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These plants are NOT Different! Thai 1.0 vs 2.0 ( Myth BUSTED )
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- čas přidán 7. 08. 2024
- The Thai Con Saga Continues
Episode 1 - • My Root ROT PRONE, Pyt...
Episode 2 - • Monstera Thai Constell...
Episode 3 - • I Had To KILL 2 Monste...
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Lmaoo that is really funny I love it
I dont think theres anything wrong with there being no difference in the 2 "versions". People should just be proud of what they have and stop trying to make it more special.
Blah..
This isn’t even close to being science.
Can you elaborate what your getting at.
To do true science you would need exact plants that are being compared. We all know dang well there is going to be a drastic difference between a cutting of a plant compared to a seed.
You can’t make a hypothesis or debunk anything when you don’t even have the proper plants.
You were all over the place with your choice of plants (of course a plant from a BBS is going to be long and lanky because it’s been inside the store). And any plant off a MASSIVE chonk is going to immediately push out larger leaves.
We all know that, if you truly know about plants. But, the really debate is between the older TC and newer ones. Even cuttings off the v2 will be larger if the plant is larger, but still different compared to the V1.
Idk, your data is all over the place and hard to follow.
Wait, how are you comparing a Mint vs a Thai, theyre different plants, lol.
I'm comparing a cutting of a monstera and it's ratio vs a fresh TC plant
And why you can't compare a v1 cutting to a v2 that was literally just deflasked
@@TechplantChannel if you want to be scientific, you should really be comparing Thais against each other, not reaching for a different type of Monstera. Mints can have variable forms and size ratios too. 🤷♀️ I feel like it's obvious you can't compare a plantlet to a matured specimen, but comparing an entirely different plant and claiming it supports your claim is incredibly misleading.
full acoustic mode😭😂 (as a fellow acoustic I approve LMAO)
Lmao it's a super power
I’ve only just found your channel and am loving your content. My favourite plant is monstera deliciosa . Please do a video on borsigiana and large form and give your options on the subject . I keep buying monstera is a desperate attempt to find a large form but no one seems to know how to tell the difference between them until they’re fully grown. I watched your video on Thai constellation regarding leaf leaf compared to petiole (?) , and my latest monstera has biggish leaves with fenestrations straight away instead of a pot of baby leaves . I’m hoping , as I’ve been told , this is large form . Looking forward to more videos, from 🇬🇧 uk
In local plant group I saw Thai, which has been bought in the same shop and about at the same time when I have bought mine. Both were small tc plants. And the other monstera looks much less compact then mine. It just depends on growing conditions
Yeap, I also think there is variance amongst all the plants bother pre and post 2019. The most important is care and age tho imo
I got mine from craigslist and kind of got scammed, it was dormant and the top was cut off, but i transfered it to leca, aand then i had an accident where a hanging plant fell on top, and from there it took off, it got nodes, and now I have 3 nice thais.
god help me how do you keep your chunk cuttings from rotting?? no matter how long i let callous or how healthy the sucker is, it starts looking bruised on any new growth then soon turns to rot in my box :3333
I should do a deep dive on all my cuttings and what has and hasnt worked. For the HUGEE ones 3inch thick they actually rotted like crazy in water. I put them in bins, 2 ways. one on a bed of sphagnum/perlite and another they were sorta suspended on top of pots so they werent touching anything and not sitting in wetnes. both the ends rotted a 1/2inch to 3 or 4 inches in but eventually they tossed out growth and stopped rotting. I have some in the bins almost a year now? they have huge rotted out portions but growing too. I will make a video.
for the mint monstera with the best portion I just stuck it in some water under strong lights.
I love that you keep experimenting with formats. It keeps your content fresh.
Not everything is for everyone but I like every one of your videos.
And for those being unpleasant in the comments, hopefully the fact that there are comments boosts the promotion of that video (so that something good comes of it).
I’m not super scientific but I appreciate when other people put in the effort. It just gets old when people who think they’re super scientific pick on every little thing in a way that isn’t constructive.
Thanks for keeping at it.
2:45 can we talk about the googly eyes on the one to the right? lmao
They are residue from the puppet show paternity test I did on thai cons when I sent them to a lab
@@TechplantChannelI think about that puppet a lot
lmaoo
… I should call her
More variegation mean more demand for light for photosynthesis right?
