Quick Tip: Caleb's Wild About Wildcat Cartridges
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- čas přidán 7. 09. 2024
- Caleb's been getting funny looks from people.... when he mentions wildcats or "wildcatting." No, he's not going into the oil drilling business, nor is he talking about cougars, panthers, or mountain lions. A wildcat cartridge is any cartridge that's not mass produced by a commercial ammunition manufacturer. They're not obsolete cartridges, those that WERE mass-produced but have since fallen out of production. Handloaders develop wildcat cartridges to fill a need that's not covered by an existing commercially produced round.
For example, the .25-45 Sharps and .277 Wolverine are wildcat cartridges that were developed to fit into the AR-15 platform and offer specific velocity / bullet-size combinations not covered by the existing .223, 5.56 or .300 Blackout loads. (There's also a wildcatter tradition of giving the cartridges clever or colorful names.) Caleb found the .25-45 Sharps to be an awesome deer and hog cartridge when the lived in Louisiana. Bonus: his favorite bolt action hunting rifle at the time was chambered in .257 Roberts, so both of his hunting rifles used the same bullets.
Wildcats are often created simply by necking up or necking down an existing cartridge case to take a different-caliber bullet. Often, the only change that needs to be made to convert a rifle to the wildcat is a new barrel. Once you get reloading dies for your wildcat (along with the necessary brass, bullets, primers and powder), you can set up your press to crank out as much custom ammo as you need.
What's your favorite wildcat caliber? GO!
.277 Wolverine
Would 204 Ruger fit?
Would u consider the ackley improved some of the first wildcats??
300 blk used to be a wildcat. So my fav old one
.277 wlv all the way!! - RED
Never fired or even seen one, but the 22 Eargesplittenloudenboomer has got to be one of the greatest names ever.
Seven shots per barrel. Read about it in one of P.O. Ackleys books
@@graypatriot1299 it’s beautiful
You shoot hoppenbouncenfluffen tails with it.
@CalebSavant , Mark here (Developer of the 277 Wolverine) - thanks for the mention and glad you are enjoying the 277 Wolverine and Wildcatting in general! If you'd ever like to have a chat, just look me up. Thanks!
Hey Mark! We definitely need to talk about that .25 GPC!
@@CalebSavant You got it! We'd love to see you try one out. See you offline.
277 Wolverine, we have 3 of them, have taken many deer 🦌, and hogs with them. 90g supersonic, and 175g subs.
Bryan Grote
0 seconds ago
I’ve been looking at .25-45 Sharps and .277 Wolverine myself. More hitting power with only a barrel change needed and minimal cartridge modification in an AR is a very attractive option.
Love my .277wlv!!!
My go to night rig with Pulsar XM50 & AAC 300TM - RED
My favorite wildcat cartridge is the .277 Wolverine
You might also be interested in the 460 Rowland conversion for the 1911. It puts it right up to 44 mag. Power in a 1911 frame. I got mine last week and am very impressed.
I had no idea you were big into wildcats, more please!
Currently working on a 22x6.8 AR, Based on the 6.8 SPC Case, One of my favorite is the 6mmx45 Based on the .223/5.56 Case, there’s many easy to do wildcards based on the 223/5.56 including the .20x45 that’s a blast on Varmints traveling at over 4000 fps. The brass is free to pickup at the range.
@Daniel Ferguson Much like the Valkyrie without some of the downfall’s, Rich Johnson make some of the best barrels. The SPC is faster because it has about 10% higher capacity and runs at slightly higher pressure. Using a windowed magazine the 22X6.8 can handle the heaviest bullets and can shoot 80's at mag length without the window
@Daniel Ferguson I’ve not messed with that 6.5 so I can’t really weigh in on it, but I’m getting just over 200 fps more in the 6.8 vs the Valkyrie. But the 243LBC Looks fun
The Sharps 25-45 is an easy cartridge to load. You simply gather the common 5.56x45 or Rem 223 brass at the range. You remove the primers and resize them. You next simply clean the cases. The case has always come out in the tolerances required with no neck trimming required.
This neck trimming step is my least favorite step while hand loading and is required after forming 300 AAC brass from from 5.56x45 brass.
