pro tip: always keep at least 30 pixels between your open plug ins to prevent them from taking heat damage. also, to prevent them from catching rust its important to keep the dry/wet knob all the way to "dry" at any given time.
That's just a myth. You can run it "wet" as long as you turn it down to "dry" after the session and let it run silent for 30 minutes or so. Just make sure you do this with all your plugins at least once a month.
I'm just waiting for the next step in analog simulation plugins where the developers deliberately cause the plugin's sound quality to degrade over time and you have to pay them *_more money_* to "service it" and restore it to it's original sound quality. _"Mmmmm, I see you need to replace your virtual tubes, that'll be $500."_ 😫
LMAO! For an extra $200 you can have the "Enhanced Progressive Patina" option where vintage rust pigmentation gradually changes over time to a more "warm" lustre.
Big up to Arturia, a well established company, for letting a potentially harsh critic review their stuff. That makes them serious developers in my book.
Arturia are mostly known for making some pretty decent recreations of various synths like the DX7 and the Fairlight CMI. I didn’t know they did FX plugins. They procure the original equipment and analyze it thoroughly. Doctor Mix got one of their R&D subjects once, if I remember correctly it was a Prophet 5 that they kindly gifted to him once they had reverse engineered it.
I am totally surprised of the sound of the sistral EQ. I have never heard such a silky EQ sound. The first digital EQ that sounds different in the first seconds.
luv how musical these plugins are dialed in from the box. Couple of tweaks and boom. Frequencies resonate harmonics very well! Not just "enhance/decrease" going on under the hood. Great for "analog" sound emulation
Valied points on conclusions. 👍 I like vintage GUI interface with screws etc but nothing wrong on both interface possibilities and abilities. End of the day it's up to user how they want to control and interact with the plugin.
Bus Force is a parallel unit intended to be used for effect then blended back into the dry signal. That's why there's not gain compensation. I know it's your schtick, but it's not always a bad thing to read the manual.
But doesn't gain compensation still makes sense in that case? Because if your parallel signal is not different in loudness from your original signal you can mix it in without getting biased by loudness differences. Or not?
As a former owner of a Sitral console (yes there have been consoles :-)) I can confirm: Nothing sounds like a Sitral EQ. It is one of a kind. Its treble band is fantastic. And I waited for a good Sitral emulation. I don't like the Sie-Q from Soundtoys. But this could be the one...
@@alphashokk7998 Yes, I do. They respected the limitations of the hardware cassettes (they modeled 3 in one plugin) with the OPTION to make use of all the digital advantages. That's something I like. I love using stepped knobs, and if I need to dial it back a bit I CAN switch off the steps. But I hate when developers force me to use what they consider "modern". Stepped controls are a true decision booster. StepLESS controls however always seem to ask you "are you sure? not 0.5 dB more? or less? How's about 0.87?" Then, there's the lack of an input stage. THANK YOU Arturia!!! Wanna know why? When Soundtoys made their Sie-Q, everyone was raving about its saturation when you drove it. That was complete bullshit. The W295b was a very, very clean EQ. It was built according to ARD specifications, the national German Broadcasting. They needed a clean tool that would be reliable, not a colour palette on its own. When I measured my EQs using sine waves the first odd harmonic would peak around -72 dBFS. Of course this can vary due to different max. output levels with different interfaces. That's why that whole -18dbFS reference is actually a funny thing. It's always relative. It never relates to a "real" fixed value in the analog world. Anyway, Arturia set their first odd harmonic at around -64 dbFS at a reference level of -9dBFS (which is the required ref.level according to the German DIN nominal level of +6dBu) This seems to be quite accurate as I measured my EQs with a -18dBFS sine wave. It differs by just 1dB (after subtracting 9dB measurement difference), which is fine considering tolerances. So...thumbs up for Arturia's version. Well done. You see, they respected its clean character, unlike Soundtoys, who made it a "drive machine".
@@costinvaly1 I understand your point but you seem to misunderstand mine; If soundtoys created a unique EQ with lots of attitude and character - fine. They are great at what they do. However to model the W295b, call it Sie-Q to make clear what this is supposed to be, even try to match the look and get the knobs right...and then give it a drive control... is just wrong. If I want a saturator I'll get a saturator. If I want a Siemens Sitral, I'll expect a Sitral. Not a hybrid kind of thing. You wouldn't expect an SSL EQ to have a Pultec-style low end or a Neve 1073 to have a tube stage, so why should a Sitral feature a drive knob? You said you wouldn't remember using its treble band. And that pretty much proves me right. You reach for a saturator, not what the Sitral is famous for.
@@costinvaly1 Listen, I didn't insult Soundtoys, I said they are great at what they do...so wth is your problem? I don't have to like every plugin they make. Looks like I really offended you by not liking their Sie-Q but praising Arturia's EQ...🤔 below a video about Arturia's version. "Karen"..."lousy attitude"... Don't you find that bizarre yourself? 🤦
@@costinvaly1 I just said I don't like their Sie-Q. It's my right to not like any plugin out there. I don't have any emotions for Soundtoys. I really don't understand what's the matter with you. Anyway, lets end this pointless conversation here. Your last comment just showed me that you didn't understand the story behind my posts.
I think you missed one of the main features of that Bus Force plugin: There are two other signal chains at the top of the plugin that were muted by default. Seems like their intention is to do pretty radical effects changes, then blend those together with the original track.
I solo the comp get it right then mix in the dry. Then I'll solo the saturation get it right then blend all 3. I love this on my drums. It's hella cpu heavy tho.
