Iguanodon: Your Dinosaurs Are Wrong
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- čas přidán 26. 07. 2024
- / ydaw -- Iguanodon's been with us for nearly as long as paleontology itself. Consequently, the way we reconstruct this animal has changed over and over, right down to the present day.
Opening skit music by Jamal Green: / jamalgreenmusic
(used with permission)
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Contents:
00:00 Opening
01:29 Overview
02:54 Early Ideas
10:11 Mastication Implications
15:20 Spiky Sloth-Lizard
24:08 Waterhouse-Hawkins
34:07 Bernissart I
43:30 20th Century Forelimbs
50:11 Bernissart II
55:58 Conclusion
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Sources & Links:
Follow the link below for the full list, as it's far too big to fit into the description this time!
docs.google.com/document/d/1d...
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Photo Credits:
Eastern Great Egret Photo by Basile Morin
CC BY SA 4.0
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
Saltwater Crocodile Photo by AngMoKio
CC BY SA 2.5
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
Cincinnati Paramylodon Skull Photo by James St. John
CC BY 2.0
www.flickr.com/photos/jsjgeol...
Iguanodon museum mount hands photo by Ballista
CC BY SA 3.0
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
Iguanodon in the glass case at Royal Belgian Institute of Natural Sciences by Fernando Losada Rodríguez (aka Drow male)
CC BY-SA 4.0
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
Vue de la salle des dinosaures, muséum des sciences naturelles de Belgique by Benoît Prieur
CC BY-SA 4.0
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
I. bernissartensis et I. atherfieldensis by Bernard J. Noël
CC BY-SA 3.0
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
Crystal Palace Iguanodon’s Head in Profile by Flickr user Kevan
CC BY 2.0
www.flickr.com/photos/kevando...
Crystal Palace Iguanodons by Flickr user Jim Linwood
CC BY 2.0
www.flickr.com/photos/brighto...
Mantellisaurus Skin Impression by NHMdinolabs
Used with written permission
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Rhinoceros Iguana Photo by LordToran
Public Domain
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
California Condors Photo by Scott Lee
CC0
www.publicdomainpictures.net/...
Plate of the Saull Specimen, unknown engraver
Public Domain
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
Hadrosaurus mount photo
public domain
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ha...
Mary Ann Mantell portrait
Public domain
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
Gideon Mantell portrait
Public domain
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
Mantell’s Iguanodon teeth drawing
Public domain
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
Hawkins’ Sydenham Studio Illustration
Public domain
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
Dinner Party in the Crystal Palace Iguanodon Illustration
Public domain
upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...
Bernissart Iguanodon Illustration by Gustave Lavalette
Public domain
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
Bernissart Iguanodon Illustration #2 by Gustave Lavalette
Public domain
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
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Your Dinosaurs Are Wrong
Attn: Steven Bellettini
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Grand Rapids, MI 49505
'YDAW' is a series that makes paleontology accessible to the general public using familiar (but wrong) dinosaur toys.
#ep26 #episode26 #YDAW #dinosaurs #Iguanodon #InternationalDinosaurDay - Věda a technologie
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This was a great episode
The intro was first class, also, could you please do an episode on the Tyrannosaurus, I know that you guys did one on the skeleton a few years ago, but this time, maybe on the actual animal. I know you must have other things planned because I know how much research goes into episodes, since that tour of the studio that you guys did a while back, so just a request.
That was an awesome episode!
@@DINO_X65 That's a dinosaur that I'm sure they get a lot of requests for, but they've mentioned they have no plans to cover... at present.
Oooo! I request Atopodentatus unicus the strange marine herbivore!
While referencing archaeology not palaeontology, I have just written "the Victorians had an uncomfortable fondness for dynamite" in my dissertation. Probably the best line I've ever written
And people still have a fascination with blowing things up, it's just a lot harder to get a hold of now
Thing like this it's what keeps me hopeful for my bachelor's dissertation. I'm nervous as fuck, but being able to reference a literal arms race on a submicroscopic scale is going to be awesome.
@@visiblur All the best to you whenever you get started on that dissertation!
I can't get too mad at them though.
