Inside Factor Bikes | GCN Tours The Factor HQ
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- čas přidán 26. 08. 2024
- While out in Taiwan for the KOM Challenge, we were lucky enough to get shown around the Factor Bikes Factory. Have a look at Factor's process for designing, creating, and testing new frames.
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Originally starting as a project between ex-pro cyclist Baden Cooke, and carbon frame manufacturer Rob Gitelis, Factor has now grown to be one of the foremost high-end bike brands in the world, and even sponsors the World Tour team AG2R La Mondiale.
Join Si as he learns about the in-depth testing procedures that go into creating a Factor bike, featuring some very fetching headwear.
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Leave us a comment below!
This was probably the most factor-y tour I've seen
Contender for comment of the week.
Thanks to Factor Bikes and owner Rob Gitelis for showing us around their factory.
What fascinates you about the Factor bikes factory tour most? Let us know!
Just the whole everything, Si, thanks for another excellent tour, but a few specifics about this tour would be that they downsized to build their own brand, the involvement/influence of David Miller, that they test other frames and build theirs to take harder hits, that their frames are painted by a person and not a robot. And that their factory is situated in a sort of Silicon Valley for the cycling industry, amazing. And just curious--if we take the factory tour, will David be screening his movie in the theater next to the gift shop? And that's a grin for anyone who has ever taken a factory tour of whatever in Hawaii. Hey everybody, let's sing Tiny Bubbles before we get there.
That his head is brighter than my future.
Global Cycling Network did Si wash his hands after his crisps, before fondling the raw carbon frames?
I am not surprised to see them testing and spec'ing their frames independent of other components, but it would be nice to see them making sure they are integrating their layup designs to work optimally with the components they intend to install on their frames. The entire high end industry is moving toward highly integrated, purpose-built products. If factor was smart, they would optimise their frame dynamics to complent the other parts, i.e. the frame stiffness plays nice with the crank stiffness, the seat post flexibility, etc. Maybe they do actually do this, but testing a frame by itself and pulling out all the other system variables is kind of meaningless to someone who needs a whole bike to realize any value in it.
Mike Taglione just because everything can be more controlled doesn't me an that it actually is. I am certain they probably check these things, it was just mentioned explicitly that they check things on the frame in isolation. I would argue that is not actually important from an end-user perspective.
Looks like controlled production is an important _factor_ in the build of these bikes.
No puns!
😂
Love these bike manufacturing vids. Its like hows its made...GCN style
+Cycling Bodybuilder thanks!
Definitely shows just how far GCN has come (no doubt with help from rhe Discovery network most recently) that they now get to do all these factory visits and get the access they do at events etc. Is GCN now arguably the biggest overall broadcaster of cycling?
Paul Fitzpatrick they probably are the biggest cycling network for sure. Gmbn is also pretty big
Those are beautiful bikes
it better be. they cost 5k each.
Proudly made in Taiwan! I like it!
China you may want to say, one of the most expensive companies in the market, and cut costs in the productions like crazy
As a designer/mechanical engineer, I found their redesign methods and criteria very informing. I love seeing the relatively unrelated methods of determining strength. With all of the people I've known in the industry, I don't know how I didn't end up in a place like that. I guess I just like riding more than working. Also that bit about not having to up their safety factor to account for factory bozos is revealing.
man im thinking exactly the same, im industrial designer and wondering why I didn't thought about applying to work for a company like that lol, im seriously thinking is time for a switch of job lol
Making carbon bikes is an art form! Finished product is so beautiful and functional.
I'd love to see GTN do the same thing with their Cervélo P5x ;)
I love the short head tubes on the Factor road bikes. Too many other makers have a totem pole out front.
John O'Neill yeah that was the determining factor for me getting one of these frames. ( pun not intended)👍
Seeing you guys on those bikes has made me want one sooo bad ....a thing of beauty
Damn. That Head of Design has to have one of the coolest first names out there! 😅😅😉😉
That burnt orange frame looked stunning!
GCN have such great presenters and Si is no exception especially in this Vid
Lol I was cycling when you uploaded this!
+Tom Melton 15 minute break and back to the bike?
Lol yea!
Brilliant. The owner is extremely interesting. Super work GCN
I love Factor because they dont hide the fact that their bikes are built in Asia. The best bikes comes out of Taiwan anyways and some company are still shy about telling that to their costumers. Its nuts.
Pinarello)
Great video and beautiful bikes. I want two.