Just bought the bundle a few minutes before watching this video. Was little afraid after seeing the title, but happy now and can't wait to play with it when the download is done :D
"It hurts my brain a little bit..." One little skeuomorphic error here, another one there, pretty soon they add up to a whole lot of brain pain. More studies need to be done! But my theory is that issues like this (that can happen several times per minute whilst mixing in the box) keep you in Left Brain mode, when 'being in the zone', and really 'hearing the music' is more of a Right Brain function. I feel your pain!
Arturia FX are top notch! Chorus DIMENSION-D, the delays and reverbs and especially Tape MELLO-Fi are awesome! At first I thought "FX you really need" was corny, but after a while I realized they have a point! 😄
You are so correct with what you are saying about the toggles. It actually has a name in design: its called Affordance. When a thing suggest how it should be used by design based on our mental models of it
I always hear the same remarks: the interface, why screws, why knobs, vu meters... And I understand, it's a very personal matter. To me, it's the other way around. This image (plugins that look like hardware) inspires me personally. It's not always a good thing for developers, because I expect it to sound fantastic and sometimes I'm disappointed. I have hardware and plugins that emulate hardware. For me, if the filters are good, if the compression sounds good, I'm happy. For example, the SSL native channel strip (plugin) it looks good and makes me want that sound, it make me want that punch and pushes me to search/work until I get what I want. Fortunately, the plugin is good and delivers. And no, I didn't choose it for how it looks, I chose it for how it sounds. Anyway, good review. Thanks for it. Cheers
I understand both sides growing up using Reason, a DAW drowning in skeuomorphism. I agree that good design can be inspiring and it can (and should) indirectly explain how a device works, what route for example a signal takes through a synth (from oscillator to adsr to filter etc) Great for beginning producers. It does however take up a lot of space which can hinder your productivity. To view a full effects rack in Reason I would need 2 screens to have them all visible at the same time. Ableton Live can show the same amount using maybe 1/8 of one screen. I do wonder if design can have the placebo effect of sounding ""analog"" just by looking like old junk with some screws :P
It's one of the reasons why Reaper is so good. The very plain, utilitarian visual design that seems to underplay how immensely powerful its features are.
I'm using the bundle on a project where all of the sounds are produced via Microfreak. The sounds I'm using are all very 'gritty', complex. The Sitral and Busforce helped me to get them to work well together. I'm not completely convinced by the large EQ, but I'm used to the UAD Lexicon, which feels a bit 'meatier', for lack of better term. At any rate, I'm well-pleased with what I've ended up with. Now to add my trumpet into the mix. Hmmmm. . . .
When they announced FX Collection 2, the thing I was most interested in was the Neve comp but honestly, the one that impressed me the most was the Sitral EQ. Bus Force is also a nice plug-in, but I rather do parallel comp/saturation etc. by routing directly in the DAW. The only thing Sitral is missing IMO is oversampling, preferably with different online/offline settings. Would make sense to have it in Bus Force aswell, but it does have linear phase mode which I guess uses some kind of OS filter.
Hi Wytse, changed your mind on how "to switch", drag or click (11:10 ...)? In the Black Box HG2 vid you expected just to click (2:40 ...). Two different user experiences on the same behaviour makes interfaces differently friendly?
question, are the songs you use as example completely finished in terms of mixing and mastering? So are you doing actions while testing the plugin you would actually do in a mixing session?
From wikipedia: "Sandstorm is an instrumental by Finnish DJ and record producer Darude. It was released as the lead single from his debut studio album Before the Storm. It was initially released in Finland on 26 October 1999 by 16 Inch Records and was later re-released in many other countries in 2000. " ;)
Completely agree with not laying (virtual) rack units one on top of the other with no ventilation space between them. While using the Sitral 295, the heat that was emanating from my monitor was so much that I needed a fan to cool them (and me) down. How can these be allowed into production with such a blatant design flaw?
I love the Siemens 295B pair. Inductor EQ's. I have to brush the pixels off them, together with the dust, but its worth it. I thought of flush-mounting them into the screen, so I don't have to turn my head to use them, since they end up on every mix. Thanks for making me smile, brother :D
Today's Darude Sanstorm Track sounds like a cross between Al Jarraeu's Boogie Down and Mezzoforte's Garden Party. WHICH I rather enjoyed. Nice Arturia FX too of course.
I’m with you on the unnecessary GUI details. And I also agree that by now, every single plug-in should have automatic gain conversation as a default feature. It should just be standard like seatbelts.
I like the skeuomorphic stuff like the wood paneling and the whole rack-mount look bc I'll never have a studio full of vintage analog gear, and while these plugins are doing their best to emulate the sound, it's a nice kind of ambience to have the visual cues to go along. You can almost pretend, lol. But I fully agree, usability trumps fake screw holes and shiny encoders, no doubt. I'd rather have a simple, original visual design with the best user experience over the inverse. Hi Fabfilter.
@@jamescuttsmusicjcm5013 I literally have Arturia V Collection 8 and Pigments 3 both uninstalled, deactivated and deregistered from my Arturia account (in preparation of reselling them on to other users) to suggest otherwise. Arturia's V Collection are nothing compared to my complete 'u-he' plugin collection paired with Modartt Pianoteq Studio bundle. Throw in some of my other plugins like Dune 3, Phase Plant, Vital and Arturia's Pigments 3 also becomes largely redundant (inferior in both sound quality and performance to my other stuff). So for my purposes, Arturia are superfluous to requirements, and so may as well be snake oil, as they are inferior to everything else I own, more superficial style rather than substance (and that's with only 'some' of my other owned software, that I've mentioned here).