If I consumed laudanum on a daily basis, I'd probably blow up a fossil bed sooner or later as well.
My house got Heinrich Schliemanned.
"Talk Dumb, Get The Thumb" needs to be on your merch I would happily buy that LOL
Yes! I'd buy it.
YES!
As would I!
Great idea!
Yes! Absolutely
I'm a longtime fan of the show, and would have the older YDAW episodes playing on loop in the office during my undergraduate and master's years. So seeing my name flash up on screen as part of a citation and seeing an adaptation of research and reconstructions that I was part of in the YDAW artstyle was a pretty amazing moment. Thank you for continuing to make awesome videos! :D
that is so lovely
It comes full circle.
Timestamp? I looked through the citations list and didn't see "Matt Dempsey" anywhere on it...
@@_veronica_r I just looked up the full list in the gdrive link in the description. There is a "Dempsey M" in the last study cited.
@@_veronica_r there is in fact, a Dempsey M. listed as the third author in the last citation (2020) on the Google doc.
I appreciate how you clarified that the workers who theorized the size of the animal weren't idiots just because they were off in their size estimations. I think way too often we like to point and laugh at people from the past who made such mistakes, not realizing we ourselves could or would likely make the same errors as you pointed out.
Yes, totally agree.
Ye we are able to use their knowledge as a basis for our knowledge.
Humans aren't massively more clever, if at all, than our ancestors we can just build on their achievements.
Exactly this. Science changes so incredibly quickly. I've literally had information from my first year of biochem be retconned on my second year and again in my third year.
We build on the wrong guesses of our predecessor to hopefully reach the right answers ourselves. Well, the right answers until we ourselves are proven wrong.
This so much! People of today tend to have a pretty prejudiced view of peoples of the past as being just plain 'dumber' than we are. People of the past were not stupid or less intelligent by any means! They were us, that's it, plain and simple. They just had more limitations and fewer giants' shoulders to stand on, and they became giants themselves. The amount of genius present in designs of early structures, machines, old tools, etc. is completely astounding. When I took apart an old air hammer and found essentially one moving part, just with a series of holes and galleys for air to pass through depending on where the part was, just left me astonished at the ingenuity, of how somebody created something basic to solve a complex purpose. The fact that the basic design of the internal combustion engine hasn't changed in over 100 years should convince anyone that we aren't any smarter than they were, we just have more knowledge.
I completely agree
This is like the episode that the opening of a series have teased since the begining, and man does it delivers in the hype
I actually lost my breath for a moment. The iguanodon is my favorite dinosaur and my friends actually hate when they get brought up because I geek so hard.
More like the Outro, but yes.
Like the Bionicle LEGO rewind
@@Mael_Str0M my childhood right there lol
@@GuyNamedSean your friends are missing out
Ok but are we not going to talk about the Little Assistant cosplaying as David Attenborough?
They had a teaser post a while back discussing the difficulty of making tiny dinosaur pants.
His name is Bertrand :D
Or maybe even richard?
Ha! I had feeling that's what that was but I wasn't entirely sure
No it was Hammond from Jurassic Park.
What I Expected: a lot of iguanodons
What I Got: a whole-ass history lesson
What It Was: awesome
The more I learn about science history, the more I feel suspicious that any time a woman is mentioned in passing (like "oh, my wife showed these rocks to me and _I_ figured out they were significant!"), it's likely she was waaaaaay more involved than she ended up being given credit for, especially the farther back in history you go.
Exactly this.
Good point. Although that last sentence isnt true. For example late medieval womens possibilities are greater then 19th cent ones in quite some points in europe. Emancipation isnt one straight climb. As is nothing really in history.
Modernity is not at the top of a straight incline in every regard. Even if it wants to be.
I love the image of a fancy Parisian party interrupted by, "Look! Fossils!"
"Hey dude, check out these weird ancient teeth I found! Pretty cool, right?"
This happens to this day in some fields. I know a guy who walked around a meeting with some a strange insect, asking anyone to tell him what it was. Turns out it was an extremely odd basal true bug.
Same guy did the same thing a few years later with a hermit crab parasite. That one turned out to be a collembolan.
@@themecoptera9258 Holy hell talk about luck.
