The Truth About Sex, Love, and Lust | The Lila Rose Podcast E86
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- čas přidán 27. 07. 2024
- Is sexual freedom good? What does Christianity teach about sexual pleasure? What if I am infertile? What about contraception? Today we discuss all things sex. Many people believe that Christianity is antithetical to sexual freedom and pleasure. This was the perspective that Dr. Christopher West, Th.D., had before he discovered a teaching pronounced by a Catholic Pope. Today I sit down with Christopher West, the President of the Theology of the Body Institute, to discuss the beauty of God’s plan for human sexuality. We discuss the philosophical background behind Christianity’s teaching on sex, the role of pleasure in sex, if there is ever a good time for contraception, celibacy for the Kingdom and much more.
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Timestamps:
00:00 Intro Sequence
00:36 Introduction
01:43 Every Life
02:37 Welcome Christopher!
03:24 Christopher's Background
05:19 An Experiment that Changed His Life
08:20 Finding The Theology of the Body
10:14 The Number 1 Response He Gets
11:13 Christopher's Biggest Regret in College
13:59 Philosophy Behind Theology of the Body
15:52 What is a "Person"?
17:29 Freedom is the Means to Love
18:46 The Love Between Persons
20:37 Is Consent Enough?
22:29 Indispensable, Irreplaceable, Unrepeatable
26:38 Seven Weeks Coffee
27:40 Coffee Shop Work vs S** Work
32:03 What Body Parts Are For
36:09 Value of Pleasure vs Value of the Person
38:01 The Role of Pleasure in S**
41:19 The Pleasure Gap and Men's Responsibility
46:09 How "Self Pleasure" Effects Marriage, And The Restored Vision
50:46 Nimi Skincare
51:39 Our Fertility is God's Domain
59:10 Good Reasons for Contraception?
1:02:18 A Tangible Analogy
1:05:57 Freedom or Addiction?
1:10:22 Celibacy for the Kingdom
1:15:24 Great Examples of Celibates for the Kingdom
1:17:10 Mary and Joseph's Celibacy
1:18:16 Difference Between Contraception and Natural Family Planning
1:20:54 Where To Find Christopher's Work
1:21:28 Wrap Up
I love Christopher. I'm a protestant, but I do find that Catholic theologians and philosophers are way ahead in terms of a theology of the body and sexual ethics. So much great learning and spiritual enrichment here!
I am sensing that you perhaps to come and see closer and discover the open realms of Heaven at the Mass when Jesus himself inlays down his life for us and we receive his body, blood, soul and divinity 🩵🕊️🩵
Honest and genuine question (since my friends are from the catholic field), why did you decide to be Protestant?
She literally invites the best people! I listen to his podcast, "Ask Christopher West." If you haven't heard it, it's a discussion with him and his wife where they answer listener questions about TOB. The way they speak to each other with such grace and love, has been inspiring to me in my own marriage.
I’m a Roman Catholic, wife, mother, professional ballerina and ballet teacher. Thank you both for this great conversation. Love your channel Lila.
Thanks for being here
@@LilaRosePodcast Why do you wear so much make up? You clearly care TONS about your appearance. You know that will tempt men, while Christ said that anybody who lusts for a woman has already committed adultery in his heart. You don’t care? I recommend a reading of the book of Ecclesiastes… All these monks and nuns struggling as Catholics, while here you are tempting men🫠
Can’t wait to see how many people’s heads explode when they realize the Catholic Church’s teaching on theology of the body isn’t crazy😂
Thank you for all you do, Lila!
So grateful for you! Thank you so much for coming on the podcast, Christopher!
I was just confirmed this past Easter into the church and one of the only stumbling blocks for me was that I had a vasectomy. I couldn’t understand why it was wrong so I felt it would be dishonest to say i repented of it at the time. Catholic answers sent me a book for free called “inseparable” was a huge help in learning why the vasectomy was wrong. I absolutely love catholic theological understanding I feel like it’s just so sensible, biblical, historic, and tested. Hard to imagine anyone giving Catholicism an honest chance and still walking away.
This episode brought me a lot of healing that has been needed for decades. I'm still tearing up as I saturate myself in this conversation for reflection. It helped me to see that God really does love me and my heart really is being changed by Him. I have doubted myself on whether God has been working in me or not because my views have become so countercultural extreme, I started to believe what everyone else was saying about beauty pageants, that I had no point in pointing out its vanity, but it all ties in together with lust and sex. I know it's the Holy Spirit guiding me away from the world, and more into Him. A huge gap was filled by this episode. The puzzle is complete. Praise God!
