when you floated "Affordable" early in video i was a bit crushed later in the video to hear the MSRP at $1200. still, really cool that they made an 031 compatible version. i bet if i told my 5 year old he was getting this he'd agree to no other birthday presents until he was 14
Jeff K At that point I would say just do what I did and rescale to HO, much more affordable; and the ability to fit more in a given space is always welcome.
I'm one of the people you talked about with limited space (12x14 ft room). For people like me, who don't have the room for a layout with O72 curves, the Lionmaster and RailKing mallets are a wonderful option and are greatly appreciated.
Glad that Lionel is bringing LionMaster back. In fact, my first Legacy steamer was one of the previous LM Big Boy runs (the 2008 version I believe). Great engine that still runs perfectly. However, I’ve got the upcoming scale Legacy 4014 on my mind.
I think the articulation on the Lionchief version of the Big Boy actually looks better than Vision Line model. The front boiler overhang on curves on the Vision Line looks pretty ridiculous, even on the large radius O72 curves it is designed for.
@@warrenlehmkuhleii8472 Yeah, I remember when Lionel made its return to HO scale in 2004 when they brought out the Big Boy for that scale (it was featured in Model Railroad News Magazine that year). Sad thing is, it was, and still is, to much locomotive for me to afford and run. Still a great model to see run though!
So what's the answer, Eric? Is there a market for this down-market, semi-scale model and control regime? Or is it another Edsel with no actual market? Thanks to Lionel for sending it to you, and thanks to you for showing it to us. Lionel is clearly trying to engage with its fans!
Thanks for the TMCc tip! I didn’t have instructions enclosed with my new Sherman Hill set and thanks to you, my horn and bell are working off my Legacy remote versus having to use both the app and legacy at the same time for sound effects.
Eric: thank you for this review and the information about Lion Chief Compatibility with Legacy. I recently invested in the Legacy System 990, but I have a very small layout (9' x 6') my curves are O-36 on the outside and O-31 on the inside. So I am glad the the Lion Chief 2 is Legacy Compatible.
MTH has the better "scale-up" system it seems, because their "Railking", and "Premium" lines can work together under one system, DCS. Edit: Also, DCS has the ability to run TMCC locomotives too.
@@HokkaidoCEngineGalaxyExpressTh Well, the Lion Master 2.0 stuff is overpriced compared to Railking. Lionel needs to compete more, not only by lowering the price, but by installing the TMCC/Legacy to their Lionchief stuff, and maybe they may have the upper hand in pricing.
@@officialpennsyjoe I don't think LionChief is overpriced. On the website (www.lionelstore.com) the lionchief plus berkshire is $500, the same as the Railking Imperial FEF (per the 2020 volume 1 MTH catalog)
You have to feel honored that Lionel would think so highly of you to send those out to you to show on your show. Which by the way is my favorite O series train shows.
I have the Lionchief Challenger (it came out before the Lionchief remote). It uses the Legacy, TMCC, and conventional. I love the locomotive. Like you pointed out with this Big Boy, it's not scale, but honestly it's so big that you don't notice it's slightly smaller than it should be. It doesn't have the Vision Line fancy features but, it's still plenty detailed.
I have the original release of the LionMaster Big Boy #4006 that I purchased in 2009 out of the 2008 catalog. #4006 is Legacy/TMCC/Conventional only as Lion Chief was not available back in those days. What a great engine, all I've done to it over that last 11 years is replace all the traction tires and the headlight!! It still runs beautifully today and has more run time then all my other engines combined.The new version is identical as far as hardware, but I noticed some new features that are nice. The are new sounds and the chuffing seems to be improved. Fidelity seems to be the same with the big speakers in the tender. They updated the headlight with a LED, much brighter than the standard bulb in my #4006. All in all, I love this little version of the Big Boy, it fits my layout!
Excellent review Eric! Looks great with the UP scale boxcars. Your layout makes it shine. After seeing is speeding by on the rails when it left Denver last November, I can only picture it in black with 4014. Don't care for the greyhound paint scheme. Might be able to get it at just about $1000 from a Lionel Dealer. Time will tell. 🤔 Thanks for the awesome review! 👍👍👍
So in looking at this, it looks like the K-Line Big Boy tooling Lionel got that they use to make the Flyer Big Boy is going back to O gauge. I have a K-Line TMCC Big Boy and its double articulated just like this one and is rated for as small of a curve as O31, same as the LionMaster. I do agree, this is great for those of us who have smaller curves! That is why I tracked down the K-Line Big Boy, with O42 I can't run the cool scale locomotives. Good on Lionel for making something for those of us with limited space!
