"Void Indigo, a comic by the writer Steve Gerber" is the exact point of the narrative you know what's up. Steve Gerber walked so Alan Moore could run. Bless that glorious madman.
@@maycontainnuts3127 I think you're misunderstanding. The "Gerber walked so Moore could run" comment isn't specifically about this but in general, as Gerber's career starts and hits "the big-time" in the 70's with radical superhero reinventions like Man-Thing, Howard the Duck, Omega the Unknown with works that in many ways act as forerunners and predecessors to what Moore would accomplish with Swamp Thing, Captain Britain and the like. Gerber is a 70's icon that goes into the 80's and 90's, while Moore is more of an 80's icon that goes forth, so a lot of Gerber's work naturally precedes Moore's (which kinda makes sense, Gerber was five years older).
@@leafyishereisdumbnameakath4259Yes, the character was retconned at one time so that Carter and Shyera were star crossed aliens who had been reborn as Egyptians and betrayed and were bound into a cycle. Pretty sure the reincarnation of the guy who betrayed them was the Shadow Thief.
@@StrangeBrainParts You want to talk about theft and damage, how about the way that Bill Mantlo changed Gerber's origin of Howard the Duck to put him on that stupid "Duckworld" with all the dumbass puns, and then not only did Marvel demand that Gerber keep that crap as canon if he wanted to come back to Howard, but effing Mantlo took SG's original idea of a world of all sorts of different talking animals and used it for the origin of his goddamn Rocket Raccoon character!!!
So this is... something... The idea of taking a barbarian into modern day and have him basically still work because society hasn't changed that much is a compelling idea, and I think Void Indigo would have a better chance of being received now as something out of Image or Dark Horse. It'd still be not for everyone and probably not even the same series but I think it would have a better shot.
Well, this is not a new concept either. David Drake's "Ranks of Bronze" took this general idea and really ran with it. i would love to see a movie made of that.
The late 80s was a weird time in the states especially. Satanic panic was in full swing and looking back it didn't make a lot of sense. Even the MPAA was slapping X rating on slasher movies resulting in some watered down entries in the Friday the 13th and Nightmare on Elmstreet franchises. I also remember the whole boycott the Proctor and Gamble products because their CEO is a Satanist rumor too...
One of the things that I really like about episodes like this was that when I started getting into comics in a small city in the late 80s, I had the feeling that there were whole worlds moving around in the depths, beyond the shallows to which I had access. Thank you for being my comic book Jacques Cousteau.
And now, we have such lovely little tomes such as "The Crossed" or "The Boys" getting not only a major following but live-action versions of the latter. How tame it was.
Tbh, there is no way that the Cad customs just "randomly" found the the book for inspection. Most likely a pundit who didn't like the content of the book tipped off the customs office to take a peak. I'm Canadian, and there are many, many issues our customs agents being ignorant and seizing items that shouldn't
They seem to have a weird fixation on erotic comics and artwork - refer to the case with the furry which was televised on the Border Security reality show, or all the various times people have been detained over manga
I'm Canadian too! I couldn't find anything to suggest they were tipped off, so to speak. It seems to me that comics were rather scrutinized by customs officials back in the day.
There’s a scene in “This Is Spinal Tap” where the band’s AR woman tells the band’s manager that retailers are refusing to carry their new album because of the cover art. The manager says that the record company could use their influence to force the retailers to carry it, and the AR woman replies that they might have… IF the band's recent sales had made them think it was worth it. Looking at the art and dialogue you’ve posted, I wonder if this was the case with Void Indigo; yes, they could have fought back, but the quality and the fact that the sales dropped with issue #2 meant that neither the publisher nor the fans considered “Void Indigo” a hill worth dying on.
@@phabiorules Steve Gerber iirc had other commitments he was trying to juggle, like the Thundarr the Barbarian cartoon which was took place at the time of Void Indigo. This was one of those instances where all parties involved decided to “cut bait”
Thank you very much! Weird for it to suddenly get attention a month after it was released. I'm not complaining, just noting the algorithm is kind of weird.
I know you don't cover a lot of licensed comics, but this is tangentially connected. In 1989, Marvel published a black & white, mature readers-labeled Nightmare On Elm Street comic in magazine format. It was apparently a success in the direct market but underperformed slightly at the newstand. Despite being almost complete up to issue #4 and with issue #5 basically outlined, it was cancelled suddenly by Marvel after issue #2. Steve Gerber was the writer of those two published issues. He was supposed to resume his story with issue #5 after two issues of one-offs by Buzz Dixon and Peter David. According to Gerber, Marvel cancelled the series not because they actually received any complaints but because they were anticipating receiving complaints.
FWIW, I don't think that decision had as much to do with the content of Gerber's stories as it did with the realization that someone had made a poor decision and they never should have licensed that IP in the first place.
This series kinda reminds me of heavy metal the movie, but I mean the content in its pages has nothing on the times we’re living in, if you want to see something worse just turn on the news and you’ll see and here it all these days, in fact it makes that comic look like a joke.
I remember the uproar. I skimmed through the two comics issues online and saw nothing to really get upset about. The Hawkman connection is interesting since the Golden Age version of the character was a reincarnated prince.