Greetings from Christian orthodox romanian Family! God bless you!💞🙏✨
Share this video to the ends of the earth, people!! JP2’s teachings along with the Church on this subject are absolute life changing. Thank you Christopher and Lila 👏🏻
@@drjanitor3747thank you for your kind reply. I will pray for you, please pray for me 🙏🏻 Glory to Jesus Christ
Such an incredible discussion. Lila, the questions you raised as "devils advocate" were on point with how the culture responds. TOB is what our world desperately needs.
Lord, hear our prayer.
Honestly wish Chris would go on the whatever podcast with you to debate. I think itd be really interesting.
That would be super interesting.
YES
Please do this
Those people are so lost and depraved I wonder if it would even be a productive conversation
@@kshwi3215it would be for at least some of the listeners!!!
I love this!!! More podcasts with Christopher plis!!!!
This just makes so much sense lol. Definitely helps too as I think everyone struggles with lust. But putting this logical perspective on it helps to resist. Instead of just sacrificing the desire for the will of god. (Which we should do anyway)
38 minutes in, and based on the philosophical foundation, I can absolutely understand the philosophy behind the current Pope, ban on surrogacy. It tracks. Thank you for this conversation Lila.
Moral clarity is so startling
This year, I have been looking for the book 'Love and Responsibility' exactly. I don't know why it came to me, but it has been detrimental to me, I have been reading the sample. At the end of the month I will buy the full book!~ thank you for this video Lila!
Desperately need these conversations in our society. The churches dont communicate these so the best place is the youtube platform and social media.
This is the world we are in now. Gospel will be spread thru technology while churches sleep.
Gospels historically too was spread in the town square and aeropaugus, while the believers meet together once a week (church buildings).
Amazing podcast episode! Thank you both! God bless both of you and your families!
I am definitely walking away feeling inspired in how to enter my future marriage well, with better education how to glorify God and love my husband. Thank you both Lila and Christopher so much!
Another great pod by Lila!
Very well put from Chris!
The speaker presents one of the most profound observations about humanity and there comes the coffee commercial.....pliiing!
I wish the guests were shown a bit more respect. Please let us enjoy the hard work you both put into the podcast.
Will work on the ad spot placements. Please support us at Locals! Podcast only possible because of our amazing sponsors like Seven Weeks Coffee and listeners who support us monthly at Locals :)
Such an interesting and important topic
Thank you for this talk, Loved it!!
This is one of your best episode!
This is superb! I've got to get that book!
As a Muslim that converted to Islam around 4 years ago, Lila Rose is one of the few if not only person I watch for the intent to understand better the catholic teachings and how it relates to my own religion.
I often find what is being educated to me through catholic church does not resonate with my heart. This podcast really proved to me I can still learn, appreciate and absorb what is being thought without weaving through potential deception or even inaccurate information even though the intent was to educate and resonate with the audience. In Lila's podcast it gives me more in depth understanding and appreciation of the knowledge coming from the catholic teachings.
Peace and blessings on everyone here 🤗
Thanks for uploading this video.
Christopher, you do a phenomenal job in so much. One small recommendation, some of your question asking is a bit elementary when engaging with people like Lila. I think you can just ask the question more rhetorical in nature and then answer it instead of “forcing” Lila to answer it.
Deep stuff ❤thank you
great episode
Wow amazing Video best I've seen on ur channel
This is so beautiful and such a cleansing after watching Whatever podcast.
Thank you. My priest advised me after confession to read Theology of the body. I found the Redpill 8 years ago, and in my search for the truth, I came back home to the Catholic Church. My view of the RedPill is that is truth, from the point that it describes accurately our Damaged Nature resulting from original sin. When we were thrown into History, and our Bodies lost Grace, to face Death and Survival, our Animal Nature came to be. Our passions disordered. Redpill describes that truth, but is incomplete if we Know humanity is not only material, is Body and Soul, Matter and Spirit. The problem with Redpill is when people take advice from it, rather than view it only as a description of our animal side. Redpill coming from a very materialistic view of the universe, is incomplete and filled with scientism.
To those who are Married and undergoing periods of abstinence use this as an opportunity to bring you closer to God and each other through prayer and fasting for each other incessantly. Invite God into your period of abstinence and give yourselves and your worries to him.
The not being allowed to augment natural consequences is my only beef. Besides that, this was so superiorly helpful when looking at why sex culture feels the way it does.
Wow this is going to be interesting
Thank you Lila and the guess
Tremendous.
