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Why The Roman Army Used The Pilum Spear
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- čas přidán 16. 08. 2024
- The Roman Army's pilum javelin, or throwing spear, is not only an iconic historical weapon, but for centuries it was an important feature of Roman military tactics. Of course the weapon achieved several functions, but what really was the primary purpose of the pilum?
Matt Easton of Schola Gladiatoria dicusses!
Extra videos at Patreon: / scholagladiatoria
"Everybody has a plan until they get pilumed" - Mikus Tysonius
Everybody gangsta until the legion starts walking
@@oskarileikos Indeed Roman Legions were the coolest kids on the block in 500 BC :)
@@XLHeavyD999 LOL, but it's more like 300 bc at the earliest....
everybody gangsta until the legion rolls it artillery up
"Friends, Romans, Countrymen, lend me your ears"
Been really loving these videos on the pilum, truly an unsung hero.
But what about DRAGONS?!?!
I wonder if the romans ever mentioned the pilum in songs, then it'd be a sung hero.
„Clearly, killing a Person is the ultimate aim“
-Matt Easton on the meaning of life
Interestingly, Wikipedia states "The scholar Agathias recorded the use of angons by Frankish warriors at the Battle of Casilinum in 554:
Suppose a Frank throws his angon in an engagement. If the spear strikes a man anywhere the point will penetrate, and neither the wounded man nor anyone else can easily pull it out because the barbs which pierce the flesh hold it in and cause terrible pain, so that even if the enemy is not fatally hit he still dies as a result. And if it sticks in the shield, it fixes in it at once and is carried around with it, the butt dragging on the ground. The man who has been hit cannot pull out the spear because the barbs have gone in, and he cannot cut it off because of the iron that covers the shaft. When the Frank sees this he quickly treads on it with his foot, stepping on the ferrule [iron finial on the butt of a spear or other pole weapon] and forcing the shield downwards so that the man's hand is loosened and his head and breast bared. Then, taking him unprotected, he kills him easily either cleaving his head with an axe or piercing his throat with another spear."
Do you think that the inability to remove the pilum after a strike also might have been a main consideration for the long iron shank?
It certainly would seam as a viable tactic, and seeing how the Germanic tribes warred with the Romans for many centuries, the inevitable exchange of ideas and goods could have lead from one to the other.
That's yet another factor in it. Yes, the iron shank means you can't just cut the head off the javelin for medical purposes. There are a lot of factors, or "context" to its uses, it doesn't JUST need to penetrate.
I go into detail with that, here, if you are interested: &lc=UgwRwbkMQ2Vti_5p2-B4AaABAg
This makes a ton of sense(stepping on the end of it to pull the shield) down.
@Badger0fDeath it might be related to the reduction of the avaibility of good armor after the fall of the empire
@Badger0fDeath true. I might also be more difficult to produce? At least in large quantities.
"...as concise as possible, by Matt Easton standards--" [13 minute video]
Never change, Matt.
He is brilliant in doing these videos in one take, with the amount of information he has in each of them.
Matt "...and probably some anti armour stuff"
Next episode: Matt lifts panzerschreck off garage wall....
"Now, you may be asking, why did the Romans prefer the LXXXVIII-mm guns? Easy, they worked!"
[Edited for historical accuracy- 88mm]
@@ALovelyBunchOfDragonballz *the LXXXVIIImm guns
Hey guys, Matt Easton, Scholagladiatoria here. Today we're going to be testing German anti-armour weapons against my neighbours garage door
@@tommyscott8511 now obviously, this isnt a conclusive test, the German army didnt fight against garage doors. HOWEVER! I unfortunately couldnt find any T-34s lying around and steve, the next door neighbor, had been a bit of a prick recently so I hope It becomes an expensive repair...
That comment is the epitome of more dakka
My brain: goes into a long-winded (edit) and lenghty explanation as to why that is.
My mouth: because pila are awesome!
Also the shank is way thinner than the point to avoid friction and facilitate penetration. Once the pyramid point gets in, the rest of the shank doesn't find much resistance
re - *winded*
I do not think that word means what you think it means.
edit - It's likely you meant *long winded* which has an entirely different meaning. Dare I say; an almost _inconceivably_ different meaning...
@@Raz.C as far as I recall "long-winded" means long and tedious, but again English isn't my first language so I might be wrong. Hopefully you get what I'm trying to say.
Edit: yeah. That was it. Speaking more than one language gets me in situations like this sometimes ahahah
There's a fallacy here, where people are assuming something can't be designed to penetrate and bend. Obviously, if you didn't penetrate the shield, there is NO WAY for the pilum to bend in it. This is a problem of misunderstanding the physics, as well....
Take a look at this comment, if you want to see the very grievous errors in Matt's backyard archaeology: /watch?v=wLmkLyBEO_k&lc=UgwRwbkMQ2Vti_5p2-B4AaABAg
@Math everything was sexual to Freud, though ahah
@@vanivanov9571 I've read your comment, and it does make sense, after all a weighted wooden handle would put strain on a thinner, soft metal shaft, I wonder if it would be possible to recreate a pilum with the same specifications, or as close as possible, to a period-accurate one.
As far as testing materials, you hear the same kinds of objections about using ballistic gel for testing bullets. And while the objections are valid, what the gel DOES do is give you a consistent medium to get a general idea about the differences in the projectiles. Point being, maybe while you're testing you should try some OTHER types of javelin and spear type weapons that were present at the same time as the pilum to see how they perform compared to the pilum in whatever type of testing media you come up with. JAT
Yeah... Matt's tested a non-historical pilum, then, despite admitting there were MANY TYPES of pila, decided NONE OF THEM bend... when his unreasonably bending resistant pilum DID bend, in an archery target meant to resist such.
I wrote up a post last time about this, but sadly people seem to have ignored it. You can check it out here, if you're interested: &lc=UgwRwbkMQ2Vti_5p2-B4AaABAg
Van Ivanov who has done tests with ACTUALL historic pilum. And his comment fit perfectly, and use real data.
@@vincewhite5087 Thanks. My tests aren't from recreations of pila, though. Just from experience with friends, doing metal working. Matt's recreation shows us how, even with a truly over-designed pilum, perpendicular force will still bend it, even against a soft target.
