Honestly i think survivor needs to cast more people who ARENT already superfans. Dont know if its just editing but the social aspect of the game seems to have less drama then it used to and I think that makes it less interesting to watch. As of late it seems as if the cast are there more because they are a fan of the show and want to "expand their social horizons" instead of being there just to play hard for the million. The game now is "who is the best at making friends", instead of "who outwitted, outlasted, and outplayed everyone else", which sucks because it limits the amount of interesting footage the editors have to work with, and makes it harder to give the audience a satisfying victor. Twists also could play a part in this because it forces players to 'play it safe'. Theres so many advantages and disadvantages and lost votes that you really can only guess at what the numbers will be.
I think merges need to be later bc it’s not an accomplishment like it once was if 70% of the cast is in it and it causes lackluster premerges that have more potential and the tribal lines to play more in merge with bigger numbers
I want 2 starting tribes to come back. There is so much more potential for conflict in bigger tribes. The small tribes leed way too much to a tribe alliance, like we have seen so many times in the new era. There is so much more small alliances and conflicts in bigger tribes. And if you then tribe switch into 3 smaller tribes later, there are then new relationships and the possibility for people being in the minority of the old tribe and have new chances. The 3 small tribes are my biggest gripe with modern survivor (and advantage armageddon)
The 2 vs 3 tribe issue is exactly why Emily needs to win this season. Coming into the merge as the last member of her original tribe has ended up being a huge advantage
Maybe this is what's wrong with Survivor. Everything in the discourse turns into "and this is why my favorite player needs to win" And so the casting directors are content with hiring people who will represent certain key demographics rather than people who can be interesting in their own right.
2 tribes of ten needs to come back. it would lead to a later merge, with the addition of having more time for a tribe swap, as opposed to 45's 2 round tribe swap of 3 tribes.
The biggest problem for me is the cut-off of 39 days. Jeff tries to make things way more intense because of the lack of days, but the way Jeff went about doing this philosophy is some of the worst survivor I've ever seen like the amount of times players lose their votes, split tribal counsel, murgatory half tribe immunity BS, do or die and of course the hourglass are because of the philosophy of things need to be harder because less days
@iambeanss the players I feel most bad for from the twist screws is Sydney, Lydia and Matt especially Matt he didn't get to vote for so many tribals then he got eliminated over a extremely unfair split tribal
Survivor needs 39 days to build stronger relationships on the island. It needs to go back to focusing on social dynamics as opposed to twists. 41-44 were very formulaic. The twists, the challenges, the sanctuary, the tribal council set, the camp beaches- everything was the same except for the cast and we don't even get to really know them well. Everything else is at the forefront.
I think there are two main reasons the new era isn't as good (though there are others, such as the lack of themes and using the same location, which don't help): casting and having 3 tribes. 1) Casting too many superfans is a problem because they end up looking at the game through the lens of past seasons and overthinking every move that they make. This encourages conservative gameplay. Without the twists and advantages producers shoehorn into the mix these days, the gameplay would be pretty boring on its own. Meanwhile if you cast people who either don't know anything about the show or watch casually, they are less self-conscious and think less about their decisions, which creates more organic gameplay AND big moves. The other part of the casting issue is the personality types they choose now, for one they tend to have less robust mentalities (because they want the sob stories now) and they choose people who are not going to get them cancelled on the internet. For me, I don't feel invested in many of the characters, on top of the fact the gameplay is meh. 2) I have a bad habit of not watching the end of Survivor seasons because I think it's boring with too few people. Likewise I dislike the gameplay with three tribes of six. I started watching AUS Survivor last year and it was so much better with big teams. Even if some of the vote-offs are predictable it still allows for more relationships and for alliances to change before the merge. Like you mentioned, people stick to tribal lines EVEN IF the people in the tribe-based alliance aren't the best people to take to the end; it happens sometimes on bigger tribes but not as often as with smaller tribes. I think part of the reason it happens more on smaller tribes is you have much less of a choice. It you're on a tribe of 12, you can pick and choose who you want to align with. If there's only 5 other people on your tribe, you really don't have options so it's safer to just stick with your tribe for the numbers. Either way, the gameplay ends up pretty underwhelming. When you combine these things together you get incredibly restricted gameplay and it's not what I find interesting in a season. Some people seem to like the more subtle gameplay but I hate it.