@@Music-tg5is I own all of those plugins. Still don't agree. But whatever floats your boat :D. EDIT: I was specifically referring to their FX collection though - deffo not snake oil.
legend has it that Arturia plugin GUIs are so detailed, you could theoretically zoom in until you see each individual molecule of paint. And that's of course the most important thing in my workflow which is to make no music. I can't wait till they put the Far Cry engine in there and model the studio, studio lounge, and the toilet cause when ya gotta go, ya gotta go. It bothers me that the rack gear is just sitting on the counter. My mixes would translate better if they were secured in rack rails. To see the rack ears empty makes me nervous. I hope they at least have used SPICE equipment to model some audiophile monster cables.
Again a great review !! I think the bundle is a bargain. I personally like the spring reverb and the bucket brigade delay a lot. But those rack-ears are ridiculous...maybe they will rust after a three-year period of heavy use (or if you place your monitors in the bathroom...) I guess from the point of user friendliness you wouldn´t like the UAD plugins. Some are really way too small - not resizable. The Arturias you can scale up to your needs which should be mandatory in 2021.
Great videos! So knowledgeable and realistic thank you. Do you have a video explaining what analog gear is “really doing” - and why that makes it hard/impossible to fully emulate digitally?
Seems like when you are in stereo mode, you only need to mess with the top one. Makes sense. Notice how the gain reduction of the 609 kicks in on both channels when you turn the top threshold.
I picked up the first bundle last year during a sale. Ive barely used it. I have way too many vsts. Because i own a lot of their software I have a great upgrade price. Not sure i want to upgrade to something I’m barely using but ill demo it and maybe. I LOVE the Arturia sound but their plugins are always way too CPU heavy so while i like the sound they aren’t plugins i will actually use because of the CPU hit.
This is going to sound crazy but I never knew Neumann Made any vintage EQs or hardware period until I started watching this channel. I fell into a rabbit hole and I now know that sound anywhere. The Antelope Nuemann EQs are truly great for mid range, but That SITRAL-295 is seriously vintage.
The thing with these "analog" style plugins is that they force you to work in a different way, if you're limited in range (or visual feedback) and have to "turn" the knobs you'll get different results. I absolutely get your criticism but if you like how fabfilter works then use fabfilter (I use Neutron for the more "chirurgical stuff). I tend to use different styles of plugins for different jobs, it forces you to think out of the box, just like swapping instruments for composing.
I bought a "brand new" Moog Slim Phatty. Rusty. It had been dropped. Looked more like it had been used for football. Didn't improve it in any way. And believe me in terms of usability it left a lot to be desired. Back to the shop.
Whoa who said you have a personality disorder? You just give your own insight on new plugins and are brutally honest about it. Nothing wrong with that at all, even if I disagree sometimes (big uad fan here lol). Keep at it man appreciate your content!
I would personally be quite interested in a video series going into the details of why analog emulation doesn’t work, not guaranteeing it would even make sense to me but I would love to hear me about that from someone like yourself who clearly knows what they are talking about 🤘
Not sure why a plugin designed to be used on a parallel bus would need makeup gain. I know it's standard in most compressors but you are likely going to have to mix it in with the dry signal regardless?
It could just be useful for workflow if you want to keep your level on that bus when you are adjusting parameters frequently. Once you mix it in if you want to adjust a parameter it would be nice to be able to keep it at the same level instead of having to re-adjust the gain. IDK I still haven't gotten to that part.
Ah, I was thinking automatic gain compensation. Makeup gain is just so it doesn't get too quiet or loud so when you mix it in it's not too quiet for the faders or clipping.
i have often wondered why plugin publishers dont offer different skins ...so 1 straight to the point and the other more fancy.......ohmboyz used to do it
Hi, two ideas for videos: 1. Your opinion about frequencies, where is the Magic for different instruments, if there is in general? And what do you think about masking frequencies and your workflow to handle it. 2. Review of the Balance Mastering Magpha Eq, I’m really interested if you can hear it in a blind test. No one does a video about it until today, bit too me it’s a game changer in the box, especially how it handles transients. Thanks and greets
Thanks for checking out stuff. Just a small thought from my side. I do not care if there are scratches on the UI or on a table. Why not focusing only how it sounds? Sometimes I think you are too hard with you criticizing so you should take into account the huge effort developers and companies invest to their products and pay more respect for their work. Anyhow thanks 🙏
You're actually a funny guy, I like the dry sarcasm. have really enjoyed your plugin videos, have watched most of them now. I don't always agree, but if I did it would be boring! Cheers
I must apologize if this more obvious than I might think it is as a computer programmer, but when you allow a user to draw curves, that's a very different and in some ways more difficult thing to deal with. If you can only turn knobs and click buttons and drag sliders, then the plugin can very easily read that as simple numerical value inputs and can then pass that on as inputs into the algorithms manipulating the sound. But if you draw a curve, the computer has to analyze that curve with complex mathematical formulas to interpret values along it at certain intervals, then it can finally plug those into the algorithms actually manipulating the sound, which may also consequently have more variables coming from user input to process and then output correct results from. It's just harder to develop, debug, and test. In the worst case it could take time away from the most important part of the plugin: the code actually manipulating the sound data, often in real time as the user or automations are adjusting the controls. It's very cool when done well like in Fabfilter though, and with modern coding techniques I do think Arturia could easily build some proprietary and very flexible code libraries to do it with a lot of their plugins, they just aren't thinking outside the hardware they're obsessed with modelling enough. With the exception of the Pigments development team, perhaps.
Melda MSpectralDynamics... I love it - unique, and incredibly useful! (I just remembered it was you who introduced me to it... I now have a dozen Melda plugz!!)
Yeah Melda plugins are the Pringles of the audio world... Once you pop, you can't stop (until you've eaten all of them). Their freebie set is definitely worth the $50.
@@StudioLams I went down the rabbit hole and bought MXXX Core (on sale of course!). Now instead of thinking "I wish there was a plugin that could..." I just put on my lab coat and build my own!
