How Do I Tell Good Stories?
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- čas přidán 11. 09. 2024
- Jake Parker, Lee White, and Will Terry discuss separating your identity from your art, introducing new work to your following, and the keys to drawing engaging stories.
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Show notes and links- www.svslearn.c...
Illustration by Analise Black / ajugabee
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Jake Parker- www.mrjakepark...
Will Terry- www.willterry....
Lee White- www.leewhiteil...
Produced by Daniel Tu at Clover Studio: cloverstud.io
Shownotes by Lily Howell: lilycamille.com
I agree we lost the ability, as a society, to disagree and still love each other. I love to hear you 3 because you discuss everything freely.
Internet and social media have brought the illusion that it's made us closer. It's done the opposite. People want to be in their own little spaces/bubbles/worlds.
@@MushroomKingdom722Couldn't agree more. There was, in my opinion, a balanced point around the 2000s, but then it all went downhill.
I laugh at just about every episode, but this one had me rolling! LOL The money tips song🤣🤣🤣I will add something here that may shed a little light on the mental health part of being an illustrator, and not taking it to heart that you are what you create. Right out of high school I met my soon to be husband, whose mother promised me Disney level star studded fame if I drew her children's work for her. It took me years to extricate myself from that situation. I stuck around, out of obligation, fear, time investment cost, all the things! It wasn't until I acknowledged my time is the only asset I will never get back. So, here I am, finally doing the thing I want to do, with a solid head on my shoulders. I am older, wiser and a whole lot better as a result, however I am hoping my story will shed light on the simple fact that yes, you must start somewhere. Have your eyes open, don't get taken by a narcissist, however, you aren't getting roller coaster Disney level status from the gate, you have to put the time in.
I think what Giuseppe is trying to say is to stop guessing what publishers are looking for in a portfolio based on what is already published. Because the books sitting on shelves have been created at least a year prior to the moment we see them.
100%. I think he's also passionate about illustrators finding their own unique voice, rather than copying what appears to be working right now at this moment in time. As like you say, published books that are trendy right now were actually illustrated 1-3 years ago, so by illustrating 'on trend' you will potentially be 2-6 years out of date by the time your book releases. He's definitely not talking about minimum mechanical skills, or how to illustrate a picture book in general, he's more talking about submitting to agents and art directors once you have established a solid portfolio and for them to turn around and say 'go to a bookstore etc'; basically "change your style to look like everyone else". Would love for him to go on the Podcast to debate this.
On arguing with people and still accepting/loving who they are: I agree up to a point. People can't agree on every single thing and shouldn't be expected to... But personally, I recently broke up with a friend because they were touting a lot of incel ideas (like women need to serve more of a traditional homemaker role in order to be accepted by men or to be more feminine), and I (a cis-woman) just cannot and will not agree with that. I don't hate the guy (they're my coworker in a small workplace, so it'd be awkward and a waste of energy if I did)... But I can't be friends with them if they expect me to go along with those ideas.
Anyway, not exactly related to art, but thought I'd chime in about that lol. Love the podcast and been listening since episode one!
@Will it’s “shoot for the MOON” and “swing for the FENCE.” 😂😂😂
Thanks for the great podcast!
Lee, the quote you were trying to say is the following:
“A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines. With consistency a great soul has simply nothing to do. He may as well concern himself with his shadow on the wall. Speak what you think now in hard words, and tomorrow speak what tomorrow thinks in hard words again, though it contradicts every thing you said today. - 'Ah, so you shall be sure to be misunderstood.' - Is it so bad, then, to be misunderstood? Pythagoras was misunderstood, and Socrates, and Jesus, and Luther, and Copernicus, and Galileo, and Newton, and every pure and wise spirit that ever took flesh. To be great is to be misunderstood.” Ralph Waldo Emerson
the other thing about the George Lucas story is Star Wars wasn't even his first movie. THX and American Graffiti are probably where he learned to develop the strategy he used on Star Wars.
25:24 "Money tips from Lee, are gonna help set you free-!" ❤
Have you listened to Giuseppe Castellano’s interview with Mary GrandPre? It actually made me think of 3PP because she touches on a lot of points that you talk about on this channel, especially about sustaining a satisfying career as an artist.
🎵At SVS the bunny won't skip Leeeeee's money tips🎵
The jingle needs to be "Lee White, helps you get your money right!"
Hey Jake - I’m digging the SkullChaser tee shirt you’ve got on. Will you be restocking them later this year? I’m hoping for a navy blue one. 😊
I think the thing with politics is that it’s no longer ideology & a difference of opinion. Church & State have merged to the point that “morality” is outweighing ethics, history, science & logic, there’s a correlation between personal beliefs & the restriction of people’s rights.
I dont see the publisher as the problem, I see their market value and placement and promotional marketing funds.. as the problem. First deal or not.. if they dont put up, they can shut up. I was looking when I came to you, end of conversation. Its nice to get along, but I dont have a need to "belong" and that reflects. And honesty is not their policy, its making money. So, when you know the costs, they dont hold all the cards to themselves. Personality, and full field of products for recognition within them, tend to get in the way more than money.
