Why Keep Subwoofers on the Floor? When Other Speakers Go On Stands Or In Bookshelves
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- čas přidán 1. 04. 2022
- Why do subwoofers most often get placed on the floor when usually speakers are placed on a bookshelf, or a speaker stand. This week, Chief Product Officer Andrew Welker explains why subs can be below ear level.
This question is often asked by people who are confused when they're starting with their system and learning about placement, especially speaker height relative to their listening position.
"Should A Subwoofer Be On The Floor?" is the next video in our "Speaker Placement" playlist. Looking forward to your comments, questions, and suggestions, one of them is sure to inspire a future video.
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#SubwooferPlacement #AskTheAudioEngineer #NowYouKnow - Hudba
This info seems contrary to a lot of other advice I've been given unless I've misinterpreted. My understanding is that you want to keep the sub away from boundaries (in a studio context). Placing the sub on the floor and transferring bass energy as you say, essentially turns the floor into a speaker. Placing Subs near any walls or under desks on floors essentially amplifies the perceived effect. This may be great if we are talking home stereo and you want that tactile response but it does not work in a production set-up where the quality of bass is more important than whether you can feel it shaking the room. Any studio I've walked into the sub is always elevated and isolated. Bass frequency energy coming through the floors or walls is going to muddy the waters when it comes to quality sound. If I'm watching an epic action blockbuster on the home theatre system then hell yeah, but otherwise...
I agree. Contrary to the advice Rel give about placing them in the corner and moving out until they sound loudest, I keep both of my subs away from the corners and placed on foam platforms to de-couple them from the floor. For me, it gives a more subtle performance and don't make their presence noticeable. As there's bound to be a delay due to going through the sub I'm surprised how often subs are placed well behind the main speakers. I don't use any digital processing so my subs are placed beside and slightly in front of my speakers.
Thanks for this explanation. I often wondered!
Thanks for explaining it. It was greatly appreciated .
Thanks for the informative video @axiom audio. One quick question. Can I keep my sub woofer above projector screen. Like 8 feet above from floor?
Hi that ported subwoofer you are showing in video, if you were to lay it down on its side lets say to fit in a tight spot.Would it sound the same as standing upright?
I couldn't agree with you more Andrew. I tried raising (on the advice of a friend) a bandpass subwoofer a foot off the carpeted floor. I noticed a disconnect immediately. The bass was slightly smoother but lacked the impact of it sitting on the floor. I feel the "coupling" of the sub to floor is important even at the cost of the occasional rattle during a heavy bass sequence in a song or movie. In addition, I found the best place to put sub was in the middle of the living room on the floor where a coffee table would normally go.
Thanks for sharing your experience! Yes, bass is very tricky…and in another room raising the sub might give you better bass. That’s why it’s so important to try things out when you’re first setting up a new system or component.
As it relates to front wall to near field SBIR you measure from from driver to from wall. With a DOWN FIRING sub would you measure from driver (bottom of sub) to floor as it relates to floor SBIR?
I ask because I found ideal sub position with a front firing near field monitor but it sounds way better when I stand up 2 ft higher. Trying to decide on a front vs down firing sub to buy to replicate this elevation. But this boundary distance to floor measurement will determine if I can fit the sub under my mixing desk. This is what makes sense for room and currently is best sound. Thanks
I have a Klipsch SW-450 down firing sub on a hardwood floor in a room that is 21 feet long with a width of 12 feet. I placed woodstove bricks under the legs of the sub along with long strips of heavy duty foam all covered with a bath towel. The foam is the type that goes around pipe to keep them from freezing in the Winter. Directly under the down firing sub I placed a folded bath towel. My speaker system is a Klipsch 7.1 Synergy Home Cinema Surround Sound system powered by a Yamaha 7.2 A/V receiver. I use the Yamaha YPAO optimizer. I know this sounds crazy, but the hack seems to work. I also did the subwoofer crawl before sitting everything up.
That’s very interesting, thanks for sharing as it will likely help someone out!
I've been lifting my subs off the floor for about 15 years now, what it does is tighten up the sound, it doesn't sound as loose but has a more of a quick impactful punch, I am not talking about a night and day difference but it is a noticeable difference none the less. It also helps if you have a light driver which has a faster response, lighter drivers are more for music but are still capable for movies to a degree [20Hz]. Anyway this has worked for me and it is worth a try.
Very interesting, thank you for your comment. How far do you have them off the floor?
