NDIS will go down as the ‘biggest piece of spending excess’ in Australian history
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- čas přidán 18. 05. 2024
- Psychiatrist Tanveer Ahmed has argued that the National Disability Insurance Scheme [NDIS] will go down as the “biggest piece of spending excess in Australia’s history”.
Mr Ahmed went head to head with Developing Australians Communities Co-founder River Night to debate whether or not the NDIS is costing Australians too much.
It comes as the Labor pledged in the federal budget to use $469 million to crack down on fraud and exploitation in the NDIS.
“Look, I think the NDIS will go down as the biggest piece of spending excess in Australia’s history,” Mr Ahmed said.
“It was designed for certain thing, but it essentially encourages overservicing the sick role and all sorts of excesses.”
My sister gets paid to take a 60yo Trans man shopping and to his therapy sessions and is paid to sit in the waiting room while this is done. The NDIS is becoming a joke and the worse thing for those with real and significant disabilities.
My wife's trans-Aunti mid/late 60's uses the NDIS, and it's costs her nearly $15K a year. It's not free, it's subsidized.
@@rag_man673 I'm sorry but Trans issues should not be categorised as a disability. It might cost her but I bet the government kicks in a lot too. Follow the money.
I saw a story a few months ago, a woman , who was working by the way, claimed agoraphobia (fear of open spaces) and applied to the NDIS for an assistance dog for her anxiety. A smart person in the NDIS rejected her application. She sued the NDIS in court and won. the NDIS was forced to provide a trained assistance dog costing $7000, and about 15 other such rejected applications for assistance animals now had to be funded too. It's absolute BS, there was nothing physically wrong with this woman and yet the tax funded gravy train just hands over the cash.
@@wongnaichungrd Well that depends on the individual. In the case of my wife's Aunt, ....while dealing with depression, related to her trans/cross dressing etc. when she was a younger man, through him self in front of buss in a suicide attempt, and is now disabled. So although, yes not a trans issue in it's self, it was the cause of her disabilities.
@@wongnaichungrd I'm sure there is a lot of abuse (financial) in the NDIS system, just like the $4.5 B we send overseas each year. How much of that goes to the people to help and how much to their respective government bureaucrats? Of the $40 B we give to Aboriginal communities each year, how much of that reaches the needy? And they are only around 4% of the population. There are many instances of financial abuse in our tax payers spending, I was just saying it's not a free ride, it's subsidized, and yes I agree there is room for improvements. I'd love to see all spending audited and made public.
3 of my neighbours are on NDIS and both the client and providers are rorting the system whilst they’re all on meth and opioids and just spending spending spending thousands on everything besides serious mental health treatment and drug treatment. Sure let’s take the ice junkie out for an activity and clean up after them at taxpayers expense while their living money goes to drug dealers
I do not think people on drugs should get it there other programs out there for that
@@lorrainebarry7184 You can't get on the NDIS just for drug addiction.
BULLSHIT 🤨
I've got schizophrenia and most of the people I've met with schizophrenia take meth. I took it a few times 10 years ago. It made my health bad.
Julia Gillard’s last act of bastardisation. Knowing full well the NDIS would never be fully funded and open to rorting.
Exactly. What a legacy for the first female PM. No wonder she scurried away to hide in Adelaide.
It was the way it was implemented by Abbott that was that was a huge part of the problem. I can tell you after working continuously in the disability sector for 23 years. Do you know what a LAC is in terms of NDIS?
So was I. NDIS is failing like the Childcare Sector privatisation is. It's open to rorts and Speculators.
look what happens when a woman gets in charge
@@David_Beames dream on. 🙄
I used to work in disability services. When the NDIS was announced the staff knew right away, that that the whole thing would be ripped off. Obviously, the Government new that as well but didn't care.
I'm aussiming your were in DES? the second biggest rort to the government. 😂
@@noodles5004 No, Aging Disability and Home Care.
