Which can also be said about a movies/books hero/anti-here, well, for that matter any character that is being portrayed in any media).
Thanks again :)
I love these video essays because the examples are thorough and the way you explain them is comprehensible while being extremely entertaining. I've literally watched all three of your videos back to back because your ability to present an argument is just amazing
This video was posted 2 years ago, but I still feel the need to dump my villain OC's backstory here.
He grew up in a world that tried to make him cruel, but he still did his best to see the good in everyone around him,even if there really wasn't. Once he thought he found someone who understood, and fell in love with them, only to be betrayed and used as a guinea pig in the development of a biological weapon by that same person.But, despite all of that, he still had hope, until, he just couldn't take it anymore, and became the monster they all wanted him to be.
After that he went with the mentality of, "if I can't be happy then why should anyone?". And even when faced with heroes, that want to reform him, he doesn't want to be. He knows he's doing bad things, but has learned, or at least fooled himself into thinking , that he enjoys it, to watch people suffer like he did,though not in the same way.
Even with all of that I still made him so I could feel some sort of sympathy towards him. In his current arc that I'm developing he's trying to learn to love again and trying to forget what someone told him, "Love is useless,meaningless, and it only makes you weak" . But still he's not going back on his ideas, He's still a villain, even if he is (very slowly and with some setbacks) trying to overcome his trauma. He's still a villain.
That's all I wanted to say, If you've read this, congratulations, you've just wasted your time reading the backstory of a character from my imagination that has barely any writen or public story, aside from a few drawings in one of my old Deviant art account and 2 animatics and an animation meme on my channel.
But, still thanks for reading, I just felt the need to drop this here in the comment section.
Put the story in wattpad
@@maadtee6281 I've tried, im not good at writing ...
You and red from overly sarcastic productions should collaborate sometime 👍. I've always loved analysis/discussion especially of tropes, I used to spend hours going through TV tropes.com. So I'm glad to see more quality content like this and trope talk. Keep up the great work 👌
Really enjoyed your last video and this one: Everything in these is so eloquently and simply stated: You convey ideas so well for a CZcamsr that's just starting out.
thank you!
I'd be interested to hear your opinion of Mauler's video critiquing Black Panther, and how he didn't see an interesting and fleshed out villain in Killmonger. I respect both of your channels approach to critique immensely and would love to hear more.
Lotso is a perfect, perfect example. I love it when you get a backstory for a villain because when it's done right, you get to see how your choices affect your path. Real life villains follow this same idea. Hitler - as a major one - whose life was filled with so many choices for the worse that it made him into a monster. He wasn't always that way, but you get to see that the wrong choices can lead to horror. It gives you pause to reexamine your own decisions. Lotso, going back to the fictional, perfectly exemplifies this. It's okay to be angry and hurt and let down - it's not okay to let those emotions justify the turn to evil.
I'm loving your channel and am definitely ready to see more. You have a knack for really breaking it down and thinking it through and man, is that refreshing. Keep up the fantastic work!
Why did it take me so long to find your channel? I loved all of them and I'd love to see more. And thank you so much for putting into words what bothered me in so many movies or shows. 🖤
The fact that you inserted a clip of Tom (Joseph Gordon-Levitt) from "500 Days of Summer" in a video about developing villains makes me wish I could subscribe all over again.
The reason that a lot of fiction has villains with tragic backstories is because in real life the worst people are all the way they are for a reason.
Sometimes, tragedy ain't the case chief.
Not always. There are some people who get the most loving upbringings possible and still become evil people. Not all the time but sometimes people are just born evil. Some killers have no reason for why they do what they do other than wanting to do it. With some nothing made them the way they are, no one forced them into it and there's no explanation for why they're that way. They just are.
Oh, how I love your videos! I too love when villains are made more realistic, they reflect the darkness in the real world, that's the scariest part. That being said, Javert is not really a villain, more like the antagonist simply because of point of view, he is just another miserable person.