Hi Lila, thank you so much for this podcast episode. I’ve just got married and I am learning about being open to life and natural family planning. (Is not as easy as I thought but I am praying to God to help me / us in this journey ) I am married to a wonderful husband that loves and respects me. However unfortunately society has been brainwashed to this anti-natalist mentality and we have been thought that even within a marriage the “responsible “ thing to do is to use contraception to avoid pregnancy when not wanted. I understand and completely agree with the theology of the body however I would really appreciate if Chris could come back and talk more about how to apply the theology of the body on our lives without fear. What I mean by that is: How do we practically live a life open to live…. How do we help our spouse understand that to be open to life should be a lifestyle? (This is all new to me myself, so I don’t blame my husband of not knowing this yet) and how do I overcome the fear of thinking I’m not good enough to do this? (I’ve been doing the billings ovulation method but I’m having a hard time understanding how it works and I’m just so scared 😢 Please help! Ps: Much love from Brazil 🇧🇷. You have inspired me in my pro-life journey
Do you know the Marquette method
@@carolinpurayidom4570 No, how does it work?
@@isabelamazoniguimaraes8234
It’s amazing! Best NFP method out there. You need a ClearBlue Monitor plus the sticks that go into the monitor. You plug in the first date of your menstrual cycle. After day 6, you start measuring your LH levels with the stick by dipping it into your urine. When your LH levels surge it’ll tell you High, High, Peak, Peak, High, High, Low etc. If you’re trying to achieve pregnancy you have intercourse a few days ahead of peak etc. If abstaining, you’re supposed to abstain like 5-7 days before peak. You find a pattern of your menstrual cycle after 6 months. So, the abstinence period doesn’t have to be as long when you first start out the method. Definitely do a Marquette method course with an instructor so they know your own cycle and can help you figure out your goal. Especially helpful when post partum and you don’t have a period, but can still be fertile!
Lila, this is off topic, but I really admire your feminine disposition. You seem like a very charitable person. As someone who is rather masculine due to my work and other factors, how can I become less combative? Have you always been like this or did it take intention?
Observant Jews abide by God’s design in the marital bedroom. It’s something that the hedonistic people of today are uncomfortable with. For instance, the idea that husband and wife should not be engaging in relations 24/7/365. There are times of the day, week, and month that are permitted when other times are not.
I am divorced for 20 years. I never got remarried so I never had sex.I am fine. The Holy. Spirit will make it possible. I have had fulfilling life.
That's good focus instead on the kingdom of God loving Good first and your neighbour as yourself.
@@carolinpurayidom4570 some friends felt sorry for m because I had no man. I didn't know how to show them God blesses on the inside.
/
I lived with my ex before I got married. Not a Christian than. It is sin and sin blinds you .I do not want to get divorced again
Proud of you! God bless
❤
There are things about waiting to have sex until marriage that I don't think get discussed.
One is the physical size of the man and woman. What if he is so large that he hurts her?
Two is the level of libido. If these are far apart, even in the honeymoon phase, it can be a sign that the two will struggle for years, especially when the demands of pregnancy and childbirth restrict intercourse.
You don't necessarily discover these relationship killers (killers imo) in a chaste dating situation. What on earth would a couple do when it's discovered, especially regarding a physical mismatch that can't be overcome?
Your mentality is the relationship killer. These things can be overcome. Step 1 Pray to God for guidance. Step 2 Change your mentality. Step 3 Seek wisdom. Step 4 Build trust and connection. Step 5 Have the conversation and/or experiment with solutions - Be patient, kind, and attentive. Get rid of old memories and fantasies. Honor your love with effort.
@@beac8238 Libido differences can potentially be managed with the steps you list but not the physical mismatch. I was a hospital and a LTC nurse for many years. I've seen and examined a lot of male and female bodies and maybe you have no experience with the size variation that exists in nature.
@reja1309
[f you're being honest, you'll admit that the occurence of a man and woman unable to match due to physical size of the organs - is extremely rare.
@@nochso6835 I have no idea what you consider rare but in a 40 yr nursing career I saw the size gamut of external genitals and I know for sure that I saw individuals that should never attempt intercourse with each other.
And so what if it was rare? When marriage is for life, that's asking an awful lot of a couple.
NFP feels like constantly starving yourself and then gorging. It’s terrible.
I wouldnt worry about it 98% catholics don't use NFP and if they do they use some other form BC too.
You should talk about lgbtq stuff.
This what religion does.... It binds people.... Im not religious and have as much sex as i want. Im happy free and feeling great.
my generator is down so doesn't apply to me😔
I don't know if I will ever be able to live by the no contraception rule. I've tried, and I got pregnant. NFP doesn't work on my body for several reasons. I love my 3 children, but I am terrified of getting pregnant again.