I love the diversity in the casting the past few seasons. I think if they just get rid of some of the twists and let the cast actually play the game it would be so much better
This exactly. Like, it's not a coincidence that the instant production makes changes regarding the players and who they cast (which is the essential part of Survivor, since it's a social experiment at it's core) when they made the 50% POC promise, they had immediate results with season 41, since that season actually has a very narratively interesting story when you look at how it all went down (mainly due to Shan's incredible Shakespearean tragedy of a story). Unfortunately, due to the relentless twists in trying to make the game dangerous (which has been proven to do the exact opposite, which is incredibly ironic) and by trying to manufacture these big tv moments, they weren't able to properly tell the story of the season, which really sucks when you realize that none of the big twists that season actually shifted anything in regards to how the game went. Survivor works so much better if you just let the players play their own game based off the relationships they form and not because of forced production moments. You create better and more compelling television that way. For example, the finales of seasons 43 and 44 are much more complex and compelling if there's no forced fire-making at 4. If that isn't there, Jesse has more incentive to work with Karla at 5 to get both of them to 4, which then creates a more compelling final immunity challenge since if either of them win, the other goes home, and it also creates the potential for a compelling final 4 vote if both of them lose immunity because they will argue their cases against each other and the two remaining players have to essentially decide which one of Karla and Jesse is going to win. That's way more compelling than Jesse losing if he fails to win final immunity and make fire. Then, with 44, it's way more complex and compelling if the Tika 3 are actually forced to turn on each other and pitch against each other as to why the other members of that alliance are more dangerous. Having to watch the closest alliance of the game being forced to turn on each other despite liking each other is way better than watching Heidi give up the necklace for a "big move" (that didn't even matter in the end) since we've already seen that before. If the players are left to their own devices and allowed to play the game freely, they will make their own drama and the game/show will be much more compelling/complex as a result.
I like both the New Era and the Old Era for different reasons. Lucky me. The casting is superior currently and that makes the show good regardless of the game format f-ups.
My personal rankings for the new era (excluding 45) 1.44 2.42 3.43 4.41 45 would go at the top, but it's obviously not done yet I feel like the New Era is getting better but still has longways to go to be truly amazing
I'm going to say it and I I know its controversial.. but actively looking for people of different races is discriminatory behavior in itself. As a minority, I don't want the show to just cast me because they need me for a wider audience. Cast me for who I am and what attributes I will bring to the game and the show as a whole rather than my race. Let the best contestant be cast
yeah, it's tokenizing behavior. I don't have a problem with diversifying the cast, but they should also be focusing on the diversity of ages, backgrounds, etc. Recently, we see more POC, however, most everyone on the cast is college-educated, between the ages of 20-30, and more than likely from the Northeastern US. Add onto that the fact that they are refusing to cast "villains," or really anyone with flaws or strong opinions. That's not diversity--it's just virtue-signaling. And it's boring.
totally agree with you about 44s edit, Yam Yam is the best new era winner and the Tika 3 were great but we literally didn’t know anyone else on this cast, Lauren who made final 5 had less than 20 confessionals all season I believe
Losing a vote on the auction is dumb because youre forced to spend all of your money immediately instead of actually bidding on something you want. And the fact that whoever has small amount of money is automatically screwed becuase they will always get outbid. Survivor needs to either remove losing a vote, or at least make it so everyone starts with the same amount of money
I think season 43 was actually a pretty decent season. And I’m enjoying season 45. We need another all star season, like bring back some players it’s been since season 40.
I feel you on this but I'm not sure if it's fair to mention editing. The editors can only work with the content they receive. If the production crew doesn't give them much to work with then...
that’s fair and I do think the twists absolutely get in the way of being able to portray a better edit, but you can’t convince me there wasn’t a better way to edit survivor 41 than the mess we got
I started watching back at the beginning of Borneo, then fell off the show somewhere around Vanuatu. I've been catching up over the last couple of years, and am currently watching Ghost Island. But I'm really wondering if maybe I should just stop after Winners at War. With everything I've seen and read, it seems like they went out of their way to remove everything interesting and novel about the show, and what little bit of novelty is included is a long series of flops. I want to see more season themes. I want to see more of the world outside of Fiji. I don't want to see the same formula every single season. Come on, Probst! Build Survivor back to its fullest potential!
FWIW I enjoyed 42 and 43, I thought they were all right. I think I watched 2 or 3 episodes of 41 and stopped. Never finished 44. Stopped watching 45 when there were two episodes left.