There is people that should get it can not get it
The NDIS is one of the greatest scams operating in Australia today, (appart fom Canberra beaurocrats)
Care providers in Sydney alone earning $500,000 looking after the less needy of the NDIS client list.
I know someone that was charged $13,000 for 7 days in a little holiday unit on the gold coast by himself n wen he questioned the provider he was told theyre allowed to charge that much once a year on a one week holiday that should of cost about 1500 at most not thirteen thousand ,its complete madness n a free for all
If was set up as time bomb by Gillard when she knew she was being kicked out. It will forever grow exponentially. Modelling was done when it started and they showed that it will be bigger than the entire budget. No country can afford the ndis.
Yep , total scam……
I'm sure we all have stories of the rorting of the NDIS. I know of someone on NDIS who lives with a partner and he has a cleaner come to clean up their house. Why is the NDIS funding a situation like this when the partner is perfectly capable of cleaning the house themselves? Blame the red rooter Gillard for the biggest government rort in this country's history.
That is where the system fails. My son is on the NDIS it’s been brilliant for us. He has Autism and an intellectual disability. We don’t get a cleaner in as I believe that he needs to learn as much independence tasks as possible.
We get a support worker to assist him in with shopping as he cannot travel independently. They need to state in the plan what a person NEEDS.
Our family works towards independence and we do not want therapists continually in our lives.
There does need to be questions around what a person genuinely needs.
Draining Australia's money as fast as possible.
It will go down as the biggest piece of scam in Australian history.
Covid beats it
Perhaps the pharmaceutical companies should pay towards the ASD funding?
They are the ones causing the problem in the first place. Medicating kids that didn't need it.
So a gov program with zero measurements of success, except spend more.
Did I get it right?
Correct, but this is the nature of all government programs.
NDIS needs a bit of Milei-action.
The NDIS is analogous to heat in the theory of thermodynamics. You cant win, you cant break even and you cant quit the game.
Know a guy on NDIS who had a cleaner travel from an hour away to clean his donga (temporary bushfire accommodation) four times and charge the NDIS $10K. Disgusting behaviour on her (the cleaner) behalf and the system as a whole. The bureaucracy that allows this is a disgrace, and the Albos ALP are financial vandal$ … 🤡😵💀
The agency charges the NDIS, not the actual worker. The worker probably got $50.
I guarantee you the $10k is for the lifetime of the plan (1-2 years) NOT 4 times at a cost of $2500 a pop.
No, this is not "what it costs". I know a person who works at an NDIS provider. Salaries are high in the office, "Not for profit" employees are entitled to $30,000 income tax free earnings, the management roles are all 6 figures and the number of reports and "checks and balances" to prove that the money is being spent properly itself soaks up huge amounts of money in report writing, account keeping, tracking new legislation, proving compliance and training to all the staff which just never ends. This person works in an office with 30 staff to support about 90 actual "hands on" NDIS workers. It's inefficient and high cost, IMO.
Even people in the industry state it is costing too much.
The staff planning services do not know what they are doing and hand out far too many services long term that are simply not required.
There is something really wrong. As a wheelchair user, I can not get a ramp built to access my house because it is a rental, and I can't guarantee I won't have to move in the next 7 years. It is so much fun dragging myself and my wheelchair over wet concrete to get in or out of my house. I could get a van modified if I could afford to buy a van less than 5 years old. Where does a disability pensioner get $50,000+ to buy such a van when the rent is 60% of my income. I have been told I need to get a mental health or behavioural diagnosis, and then I would attract more funding. Why would I want to do that? I would like a job, but there is no assistance available, and as soon as an employer sees the chair, I am on the no list.
It's wrong. I do feel for you, how can you make sense of it.
Australia is finished
The rorts are endless in NDIS. I know of one rural client with alleged learning disability who gets picked and driven 200km once a week to have coffee with play computer games and returned. The NDIS provider charges that out at over $100 /hr. Even the IMF have publicly warned this government this will affect our international credit rating .