V1 vs V2: doesn't have a V1... very scientific!
The first idea I'm presenting is the difference between cutting grown and fresh from TC. Another yotuber made that initial comparison which was a bad comparison. So I illustrate the difference between cuttings and fresh TC grown.
The second part where I even admit I don't have a v1 but I can look at photos from 2019 and see no difference.
I don't know what you took from this video but I don't think it's what I presented
This isn't scientific. Do you know what scientific means?
But she never said it was scientific
I think the critics are right and I don‘t know if the V1-comparison part with random pre-2019-pics is all that valid/ ‚scientific’ because it doesn’t account for the conditions the respective plants are in nor the sample size for this comparative method. My bg is empirical culture science & we do work with small sample sizes for qualitative studies, but … I don‘t know if that‘s quite applicable for plants? Or maybe less broad claims need to be made …idk I love how curiously you‘re exploring the plant world, but this research design is a bit too sloppy to be considered ‚scientific‘, I think …though the differences between TC & cuttings were well illustrated!
i am at point where its loony to drag this out any further. to be honest there is so many forms of thai con, marilyn, creme brule, etc. this is just mundane at this point. theres so many mutations off of thai con that the argument can just end. I'm more inclined to listen Kaylee Ellen and pretty in green who actually sell these for a living and have seen SO MANY forms and not just of one plant but multiple of the same and having to keep them alive to sell. It's just dumb and should just lay to rest.
Hi, I looked for a video about this but I'm not having any luck. I have a monstera, (not a borsigiana) that hasn't given a new leaf in 6 months! I keep it outside because I live in a sub tropical climate. I water when it gets dry once to twice a week, it gets lots of bright indirect light, I can't find pests. Any idea what gives? When I bought it 6 months ago I gave it a new pot not much bigger than the one it came in, I also planted it upright (for a pole) instead of horizontal, which is the way it was in store. Maybe this has something to do with it, but 6 months!!! Maybe I should give up. Any insight is appreciated. 😊
I don't know how large it is but I've had some small and large ones too I guess do this. I've upset them and rhey just pause for a couple months. Eventually they wake up and grow but I have no idea why or how
Unfortunately, I don't see a real comparison to the first Thai Constellations here. I think I was one of the first people in Germany to own a large Thai Constellation. None of those in your video are from the first generation. If you want, I can send you old pictures from back then (2018/19). I have also owned plants from newer generations. I can confirm that there are definitely differences.
Yeah the only comparison I can make is from all the pics I showed that were pre 2019. Send me some pics of yours from back in the day I'm curious. techplant.official@gmai.com or in instagram
@@TechplantChannelI don’t think you can make the claim that you’re truly using “scientific evidence” when you don’t even have a first gen Thai con to compare.
@@fussbrain9161 I think you are trying to imply that my measurements and that "science" is applicable to the V1/V2 comparison. that entire portion of the video was to show why you cant compare cuttings to tc growth.
I literally say in my video I cant confirm or deny v1/v2 difference, but neither can Kaylee based on the plants she held up.
@@TechplantChannel if you say in the video that you cannot confirm or deny the difference how can your title to it be "These plants are not different"
@tinabeall22 the same reason Kaylee made her title the way it was
Those arent cuttings. Those are baseball bats lol
lmaooo
The second that creator mentioned this 1.0 vs 2.0 thing I immediately knew you would make another video about it 😂❤
There is so much renaming for marketing its a bit ridiculous. To me if it has a patent then it a recognized cultivar.
In this case I think it hasn't anything to do with renaming. The first generation was really completely different from today's generations
@@variegated.mind. I don't think there is a generation issue, the plant has been around since the 90s at least, the pandemic was a little crazy selling chopped up garbage. Since then there has been a lot of tissue culturing using genes from plants with considerably better variegation. Same thing happened with pink princess.
Great video, thank you for sharing your experiment results and knowledgeable perspective. 👍
Thanks for watching!