I noticed in this video of the semi-scaled LionMaster LC2 Union Pacific Big Boy steam locomotive is that it has the exact same whistle sound as Lionel's 3-Rail O scale rendition of the 844.
Well for what it is this Big boy looks like it'll be great for running around my Christmas tree since that's O-36. O-72 wouldn't fit in the space I have so I couldn't run the vision line big boy.
I believe this is 4th generation of the Lionmaster Big Boy. The first one was TMCC. The second one had Legacy. The third one was Legacy redesigned with smoke whistle effect. Now it's Lion Chief 2.0 and TMCC compatible. I currently own the 2nd generation and love running it with a scale consist even though it would be dwarfed by a scale Big Boy, the Lionmaster still looks amazing pulling scale cars vs traditional size ones.
My favorite feature of the vision line version was the independent smoke stack operation. Sad to see that did not include that on this one. I realize things were done to keep costs down.
Because the big boy is a rebel who plays by his own rules! Seriously though, that red dwarf signal is a switch direction indicator and is there for my benefit to let me know how the switch in the tunnel is thrown. It’s a long story, but it needs to red for the train to take the route I want. If it was green the train would take another route that I didn’t want it to take when I was shooting the video.
I have to say, I do like The Big Boy, but if I was to get a train similar to a 4 - 8 - 8 - 4 in size, I would get the EM - 1 B & O by Lionel. If you’re wondering why, I just love that blue paint scheme on that locomotive SO much.
Pretty impressive. It’s a fantasy of mine, but I would love to see a Big Boy with the paint scheme of royal blue, and sterling silver. Call it “Blue Boy”.
I have to say that's my favorite thing about mth is all there trains from proto sound 2 and up work with all the current technology, even all of there cheapest starter sets. I feel like that's something lionel forgot to do and instead try make the cheapest possible thing and then finally said "oh well let's add this so people don't feel left out after spending 1000+ on a locomotive" I have that current problem now with some of my lionchiefs being so old they don't have Bluetooth or anything, and my new one does and it be nice if it all worked together, I mean I'm not sure it he possible but it be awesome if they could make a digital remote like legacy but it works with the lionchiefs signals then almost there whole catalog of sets and locomotives that have lionchiefs would work together. I really hope lionel focus on a eco system that works across all sets and locomotives it would be awesome just like mth
To Eric’s point about the cost of these models , there is a lot of technology that has gone into these models vs models made in past years , the parts today are precisely designed and made to specs , you have a complex set of electronics , including a micro processor, sound board , all the electronics create the prototypical functions , forward , backwards motion, speed momentum, rail sounds , crew talk , chuffing in sync with smoke 💨 output , and lighting effects, and it does all this from the information passing through the rails of the track or radio control referring to LionChief plus , 2.0 .
Chuffing sound is synced hope they fix that and not have another disaster like they did with the recent vision challenger. And they had better have the correct sound on the upcoming vision big boy as well.
So I have one question, with the extra sound effects (besides dispatch and crew) do you press the announcement button on the remote for that to happen?
Looking at this much later . . . This was a step backwards in one way. I have a Lionmaster Legacy Challenger (pre LC2). Given a choice, I'd rather buy a used Legacy Lionmaster Big Boy than one of these. Seems Lionel thinks more about convenience for them than the customer these days. TMCC? Seriously? Decisions like this is what made me decide to go with MTH (this was before Mike's retirement and the break up)
Personally I hope this model does well, as it might convince Lionel (and hopefully a few more manufacturers too) to continue catering to those of us who have small layouts but love to run the newer locomotives alongside the postwar and MPC engines of earlier generations. Me personally, I have an O-27 layout because of space limitations and affordability of the component parts, which means I have a bit more of a challenge on my hands when it comes to filling out my roster of locos and rolling stock. Though I doubt even this Big Boy would cope with its dual articulation, I am sort of hoping that Lionel might make a Lionmaster Challenger that could, or even a fantasy design that was even shorter, say a UP-style 4-4-4-4. I know O-27 isn't as prevalent as it used to be, but there are still quite a few operators who have it along with plenty of others who are quite happy to use semi-scale equipment, as it tends to cost a lot less as it doesn't all the precision details as scale equipment does, so it's cheaper to make. As for Lionchief not fitting in with Legacy, that's not entirely true. I've ran my own lionchief engines on tmcc/legacy layouts, as well as alongside MTH engines on ones that have DCS fitted (even legacy doesn't do that), not to mention my old-fashioned transformer driven conventional pike, as all you need is for there to be power on the track. Yeah, you still need the app or the remote, but I personally consider that a relatively small downside for such great versatility, makes for a good "touring" locomotive to visit clubs and friend's layouts with.