@@KABLAMMATS i think that it was just less visible, you could live in a "safe space" bubble in the 80s, now there's a broadcast device in every hand. I'd argue that there's "less" racism now, the cases are just exponentially more visible.
Good stuff. I remember parents being so freaked out about comics and satanism in the 80's. Made me feel like they were crazy. A lot of them were actually kind of not the smartest people. Their opposition peaked my curiosity so thanks.
Wowed me as an 80s teenager. Like Ronin, but more extreme, kind of a bellwether of the Iron Age that would fully arrive a couple years later. And another example of how Marvel's Epic paved the way for DC's Vertigo.
I've been curious about this series for years, having seen ads back in the day. The thought only crosses my mind very occasionally though, so, thank you!
An SBP video is one I *always* get to as soon as possible, which normally means immediately. I wish I could help out more; hopefully soon. Thanks again and stay safe and healthy
Thank you very much. The view and a comment is all I can ask. If you can do more that's always appreciated, but not expected. You take care and stay safe yourself. Until next time...
I copped both issues at the time and was excited for more content from the title. There was not real word of mouth or uproar at my local comic shop. I knew it was pushing the envelope back then but it was so off the radar for my direct comic community.
A very unfortunate moment. You would think fans and "internal" critics of comics would be above this kind of Wertham-tier nonsense, especially in the mid-80s, but apparently not. I should point out that Canadian border police are kind of notorious for their hostility to comics, especially when it comes to the matter of sexuality and erotic art. Most cases of this I can recall involve manga, but the furry fandom have been on the receiving end of ridiculous border stops over comics and artwork on multiple occasions (one of which was even televised on the reality show Border Security)
Sometimes it was due to self preservation. The comic’s code authority was created as a means of self censorship so they didn’t have to worry about the government doing it. It’s possible these people were worried what might happen if they supported it, (and given how many comments here are talking about how mediocre it was) and realized it wasn’t worth it.
So basically, if Gerber had waited 10 years then he probably could have made it a Hawkman series released on Vertigo. And subsequently cancelled within the first year.
When I first heard that Void Indog was "controversial", I checked it out. Then I wondered what the problem was. Then I remembered, you guys are American and think Mad Magazine is spicy, while in Europe Bodoï and Fluide Glacial are sold in newsstands.
Haha so true! And Metal Hurlant was also sold in regular stores. Well, even porn magazines were sold in many street kiosks and not very well hidden (on purpose of course). It’s so crazy how the USA are so conservative and prude with this stuff, but then you can get a gun easily 😄
@@Daniel__Nobrenot easy to get a gun for citizens. I do wish we’d be harder on some criminals. And Europe has a LOT of problems too. Just like us. Being “prude” is the least of everyone’s problem.
A very small but interesting .... well to me anyway... fact about Void Indigo is it lead to John Smith changing the name of his original 2000ad short Void Indiga when he became aware of the Graphic Novel and hence we get the brilliant Indigo Prime
i remember reading issue#1 at sge 14 and thinking to myself what the heck is this? it was'nt a very good comic but it was memorable! underground comics have been doin this type of thing for years so i'm not sure how truly groundbreaking this all was? Howard chaykin's "Black Kiss" was coming out around this same time as I recall to.
As much as the trans opening feels awkward I’m kind of a tiny bit impressed where it was aiming directionally. It has the trans sex worker clearly represented as someone to sympathize and feel emphatic towards beyond being a punchline (maybe a low bar but it was low for a long time) as well as having actual rep of a trans man not to mention showing a range of what trans ppl can be like instead of a blanket monolith . I think the main uncomfy point is just using transness it self as a way to be shocking which is too bad but I would have preferred this kind of rep growing up as opposed to none at all.
What does it matter anyway. Art should be a weird tableau and getting locked up on whether it is or isnt trans or queer or whatever robs you of the grander picture and room to appreciate it. That scene looked like it barely had anything to do with the narrative anyway, just weird for the sake of weird. Im not offended but dont feel like its pioneering or brave or anything either. I like that its just there and doesnt mean a damn thing.
@@CoffinBanger On the contrary, I think it had a real meaning in the theme of the story. Reversing the role of victim and perpetrator at least on the level of assigned sex at birth, communicates that though the roles of society may change with time, humanity remains as barbaric as ever. I'm a trans woman myself (as much as I don't think that really matters here) and we can talk about representation, or whether or not it was really a salient point or not. And you can even argue that, at the end of the day, it was still motivated at least in part by the desire to shock an audience. But to say it had no meaning is dumb when the meaning in the context of the piece is pretty obvious as it its with its overall thesis.
Always ahead of his time was Steve Gerber. Not the most positive representation of transgender people, but he had the forethought to at least consider them.
Smh! Listened to commentary, also the images! Shocking, Yes! Artistic masterpiece...👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻! Is Steve Gerber and the artist Stiller around? Would Love to get ALL SIX prior issues!
Steve Gerber has been dead since 2008 (Marvel published the Man Thing graphic novel Screen play for a Living Deadman as a tribute to him…and I remember reading about this Man Thing graphic novel in the early nineties {Comics Journal did an interview with Steve Gerber} however the Graphic Novel got “tied up” due to lateness on the writer and artist {Kevin Nowlan}’s part 🤷♂️)
I have a Gerber signed copy of Marvel Age #21 that my sister gave me years ago.. I had no idea what it was. Might have to go dig it out and give it another look.