This vid was chaotic af and all over the place 🤣
I have acquired multiple V1s and there is a laminar flow hood order places along with tissue culture supplies, its gunna get crazy
@@TechplantChannel so this popped up in my recommended section, how long have you been dealing with plants whether tropical or others? Always looking for more plant cm content 🤣
NGL I was pretty disappointed that there wasn't any "testing" on the og Thai but the video was still put out as if that would be happening…
I watered my apple philodendron yesterday and really noticed the stem. It was nice and thick at the bottom and that was in a window spot and the top was much smaller and that is when I moved it from the window away. Something to note I thought was interesting. I knew the leaves and growth would slow but the stem decreasing in size was unexpected.
How do you make a video comparing the 2 when you don't own both that's kinda confusing as its not very scientific.
I'm comparing cutting grown vs a young plant from TC and showing their growing characteristics. Because the other youtuber who is making the claim that they are different made a very poor comparison.
I don’t think your comparison is very scientific either. All your “examples” of Thai plants prior to 2019 were photographs and were unable to measure. Secondly you measured other Monsteras. So scientifically speaking, you’d need to compare 2 plants around the same maturity both given the same care. Actually, a larger group would be better
I don’t understand this video at all. The other video I’m pretty sure you are referencing stated “this is not scientific, just something she’s noticed”. An observation in her own collection.
@@kitcat9825 maybe its my videos organization but you are missing the point of the comparison. My measurements have nothing to do with thai con comparisons. Im illustrating with my measurments and multiple plants that growth from cuttings have better ratios than plants direct from seed/TC|
I did secure multiple pre 2019 thai cons now and ill spend the next year TC'ing them and documenting their growth. hope to see you in a year! regardless of the results it should be cool
In my experience cuttings from mature plants take off better because the mother plant has lots of food and energy stored in it's branches.
This is the least scientific comparison I’ve ever seen 😂 (coming from an ecologist with a scientific background!)
I really think you missed the mark and it’s interesting to see many in the comments also think there is a difference.
I'm showing examples of plants from cuttings and plants from seed or tissue culture flasks and the evidence shown suggests that monstera species grown from mature cuttings are more compact and have a better ratio that recently deflasked plants. Give me a government grant and I'll give you even better videos
Also not a single person saying they are different have offered any evidence whatsoever other than 'I feel like there is a difference' so this is the best comparison so far along with my previous videos where I sent them to a lab to be tested
@@TechplantChannel you cannot say myth busted and claim that v1/v2 is rubbish when you haven’t tested it scientifically. You have suggested you don’t like the other claims because they aren’t tested yet I would suggest growing both versions for years as these growers/youtubers/shop owner/collectors have, is a more robust assessment than what you have tried to achieve here.
sure, I cant say with 100% certainty that there is no difference, however Ive at least shown actual evidence in which Ive formed my opinion with.
I found images pre dating 2019 and you can see no discernable difference as far as petiol to leaf ratio.
My videos main focus was calling out a comparison another youtuber tried to make where they compared a thai con growth from a mature cutting vs a recently deflasked thai con. Those were the main illustrations that I showed in this video.
There are other commenters who have a v1 and v2 who say they see no difference as well. So that means you have two conflicted opinions that are just based on a "feeling"
at the very least Ive shown why comparing the v1 cutting to a v2 deflasked plant was a poor choice to try and illustrate the difference.
If I can get a v1 thai con I will pay money to have it gene tested.
so far im the only youtuber that has paid his own money and had plants sent to a lab to be tested for disease. I also subjected 8 other v2 thai cons to bad conditions to prove they arent weaker. I had a 100% success rate deflasking where other detractors still cant get a 100% success rate which is why they made up random claims of the plant being weak.
@@TechplantChannel sorry to chime in but as an empirical culture study person, I just wanted to add that „feelings“ can actually be assessed in a scientific way if you know how and locate it properly within their respective context. They stem from observations ppl make within their specific environment, and let‘s say if someone deals with hundreds of thais over a few years under the same care conditions and they notice a consistent difference in shipping batches, I don‘t think the observation should be easily dismissed. I think figuring out in what cases the observation is valid & relevant for everyone else is perhaps more interesting?