@@themecoptera9258 I had a "local ecology" class once, and was delighted to call the teacher over to an insect on the doorframe, ask, "What is that?" 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘩𝘢𝘷𝘦 𝘪𝘵 𝘣𝘦 𝘱𝘦𝘳𝘵𝘪𝘯𝘦𝘯𝘵 𝘵𝘰 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘤𝘭𝘢𝘴𝘴.
Honestly it's amazing that the earliest paleontologists to work on Iguanodon got anything right, given that they had absolutely zero context for this kind of creature. Despite getting a lot wrong, they managed to work out that it was an herbivore, the initial size estimate wasn't off by all *that* much, and they even figured out that unlike any modern reptile, it chewed its food, and they even pieced together roughly how it did so.
“Talk dumb, get the thumb.” I’m stealing that.
lol
"Talk dumb, get the thumb! We don't need to leave that in"
YES YOU DID! =D
make 'talk dumb, get the thumb' the next 'you're talking shit for someone in thagomizer range'
Iguanodon: The originator of YDAW arguments.
?????
@@AverageAlien ydaw means your dinosaurs are wrong
@@gamingwithjay3 and?
@@mareksicinski3726 reread the first comment that started this thread, lol
Fantastic episode as usual! There is actually one more Non-avian dinosaur used on a coat of arms, the Russian Chernyshevsky district has a Kulindadromeus rampant on its coat of arms.
Liliensternus is on the coat of arms of Bedheim as well!
I meant 'used as a supporter,' there are actually a few non-avian dinos used as charges
@@StevenBellettini I see, seems i misunderstood. Thanks for the correction! :)
I just looked it up. It's also on the flag, which is excellent.
"Talk dumb, get the thumb"
Soooo....when are we getting a "Talk dumb, get the thumb" tshirt and or stickers lol?
TAKE MY MONEY!
As a Belgian who has been obsessed with dinosaurs ever since I was a little boy, and a big fan of this show ever since I found it a couple of years ago, I can not tell you how long I've been waiting for this episode. I was so excited when it was announced that Iguanodon was next. And now that it is here, I can say that I loved this episode. This talk may not be dumb, but I will gladly give it the thumb.
The iguanodons in Brussels were probably the first dinosaurs I ever saw outside of a picture book back in primary school, so it's amazing to see an episode on them mentioning the ones from Belgium.
Proud Belgian here as well ☺️
proud belgian here!!!
Man I've been waiting for this episode since like the beginning of this series lol
Jojo!
Joshu being based
hi joshu
The idea of combining a prehensile tongue with a chopping beak would make iguanodon lunchtime more like a horror film!
Bloody tongues falling all over the place
Aah so that's why snapping turtles that have a sharp scissor like beaks and use their tongues as lures all have no tongue left...? you make no sense m8
Their tongues aren't prehensile in the way a giraffe's is. Generally animals with beaks and without soft lips can't stick their tongues out of their mouths.
@@psilovecybin5940 Snapping turtles dont have tongues long enough to come close to their beak. That argument makes no sense, even more so when you consider the original comment is clearly joking.
audibly screamed when i got the notification
i'm way too excited about this chanel
same! I was like "YESSS It's been too long!!!"
Pyritized Fossils: Gold Plastic Syndrome For Paleontologists
would love to see a video explanation on the "death pose", since many fossils seem to be found with the neck bent back unnaturally
In the velociraptor episode he talks about the fighting dino fossils and mentions the neck might have been bent back as the flesh and skin dried out
I'm way too late to the conversation, but as a pet bird owner who sadly buried many birds (pets and wildlife rescue) they just kind of do that.
When they're actively dying they bend their head back like that. Some mammals do it too.
I love the way Iguanadon has stayed relatively popular in dinosaur media after all this time still appearing occasionally in games and movies to this day. The main reason I mention this because certain early dinosaurs get barely any love anymore for some weird reason.
Megalosaurus needs a lot more love imo
I find you everywhere 💀
@@thebestgirlwithpooeyes9531he really is
A small nitpick at around 52:00
Quadrupeds would actually be less likely to sink into loose soil than bipeds because they spread their mass over 4 points.