I've always been a bit skeptical of the notion that pila were meant to bend in shields or so that the pila couldn't be thrown back at the Romans. First, because if the pilum is weak enough to easily bend it will lose a substantial amount of penetrating potential. Second, because pila are short ranged weapons used shortly before the Romans and their enemies engaged in close combat. How much time would people have to throw back the pila before the battle lines clash.
It doesn't bend on impact... so no, it doesn't reduce penetration, if you use a heavy pilum designed to bend. And you're thinking of a Hollywood situation, where everything is decided in one decisive clash. That sometimes happened, sure, but thinking all warfare came down to that is not accurate.
You can check out this comment, if you want to see a thorough analysis of the issue: /watch?v=wLmkLyBEO_k&lc=UgwRwbkMQ2Vti_5p2-B4AaABAg
The wooden pin would do it. Does not change anything on impact, just when you try to pull it off.
@@buildingenergy9365 But then the wooden pin is only mentioned once by one source, and all archaeological finds of Pila have had metallic pins, no wooden ones.... so how much faith can we really put in the idea that wooden pins where used? *edit* if we accept that they where used in that battle, then it gives no idea of how wide spread they where outside of that one event.
@@vanivanov9571 anything that is malleable will deform on impact, anything deforming on impact will transfer kinetic energy into its deformation and not trying to pass through.
It seems pretty frivolous to expect a specific behavior out of a weapon like that. Penetrating the shield is already annoyingly difficult because most of the time you will miss, hit at a deflection, hit the boss, entangle in spears etc. so to specifically expect it to bend when penetrating the shield is weird.
Also, the context of its usage is legionaires throwing their pila at pretty much point blank range before charging with the implication of hitting the enemy with the charge when they have not recovered from the pila disrupting them, yet. Nowhere in there do you need the pilum to bend. They guys who have their shields penetrated and thus struggle holding position or counter charging are the very guys you want to kill in that charge!
Seems to be like the arrows fired back idea which as we saw with Tod's Workshop: Good luck firing those arrows back in one piece while scurrying over the field like a ferret to find one with its arrowhead still attached and undamaged!
The pilum are used right as the enemy are charging, to break their momentum. There is hardly any danger of it being picked up and thrown back, because by that time the two opposing infantry lines are engaged in melee combat.
Although we have no way of knowing how hard or soft the metal shaft were, i have a hard time envisioning the roman empire having to replace the pilum after every few battles. If the romans devised it to bend on purpose (which i doubt), the material would need to be very soft, and we all know what happens when you bend and straighten metal time after time. It gets metal fatigue and breaks. And the bending itself takes away energy from the pilum´s thrust, which means penetration is affected. A rigid shaft is desired to achieve maximum penetration.
I think the roman legions used the pilum to break enemy formations just before charging, or to break enemy momentum when they are being charged at. Either way, it happens mere seconds before both battle lines collide, so there is never any chance for the enemy to retrieve the pilum and throw them back. After the battle is over, the legionnaires just pick it up from the ground, since they were more often than not victorious.
Everyone gangster till you hear the centurion shout, “Consiste! Pila iace!”
My thoughts. 1. To break up the line they are attacking or being attacked by.
2. To kill the enemy.
3. When they stick in shields, they make the shields hard to use.
4. They give you a lever to move the opponents shield creating openings for comrades
@@Bob-sq1us You are never going to be trying to pick up or kick a pilum like a lever as an actual feasible tactic. Not unless you want your outstretched arm / leg chopped off. In the press of melee combat the fact the shield is now functionally got a 12" stabbing implement stuck through into your soft squishy bits is about all the leverage required for the enemy to shed the shield at the first opportunity and pick up another from a fallen comrade if they are able.
@@koncorde you have more than enough heft to retain your grip and keep hand, let alone your whole arm, behind your shield. Once the shank is even an inch or two in, and thus supported by your opponents shield it can be gripped closer to butt of the weapon, you would not have to leave to arm at the exetenton of the thrust. Conduct the experiment
@@koncordealso one could very easily step on a pilum embedded in an opponents shield without exposing your leg. Provided the end was near the ground which almost certainly would be
@@Bob-sq1us And that low thing is likely where you'd get a lot of bending if someone was advancing. If you're a Celtic or German warrior charging at the Romans and a pilum sticks midway or farther down your shield as you run forward that shaft will dig into the ground and you'll put a lot of torque on that iron shaft as you run forward until the whole mess makes you fall ass over tea kettle.
So the secret to bring down the roman empire was carrying multiple shields
So basically like you do in dark souls, right?
Skallagrim was wrong, double welding shields is the way.
like a mountain blade seige
@@menwor1
double welding shields? What? You mean forge-welding them together? Because they didn't have many methods of welding 2,000 years ago and I even suspect that forge-welding may have been the ONLY method they had. All of which is largely irrelevant, since I'm convinced you meant to say *wielding* and not *welding...*
Having spare shields is a good idea, being well supplied means someone can just go to the back of the line and get a new shield, or take time removing the pilum from it. The pilum bending makes it much harder to remove, however, so you would need a new shield. Even if you can go back and get a new shield, temporarily disabling enemies is a good move.
And yes, pilum did bend... See this comment, if you want to argue over that: &lc=UgwRwbkMQ2Vti_5p2-B4AaABAg
The pilum's penetrative power would also be greatly increased if the target is charging vs stationary. Have someone run at you while carrying a shield.
Preferably one of your enemies 😄
The most energy would be transferred if both the target and the thrower were charging at each other.
Concerning the gladius, the Zulu tribes using very short spears with large shields had the same effect and were definitely cheaper to produce.
Simple answer. They liked to pilum on the pain.
May I suggest, to account for the arm absorbing some of the energy by recoiling or turning the shield, hang it from a grip using rope and the hang a 30 to 40 pound to below the shield, also secured to the grip. The whole thing should weigh in at heavy bag range. During destructive tests of center grip round shields, we found that method gave good approximation to a shield being struck while held (do not try this at home) and yielded significantly different results to a static mount.
Your genuine helpfulness has no place here. Only childish innuendo and penis jokes. 🧐 Those are the rules
We know from Plutarch's life of Marius that one of Marius' military reforms was to replace one of the two nails holding the head of the javelin with a wooden peg that upon impact would break and thus allowing the shaft to pivot. (Life of Marius 25.1) This lends itself to supporting that the the javelin was supposed to penetrate deeply into the shield but rather then bend it was designed to break so that it remain lodged in the shield and was unable to be thrown back at the Romans.