@@AxiomHomeTheaters I am using six 12" powered ported subs in a 2 channel system.
Two subs are 12" off the floor on custom made stands weighting 90 lbs each with fine grade sand in the legs., the second pair sit on top of the first pair and are 33" from the floor. The third pair are on separate stands and both are 66" off the floor. All subs are transmission line from the same series from the one company. Hard to tell the subs are on most of the time until an explosion or something dramatic happens in a movie and then the subs come alive and the sound pressure hits you in the chest.
Personally, I will never go back to putting subs on the floor.
I am building my system into a surround sound, either 5.1 or 7.1
I have ordered a center channel speaker with leather baffle that measures 37" wide, 11" high, 16.5" deep. It uses 2x 7.5" Satori woofers,
2x 5.5" SB Acoustics NRX midrange drivers and 29mm wave guide tweeter, this center matches my two large bookshelf speakers to get a seemless front sound stage image.
Everything is custom made when I order and are not off the shelf items and costs more and is taking me longer to save money but the sound is simply incredible and worth the wait.
Not sure how but if interested I can send photos which might help others decide if they would like to do something similar.
@@lorindamikaela Very interesting. I have done a lot of research into multiple subs and the impact on room acoustics, but not loading the room vertically like you are doing. Certainly something to explore!
@@AxiomHomeTheaters While subs use the floor to their advantage as boundary reinforcement, you lose some of that by lifting the subs off the floor, what you do is turn the gain up slightly to compensate or add another sub to the equation. All my subs have the gain set between 1 and 3 that's all and the pressure they develop in my room actually vibrate the windows if a big enough explosion happens. The plate amps in each sub are only rated at 350 watts which is "more" than enough when using multiple subs.
We use speakers at different heights in our home theatre setup why not do the same with subs ???
Yes subs are omni-directional "BUT" you get a grand sense of scale when subs are placed at different heights and placed correctly. I've been exploring this for 15 plus years through trial and error and I am really happy with my current setup.
Example --:
Have you ever experienced a fighter jet flying low over-head and you feel the deep growl and roar and the pressure that is generated from that jet engine over-head which almost takes your breathe away and it gives you a fright and you duck your head but it also brings a smile to your face --------
that's what I experience in my setup.
It's life-like and feels like reality and you live that experience all over again.
It's not about volume but realism.
My sound stage is not just front and center but wide, high, deep and solid and even at low volume late at night the impact is still there.
It's worth a try but it will not be to everyone's liking.
@@lorindamikaela Your comments on this topic are really interesting, and it’s something I am going to explore when I can find the time. It sounds like your setup has the LF “horsepower” to really energize your space, without strain or compression. To me that is one of the most important aspects of good bass performance, it should not be noticeable except when the source demands it, and it should be effortless.
The number one reason that they are placed on the floor because they are bloody heavy!
And big
Does it still need to be centered or does it not matter? If my sub is closer to my right ear will my right ear be hearing more bass than the left?
How to reduce vibration that shakes the building to disturb others?
I have my 12" Velodyne sitting on top of my 5' tall gunsafe
and it sounds amazing... /shrug
Yoga mats work well for subwoofer if you're placing them on a hardwood floor. And they're fairly cheap.
That’s an excellent cheap tweak…thanks for sharing.
Hi, for a consumer home theatre system like JBL 5.1 Soundbar, I was suggesting my interior designer to leave an empty space at a corner of the tv unit for placing subwoofer. They were suggesting to place it inside the tv unit itself as they used to do that and there is no complaints from their customers about vibration noise. Do you think it can be placed inside tv unit (CABINET) shelf ?
Let me know as well
I am going to cancel a tv console unit that i just ordered as it's dimenions are not same as subwoofer.
Is it like a compulsion to place it on floor?
In a two channel situation you want the most accurate bass response I have two svs 4000 and they are both off the floor with two foot stands,all air motion drivers should be away from all surfaces so they do not get influenced by them,those are the laws of physics
You know along those same lines, I wonder why it seems, that lately -some- speaker manufacturers are promoting two subwoofers. My Marantz pre/pro also has a second sub out on it. If you have a very large room, or a room with a high vaulted ceiling, I could understand the need but lately I've seen a number of systems that are comparable in size to mine, but they've added a second sub. Makes no sense to me. I have down firing Hsu Research sub (that compliments my Axiom's really well!), and I can't imagine adding a second one, there's just no need. Do people not understand the non-directional part or am I the one that's missing something? Just wonder if anyone has any thoughts on this...