I've been watching Raoul Luescher's videos on bike manufacture. The things he finds are very eye opening and I trust his expertise. I'd like to know more about the manufacturing process now. It's inside the frame that counts. After dropping weights on components how do they know there are no cracks in them? Seeing cracks inside the carbon is hard enough without painting the the part.
Dunno, kinda looked like a small void on the side of the seat-clamp hole to me!
Essentially the smaller your process the more you can oversee each individual person and the more you can train them, so you don't get Steve - who used to be from accounting - turning up hungover and just throwing carbon at the mould incorrectly.
I get that. A smaller hand picked team that you can train and keep an eye on but I think the real gains are in using techniques that avoid human error. Raoul is describing things like semi-rigid internal bladders and expanding mandrels to avoid wrinkles. Using a fallible process and then criticising people for being human isn't very smart.
every process can fail, as Raoul points out even airplane parts can be made incorrectly, or not up to standard, the rate of which increases after lay-offs. It's about catching those parts before they go to a consumer and using better techniques or methods for making them in the first place. Smaller factory can be more picky with the workers it hirers and is more likely to have longer-term workers - assuming it's run correctly. Realistically processes need to be designed around human failure, there's a lot of large scale engineering examples of bad design that leads to human mistakes that leads to major disasters. It's the whole design cycle which needs to have safety worked into it, from adequate material safety factors, to supervision of workers, to accountability of every part/batch, through to end QC.
Phased Array Testing is standard for subsurface cracking, its ultrasound technology similar to the types of test used in pregnancy. It basically uses sound waves out of phase, that are reflected back if there is a crack or a void in the material. Have a Google if you want to know more.
Hey Si, I just got mine yesterday. Bike is AMAZING, looks are drop dead gorgeous. Your video was very instrumental in helping me make my decision to purchase one, thank you!
TheRedduck1 how’s ur long term experiences on factor bike ? I heard that the frame is not strong enough like other major bike frames.
V90 Cross Everything is great, no issues here. Rides like a dream.
I know that they made them in Asia because it's cheaper. But I would love to be sure that people working there get a proper salary and working hours (I would pay more for bike like that).
pendulum test seems misleading since the whole frame with its supports on ground are moving when the pendulum hits. this movement shows that some of the force applied is transformed to movement instead of being absorbed by seatstay. such tests on specific parts should be done while the frame is fixed where momentum of the mechanism cannot be transformed to movement.
Ozan Targal -- Still it's a lot better than most bike companies that sub out their work to inexpensive subcontractors everywhere in Tiawan.
Oh my the plant is located in my home town! no wonder I often see Rob and his amazing RB O2.
Most stuff is made in Taiwan but designed where the company is based . My Scott Spark had 'made in Taiwan' and I believe the Open frames are made in Taiwan too . Heck even some Chinese branded frames are pretty decent . Might get one to try soon ,
The Factor bikes are made in China. I believe Giant bicycles are based in Taiwan and made in Taiwan, plus they cost way less.
É muito bom ver o quanto é estudado cada comportamento do quadro em diversas situações. Valeu!
It's great to see how much each bike is studied in various situations. Nice!
Verdade, sempre tive interesse por essa marca, que é bem rara de se ver no Brasil.
Like how Factor is so honest about their frames being manufactured in Taiwan and even opened their doors to GCN, unlike the other big brands.
They're made in China, not Taiwan. The part in the middle where they can't visit the Chinese factory because of visa issues? They're designed and painted in Taiwan, and made in China.
@@pierrex3226 Thanks for the clarification Pierre, a question for you? Is SEKA made in the same factory as Factor? The finish to the amateur eyes are so close, just slight diff in design lines
@@tom-lk idk about that. But my next frame will be a Chinese one, for me to experiment. Im a geek and like experimenting, which is not the case for most people. From my "research", if you hesitate between a Seka and a factor, buy a Seka, unless you don't look at prices. I care about value more than price. Brands like specialized and factor offer terrible value. Seka seem to make very high end frames at lower prices (not low, but lower).
@@pierrex3226 appreciate the feedback Pierre, i think value matters cos we're not following some social media trends here - we do our research to find the best quality bikes for the money, not who got the most likes right. The only thing that big brand offers are technology, they have endless resources to perform so many tests (incl wind tunnel) and good resale value - Having said that, based on my research these big brands are made in only a number of chinese factories , so these tech will be easily trickled down to the other chinese brands just have find which ones.
congratulations i bought it!