What happens if you uninstall and reinstall? Does it remember your previous rust state or does it start with a fresh coat of paint? How would it detect the humility level? This would affect the rust rate. Should there be an option to repaint it and remove the rust? These things are not "trivial". Much thought must go into this groundbreaking feature as this is truly the bridge between the digital world and the analog world. 🤔😂
I think the design portion is partly for the nostalgia, partly for the ease of having a bunch of plugins open making it easy to find and lastly making it easier for non-professionals who might buy the product. Arturia does make good stuff though.
It bothers me that these units are shown sitting on a wood table, and not mounted in a rack. That's so not-pro. I build all my own furniture, I would NOT use these units unmounted, and risk scratching my desktops. Plus that extra border space around the unit is just wasted space. Screen space is precious! These may seem like frivolous comments, but they just undermine my confidence in this plugin in package. I'm an Arturia Keylab owner, I love their synth models, and I do like skeuomorphic interfaces.
I know we don't want rust on a brand-new product, but I do think there is a lot to say for familiar graphical user interface controls. When I see a dial with a white center-line, I know exactly what it does.
The next level of analog simulation will have not only the rack mount unit hanging into your desktop, but a virtual drink sitting next to it which you can spill into the circuits for various circuit destruction effects.
@@kutchutozov haha yeah the rack scratches are a "nice" touch and the rack ears are totally pointless. By I can overlook these cosmetics for the sounds quality of their FX and instruments.
I agree that these company's should really change their interface's. Like we get it, it's a analog based vst but it doesn't make sense to have 20 knobs to control a EQ if u can draw it much faster. At that point ur just making it harder for the consumer vs looks, which is stupid. But yeah it still seems like a trend at all these Analog vst company's sadly.
I personally disagree *in certain scenarios*. I love that fab filter is the way it is and will go for that 70% of the time, but when im just trying to liven up a sound or a whole mix without thinking about it to much I think its helpful to have some eqs with well tuned fixed frequency bands and curves to keep from overthinking it or mixin with my eyes. Still, there is a point. Like if an eq plugin truly has 20 knobs then yea, that sucks. but 3 bands and a high and low pass with knobs that arent tiny, works for me.
I too am worried about proper ventilation on my VST plugins. The Arturia graphics design team could have easily photoshopped some much needed vent holes to prevent overheating problems so common with VST effects these days.
This need for speed, client is waiting thing can be a pain and sometimes counter productive. Deadlines are of course walls that are difficult to get out of but most times with a little diplomacy it’s possible. The whole skeuomorphic thing is very much a question of taste - maybe I’m just a Luddite - but it appeals to me. And if you really know your software then it shouldn’t slow you down If there’s a need for speed. Once again great review. Thanks.
pro tip: always keep at least 30 pixels between your open plug ins to prevent them from taking heat damage. also, to prevent them from catching rust its important to keep the dry/wet knob all the way to "dry" at any given time.
That's just a myth. You can run it "wet" as long as you turn it down to "dry" after the session and let it run silent for 30 minutes or so. Just make sure you do this with all your plugins at least once a month.
Always remember to warm up your daw for like 20 minutes before opening any plugins.
But if you run your mix very hot you don’t have to be worried about it at all.
You guys need to upgrade. With windows 95 none of this is necessary
I'm just waiting for the next step in analog simulation plugins where the developers deliberately cause the plugin's sound quality to degrade over time and you have to pay them *_more money_* to "service it" and restore it to it's original sound quality.
_"Mmmmm, I see you need to replace your virtual tubes, that'll be $500."_ 😫
Jheeze don't even suggest that lol
LMAO! For an extra $200 you can have the "Enhanced Progressive Patina" option where vintage rust pigmentation gradually changes over time to a more "warm" lustre.
Waves come to mind for that one !
Something Waves had in mind with their bloody "upgrade plan" :-(
Great idea ! Let escalate it, but keep the credit for it, they will come for you :’j
Big up to Arturia, a well established company, for letting a potentially harsh critic review their stuff. That makes them serious developers in my book.
When you know your products are great, you have nothing to fear! Arturia plugins are on top league, up there with the very best
The music at 5:03 put me in a unreasonably good mood.
that music has so nice pokemon/nintendo vibes
Best versions of Sandstorm yet.
Rusting makes analog analogish
Arturia are mostly known for making some pretty decent recreations of various synths like the DX7 and the Fairlight CMI. I didn’t know they did FX plugins. They procure the original equipment and analyze it thoroughly. Doctor Mix got one of their R&D subjects once, if I remember correctly it was a Prophet 5 that they kindly gifted to him once they had reverse engineered it.
I am totally surprised of the sound of the sistral EQ. I have never heard such a silky EQ sound. The first digital EQ that sounds different in the first seconds.
luv how musical these plugins are dialed in from the box. Couple of tweaks and boom. Frequencies resonate harmonics very well! Not just "enhance/decrease" going on under the hood. Great for "analog" sound emulation
Valied points on conclusions. 👍 I like vintage GUI interface with screws etc but nothing wrong on both interface possibilities and abilities.
End of the day it's up to user how they want to control and interact with the plugin.
Bus Force is a parallel unit intended to be used for effect then blended back into the dry signal. That's why there's not gain compensation. I know it's your schtick, but it's not always a bad thing to read the manual.
But doesn't gain compensation still makes sense in that case? Because if your parallel signal is not different in loudness from your original signal you can mix it in without getting biased by loudness differences. Or not?
As a former owner of a Sitral console (yes there have been consoles :-)) I can confirm: Nothing sounds like a Sitral EQ. It is one of a kind. Its treble band is fantastic.
And I waited for a good Sitral emulation. I don't like the Sie-Q from Soundtoys. But this could be the one...
did you liked it?