@@bluefoxy6478 T1's aren't articulated, wouldn't make the curves or go through the switches, but more or less yes. What I have in mind is basically a shortened 3900 challenger boiler on top of an articulated 4-4-4-4 chassis with blind middle drivers and a shortened centipede tender.
What is everything i need to run legacy? I have a lionmaster sd80 with tmcc and would like to be able to control it with the command system. Right now i am running conventionally.
Enjoy this sneak peek of the upcoming LionMaster LC2 Big Boy from Lionel! This is a one-of-a-kind engineer prototype on loan to my from Lionel. Enjoy!
I enjoyed the vit
Video
If i had a model that was blank like that prototype you got i would name it the Phantom Express
Great Video, I also do reviews!!!
This was so exciting
TBH I lowkey like the non-painted version. Looks really cool.
when you floated "Affordable" early in video i was a bit crushed later in the video to hear the MSRP at $1200. still, really cool that they made an 031 compatible version. i bet if i told my 5 year old he was getting this he'd agree to no other birthday presents until he was 14
Jeff K At that point I would say just do what I did and rescale to HO, much more affordable; and the ability to fit more in a given space is always welcome.
There is a mth railing big boy that is $800 on trainworld.com. It is almost the same model as this one.
@@warrenlehmkuhleii8472 Also HO has realistic track . The train is awesome though.
I'm one of the people you talked about with limited space (12x14 ft room). For people like me, who don't have the room for a layout with O72 curves, the Lionmaster and RailKing mallets are a wonderful option and are greatly appreciated.
A 25 minute sneak peak? You're the man
Glad that Lionel is bringing LionMaster back. In fact, my first Legacy steamer was one of the previous LM Big Boy runs (the 2008 version I believe). Great engine that still runs perfectly.
However, I’ve got the upcoming scale Legacy 4014 on my mind.
I think the articulation on the Lionchief version of the Big Boy actually looks better than Vision Line model. The front boiler overhang on curves on the Vision Line looks pretty ridiculous, even on the large radius O72 curves it is designed for.
Awesome. It’s nice that Lionel could hook you up with one of their upcoming products, especially a prototype 👍🏾
Any way you look at it, that's still a whole lot of locomotive even if it is a scaled down version of the Legacy Big Boy!
randall ellison Of course it is more of a Medium Boy, and the HO are the Small Boys.
@@warrenlehmkuhleii8472 Yeah, I remember when Lionel made its return to HO scale in 2004 when they brought out the Big Boy for that scale (it was featured in Model Railroad News Magazine that year). Sad thing is, it was, and still is, to much locomotive for me to afford and run. Still a great model to see run though!
That whistle is absolutely spot on for the Big Boy. Great review Eric!
wow im impressed with the look of this , Awesome they trust you enough to show us these eric, thanks
Love that unpainted look. This’ll be something fantastic to display in a model steam shop. Put some worker action figures next to it working on it.
That is an Awesome idea to use the unpainted version for.
So what's the answer, Eric? Is there a market for this down-market, semi-scale model and control regime? Or is it another Edsel with no actual market?
Thanks to Lionel for sending it to you, and thanks to you for showing it to us. Lionel is clearly trying to engage with its fans!
Great video Eric! Great looking and sounding locomotive! Thanks for sharing!
Thanks for the TMCc tip! I didn’t have instructions enclosed with my new Sherman Hill set and thanks to you, my horn and bell are working off my Legacy remote versus having to use both the app and legacy at the same time for sound effects.