I still watch it every week and season even though I kinda dislike nearly every twist from the lose your vote, the split tribals, the auction being fundamentally flawed Honestly I still dislike the SITD even though on a paper it’s inoffensive, it prevents players from actually talking about the game Matt’s f12 talk in 44 where he related mergatory to a confetti cannon ski ride picture creator or whatever the hell
We still get really good moments in the new era despite how badly production is trying to ruin things. Imagine how good survivor would be right now if production didn’t get in their own way
also with the editing being bad i'm not liking these creative edits on season 45 like the top gun boys edit and the flashfoward with jake outlining the tribal council. like you can tell they are struggling to fill the 90 minutes
Go back to 39 days format, better casting, less sob stories & more challenges, I.e. a reward challenge & an immunity challenge each episode . And finally get rid all the stupid advantages....
It's like they are afraid to say something or do something that's going to be considered discriminatory. Production is walking on eggshells every second
I know exactly what’s wrong. “Fans” who don’t like anything and complain about everything and immediately bully and shutdown anybody who says they like the new era.
@@XanderMatthews-nv9zfI’m calling somebody out for commenting based on a title or how they feel about me without actually listening to what I said in the video
Honestly i think survivor needs to cast more people who ARENT already superfans. Dont know if its just editing but the social aspect of the game seems to have less drama then it used to and I think that makes it less interesting to watch. As of late it seems as if the cast are there more because they are a fan of the show and want to "expand their social horizons" instead of being there just to play hard for the million.
The game now is "who is the best at making friends", instead of "who outwitted, outlasted, and outplayed everyone else", which sucks because it limits the amount of interesting footage the editors have to work with, and makes it harder to give the audience a satisfying victor.
Twists also could play a part in this because it forces players to 'play it safe'. Theres so many advantages and disadvantages and lost votes that you really can only guess at what the numbers will be.
I think merges need to be later bc it’s not an accomplishment like it once was if 70% of the cast is in it and it causes lackluster premerges that have more potential and the tribal lines to play more in merge with bigger numbers
THIS!!!!
I want 2 starting tribes to come back. There is so much more potential for conflict in bigger tribes. The small tribes leed way too much to a tribe alliance, like we have seen so many times in the new era. There is so much more small alliances and conflicts in bigger tribes. And if you then tribe switch into 3 smaller tribes later, there are then new relationships and the possibility for people being in the minority of the old tribe and have new chances. The 3 small tribes are my biggest gripe with modern survivor (and advantage armageddon)
The 2 vs 3 tribe issue is exactly why Emily needs to win this season. Coming into the merge as the last member of her original tribe has ended up being a huge advantage
Maybe this is what's wrong with Survivor.
Everything in the discourse turns into "and this is why my favorite player needs to win"
And so the casting directors are content with hiring people who will represent certain key demographics rather than people who can be interesting in their own right.
Kinda(though she is one of the most interesting characters in a while) but she should've won😔 😞⚰️
So I don't think casting directors trying to pander to different demographics is apart of why this person likes Emily though
I haven’t even watched the video yet but I’m 90% sure a LOT of these problems are solved in Australian Survivor
Fax!!! Hands down Australian survivor KICKS Ass!!!! 1000%
2 tribes of ten needs to come back. it would lead to a later merge, with the addition of having more time for a tribe swap, as opposed to 45's 2 round tribe swap of 3 tribes.
The biggest problem for me is the cut-off of 39 days. Jeff tries to make things way more intense because of the lack of days, but the way Jeff went about doing this philosophy is some of the worst survivor I've ever seen like the amount of times players lose their votes, split tribal counsel, murgatory half tribe immunity BS, do or die and of course the hourglass are because of the philosophy of things need to be harder because less days
they try to compensate to fill up the episodes, and that’s lame
@iambeanss the players I feel most bad for from the twist screws is Sydney, Lydia and Matt especially Matt he didn't get to vote for so many tribals then he got eliminated over a extremely unfair split tribal
Survivor needs 39 days to build stronger relationships on the island. It needs to go back to focusing on social dynamics as opposed to twists.
41-44 were very formulaic. The twists, the challenges, the sanctuary, the tribal council set, the camp beaches- everything was the same except for the cast and we don't even get to really know them well. Everything else is at the forefront.
I think there are two main reasons the new era isn't as good (though there are others, such as the lack of themes and using the same location, which don't help): casting and having 3 tribes.