Closest I’ve gotten is a cursory interest in 5.7 spitfire in an M1 carbine. Seems like just a silly and fun little round out of a handy little rifle
The only rifle I've ever owned that was truly wildcat was a Winchester model 70 in .257 Ackley Improved. Laser accurate, I hunted with it for a long time.
I love this channel. Short and sweet and to the point. .17 Remington is the closest to a wildcat round I loaded for. Good round
I always had the hots for a .17 44. Never owned one or even have the dies, but loaded lots of .44 Mag. Great for a Contender.
Caleb, .257 Bob is a great round. I'm having a rifle built for it now. I had the throat deepened so I can have 3inch COaL. Both Blackjack and Berger make some nice heavy bullets with real good BCs at 130 and 131 grains. I should be able to push those at around 27 to 2800 fps with Reloader 26. That will carry 1500 ft/lbs at over 300 yards so it should work well on Elk at that distance.
I’ve been reloading for quite a while now & haven’t built a wildcat round yet. Your right though, it’s time to do it.
Great video
7mm T/CU. I used it when I competed in IHMSA Unlimited Class with many 40x40 scores. Effective with 130-140 gr bullets shot from a 14” Contender out to 150 yards for whitetail deer.
Thanks for the learning
The title should be….expensive cartridges 😂
Not expensive if you make them..
I just got a barrel and got into loading for the .277 Wolverine. You’re right about it being fun. I’ve been looking hard at the 25 Sharps too. I don’t hunt deer or hogs but I do love the AR-15 so why not?
I just got a 25-45 sharps 24" barrel because of the large amounts of .223/556 brass available. I have a 5 gallon bucket of it but don't need to load it for that caliber. I also don't like 300 blackout, I just don't see the point. For me the 7.62x39 in my AR is better and cheaper. I first started looking into something to repurpose this brass into and saw the 6mm/223 which was interesting and found that Midway used to sell a complete upper but has since discontinued it. I looked for barrels and they all seem to be coustom builds that were expensive. Then I stumbled onto the 25-45 Sharps, bought the barrel and a Sierra manuel because they were the only ones with load data! I wanted to shoot between 100 and 120 grain bullets in it to give a slight advantage over the .243 diameter bullets. Talking with the guys at SRC they had loaded 117 grain bullets with CFE 223 with good results and this looked promising but he said the load was very compressed. I have 8 pounds of Ram Tac and like it very well in other cartridges so I developed a load with it as follows. 26 grains of Tac, 110 gr FTX, 2575 fps. 117 gr Hornady, 2513 fps. And 120 gr Game King, 2474 fps. No pressure signs and cases were slightly compressed. If you have pet loads you would like to share I would appreciate them. Also feel free to share my results. Here in NC my shots are mostly 100 yards or less and this cartridge should hold around 2000 fps past 250 yards. I'm looking forward to deer season!😉
I always thought the main definition of a wildcat round was something that wasn't SAAMI approved yet. Once it was SAAMI spec'd, it was no longer considered a wildcat. Am I mistaken?
That was my understanding.
Mostly yes, the custom reamer used to cut the chamber may not be to saami spec. I have a 280AI which is now saami cartridge but my chamber predates that and is slightly different, so something to keep in mind.
My dad bought a 30 Herret when I was 14. It was a fun wildcat to load. Have thought about getting one recently.
I hope the 277 wolverine takes off because the Army adopted the 6.8x51 the 277 wolverine is a 6.8 projectile on a 5.56 casing. You get 90% the power of 6.8spc with supers and 80% the suppression benefits of 300blk BUT unlike the 6.8spc it doesn’t require a new bolt head and magazine which is why I plan on making me a QD barrel for my ACR
Been running 25/45 for awhile.
One of the first I ever reloaded.
Due to availability.
J D Jones was probably the most prolific wildcat developer. He designed the 300 whisper which came to be the 300 black out. He has many others with my favorite being the 375JDJ for my contender.