I feel like my only choices are being pregnant until I am infertile or going to hell.
It is ruining physical intimacy in my marriage. I'd rather never have sex again (which is pretty much what has been happing since I got pregnant last), but I am not alone in this marriage.
This demand by the catholic church really sometimes makes me despair. I feel stuck. What if you can agree with all of the theology but don't see yourself being able to adhere to it? It makes me so sad all the time. I can't even go to confession because you can't be forgiven for something that you don't intend or see yourself able to change.
All I can do is pray.
I'm sorry for what you're going through. God hears you crying out and loves you. And confession is always available. Even if you're not sure how you feel about your contrition or what exactly are the sins on your conscience... Go seek Him in the sacrament of confession. Love and prayers.
Have you tried the Marquette method of NFP? It's much easier since it relies on using a device to determine fertility rather than trying to guess based on temperature/mucus. It's just as effective as the pill
You’re not alone. I’m going through the same thing, and no Catholics ever want to talk about this part. The abstinence is KILLING my marriage. NFP has ruined my sex life. I can really only have it when I am biologically designed to not want it, when I am in fertile, and I can’t do anything when I’m ovulating, when I really want it. All it is trade me to do is to fear sex. I have a panic attack every time I have to engage in sex. I cannot mentally or physically handle another pregnancy. I wish I understood the church’s teachings on this, I truly don’t, but I just wanted to let you know that you were not the only one.
Hello lovely people!
I only just realised that you commented on my comment (phone didn't mention that...).
You are all very kind. Thank you. I have done a ton of research, I made an appointment for confession and I pray a lot more. We'll see what comes of it. Can only get better 😅
@@theresa.m.
Thank you for you brutal honesty. VERY REFRESHING.
I am so sorry for what you have to go through. I am with you, I have a masters degree in theology plus lot of ethics classes, my moral compass is pretty good and I can manage to feel guilty for the smallest things, just not for condoms. My God given ability to reason makes me come to a different conclusion everytime. I can not see the difference between trying hard not to get pregnant with NFP and using a condom, not in my intentions, only in the outcome. One is a God made contraceptive and the other one is man made. But so are many things, like garlic and antibiotics. And like with everything we humans have made, you can use it for good and evil. I can see how contraception can lead to promiscuity, out of wedlock sex etc. But I always wanted to be married with kids and I am. And now contraception (and I am not talking about the pill), would help my marriage and yes my mental and physical well-being too. Am I allowed as a married woman to make plans, take care of myself and do anything but being pregnant and stay at home, isolated looking after my children?! Some women can handle it or even love it, but my personality struggles immensely with it.
What do you think?
I just want to be able to have an honest and realistic discussion about this topic.
I am curious on his views of sex now as they are past child bearing years. Does the sex stop since the only fruit coming from that is pleasure and not a child? Am I expected when I hit menopause I am not have sex with my husband because I can no longer have children?
I promise I am not being cheeky I am genuinely asking out of concern
No. Catholic Church teaches that sex has 2 purposes. Love and procreation. These 2 cannot be separated. Lust is wrong because you are using your spouse as an object for your own pleasure. But sex has a spiritual connection of ultimate love to your spouse. Just because you can’t conceive doesn’t mean you are not to show your spouse love
Sex is also for bonding within marriage,
@@alqoshgirl thank you, that makes sense.
Married Couples of child bearing years have sex all the time without contraception and don’t get pregnant. They are working with the bodies natural functions and not against it. The church would see no problem with that. The same applies to couples after child bearing years.
52:00 they discussed this
My friends was diagnised with blocked fallopean tubes. She had a tubal pregnancy and did not know. She was literally rotting inside. She is married, wouldnt contraceptive be better for her than risk another tubal pregnancy?
You should look into Natural Family Planning. They briefly mentioned it at 1:18:00 but basically it teaches you how to track your fertility and be really in tune with your body, so that you will only have to abstain for 3-5 days during your fertile window. You will actually learn how to tell what day you are most likely ovulating. I learned so much more about my body than I did during “health class” if you are irregular or breastfeeding you can also use cheap ovulation tests to double check. Sure it’s probably “easier and more convenient” to use birth control but it is totally possible to use NFP and it works. There are also a ton of apps that can help you track your cycle, you just need to take responsibility over your fertility and use self control during fertile days
If she were following the Christian sexual ethic that he’s laying out here then your friend’s marriage would be called to practice periodic abstinence. I know this because I live it out in my marriage for serious health reasons as well. Using natural family planning methods we abstain during my fertile time. We lived the contraceptive life early in our marriage and I can honestly say that our marriage is way better and stronger now than it ever was when we contracepted. If your friend wants to reject those sexual ethics then she’s free to do so.