FACTOR has one of the gorgeous silhouette in their O2.
David involvement is he supplying the epo
Brian Joshua -- No Brian, the supplying of EPO is from a Dr. Michele Ferarri who resides in Italy. But heroin would be good for you, you can find that anywhere in your trailer park.
5:30 When you open your Xmas gift and it's jet another pair of regular woolen socks (imagine you live in Australia or the Caribe). Amazing vid, guys!
Another brilliant video!
Would definitely love to have the 02 VAM!
Great Vid; nice tour of the factory, very informative. We all know by now GCN has sponsors, and good for that, you can bring us more great videos! But would love to see you do something with a Titanium bike builder, non-racer who doesn't ride carbon would love the diversity! Cheers!
Thx 4 sharing . Very interesting. Rob Getilis ( Gee l hope l have his surname spelt correctly 😀) Love his passion & the FACT..or that he showed us how they test & stress frames. Would ❤ 2 own a few of there bikes. With a couple of tweaks. 1) THM FULL CARBON CRANKSET & 2) LOOK Keo Ti Carbon Pedals. Very expensive upgrades plus Dura Ace 12 speed groupset.
Don't touch before painting. Glove up!
I was fascinated by the early bikes this company made like the Vis Vires because they were quirky and made just a bike rides distance from where I grew up. But they don't appear to be the same company anymore. The design elements have continued but the bike used by Ag2r is the least like the originals. I guess they just couldn't get that fork past the UCI.
Nice of Factor to let GCN 'in'. It's just taken 15mins to go from disliking their bikes to liking them a lot.
This bike was really easy to assemble czcams.com/users/postUgkxMesz3KOGEmwmvyKQfLfrRSUXLFzfVHZA and required very few adjustments out of the box. The wheels did not require any truing/adjustments. The frame had some small scratches, but nothing major.I did replace the seat though - the seat it came with was very uncomfortable. The tires need to be re-inflated every 4-5 days, but this appears to be quite common for the narrow 700x25 tires.Overall, in my opinion, this bike looks and rides like a much more expensive bike.
Not sure what make of rear mech is fitted to the bike in the back ground but the jockey wheels are huge!!! Well in comparison to what I’m used to anyway. See 2 mins 14 secs.
It's from a brand called Ceramic speed. They make high end component, helping save a small amount of watts. Their bearings are ceramic, instead of steel, and their jockey wheels are massive (17t instead of 11) as it means the chain doesn't bend as much, which uses less energy. They're expensive, so not worth thinking about for 99% of cyclists, but it works.
Nice PR video.
The insight into how the design might need to account for worker error was very interesting. Also more emphasis on the entrepreneurial factor would be good. Overall 2 thumbs up!
Thanks Martin!
Nine Panerai watch the owner is wearing. Might need to purchase a bike now.
5:22 frame is not fixed to the ground? frame is moving to the side absorbing the impacts...
My thought exactly ;D
You would have thought that the frame stiffness test would have been done with the crank arm at around 90 degrees, or whatever correcpsonds to the typical rider's crank angle at max. pedal force. I'm sure it isn't at the angle it's at !! Still, it sounds as though some real engineering thought has gone into this.
By my intuition, flex isn't necessarily highest at the point in the pedal stroke where you make the most power. Anyway, as long as they're consistent with the angle it shouldn't matter where they test it.
No, it isn't necessarily at the highest point in the pedal stroke. However, it's at the highest crank torque that is where you want the highest stiffness to get the force to the back wheel and not store it as elastic energy.
What you'd really want is a bridged strain gauge on each tube to be measuring strains as a function of crank angle.
What this comes down to is that I would like to understand the reasoning behind them doing the test at that set up.
I would do multiple test, with the same load in each, but with the crank arm at every ten degrees around the pedal stroke. Then find the position with max deflection.
...which is what I said.
Im just wondering which former brand of bike are they making before the owner decides to have his own brand?
please visit giant factory!
Yang Guan Tang -- That will NEVER happen, you'll see how most Specialized, Trek, and Cannondales are made. And an occasional Giant.
La mejor bicicleta del mundo. Saludos
Where was Baden?
Did you get to keep these band boys si?
Is there a disk brake model in the future?
they put the bearing races in before painting and then don't protect them from the paint? Am I missing something?
Maybe I've missed it, but does Factor include any real world testing, with fully build up bikes riding on real roads in their design proces?
he1z Yeah, I think the AG2R team are a pretty good test team.