So at 3:00 time, the two very compact thai constellations, its very rare that they have half moon leaves and im kinda questioning if they are constellations, its very rare for them to have half moons, in albos its normal for them, but im questioning if those thai constellations are what you say they are
They came from the same lab as what a lot of other youtubers are selling. I bought a ten pack so it would be odd to have a mix up, I can show you some other leaves on it if you are interested
You are so gangster lol!! I hope someone will trade you a V1, would love to see u put it to the test!!!
The different appearance is all about growing conditions. They get long petioles with small leafs, when the light is bad or too far away, same with internodes.
I have an experience idea, try to dry anthurium seeds and plant them after, I search for the question and I didn’t find anyone talking about.
will do
Great video!
I thought V1-V2 the difference was a variation of the amount of variegated? V1 has much smaller spots whereas V2 has the bigger splotches and half-moon tendency?
What I've been told is PROBABLY wrong though lol
Thanks for your videos 👊💪
Yeah it's hard to say. I'd love someone who has a bunch of these plants to make a video about them. All I can do is look at pictures from pre 2019
K I’m up way too early, am i really the first to comment? Love this, keep these awesome videos coming!!!
Lol. I had to look up what/who you were talking about 😅. I also don't think there is a v1 and v2. It's crazy how they said that monsteras don't like as much light! That's an absolute bonkers take LMAO! Monsteras love a lot of light especially thai cons.
Verigated plants in general usually need more light cus they have fewer cloroplasts
Loved this, i always love watching you prove things .
Unshowered caught my attention, immediately!! 👍😍👍😋😋😋
I truly dont think 99.9 percent of people wont care about a 1.0 or 2.0 they all orinated from the same plant at one stage. Sounds like people are just trying to come up with a reason to charge more for one more than another. I dont think any of this video proves anything.
lmao not again 😂😭😂 oh well i'm here for it
Random but what kind of music are you in? I’m gonna guess indie
im into a lot of different things. my interests usually kinda flow around, Ive listened to a lot of indie stuff over the years and many bands are all time favorites
@@TechplantChannel name me a few
@@zachw611 the strokes, the killers, interpol, gorillaz, shiny toy guns, taking back sunday, vampire weekend, animal collective. The Strokes, The Killers and Interpol were my top ones I could listen to entire albums over and over tho same with gorillaz
@@TechplantChannel nice I’ll check them out. Ever listened to cut copy?
💚
I have two from different sellers. One was a cutting from one of the original TC’s, one was a little TC plantlet from the most recent batches. Both are in the same pot, same water, same nutrient solution, same size - the cutting is fine, the little one from a recent TC batch has root rot.
I didn’t think there was a difference either, but I’ve seen first hand that there is.
I would think the cutting would be much more robust than a very young TC plant. I think you might see the same results regardless of the species if it were like that
Yes! Thank you! This is why we watch your channel 🎉 I think I know which video you're talking about, and it bothered the heck out of me too. Especially since many people consider this person to be something of an expert on rare plants. The channel I'm thinking about is usually pretty good about dispelling myths around TC, but that video really missed the mark.
I agree. It’s the same.
👏🏻 😂
How old was your thai????
About 1.5 years old I think I bought this end of December 2023 and it was probably a few months old at the time
Love this video
interesting that the biggest people peddling this myth are plant sellers who have some skin in the game
lol it always seems to be the case
Hey Matt - Are you able to sell me a Monstera plant? I've tried 3 times to buy from Amazon and ended up with wilted spinach. Thanks.
If you're in the UK get one from Tropical Plants UK, I got a massive meter tall four leaf rooted plant for £50
UK also sells them from M&S, RHS and Is stay well away from Thompson and Morgan. Etsy if the seller has good reviews but eBay is usually better (agian reviews)
Point being, amazon sucks
People live their conspiracy theories
Some people just can’t grow a plant
Yes! I thought that was obvious as far a the age of the plant. I've seen some recent videos on this. Ate we talking Kaylee Ellen or is there one that I missed? I saw PIG too. Love him, but disagree on this point.