Exactly. I read that book years ago and also understood the innovation of the wood peg. It allows the weapon to damage the enemy, then safely break and not be able to be used against the Romans. At the back of the line there would be a guy with a bucket of pegs to repair the pilum and return it to the battle very quickly.
The other advantage of the thin shaft is that even if it bends, the blacksmith can heat it and straighten it out in a minute or two.
The bottom line is that when Roman weapons broke, they could be easily repaired on the battlefield and returned to service the same day.
This suggests something contrary to the tactic of "throw and immediately charge" usage of the pilum that is widely accepted though. Getting even a leaf shaped spearhead out of a wooden shield is a pain in the ass and a wooden pin would be necessary unless you were doing a lot more missile throwing at standoff distance.
@@TheChiconspiracy modern thinking [see Zhmodikov et al] is that like other armies the Romans would approach, cast missiles for a long while, and if the enemy are shaken or they are urged by the moment, they will charge and press into the enemy for few minutes until they are exhausted, then return to the maniple, where the tired and wounded would be relieved by the man in file behind each, missiles would be put in the new file-leaders' hands, and they would throw more. The difference to the skirmishing of velites is that the hastati etc have legionary panoply to push into the enemy when the javelin volleys had disrupted his organization or weakened his morale.
Think how important finding rocks and spent javelins was to the Roman soldier, it is the ONLY other reason to break ranks in the face of the enemy, beside saving the life of a fellow Roman citizen. And the so-called rotation of troops seen in the HBO Rome series was nowhere attested in the primary literature, but it could be done in the lulls between close melees once the front-rankers tired and drew back.
Probably the reason the legions could never resist the Greek phalanx frontally is that they were more heavy armed skirmishers than the pure heavy melee infantry that the phalangite was. And many of the Roman enemies were the same, such as the Gauls and Germans who threw missiles and charged by dense columnar wedges.
Mike Loads was featured in a brand new history channel documentary and he can to the conclusion that once the head passes, the rest of the shank has virtually no friction with the shield. It was also observed that none of them bended
You have a title for it? I would need to see these pila and the testing conditions. If it's like Matt's.... well, his wasn't designed to bend, and it bent on an archery target meant to preserve arrows.
Yay, Mike Loades is back on History Channel, rather than those modern lorry drivers and lumberjacks taking up airing time!
But did this documentary use soft iron comparable to what many pilum used? It's pretty much accepted that they were designed to pass through shields and penetrate armor, that doesn't negate the other major advantages to the design. Sticking in shields was a huge benefit if the person was not killed. We know that both light and heavy pila were used, with the lighter and more common variant having softer and thinner iron shanks than the heavier version - the heavier version thought to double as melee weapons.
I really appreciate such an informative video that’s over the 10min mark and you resisted the temptation of filling this video with extra ads we’d have to get thru just for extra revenue. In a day and age where every p.o.s. CZcamsr is using that slimy tactic you stand true like a bright light in darkness. Cheers mate
I've got a bit of a ramble but this video really overlaps with a lecture (happened a good 4-5 years ago) put on by the Classics Association at my university, I think it was by Dr Jeremy Armstrong who was visiting at the time. It's been so long that I don't recall all the details, but the gist of it was about development of the Pilum and how it changed the structure/style of the Roman military during the 4th BCE. As best I recall, he argued that archaeological evidence showed that most of the 'warring' in Iron Age central Italy was done by tribal elites who were super heavily armored and decided battles in a series of semi-ritualized 1v1 battles. There was also a concurrent skirmishing tradition which was useful for more battlefield adjacent things like raiding and foraging, but wasn't effective enough to play a part in the 'major' battles because the elites were too well protected. The development of the pilum, (which he believed was an indigenous Roman invention from earlier javelin types) revolutionized the Roman military system because (in this he'd agree with you) the long shank was to aid in penetration, finally making the traditional skirmishing tactics lethal enough to harm the traditionally heavily armed elite. As a result Rome suddenly had a major advantage and shifted into a more democratized, skirmish-heavy form of warfare that proved so effective that most major enemies were subdued or overshadowed before they could adapt. As a result of this (and once again he'd agree with you here) the pilum was a much more central and important weapon to the Roman warrior than any of his sidearms, and through to the Early Republican Period the Roman warrior thought of himself, first and foremost, as a Javelineer rather than a swordsman. Armstrong had all these great ancient literary quotes about the symbolic importance of pila to Roman military and religious ritual during the Early Republic, arguing that the 'primacy' of the gladius was a retconning of later authors who projected the primacy of the gladius during their own time back onto the poorly recorded Roman Iron Age. I don't know how much of this has made it into his publications, but Armstrong has a number of books on Early Roman warfare and it's effect on Roman Society, they might be worth checking out?
Yes that's the gist of what Dr Armstrong aruges (I think convincingly). If you liked his lecture and want to go into more detail I'd really recommend his book (if you can afford it, damn university textbooks): www.amazon.co.uk/War-Society-Early-Rome-Warlords-ebook/dp/B01CJUV4EO
@@dernwine do you have any other recommendations of his books? I might contact him directly and ask too
Anthony Bracuti sorry, no I don't, I know he's written a few more but I haven't had the opportunity (or money since they're all expensive) to read more, I'll try to remember to come back here if I do get a chance to read more of his work.
@@dernwine no sweat, I contacted him directly, hopefully I'll get a reply
@@anthonybracuti6898 let me know if you do.
YES! Matt is back on the Pilum train!
I would love to see the effects of a mass pilum throw. It would be amazing to see a test of a bunch of guys in formation all throwing their long range pilum first, and seeing what the damage/spread is like. And then having them throw the short range ones after. The damage must be insane but I can't really picture it in my mind.
It really sucks that you never see this scene recreated in TV series. I mean, these things were probably launched en masse under command of the centurion, one of his main tools in both defense and attack. It would look awesome (probably one of the reasons it was successful).
There's a fair description in a few books but I get what you're saying.
I remember from my ancient history courses waaaay back when hearing that the pins holding the "shank" to the haft? (the woody bit) were designed to break away, so that the there was a bend or break at the shank/haft junction after impact, so that yes, it made use of the shield awkward after it stuck in (with a dangling pilum dragging about), but that also it made the pilum useless for an enemy to pick up and try to use back against the Romans (as the pins would need to be replaced). Anyone heard that, or was my old history professor high as a kite?