I mean they would sink easier but prob scape easier
YAY finally i get to see what Aladar actually looked like
The genuine paleontologist look, voice, temperament, humor, and knowledge. Exquisite.
The Iguanodon wastebasket taxonomy phenomenon was far more wide-reaching than just Lower Cretaceous taxa. By the early 2000s, some workers still apparently classed Late Cretaceous taxa as Iguanodon, as is inferable from certain documentaries at the time, like how Dinosaur Planet referred to their Rhabdodon (an ornithopod more basal than Iguanodon) as a species of Iguanodon. Likewise, Late Jurassic taxa, like the British, hilariously-named Cumnoria were also at one point lumped within Iguanodon.
“Are you watching a dinosaur toy in Dino clothes talk about lizards?”
YES.
I've recently been binge watching this show and I must say - the graphic profile has been adapted with great success! The quality of this episode (besides the actual content) is so nice to look at! Great work, from one graphic designer to another!
I know there is no chance that this is true, but my mental cannon about Bernissart, is that the iguanodonts used the place as a "elephant graveyard" sort of thing. Which i think could be a pretty cool behavior
You may or may not know this already, but it turns out that elephant graveyards are the results of flooding pushing elephant corpses into the “graveyard”. The true nature of the area is that a whole bunch of bodies get caught and remain in that area, and the fact that so many elephant remains are found there is notable simply because elephants are big and noteworthy.
@@KnufWons not even, it's not a case of misreading the evidence. There is no evidence. There is not a single example of an elephant graveyard ever found. It's an idea that comes from old pulp stories of darkest africa and people just accepted the idea and it stuck in the cultural consciousness.
Almost an hour long! I feel spoiled. Thank you YDAW and all the people supporting it to make videos like this happen.
In my opinion, this has to be one of the greatest CZcams channels available nowadays. As a person who graduated both in the fields of science and visual arts, this kind of content is just the holy grail. Thank you for your educational service! Cheers from Portugal!
11:27 damn I wrote a paper on this for D. Altus. Memories
YESSSS WE'VE BEEN WAITING
9:10 that ain’t no iguanadon. That’s the rhedosaurus from the beast of 20,000 fathoms.
Well, it gets even weirder, because something like this happened more than once with the same kinds of animals. We have a mass deposit of Iguanodon and Mantellisaurus here in Germany as well. It contained around 15 individuals according to Norman's paper. Actually it seems that the sediment containing them also sank into a karst fissure. The similarities don't end there, because all bones are pyritized. It's all very very weird...
As someone who works a bit with both source criticism and dissemination of science this video really impressed me. Super complex and narrow concepts and ideas really come to life in a way that is interesting to people who aren't biologists or paleontologists. Kudos for this.
Glad to see this channel still going. I have always loved the hosts sense of humor sprinkled in through the fantastic animations.
In case you didn't understand the jaw mechanics, here's an animation that better represents it: czcams.com/video/6Sr5is7-wdk/video.html
Thank you! I've always struggled with the various descriptions and graphics of it that I've seen, but this actually shows what is going on. Super helpful!
Thank you kind stranger
(1) This is by far the best class on Paleontology I've seen on CZcams. Thank you!
(2) I had the opportunity of visiting the Iguanodon fossils in the Brussels Museum. What a sight! I could stay hours just looking at those giants! Even though I understand the necessity and value of displaying casts in place of actual fossilized dinosaur remains, these cause a deeper psychological effect in me. Man, I'm really looking at what once was an actual, living dinosaur from millions of years ago! Again, it was a remarkable experience.
The crystal palace “pseudo-beak” kinda looks like they were using rhinoceros lips as reference, which would make sense since they gave it a nose horn as well.
Also, maybe the iguanodon bonebeds are a sort of “elephant graveyard.” Maybe older iguanodons went to the swamp in search of food that was easier to chew, and ended up just dying of old age in that area?
I was thinking something alone the same lines. And maybe the occasional younger adult iguanodons were badly injured or ill enough to be abandoned by the herd, and relocated to this area, whereas juvenile members of the herd would be looked after right until death due to maternal instinct. It's hard to think of a reoccuring natural disaster that would only affect such a specific area and demographic, so it does seem to feel somewhat intentional. Although as humans we are prone to seeing intent where there is none.