A little suggestion, it would be good to have more consistent and easily recognizable thumbnails. I ignored this video in my feed for a whole month before today realising it was a Strange Brain Parts video. The thumbnail didn't grab me becaue I wasn't familiar with the image, and the big "CANCELLED" text is what we see in way too many thumbnails these days. So I ignored it, but if the thumbnail was more recognizable as a SBP video, I would have clicked on day one.
I adore Watchmen but never had any interest in any version of The Boys. Watchmen has barely any violence in it, but when it does happen it means something and hits like a load of bricks.
It seems Gerber was always getting screwed by one or the other of the big two but this may be his own fault for pushing too hard at the envelope of the time. And I do see many, many similarities between this and post Zero Hour Hawkman.
Never heard of this book. Now I'm decently curious. Especially when a thing gets a bad review. In most cases like when a bad vegetable says something is terrible, I know I'm going to love it
I had that comic back then and I found it really amazing for the plotline because of exactly it shows. no one has ever done such a comic like that before, the idea to show life and human race as it is in reality: cruel and violent. and to this day I didn't know what happened to the sequels, until I've watched this video. and I must thank you for that.
I kinda wish this had been hawkman. It would have added an interesting perspective to the character that we now will never get. but Void Indigo probably gave gerber more room to do whatever he wanted.
If you don't like it, don't read it. But don't stop others who do not share your delicate sensibilities from reading a damn comic book. Surely, there are more pressing matters to deal with.
I collected virtually all of Void Indigo. I kept trying to give it a chance and then one day, I thought to my teenage self, "This is just garbage." And the characters were cross dressers, not transgenders and when the woman gets the sword impaled through her head, it's not "Disney-esque" It was gross then and it's still gross now. I also knew it was an attempt at the gross out and it was gross. But the story was soooo plodding and ultimately pointless. Not only was it morally degenerate, but it was artistically insulting. Years later, when I debated whether to sell the issues or not, I actually destroyed them instead of selling them. I didn't want to be part of putting that inartistic rot into anyone else's brains or potentially even profiting off of it. In contrast, Dreadstar was out around the same time and was in general a much better premise, storyline and series when it came to your budget for comics. Byrne was doing great with Fantastic Four. Alien Legion was good. There was simply much better stuff at the time. There was also plenty of "shocking" material available but "shocking" doesn't necessarily mean "quality" or "thought-provoking." Void Indigo was not even worthy of liberal pretentiousness.
Oh, if only Steve Gerber held on for another 15 years (if Steve Gerber was that nihilistic about the 80’s, 2016 and up would have had Stevie go “full prepper “)
I bought these back then. I hated the coloring on them (except the cover of the graphic novel). Seems like it compounded the abrasive nature of the story. I guess that could be intentional, but the color just felt gross.
The Hawkman parallel is obvious. DC’s Legends of Tomorrow, season one was almost the same story, differing only in that they hijacked, and ruined, Vandal Savage, to play the part the dark wizards played, Hawkman was an Egyptian prince, instead of an alien, and Hawkgirl, who became the primary protagonist, rather than Hawkman, took the place of the consort. They did crowbar the Thanagarians into the story, so, technically, there were some aliens, but they never really made an actual appearance. It’s a shame that this story didn’t get a chance to be told, in its entirety, but the biggest shame was the truly awful hairstyle of the protagonist. Apparently, even on highly advanced alien worlds, some foolish, and delusional, men think that by growing the tiny bit of hair, at the very base of the skull, really long, they will fool people into thinking that they actually have a lot of hair, and that it looks anything other than ridiculous. He’d have looked much better completely bald, though if he had a full mane of pure white hair, it would have looked even better than that.
lol just a crappier version of the show lexx, that being said super glad lexx wasn't cancelled before it began. the existential dark absurdity of the show is brilliant!
That's a good question, considering it was creator owned. In fact, I wondered the same thing, especially when Vertigo came around in the 90's. But I couldn't find anything that explained why both he and Mayerik allowed the project to die. Best guess? Gerber had other work in animation and the hassle he experienced with Void Indigo probably killed his interest in finishing it off. So, that may be a partial reason why he didn't shop it around. It just felt like poison and he had other work to do.
The Dark Lords had to find souls worthy of their Overseers to consume. The Dark Lords so cowed their people that although they had marched thousands into the abbitoir their populace were so broken that their souls were unsatisfying. "They die...too Easily!?" So subjecting The Barbarian King to a Spectrum of Torture while he fights for his life not only satiates the Overseers, but The Dark Lords are Rejuvenated back to their younger, stronger selves.
I think part of what drove the controversy was just that it was hard for many critics and readers to understand why anyone would want to read the series in the first place. The dark tone and unpleasant imagery and themes were understandably inaccessible for many; but what's more, as seen by how many critics found the book cynical and pointless, it gave a lot of people the impression that it was written by and made for unpleasant, angry people who hate everyone around them.
The quote at 7:29 absolutely hits the nail on the head and speaks to my thoughts on the matter. I felt the same way reading a lot of Garth Ennis and Mark Millar's work. It strikes me as overly cynical, violent and shocking with little substance.