That is correct. Roman weapons were designed to be easily repaired on the battlefield. The wood peg was a brilliant innovation
The wooden bit is mentioned in an aside in one source (and the author is writing about a battle that happened 150years before his time), it's not clear if it was just for that one battle or if they kept being used according to that source, and there has never been a pilum found that has evidence of a wooden pin being used. So the questions about the wooden peg are massive:
Did he get that right? Was his source reliable or did he just repeat a popular myth? Was it used in this one battle? Was it widespread? Why does nobody else mention the wooden pin? Did the Romans use some pila with wooden pins some with metal ones? Or did the wooden pins represent just a small moment in the Roman story?
@@dernwine the only way to find out is by experimentation. It could be a fun day throwing a pilum with and without wood pegs to see what makes sense.
@@tjsogmc I agree it would be fun, but it wouldn't really answer any of the questions: Even if it works, that doesn't tell us anything besides Plutarch probably was right about that specific instance. Whether it was a single incidence, or continued use, or why nobody else mentions it, how long it was in use, etc, none of those questions would be answered even by a succesfull test.
The best chance of the question being put to rest would be if we could get a broad sample of dateable Pila with evidence of woodpegs, but I suspect that's not going to happen.
@@dernwine I think we see eye to eye on this one. It's very hard to say "this" or "that" about the pilum when we don't have a good sample of evidence backed up by eye witness accounts. When dealing with things like this, it comes down to what we do know from archaeology and surviving records bumped up with some educated speculation.
First is the pilum design. Clearly, the pivoting mechanism can only be used with the ones that have the blade tang using only two rivets. Styles with three rivets or have the socket shrouds won't work like that. So now we are only speaking about a specific type. When was it used? Here and there throughout the 700 or so years it was in service? Only the one battle and one time and never used again because they found out it really wasn't a gain? We don't know.
Next we have to look at culture. We know the Romans were pagans and absolutely loved writing everything down about every ordinary detail. Knowing this, there MUST have been a military manual published showing the pilum design and battlefield use. Unfortunately, we don't have a copy of it. And also unfortunately, there is little reference to it outside of a mention Plutarch. We also know that Roman historians can be a bit, um, shall we say, jingoistic and prone to exaggeration? So the reference MAY be reliable, or it may equally be hearsay - 50/50 on that since they seldom made the effort to distinguish between the two.
The only thing is to try out the theory and see if it works. If it does, then that gives some merit to the surviving account and therefore it MIGHT have been a technique used on the battlefield. If it fails utterly, then we know Plutarch was full of shizzle and just repeating some drunk sailor talk. Either way, it sounds like a good excuse to throw around some spears and spend a day outside in the fresh air.
I like the attitude on this one! You got the chops to back it up so it's sound input! History needs the experiential contribution!
The neighbours: Why has that nice Mr Easton got a sign in his driveway reading "Volunteers For Pilum Experiments This Way"?
+1 on the pilum love. The pilum was the legionary's "primary" weapon not the gladius - the same way a knight's primary weapon was the couched lance. (Also a single/limited use weapon.) I have been beating that drum for a while now.
Tournament lances were made to explode on contact to make a better show/make things slightly safer, but in battle they'd be stabbing every poor SOB they could reach as soon as they shook off the previous guy. Same concept as straight-bladed cavalry swords, but with more reach and impact. The saber (or sword, the lancers I'm most familiar with were more Easton's era, but medieval lancers worked pretty much the same) was only for emergencies (broken or dropped lance) or in the melee when too close to use the lance, much like modern pistols are only used when the rifle runs out or the bad guy is RIGHT THERE (among the few specialist people who carry both).
Exactly Romans used heavy infantry. Like later medieval kingdoms used heavy calvary. At least as far as the manual of arms.
@@DeliveryMcGee I'm sure they would stab and retract, when possible. However, the advantage of cavalry is mobility, and the combination of the horse's speed and momentum would make deep penetration likely and limit the time available for retracting; penetrate 1 ft while the horse moves 2 ft, and you're at the limit of how far you can retract the lance. Beyond that point, and you'll be riding around with a dude stuck to your lance. I'm pretty sure most people decided to ditch the lance and switch to their secondary weapon, at that point, which would probably be an axe, mace, hammer or similar, rather than a sword. Swords were more tertiary weapons. There were lance tips designed for limited penetration, and even for using the forward momentum to rip the lance out, but they were uncommon, and will have worked poorly against armored opponents.
@@erikjarandson5458, you don't need to pull the lance to get the body off it. You can untuck it from under your arm and tilt it to let gravity and your horse's continued movement to pull it free for you. The main reasons to drop the lance and switch to another weapon would be breaking it (which would be the exception rather than the rule) and getting caught in too thick of a melee, thereby temporarily losing your mobility advantage.
Really enjoying the quarantine content! Keep em coming Matt! Cheers from Athens, Greece! :D
I got stabbed through my shield by a pilum once. Fortunately it didn't have a long shank, and so it didn't reach me. That was my Short Shank Redemption.
#BwahHahhHahhHahh
This makes so much more sense. I was in the military. And I always thought it odd that an army would use a "support weapon" on the front lines. Lethality is always a weapons primary purpose.
Well, you can wreak an awful lot of havoc by injuring the enemy. A dead soldier/warrior doesn't call for help. A wounded one does. At least that's what we were taught back in the days.
"This is all conjecture." It's also bleedin' obvious that's what the long thin spike is for! This situation reminds me of the discussions over another weapons subject from another time - The crescent shaped arrow head. It's not "for cutting rope" as that's a ridiculous idea! What does it do best? It's best for shooting at small game on the ground without losing your arrow as it doesn't zip underground like other arrows tend to often do.
This is interesting. As you mentioned Matt like many I've been led to believe the pilum was designed to bend once it hit the target. But if that was the designed intention to reliably bend,the shank would have to be so soft it couldn't be relied on to consistently penetrate. It would hit the shield, the shank would absorb most of the kinetic energy and the pilum would crumple and fall harmlessly to the ground. My guess it would probably hit the human target,even moderately armored and get little to no penetration.
Matt am I thinking correctly on this?
I think bending would owe more to leverage than any kind of weak metal. Butt end stick into the ground with the point stuck in the shield of a man running full tilt will put a lot torque on that shaft.