Very impressive. That's one awesome whistle. Thanks for yet another GREAT review.
Hopefully they’ll bring back the lionmaster AC-11. The railking cab forward ain’t the same
They did
O
Fantastic review as always, Eric. Watching this has made me even more hyped up for my LC2 Southern 2716 when it's shipped in March. :D
I pre-ordered the 765. Looking forward to that and I'll be making a review on it.
Nice! I can't wait to see that. :)
Eric: thank you for this review and the information about Lion Chief Compatibility with Legacy. I recently invested in the Legacy System 990, but I have a very small layout (9' x 6') my curves are O-36 on the outside and O-31 on the inside. So I am glad the the Lion Chief 2 is Legacy Compatible.
Great video, thanks for sharing your time and knowledge.
I like the way that engine negotiates the curves on your layout. Letting the rear engine swivel is great idea, even if it isn't prototypical.
What a nice locomotive. Thanks for sharing.
Looks good and runs great. Good review.
MTH has the better "scale-up" system it seems, because their "Railking", and "Premium" lines can work together under one system, DCS.
Edit: Also, DCS has the ability to run TMCC locomotives too.
Thiers a brolme
Its over a price
@@HokkaidoCEngineGalaxyExpressTh Well, the Lion Master 2.0 stuff is overpriced compared to Railking. Lionel needs to compete more, not only by lowering the price, but by installing the TMCC/Legacy to their Lionchief stuff, and maybe they may have the upper hand in pricing.
@@officialpennsyjoe I don't think LionChief is overpriced. On the website (www.lionelstore.com) the lionchief plus berkshire is $500, the same as the Railking Imperial FEF (per the 2020 volume 1 MTH catalog)
You have to feel honored that Lionel would think so highly of you to send those out to you to show on your show. Which by the way is my favorite O series train shows.
What an honor to run a prototype model on your layout! Absolutely Beautiful!
I have the Lionchief Challenger (it came out before the Lionchief remote). It uses the Legacy, TMCC, and conventional. I love the locomotive. Like you pointed out with this Big Boy, it's not scale, but honestly it's so big that you don't notice it's slightly smaller than it should be. It doesn't have the Vision Line fancy features but, it's still plenty detailed.
Great video I Can't wait to see the lionel legacy big boy that will be coming out soon
Excellent review Eric!!!
I have the original release of the LionMaster Big Boy #4006 that I purchased in 2009 out of the 2008 catalog. #4006 is Legacy/TMCC/Conventional only as Lion Chief was not available back in those days. What a great engine, all I've done to it over that last 11 years is replace all the traction tires and the headlight!! It still runs beautifully today and has more run time then all my other engines combined.The new version is identical as far as hardware, but I noticed some new features that are nice. The are new sounds and the chuffing seems to be improved. Fidelity seems to be the same with the big speakers in the tender. They updated the headlight with a LED, much brighter than the standard bulb in my #4006. All in all, I love this little version of the Big Boy, it fits my layout!
I Like The Feature How It Looks Sandblasted, And How The Bronze Steam Parts Look With The Black Paint With The Wheels, And The Front Of The Engine
Wow amazing nice job keep up the good work 🚂👍👍👍
Sounds amazing!
Excellent review Eric! Looks great with the UP scale boxcars. Your layout makes it shine. After seeing is speeding by on the rails when it left Denver last November, I can only picture it in black with 4014. Don't care for the greyhound paint scheme. Might be able to get it at just about $1000 from a Lionel Dealer. Time will tell. 🤔 Thanks for the awesome review! 👍👍👍
It almost looks like a Christmas big boy!
7:20
So it's a slightly less big boy?
Mini boi
Regular boi
Medium Boy
Half boi
Really nice model! I wish they had a bridge to run Lioncheif (their starter sets) engines on legacy. Maybe one day....
So in looking at this, it looks like the K-Line Big Boy tooling Lionel got that they use to make the Flyer Big Boy is going back to O gauge. I have a K-Line TMCC Big Boy and its double articulated just like this one and is rated for as small of a curve as O31, same as the LionMaster. I do agree, this is great for those of us who have smaller curves! That is why I tracked down the K-Line Big Boy, with O42 I can't run the cool scale locomotives. Good on Lionel for making something for those of us with limited space!