There is no need for the raw garbage of books like "Void Indigo" and its even-worse successors. I remember glancing at it when it came out, and thinking "what is this crap?" Everything about it was disturbing and off-putting, for no redeeming reason. Steve Gerber, even as described in the friendly way of this video, sounds like a true deviant. On a related note, I have always absolutely hated even the concept of Howard the Duck. It's not surprising that Gerber's other stuff is a lot worse.
Well…opinions are like sphincters…in that everybody’s got them. So you didn’t like Void Indigo (or Howard The Duck for that matter), there were some that did like them. I don’t seem to recall anyone dying and giving you the authority to judge, and critique other people’s work “Mr.Blackwell”
@@sawtooth808 your assertion is ridiculous. Neither you, nor I, nor anyone else, needs your, mine, or another's permission to express our opinions, positive or negative. We all have the right to judge and critique works that are submitted for public consumption. Have a great day.
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You’re mentally i|| for supporting this je.vv.ish gender BS.
Did this one also get demonetized?
"Void Indigo, a comic by the writer Steve Gerber" is the exact point of the narrative you know what's up. Steve Gerber walked so Alan Moore could run. Bless that glorious madman.
I agree! 100%.
You can't say that when V for Vendetta started in 1982 and Void Indigo in 1984. If anything it was more of a bullshit bit of hypocrisy of the time.
@@maycontainnuts3127 I think you're misunderstanding. The "Gerber walked so Moore could run" comment isn't specifically about this but in general, as Gerber's career starts and hits "the big-time" in the 70's with radical superhero reinventions like Man-Thing, Howard the Duck, Omega the Unknown with works that in many ways act as forerunners and predecessors to what Moore would accomplish with Swamp Thing, Captain Britain and the like. Gerber is a 70's icon that goes into the 80's and 90's, while Moore is more of an 80's icon that goes forth, so a lot of Gerber's work naturally precedes Moore's (which kinda makes sense, Gerber was five years older).
@@maycontainnuts3127 Okay then, Watchmen
@@matheusarruda6462Most popular Vertigo writers have said they were big fans of Gerber and he influenced their work.
This originally being a Hawkman story always surprised me, but in retrospect it really made sense
It makes total sense if you read Hawkworld which was out at that time.
It's very "Heavy Metal" who's movie also dealt with an evil orb that gave off a dangerous green energy
1:37 isn't this hawkmans origin tho
It was a way to merge the Golden Age and Silver Age/Bronze Age origins of Hawkman (Carter Hall/Khufu and Katar Hol).
@@leafyishereisdumbnameakath4259Yes, the character was retconned at one time so that Carter and Shyera were star crossed aliens who had been reborn as Egyptians and betrayed and were bound into a cycle. Pretty sure the reincarnation of the guy who betrayed them was the Shadow Thief.
And then DC used Steve Gerber's ideas for Hawkman anyway.
That they did!
@@StrangeBrainPartsOh I’d love an episode on that topic!
@@StrangeBrainParts You want to talk about theft and damage, how about the way that Bill Mantlo changed Gerber's origin of Howard the Duck to put him on that stupid "Duckworld" with all the dumbass puns, and then not only did Marvel demand that Gerber keep that crap as canon if he wanted to come back to Howard, but effing Mantlo took SG's original idea of a world of all sorts of different talking animals and used it for the origin of his goddamn Rocket Raccoon character!!!
So this is... something...
The idea of taking a barbarian into modern day and have him basically still work because society hasn't changed that much is a compelling idea, and I think Void Indigo would have a better chance of being received now as something out of Image or Dark Horse. It'd still be not for everyone and probably not even the same series but I think it would have a better shot.
Well, this is not a new concept either. David Drake's "Ranks of Bronze" took this general idea and really ran with it. i would love to see a movie made of that.
Didn’t Valiant do something similar with XO Manowar?
The late 80s was a weird time in the states especially. Satanic panic was in full swing and looking back it didn't make a lot of sense. Even the MPAA was slapping X rating on slasher movies resulting in some watered down entries in the Friday the 13th and Nightmare on Elmstreet franchises. I also remember the whole boycott the Proctor and Gamble products because their CEO is a Satanist rumor too...
One of the things that I really like about episodes like this was that when I started getting into comics in a small city in the late 80s, I had the feeling that there were whole worlds moving around in the depths, beyond the shallows to which I had access. Thank you for being my comic book Jacques Cousteau.
Merci beaucoup, mon ami.
And now, we have such lovely little tomes such as "The Crossed" or "The Boys" getting not only a major following but live-action versions of the latter. How tame it was.
Both of them have live action adaptations
@@paulakroy2635 The Crossed?
Link it, please. I need nightmares without end.
@@NorthForkFisherman sadness
@@paulakroy2635 Just saw the red band trailer.
I'm sure we're probably on a watchlist now.
Cool.
Tbh, there is no way that the Cad customs just "randomly" found the the book for inspection. Most likely a pundit who didn't like the content of the book tipped off the customs office to take a peak. I'm Canadian, and there are many, many issues our customs agents being ignorant and seizing items that shouldn't
They seem to have a weird fixation on erotic comics and artwork - refer to the case with the furry which was televised on the Border Security reality show, or all the various times people have been detained over manga
I'm Canadian too! I couldn't find anything to suggest they were tipped off, so to speak. It seems to me that comics were rather scrutinized by customs officials back in the day.