Hello Matt, I'm not a regular I just happened to see your video and found it interesting... I spent three and half years training as a traditional 'upholder' among the tools an upholder (not upholsterer) uses are these 22" long double-ended buttoning needles... many trainees when inserting these needles into thick layers of leather/fabric/padding can end up penetrating and seriously injuring themselves. Buttoning needles come in two types the round and the square-point... the round depends purely on pressure, the square-point actual cuts and tears... I believe the best use of the pilum is in a thrust, a proper thrush will penetrate through many layers of metal and otherwise particularly with a squarer point... Cheers!
I'm excited for the upcoming pilum videos!
I'm curious about the effectiveness of wicker shields against different weapons. I've seen weapon tests against all sorts of shields, but never wicker. We can assume cultures across Afro-Eurasia wouldn't be using them for such a long time if they didn't stop common weapons, so it would be nice to see them in action.
@Colin Cleveland That seems to have been the norm. If Homer and archaeology is correct Bronze Age Greek shields tended towards layers of hide over a wicker backing.
i remember reading that wicker shields were somewhat annoying for hoplites because their spear would get penetrate easily but get stuck in the shield. this is probably from Xenophon's "Anabasis" or from the journal of the journey of the mercenaries through Anatolia. also i suppose wicker shields are good enough against arrows and Messopotamian armies favored archers.
@@apokos8871 Never run across that but hoplites always had issues with light missile infantry like Thracian peltasts.
Discitus: And a wicker shield is still better than no shield at all.
Ever shot against a wicker archery butt?
Pay attention to how you "mount" the test shield keeping in mind that holding the shield in your arm allows for more dampening than a rigid support. Ideally, the shield is mounted to a heavy spring instead of say a tree. I really look forward to see these experiments. Also, many people say there are many types of shields but few ever go into detail about very many of them. I know talking about shields is a bit tangential but then again maybe you can kill two birds with one stone. Final note/question, is it correct that the Romans used a throwing device with the pilum like a leather thong to extend its range or penetration?
I'm not sure if pilum were used with aumentum but the light javelins of the Early Republic velites certainly did.
We do want a video of Matt talking about leather thongs and penetration, of course... I don't think pila were ever described with a leather strap, but the shorter Verutum was.
That sounds awesome, looking forward to it.
Might want to see if Tod's workshop wants to collaborate, sounds right up his alley.
Always enjoy your reasoned perspectives. Thanks!
This is Thrand, and I totally agree Matt I did a video a wile back to bend or not to bend ? Where I explained the purpose is to pierce shields to hit opponents behind it and better penetration of armours. The bend takes place upon hitting something it can not penetrate normally.
Loved the video Matt. I'm very excited for the experimentation.
One thing I might suggest during experiments with this is to see the pulling out aspect from the shield. If you pull the pilum out straight and take your time, then I would assume you can get it out without bending. However, in an ancient battle situation, a soldier may be trying to yank it out quickly and panicked, as well as trying to do it while close in formation. In that ancient warfare context, I can see how a soldier could bend the shank trying to yank it out and get it really stuck in.
I liked and subscribed based on this video alone! I never questioned the Pilum bending in a shield theory before, but you present an interesting argument. In terms of testing I think a good analogy for a human arm holding a shield could be a spring of varying gauges (maybe a car strut spring). Striking the shield at various angles would be useful but I'm guessing in a real world application people in a battle line would anticipate the main attack coming from directly in front of them and therefore the most common scenario would be a somewhat perpendicular strike. Great content, looking forward to seeing the results!
Thanks Matt! This is a fantastic video, setting-up a fascinating set of future recorded experiments. I really appreciate all of your work, and I'm looking forward to seeing these results!!!
Matt is officially a scientist. Love that level of skepticism and meticulousness!
I love this channel. Thank you for this content and all the hard work you do.
Pilum is brilliant, even if it doesn’t bend, you can’t charge with one stuck in your shield?! Imagine the best pilum thrower (Olympic Javelin).
I believe they were thrown very close to the enemy formation so you can make contact with the enemy line as quickly as possible while they are still trying to pull out plia from their shields and are still moving wounded warriors from the front ranks to the rear.
Not much point in disrupting their shield wall and giving them 20 or 30 seconds to reform before you get into gladius range.
No you can’t. In fact even if it DOESN’T bend, your shield will be terribly heavy and unbalanced. All you can really do is throw the shield away or retreat.
An other pilum video, thank you so much! I really hope there will be much more and at some time you could explain, why it got replaced by the Francisca (after usage of angon). And then, why did the francisca disappeared, people used shields back then and plate wasn t used. This disappearence of close distance throwing weapons is still a mystery for me, they were success full for 1000-2000 years and then gone, why? Thank you very much. Happy easter and stay healthy :).
Can't wait for the next video with information about how gripping and wiggling the shaft works.
I guess these videos on the pilum cannot be praised highly enough. Of all the historical combat youtubers that I know I would rank your channel highest in expertise because you seem to be the most knowledgable (my non-expert impression).
I'm actually curious if a pilum would pierce through shields or/and armor if it doesn't hit flat but if the shield/armor is angled towards the pilum. I think entry angle can make a huge difference in the effectiveness of armor.
Could be one the reasons the Romans preferred curved shields. Generals often spend time thinking about how to counter their own weapons and tactics. Does anyone know evidence either way?
@@Bob-sq1us
It really depends on the energy carried by the pilum as it strikes the surface of the armour. If it has enough energy behind it, it'll pierce the shield/ armour, regardless of the angle of either at the moment of impact. That doesn't mean that this idea is without merit. Not at all. Holding a shield at an angle/ sloping one's armour will necessitate that a projectile be carrying more kinetic energy if it wishes to penetrate.
But then, if it doesn't penetrate, the pilum us likely to skip along the face of the shield and either hit you or the bloke behind you right in the face...
@@Bob-sq1us the curved shield of the scutum is more indication that the Romans believed that every individual soldier needed more individual than unit protection aka expected to be attackable from multiple angles as in standing in a looser formation.
What is the best weapon - long pointy sticks (LPS)
Which LPS are safer for me - shooting LPS with a bow from a distance
What is the best defense against LPS - a really big shield
I'm carrying a big shield and cant use my bow anymore - I need throwable LPS
The enemy have big shields - use multi purpose LPS that stabs them both close up or at distance, or screws up their shields
Pila evolution
the thickness of the archery target could also mean that it wont bend as likely. the depth of the target may supports the metal shaft and therefor avoides lateral movement which could maybe the main reason for eventual bending during the phase where the pilum still has velocity but changes its direction duo to restistance.