1) Casting too many superfans is a problem because they end up looking at the game through the lens of past seasons and overthinking every move that they make. This encourages conservative gameplay. Without the twists and advantages producers shoehorn into the mix these days, the gameplay would be pretty boring on its own. Meanwhile if you cast people who either don't know anything about the show or watch casually, they are less self-conscious and think less about their decisions, which creates more organic gameplay AND big moves. The other part of the casting issue is the personality types they choose now, for one they tend to have less robust mentalities (because they want the sob stories now) and they choose people who are not going to get them cancelled on the internet. For me, I don't feel invested in many of the characters, on top of the fact the gameplay is meh.
2) I have a bad habit of not watching the end of Survivor seasons because I think it's boring with too few people. Likewise I dislike the gameplay with three tribes of six. I started watching AUS Survivor last year and it was so much better with big teams. Even if some of the vote-offs are predictable it still allows for more relationships and for alliances to change before the merge. Like you mentioned, people stick to tribal lines EVEN IF the people in the tribe-based alliance aren't the best people to take to the end; it happens sometimes on bigger tribes but not as often as with smaller tribes. I think part of the reason it happens more on smaller tribes is you have much less of a choice. It you're on a tribe of 12, you can pick and choose who you want to align with. If there's only 5 other people on your tribe, you really don't have options so it's safer to just stick with your tribe for the numbers. Either way, the gameplay ends up pretty underwhelming.
When you combine these things together you get incredibly restricted gameplay and it's not what I find interesting in a season. Some people seem to like the more subtle gameplay but I hate it.
I love the diversity in the casting the past few seasons. I think if they just get rid of some of the twists and let the cast actually play the game it would be so much better
This exactly. Like, it's not a coincidence that the instant production makes changes regarding the players and who they cast (which is the essential part of Survivor, since it's a social experiment at it's core) when they made the 50% POC promise, they had immediate results with season 41, since that season actually has a very narratively interesting story when you look at how it all went down (mainly due to Shan's incredible Shakespearean tragedy of a story). Unfortunately, due to the relentless twists in trying to make the game dangerous (which has been proven to do the exact opposite, which is incredibly ironic) and by trying to manufacture these big tv moments, they weren't able to properly tell the story of the season, which really sucks when you realize that none of the big twists that season actually shifted anything in regards to how the game went. Survivor works so much better if you just let the players play their own game based off the relationships they form and not because of forced production moments. You create better and more compelling television that way.
For example, the finales of seasons 43 and 44 are much more complex and compelling if there's no forced fire-making at 4. If that isn't there, Jesse has more incentive to work with Karla at 5 to get both of them to 4, which then creates a more compelling final immunity challenge since if either of them win, the other goes home, and it also creates the potential for a compelling final 4 vote if both of them lose immunity because they will argue their cases against each other and the two remaining players have to essentially decide which one of Karla and Jesse is going to win. That's way more compelling than Jesse losing if he fails to win final immunity and make fire. Then, with 44, it's way more complex and compelling if the Tika 3 are actually forced to turn on each other and pitch against each other as to why the other members of that alliance are more dangerous. Having to watch the closest alliance of the game being forced to turn on each other despite liking each other is way better than watching Heidi give up the necklace for a "big move" (that didn't even matter in the end) since we've already seen that before. If the players are left to their own devices and allowed to play the game freely, they will make their own drama and the game/show will be much more compelling/complex as a result.
I like both the New Era and the Old Era for different reasons. Lucky me. The casting is superior currently and that makes the show good regardless of the game format f-ups.
oh the casting has been incredible in the new era, and I’m glad you’re enjoying the new era so much
if i ever get on survivor and they take away my vote production bouta hate me when i go off on them 90% of the fun is the voting
I think with 26 days it would make so much more sense to start with 2 tribes
My personal rankings for the new era (excluding 45)
1.44
2.42
3.43
4.41
45 would go at the top, but it's obviously not done yet
I feel like the New Era is getting better but still has longways to go to be truly amazing
45 gave me so much hope survivor will continue to get better, but yeah they just need to tweak a few things to get the best show possible
I'm going to say it and I I know its controversial.. but actively looking for people of different races is discriminatory behavior in itself. As a minority, I don't want the show to just cast me because they need me for a wider audience. Cast me for who I am and what attributes I will bring to the game and the show as a whole rather than my race. Let the best contestant be cast
yeah, it's tokenizing behavior. I don't have a problem with diversifying the cast, but they should also be focusing on the diversity of ages, backgrounds, etc. Recently, we see more POC, however, most everyone on the cast is college-educated, between the ages of 20-30, and more than likely from the Northeastern US. Add onto that the fact that they are refusing to cast "villains," or really anyone with flaws or strong opinions. That's not diversity--it's just virtue-signaling. And it's boring.
totally agree with you about 44s edit, Yam Yam is the best new era winner and the Tika 3 were great but we literally didn’t know anyone else on this cast, Lauren who made final 5 had less than 20 confessionals all season I believe
Losing a vote on the auction is dumb because youre forced to spend all of your money immediately instead of actually bidding on something you want. And the fact that whoever has small amount of money is automatically screwed becuase they will always get outbid.