4:45 Should people with disabilities not have their houses cleaned, lawns mowed, food cooked ? How dare they expect a standard of living we all take for granted. Is there abuse of the system, oh I'm sure there is. But of the other wasted tax spending, this is a problem?
Agree. But the charges for housekeeping needs to be commensurate with charges applied to non disabled clients. You can't have a significantly higher charge for disabled people. Which is what happens now. The reasoning is that cleaning for disabled might be more onerous eg can only do so at certain times, might need to do so quietly etc. But the charges to the NDIS cannot be exhorbitant.
The NDIS will destroy our economy, if it hasn't already. Labor is responsible.
It is getting rorted everywhere, Autism diagnosis are off the charts.
Horse riding etc. absolute disgrace
Builders are just fleecing the system for work they do for the disable and dont blink an eyelid.
A lot of the money isnt going to the people on disability. there getting over charged
Sick Australia...
The NDIS providers have money to burn judging by the amount of advertising they're doing.
It's not just the NDIS because look at the number of employment agencies.
Every time government come up with new ways of blowing tax dollars complete industries spring up to help them spend it.
Are you saying we don't need employment agencies ? Then how the heck do people find work then ? Are you hiring ?
People could find work the same way they have for millennia before the nanny state stepped in with buckets of our tax dollars.
Try living in rural Australia where every second business is thriving on the government teat replacing the originals that became unviable.
The psychologist is SPOT ON!!
I tried to get the disability payment in 2023 because im losing my memory SVBD since 2020 i am getting worst but still cant get it centrelink told it is because i smoke and need to stop before they give it to me, what i do personality has nothing to do with them so please tell me why? When you have alcoholics on this payment and drink and smoke every day.
Thank you River, I have severe physical disability and some m/H issues…. And cannot easily get my basic needs meet. There are different situations.
Where has all the money gone? 🧐
middle and upper class
Mostly to people with disabilities so they can get the services they need. Abbott implemented it.
@Design_no Into private hands.
@@gkw9882 So who got paid to do things before? Think before you answer.
@@David_Beames I worked for the Dept. of Aging, Disability and Home Care for 19 years. Is that enough time for thinking? When the NDIS came in our bosses moved heaven and earth, to get public guardians for ALL our clients. Why? you ask, because many of them had substantial savings accounts and were at risk of being swindled by the new startups. The NDIS provided an opportunity for new business owners, with their eyes on government money and profit before people. They keep costs down by hiring inexperienced staff, by understaffing and reducing service to the clients. People I used to look after, now have to put up with staff who are only there for a paycheck and don't care about the clients.
It's the gold plated version. They are providing services that are not needed
Every provider knows a “sympathetic” doctor.
Providers are unregulated. They can charge up the wazoo without any checks or balances. Employees get paid astronomical amounts, even entry level.
some are mere private taxi drivers , i know some.
Providers are regulated. They have to abide by NDIS Guidelines and regulations whether they are registered or unregistered providers. They cannot charge more than what the NDIS has stipulated.
@hereweare9096 it dosen't seem like it. There have been past media reports of charging elderly residents heaps for very little, though that could be independent contractors.
@@hughmiller925 They are supposed to operate by pricing limits. That’s where the dodgy operators are. Independent contractors still need to abide by NDIS rules and pricing if they want NDIS participants.
They can be reported if they do not comply with the requirements.
@hereweare9096 that's where a lot of it is. I know families that are almost destitute from the cost incurred from such providers, worse if they don't renew eligibility for the program though. And yet we have shit kicker entry level disability support workers on 120k a year.
been essential for my sons occupational, speech and physical therapy, no way we could have afforded it otherwise
U just showed the world the problem. Its u.
We have the same. But you and I are honest, there really many that are not.
Get another job?