I really enjoy the way he puts things into context. He always reminds us not just WHAT happened throughout the history of researching the animal, but WHY the researchers thought the way they did. It's so refreshing to have things framed that way and not "hurr hurr past scientists dumb because they don't know what we know". Keep up the great work!
I am from Maidstone and went to the grammar school there. That coat of arms was on our school uniform. Strangely enough I just found out that the site of where it was dug up was long since built over with housing estates where one of my friends lived. The iganadon is still very famous and there is a cast copy of it in the local museum - which along with a smuggled mummy from Egypt is one of the two main things to see there.
YAAAAAAAASSSSS!!!
Finally, a critical look at one of the dinosaurs with famously problematic restorations.
When I was studying at Cambridge in the early ‘90’s I had a friend on a similar course to mine whose name just happened to be David Norman and who kept getting letters from children about dinosaurs in his pidgin hole as they were addressed to David Norman, Cambridge University as far as I am aware they were all forwarded correctly.
I'm a simple person. I see Iguanodon, I click.
Perfect timing as I just finished cooking my meal and was looking for a vid to watch while eating xD Bless
'talk dumb get the thumb' would be an amazing shirt
At long last
The iguanodon episode
Wait, is this a very high quality video on a very interesting topic with a good intro, filmed with a very good camera with a professional script and a pleasant presenter/host with a good sense of humor?
*Why are there so few views and subscribers?*
P.S. Thanks youtube recommendations for showing it to me
Great episode. Though I was distracted by that Barney in the background, I still managed to digest all the information in this way too short episode.
I look forward to part 2! :P
Only 15 minutes in and I’m already sad that it will be over soon. I don’t want it to end. I wish there could be a new Your Dinosaurs Are Wrong episode every week.
13:30 I just wanted to point out that some birds like the Friarbirds (genus Philemon) for example the Noisy Friarbird (Philemon corniculatus) do have cheek-like soft tissue at the base of their bills although I can't find any research on what kind of selection pressure gave them those weird cheeks nor do I know if there are osteological correlates on Philemon corniculatus' skull. Worth investigating !
excited for sequel! Iguanodon 2: "No, they did not have wings."
As a Belgian, I couldn’t be more proud of this documentary, I always felt very connected with the history of iguanodon.
17:46 Liliensternus is also on the coat of arms of Bedheim, Germany
17:47 the flag of Chernyshevsk, in Russia has a Kulindadromeus on it
Just discovered this series, love to see it! Would love to hear an episode on troodon, or possibly the strange humanoid-dinosaur image that always seems to accompany troodon.
"Talk Dumb, Get The Thumb." This needs to be put on a sticker, shirt, or button with a YDAW illustration of Iguanodon. I will buy it all. Make it for Iguanodon's 200 year discovery for next year in 2022! It would be perfect and I would again buy it all! :)
The one thing I noticed growing up is that there was never a single consistent depiction of Iguanodon and it bothered the hell out of my OCD.
"Talk dumb get the thumb"
Yessyeysysysyhs
Iguanadon was one of my favorite dinosaurs as a kid, and I had the upright, spike-thumbed version fixed in my head, so I was surprised to see you criticize it, and then fell in love with the whole story of how we came to better understand iguanadon, and it's still one of my favorites, just in a different way.
32:08 oh my god that hadrosaurus painting is hilarious. it looks like some dudes in a suit creeping around in a golden age hollywood b movie monster flick.
the hip and legs of both paintings are human looking, lord it creeps me out.
I’m a new fan but I already watched most of the series, I love how detailed and how you see the creature change into something that was real, would love to see sarcosuchus or baryonyx
Wake up babe, new YDAW :0
Huzzah! Your work is always the best. I knew you were going to bring up Sternberg's Mummy Edmontosaurus. I'd love an episode on Edmontosaurus itself, but what I want most is an episode on a Plesiosaur.
Wow, you two absolutely crushed it with this episode.
Would not another possibility as to why the site has so many iguanodons be this: ?