Don’t mean this in any rude way but it’s completely possible for two separate mother plants from a pool of genetics to produce two semi different tissue cultured clones. That’s how most cultivars as a whole are started these days. And one of the main reasons choosing a mother plant with good genetics is important in tissue culture, as the mother plant can affect the outcome of the babies. Not to mention the whole tissue culture isn’t true cloning and there are still small genetic differences in some of the clones which is why they can be prone to mutations such as variegation. I mean monstera species as a whole have some of the highest phenotypic plasticity of any genus of plants making them way more prone to said genetic variation during cloning due to cellular damage. Not to mention to strenuous qualifications needed to be classified a true cultivar including multiple types of propagation and multiple mother plants needed. They also require testing of genetic variation through seed multiplication to ensure said genetics carry through to truly be called a cultivar. In my opinion it is not a stretch in any way shape or form to state there have been ATLEAST two unique individuals of M Thai constellation tissue cultured and spread widely into cultivation, in much the same way multiple forms of adansonii were spread into cultivation under the guise of one species name. If somebody tissue cultured a clone of m Thai con with high var there is a higher chance the plantlets will come out with higher var, much in the same way if you cloned a Thai con that had a slight genetic propensity to have smaller leaves and longer meristem it’s possible a significant portion of the produced pups would aswell. And that genetic difference is present through every single plant and can be affected by growth conditions, damage, human interference through forced genetic replication, etc…
Not to even mention the basis of your original videos was debunking the fact there was a tissue cultured fungal infection on the Thai con as a whole which is not applicable to this topic as this would simply be slight differences in genetics and how those slight differences would affect the way certain plants grow for certain people in certain conditons, the only way to really scientifically put this to bed would be to have a full genome mapping done of a sample of a V1 and a V2 to see if there are any even minute differences.
Depending on the cost I'll see if I can do that. I'm sourcing a few different v1s. I also wanna TC all the v1s and v2s I have and then let their children grow out for fun and see if there is any big difference in the batches. Thanks for the comments!
Great comparison. You're so smart.
This is the complete opposite of scientific. You "show" that there is no difference between the v1 and v2 without ever showing a v1, without documenting when the images you are showing are from, without noting in your comparisons of COMPLETELY DIFFERENT PLANTS if they are large form, small form, head cuttings or mid cuttings. You found a conclusions and looked for ways to confirm that conclusion with whatever evidence you could find.
If you want to be scientific, but a v1 and v2 thai constellation bottom cutting (so the age difference doesn't interfere) and compare their ratios for the next couple of years. This would be deeply valued in the community and would be a step in the right direction towards actually finding or not finding a difference between v1 and v2.
Until someone does this analysis, I agree with Kaylee Ellen's conclusion that the v1 and v2 thaicons are different, since she shows proof and owns/cultivates both versions.
I've already wrote replies to messages like this too many times but you missed the core of my video. It's always wild to me that people will accept her 'evidence' but anyways it does not matter. I have built a TC lab and I have sourced multiple V1s V2s V3s and so on. I'm going to culture them all and grow out about 10 plants from each strain and see if we have any discernable difference.
@@TechplantChannel sounds good, I will look forward to hearing about your findings!
Skill issue for all the nay sayers 🐛
You're using a tape measure and two different sized plants. Not to mention the fact that you DONT EVEN HAVE A 1.0. Extremely scientific lol
You are missing the whole point of the video and what I'm illustrating. I have a new update that makes it much more clear on my goal
To me there is a difference, it's in the evolution of variegation rather than leaf size, I actually prefer v1, v2 has tendency to go half moon eventually half dark moon you'll want to chop but has wider constellation dots, even mint parts. Clearly they selected more variegated mother over there in thailand as they go along. Later on you even get the creme brulee that has more variegation. last on is the legacy that looks almost like a mint. I did enjoy this video and the theory.
Kind of a lazy comparison, ngl. How are you intending to debunk this "myth" if you don't even own a Thai 1.0? Comparing your pretty specimens with some laggy plant pictures you found on facebook sounds like many things to me, but not scientific at all. What I find funny about this is that you're quick to judge the video that inspired you to do your comparison but yours ended up being even more shallow and useless. Kuddos on your Pythium experiments tho.
I think you are missing the entire idea of my video which i guess is my fault. My gripe was she showed two plants as her "proof" one was V1 growth from a mature cutting. The other "v2" was growth from a flask. My whole argument is that its a poor comparison.