I subscribed a few hours ago because of a recommended video in my feed about adaptation attractiveness and loved it so much I subbed instantly. Then I saw you only had one video and was sad, but hoped you'd upload more some day and here we are! Lol. Great video again!
Well, I just watched your whole Channel, not a huge deal at this point but still :P Amazing start. I think you're going to grow really fast now and I look forward to seeing it.
This video is nothing short of spectacular. I can see this channel going places and it's nice to be here at the beginning. Keep up the great discussion.
That Cruella review: "Just a waste of screentime" really aged well.
This is great. So far, every video of yours I've seen has been great. Like a few people have already mentioned, it's only a matter of time before you get wildly popular. Your analysis is strong, your examples are spot on, your editing is superb, your script is well-written and easy to understand, and you have a great voice for this. All in all, excellent content, and I'm looking forward to more and more videos from you!
Another fantastic video! I really like your style and the way you portray your thoughts. Definitely looking forward to to future content (while enjoying what is up so far!)
I'm so glad I found this channel!
I can't believe people think Thanos' actions are defensible: he killed half the univers so that the other half could continue to spend ressources in an overluxurious manner.
I'm actually writing a series of books where I wanna make the main villain purely evil, and I'm glad you didn't just explain here those ways to make those tragic villains, but on the contrary also took the path down how really evil villains work, this helped me a lot, thanks!!
Even ONCE upon a time didn't Try to make CRuela Sympatric they Made her a person who killed her father and Step father
Let's not forget that she used her magic to control her mother's dogs and had them murder her. That's sick.
I absolutely love what you've produced so far and really hope more is in the works! I find your analyses to be so inspiring and informative from a content-producing standpoint. I've been mulling over becoming a writer and, honestly, you've given me so much to consider and some great ideas on where and how to start!
Well, I feel that with a few examples of villains shown here, they're being set up as more anti-heroes/anti-villains, rather than plain villains.
(Edit: By the way, I love this video and am glad I finally got it off my "watch later" list!)
I'd like to see more villains that are evil just cause they enjoy it, classic disney villains who deserve to be knocked down and do bad things because they get a sadistic pleasure. I do agree villains with a good justification will always be more complex and relatable, but like you said having every villain have a backstory to try and justify skinning people alive before eating them can be annoying, unnecessary, or just poorly done
I just discovered this channel, and it's really cool! The quality of the videos are solid and you put a lot of detail into your points and discussion. Excited to see more of this!
I saw this last night and talked to my husband about this video and channel. It only has 3 videos... And the quality is phenomenal. This content and topic are totally what I have been looking for. Keep it up! I am impatiently waiting for more.
Thanks, this was a really helpful discussion of this topic. I would love to see it further explore in detail issues like how the timing of the tragic backstory reveal impacts the story, and different methods of revealing it.
Cool video!! I like how you explicitly say what your opinion is/what you thought. It's a refreshing perspective instead of the more common "I'm explaining something and this is right", keep it up!!
I think Jigsaw's backstory would've been fine without the suicide attempt. Him getting cancer, as well as losing his unborn son, would've given him a more deeper outlook on life and death, and those that take life for granted, and he would want to do something to change that within the time he has left, even if everyone would hate him for it. If his attempted suicide was supposed to be like his own test that he passed, it doesn't work cause he was deliberately trying to die and his survival was based only on luck rather than his own survival instinct.
I am loving your content man :) very excited to watch more of your videos in future
I really like this. In writing I find myself having difficulty creating a good villain whose motives seem believable. What I often resort to are villains that are forces of nature in personality, and the relatable tragic villain becomes something of an anti-hero later on. While I find this makes for good writing (Darth Vayder doing the heel-face turn in Episode 6) in some respects, I feel I'm invariably forced to make my tragic villains a sort of hero in a way. I'm not sure if it's my own naive belief that anyone can (and therefore should?) be redeemed, or that I end up forcing my villains to a moral event horizon that they cannot cross because, well, to do so would be unrealistically cruel to the point of being completely out of character (Darth Vayder in Episode 3). I feel like I need to practice with this a bit more, because I so greatly enjoy a story with a good villain (probably more than anything else in terms of character development), and haven't really gotten it right in my own characters. Thanks for the guideposts; I'll be using this in my practice.