Switched from Specialized after being a lifelong S-works user. The Ostro Vam is better in all regards; price, handling, aesthetics, and build quality.
Did I hear that right.....30mm or 13mm deflection at the end of the crank with 105kg on the drive side? Sounded like 30mm which is surprising.
tarmacsurfers yeah, I heard 30 mm
same, quite a bit of bendage, is it not?
I think he read it wrong, 13 or 30mm is a lot in terms of deflection. i could have been 1.3 or 3.0 mm which seems more plausible .
Mike Pop this is what I was thinking. I cannot recall seeing an engineers clock gauge go up to 30mm, plus this doesn't sound like a very stiff BB! 😂
This is gonna blow up on Twitter! Getelis better go into damage control mode. ^^
I love David Millar but his dress sense is something else!
more videos like this!!!
+Thomas Urgento on the way!
They didn't show any of the parts after the tests tho...
Love my factor o2
Still have it. Has was it ?? Need some long term review
@@v90cross2 was nice yeah. Cracked it twice though. Too delicate. Much prefer my emonda slr 2021
Tobias Dahlhaus yeah that’s what I’m worried little bit. I heard that the frame is not strong as much as other major frames like giant trek specialized. Can you describe what happened ?
@@v90cross2 first time was top tube in a crash. Second time a random crack in seattube. Maybe their newer ones are stronger.
30mm? Thats 3cm. That can’t be right
Had the same thought
I guess he said 13mm.
he said 30, but if you look at the gauge is says 0-10mm so really each 10 is only really 1mm
so did Simon paint the frame that he rode in the KOM challenge?
Was pretty interested until I saw the prices. Wow. Too many 10-person to 15-person wrecks in the group rides to chance a bike like that.
Interesting... its a “UK” brand, owned by an American but built in their factory in Taiwan.
Are they working on any graphene frames/components?
Millars appearance in this video, was near frightfull...why does he always look worried about something, nervy and wanting to be elsewhere ? when i seen him back in the day at the cycleshow (when he was on drugs) he looked ok...strange.
He looks exactly as flighty and over-it here as he always did, really.
I would love one... but no dealers near me :(
Awesome, you did the KOM Challenge in Taiwan? Why didn't you tell us?
in my opinion la kan...
yall should do economics design not just top notch expensive..
bike for junior cylist
cyling is going good
In the Tour the bikes will always be painted -- and covered with adverts
Did you see yourselves switching to Factor from Canyon?
Factor must have paid loads for this ad.
Doesn't watch whole video. Leaves negative comment. Charming...
Maybe a free bike?
The've visited plent of manufacturers.
Ya, 2 built out bikes. Must be nice to get free stuff.
im surprised yall dont got 10 mill
I own a OSTRO it’s great seeing what goes into a £5k frame set money well spent I love it you can’t put a price on happiness🥳
What "pro" race bikes does FACTOR make in this factory? (Road/TT/Track) Any? +GCN
Great
Sexy looking frames!!
Nice video. Been living in Taiwan for a long time. The "wan" in "Taiwan" should be pronounced like "won". Keep up the great content guys!
Frank Meiring errr taiwan in chinese is 台湾. The hànyú pīnyīn or chinese romanization for 台湾 is táiwān. Not tai"won". Bilingual speaker here...
Nepo35 I agree. But to be clear it should not be pronounced "wan" where "a" pronounced as in "cat". I am fluent too...
GCN的人沒有學過中文。用漢語拼音解釋台灣的發音沒有意義。我就是在用英文的"won"因為很接台灣的“灣“正確的發音。這樣GCN的人最容易了解。不需要在這邊炫耀。我的目的就是幫助GCN用到正確的發音，所以別人不會誤會台灣是泰國。如果你現在住在台灣的話，我們改天找時間討論吧。。。聖誕節快樂
Im not really that fussed. Ill pronounce it how you like when people from taiwan can pronounce my name or at least my countries name.
Do Giant factory tour. Thumbs up if you all agree
What about Factor track bikes
They look very nice, but let's face it, they're not Raleigh.
Are they?
5:23 auuch it actually hurts
Left with the thought that given they are made in China is it worth risking buying a Chinese frame as I am pretty sure many of the big makes are made from the same moulds. Pension will not allow me to buy the real mc coy.
Ted Edwards China is a big country with a lot of carbon manufacture. To have one company building high performance frames doesn’t guarantee all of them!