Perhaps the swamp-lake was too deep for most non-swimming animals to traverse (including juvenile iguanodons), but just the right depth for adult iguanodons to walk through. But then there are sudden changes of depth at the sinkholes, and these large, non-swimming animals die? The borders of this lake might be sloped such that smaller animals pick up that it's getting too deep for them and thus never venture out to the areas with the more sudden changes in depth.
But maybe that's crazy. It seems that most contemporary, terrestrial herbivores can swim when they need too.
The way you talk and explain things puts me at complete ease. You make exploring this special interest of mine so much fun, thank you.
It has been so long! So excited to see this. Hope you guys are on a roll now to make one of these every month or 2.
I love that Bertrand got dressed up as David Attenborough for the introduction😂❤
The episode I’ve been waiting for since it was often out in the credits of old videos!
17:43 Actually, Russia's Chernyshevsky District has Kulindadromeus on its coat of arms!
I have been waiting for ages to see this and loved every last second of it! Thank you for all your excellent work and for taking your time to make this happen!
Finally! Iguanodon is such a classic. Thank you.
I loved the Richard Attenborough impression that Bertrand did!!!
I LOVE the little dude's Sir David outfit. Perfection.
"talk dumb, get the thumb"
Liked and subscribed just for this.
May I suggest spinosaurus? I know the research would be frustrating, as the reconstructions change about every year, but I think it's a very interesting topic!
Considering that they only just found a better preserved tail within the last year or two (not to mention one of the best examples of it ever found being literally bombed) this would be a super interesting one.
Spinosaurus was already done, and he already seems aware of most of the new research
They are certainly going to do an update video at some point but as far as I know it hasn’t been announced yet
Take this as you will; your site has become "comfort media" for me. I suppose you could think of yourself as paleontological macaroni & cheese. Thanks so much for the fine research, enthusiasm, wry humor and animation.
This episode is less "your toy is inaccurate" and more "your toy is a springboard for launching a conversation about the formation of paleontology as told from the perspective of THE OG dinosaur", won't catch me complaining tho XD
This really is incredible content. I'm so amazed at the level of work and research that goes into every episode.
God I love this channel so much. Definitely becoming a patron when I can afford to. So stoked to finally get the Iguanadon episode and it was even more interesting than I expected. Can't wait for the next. Also, "talk dumb, get the thumb" needs to be on some merch asap lol
Been waiting for this for so long! Thank you for all the content, folks! Already excited for the next video 🎉
This is the 1st episode of YDAW I've come across and it's AMAZING! The quality of the science, the animations, the illustrations and the presentation of the material are all just brilliant. Well done.
I love how you speak like you have 75k more things to say. I do that too. Appreciate the excitement and knowing there's more to come!
All I can say is that this dinosaur is a heckin’ chonker.
My amateur intuition of a thumb-spike is that it seems pretty multi use:
- intraspecific competition
- defense against predators
- rooting in ground for tubers maybe?
- could defo be for breaking into woody materials
The animations in these videos are always insane and so helpful. Thank you!
This is the first ydaw I've ever watched, and one of the longest CZcams videos I have ever watched. Awesome show. I enjoyed it from start to finish.
Very excited to unveil our interview next month. Excellent work, as always.
What happend at bernisart?
Scientist: dedicating years of research to figuring out what it is.
Me: Simple. iguanadon graveyard
I could listen to a whole more hour discussing that sinkhole fossil bed. It's so interesting.
I found your show randomly recently and I love it! I REALLY appreciate all the detail and research and the explanations of the bones you do! Keep it up!
This super-episode was amazing! I enjoy YDAW so much everytime. Thanks for this one! ^^
Omg! I finally saw this in my recommended! Whoo new vid! And the first thing I said when it was an iguanodon is "talk dumb, get the thumb!"
FINALLY! ITS BEEN SO LOOOONNNGGGG honestly it's been so long that I think I've gotten a grey hair 😂
oh my god an hour of YDAW
This is one of the best channels on CZcams. All the details that you cover it's something nobody else on CZcams is doing. I just came across your channel recently, and I am absolutely fascinated with the detailed work that you do. I have learned so much! Thank you for doing what you do !!!! Keep up the good work!!!!