Hi Team, as always that was another great episode. QUESTION: do you cap the episode at around 60 minutes for your schedules? The reason I ask is that I as a viewer/listener would watch listen for 2-3 hours. I frequently watch other shows that go over an hour. Personally I’d love to hear you guys discuss topics and answer questions for 2-3 hours. I’m just curious to know why you cap it at 60 minutes.
I love your show it’s the best. Thank you!
I've wondered if we should go longer, or keep it at an hour. We might try that once.
The main reason keep it at an hour is we are all itching to get to the other stuff we have/want to do. We record wednesday mornings, chat for about 30 minutes before we hit record, do the podcast, hit the stop button, then have a meeting about SVS for another 30-60 min. After 2.5 hours we're hungry and go grab lunch and get to work on our to do lists.
@@jakeparker44 thanks Jake. I figured it was schedule based. I guess I just love the show too much lol. I appreciate everything you guys serve us. I’ve learned so much.
I would like to hear the Podcast about Sunk Cost spoken at about 6.05. I could not find it in the Show notes and links.
@57:36 I just went through this very thing with a self publisher. I hated the process and got almost no wiggle room with the art. On top of that I was very purely compensated for six months work. It’s honestly put me off doing any more kids books. 😩
You are such an inspiration 0:51 ❤
I believe that Mary Grandpre had a flat fee for the first three books and then renegotiated for book 4 and beyond.
thanks! i'll look into it and correct that on the next podcast. do you happen to have a source for that info?
@@leewhite134 I'm sorry I'm not sure how much I can say, but let's just say that I interned with a certain art agency about 20 years ago and Grandpre had taken them on as an agent to renegotiate her contract after the third book blew up. You can see a distinct difference in quality from the third cover to the fourth. I'm a lousy source. Sorry I can't be more helpful.
50:25 How to tell a good story
Re: 30:00- What is it about "pros" that are so willing to dispense advice as if their pov and experience is representative of an entire global multifaceted industry? As if their experience and preferences are a window to the entire picture. They present their ideas like they know all (not referring to 3PP folks). I see this with designers all the time. They might have been in a single job for 6+ years (maybe less) at an ad agency or a brand and suddenly they think that whatever their particular job is, describes the whole. Suddenly they're the world's foremost authority on all graphic design roles everywhere, unaware of what they don't know. Is it a social media thing? Is it just for attention? Maybe it's an insecurity thing resulting from having to claw your way to survive in creative careers. Maybe it's just human. It's very common among artists that work in games. (I'm looking at you Brainstorm). SHOTS FIRED lol ;). Even in design, the aspects of the job vary widely and profoundly between industries and settings (advertising, brand side, tech, etc.) Sometimes infuriatingly so. Don't even get me started on the term "art director." It's almost become a meaningless word because it conveys no meaning as to what that job is. I think 3PP is generally great at exploring various perspectives that differ from Will, Lee, and Jake's experience. I love those episodes where you guys explore roads you haven't taken in addition to giving us all your gems of hard earned knowledge. Artists need to be less philosophical. Philosophy is not their area of expertise and it gets in their own way. Spend less time worrying about things like the definition of art or how someone does something different from you and focus on thriving as a working artist. And especially, don't take a dump on the people coming behind you because you resent how hard it was to gain success.
What did the Brainstorm guys say out of curiosity?
@@mimi_simon I’ve taken several courses from Brainstorm and their instructors are very talented. It’s not about what they say but how they present their point of view as being standard. One pixel brush is notoriously similar. It comes off as overly “bro-ee.” Like bro you should make all swords like Final Fantasy bro because like that’s the best way to draw swords bro and by the way bro never draw trees found in Europe because that’s like too white bro. You can get a lot of value from Brainstorm but I’d be selective based on what you can find out about the teacher just like anything. Some of the courses to me felt like the value came in the first 2 lessons and stopped. The other thing I noticed is just lots of splaining. Not knowing your audience. I prefer SVS format but that’s just me. Online class is hard on all sides of the equation.
@@mimi_simon It's not so much what they say but how they present their point of view. Just a lot of know-it-all bro vibes in the several courses I took from people that have had like 3 jobs. Lots of splaining and taste critique. Bro you shouldn't draw trees found in Europe because that's like too white bro and use blue because I like blue bro. Lots of talented people over there. Results will vary by class and teacher and Brainstorm can be a valuable resource for networking. There's a ton of gamer artists on CZcams that are essentially the same way. Everything they do is fire lol.
Me scrubbing cabinets
Living on a prayer Lee. I hope it's on your lower back. hahahaha
luckily not that bad, but close!!
@@leewhite134
Did Will just say, you can win the Caldecott and become a millionaire? Is that for real?
it depends on many factors of course. There is the money that comes in from the book that won of course, but then your whole career is elevated from that point on exponentially.
@@leewhite134 thanks Lee, I only ask because one of my buddies Jason Chin won the Caldecott I think two years ago. He’s a pretty chill dude but I don’t think he’s at millionaire status yet. Maybe in a few years.