Greetings from north of the medicine line sir, thanks for the video. Back in the '90's I put together a .22-250AI 40° with a Douglas Premium Air Gauged barrel, 'cause that's what the dinosaurs like me did back then. The local coyotes didn't think much of it. Later we picked up a .250AI 40° when our girls started hunting as it was low recoil and muzzle blast for the shooter and way less expensive than a .243 was since nobody else seemed to want a rifle they couldn't buy ammo for at Canadian Tire. Good to see the coffee cup again too by the way. :)
made my first wildcat this year. a 458 WSM. custom barrel in a LR308. puts the hurt on both ends of the rifle. still waiting on my custom resizing dies so I can reload my fire form cases. so far I've worked the load up to 67.5 grains of LT-30 with no excessive pressure signs. case is now full so compressed loads are next
need to get me a chronograph so I can see velocity. software states I should be getting 2400+ fps with a 350 grain bullet and over 4600 lb/ft of energy
only good until about 300 yards or so as it starts to drop off really quick after that. I'm sure a higher BC bullet will do better but they are hard to find in .458 due to the diameter.
I’ve been wanting to build a .270-08 for years. Instead I settled for the 6.8spc, for now.
Wildcat cartridges is one draw of the TC Contender. I have barrels in 17 Ackley Hornet, 22 K Hornet, 6mm x 45, 25 x 225 Win, 6.5 JDJ, 7mm TCU, 7-30 JDJ, & 30-30 AI. Have been thinking about getting an AR-15 barrel in 25x45 or the 25 Ocelot.
Getting ready to do a long loaded 25-204 ruger in an SFAR . Samish case capacity as grendel with 60ksi operating pressure . 1:7.5 twist bbl and 110gr eld-× .
I would love to see a 20mm case necked down to 50 BMG and call it the 50 mad max. Using solid copper projectiles I honestly believe this would be the ultimate long range cartridge. May have to design a new recoil reduction platform but what the hey. All in the fun of it. Also it would have to have a 30 to 34" barrel at minimum to burn of the charge effectively.
It would be sweet but I wouldn't shoot such a monstrosity off-hand standing. It would launch the shooter back 15 feet and break his collarbone and he'd be deaf for a week. It would be really cool if someone did it though.
I inherited a 22 cheetah "mk 1" from my late father in law that he custom built himself...love it for groundhogs and paper punching
My favorite wildcat is 20 vartarg ..221 fireball necked down to 20. Makes for a perfect and very economic varmint gun for game up to coyotes ..and pretty dang flat out to 600 yards
Very cool!
Good topic. Perhaps it should be mentioned that what were wild cat cartridges at one time in many cases are now factory loaded rounds. Today considering the many variations of cartridges out there are so great, it would have to be a special case for me to use a wildcat round. The skills needed for wild catting I might use to make vintage brass that is no longer loaded by the factory. The 300 blackout AAC based on the 300 whisper that was a proprietary cartridge I might make since 5.56 brass is plentiful and cheap vs 300 blackout that is not.
I would say that wild cats and proprietary cartridges in many cases are the same.
I want to dabble a bit in wildcatting, but I'm stumped on how to get a test barrel for a cartridge I have in mind. I have a 25 Sharps for my first AR, and I want to stick with that platform. I've seen some experimentation going on with rounds that sound promising, but they either fizzled out, or I'm on my own for acquiring components with little or no guidance.
Both of my favorite cartridges started off as Wildcats, the .243 and the 25-06.
And a long time favorite of mine....22-250.
220 swift, my absolute favorite cartridge of all time. Stupid fast velocity
My dad was proud of having traded a batch of wildcat cartridges for a horse, and figuring he got the better part of the deal.
7mm tcu started the bug, followed by ackleys in 22-250,257 roberts., 1st ar 20 practical, followed by another barrel by Ritch in 6 x 6.8 spc, hand reamed a h & r handi 44 mag into 445 supermag, have another one that started life as a 17 hmr, now a 17 rem fireball, i mite not be done yet!
left out 6mm rem ack!
I think PO Ackley had the right idea. Taking a known cartridge and blowing out the angles and move the shoulder up. A 7mm-08 Improved would be a good cartridge coming close to the 280 AI as it were.
Agree, I have a .243 Ackley Improved with the 40 degree shoulder. Almost 3900 fps with 70 grain bullets.
Thanks for the uick tip! :)
My favorite wildcat is that AT-4 in your safe.
30-338 win mag. 357 Harret, 6x45 . Then some really far out stiff. 30 Whelen. 284 Roberts....
Nice job 🙂☕👍
Great job
My favorite is the 222 Low-Drag.
260 AI. Great versatility with bullet weights for different game.
40s&w, and 10mm auto, same reason using the same projectile for reloading and the same die! My next rifle is leaning towards the 280AI or the new 7mmPRC! What do you think.