Geez, draconian much?
There’s a scene in “This Is Spinal Tap” where the band’s AR woman tells the band’s manager that retailers are refusing to carry their new album because of the cover art. The manager says that the record company could use their influence to force the retailers to carry it, and the AR woman replies that they might have… IF the band's recent sales had made them think it was worth it.
Looking at the art and dialogue you’ve posted, I wonder if this was the case with Void Indigo; yes, they could have fought back, but the quality and the fact that the sales dropped with issue #2 meant that neither the publisher nor the fans considered “Void Indigo” a hill worth dying on.
I could see that. Especially if Gerber wasn’t making deadlines.
@@phabiorules Steve Gerber iirc had other commitments he was trying to juggle, like the Thundarr the Barbarian cartoon which was took place at the time of Void Indigo. This was one of those instances where all parties involved decided to “cut bait”
Nothing makes me happier than seeing this video go viral. My favorite CZcams channel!
Thank you very much! Weird for it to suddenly get attention a month after it was released. I'm not complaining, just noting the algorithm is kind of weird.
I know you don't cover a lot of licensed comics, but this is tangentially connected. In 1989, Marvel published a black & white, mature readers-labeled Nightmare On Elm Street comic in magazine format. It was apparently a success in the direct market but underperformed slightly at the newstand. Despite being almost complete up to issue #4 and with issue #5 basically outlined, it was cancelled suddenly by Marvel after issue #2. Steve Gerber was the writer of those two published issues. He was supposed to resume his story with issue #5 after two issues of one-offs by Buzz Dixon and Peter David. According to Gerber, Marvel cancelled the series not because they actually received any complaints but because they were anticipating receiving complaints.
FWIW, I don't think that decision had as much to do with the content of Gerber's stories as it did with the realization that someone had made a poor decision and they never should have licensed that IP in the first place.
Off hand, I don't recall anything about that cancellation. But it's something I'll look into!
@@StrangeBrainParts The CBLDF site has some good info.
Stan Lee cancelled it when he learned that Freddy was a child predator and thus too immoral to be a Marvel publication.
@@arlem525 Stan Lee hadn't been the EIC at Marvel for about a decade at that point.
I think of the Joker's statement in The Dark Knight: "I'm not a monster; I'm just ahead of the curve..."
This series kinda reminds me of heavy metal the movie, but I mean the content in its pages has nothing on the times we’re living in, if you want to see something worse just turn on the news and you’ll see and here it all these days, in fact it makes that comic look like a joke.
You see, it's okay, when they do it.
I remember the uproar. I skimmed through the two comics issues online and saw nothing to really get upset about. The Hawkman connection is interesting since the Golden Age version of the character was a reincarnated prince.
People (mostly Gen X and Boomers) talk a lot these days about how much they miss the 1980s. Now and then we get reminded how shitty it was sometimes.
@@frigyou1078lol "less racism!" 😂😂
@@dalemsilas8425less crying about racism, maybe
@@KABLAMMATS i think that it was just less visible, you could live in a "safe space" bubble in the 80s, now there's a broadcast device in every hand.
I'd argue that there's "less" racism now, the cases are just exponentially more visible.
When people say they they mean “racism against white people” which is absurd
Good stuff. I remember parents being so freaked out about comics and satanism in the 80's. Made me feel like they were crazy. A lot of them were actually kind of not the smartest people. Their opposition peaked my curiosity so thanks.
Wowed me as an 80s teenager. Like Ronin, but more extreme, kind of a bellwether of the Iron Age that would fully arrive a couple years later. And another example of how Marvel's Epic paved the way for DC's Vertigo.
I've been curious about this series for years, having seen ads back in the day. The thought only crosses my mind very occasionally though, so, thank you!
You are welcome!
An SBP video is one I *always* get to as soon as possible, which normally means immediately. I wish I could help out more; hopefully soon. Thanks again and stay safe and healthy
Thank you very much. The view and a comment is all I can ask. If you can do more that's always appreciated, but not expected. You take care and stay safe yourself. Until next time...
I will say this comic is probably not for me, but the panic it caused sounds really overblown...
Same here.
The 80’s were…”interesting times” for lack of a better term
I copped both issues at the time and was excited for more content from the title. There was not real word of mouth or uproar at my local comic shop. I knew it was pushing the envelope back then but it was so off the radar for my direct comic community.
The drawings on the GN are awesome.
God I miss when people would fully paint comics. Like get an actual canvas and paint the page on it that was cool, we don't see that enough anymore
A very unfortunate moment. You would think fans and "internal" critics of comics would be above this kind of Wertham-tier nonsense, especially in the mid-80s, but apparently not.
I should point out that Canadian border police are kind of notorious for their hostility to comics, especially when it comes to the matter of sexuality and erotic art. Most cases of this I can recall involve manga, but the furry fandom have been on the receiving end of ridiculous border stops over comics and artwork on multiple occasions (one of which was even televised on the reality show Border Security)
Indeed. There are no shortage of incidents involving comics. Especially ones that had sex or, let's say, non-mainstream sexual interests.