@@alphashokk7998 Yes, I do. They respected the limitations of the hardware cassettes (they modeled 3 in one plugin) with the OPTION to make use of all the digital advantages. That's something I like. I love using stepped knobs, and if I need to dial it back a bit I CAN switch off the steps. But I hate when developers force me to use what they consider "modern". Stepped controls are a true decision booster. StepLESS controls however always seem to ask you "are you sure? not 0.5 dB more? or less? How's about 0.87?"
Then, there's the lack of an input stage. THANK YOU Arturia!!! Wanna know why? When Soundtoys made their Sie-Q, everyone was raving about its saturation when you drove it. That was complete bullshit. The W295b was a very, very clean EQ. It was built according to ARD specifications, the national German Broadcasting. They needed a clean tool that would be reliable, not a colour palette on its own. When I measured my EQs using sine waves the first odd harmonic would peak around -72 dBFS. Of course this can vary due to different max. output levels with different interfaces. That's why that whole -18dbFS reference is actually a funny thing. It's always relative. It never relates to a "real" fixed value in the analog world. Anyway, Arturia set their first odd harmonic at around -64 dbFS at a reference level of -9dBFS (which is the required ref.level according to the German DIN nominal level of +6dBu)
This seems to be quite accurate as I measured my EQs with a -18dBFS sine wave. It differs by just 1dB (after subtracting 9dB measurement difference), which is fine considering tolerances.
So...thumbs up for Arturia's version. Well done.
You see, they respected its clean character, unlike Soundtoys, who made it a "drive machine".
@@costinvaly1 I understand your point but you seem to misunderstand mine; If soundtoys created a unique EQ with lots of attitude and character - fine. They are great at what they do. However to model the W295b, call it Sie-Q to make clear what this is supposed to be, even try to match the look and get the knobs right...and then give it a drive control... is just wrong. If I want a saturator I'll get a saturator. If I want a Siemens Sitral, I'll expect a Sitral. Not a hybrid kind of thing. You wouldn't expect an SSL EQ to have a Pultec-style low end or a Neve 1073 to have a tube stage, so why should a Sitral feature a drive knob? You said you wouldn't remember using its treble band. And that pretty much proves me right. You reach for a saturator, not what the Sitral is famous for.
@@costinvaly1 Listen, I didn't insult Soundtoys, I said they are great at what they do...so wth is your problem? I don't have to like every plugin they make. Looks like I really offended you by not liking their Sie-Q but praising Arturia's EQ...🤔 below a video about Arturia's version. "Karen"..."lousy attitude"... Don't you find that bizarre yourself? 🤦
@@costinvaly1 I just said I don't like their Sie-Q. It's my right to not like any plugin out there. I don't have any emotions for Soundtoys. I really don't understand what's the matter with you. Anyway, lets end this pointless conversation here. Your last comment just showed me that you didn't understand the story behind my posts.
You are so on it, only saw the advert this morning and screenshotted to remember to check it out.
I think you missed one of the main features of that Bus Force plugin: There are two other signal chains at the top of the plugin that were muted by default. Seems like their intention is to do pretty radical effects changes, then blend those together with the original track.
I solo the comp get it right then mix in the dry. Then I'll solo the saturation get it right then blend all 3. I love this on my drums. It's hella cpu heavy tho.
@@kyledege315 Might as well just do it manually with a Chain
Just bought the bundle a few minutes before watching this video. Was little afraid after seeing the title, but happy now and can't wait to play with it when the download is done :D
Demo first.
"It hurts my brain a little bit..." One little skeuomorphic error here, another one there, pretty soon they add up to a whole lot of brain pain. More studies need to be done! But my theory is that issues like this (that can happen several times per minute whilst mixing in the box) keep you in Left Brain mode, when 'being in the zone', and really 'hearing the music' is more of a Right Brain function. I feel your pain!
Even when there's no fake rust, we still get a pretty good fake rust rant. LOL. I love it!
Adding the capability to click the curve would totally win me over the appeal of software vs hardware. (Aside from cost savings etc.)
how do you set up your mic to get rid of the sound from the speaker without wearing headphones?
Arturia FX are top notch! Chorus DIMENSION-D, the delays and reverbs and especially Tape MELLO-Fi are awesome! At first I thought "FX you really need" was corny, but after a while I realized they have a point! 😄
You are so correct with what you are saying about the toggles. It actually has a name in design: its called Affordance. When a thing suggest how it should be used by design based on our mental models of it
Which is why every Low Pass Filter should have a T Bar to control the cut-off :)
A nearly perfect test of this plugin, well done!
I always hear the same remarks: the interface, why screws, why knobs, vu meters... And I understand, it's a very personal matter.
To me, it's the other way around.
This image (plugins that look like hardware) inspires me personally. It's not always a good thing for developers, because I expect it to sound fantastic and sometimes I'm disappointed.
I have hardware and plugins that emulate hardware. For me, if the filters are good, if the compression sounds good, I'm happy.
For example, the SSL native channel strip (plugin) it looks good and makes me want that sound, it make me want that punch and pushes me to search/work until I get what I want. Fortunately, the plugin is good and delivers.
And no, I didn't choose it for how it looks, I chose it for how it sounds. Anyway, good review.
Thanks for it.
Cheers
I understand both sides growing up using Reason, a DAW drowning in skeuomorphism. I agree that good design can be inspiring and it can (and should) indirectly explain how a device works, what route for example a signal takes through a synth (from oscillator to adsr to filter etc) Great for beginning producers.