I noticed in this video of the semi-scaled LionMaster LC2 Union Pacific Big Boy steam locomotive is that it has the exact same whistle sound as Lionel's 3-Rail O scale rendition of the 844.
Well for what it is this Big boy looks like it'll be great for running around my Christmas tree since that's O-36. O-72 wouldn't fit in the space I have so I couldn't run the vision line big boy.
I like it! Fits my layout and wallet!
I believe this is 4th generation of the Lionmaster Big Boy. The first one was TMCC. The second one had Legacy. The third one was Legacy redesigned with smoke whistle effect. Now it's Lion Chief 2.0 and TMCC compatible. I currently own the 2nd generation and love running it with a scale consist even though it would be dwarfed by a scale Big Boy, the Lionmaster still looks amazing pulling scale cars vs traditional size ones.
That would be super fun to paint, that is if you can get it back together.
awsome video and i like the train
wow, really cool!
Notice how they finally put a dynamo on the big boy. They didn’t put a dynamo on any scale big boy like the JLC or visionline one.
I can't wait to get mine
4:49 to 5:08, I slowed way down to view the side gear.Great Detail!. As comnplete as could be expected for such a small mechanism.
My favorite feature of the vision line version was the independent smoke stack operation. Sad to see that did not include that on this one. I realize things were done to keep costs down.
Lowell Dever my favorite feature also
20:33 why is the train going through a red signal
Because the big boy is a rebel who plays by his own rules! Seriously though, that red dwarf signal is a switch direction indicator and is there for my benefit to let me know how the switch in the tunnel is thrown. It’s a long story, but it needs to red for the train to take the route I want. If it was green the train would take another route that I didn’t want it to take when I was shooting the video.
ericstrains lol
Big brain
ericstrains ok
He's running late
ericstraims Thats fuckin awsome! We need a lionchief plus 2.0 SD40-2
the whistle is the best part
A nice sneak peak , looks like the the Pet Detective delivered it by the looks at the of the box .
I have to say, I do like The Big Boy, but if I was to get a train similar to a 4 - 8 - 8 - 4 in size, I would get the EM - 1 B & O by Lionel. If you’re wondering why, I just love that blue paint scheme on that locomotive SO much.
Pretty impressive. It’s a fantasy of mine, but I would love to see a Big Boy with the paint scheme of royal blue, and sterling silver. Call it “Blue Boy”.
(18.Jan.2020)
that is SO cool!
Tanks fer da fab sneak peek, Eric. But lube dat reefer! :)
Surprising and excellent is the side-by-side comparison. Coal load in tender? Weren't these oil-burners in their twilight years?
that's cool!!!
Like the 8mm projector
I have to say that's my favorite thing about mth is all there trains from proto sound 2 and up work with all the current technology, even all of there cheapest starter sets. I feel like that's something lionel forgot to do and instead try make the cheapest possible thing and then finally said "oh well let's add this so people don't feel left out after spending 1000+ on a locomotive" I have that current problem now with some of my lionchiefs being so old they don't have Bluetooth or anything, and my new one does and it be nice if it all worked together, I mean I'm not sure it he possible but it be awesome if they could make a digital remote like legacy but it works with the lionchiefs signals then almost there whole catalog of sets and locomotives that have lionchiefs would work together. I really hope lionel focus on a eco system that works across all sets and locomotives it would be awesome just like mth
I still think that the #4006 from 2008 is much better. I got one for Christmas AND I LOVE IT!
I was gonna say it's O27, it's great Lionel is doing different size turnout trains again.
Very cool
That's pretty smart by Lionel. 8:13
Even as a prototype it still looks cool
I can agree, i liked your comment too
To Eric’s point about the cost of these models , there is a lot of technology that has gone into these models vs models made in past years , the parts today are precisely designed and made to specs , you have a complex set of electronics , including a micro processor, sound board , all the electronics create the prototypical functions , forward , backwards motion, speed momentum, rail sounds , crew talk , chuffing in sync with smoke 💨 output , and lighting effects, and it does all this from the information passing through the rails of the track or radio control referring to LionChief plus , 2.0 .
hola buen dia muchas gracias por subir el video abrazo grande
How about a price comparison to the LEGACY Lionmaster! Big Boy. The Legacy version was cheaper and had quilable whistle.