Tell her to get on the pill or use protection.
The Catholic response would be your friend needs to track her fertility cycle and go to a NaPro doctor or a specialized gynecologist. To be susceptible to a tubal pregnancy is NOT normal, something biological is clearly wrong. Slapping birth control in her system isn’t going to help since being on Nexaplanon or the IUD could result in a tubal/ectopic pregnancy as well. So should she risk her hormones being wrecked for the sake of not getting pregnant and still assuming the same risk that birth control could bring?
@@drjanitor3747 so if he has sex with his wife while she is pregnant, is it a sin, as I'm sure he's not wishing another child at that moment. And if he has sex with his wife after her menopause, is it a sin, since children are no longer an option. Or is he supposed to always desire children at every intimate moment. What if he just forgets to desire children? There are 2 ends to marriage, so if the first cannot be fulfilled because of above mentioned reasons, then the mutual love and respect of the spouses still allows for a grace filled experience in the bedroom. I don't ascribe to the NFP mentality, but this quote seems misleading.
People are indispensable ? He obviously hasn't fought in a war, look at the Afghanistan, vietnam, war and all the men and women that died in that war and for what?
And his other theory on that is people don't want to be thrown away well wouldn't rejection be a form of throwing somebody away?
According to his theory and logic you should probably marry the first person that you date never should never break up with them in a dating situation? Because otherwise wouldn't that be a former rejecting of the human person?
i’m not gonna lie i’m kinda skeptical of Mr. West. he has said some suspect things in the past (see what he said about the Paschal candle and statues of the Blessed Virgin)
The thing about the Paschal candle the church teaches...
@@tpangle17the church teaches that is represents a phallus? where exactly???
I'm wrong. I guess it's not "taught by the Church", but it's not Christopher West's original idea. It's a common explanation for the symbolism among liturgists: "Monsignor Nicola Bux, professor of sacramental theology at the University of Bari in Italy, and a consultor of the Congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith, the Congregation for the Causes of Saints, and the Office for Pontifical Celebrations: "In the baptismal liturgy, the priest, standing before the font, blesses the water singing the prayer: Oh God, through the sacramental signs; while he invokes: Descend, Father, on this water. He can submerge the Paschal candle in the water once or three times. The meaning is profound: the priest is the fertilizing organ of the ecclesial womb, symbolized by the baptismal pool. Truly in the person of Christ Head he engenders children that, as father, he fortifies with the chrism and nourishes with the Eucharist. Also by reason of the marital functions to the Church Bride, the priest must be a man. All the mystical meaning of Easter is manifested in the priestly identity, coming to fullness, the pleroma, as the East says. With him sacramental initiation reaches its culmination and Christian life the center."@@brians7100
I have decided that if I were to follow a faith it will not be catholic.
What a waste
@@r.m5883 excuse me? First of all I refuse to join a faith that doesn’t recognize it’s own sin within its own walls. I’m referring to the child sex happening in the catholic faith. And when they choose to hide it. And also I don’t think it’s the right journey for me and that’s allowed.
@@Umlaland There are plenty of people who acknowledge the sin within its own walls. I'm Catholic and I do and so does LIla and Christopher. Doesn't mean the faith is false just that there are people claiming to be members of the faith who fall drastically short of their calling.
@@forlife84 I’m not hating. I just don’t think that the catholic faith is the right path for me. There are plenty of paths to get to God.
Amazing podcast, opened my eyes to things that I had never realized! Please continue with these wonderful topics! Thanks Lila Rose! 🤍
West is very intelligent but far to crass and sloppy with language about things that ought to be discussed with a elevated decadence.
I thought he did a good job discussing the nuts and bolts without being crass.
He's relatable. He wasn't gratuitous. I assume that you're an adult; so, you can practice self censorship for your own ears. All of this pearl clutching is giving liberal vibes; they're the ones always policing language.
Then normal people won't understand.
JP2 was a major player covering child abuse by clergy...
And you are a major, major sinner…. Should we cross out every contribution you made in this life?
Truly tragic Lila doesn’t have an Onlyfans… I pray daily for the lord to change her heart.
Pray Instead for the Lord to change your heart in order for you to stop lusting another man's wife.
@@carolinpurayidom4570he’s mentally ill…