It does however take up a lot of space which can hinder your productivity. To view a full effects rack in Reason I would need 2 screens to have them all visible at the same time. Ableton Live can show the same amount using maybe 1/8 of one screen. I do wonder if design can have the placebo effect of sounding ""analog"" just by looking like old junk with some screws :P
That's exactly why I hate Melda's UI
It's one of the reasons why Reaper is so good. The very plain, utilitarian visual design that seems to underplay how immensely powerful its features are.
skeuomorphic design can be helpful, but it can also be a hindrance
I'm using the bundle on a project where all of the sounds are produced via Microfreak. The sounds I'm using are all very 'gritty', complex. The Sitral and Busforce helped me to get them to work well together. I'm not completely convinced by the large EQ, but I'm used to the UAD Lexicon, which feels a bit 'meatier', for lack of better term. At any rate, I'm well-pleased with what I've ended up with. Now to add my trumpet into the mix. Hmmmm. . . .
You were in a good mood today! Fun to watch.
Thank you for the excellent video!
Btw you can disable the stepped controls on all Arturia plugins in the toolbar on the bottom for continuous values!
I really like the FX bundle so I updated this morning. I haven't had time to do much today, but I will be surprised if I don't love 'em.
I’m excited to try these, especially the bus force one
When they announced FX Collection 2, the thing I was most interested in was the Neve comp but honestly, the one that impressed me the most was the Sitral EQ. Bus Force is also a nice plug-in, but I rather do parallel comp/saturation etc. by routing directly in the DAW. The only thing Sitral is missing IMO is oversampling, preferably with different online/offline settings. Would make sense to have it in Bus Force aswell, but it does have linear phase mode which I guess uses some kind of OS filter.
Hi Wytse, changed your mind on how "to switch", drag or click (11:10 ...)? In the Black Box HG2 vid you expected just to click (2:40 ...). Two different user experiences on the same behaviour makes interfaces differently friendly?
I would have liked to see more than 20 seconds of the 609.
question, are the songs you use as example completely finished in terms of mixing and mastering? So are you doing actions while testing the plugin you would actually do in a mixing session?
From wikipedia: "Sandstorm is an instrumental by Finnish DJ and record producer Darude. It was released as the lead single from his debut studio album Before the Storm. It was initially released in Finland on 26 October 1999 by 16 Inch Records and was later re-released in many other countries in 2000. " ;)
Love your work mate, you make perfect sense for the stupid little things that will eventually cause you to snap😅
One thing that bugs me about Arturia's plugins is the lack of oversampling option.
Completely agree with not laying (virtual) rack units one on top of the other with no ventilation space between them. While using the Sitral 295, the heat that was emanating from my monitor was so much that I needed a fan to cool them (and me) down. How can these be allowed into production with such a blatant design flaw?
Are these mainly for mastering purposes? Would you use them on individual tracks as well?
I think the fx collection is great for sound design personally as a producer.
I have the SoundToy’s Sei-Q which is an emulation of the Seiman w295b. I may still try this out
Make those 10 videos explaining the differences between analog gear and plugins. Don’t keep us in suspense. If it’s super interesting, please share.
Agree.... digital is an amazing space right now.
Anyone know what track is being used during Comp Diode and Bus Force?
I love the Siemens 295B pair. Inductor EQ's. I have to brush the pixels off them, together with the dust, but its worth it. I thought of flush-mounting them into the screen, so I don't have to turn my head to use them, since they end up on every mix. Thanks for making me smile, brother :D
Could you please review the Focusrite Fast Bundle? Thanks!
I love mstereospread. It sounds crazy but it sound so good on bass when you just spread the overtones a little bit.
Today's Darude Sanstorm Track sounds like a cross between Al Jarraeu's Boogie Down and Mezzoforte's Garden Party. WHICH I rather enjoyed. Nice Arturia FX too of course.
All those EQ pushes sounded so soft...
Very nice
I was really impressed with the EQ SITRAL-295. One of the very few ones that can be considered "Musical" imo.
Looks like negative compression on the bus force?
I’m with you on the unnecessary GUI details. And I also agree that by now, every single plug-in should have automatic gain conversation as a default feature. It should just be standard like seatbelts.
But then no one would buy these snake oil plugins again.
I like the skeuomorphic stuff like the wood paneling and the whole rack-mount look bc I'll never have a studio full of vintage analog gear, and while these plugins are doing their best to emulate the sound, it's a nice kind of ambience to have the visual cues to go along. You can almost pretend, lol. But I fully agree, usability trumps fake screw holes and shiny encoders, no doubt. I'd rather have a simple, original visual design with the best user experience over the inverse. Hi Fabfilter.
@@Music-tg5is Arturia are so far away from snake oil. lol!
@@jamescuttsmusicjcm5013 I literally have Arturia V Collection 8 and Pigments 3 both uninstalled, deactivated and deregistered from my Arturia account (in preparation of reselling them on to other users) to suggest otherwise. Arturia's V Collection are nothing compared to my complete 'u-he' plugin collection paired with Modartt Pianoteq Studio bundle.
Throw in some of my other plugins like Dune 3, Phase Plant, Vital and Arturia's Pigments 3 also becomes largely redundant (inferior in both sound quality and performance to my other stuff).
So for my purposes, Arturia are superfluous to requirements, and so may as well be snake oil, as they are inferior to everything else I own, more superficial style rather than substance (and that's with only 'some' of my other owned software, that I've mentioned here).
@@Music-tg5is I own all of those plugins. Still don't agree. But whatever floats your boat :D.
EDIT: I was specifically referring to their FX collection though - deffo not snake oil.
legend has it that Arturia plugin GUIs are so detailed, you could theoretically zoom in until you see each individual molecule of paint. And that's of course the most important thing in my workflow which is to make no music. I can't wait till they put the Far Cry engine in there and model the studio, studio lounge, and the toilet cause when ya gotta go, ya gotta go. It bothers me that the rack gear is just sitting on the counter. My mixes would translate better if they were secured in rack rails. To see the rack ears empty makes me nervous. I hope they at least have used SPICE equipment to model some audiophile monster cables.