Obviously the people on here have no idea. Considering the boomers who say we had to do it without ndis is crap they just allowed the problems in there kids to grow and now as adults there is issues mentally. Ndis if used correctly has a place however I see plenty of people adults and kids trying there damn hardest to get onto this system when they really should not be. They need to stop allowing providers who scam the system the opportunity to keep scamming. Cap the amount of providers out there. I have gone to quote jobs and been told by providers to bill them as hours even if not worked so that the ndis applicant does not have to pay out of pocket. This is entitlement at its finest
@@JonC12312How is a carer supposed to get another job while caring for a child with disabilities?
Our children require 24 hour care.
I work while my child is at his special school because we cannot survive on the carer payment. Cost of living has skyrocketed. The impact on people and families with disabilities is enormous.
Its huge cost and the ones who are really in need are not getting benefit of scheme, its all those providers who are getting all the money in their pocket.
"NDIS... ..doesn't encourage people to get better" ??? The health system doesn't do that either. Nothing new.
No. The medical system is meant to do that. Psychologists are only meant to be paid by the NDIS only if one has autism and the intellectual disability that goes with it. However, kids who need to see psychologists but with no autism or intellectual disability get diagnosed as such only to gain access to these services.
NDIS should only available for severe cases. Shouldn’t be there to support people with drug or alcohol addictions, people who have a sex change or people who just don’t want to work and pretend they have mental problems. NDIS is a bandaid for the slackers who know you can take advantage of the service as much as you can.
I only hope that all the comments section contributors don,t one day suffer from any disabilities and find that there is no services available for them.
Tanvir is 100% correct; there s zero incentive to get "clients" back into work. Better to be paid $60.00 per hour to sit on a beach then go for lunch and a coffee.
What work ? Disability Employment Services absolutely useless. My autistic son applied for 100 jobs in one year and got zero response back. Only got a paid job through his NDIS provider. People who knock the NDIS can go pound sand. And that includes Tanvir.
I imagine it is in the interests of the people working in the NDIS system to maximize the assessments of disabilities. It had to happen with the way it's been set up.
The problem is the middle men. The people on the ground providing the actual services are not being overpaid.
@@captain-poppleton Yes I believe the term is "rent seeking" where some devise schemes specifically to qualify for funding.
Shortens Rolls Royce service NDIS how about a toyota carolla.
It would be better to increase the number of visits you can have under the mental health and physical health care plans and less people would trying to get on ndis.
One of many wasted policies
NDIS , INDIGENOUS , Albo's new Plane
Ndis is a joke I had to go and work for someone with Parkinson he was on ndis but he very little care he needed 24 hour care and he had no one for 5 - 6 hours while I was there he couldn't drink water out of a glass I had to help him. I am a Carpenter I was there to do a few things to make his life easier which ndis said was not needed.
Some days I stayed back for 2 hours just because he needed help
We had to remove a few glass doors as it was dangerous for him to go near them. ndis said they would pay $29 to go out and remove them and make them safe
That's travel time and work we said that doesn't cover our fuel.
He ended up dying a year or so after and nothing changed they were all payed well to do nothing
Yes exactly Tristan. That’s very lovely of you to show some compassion and help him out but it’s infuriating to hear that people who are truly disabled are not getting the help they desperately need whilst there are so many who are not as functionally disabled getting more assistance. Like many other public services .. the lunatics are in charge.
Worked for 30 yrs in disabilities and it was the biggest rip off even caught a guy who was a provider going to sleep on the job and they didn't even say anything and providers turning up in vehicles that were not roadworthy nothing was checked and if you said anything to the authorities your called a problem as it was all in the too hard basket for the LAZY
Why do Carers of a Disabled person get paid when the Disabled person has support workers doing their jobs?
what are you talking about? it does EXACTLY what it was made for - transferring wealth from Australians to the new australians, enriching the special caste in the process, of course.
Typical bigoted and racist comment you grub.
I personally know 3 people who know what to say and who to see who have gotten NDIS. None of them need it. A total rip off with no remorse or conscious.
And I know of people who really need it (like physically disabled) who gets nothing. And yes, personally know someone with mental health issues yet is able to hold down job and maintain a house. And still gets NDIS
I've been on disability support pension for over 10years ndis has never gave me any money for anything 😅
you don't get cash - you get services allocated to you.