I'm having an already nicely sporterized Kar. 98 8x57 with (to me)a beautiful graft line walnut stock re-barreled to 257 Roberts. I got it dirt cheap because whoever sporterized it left the original military stepped barrel on it and it is in just so-so shape. Some signs of surface rust that has been cleaned off but no pitting and bore is just OK but not great. My question is why has no one, at least that I know of, has put a .257 in a 308W case? Seems like the next logical step to me.
Ain't *Nobody* going to say anything about the random AT-4 anti-tank launcher propped up in the back of the gun safe???
My favorite caliber in a handgun is 38 super so I understand a little
Caleb, when can we get a video on the .22 Eargesplitten Loudenboomer?
Back in the day, wildcat cartridges were based on the brass people left on the ground. Nobody picked up 30-30 brass and some handgun and a few rifle cartridges were based on it. So yea, 30 WCF is my wildcat round. Not a wildcat round you say, it is the way I load it.
I hear if you find it on the shelf it can be pricey.
358 Yeti for the AR platform.
Everyone talkin bout their favorite things to load. No one mentions the AT4 in the safe
Nothing like an older woman.
😂😂
Also: 🤢
I would watch Caleb sell carpeting
Read P.O. Ackley's books on wildcat cartrides they are very educational.
I know this may sound dumb but I wish somebody would wildcat a 5.56x45 or .223 cartridge I think there is allot more ballistics that can be found in the 5.56/223 cartridge, especially in the 5.56x45 with the higher pressures. I am waiting on someone to make a 5.56nato cartridge and use the new Sig 6.8/277Fury case technology, and apply it to the 5.56nato round, with a heavier projectile. there should be some serious improvement done for the 5.56 cartridge at that point
A 6.8 necked down to 5.56 is already a thing, It's the .224 Valkyrie!
I am looking for specs on a .257 Ferret wildcat. I have only seen a picture of one. This is not the .256 Ferret that was the forerunner of the .256 Win Mag which started on a 357 Mag case. This one uses a small rimless case like .223 Rem or .221 Fireball. If anyone knows of this one I would appreciate hearing about it.
Now that we talk about Sharps rifle company. Is their special bolts any good?
THANKS
Caleb, if they ever remake the show Gunsmoke, are you going to play chester? Thanks
Wildcat creation is particularlynuts! Once you make the cartridge you have to get a barrel to chamber it! That's not easy.
It depends. If you know a gunsmith who can chamber and install a barrel. (Brownells sells the rifled blanks) You decide what you want, talk to reamer makers like Clymer about your design, they can make the reamer and send that to RCBS and they can make reloading dies for it and Clymer can probably make the go/nogo gages, if needed.
It is not exactly simple and you will have to figure out your load data and bullet selection. Who knows you might become famous, in our circles, like Ackley and Whelen, though they were much more than that.
But the trick is to develop something that fills a niche not already done, though that has not stopped people anyway.
As an systems engineer for many decades, I have some concerns re how painstakingly and scientifically every single component in the rifle has been verified to have the adequate dynamic structural strength - plus safety margins - for the (almost always) substantially increased pressures and velocities of wildcat loads. In addition, the questions of durability and reliability are significant. I entirely understand that good wildcatters GRADUALLY increase pressures, hopefully to ensure that no catastrophic failures occur. Even this, however, does not resolve the issues if reliability and durability.
There’s are good reasons - some written in blood - that SAAMI specifications exist.
There are programs for that, even several for loading which powders to use, what burn you’ll get from them and an average max pressure. If you handload you already know these risks.
In the development of my pet wildcat, .358 Yeti, along with other wildcat cartridges developed by MDWS and friends, pressure trace equipment is used. I'm sure there's some cowboys out there pulling triggers with long strings on their wildcats, but from my experience in the arena, thats the exception- not the rule.
I would like a 6mm SPC/Valkyrie. I know there is a 6mm ARC, but the bolt is not as robust as I would like. Otherwise, it would be just about perfect.
I went with a 6mm mongoose, based off the 223. Uses standard bolt, and mags. The guys out west are getting deer and coyotes at 350yds and I can vouch for a 600 steel ping about every time. Plus it’s fun to shoot!