?
Again a great review !! I think the bundle is a bargain. I personally like the spring reverb and the bucket brigade delay a lot. But those rack-ears are ridiculous...maybe they will rust after a three-year period of heavy use (or if you place your monitors in the bathroom...)
I guess from the point of user friendliness you wouldn´t like the UAD plugins. Some are really way too small - not resizable. The Arturias you can scale up to your needs which should be mandatory in 2021.
Great videos! So knowledgeable and realistic thank you. Do you have a video explaining what analog gear is “really doing” - and why that makes it hard/impossible to fully emulate digitally?
what do you say to the statement that "fabfilter pro-q sounds like ass if you compare it to lets say a weiss eq mp" ?
Seems like when you are in stereo mode, you only need to mess with the top one. Makes sense. Notice how the gain reduction of the 609 kicks in on both channels when you turn the top threshold.
It looks great. I'll test a demo someday.
Thanks for a review!
I picked up the first bundle last year during a sale. Ive barely used it. I have way too many vsts. Because i own a lot of their software I have a great upgrade price. Not sure i want to upgrade to something I’m barely using but ill demo it and maybe. I LOVE the Arturia sound but their plugins are always way too CPU heavy so while i like the sound they aren’t plugins i will actually use because of the CPU hit.
Insightful and amusing, as always!
This is going to sound crazy but I never knew Neumann Made any vintage EQs or hardware period until I started watching this channel. I fell into a rabbit hole and I now know that sound anywhere. The Antelope Nuemann EQs are truly great for mid range, but That SITRAL-295 is seriously vintage.
The thing with these "analog" style plugins is that they force you to work in a different way, if you're limited in range (or visual feedback) and have to "turn" the knobs you'll get different results. I absolutely get your criticism but if you like how fabfilter works then use fabfilter (I use Neutron for the more "chirurgical stuff). I tend to use different styles of plugins for different jobs, it forces you to think out of the box, just like swapping instruments for composing.
the sound matters more lol
i would love to see a review of logics vintage eq collection
Curious to see what you think about UVI shade I know people that swear by it and ditched fab filter
I have been using the new additions and they sound so great. For those wondering. I love it so far
Shootout!!! UAD vs Arturia vs Softube. A few plugs come in mind: 33609, 1176, 1073, db165.
I bought a "brand new" Moog Slim Phatty. Rusty.
It had been dropped. Looked more like it had been used for football.
Didn't improve it in any way. And believe me in terms of usability it left a lot to be desired.
Back to the shop.
Whoa who said you have a personality disorder? You just give your own insight on new plugins and are brutally honest about it. Nothing wrong with that at all, even if I disagree sometimes (big uad fan here lol). Keep at it man appreciate your content!
I would personally be quite interested in a video series going into the details of why analog emulation doesn’t work, not guaranteeing it would even make sense to me but I would love to hear me about that from someone like yourself who clearly knows what they are talking about 🤘
Not sure why a plugin designed to be used on a parallel bus would need makeup gain. I know it's standard in most compressors but you are likely going to have to mix it in with the dry signal regardless?
It could just be useful for workflow if you want to keep your level on that bus when you are adjusting parameters frequently. Once you mix it in if you want to adjust a parameter it would be nice to be able to keep it at the same level instead of having to re-adjust the gain. IDK I still haven't gotten to that part.
Ah, I was thinking automatic gain compensation. Makeup gain is just so it doesn't get too quiet or loud so when you mix it in it's not too quiet for the faders or clipping.
Is that Siemens EQ the same model used in soundtoys SIE-Q?
Yeah pretty much, but they all sound different.
i have often wondered why plugin publishers dont offer different skins ...so 1 straight to the point and the other more fancy.......ohmboyz used to do it
Ever since i bought the arturia plate im curious about this company. Because its plain better than any orher plate reverb plugin i ever heard.
the spring is my favorite too.
Nobody has picked up on the fact the BUS Force is essentially the Overstayer 8755.....which is THE most fun piece of outboard on the market.
Had the exact same thought. Thing is a proper creative beast.
I really enjoyed this, thank you! What was the first tune?
Might be worth it to invest in some light diffusion, the lights are casting some harsh shadows
My Fabfilter lights don't cast any shadow.
Anyone knows the real name of the first """Sandstorm""" version? XD
Soo good xD
I see dutch & dutch 8c speakers. Can you make a video about them, if you haven't yet? Have you checked the Kii Three as well?
Hi, two ideas for videos:
1. Your opinion about frequencies, where is the Magic for different instruments, if there is in general? And what do you think about masking frequencies and your workflow to handle it.
2. Review of the Balance Mastering Magpha Eq, I’m really interested if you can hear it in a blind test. No one does a video about it until today, bit too me it’s a game changer in the box, especially how it handles transients.
Thanks and greets
"great for bats" xD
- people who have dared turn a resonance knob to max with headphones on
Thanks for checking out stuff. Just a small thought from my side. I do not care if there are scratches on the UI or on a table. Why not focusing only how it sounds? Sometimes I think you are too hard with you criticizing so you should take into account the huge effort developers and companies invest to their products and pay more respect for their work. Anyhow thanks 🙏
Gotta have things that stand out about you if you're gonna be a successful CZcamsr.
You're actually a funny guy, I like the dry sarcasm. have really enjoyed your plugin videos, have watched most of them now. I don't always agree, but if I did it would be boring! Cheers
Some people are also buying trousers with holes in it.. curious what you think of Kush plugins, he makes also hardware but also vsts.