@@captain-poppleton why does ndis spend billions of dollars then 🤔 to rort the system and steal your generation 🤔 🙄 😒 😑
You are on DSP because you are unable to work due to physical limitations. If you can cook, clean, shower and generally participate in society, why do you need services ?
@@xxxxxxxxx3944 nah I'm mentally retarded hahaha 😆 😂 🤣 😅 🤪 🙃
@@captain-poppleton if I'm the one that's retarded why hasn't anyone set up the services for me why do I have to do all the work cause it's a fucking scam boy hahahaha 😒 🙃 😑 😤 😂 😐 😒
This is really true. NDIS funding is such a waste of funding. Look at our aged people they suffer while ndis particiipants are living in luxury.
Er no. I can guarantee you a vast number of participants are NOT. Governments of both persuasions pander to the Aged lobby because they vote. The disabled do not. The Aged lobby just wants more money from the disabled ?
They say no one on the NDIS ever comes off it. Why would they. I’m talking about the ones with short term non permanent disabilities. They e got it made.
I think the bigger issue is the $900,000,000 sent to Isreal each year plus the $10,000,000 in ammo ,
Yep, it is being rorted from all different areas. The amount of assessments required, on buildings, equipment as well as clients is ridiculous, this is where most of the money goes, not to mention all the support services that have sprung up to manage the money.
River Night says he can’t get a public or private Psychiatrist or he goes to a Community of Mental Health Services there are no services there, would that be because all the services that are needed only support you if you are NDIS funded as they get paid a higher rate then if they were for the general public. So money has prevented Mental Health Services from providing the services needed.
Most don’t get better from ASD, they learn how to cope with normal society. The QLD public school system does not support children with additional needs, the NDIS is the only support for students.
The school does not cater to people with various neuro divergent thinking patterns. You can only pay for a psychologist using NDIS money to come up with a study plan or strategies for helping the child learn. But many teachers don't have time or energy to follow through. In the US, they home school instead. Maybe that is the solution.
I know of 2 people on ndis, between them both, per year, they spend around $1.5 million, yes you read that correctly.
Whaat, I am in a wheelchair and can't get a ramp built to get in and out of my house because it's a rental and I can't guarantee I won't move in the next 7 years. It's so much fun dragging yourself over wet concrete to get in your house.
@@Kylie-oz3ks this is where the NDIS fails, real people are left behind, I know that one of the people I mentioned just won't get out of bed, claims to have a mental issue. She pays someone $375 at night time to drive to her house to get her salt out of her kitchen.
@@Kylie-oz3ksThat is why you can't get a ramp built, because it is a rental. They need to find landlords willing to have ramps on their properties, and put you in touch with them. They cannot put up a ramp, then have to take it down 6 months later. You know, people on this comment board will say it is a waste of money.
@xxxxxxxxx3944 My landlord is not the problem. No private landlord can guarantee a 7 year tenancy as life happens to them as well. It is seen as wasting money apparently, but horseriding and holidays are more temporary but not wasting money??
Rent seekers gone crazy
I’ve often wondered what insurance has to do with it.
Worker’s compensation insurance got rorted to the hilt, third party accident insurance got rorted. They stuffed both for people who really needed it. They had to find a new rort!
Exactly health care is expensive and it should be expensive. 🙏🏻👏🏻
And a majority of Australians don't benefit only for the burocrats
Gillard ,Shorten... say no more😊
Now you have foreign students (NOT citizens) saying they deserve to be on the NDIS because they were bashed and developed disabilities as a result. Seeing how all this craziness is unfolding, and all that racism guilt shaming happening, I don't doubt the NDIS will be expanded to include the whole world.
people on NDIS who can afford their own care
The NDIS is costing us considerably more than the old system and the outcomes for clients have worsened, the only ones getting rich are the army of fly by night providers bleeding the system dry.