But maybe i am wrong.
Context;)
You may want to try Irish War darts, very similar to the pilum and did part of the function of Shield breaking; The Darts are designed to be fired at around 30 Meters and to force shield UP or A Shield formation; It very flexible so the bolt can slide under armor. Usually follow up by a hidden Champion Hand Stones, tailored made Axes and Warhammers that cause internal injuries when they strike the shields.
Great. Totally agree with your Pilum assessment & looking forward to seeing how it performs against various shields. Be good to see your Roman Scutum painted too.
can't wait for Matt's experiments testing the effect of different grips on his shaft :D
Salve amice! I think you're entirely right about the pilum shank not being meant to bend on impact. Grew up with that 'urban legend' myself, but was struck a while ago by the thought that a shank meant to bend that way would SERIOUSLY impede penetration. Beyond the points you made about penetration, with which I wholeheartedly concur, I suspect the pilum was also designed to function well as a melee weapon. The area behind the tang with its concave bevel seems very well suited to accommodate a hand thrusting the spear, and totally unnecessary if the pilum was meant to function as a javelin alone.
I laughed at the fact that someone using a roman style shield was saying he was protected from lots of different Angles.
Angles, Saxons, the list goes on :-D
I remember learning in grade school that they would throw a volley of them to lodge then into enemy shields so they would have to drop them
The idea of the shank not bending at the impact but bending after is actually quite entertaining..
Don't forget that the arm holding the shield will give somewhat under the impact if it's extended, absorbing some of the energy/momentum of the blow but reducing the distance between shield and holder.
Thran did a video on this. He set up a dummy with a shield made of 1/4" plywood with a layer of rawhide front and back. The dummy had butted mail over padding. It was tied up to a post made out of a 4x4. He admitted the butted bail was not historical but said it didn't really matter because the pilum was not going to go through the shield.
He threw the pilum from about 15-20 feet and it went through the shield, through the mail, through the padding underneath the mail, through the balistic gel, through the padding on the backside, through the mail on the backside, and stuck firmly into the 4x4. Pilum are scary.
Most information seems to come from "The military institutions of the romans" by Flavius and translated by John Clarke on kindle. Not much information but seems to have been one of many types of javlins used
2 thoughts: A place to start experimenting would be hit approximations of shield types the romans would face when introducing the pilum. If it didn't work against them, it would have been scrapped.
Second thought, even if the pilum doesn't penetrate deep into the shield at the beginning if the opponent is close he might go for grabbing the shaft and forcing the spear through and into the body? I have no idea if that would be possible in actual fighting but I can imagine the threat.
Its not possible to move with it stuck in your shield, you just have to drop it.
Matt, I like your idea that the pilum is the “unsung hero” of Roman fighting. Even if it is speculation, it makes complete sense! If you look at when they were thrown, it seems to be usually just prior to closing. Even if one didn’t go through your shield, or get stuck in it, the sheer fact of them coming at you may still cause a brief period of chaos and disorder in the ranks affecting your battle plan. I guess I think of like a period flashbang, in that whatever its effect, it takes your attention away from what’s coming at you. By the time you brace, reorganize, plug the gaps in your ranks, get the pilum out of your shield, or whatever, the Roman infantry are already on top of you! Great insight here, love the video and look forward to the tests! : )
Hi Matt, greetings from Los Angeles California, good video.
Perhaps a test of the pilum against a hoplon shield could be interesting, or more correctly a square hoplon cross-section imitation made of wood with leather backing and a very thin layer of bronze on the front.
Being convex helps performance, I imagine.
I'd love to see a video on the soliferrum used in the Iberian peninsula. My understanding is that they were made from solid iron, solely for being compact, heavy, and able to penetrate shields.
If you look at the source material the bending originally was a resullt of replacing one of the two nails that fixed the shaft in place with a wood dowel nail by gaius marius specifically for the purpose of "bending" (more realisticaly breaking and pivoting) and preventing it from being removed. Later on this innovation was incorperated by spot hardening, meaning a portion was left soft specifically to bend. In the reproductions you have, they are likely through hardened throughout the entire shaft, so no, those won't bend drastically and as a result they won't be true to the original early empire/late republic design.
Me: Huh; Matt's not doing as many double entendres as he used to
Matt: "...About as deep as my fist is..."
Me: Ah! There it is!
The pilum may also be thought of as a kind of ram. I imagine shortly before the legionaries meet with an enemy army, the pila are thrown. They either kill right away or are in the enemy's shield. Now the legionnaire can use the pilum again like a stick and push the enemy into his own people. Because of the long tip, the person opposite is either dead or wounded and does not fight back. The legionnaire would be protected anyway by his scutum. The advancing enemy cannot dodge its own impaled man in the crowd and is stopped. This in turn gives the legionnaire the opportunity to advance with the Gladius.
Would this be possible?
The Pilum shank was fixed in the wooden shaft with wooden bolts made to splinter on impact, so that it can't be thrown back at the legionaires. No bending, and easily repaired for next use after the battle.
The Romans used the pilum because it is a heavy javelin that can punch through shields and armor to wound the man behind. Previously most javelins had been light spears basically with a small metal head, designed for a much longer range cast. This allowed a skirmisher to move in, throw, then move back out of range again. The Roman legionaries did not move back out of range though, they moved up, started throwing javelins, and stayed close to the enemy. Unlike skirmishers they were heavy infantry and were not afraid of engaging the main body of the enemy army in melee. Once the enemy had been suitably softened up with many of them killed and wounded and with their shields disabled, the legionaries would draw the gladius and go in to finish them off.
Throwing heavy javelins at close range is far more deadly than casting light javelins at long range. The Roman legionaries were javelin throwers but not skirmishers, they were shock-assault troops overwhelmingly oriented to offensive action.
It's well-known that the original Macedonian phalanxes were equipped and able to use javelins (the old Macedonian national weapon). One can imagine they would have used them similarly on occasion, particularly on sieges or mountainous terrain.