I must apologize if this more obvious than I might think it is as a computer programmer, but when you allow a user to draw curves, that's a very different and in some ways more difficult thing to deal with. If you can only turn knobs and click buttons and drag sliders, then the plugin can very easily read that as simple numerical value inputs and can then pass that on as inputs into the algorithms manipulating the sound. But if you draw a curve, the computer has to analyze that curve with complex mathematical formulas to interpret values along it at certain intervals, then it can finally plug those into the algorithms actually manipulating the sound, which may also consequently have more variables coming from user input to process and then output correct results from. It's just harder to develop, debug, and test. In the worst case it could take time away from the most important part of the plugin: the code actually manipulating the sound data, often in real time as the user or automations are adjusting the controls. It's very cool when done well like in Fabfilter though, and with modern coding techniques I do think Arturia could easily build some proprietary and very flexible code libraries to do it with a lot of their plugins, they just aren't thinking outside the hardware they're obsessed with modelling enough. With the exception of the Pigments development team, perhaps.
Melda MSpectralDynamics... I love it - unique, and incredibly useful! (I just remembered it was you who introduced me to it... I now have a dozen Melda plugz!!)
That and DSEQ are life savers
Yeah Melda plugins are the Pringles of the audio world... Once you pop, you can't stop (until you've eaten all of them). Their freebie set is definitely worth the $50.
@@StudioLams I went down the rabbit hole and bought MXXX Core (on sale of course!). Now instead of thinking "I wish there was a plugin that could..." I just put on my lab coat and build my own!
It would be trivial to code "slowly rusting over time" into a plugin. So it could be pristine when first installed and then would gradually rust.
What happens if you uninstall and reinstall? Does it remember your previous rust state or does it start with a fresh coat of paint?
How would it detect the humility level? This would affect the rust rate.
Should there be an option to repaint it and remove the rust?
These things are not "trivial". Much thought must go into this groundbreaking feature as this is truly the bridge between the digital world and the analog world. 🤔😂
So you're saying the plugins actually lose quality over time ?
Has anybody figured out which Melda he uses?
I think the design portion is partly for the nostalgia, partly for the ease of having a bunch of plugins open making it easy to find and lastly making it easier for non-professionals who might buy the product. Arturia does make good stuff though.
It bothers me that these units are shown sitting on a wood table, and not mounted in a rack. That's so not-pro. I build all my own furniture, I would NOT use these units unmounted, and risk scratching my desktops. Plus that extra border space around the unit is just wasted space. Screen space is precious! These may seem like frivolous comments, but they just undermine my confidence in this plugin in package. I'm an Arturia Keylab owner, I love their synth models, and I do like skeuomorphic interfaces.
No screws means better resale value :)
@@KlemenKotar they should have screws with rubber washers to protect from rack rash
My monitor broke when i tried to uninstall
Maybe i was using the wrong type of screwdriver
Love arturia preamps and reverb and delay.
The compressor is not really my thing but they giving you very honest sound with the auto gain compensate.
I know we don't want rust on a brand-new product, but I do think there is a lot to say for familiar graphical user interface controls. When I see a dial with a white center-line, I know exactly what it does.
I presume these are rack-mountable, judging by the front panel?
The next level of analog simulation will have not only the rack mount unit hanging into your desktop, but a virtual drink sitting next to it which you can spill into the circuits for various circuit destruction effects.
Sees: Arturia.
Knows: Not snake oil :D
The GUI's look a little oily to me but the sound was always going to be up to Arturia's unbelievable standard I guess lol . But make it USABLE please!
@@kutchutozov haha yeah the rack scratches are a "nice" touch and the rack ears are totally pointless. By I can overlook these cosmetics for the sounds quality of their FX and instruments.
@@nanob0zo Agree but I'm too tight so out of my price range anyway lol.. #bargainhunter
@@kutchutozov Totally agree - i always first buy on sale and also wait for upgrade sales too.
I’ve never heard an Arturia product that I thought sounded
Good
I agree that these company's should really change their interface's. Like we get it, it's a analog based vst but it doesn't make sense to have 20 knobs to control a EQ if u can draw it much faster. At that point ur just making it harder for the consumer vs looks, which is stupid. But yeah it still seems like a trend at all these Analog vst company's sadly.
I personally disagree *in certain scenarios*. I love that fab filter is the way it is and will go for that 70% of the time, but when im just trying to liven up a sound or a whole mix without thinking about it to much I think its helpful to have some eqs with well tuned fixed frequency bands and curves to keep from overthinking it or mixin with my eyes. Still, there is a point. Like if an eq plugin truly has 20 knobs then yea, that sucks. but 3 bands and a high and low pass with knobs that arent tiny, works for me.
That EQ and Parallel Processor would be useful for sound design, wouldn't use it for mixing though
UX is a good point. Knobs with a mouse e.g. is always a challenge and not necessary these days.
the rust bit killed me hahaha!
How can I buy the song playing in the background? Is it a song you produced yourself?
5:42
Holy*** Please give me a song name.
The EQ 295 sounds amazing
I too am worried about proper ventilation on my VST plugins. The Arturia graphics design team could have easily photoshopped some much needed vent holes to prevent overheating problems so common with VST effects these days.
This need for speed, client is waiting thing can be a pain and sometimes counter productive. Deadlines are of course walls that are difficult to get out of but most times with a little diplomacy it’s possible. The whole skeuomorphic thing is very much a question of taste - maybe I’m just a Luddite - but it appeals to me. And if you really know your software then it shouldn’t slow you down If there’s a need for speed.
Once again great review. Thanks.
ahhh mp midi controller, i was an early bird too, realy nice to have it, i'm looking forward to your snake oil video
…p.s i know: Touchscreen is to small😉