In my video I give you a baseline of ratios. then i show you how much better ratios are on growth from mature cuttings are vs TC and seed grown ratios. The evidence i show you shows that the growth from cuttings has a much better ratio.
Meaning the two plants she showed on camera as her example that v1 is different than v2 is a BAD evidence.
I'm laughing at this point because its comment after comment that always comes back to my "declarative" title that is literally the opposite of hers. She makes a declarative title claiming they are different. and her evidence she shows on screen is bad.
Also I cannot understand your issues of multiple photos from pre 2019 but somehow her image of her plant is acceptable?
My whole issue is there always youtubers making these big claims and yet its only every words and never once a real comparison. or any real attempt to back up words
Sloppy work on your end.
what is sloppy? I wanted to illustrate you cant compare the growth from a cutting vs another plant thats fresh from a flask and use that as evidence that there's a difference. all the measurements I showed, show that growth from cuttings show far greater ratios than young plants from seed or flask
You're misrepresenting the scientific method. Unhinged, unfollow.
I'm doing the best I can, I measured the ratio on seedlings and deflasked plants to give you a good variety of measurements from that style of growth. Then I measured growth from cuttings so you could see the ratios of that style of growth. The ratio was better on the growth from cuttings. So I illustrated that making a comparison of growth from a cutting vs a deflasked plant is a bad comparison. The evidence I have gathered in this video shows this to be true. If you missed that I guess my video is disorganized so I apologize for that. But this video does 💯 show with evidence that cuttings produce better ratios than seed grown or tc grown growth at similar stages/leaf count.
@TechplantChannel no no no this goes beyond just you is like your entire generation is cocky and delusional to how anything works. You need like 1000 of each with laboratory conditions with specimens raised in the same ways... I mean this isn't scientific. You should specify that this is a kitchen experiment instead of misrepresenting. Young people are becoming arrogant and also people in general are becoming so dumb they will believe everything and be in your comments like YOU'RE A SCIENTIFIC GENIUS... I hate it here take me back to 2004 omfg.
@@pixiesprite9433 I don't know how many scientific papers you have consumed but if you read a bunch you will start to see that many times papers are written, reviewed and published with far fewer specimens than you are claiming. You will also see how rudimentary a lot of those experiments are that take place in the papers.
I will provide you with this definition "the systematic study of the structure and behavior of the physical and natural world through observation, experimentation, and the testing of theories against the evidence obtained."
There is nothing in there that says only sample sizes greater than 1000 is science. Science can be done in the hobby world. The best part about science is people can try and repeat these results. You can go to your plant collection right now and measure your ratios on growths from cuttings vs ratio on seeds and TC and report your findings and if it contradicts mine we can improve the experiment and try again.
I think you are grossly overestimating what "science" is and can be. I made claims that growth from mature plants produce better plantlets with better ratios than TC and seed grown do. The evidence supports what I've said. I'm not a scientific genius nor do i claim to be. a lot of the "science" humor is directed at long term viewers who saw another youtuber try to discredit me with poorly read papers which is why i did lab testing and contacted people who work in a lab to confirm what I had said in previous videos.
I do not know why you are so aggressive when I'm trying my best and in almost any video where I show you how to do something I document it as well as i can so you can see progress over time and in multiple mediums and how they perform.
I think you are too worried about winning an argument instead of just being open to the future. I have contacted several people and im getting some pre 2019 thai cons that i will do my best to tissue culture and also do some DNA testing.
Im disappointed in many of the commentors aggression when Im one of the few people out here at least trying to illustrate ideas. Your aggressiveness is unfair in my opinion when you are accepting Kaylee's opinion based of her observations she claims and nothing else. I dont mind that at all but i dont know why you are going wild on me when im trying to illustrate neat concepts.
Literally no one in my comments even my supporters have every called me a genius, they just appreciate my attempts to illustrate ideas and growth. AND unlike kaylee my Dms are open and i collaborate with all sorts of people and I listen to their opinions and take time to type stuff like this out. Ive had a lot of fun in the plant world working with people. There have been hundreds of Dms of people disagreeing with me or showing me their findings and changing my mind or helping me modify my ideas.
I hope after reading this we can be at peace and if you can present me some contrary results about cuttings growth vs TC growth I would love to see it so I can do more experimentation
Spill that tea king