Chuffing sound is synced hope they fix that and not have another disaster like they did with the recent vision challenger. And they had better have the correct sound on the upcoming vision big boy as well.
So I have one question, with the extra sound effects (besides dispatch and crew) do you press the announcement button on the remote for that to happen?
Looking at this much later . . . This was a step backwards in one way. I have a Lionmaster Legacy Challenger (pre LC2). Given a choice, I'd rather buy a used Legacy Lionmaster Big Boy than one of these. Seems Lionel thinks more about convenience for them than the customer these days. TMCC? Seriously? Decisions like this is what made me decide to go with MTH (this was before Mike's retirement and the break up)
Behold, indeed!
Awww dude. Its even got the wheel slip effect
Personally I hope this model does well, as it might convince Lionel (and hopefully a few more manufacturers too) to continue catering to those of us who have small layouts but love to run the newer locomotives alongside the postwar and MPC engines of earlier generations. Me personally, I have an O-27 layout because of space limitations and affordability of the component parts, which means I have a bit more of a challenge on my hands when it comes to filling out my roster of locos and rolling stock. Though I doubt even this Big Boy would cope with its dual articulation, I am sort of hoping that Lionel might make a Lionmaster Challenger that could, or even a fantasy design that was even shorter, say a UP-style 4-4-4-4. I know O-27 isn't as prevalent as it used to be, but there are still quite a few operators who have it along with plenty of others who are quite happy to use semi-scale equipment, as it tends to cost a lot less as it doesn't all the precision details as scale equipment does, so it's cheaper to make.
As for Lionchief not fitting in with Legacy, that's not entirely true. I've ran my own lionchief engines on tmcc/legacy layouts, as well as alongside MTH engines on ones that have DCS fitted (even legacy doesn't do that), not to mention my old-fashioned transformer driven conventional pike, as all you need is for there to be power on the track. Yeah, you still need the app or the remote, but I personally consider that a relatively small downside for such great versatility, makes for a good "touring" locomotive to visit clubs and friend's layouts with.
So, you want a T1, but with union Pacific on the tender instead of Pennsylvania?
@@bluefoxy6478
T1's aren't articulated, wouldn't make the curves or go through the switches, but more or less yes.
What I have in mind is basically a shortened 3900 challenger boiler on top of an articulated 4-4-4-4 chassis with blind middle drivers and a shortened centipede tender.
wish I could test out prototypes hehe
I would paint that too
It looks better than I thought it would but it's still way more expensive than I could afford.
Drool-worthy. So since it is technically TMCC controlled I could run it on my MTH remote provided I have the TMCC set up correct?
Yes that is true because I have the same set up and it can run on your phone
@@tjprptchable Sweet! Only a couple more weeks and I have 765!
@@FutureRailProductions awsome
Cool engine
How do you make your train cars look dirty? I have the Chesapeake boxcar. So I would like two do that so it looks real.
how do you power up the power up the track with the mth and lionel transformers together so you can run either train on the track ???
What is everything i need to run legacy? I have a lionmaster sd80 with tmcc and would like to be able to control it with the command system. Right now i am running conventionally.
Lionel must have moved productions to Italy because on the box it says Fragileeee ! ! !
Lionel is going to make GS class Northern with whistle Steam and cylinder Steam.
In every video I keep expecting that white figure @ 20:12 to get hit by every loco which comes by on that curve. Especially by a Big Boy!
They should have make it Legacy and TMCC so you can have the quilling whistle
would you know if this may be available in S scale also? any word on that?
It’s a baby big boy
Hi Eric I have a question, do you ever just run trains for the fun of it?
Of course
How cool would it be to have this in your collection
Can you quill the whistle with the Lionchief app?
It is a big improvement over other lionchief engine. But that price tag... I can get the MTH equivalent for much less.
That's what I was exactly thinking. Though lionel did much better on detail and the sound system so I'd take the this one if I could.
this thing can run on o31?
AWESOME
Because it's double articulated. Personally, I find the double articulation really ugly.
I like it
How on earth did you manage to get your hands on the prototype
Can you please re-review the Union Pacific Challenger
How did you get ahold of a non production engineeering prototype ???
Will it be like the hybrid never made?
Are you still doing the same thing with the trains
Where can you get the vision line bigboy