@@tl8211 Yes, in the Greek world soldiers were making increasing use of javelins and shifting away from the old rigid phalanx equipped mainly with the old hasta (the heavy long spear). A number of instances of the old style heavy hoplites being massacred by javelin throwing skirmishers reinforced this trend. When the Romans switched from the long spear to the javelin for their hastati and principi during the Samnite wars this wasn't unique to them but was part of a broad trend across the mediterranean world. The story that they copied the tactic and weapon from the Samnites probably reflects this innovation coming to the rather conservative Romans from abroad and likely being adopted by their enemies ahead of them. The Samnites who were being conquered in these wars dwelt mainly in the central and southern Italian interior and so would have been in contact with the Greeks. This new style of fighting was more mobile and flexible, giving more space to the individual soldier. If anything the Romans seem to have taken to the javelin even more than the Greeks. Many Greek warriors kept on carrying a spear for melee fighting while the Romans dispensed with it entirely except for their reserve troops (and then after Marius reforms dropped it entirely).
The Macedonian phalanx under Philip and his son and successor (and possibly assassin) Alexander of course then shifted back the other way and concentrated on the very long spear, the Macedonian pike or sarissa. This was probably done because the individual Macedonian warrior at the time wasn't as skilful or well-equipped as the average Greek and the tactic of using a dense pike block let them fight as a mass rather than relying so much on individual skill. This tactic was effective because for the Macedonians the infantry was not the most important arm as it was for the Greeks or Romans, instead it was the cavalry that was the battle-winning weapon with them. In Alexander's great battles it was always the action of the cavalry that brought on the victory, the infantry was there to engage and tie down the enemy army so he and his cavalry could strike at the weak spot to collapse the enemy army. Macedonian missile troops were there to harass the enemy and protect the pike phalanx from enemy missile troops. I can well imagine that during Alexander's campaigns in the mountains of Iran the Macedonians shifted back to using javelins a lot more as there were few pitched battles during those campaigns but a lot of storming of fortified towns and guerilla fighting across mountainous terrain.
An interesting hypothesis indeed, can't wait to see the results of further testing. The only thing i would add is perhaps aside from a few different shield simulators, perhaps also a few alternative throwing objects. Like maybe a light throwing spear or a javelin to compare the relative results when compared with the pilum. Cheers Mat, and thanks for touching on a subject that has long held my interest and to be completely frank, i never expected to see it covered on you channel, that was predominantly on medieval subjects.
Part of me thinks that the heavy weight of the front end is there to act as a way of allowing the user to throw the spear up higher and guaranteeing it will fall down tip first at longer range, essentially allowing for users to throw the pilum up high and then charging in quickly, I don't see the unit throwing the pilum at very close range because the most obvious thing for the enemy to do is charge as they are preparing to throw their pila.
So the weighted end acts as guarantee that the pilum will fall tip first nearly every time, considering the user has no ability to do a run up the extra weight adds to the chance that the pilum can be thrown father and will fall down tip first, and means that with the unit can stay cohesive while throwing the pila.
It also means it is more likely to be salvagable after a fight, the pressure is usually at the head of the weapon when it hits so if the pressure is all on a joint then its more likely to break, however if it is all metal then at best it will bend which can be easily repaired by a blacksmith and bent back into shape.
As a character in Asterix once said " My pilum is harder than your sternum"....... oh yes....
What? THe video is already over? I was so into your explanantions i was waiting for you to go outside and start throwing the pilum... :D Looking forward to it
Consider the robustness of the connecting point between the metal and wood sections of the weapon....a huge chunk of wood and metal. It is in a much more balanced (further back) position on the shaft, allowing it to consist of more mass, while not making the point heavy. Skinny piece of metal with a hardened point penetrates better than a thick stick of spear shaft, and is sturdier, lighter, and better balanced. With a thrusting weapon (such as a boar hunting knife) it helps to have a stopper built in so your hand doesn't ride up, Pilum has that. You also don't want it to get stuck in a body. While this seems to get stuck in shields quite well, you could probably tear it right back out of a torso.
Awesome video Matt, channels like this are a cure to the History nerd’s quarantine boredom. However I have to wonder, what is that kidney shaped wooden club thing over your right shoulder for?
Its best to think of the Pilum as a battlefield harpoon.
It just occurred to me, the mention of when it bends while trying to remove it might also show less of a "use" as much as an issue. Let's consider a scenario where you can't just grab a new shield and you have a pilum stuck to yours that you failed to remove. Option A you leave the pilum sticking out straight as it is and you try to use the shield that way. Option B, you give the pilum a good bend if you can't take it out so that it both makes it stick out less and more horizontally and also the point bit on your side of the shield is also less threatening. Option C is no shield at all, just throw your primary defense entirely out. I don't know about you, but if it is an option I am feeling option B much more than the other two.
The leverage thing rather than weak metal is probably why a bend would happen. Any giggling from the wooden section is putting a lot of torque on that shank. If you got hit and it didn't penetrate well at the run and the butt went into the ground you'd have the full weight of a running man applied to that shank with a ton of leverage to boot.
Every weapon is meant to primarily damage the enemy. The shape of pila would be suited of piercing through shields with fairly little resistance, so it's likely designed to penetrate the body of the person behind. The sticking is secondary just like how the bending of plate armor is the secondary effect of using a mace/warhammer in medieval times. Incapacitating is number 1, hindering the opponent is a side effect.
please do also make tests of a Modified Pila-- where the second pin is wooden, and fragile when thrown, an evolution attributed to Marius and his "mules" which seems to have been a significant change. great stuff! thanks much.
Thanks for the info! Love ancient history!!
i'm pretty sure it is to prevent disarmament. spears were everywhere, and if you can chop the tip of a spear off, then they only have a staff. the longer you make the tip the less perpendicular the swipe. once you get an arm's length distance to the tip, opponents can't take the tip off.
Thoughts: If the Pilum punctured a shield but did no initial damage, I think there is a higher chance of injury as gravity takes hold. Due to the longer shaft than standard javelins, the back (wooden) end would drop causing the front end to rise a significant amount thereby increasing the range of injury on the back end of the shield. This wouldn't be significant damage, but an additional effect regardless. I don't suspect with testing that the Pilum would maintain it's angle of entry if thrown into a shield with a narrow depth.
I think it important that you mention the shaft being a similar length of the arm. If a shield was punctured you would not be able to remove the Pilum in one swift motion. This would also cause the enemy army to be slightly disorganized if several members were messing around with removing Pila. One could only imagine the annoyance in a tight formation if the soldier next to you is hitting you with the Pila they are trying to pull out of their own shield.