Sometimes it was due to self preservation. The comic’s code authority was created as a means of self censorship so they didn’t have to worry about the government doing it.
It’s possible these people were worried what might happen if they supported it, (and given how many comments here are talking about how mediocre it was) and realized it wasn’t worth it.
How draconian can you get?
Granted, I am American so I probably can't talk...
So basically, if Gerber had waited 10 years then he probably could have made it a Hawkman series released on Vertigo. And subsequently cancelled within the first year.
When I first heard that Void Indog was "controversial", I checked it out. Then I wondered what the problem was. Then I remembered, you guys are American and think Mad Magazine is spicy, while in Europe Bodoï and Fluide Glacial are sold in newsstands.
Good point.
Haha so true! And Metal Hurlant was also sold in regular stores. Well, even porn magazines were sold in many street kiosks and not very well hidden (on purpose of course). It’s so crazy how the USA are so conservative and prude with this stuff, but then you can get a gun easily 😄
@@Daniel__Nobrenot easy to get a gun for citizens. I do wish we’d be harder on some criminals. And Europe has a LOT of problems too. Just like us. Being “prude” is the least of everyone’s problem.
I always get a kick out of the pedophile continent calling Americans prudes
@@ChrisP58we're just pointing out cultural differences mate
I vividly remember Void Indigo from my childhood comic days, and still think of it often. Poof, it was gone. TIL what happened to it.
A very small but interesting .... well to me anyway... fact about Void Indigo is it lead to John Smith changing the name of his original 2000ad short Void Indiga when he became aware of the Graphic Novel and hence we get the brilliant Indigo Prime
A little add on tidbit to yours: both titles are based on the fact that we are supposed to not be able to see the color indigo on the visual spectrum.
this might be your best video ever.
The real offensive part was the main characters bald-mullet.
i remember reading issue#1 at sge 14 and thinking to myself what the heck is this? it was'nt a very good comic but it was memorable! underground comics have been doin this type of thing for years so i'm not sure how truly groundbreaking this all was? Howard chaykin's "Black Kiss" was coming out around this same time as I recall to.
Imagine if they'd seen something like The Boys back in 1984.
As much as the trans opening feels awkward I’m kind of a tiny bit impressed where it was aiming directionally. It has the trans sex worker clearly represented as someone to sympathize and feel emphatic towards beyond being a punchline (maybe a low bar but it was low for a long time) as well as having actual rep of a trans man not to mention showing a range of what trans ppl can be like instead of a blanket monolith . I think the main uncomfy point is just using transness it self as a way to be shocking which is too bad but I would have preferred this kind of rep growing up as opposed to none at all.
Transess will always be shocking to most people unfortunately
Its not trans
What does it matter anyway. Art should be a weird tableau and getting locked up on whether it is or isnt trans or queer or whatever robs you of the grander picture and room to appreciate it. That scene looked like it barely had anything to do with the narrative anyway, just weird for the sake of weird. Im not offended but dont feel like its pioneering or brave or anything either. I like that its just there and doesnt mean a damn thing.
@@CoffinBanger On the contrary, I think it had a real meaning in the theme of the story. Reversing the role of victim and perpetrator at least on the level of assigned sex at birth, communicates that though the roles of society may change with time, humanity remains as barbaric as ever.
I'm a trans woman myself (as much as I don't think that really matters here) and we can talk about representation, or whether or not it was really a salient point or not. And you can even argue that, at the end of the day, it was still motivated at least in part by the desire to shock an audience. But to say it had no meaning is dumb when the meaning in the context of the piece is pretty obvious as it its with its overall thesis.
@@CoffinBangerbro you just said “interpret at my way, not yours. It doesn’t mean anything”
I like your use of the CZcams logo in the video. :)
We need Void Indigo. We need it now.
Good luck getting the scripts because Steve Gerber has been dead for 15 years now
@@sawtooth808 cast Speak With Dead
Ah, something to seek out! I love Gerber's writing and this is one title I was never able to find (the collectors life was a struggle before ebay).
Always ahead of his time was Steve Gerber.
Not the most positive representation of transgender people, but he had the forethought to at least consider them.
There is so much interesting media that I will never come across in my life, while tragic it also speaks to the many talented people in this world.
I LOVED Void Indigo! I still love it! I wished it went longer. :(
10:26 well both of those weren't published by marvel so I would assume its more of a "marvel doesnt want adult content like this"
Is it weird that the only thing I could think of in this video is: Void Indigo couldn't move like Jahgur?
Ha ha ha! Someone forgot to start him up!
@@StrangeBrainParts And Jahgur’s comic (Void Indigo) made Grown Men cry 🤣🤣🤣
I remember hearing about it at school at the time: "Cancelled comics! Oh la la!" But it wasn't that exciting in the end lol. Sold them early 2000.
Smh! Listened to commentary, also the images! Shocking, Yes! Artistic masterpiece...👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻! Is Steve Gerber and the artist Stiller around? Would Love to get ALL SIX prior issues!