I honestly like characters who are just evil for no reason because a lot of people are just like that. While I do also love character development, it only works with certain villains who actually need it. Tragic backstory also only works with certain characters. This is why characters like Light Yagami from Death Note because he had a Normal life and just became and evil person due to their view of the world.
I absolutely hated Hannibal Rising and everything associated with the plot of it until I watched NBC’s Hannibal. Still not my favorite, but the writers managed to work that backstory into the character in a far more nuanced and believable way without taking away from Hannibal’s completely villainy. I highly recommend it!
Your youtube channel is already shaping up to be a great addition to the writing/analysis group of channels after only 2 videos. Great editing and vid quality with concise narration. Keep it up and youll be very successful!
Ah I'm so glad you updated! I saw your last video on adaptional attractiveness and was sad when I saw you had only one other video (the MPDG) because they were both so unbelievably good! How you explain and defend things are so exact and precise and easy to understand, and so useful when thinking about media critically, and for others wanting to tell their own stories and developing characters. Thank you for making these videos, and I'm very excited to see more!
I watch a lot of video essays, and dude, this is outstanding. You pulled from so many different types of movies (I LOVED seeing you use Lion King 2) and your vocal performance is so unique but very super engaging because of how calm it is. And that Thanos hashtag bit made me burst out laughing. A favorite villain of mine is Phillip Seymour Hoffman's character in Mission Impossible 3. He's so calm and terrifying, and I don't think he has an ounce of backstory. Other favorites is Sylar from Heroes (went from just a basic slasher villain to a great character arc that saved that sorry show's ass), and Ben from Lost (you can never trust a damn thing he does!!).
Super glad your last video popped into my recommended. I look forward to your future content. Some suggestions I haven't seen from other creators:
1. How to effectively use religion in film
2. Nudity in film: is it necessary and why should it be used?
3. Why The Academy doesn't give casting directors Oscars and what a SHAM IT IS
4. Analyzing how animated film has progressed throughout the years and how it should no longer be considered a children's medium
I subbed to you after watching just one (second) video, and after this current one, I see it was one of the best decisions I made on youtube, keep up the good work man, and cheers from Turkey!
note: 2:57 the subtitle reads [ain't] instead of [ate] and at 11:35 [Sround] instead of [Around]
Of course, typos happen, just wanted to warn you in a constructive way.
thank you! will fix it
I would like a discussion of the pure evil villain trope.
omg the toy story explanation was done in such a serious tone, I LOVE THIS CHANNEL
I just found your channel, saw the 3 videos, and i'm excited for what's coming next! Keep the good work!
Glad you came back to the channel!
Loved the final sentences of the video, because they can be applied to most tropes.
Looking forward to your next videos. Hope you'll cover my favourite trope, the Magnificent Bastard, sooner or later!
The two videos you have uploaded are great, i now am subscribed
Damn, this is really good. I never really thought about when it was appropriate to include a villain backstory until now.
Most of my villains want revenge.
The main two have tragic fatal flaws that caused them to be who they are.
I don’t have the BEST story but I’m developing it as much as I can.
My first main favorite one, Cactivil. Falls from a pit of cacti that gives him the devil like personality to be a prick (pun intended).
While Icelynn, gets her powers from a cold after running away. Keen and Alice mainly have their revenge from the group of gangs that were mostly canines who kidnapped them and killed one of their closet ones (Alice’s sibling Crystal) while leaving the two alive with their fatal flaws to go as a villain.
The gang was a secret canine gang ordered by Dr. Leo Grummel and some others who just wanted to stop the trial to end but their means were unnecessary.
In a summary, Leonardo kinda took it far which I would kinda consider him as a grey side anti hero. (But he was trying to cure Icelynn when he had his job, but was fired by the hospital later on.)