A final consideration is imagine if the enemy just discarded the shield on the battlefield with the Pila left in. Now it's highly likely the shield would land in such a way that the point of the Pila is pointing upward. A standard javelin would be of no consequence, but a 2 foot long shaft would be like a stake in the ground. Which now has me wondering if there is any evidence of the Romans placing Pila in the ground in front of them as makeshift studes.
Congrats Matt! You actually get it 😃
In "De Bello Gallico" Julius Cesar describes in one battle report what the pila did. The enemy marched towards the stationary legions in tight formations with many shields overlapping. so the volley of pila nailed many shields together. Most of the front row fighters tried in vain to get the pila out of their shields with lots of wiggling and shaking and decided finally to continue the fight without them and, inevitably, getting slaughtered. As getting a straight metal stick out of a shield should normally be no big deal this points to the possibility that the shafts were indeed bending. It would anyway be not very smart to hurl a high tech missile weapon at an opponent and allowing him to throw it right back at you. It would be like nowadays throwing a frag grenade with a 5 sec fuse at an enemy familiar with that specification - it would come right back and detonate immediately.
Additionally, when charging the legions at even a moderate pace, the shaft of the pilum would after shield impact immediately tilt down and get caught in the ground, temporarily stopping its owner and the ranks behind him.
It's always kind of seemed to make sense to me that the 'needle point' design of a pilum was designed to penetrate things-- be it shields, or the many types of armor of the era that wouldn't have been as robust as what the Romans were wearing. It seems to me that the needle-like tip would penetrate primative armors better than a more leaf-shaped or shorter headed javelin would. The bending notion always seemed kind of apocryphal and misinformed to me, even though it's an idea that seems quite clever at first glance.
You know, despite it being mentioned by CONTEMPORARY historians of the time.
A roman reenactor I met one time took a replica pilum and through it at a replica scutum and it SPLIT the scutum down the side. Nasty bit of kit that is.
Hey Mat,
If you test this: please try to record the amount of force that is transfered onto the shield. This will help to determine how much the shield would be pushed onto you, upon impact.
Let me propose another idea, use of pillum before Marijan reform from the perspektive of a target. First you get hit by light velite pilum, pennetration probably similar or lighter than an arrow. Primary function is against lightly armoured oponents and harrassement. These are wery thin and designed to bend If pennetration fails so enemy cant throw them back. Then you get hit by the light pillum. It is designed to penetrate the shield and possibly armour If the person is wearing it. If pennetration of armour fails it bends making the use of the shield in formation less practical. If that fails there is a second heawy pillum that can be used as a traditional spear or thrown. This one is basicly the same with bigger head and more robust. By the time of Trajan it was weighted down for aditional close range throwing pennetration. The pillum is designed by weaker metallic part underneath the head. Ive seen massai throwing spear looking similar, but having squished part behind the long needle near to the handle, having probably simillar function. That opens possibility for first hand account of its use by Massai elders and connect the analogy to the pilum.
Sorry, but you had me at "pointed sticks"...
*"Pointed sticks? Want to know all about pointed sticks, do we? Fresh fruit not good enough, is it?!"*
Oh for the love of LOL
:-D
Another advantage of the soft iron is that if the pilum bends, for whatever reason, the enemy can’t throw it back at you until he has a chance to straighten it
"...about as thick, as deep as my fist is"
"grips the shaft very tightly"
In matters of war and love there are no rules
Glad I'm not the only one here who noticed that one!
*T H A T S M Y F E T I S H*
Squidfish: This brings a whole new mening to the phrase "the Legion was the Iron Fist of Rome" . . .
I enjoy these ones that involve us in your research project.
Just a idea for videos, since we are all stuck in with the covid stuff more challenges like your water bottle cuts but something that involves knives since far more people have access to them.
Thanks for all the work.
Cheers
Here is something for your consideration. A shield wall is lethal at it's spear points. A Roman legion advances against an enemy, at extreme range the front rank launches its pila next rank advances and launches continuing until it reaches the spear points. At least that's how I picture the advance, by the way I believe the heavy pila was specifically for shields and thrown first. I don't think every rank threw at the same time but some sort of volley system, lethality at distance, the strength of a shield wall is its integrity which would just be in chaos. A constant rain of pila and now the guys with swords and shields show up.
A note on the greeting from a Latin nerd. The v in salve should be pronounced like a w: sal-way. Also, salve is for greeting a single person. To greet multiple people, you would say salvete (sal-way-tay).
I think another important factor that is worth considering is that it is a ranged weapon. So even if an enemy is reticent to close with the disciplined ranks of roman soldiers, either for a tactical or psychological reason, the legionary is able to wound the enemy without sacrificing their own position or set conditions to close with the enemy on their terms. In short, I think it offered centurions greater tactical flexibility than most other troops, providing small unit leaders with the tools to problem solve at the small unit level based on the situation.
I think you are spot on. I also think that while the Romans had good gear, the odds are good that over time the variable quality of the metal available and the length of time a particular item was in use and how well maintained it was meant that at some point some pilums were weaker than others and some bent but most didn’t. It makes more sense that the Pilum was designed to be reused and something that bent after one use would be a questionable tactic in an army that is very expeditionary around a long Imperial border.
Not disregarding your theories but here's what I know.
Somewhere on the net I've seen people construct 'breakable' pila. It's quite simple really, just swap one of the iron pins on the shaft with wooden dowel. The pilum breaks upon impact and if it embeds itself in a shield it makes it cumbersome to wield... if it does not penetrate a shield - hey, at least enemies won't be able to throw it back at you =) It goes without saying, but after the battle Romans collected their pila and gave them to the blacksmith at camp to fix them for further use. Also, Roman hastartes wore two throwing spears with them, however one of them was a light spear for throwing from a distance while the pilum was used almost at point blank.
The Stele of the Vultures shows very great shields being used approximately 4500 years ago. (It also appears to show, basically, a Greek phalanx formation). So the technology was even older and more durable than you stated! Outstanding video, though. Looking forward to your experiments. Glad you seem to have recovered! Cheers! www.ancientpages.com/2016/09/01/sumerian-stele-of-the-vultures-oldest-known-historical-records-carved-on-limestone/
The phalanx is one of those near constants in warfare from the Chacolithic period until the rise of the empty battlefield from the American Civil War and Wars of Italian and German Unification in the latter half of the 19th century AD. Even the Roman Legion from the Crisis of the Third Century to the end of the Empire evolved back into a phalanx.