Steve Gerber has been dead since 2008 (Marvel published the Man Thing graphic novel Screen play for a Living Deadman as a tribute to him…and I remember reading about this Man Thing graphic novel in the early nineties {Comics Journal did an interview with Steve Gerber} however the Graphic Novel got “tied up” due to lateness on the writer and artist {Kevin Nowlan}’s part 🤷♂️)
Goodwin at Epic did some wonderful things, including publishing essential Jean Giraud volumes, and my favorite book: Starstruck.
So none of the people talking down about Void Indigo and how it represents females were apparently aware of the existence of Conan comics?
😂
The reaction is odd considering that epic illustrated was printing very adult content for the as well as heavy metal?
Great video! 👍
Thank you!
Was a big fan of Gerber but totally forgot about this series. The Canadian angle was a funny piece of the story.
I have a Gerber signed copy of Marvel Age #21 that my sister gave me years ago.. I had no idea what it was. Might have to go dig it out and give it another look.
Im so glad I ran into this channel.
A little suggestion, it would be good to have more consistent and easily recognizable thumbnails. I ignored this video in my feed for a whole month before today realising it was a Strange Brain Parts video. The thumbnail didn't grab me becaue I wasn't familiar with the image, and the big "CANCELLED" text is what we see in way too many thumbnails these days. So I ignored it, but if the thumbnail was more recognizable as a SBP video, I would have clicked on day one.
I had forgotten about this series; but I do remember enjoying it. It's a shame he wasn't able to take it elsewhere or publish it later.
Have it, love it.
Sounds interesting... if a bit too grim.
And while I prefer comics as escapism, I'm not opposed to a good message every now and then.
I guess this was written before *"The Boys"* or *"The Watchmen,"* today, it would be a movie or a cable series.
I adore Watchmen but never had any interest in any version of The Boys. Watchmen has barely any violence in it, but when it does happen it means something and hits like a load of bricks.
5:43 I don't know if that's clever or convoluted
Sounds like thick people got involved, It sounds like a great work of art.
Back when the comic industry had standards.
It seems Gerber was always getting screwed by one or the other of the big two but this may be his own fault for pushing too hard at the envelope of the time. And I do see many, many similarities between this and post Zero Hour Hawkman.
Not only that, but he did fail to meet deadlines, screwing over comic stores.
Great Video.
Thank you!
That's incredible, they were able to use the CZcams play button in the 80s! Oh... wait...
Epic was the coolest.
Never heard of this book. Now I'm decently curious. Especially when a thing gets a bad review. In most cases like when a bad vegetable says something is terrible, I know I'm going to love it
I had that comic back then and I found it really amazing for the plotline because of exactly it shows. no one has ever done such a comic like that before, the idea to show life and human race as it is in reality: cruel and violent. and to this day I didn't know what happened to the sequels, until I've watched this video. and I must thank you for that.
The story is grotesque, but good lord is that art AMAZING... I really love how it all looks!
I have no mouth and I must scream
I was wondering if the art was uneven on purpose.
@@laurabeane8862 🤣🤣🤣 to each their own
Ultra violent for the time. The graphic depictions of Jhagur doing away with his foes were looked at as gratuitous.
I kinda wish this had been hawkman. It would have added an interesting perspective to the character that we now will never get. but Void Indigo probably gave gerber more room to do whatever he wanted.
If you don't like it, don't read it. But don't stop others who do not share your delicate sensibilities from reading a damn comic book. Surely, there are more pressing matters to deal with.
Would have been picked up if I'd seen it. Poope misguided Steve 😂❤
I collected virtually all of Void Indigo. I kept trying to give it a chance and then one day, I thought to my teenage self, "This is just garbage." And the characters were cross dressers, not transgenders and when the woman gets the sword impaled through her head, it's not "Disney-esque" It was gross then and it's still gross now. I also knew it was an attempt at the gross out and it was gross. But the story was soooo plodding and ultimately pointless. Not only was it morally degenerate, but it was artistically insulting. Years later, when I debated whether to sell the issues or not, I actually destroyed them instead of selling them. I didn't want to be part of putting that inartistic rot into anyone else's brains or potentially even profiting off of it. In contrast, Dreadstar was out around the same time and was in general a much better premise, storyline and series when it came to your budget for comics. Byrne was doing great with Fantastic Four. Alien Legion was good. There was simply much better stuff at the time. There was also plenty of "shocking" material available but "shocking" doesn't necessarily mean "quality" or "thought-provoking." Void Indigo was not even worthy of liberal pretentiousness.
People can be as outraged as they want, it doesn't make Gerber any less correct in his observations about human nature.
Oh, if only Steve Gerber held on for another 15 years (if Steve Gerber was that nihilistic about the 80’s, 2016 and up would have had Stevie go “full prepper “)
I bought these back then. I hated the coloring on them (except the cover of the graphic novel). Seems like it compounded the abrasive nature of the story. I guess that could be intentional, but the color just felt gross.
The Hawkman parallel is obvious. DC’s Legends of Tomorrow, season one was almost the same story, differing only in that they hijacked, and ruined, Vandal Savage, to play the part the dark wizards played, Hawkman was an Egyptian prince, instead of an alien, and Hawkgirl, who became the primary protagonist, rather than Hawkman, took the place of the consort. They did crowbar the Thanagarians into the story, so, technically, there were some aliens, but they never really made an actual appearance.