We actually did real-world testing on this, I had friends & family allow me into their homes where I added subs to their home theater systems and did measurements. It did make a difference, but not in the way you’re thinking, it’s not for more bass and loudness, it’s for smoother bass. This video gets into better detail czcams.com/video/SkhBQ0oF-fg/video.html
Ahhh, that makes sense. I totally missed that video by the way, and you did explain it well. I think my next home theater improvement is going to have to be a bigger room! ; )
@@sjbenes Thank you! Yes, a bigger/better room is a dream for many of us. 😊
Would having a sub on the wall be cool?
room gain is essentially distortion. so adding more room gain is nothing but adding more distortion. is this statement correct ???
It depends on how you want to look at it. Since we cannot separate the room from the loudspeaker, they must be looked at together as a unit. With that in mind the target should be the best room-response possible, and gain at low frequencies from the room can assist in extending the natural bass cut-off of a loudspeaker or subwoofer. It can also be detrimental, so we will always need to live with some level of imperfection.
What are your recommendations for subwoofer placement if you don't want to disturb your neighbors?
Don’t use a subwoofer!
Bass travels, not much you can do about it unless you have 4ft thick walls….bass *will* get through,
..even if they were 4ft, some bass would still get through.
Bass is very tough to control, and even with thick concrete or cinderblock walls it can travel. Some decoupling from the floor will certainly help…there are isolation pads available specifically for subwoofers, but their impact can be hit or miss.
And insulate your windows with foam and insulate your walls with like carpets unless you got the thick concrete walls also have carpeted floors if not get something to like cover the floors with extra carpet or soundproof it with the egg crate stuff on on the walls and windows and also sometimes it helps if the neighbors aren't home haha unless they're really cool and don't give a dang
I encounter two kinds of subwoofers.
1. One with the woofer facing the ground and an air hole in the front.
2. Another kind is with the woofer facing the front without any air hole.
So is it normal to think that the first one should be placed on the floor for better coupling and the second one could be placed on
a stand?
Also, could you advise how these two kinds of structural differences might bring better sound effects?
For a down-firing subwoofer the design is probably anticipating the loading from floor placement and that’s where it should be located. With a front-facing woofer you can certainly try raising the sub to control room effects, but you will likely loose some bass because of the reduced boundary loading.
What does 7th order bass box mean?
It could only be some sort of modified bandpass design.
@@AxiomHomeTheaters I thought I thought it was just rearranging the speakers with like boxes and different things to put around them to make them sound deeper and clear that's what I thought
@@AxiomHomeTheaters yeah I've been messing with speakers since I was about 13 14 and I'm 48 now sometimes you'll hear a song and you rearrange your speakers in a different way I even put them in the closet it's up in the air and whatever and keep it that way for a little while and then change it up again you know it's just like messing with the speaker wires and trying different things it's kind of addicting you know it's like a little hobby
@@damondteachout4948 Playing with positioning can often give you surprising results, and it's cool that you still enjoy trying new things with your system! Although I'm less "into" the hardware side of my system these days, I still do get intrigued by experimenting with my setup or a new piece of gear.
Not a sub guy but good information here.
Agreed, love these no nonsense videos.
Thank you both for the kind comments!
Hau protect memory cards from wifi active sub wofer
Not sure what you are asking? Normal memory cards should not be impacted by magnetic fields.
I really prefer to hang my sub from the ceiling.
.
.
Above the dining room table.
😂
Bruh.. I'd love to see that 😂
Most floors are solid, subwoofers notoriously vibrate tremendously, in my opinion putting them on a stand or shelf is a horrible idea
I have my subwoofer on a subwoofer platform.
I'm curious about why you went this route, i.e., what the problem with the original SW placement and how you determined that a platform was the solution. Thanks!
It’s a great idea for some setups.
Simply answer is NO
Y U PUT SUBS ON FLOOR?
CUZ DEY BIG AN HEVY, DUR! 😊
For people in apartments, how does one enjoy a subwoofer without transferring it to hard floors to other apartments? And even though sound levels the bass can travel and sound very loud to others. I tried putting towels underneath of it but then it really dampens the hole sub. There's no carpet here which only would help a little anyways.
The first thing would be to stick to a front-firing subwoofer, a sealed design rather than ported would be a good choice. Also, don’t go for a bigger subwoofer than your room requires. I would suggest that you check out the isolation pads and stands that are on the market specifically for subwoofers. They won’t eliminate the problem but can make it better.