Barrels are available from places like x-caliber, DTI, Rich’s Preston rifles, it’s a simple neck down, very nice cartridge
6mm/22 ,6.5mm/06,338/06
For anyone who wants a good laugh look up 338 razorback.
300 Ham’r …. I can load my 300 Ham’r, 300:Blackout,AR10 308 and my 308 bolt action with same 30 caliber bullets…
300 HAM'R leads the way.
6mm dasher
25-06 kampfeld
What about 7mm. STW?
I have an idea but don't know where to start making my own wildcat.
you basically need to be a machinist, or have one available who can make the chamber reamer to match your drawing. Then make a resizing die to match. You can then use a case that is close and resize it to the new shape.
Nowadays you have software like Quickload that can help you get close to the ballistic expectations you’re looking for, before you go out and break stuff.
@@jwilsonhandmadeknives2760 ok, thanks for the info 👍
There is some cad drawings needed and other things.. you might be surprised that someone may have already thought of it and it’s being made somewhere
Actually you just need to create the cartridge first, once you have that many reamer companies can make a reamer based on the cartridge you send them. It is much easier than most people make it out to be!
@@CalebSavant ok cool, thanks caleb.
416x54R
6x45
300 whisper
Didn't the .35Whelan start as a wild cat.
I am pretty sure it did. There are a lot of cartridges that were wildcats. .22-250 and many others.
My question is this...are wildcat cartridges only for shooting wild cats?😉
257 Roberts? You look too young to be from the Jurassic Age. ;-)
Q*
👁️👁️👍🏻
.22 LongBoi
In My Humble Opinion,
EVERYONE in The United States of America NEEDS to Read and UNDERSTAND The Second Amendment of The Constitution of The United States of America. Just MY OPINION here!!
The following is the EXACT text of The Second Amendment of The Constitution of The United States of America:
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.¹
In My Humble Opinion, based on the Text, History, and Tradition, of The Constitution of The United States of America, and The Second Amendment thereof, I believe the following statements to be true to the intentions of the Framers of The Constitution of The United States of America.
As used in The 2nd. Amendment, the phrase "well regulated" means: Well trained in the use of, and maintenance of their arms, and in their ability to follow directions given by a leader.
As used in The 2nd. Amendment, the word "Militia" means: An army of trained civilians, being made up of the entire able-bodied male population of a state between eighteen and forty-five years of age, that may be called on to provide military service in an emergency.
As used in The 2nd. Amendment, the phrase "the right of the people" means: This right is only for the people, not for the State, and not for the Federal government, and as such it is NOT SUBJECT to ANY Rules, Regulations, or Laws created by ANY government in the attempt to Infringe upon, or to Subvert this CONSTITUTIONALLY PROTECTED RIGHT.
As used in The 2nd. Amendment, the word "keep" means: to have; to own; to posses; etc.
As used in The 2nd. Amendment, the word "bear" means: to carry; to bring; to transport; etc.
As used in The 2nd. Amendment, the phrase "shall not be infringed" means: That NO Rules, Regulations, or Laws SHALL be made that restrict the right of the people to keep and bear arms.
Therefore, Based on the Text, History, and Tradition, of The Constitution of The United States of America, and The Second Amendment thereof, We The People of The Unites States of America are The Militia referred to by, and in, The Second Amendment of The Constitution of The United States of America, therefor, the phrase "shall not be infringed" means EXACTLY THAT‼
¹ What this means is that without "the right of the people to keep and bear arms", there would BE NO Militia to help protect the security of a free State.
We The People Have The Right To Keep And Bear Arms to ensure that we can form a Militia if and or when we NEED to do so, to Protect Ourselves², our State, and, if the need arises, our Country from ALL THREATS³, FOREIGN or DOMESTIC in nature.
² This means not only ourselves, this will include family and friends, neighbors, all citizens, and even strangers that may need protection.
³ Such Threats as, but not limited to, an armed Foreign invasion, or a tyrannical government oppressing it's citizens.
The preceding statements, which are based on the Text, History, and Tradition, of The Constitution of The United States of America, and The Second Amendment thereof, are MY opinions and, as such, I understand that it is within the realm of possibility that your opinions might possibly be different from mine‼
Long Live The Constitution of The United States of America‼ Long Live The Second Amendment‼ Long Live The Republic of The United States of America‼
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