Survivor needs to either remove losing a vote, or at least make it so everyone starts with the same amount of money
I'd go with them stopping the losing their vote. It adds nothing.
I think we need stars - two-time players. That’s how the original survivor stars became household names.
watched this as a pregame for the episode and ofc ... theres a god damn lose your vote/immunity challenge. Is it so wrong to want a pure play week
I think season 43 was actually a pretty decent season. And I’m enjoying season 45. We need another all star season, like bring back some players it’s been since season 40.
Older cast!! I don’t identify with these young players. I don’t watch much, but I think Maria is wise and I love that.
I feel you on this but I'm not sure if it's fair to mention editing. The editors can only work with the content they receive. If the production crew doesn't give them much to work with then...
that’s fair and I do think the twists absolutely get in the way of being able to portray a better edit, but you can’t convince me there wasn’t a better way to edit survivor 41 than the mess we got
To be fair to Reba, they turned on each other earlier than finale. So only two of them made F4.
I like shot in the dark and legacy advantage.
I started watching back at the beginning of Borneo, then fell off the show somewhere around Vanuatu. I've been catching up over the last couple of years, and am currently watching Ghost Island. But I'm really wondering if maybe I should just stop after Winners at War. With everything I've seen and read, it seems like they went out of their way to remove everything interesting and novel about the show, and what little bit of novelty is included is a long series of flops. I want to see more season themes. I want to see more of the world outside of Fiji. I don't want to see the same formula every single season. Come on, Probst! Build Survivor back to its fullest potential!
If you're gonna skip 41-45 skip WaW as well that was probably the worst season of a survivor of all time.
@@Justin-ul7fh Decided not to skip. Watching 41 right now. But I actually enjoyed Winners at War a lot.
FWIW I enjoyed 42 and 43, I thought they were all right. I think I watched 2 or 3 episodes of 41 and stopped. Never finished 44. Stopped watching 45 when there were two episodes left.
I still watch it every week and season even though I kinda dislike nearly every twist from the lose your vote, the split tribals, the auction being fundamentally flawed
Honestly I still dislike the SITD even though on a paper it’s inoffensive, it prevents players from actually talking about the game
Matt’s f12 talk in 44 where he related mergatory to a confetti cannon ski ride picture creator or whatever the hell
We still get really good moments in the new era despite how badly production is trying to ruin things. Imagine how good survivor would be right now if production didn’t get in their own way
also with the editing being bad i'm not liking these creative edits on season 45 like the top gun boys edit and the flashfoward with jake outlining the tribal council. like you can tell they are struggling to fill the 90 minutes
some of that stuff is fun but they can get too cute and that’s when it’s not fun
Which definitely shouldn't be a problem with the amount of footage they have
45 is the best of new era
Firemaking is garbage. And 39 days.
Go back to 39 days format, better casting, less sob stories & more challenges, I.e. a reward challenge & an immunity challenge each episode . And finally get rid all the stupid advantages....
Get rid of the after show
“Hey person who just lost a million dollars how are you feeling right now?” It’s insanity
Bro I was so interested but plz talk without that bizarre cadence
that’s a new one, points for being unique
this is such a strange request lmao
Watch Australia survivor 100% better hands down!!!!
the new era is too much woke. its all that woke
Everyone's there just to be friends
It's like they are afraid to say something or do something that's going to be considered discriminatory. Production is walking on eggshells every second
I know exactly what’s wrong. “Fans” who don’t like anything and complain about everything and immediately bully and shutdown anybody who says they like the new era.
I’d appreciate you actually watching 15 seconds of the video before commenting bestie xoxo
I have literally never seen you be able to take literally any criticism about this show and I’m around a lot of comments sections
@@XanderMatthews-nv9zfI’m calling somebody out for commenting based on a title or how they feel about me without actually listening to what I said in the video
I was talking about the other person 🙄
@@XanderMatthews-nv9zf Oh this is so embarrassing for me I will be curling up in a ball