It’s a shame that this story didn’t get a chance to be told, in its entirety, but the biggest shame was the truly awful hairstyle of the protagonist. Apparently, even on highly advanced alien worlds, some foolish, and delusional, men think that by growing the tiny bit of hair, at the very base of the skull, really long, they will fool people into thinking that they actually have a lot of hair, and that it looks anything other than ridiculous. He’d have looked much better completely bald, though if he had a full mane of pure white hair, it would have looked even better than that.
The poor dears must have clutching their pearls in fear at such ideas. Never heard of this, would like to have seen where it went.
The one character looks like Jesse Ventura.. 😂
Sounds like it would’ve been awesome. Sounds like they didn’t want that on the money description of modern life out into the ether yet.
I can't be the only one that got the "justified and ancient" nod at the end.
Nope, you weren't. :)
lol just a crappier version of the show lexx, that being said super glad lexx wasn't cancelled before it began. the existential dark absurdity of the show is brilliant!
Oh my god, I had no idea I'd encounter a fellow Lexx fan here. It's the best
Lexx really ruined space shows for me. It is such an oddball series with its freudian and psychosexual outfits and references.
You know, I never made that connection! But, yeah! I see it now. Good call.
Why didn’t he just publish this with Heavy Metal? Their content pushed the boundaries as well.
That's a good question, considering it was creator owned. In fact, I wondered the same thing, especially when Vertigo came around in the 90's. But I couldn't find anything that explained why both he and Mayerik allowed the project to die.
Best guess? Gerber had other work in animation and the hassle he experienced with Void Indigo probably killed his interest in finishing it off. So, that may be a partial reason why he didn't shop it around. It just felt like poison and he had other work to do.
Hell yeah I have that issue of Marvel Age
10:35 I was just going to say CBG writer calls Void Indigo a cynical nihilistic take on humanity. David Quinn on Faust “Hold my beer 🍺 “
I always wondered what the hell happened to Void Indigo, I LOVED that comic...
I once read a Punisher comic with fairly graphic incest. How times have changed
I have a copy of the first issue. Was part of my Dad's collection. No idea it actually had some history to it.
The Dark Lords had to find souls worthy of their Overseers to consume. The Dark Lords so cowed their people that although they had marched thousands into the abbitoir their populace were so broken that their souls were unsatisfying.
"They die...too Easily!?"
So subjecting The Barbarian King to a Spectrum of Torture while he fights for his life not only satiates the Overseers, but The Dark Lords are Rejuvenated back to their younger, stronger selves.
I think part of what drove the controversy was just that it was hard for many critics and readers to understand why anyone would want to read the series in the first place. The dark tone and unpleasant imagery and themes were understandably inaccessible for many; but what's more, as seen by how many critics found the book cynical and pointless, it gave a lot of people the impression that it was written by and made for unpleasant, angry people who hate everyone around them.
The do gooders have always known what's best for us. Sadly they are still at it today.
1 ive never heard of this.
2 looks great!
3 cool ideas.
You can see how fans of Howard the Duck might have seen this as a bit of a departure.
These comics are insane 😊
Had tis book around sixth/seventh grade. Fucking loved it. Glad to hear the complete story.
Yet , they allow stuff like this now on tv
you can't judge yesterday through todays lens
Actually, you kind of can, you still have the same reactionary elements that are very prevalent today…on both sides of the aisle so to speak.
This series would thrive on Image comics. Now I definitely gotta read this book and the others shown in this video.
I've always been a fan of both Mayerik and Gerber. I thought Void Indigo was cool and hoped to see Val's superior depictions of the martial arts.
The quote at 7:29 absolutely hits the nail on the head and speaks to my thoughts on the matter. I felt the same way reading a lot of Garth Ennis and Mark Millar's work. It strikes me as overly cynical, violent and shocking with little substance.
I mean if you can’t analysis the themes of Ennis’s work sure lol
@@paulakroy2635 You're right, I'm not as intelligent as you, and the themes flew right over my head.
The ironic audacity of people who “work in the comics field” to censor or block a comic is itself indecent.
There is no need for the raw garbage of books like "Void Indigo" and its even-worse successors. I remember glancing at it when it came out, and thinking "what is this crap?" Everything about it was disturbing and off-putting, for no redeeming reason. Steve Gerber, even as described in the friendly way of this video, sounds like a true deviant. On a related note, I have always absolutely hated even the concept of Howard the Duck. It's not surprising that Gerber's other stuff is a lot worse.
Loser.
Well…opinions are like sphincters…in that everybody’s got them. So you didn’t like Void Indigo (or Howard The Duck for that matter), there were some that did like them. I don’t seem to recall anyone dying and giving you the authority to judge, and critique other people’s work “Mr.Blackwell”
@@sawtooth808 your assertion is ridiculous. Neither you, nor I, nor anyone else, needs your, mine, or another's permission to express our opinions, positive or negative. We all have the right to judge and critique works that are submitted for public consumption. Have a great day.
This comic series, gives me Deathstroke vibes.
Wouldn't mind reading that....
82? That was right around the satanic panic wasn't it?
Hard to remember what with me being 2 at the time.
I'm not 100% sure, but it was at least beginning around that time.
I have the first issue of void indigo