Calvin and Alice wants revenge after the gang that jumped him, and also broke into Alice’s house and also kidnapped her and her older sibling Crystal killed them in the process, leaving Alice and Calvin alive. Until Calvin went after Leo which led to Leo calling his gang to help save him from Calvin who was going out his way to kill or at least beat him up severely which was a failure. Calvin also loaded his job as a lawyer defending Alice’s parents (Glacials) from Dr. Grummel which didn’t really bother him entirely. It is just that the secretive gang of Dr. Grummel’s killed Crystal after trying to aim at Calvin (who was fighting the gang) but shot Crystal who was trying to get Calvin and Alice away during the kidnapping rescue thing.
I think there are places for the simply evil villains we find in a lot of classic stories, but overall I definitely prefer a deeper, developed antagonist that explains how they became that way. Often, this does include plenty of tragic backstories, as that's how people normally go bad in real life. When I see a terrifying, monstrous murderer like Hannibal Lecter, I don't just want to fear him, I want to understand how someone could become that way.
All that being said, works like Game of Thrones that mainly has antagonists rather than plain old villains are much more interesting to me
Tragic backstories grossly oversimplify complicated human emotions and motives though.
You can give a villain a backstory without going the "He or she was abused as a child and bullied at school" route though.
You and Pop Culture Detective are now my favorite channels about movies. Great videos!
A bit of a complaining though: this video lacks Zucko from avatar! One of my favorite villains of all time. Also, Meruem from hunter x hunter.
Hi I enjoy your youtube channel. Keep doing what you're doing, it's working. :)
I love Lotso as a character also but never realized it until this video. The viewer is basically 99% to understanding him, but he remains out of reach, what a ride with that guy.
it inspires me to make videos my self
This channel is so good.
Another well done video...Thanks for your great content keep them coming.
Here's my idea for a villain in a movie in my imagination zone. It centres the theme of magic vs science:
His name is Count Blackheart, real name Blair Corkwood, a scientific supremacist who wishes to make magic extinct. He has an army of "Bots" at his disposal, each with their own name and personality. As the film progresses, he starts to become more desperate and eventually more of a machine. He replaced his right leg with a prosthetic made of tungsten metal and later loses his left arm that was accidentally cut off by the main character ("You goshdarn hypocrite! You falsely claim magic is used for hope, a beacon for harmony! You... You use magic to HARM!! You were never meant to wield such a responsibility, let alone lead a kingdom! You'll _pay_ for this! You'll *pay* for this!").
(This takes place before the war) At a young age, he was an orphan but had dreams to be a great wizard; that's right, he used to _love_ magic... But there were actions he could _never_ forgive back then. During an event, a stray spell of blinding light was redirected and blasted him right in the face, permanently scarring his right eye. No matter how much he begged and pleaded for a cure to fix his eye, Blair got the same answer, "You'll live. It's just a flesh wound." This made him believe that magic is only used to hurt and never mend. Blair decided to show everyone an alternative way to progress with science, which fell to weak minds. For years, Blair tried to change their minds and support science. By the time he finally got people to pay attention to him, the princess was born, stealing all his respect. Blair's heart finally turned blacker than the night and vowed to get his own back. At the stroke of midnight, Blair snuck into the kingdom and prepares to murder the infant with a rusted dagger but was found out. The king angrily banishes Blair and promises to kill him if he ever returns with whatever army he joins. Blair also promises to rid the world of magic, in a dialogue that feels more like a sinister curse he's placed upon them. Some time later, he discovered some anti-magic materials and begins to make his move. He murdered the leader of the science side and pins the blame on those "spellpunks" which started the age old war that costed the life of the queen. Blair Corkwood, now *Count Blackheart,* appoints himself the head of science and begins his evolution to a cruel mastermind.
2:06 that aged like fine milk ... we got a movie
You're analysis are always spot on!! I'm looking forward to more concent from you!
I watched all your videos in a row and immediately subbed