Ted Edwards China is a big country with a lot of carbon manufacture. To have one company building high performance frames doesn’t guarantee all of them!
Ted Edwards China is a big country with a lot of carbon manufacture. To have one company building high performance frames doesn’t guarantee all of them!
Thanks for reply Si. It just seems like for most of us good quality CF bikes are becoming even more out of our price range. As you know you read good and bad reports on cheap Chinese frames. Best I start saving then !
China factory and test on England? How many brand work like this?
Where’s that veganism vid?? Wasn’t it supposed to come out on friday?
+Félix Fortin coming this week Felix
Will Reyes it’s legit i think it’s like ” can you be a vegan pro cyclist ? ”
Be careful, his 'community' are very sensitive about these things.
David Miller sounds and looks like Bike Cumberbatch.
Is Iñigo.Not Inigo.
30mm deflection are you sure ? That’s over an inch.
If you want to buy this bike you had better factor in the costs of owning it.
Factor? Never heard of it.
who the hell needs these paper frames, makes no sense apart from top racing applications - why deep sub-kilo when few hundred grams can make it orders of magnitude impac resistant, esp. in areas like they describe (rear tubes) that are often neglected (unlike e.g. forks which are at least known to be a failure-prone, see Raoul Luescher channel)
That's why we should ride more steel, made from builders based in the same continent as ourselves.
Interesting question! Worth bearing in mind that adding material isn’t just going to change strength, but also ride quality. Light weight frames reportedly have a more lively feel which is deadened by additional layers. Maybe people are happy with the trade off.
Ride a 6.5kg bike up a mountain and your question will be answered.
Was under the belief that Factor bikes are a UK company, is this correct cos obviously the guy who started it ain't?
Not anymore, they were sold.
I think they used to be a part of Carbon Technologies, based in Diss in Norfolk. Not sure they ever made any bikes there, but it is still a bespoke motorsport facility.
factor bike started as an offshoot of bf1systems in Norfolk who do composites & electronics for motorsports, it was then sold to Carbon Composites Bike Asia the last bike designed with influence from the original team was the Vis Vires, everything now is now mass produced & popped out of a generic jelly mold in Asia like every other manufacturer.
That's why the twin vane split down tube has gone, it's time consuming & creates additional manufacturing challenges.
These are my thoughts as well. I was thrilled that they were designed and made in Diss as I grew up in Stowmarket. The attraction is disappearing now that they are just another cookie cutter manufacturer. I bet what happened was the bikes were too radical to be UCI legal and they had sunk a lot of money into the company. The only way to go was to make more normal bikes. The staff probably weren't interested so the company was sold to recoup the investment cost.
11.50 Do not touch the primed frame without gloves!!!!!!!!!!!!!
if I was rich I would buy it all
My road bike has flat pedals and I have a hard time bunny hopping
13:03 Not a good idea to breath in that stuff!
China Frame price 500 $ .
#Torqueback My Coach is making me ride 4 to 5 hours of endurance rides 3 to four times in a week(very mentally demanding). I am planning to start my first race around fall 2018. Right now I can do 150 kilometers with 32 avs on my own. I live in shanghai(dry winter) and the only place I could train is a 13 kilometer course that is 60 mins away from my house. It would benefit a lot if I can do shorter and harder rides. But if I do start doing short intervals instead of long hours in the saddle, what will I loose? My coach said that if we were racing and that I just could not keep up for the last one hour if I do short intervals. He is making me do long rides over the winter to build up my base. Any advice? I am 14 btw and have a dream of becoming a pro.
Who buys these? Min $10k. I mean, they're great, beautiful, light, but who actually buys them? Never seen one in person.
Hey, I'm early! Hi mum!
"Take the risk and die on your ass." - Simon Richardson
All carbon frames are made in China. All no name brands learnt their trade from R&D & engineers from big brands. As long as you don’t buy a copy frame all carbon from China is good.
Everything is made in China
John Bicycle yup. Not just “made” these days. Because of more successful education systems over in the Far East many brands (not just bike) move their R&D over to China too.
It’s just the marketing & tax evasion that’s handled in the West.
David Fellows That trend has slowed down a lot. A lot of companies actually backsourced their RnD to western countries.
David Fellows All carbon from China is good? Have a look at Luesher Teknik content where frames are cut open and assessed......
mrjt yep & their profits take a massive dive because the manufacturing is taken over by the old engineers & New companies started up. - just look @ apples falling profits in China.