There's always a bigger waste of money on the way. We've had the racist Voice, Albo's air miles etc.
Sadly, I think net zero will eclipse it.
Get rid of it and bring back the old system.
The whole point of the NDIS was to provide choice and to let the free market deal with it. We know free market equals rorts.
they need to have some control over the NDIS providers. i know businesses that buy a house for 1.5mill they spend 100k on renos 200k for equipment. then the NDIS pays $250,000 a year to house a high need patient. just to put a roof over their heads. then the cost for nursing and such. over a million a year per person time 4 for a 4 bed house.
I agree and know for a fact this is typical…a client who cannot live with others due to aggressive behaviour.
@@Jacqui-ie9kw it's good we provide for these people and their families. A person with a cert 4 in disability services are being payed 60 to 80 dollars an hour so wonder what the service providers are charging probably double that.
Ask the police about the mental health problems on the streets
A lot of it is drug related. Also from shitty policies.
Enough money to spend on illegally fortune seekers?
Rorters need to be named . There are plenty out there.
That shrink is not a doctor… how uneducated ..,
Needs to be abolished its a rort and a gravy train.
carers 7/24 just employed to keep the client company!
beautiful roast meals cooked
1 client to 1 whole house.
1 bdrm for the carer 24/7
if client is hospitalised carer still gets paid to sit and keep company!
Well if Aus government didn't give so much money to ukraine there would be alot more to spend locally.
If UsA supports Ukraine there is no need Aus to follow suit.
If you have autism how does that get your house cleaned, lawn mowed and meals prepared.
Sorry no capital gains and land depreciation will be
I mean the people who want to use medical care should pay gor their ward. It cannot be cheap. Medical ward and social workers do a very important jobb and should be very well paid. Medicines and machines are expensive. All the people should go to work and only those who are severe sick and dissabled should have an amont of help. They don't need to have services like a king family its not their fault that they are disabled neither the society
The guy in the purple shirt's a crook, he could be a politician the amount of times he said 'broken system'.
I am on the DSP but cannot get training for work I am not on the NDIS & I threw in the towel years ago
NDIS does NOT provide training for work. It is only meant to pay for support workers to help you when you study or work. If you study 10 hours a week, a support worker will only help you for 1. So really not that helpful and you have to be very judicious in how you use that support worker. And that is only if you are capable of study, which many in the NDIS are not.
But the agency only want to know about DSP if your on NDIS meaning no funding or help because they make more money out of NDIS less help for others
It’s an absolute bloody rort 😡😡
Treatment is better than cure: give kids a loving, stable home and live good lives. Kids behaviours will improve. Also, be careful what a mum puts in her body while she's pregnant. Eat healthy.and avoid drinking plain tap water. Have love at home and communities and kids will be happy.
Meanwhile I can’t get either my autistic kids into therapy to send the $$$ allotted to them
.Brand new carolla hybrid parks at st francis cathedral adelaide every sunday NDIS signage on it. Taking a client to mass billing the govt eye watering cost
Need to itemize those numbers.
Both sides have good points
Hard to use😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢
He cpuldnt even amswer the question
Ahmed thinks Australia is India. Sky News Get rid of him. Australia is the number one in the world. What are you talking about? Ahmad
Someone out there is rich
No that will be 356 Billion on nuclear submarines.
Hey Beamish, still hanging out here I notice. You belong at the abc mate.
@@Design_no Nah I have my own sole trader business. How about you? Is mum and dad still providing you a home?
@@David_Beamessole trader? I knew a shoe maker once. He made the whole shoe though, not just the sole.
Have to remember the submarines are potential providers of people with disability. Submarines - NDIS, go very well together.
@@David_BeamesWe all know you have a sole business, with an R in front eh Reames?😂
Waste of money 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Oh boy…I bet you haven’t cared for disabled people. Some require around the clock care. Or do you think carers should be available and working 24hrs / day. Get real.
I thought the introduction of ndis was a good idea to help the most in need,but has been rorted by every man and his dog,like most government schemes.